FF: Tactics vs FF: Tactics Advance

Original was better, both were great
I really miss these clan building SRPGs with lots of classes and skill interactions between classes

I love FFT, but I couldnt stand the judge system in FFTA.

Is FFTA2 any better?

Would Ogre Tactics be a good game to play if I loved FFT?

RED MAGE SUMMONER DOUBLE CAST FULL MANA PUSH PEOPLE OFF EDGES AND SAGES DROPPING METEORS TURN 1 EPICCC

I liked advanced mroe desu. I liked the gameplay more and marche is a decent enough protagonist. FFT was just a boring slog both gameplay and plotwise.

patrician taste

I thought Advanced sucked ass, but I loved the original Tactics.

>Is FFTA2 any better?
No it's generally worse than FFTA

>Would Ogre Tactics be a good game to play if I loved FFT?
YES

I like tactical games, shit like xcom (yes even the old school xcom) not games where it can take 3 minutes for an AI to move

I'm playing through ff ta right now on gba emulator. It's pretty fun. Overall I think the original tactics is better in terms of playing through the game once. It has a much more compelling story and better characters. FFTA has more continous playability with constantly spawning enemies on the overworld, varying rules in each fight that stop you from steamrolling the game with the same tired tactics and missions that you send your characters on to get rewards, potentially depriving you of your best units and forcing you to diversify your unit selection. Very xcomm 2.
If I had to recommend only one to play, It would be FF tactics: war of the lions. Then if you enjoyed the game play, go to FFTA which is more of the same but more varied, with a boring and fairly short story. Also highly recommend the emulator version as just as some have said in the thread, turns can be pretty slow and the speedup functions bring it up to palatable levels.

>i like games where you have less of a chance to hit than a blind man

Can you recommend more of them?

I feel like I owe much of my academic success and problem solving skills to playing FFT at like 9-10 years old and learning about build build optimizations strategy at a young age

pardon the blog, but I love these games. Both are great, but FFT is really special and you should play it =)

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Shitter detected.

I'd much rather lose hits than seriously watch an NPC moving at like 1 square every 10 seconds

Not him, but why are you making excuses for something that doesn't need to take so long?

What are your opinion on Vandal Hearts?

FFT isn't immune that kind of bullshit either.
>mission critical revive spell misses, ramza turns into a crystal immediately after, gg

I get that gist of the story of FFT but I don't know the motivation of most of the characters or the history of the setting. Am I just a brainlet of should I just not know it yet? (At chapter 3)

Love it
Super underrated game overshadowed by the others

It was ok, fairly challenging and a bit rough around the edges.

I actually didn't beat it because my save data corrupted, but I don't really feel a strong desire to go back to it anyway 2bh

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??

I would gladly take the slow pace of FFT and TO over spending countless turns trying to track down one alien sitting in a remote corner somewhere in Terror from the Deep. That said, I love the original X-COM, and I agree that FFT and TO should resolve AI actions more quickly and have faster animations.

Agreed with this guy about ff tactics war of the lions

also agreed with this guy

how do we feel about this Tactics clone?

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Tactics for the story, Advance for the gameplay.

People actually prefer the gameplay of Advance? Am I am being trolled here? People enjoy the arbitrary rules or each encouter?

I tried FFTA2 once but dropped the game when it forced you to accept the thief girl into your party when neither Luso, Cid, or myself wanted it and there was absolutely no reason plot wise to let her join.
Does it get any better, or is it the same kind of "things happen because the plot needs them to, character actions bypass character motivations" shit like the first game was the whole way through?
I really want to like these games, but I can't stomach the lazy writing.

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Never heard of it

you can just mod out laws lmao
that said I liked them, they gave me a reason to switch tactics and use different characters

>uironically playing games for the story
Kys.

FFTA2 > FFT > FFTA

FFT has the best story and music, FFTA2 has the best gameplay but worst story, and FFTA is in the middle but nothing pays off.

I personally like more gameplay than story so i was having more fun with TA2 than FFT.

You need to read a lot of the character bios as they change by chapter and by battle.
End point is a faux War of the Roses, with the church pulling strings to revive an ancient evil they perceive to be God.

FF: Tactics is the better game and Advance is not a port.

FF: Tactics does not have this bullshit making the game unfun

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Fft was awesome, but i find tactics ogre immensively boring

and now you have!

This game is godlike. I love fat seal arbor day

Hope you mean the snes ps1 original.
Remake is garbage with easy battles and micro management of units. Like why spend more time in unit screen spending points on skills and less time in battle because you just bum rush the leader with "limit break" bullshit attacks because you get 3 turns before a ko'd unit does, because CASUAL

CAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAL

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Is it worth playing if I can't stand the art? Like holy shit, I've never seen an uglier game.

