Why does jrpg worldbuilding suck and is unfilling compared to Elder Scrolls kino?

The guys who built Elder Scrolls lore literally started when they were young.

boards.fireden.net/v/thread/472925608/
Basically the same thread over again. Bait.

What's that suppose to mean? They were all working adults.

nice jrpg rec+bait thread op, go suck a dick

he must be really really lonely.
there! Cheer up

Change of pace from Smash threads and other nintendie generals.

Elder Scrolls sucks too. The implementation is just fucking awful.

All Japan cares about is making fapbait characters, modern JPGs are garbage and that's why every thread about them is just to circlejerk to their generic anime girl without ever having any actual discussion about the game because its all the same tired cliche garbage. That doesn't mean modern WRPGs are any better, most are either simplified watered down garbage to appeal to the mass and has little to no actual RPG elements or they use it for their liberal sjw political agenda rather than just trying to make a fun video game.

Would help if you didn't have the attention span of a zoomer and actually bothered to read the books each game has.

because the elder scrolls devs spent so much time writing lore that they forgot to make actual games

Morrowind and Oblivion are actual games though.

Imagine looking at the criticism PS:T (wrongly) gets for being a book and saying "that's what we should do, but moreso".

The difference is Elder Scrolls games are actual games while PS is a boring VN about high schoolers.

News flash, buddy. It's not good implementation to put all the interesting lore in the books.

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Correction, Morrowind and ESO are actual role playing games. Skryim and Oblivion are too but they don't meld gameplay and lore as well as the other two.

PS:T you brainlet
Also if the games are actual games, as you say they are...then you should be able to "play through" the setting, instead of having to read it.

Morrowind is the last bethesda RPG worth spending even a minute on.

And Oblivion stop leaving that out.

>retcons everything (cyrodiil jungle, khajiit humans, daggerfall endings, etc.) and comes up with flimsy explanations
>nothing interesting coincidentally never happens in-game
Wow dude so interesting, KINO! bazinga

I wrote what I wanted to say very clearly, don't shove your poor taste to dilute matters.

>Oblivion Crisis
>Dagoth Ur
>nothing interesting happens in game
At least make the effort of playing and finishing the games before you make retarded posts like this.

Oblivion is only good after heavily modding it, Morrowind is the only Elder Scrolls game that can be enjoyed playing 100% vanilla.

Oof, I wouldn't go that far, but modded Morrowind can be downright impressive for a game made ages ago.

lmao this kid is still triggered over his shitty entry tier dnd setting getting called trash

ESO explains why Cyrodil was a jungle and then became grasslands. Basically whoever controls the tower there, the land morphs into said controller's idealized vision.

"Thus the Summerset archipelago, in the sphere of the Crystal Tower, is a warm and paradisiacal domain perfectly adapted to the Altmer. And Cyrodiil, in the sphere of the even-more-powerful White-Gold Tower, became a warm and subtropical jungle—which suited the ease-loving Ayleids.

But then the slaves of the Heartland High Elves rose up against their masters, conquered the valley of the Nibenay, and the Ayleids ruled no more. Thereafter, White-Gold Tower was the center of a human empire, peopled by Nedes and Cyro-Nords who originated in cooler, northern climes. And so the Tower of Cyrodiil responded to the desires of its new masters."

And with that, ESO fixed what Oblivion broke.

>Cool lore
>Cool world
>Cool aesthetics
>Cool story
>Abysmal gameplay
>Abysmal implementation of lore/world-building

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Hold up, so the white-gold tower controls the climate of Cyrodiil?

That plus some more. All the towers control the very fabric of reality. That's why the Thalmor want to destroy all of them so they can ascend back to god-hood.

But they're wrong because all you have to do is just achieve Chim instead destroying reality. The dunmer did it their own way through Numedium which almost destroyed reality as well and made them disappear forever.

ESO gives good lore.

That's what retcon means, user.

>dunmer
you mean dwemer but yeah you are right its actually quite interesting the daedra lords end up actual somewhat helping a few dummer self-actualize what the altmer keep pissing about.

Also they still salty as hell about the talos kicking their ass with the numedium.

Because nips who write games are all waifu anime fags

No Japanese dude will do a bunch of shrooms and lock himself in his apartment for a week while writing some lame ass anime arena fighter

Haha kind of I guess. Oblivion truly retconned but ESO did an amazing save with using it for world building.

So nips can't write soul?