I want to FUCK a lot of vieras and breed with them

Honestly, that's my issue with the game.
The art is god awful, but everything else about it seems good? Lots of positive feed, I've yet to see anything negative about the game.

the only ugly thing, imo, is the animations, it looks good otherwise unless you really don't like a cartoon-ish artstyle

final fantasy tactics for the PSX is easily one of the best games every made, do yourself a favor and at least try it

OB64 > LUCT > FFT > FFTA

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retard

FE has the better gameplay out of all the SRPGs.

>472688992
you have to put bait on the hook if you want (you)s, man

problem there is you can fight random battles and shit for fun end game FFT but OB64 gets stupidly easy in the last 1/3

At the very least, it's more strategic. For those FEs that don't have random encounters, you have to make do with a limited amount of exp. Whereas in FFT you can just grind forever to trivialize anything.

"sequel"

no it doesn't get better plot/characters wise

FFTA2 is only for people who really like the battle gameplay of FFTA and want lost more of it. The quests, maps and uits are all good if you like FFTA, but it's story and chars are garbage.

I'd say play FFTA instead, then go back to ffta2 if you want more and just ignore the crap story.

because youre playing an army not a simpleton

>le red cards xd
t. low iq

let us cling together user

there was something really frustrating about that game's menus and information, but I haven't tried to go back since I first played it when it came out
like, it was a struggle to find out which classes could equip which weapons from the shop
and something about being able to miss out on some classes completely

we'll never fight alone

>64 posts in
>not a single post about how Marche was right
I'm surprised.

Marche was right

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here come the OLD THING GOOD people claiming FFT is superior to advance.
it isnt, Advance and Advance 2 have vastly superior gameplay.
>Muh judge system
Just fucking walk a few more steps, the laws cycle through and A2 doesnt even have that system anymore.
And even then. Having restrictions should not make you mad. its called Final Fantasy TACTICS, adapting to changing rules should be part of tactical thinking. Thats exactly why the system exists, do shake up your tried and true formulas, the only time it realy gets annoying is when hitting monsters is illegal while fighting mosnters, but thats a case for "Just walk a bit more on the world map"

The only legit criticism is that FFTA is too easy.
coudlnt get over the uglyness.

the final fantasy tactics are for literal fucking children who have no brain and can't understand a good story like any of the tactics ogre games
i can't believe people like the shitty ripoff of an actual series just because it has le epIC Final Fantasy on it!!

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oh god. I just fantazised something so fantastic, I headcanon-creamed.

What if Bravely Default 3/Third is actively Bravely Tactics.
>BD art style and chibis in a Tactics game
>Brave/Default system plus speed-up to massively quicken battles
>All the BD and BS plus BT jobs put to even better use
>On switch

I can't stop drooling

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No its just nostalgiafags that like it. Not only is it the worst in the series, its the worst in the entire genre.

Nobody plays Tactics for the story

No way fag.

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>it was a struggle to find out which classes could equip which weapons from the shop
yeah I get what you mean, I loaded a save from like three years ago and it took me about 5 seconds to find it, that shit is unacceptable

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Someone please explain WHAT SPECIFICALLY is good about FFTA's gameplay. I just remember moving my units next to enemy units and killing them, I can't think of any complex or memorable tactics for specific battles or anything like that.

It's just fun building up your units and experimenting with different skills and jobs.
It's not a hard game but fun if you're into that sort of stuff.

must have mixed it up, thanks for correcting

FFT is better and more in-depth, but FFTA has Viera, which also makes it better.

>more in-depth
in what way

It's grittier, more grimdark

Yup

I never played FFTA, but FFT is...kind of strange. Like, the systems in place are largely very good, and it's a cool world with fun main missions, but you won't see like 50% of the classes if you just play through that. You need to do a bunch of dumb grindy shit to ever see the most advanced stuff, and the most efficient way of doing that is just pretty dumb because of how xp works in the game. That xp system also incentivizes some weird things in main play if you're ever not under pressure (although you usually are, thankfully). Very rough around the edges, but its best parts are excellent.

Am I the only one who didn't mind the card system? Why do you guys have such a hate boner for it?

>I like tactical games, shit like xcom
>not games where it can take 3 minutes for an AI to move
>even the old school xcom
>where it can take 3 minutes for an AI to move

You can easily be looking at HIDDEN MOVEMENT for well over 40 seconds in xcom. No enemy turn takes that long in any of the FFT games unless you've somehow found a Calculator that's dropping Holy on your ass.

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I'd take any FFT2, FFTA3, TO2. But a BDT would be incredible

Advance is actually a way better game than Tactics which is actually an incredibly poorly designed SRPG but FFT is still FFT and worth way more than the sum of its parts.

>try to play Tactics Ogre PSP
>get raped
I know I suck when it comes to SRPG but holy fuck

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>Tactics which is actually an incredibly poorly designed SRPG
why

is this a fucking joke

The game more or less gets easier as you go along. Unlike FFT they give you the broken unit (Canopus) right away.

FFT also has some fucking insane difficulty spikes, like the Dorter slums or this son of a bitch who can fuck over your save file permanently.

I think FFT's biggest problem is that there were so many levers to pull in terms of balancing encounters that they threw up their hands and didn't even try. It has other major flaws, like how hard it is to predict damage breakpoints before committing to actions, or how mind numbingly FUCKING SLOOOOOW it is, but the fucked up difficulty curve is its biggest offense. Shit like auto-potion makes me wonder if balance was even anywhere on their radar during development.

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They're two entirely different games.

It being broken as fuck is part of what makes it so fun though
If you know what you're doing you can do some crazy shit

I still get raped, even during my first random battle.
holy fuck i suck so much

There isn't really anything good about the gameplay, it's just that most people have never played another SRPG.
The difficulty is terribly tuned. You don't have to be an experienced player who understands the systems to exploit it, a brand new player can completely trivialize the game by accident because they happen to route into auto potion quickly before carrying that momentum forward. On the other hand you can accidentally make the game almost unwinnable when you're new by building poorly enough to get locked out of story while being unable to grind due to the scaling. The actual story maps just bounce between brutal and trivial randomly.
The strategy side is marred by awful class balance and unintuitive mechanics like the bravery/faith values. There's not actually that much room to play around compared to something like LUCT or FFTA, but compared a series like FE things aren't nearly as well tuned. The tactics side is pretty much non-existent despite some great maps because it emphasizes the strategy side so much that most maps are decided before you start them by your build direction. There just isn't a lot of room for you to do anything clever because the numbers at work are so linear.

It's not just that FFT plays poorly compared to the big famous titles either. There're a lot of B list junk SRPGs like Luminous Arc or Stella Glow that actually play a lot better divorced from their own flaws. There's really nothing mechanically compelling about FFT.

I'm saying this as someone who's beaten it twenty times and completed solo Ramza archer run. The game as a whole product is amazing and I love it, great story, presentation is amazing, it avoids the pacing issue a lot of SRPGs have with snappy enough animations and a gameplay loop, the content is thick enough without overstaying its welcome, but it gets too much love in SRPG discussions still. It just does not play well.

>this son of a bitch who can fuck over your save file permanently
Please explain, just started FFT

What does your team look like? Because unless you're running a full team of rune fencers/valkyries (who start off pretty damn weak) you shouldn't struggle that much.

I'm well aware that the game lets you do retarded overpowered shit like a teleporting AoE nuke wizard with Draw Out, auto-battle holy absorbing Calculators and fleets of Martial Arts Ninjas, but almost all of the fun is on the macro character building layer and not on the actual tactical layer. A game that asks the player to police themselves in order to keep combat engaging as much as FFT does is a game with room for improvement.

There are a few story battles that occur in phases and you're given opportunities to save and shuffle your party jobs/gear around between phases. If you overwrite your only save between phases it becomes impossible to back out to the map screen, which can cause you to lose yourself into a corner if you get through phase 1 but hit the wall on phase 2. Keep backup saves in different save slots before those missions and you'll be fine.

I don't think it was humanly possible to effectively balance a game like that back in 1997 unless you had a ridiculously lengthy development period - something that Square was adamantly against for most projects. Much like Tactics Ogre, it sort of ran with it and introduced look ideas as the team saw fit, regardless of good the implementation was.

Sometimes there are maps you have to do in succession and you can't go back to the world map once you're in there. His fight is a 1v1 and if your Ramza sucks ass he will wreck you. If Ramza is so weak you can't salvage it, your only way out is to load an earlier save from before you went in. If you didn't keep several save files, you're fucked. So in short, keep several save files (which you should do in every game anyway). Or just give Ramza the auto-potion skill, problem solved.

Advance had a fucking retarded stoy, but a decent set of characters and races

Tactics: War of the Lions is the best FF, the best FF tactics and the most tragic MC out of all FF games in my opinion

What would you say are the best SRPGs in terms of gameplay? I feel like Yggdra Union is pretty high up there.