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Is TES as full of retcons as fallout?
I barely understand any of the lore im told.
Also is chim just a load of shit or is it canon?
Please spoonfeed me anonymous.

Is Oblivion more like Morrowind or Skyrim? I hate Skyrims lore, but I hate Morrowinds gameplay. I want a middle-ground.

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Oh shoot yeah I'm used to writing dunmer since they're the most interesting race I guess I just talk about them all the time. And yeah that's actually true the daedra helped I never thought about that. From chaos comes order and from order comes chaos. Since it's wrapped up in yin and yang philosophy as their source of inspiration. Altmer who are orderly are actually inciting chaos and dunmer who are chaotic end up finding order? Makes sense.

Oblivion, it actually tries to be a RPG unlike Skyrin.

CHIM is mentioned 3 times in game.
From that we learn
It is a secret syllable in Morrowind
Tiber used it to change the jungle so that it never was a jungle.
It is the name of an elder scroll in ESO. Don't really learn anything.

The actual answer is it is Vivecs lore armor and chances are you are too dumb to understand it. Just nod your head and yep em to death when they get rambling.

Morrowind talks about Chim specifically I think.

Based

Why can't Japs write a proper pantheon of God's that isn't a bunch of little girls?

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Thanks Todd, I'll pick it up. Any mods I should use?

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And skyrim

Top tier lore you got there my dude

SMT has good gods

Ar tonelico has deeper lore than any WRPG.

>unexplained text dumps arbitrarily attached to items
>good world building

It's funny how westernlets think item text is the be-all end-all in worldbuildings.

They're more like really fancy pokemon, and they borrow from mythology and popular culture instead of making up their own cosmology.

>and they borrow from mythology and popular culture instead of making up their own cosmology
That's not a bad thing.

Isn't that how all media throughout histortystarts off though? Not necessarily a bad thing but Elder Scrolls god's are a lot more refined with their own planes of Oblivion or Atherius with servants than japshit that just has some 10,000 year old loli fox girl.

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Tamriel AE Daedroth

gracias

What the fuck are you saying. No one thinks item text is a good thing. Even the people who like dark souls lore don't like it. I'm not making any comment on the lore itself, I'm saying how they tell the player the whole story is fucking lazy at best.

Deities being just a guy with red eyes or that pic edgy clusterfuck is the most boring portrayal of divinity I can imagine

...

That's Jyggalag the Daedric Prince of pure Order.

exceptions prove the rule

anyways, is this the thread where /tesg/ will show up?
if yes, can some of you explain what the fuck happened to the dwemer and why orcs are fugly samurai ungas?

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Kagrenac used the power of the Lorkhan artifacts to activate Numidium to kill Nerevar, however instead of turning on it turned him and all the Dwarves in Tamriel into the bronze skin of Numidium. And the Orcs became fugly after they rubbed the blood of chewed up Trinnimac after getting vored by Boethiah on themselves which subsequently cursed both the Mer that became Orcs along with Trinnimac becoming Daedric Prince Malakath.

But a majority of western games don't do that shit

Elder Scrolls lore is intentionally ambiguous.
The mortal plane is cyclical, a kalpa is a single cycle, kalpas begin after alduin eats the world.
The current cycle contains all games.
CHIM is seeing the I the tower of the wheel. It's 1 + -1 = 1
Zero-Sum is 1 + -1 = 0
Anti-Chim is seeing the wheel from within.

That image shows how item-text can be done well. If a game literally only had item-text to flesh out the lore, it'd be shitty world building even if it had good item-text. Dark souls, if it had none of it's obscure lore told through item-text, would lose like half of it's entire lore. So they resort to a mediocre form of story telling and they do it poorly.

When is a developer gonna make a game with good storytelling AND good gameplay?

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theres nothing ambiguous about the lore

And Sheogorath is the spit up version of him? Something like that right?

i have trouble understanding most of the words you're using

I think he means it starts that way since it's all written from people in the Elder Scrolls universe and they have their own opinions. So they all agree on certain historical points and then opinions flow in different directions on how those things happened.

It's easy, Japan still treats the narrative of a game just as a movie with gameplay tacked on or vice versa. They never figured out how to tell a story through the interractive medium. And worldbuilding in a movie in general is hard. How many movies can you think of with interesting, well-developed settings that weren't based on books or other media?

I still play japanese games. I mean there is just some kind of novelty in and unique wackiness to their titles that you don't really see anywhere else. No work of culture in the world is like Killer7, God Hand or Bayonetta. But I do avoid jrpgs unless it's action-focused ones like Nier or Souls games.

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Well one group has to retcon races and the geography and politcal landscape of whole countries every other game and the other group barely ever does more then 1 "real" sequel.

No Sheogorath is the cursed version of Jyggalag the opposite of pure crystaline Order is Manic and Demented Madness.

Don't be a lorelet.
>Numidium is gigantic Dwarven construct, an artificial god built because the Dwarves wanted to make the Divines and Daedra eat shit
>Kagrenac was the high priest and Magecrafter of the Dwarves responsible for building Numidium
>Nerevar was the king of the Chimer, Daedra worshipping elves and was adamant that Numidium was heretical to their lords
>Dwarves tell Chimer to fuck off
>war begins
>Dwarves weakened from the Nords during the Skyrim Conquests
>Dwarves are losing at the battle of Red Mountain
>Kagrenac uses the artifacts to tap into the Heart of Lorkhan and activate Numidium to kill all the Chimer
>shit goes wrong and instead all the Dwarves disappear from Tamriel and become the bronze skin of Numidium

I can only think of Elder Scrolls melding gameplay and world building together and building upon it through each game. What other WRPGs do this?

Dark Souls isn't famous for its item descriptions, user. Dark Souls is famous for its environmental storytelling.

Jyggalag is just a different form of mad.

Dark souls is famous for being hard

Planescape, Arcanum, Dark Souls, VtMB, Fallout, Deus Ex

But Sheogorath killed Jyggalag. So who is really the cursed one? The one who can see the possibilities or the one who sees everything literally set in stone?

DS actually has good environmental storytelling though.

Daedric Princes can't die stupid.

Only Dark Souls and VtMB do that, though. The rest painfully try to pin them together.
>Planescape
user, the setting is famous for being shitty to meld with gameplay. Respawning is the only thing I can think of the game succeeding in melding with the world.

YesJyggalag is a different form of madness because bringing compulsive order to the chaos of Oblivion is impossible.

This is literally true for everyone in the ES universe.

They all have a soul and souls just get transported to the next body. But Daedric Princes aren't part of that reality and actually go back to the black void in eternal chaos and can't come back if they are defeated in their own oblivion realm. So you could say if death is about losing consciousness then they do die and it's worse than Anu's children who get reincarnated.

Jyggalag literally comes back to tell you thet you've broken the Greymarch curse after you kill him so death does not work the same way for Daedric Princes.

>But a majority of western games don't do that shit
Plenty of them do. Some of them even go a step further, and have unique item descriptions depending on what party member is examining the item.

Besides, what western games are even praised for their item descriptions? Meanwhile, everyone and their mother jerks over Dark Souls lore.

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He didn't die in his realm. My point was to show you that they can be considered worse than killed.

But yeah the cursed Sheogorath uncursed Jyggalag.

Battlespire has Merhunes Dagon die in his own realm after getting drained of power so where are you getting thid black void shit from?

>user, the setting is famous for being shitty to meld with gameplay. Respawning is the only thing I can think of the game succeeding in melding with the world.
Yet you praise Dark Souls of all things, a game where:

>dragon with an entire massive archive full of books and discovered the secret to immortality
>locks chosen undead in a cell with a bonfire and all his gear, and has a guard with the key in front of the cell door which you can easily kill since your attacks can somehow clip through the cell bars
>before he does that, he kills you, so it makes no sense that he could lock you up, since you would have respawned at the last bonfire

>game says everyone goes hollow and loses their mind if they don't find enough humanity
>you can go through the entire game at zero humanity and never lose your mind

There's a good reason why Planescape is so well-regarded, and it's because it does what no other RPG has ever done, or since. It uses RPG mechanics to convey personal character growth. In Dark Souls and most other RPGs the RPG systems are only about combat and how efficient you can kill stuff, By contrast, in Planescape: Torment, you not only have full control over what your character says, but your stats determine what insights you can glean from the world around you, uncovering more of the mystery of your past lives and becoming a wiser and more introspective person in the process.

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The first thing is a plothole.
The second thing is the whole "point" of the game, thematically. Going hollow is giving up. So long as you keep trying to make your way through this ruined world, you are not hollow.