>War of the Lions

Why are you spreading lies?

OP play the original on the PS1 and not that pseudo-Shakespearean trash that is WotL. The extra content is just not worth the cringe.

Weigraf is a notoriously difficult boss that does a lot of damage and has more range than most melee classes, which most people run a melee Ramza. What's worse is you don't have your party for the first half of the battle so you're on your own and every turn counts. And it tends to fuck over new players who just don't know about him.

There are worse fights though. Personally I pulled one of these numbers.
>Forced to attack MP until it's reduced to zero
>Recover MP with every step
>completely impossible for him to kill me

The Elmdore fight on the roof is the true bullshit

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>judges
>race locked jobs
yeah how about no

Okay so strategery and tactics are one thing but which game had the best girls?

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Yggdra Union is great. As far as the strategy heavy titles where you spend a lot of time in menus go, I'm inclined towards LUCT, but the better Fire Emblems are my favourites to play just for gameplay. Very few SRPGs try very hard to make the tactics side very compelling.

At this point you're better off asking which TO girl is the best.

Everyone bitches about the elevated English in WotL but after the first chapter I completely stopped noticing it

>not that pseudo-Shakespearean trash that is WotL
The old english translation is very appropriate given the tone and subject matter of the games. It's only sins are rewriting the odd cool lines in the original translation and retranslating the names.

Yeah but then the answer is just Ozma and that doesn't really make much for discussion, does it

>it gets too much love in SRPG discussions
cuz there's nothing else

What would be needed to make the tactics side compelling? I've never played Jagged Alliance, and only about 20 minutes of the original XCOM, but I know those are heralded as the best. I don't know much about them though.

Fair enough. I do like me some fat fucking witch thighs though

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Thanks for explaining, that makes a lot of sense. I do think the job system is cool and I thought there were some cool maps, and I thought there were a reasonable amount of viable class setups, but I understand your complaints.
I'm a bit confused though, why is advance a much better game? I thought the gameplay was far more dull and forgettable, though I can't remember it well enough to explain why.

Any thoughts on SMT devil survivor or Growlanser (if that counts)?

Is there any debate?

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>her shop sprite does that slow uncrossing and cross leg thing

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Tactics Ogre > FFT > FFTA = FFTA2 (1 has better plot, 2 has better gameplay)

So why did the genre just ... die? Disgaea is pratically dead, company stopped making b-listed games like Stella Glow, the Advance War clones are garbage. Only FE is still alive, somehow
Feel like RTS all over again

I played FFTA when I was a kid, didn't have a problem with laws and judges, I thought it was a nice concept, manipulating the law to make the enemy break the rules and get carded was fun as fuck

make multiple save files that are far apart from each other storywise

It's not like making a game that emphasizes tactics is particularly hard, it's that the devs have decided not to do it and that's perfectly fine. It's a preference. Most SRPGs are essentially JRPGs on grids where you get a lot of units to build. For the most part it's not that there needs to be tactics elements added, it's that there're too many strategy elements diluting it.

I haven't played Growlanser but Devil Survivor pretty much ditches the pretenses of being a tactics game and goes all in on the "this is a JRPG on a grid" design and it's fine for it, but you're literally moving units around and then entering turn based combat screens.
FFTA just isn't as broken of a game as FFT when it comes down to it. The law system is divisive at best but it means you need to give more consideration to your preparations and play, and otherwise the game is just way better balanced. You can technically make anything work in FFT but the difference between good set ups and bad set ups is massive, and the bad ones are generally only workable by exploiting other systems. In FFTA everything has some utility without just being completely outclassed by five other similar set ups scaled better, and while you can brute force the game you need intention to break it, it doesn't just snap itself in half by accident.

The Nu-Xcom games are a really good example of making the genre more accessible while retaining most of its appeal as far as the tactics side goes. Building unstoppable juggernauts that trivialize the tactics layer is pushed out of focus until the reverse difficulty curve kicks in lol in favour of giving the player more options for mitigating risk. Numbers are low and arithmetic is kept easy to make the outcomes from actions more predictable. There's no bullshit like in FFT where you need to account for a dozen different damage formulas that have 2 to 3 stats thrown in them. Playing well on the tactical level gives bigger bonuses than statchecking the shit out of everything, which means you're rewarded for playing well instead of just throwing the overpowered units you've grinded up at the problem.

In other words, planning more than one turn ahead is actually plausible.