Stats unlocking dialogue options is not a deep mechanic or a unique one, either. Even visual novels have them. Also, basically everyone who plays the game plays the same high-wis build. Besides that, the combat is so bad and divorced from any narrative that I wouldn't even call it the main gameplay; that would be the dialogue options you mentioned.

it is by every definition of RPG. accurate image though. Japanese writers are shit. JRPG are Peter-Pan syndrome having losers who only care about bright flashing colors and anime tiddies

>Why does jrpg worldbuilding suck
The biggest issue with jrpg settings is that they are basically Tolkien-like worlds dressed up in superficially different skins.

First, let's look at how wrpgs utilize their settings. If you look at wrpgs that aren't high fantasy, like say Fallout, Deus Ex, Jagged Alliance, Vampire The Masquerade, etc. they tend to incorporate aspects of their setting in their gameplay. And I don't mean things like characters using guns. I mean stuff like Fallout having a barter economy, which is logical in a post-apocalyptic society where monetization has broken down. Or how cybernetic augmentations in Deus Ex take the place of a more traditional RPG system. Or the whole mercenary company aspect of Jagged Alliance.

It's obvious that a game's setting should inform its gameplay. But jrpgs really don't do this. Even jrpgs that take place in modern or futuristic settings, such as Persona or Xenoblade, still revolve around typical high fantasy cliches like dungeon crawling and god-killing shenanigans. The characters even still use medieval weaponry. Heck, Symphony of the Night is a Japanese RPG where you play as a vampire, yet you can't even bite anyone to drink blood, meaning you can't even fulfil the basic function of a vampire. How lame is that? Or take Lost Odyssey, a game where you play as immortals, yet you can somehow still die from combat.

Another baffling trope is when jrpgs take place in a world such as various Final Fantasy games, where the technology and level of civilization is far more advanced than our own, yet the world still functions like a pre-industrial society, with small settlements separated by vast, uncharted expanses of wilderness filled with wild beasts and roving bandits, and characters still using medieval weaponry. What is the point of going with a futuristic setting if it's functionally and thematically identical to a medieval fantasy world?
I don't really understand why jrpgs are designed like this.

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JRPG fans*

How is it an rpg? There's no lockpicking, no quests, no skills that can be used to advance things outside more damage or health, "factions" using that term loosely are just item fetching by getting singular item from killing other players.

Japan doesn't know how to tell stories. At best, they rely on "implied storytelling", like Silent Hill or Dark Souls. Then, weebs insist any game with bad translation is using implied storytelling.

It's in the book of daedra. Also the dark brotherhood worship the void thinking they're worshipping that mother lady. Daggerfall is different because of the time shift due to Numedian

>wrpg fag is still at it
Did JRPGs kill your dog or something?

Jrpg's are too sòy filled to do anything like that.

Sithis and Sweet Mother are two different entities, the Brotherhood knows that.

>The first thing is a plothole.
So? It's an obvious oversight, and goes against your argument that Dark Souls does a good job of integrating narrative and gameplay. I like Dark Souls a lot, but it's rather obvious its setting is more of a mood-setter than anything to be analyzed in-depth.

>The second thing is the whole "point" of the game, thematically. Going hollow is giving up. So long as you keep trying to make your way through this ruined world, you are not hollow.
That's just stupid. You can give up in any game. How is Dark Souls different in that regard?

>Stats unlocking dialogue options is not a deep mechanic or a unique one, either. Even visual novels have them.
That's like saying Dark Souls is not a good game because action-RPG combat is not unique. How many games or visual novels have you go inside your mind and wage a battle of wills against the remnants of your previous incarnations that lie in the corners of your mind?

Planescape's integration of narrative and gameplay goes a lot further than you seem to think. This becomes particularly clear when we compare it to another RPG with the exact same premise.

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>Molag Bal once imprisoned one of his minions in a nanoplane for putting a whoopie-cushion on his throne in an incident known as "The Seat of Tyranny Rude Cushion Incident".[24]
It has a citation to a fucking in game loading screen. This lore is good?

>There's a good reason why Planescape is so well-regarded
It isn't, in fact it bombed massively when it released.
90% of people aren't even aware it exists, most people who play RPGs don't too and even less consider it a good game, mostly because it's hardly a game to begin with.
>it's because it does what no other RPG has ever done, or since. It uses RPG mechanics to convey personal character growth
Ah yes, talking with a bunch of people until you level up and then dump anything into STR or kill a bunch of skeletons and dump point into INT/WIS so you can magically solve Gith riddles sure does convey coherent and logical personal growth.

Not like it matters how many times I remind you of this, you'll still pretend nothing happened, because your entire, miserable life revolves around lying about videogames on the internet, and do that every day, for free.

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You're forgetting Evergrace
What a fucking shitty game

who the fuck cares about tes lore
it gets fucked in the ass with a stick anytime beth releases a game anyway

You don't analyse settings in depth. That's not what settings are for. The presentation of settings should be indistinguishable from the experience of playing the game. If your game is serving the setting, then you've done something wrong. This is why people hate the Planescape setting on /tg/, by the way.
This is why the setting in Dark Souls is good. It mood sets the fuck out of the game.

>You can give up in any game
This is a non-sequitor. Dark Souls is based around the theme of perseverance in an already lost world, and hollowing = losing perseverance. You can give up in other games, but unless they're ripping the fuck off of Dark Souls you won't go hollow in them.
>How many games or visual novels have you go inside your mind and wage a battle of wills against the remnants of your previous incarnations that lie in the corners of your mind?
Don't confuse "a good story" with "a good setting", and especially don't confuse it with "gameplay and setting integration".

Ignoring the dialogue, PS:T's gameplay is about as integrated with the setting as any D&Dlet vidya. Which is to say, not at all. PS:T is my favourite RPG, but it's got significant flaws.

Better than japshit if I say so myself.

most wrpgs suck dick too, including elder scrolls

Morrowind was simply an exception

>This is a non-sequitor. Dark Souls is based around the theme of perseverance in an already lost world, and hollowing = losing perseverance. You can give up in other games, but unless they're ripping the fuck off of Dark Souls you won't go hollow in them.
But you don't go hollow in Dark Souls either. There is no consequence for giving up in Dark Souls, neither on a mechanical or a narrative level. No offense, but this argument is complete nonsense.

Interestingly enough, Planescape: Torment actually offers you the option of ending your existence in the Fortress of Regrets. Meaning you don't even get the ending cutscene where you go to hell, because you choose oblivion and you don't get to go the afterlife. While it's basically just a non-standard game over, it's interesting that the developers actually put enough thought into it that they designed this option into the game and gave players the option of refusing to take responsibility for the crimes of the Nameless One and avoid going to hell.

>about as integrated with the setting as any D&Dlet vidya. Which is to say, not at all.
Are you seriously implying D&D video games do the worst job of integrating narrative and gameplay? What universe do you live in? I already mentioned the example of Seath the Scaless before, but that's far from the most egregious example. If you look at something like Final Fantasy X for example, or really any typical jrpg, you have a game where the characters defeat Seymour, a villain, half a dozen times over the course of a game in combat, yet at no point do they finish him of because cutscenes don't let them. And later in the game the characters get captured by two guards in a cutscene, even though they are shown to be able to defeat monsters the size of skyscrapers in combat. That sort of massive contradiction between gameplay and story happens literally dozens of times of the course of many games. D&D video games do a comparatively much better job of avoiding these issues.

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Oh yeah my bad. I know they're getting tricked by something though but I forget it's been a while since I've been in the lore scene. But yeah the void is death.

Elder scrolls died after morrowind.

You've gotta understand that D&D finds it difficult to meld setting with gameplay when it's being used as a tabletop roleplaying campaign (so long as you're not going full hexcrawl/dungeoncrawl). When it's in a video game it's worse by a tenfold. The Final Fantasy games are actually based on D&D, and they're also shit which is why I didn't mention them.
You DO go hollow in DS. It's what happens if you quit the game halfway through and never pick it back up again (on that character, anyway). That's not explicitly stated, but it's clear that what makes you the "Chosen Undead" is your own ability to pick yourself up and keep playing.
Without the world giving you a hopeless, folorn mood, that would be a pretty hackneyed theme (try, try, try again lol). But that's why the world is important: it gives you a reason to give up at the same time as it gives you a reason to keep going.

>t. seething weeb

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>you have a game where the characters defeat Seymour, a villain, half a dozen times over the course of a game in combat, yet at no point do they finish him of because cutscenes don't let them.
You've never played FFX I see

>You've never played FFX I see
What reason is there for characters to stand there like morons after they defeat Semour instead of doing the sending ritual?

The developrs of the game did that so they can have you fight Seymour over and over again for the sake of ~Drama~, but from the perspective of the characters, it makes absolutely no sense that they wouldn't do the sending ritual.

There's a reason why in Planescape; Torment, you don't come face to face with the villain until literally the last few minutes of the game. Because the developers were actually smart, and knew that if the player met the villain earlier, they would have to come up with some bullshit contrivance to explain why the villain survived/escaped and they didn't want to do that.

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But if you don't try you don't succeed.

>What reason is there for characters to stand there like morons after they defeat Semour instead of doing the sending ritual?
He literally explodes into a bunch of pyreflies like any other enemy you kill and he isn't even the final villain.

>WRPG with "cool lore"
>It's just stolen tolkein maybe with a few aspects of some folk lore shoved in there

Okage is the only JRPG that does world-building right. Change my mind.

Tolkien didn't invent the Daedric Princes or the concept of Oblivion you lorelet.

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Gotta love when WRPGcucks fall back on buzzwords and ad hominem when backed into a corner

>He literally explodes into a bunch of pyreflies like any other enemy you kill
What the fuck are you talking about? He explodes into pyreflies because Yuna sends him after you defeat him for the billionth time. Did you even play the game?

The point is that there's no reason why she coulddn't have done that after the first time you defeated him. The only reason is 'because the plot said so'.

It's hardly unique to FFX either. Most jrpgs for some reason rely on this same exact trope, where they have a boss who either repeatedly defeats the party in combat with ease, but doesn't finish them of for some reason (Kuja/Beatrix in FF9) or the other way around, a boss that the party repeatedly defeats in combat, but they let him get away for some reason (Kefka in FF6, Seymour in FFX).

It's why I can't take all the praise for jrpg stories seriously. They have lazier plotting than Saturday Morning cartoons FFS.

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>What the fuck are you talking about? He explodes into pyreflies because Yuna sends him after you defeat him for the billionth time. Did you even play the game?
>youtu.be/UHeaQiCUbuQ?t=825
You really did not play any jrpg you complain about holy shit

Actually Battlespire was an oblivion plane made by wizards.

You are genuinely retarded. They fight Seymour a bunch of times. In this particular instances he explodes into pyreflies (which makes no sense, so it's yet another example of the game coming up with more bullshit contrivances so that you have to fight him again later), but in the other occasions that they fought him, they could have easily done the sending ritual.

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>cherrypicks one out of many fights against seymour and pretends that's the only time you fight seymour
>complains that the other poster hasn't played the game

>In this particular instances he explodes into pyreflies
youtu.be/6Ls4l4UdNiQ?t=714
Dumb frogposter

Wrpg fantasy like Warhammer and Elder scrolls> cringe Japshit like Final fagtasy and Xenocringe

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DS uses the Generic fantasy of WRPG, so it's not a JRPG world at all

Are you just going to ignore this:

youtube.com/watch?v=ueCpIZOqmlU

Scroll to the 16;00 mark. They defeated him, his body is still there, yet they don't do the sending ritual for...no reason whatsoevr.

And yes, in later battles he explodes into pyreflies, which makes NO SENSE, since he is not dead (since he returns later to fight you). Care to explain that one, genius?

So good job. By highlighting all the instances where he turned into pyreflies, you've proven even further how shitty FFX"s writing is.

Retard.

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Sheogorath was always Jyggalag. Jyggalag was always Sheogorath.
There's no time outside the mortal realm.

>tries to defends FFX's writing
>points to instances where Seymour turns into pyreflies even though the game establishes characters only turn into pyreflies when they go to the afterlife
>but Seymour still repeatedly hunts down the characters to fight them, so he couldn't have gone to the afterlife, so him turning into pyreflies makes no sense

You really didn't think this through, did you?

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They're both the same Daedric Prince. Sheogorath was just a cursed Jyggalag.

>"I-It's got good lore! You're just iliterate!"

It does have good lore, stop being a smoothbrained retard, probably nwver read even one of the 37 lessons of Vivec.

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>It's why I can't take all the praise for jrpg stories seriously.
But WRPG recurrent villains who are also conveniently resurrected by the powers that be are completely fine, right?
Sarevok coming back in BG2 just to prove a point? Amazing writing.
Braccus being resurrected by multiple idiots over and over in the divinity games? A masterpiece.
Black Garius being a mustache twirling villain who literally isn't allowed to die for real throughout the entire game until the very last battle? Fucking Dostojevski couldn't have come up with anything better.

But one fucking Seymour Guado daring to be the same thing, damn fucking japs and their shitty writing, amirite?

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