The nu-Xcom games have a lot of problems of their own and a TON of room for improvement, but I think a lot of Japanese SRPGs can learn from it. Some of them, like the good Fire Emblems, achieve some of the same goals more or less by accident. One example is how some Fire Emblems limit combat encounters, which means experience is a finite resource, which means grinding isn't an option.

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I want to blame the fact there aren't really any consoles that work with turn-based SRPGs any more. Something about this genre went really well with handhelds, but now everyone uses phones and mobile games are by and large trash or gacha or both. There's the occasional knockoff indie game that pops up on steam but they all seem to have awful art and worse writing, to say nothing of the gameplay.

showing my age here but maybe the kids these days simply don't have the patience for this type of game.

There's still indie, like voidspire tactics, fell seal, or maybe xcom if you squint really hard.

There's only one fight in FFT that still gives me trouble 20 years and 20 runs later: Golgorand Execution Site. Fuck this map to hell. People bring up Dorter, Wiegraf, and Riovanes Roof constantly, but Golgorand is the true hell. Try that shit on any sort of challenge run - it fucking sucks. Other than that, it's the greatest game ever made, flaws and all. The original PS1 version, of course; not that Shakespearean WotL shit.

because the market moved more towards the mass crowd, who don't have the brains for Strategy or turn based games in general, even if those games aren't actually that hard. I'm sure there's some occasional indies and shit, and Fire Emblem only survived because of Awakening. It pretty much is in the same boat as RTS, honestly.

Niche genres. Most people have never cared about strategy games, but they sold enough to be made for players that care by devs who care.
The problem is that development costs keep going up and the player base hasn't grown proportionately, so we still get indie titles that do well enough but large devs are just better off spending resources on something that sells more reliably. Fire Emblem is only alive because they managed to find a niche outside of the actual gameplay but it spent years dying.

FFT is the best game of this kind and always will be, something I am sure of despite playing no other games in the genre except FFTA.

Thank you. This is all very interesting to me because I'm planning on making an SRPG of my own. I definitely need to play JA and XCOM at some point.

As for Fire Emblem, some of the most fun I've ever had in it was playing Conquest Lunatic. Chapter 10, the one where you have to defend for 11 turns. Absolutely brutal. Fates does allow you to grind with DLC, but I always find that boring so I don't do it. So with the characters I had available, I had to figure out a plan. And because Lunatic is so brutal, there's very little room for error. I was constantly having to change up my strategy on the fly, turn by turn, based on what happened the previous turn. I slowly got closer and closer to turn 11, and got further more consistently. Finally beat it. That was way more fun than being able to grind forever to curbstomp whatever you come across, like what FFT or TO allows you to do.

But to be fair, I guess if you made a point to avoid grinding in those games like I did in Conquest, it would be more necessary to plan your moves carefully.

I realize this is getting off topic but do you guys like battle for wesnoth?

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If you're deadset on making an SRPG keep in mind what this cool dude said . There's more than one way to skin a cat, and the fans of the genre like these games for different reasons. Nu-XCOMbabs like nu-XCOM because it borders on a boardgame, is very tense and is more respectful of their time. Old XCOM and the JA games feel almost like simulation games to play. Disgaea and its knockoffs are basically JRPGs with a layer of positioning chucked in.

Never played it, can you give me a pitch? Do you have any recommended gameplay footage?

In the PSP WotL I remember there was a metric fuckton of weapons and items locked behind some co-op modes. Is there any way/mod to get around that?

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It's alright. If people say XCOM's hit percentage is annoying, they should play this.

Well, I'm not making it to target any particular fanbase. I'm making it more for myself than anything. Some mechanics that I think would be cool and would allow for strategy/tactics. If other people like the game, that's cool.

advance is a completely different game story-wise.

Ugly characters, terrible combat animations, good map design, extremely modulable difficulty, great class system, interesting combat items system, decent soundtrack, fun.

terrible games. both of them.

It's an open source turn based tactics game, very simple but plenty of strategy. The hit percentages are low but despite that you can beat campaigns reliably if you use your units right.
wesnoth.org/
Ironically I can't find good gameplay footage on youtube since (other than pvp) people just upload their replays to the forums while casuals record footage, but here's a playlog if that helps
forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=43304

Actually good SRPG mmo fucking when

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>make an army of bunnygirls who petrified every other enemy unit in the game for no muss/no fuss.

Fast battles and trophies of my conquest.

to add to this, perhaps I'll get some flak for this but while there is definitely the appeal of tactics on the fly, positioning, and all that good stuff, one thing that I enjoy about these types of games is building up a team, watching it come together over the game, and then unleashing them on maps and watching them plow through everything with the satisfaction of a team well built. That doesn't mean grind until they're gods, it just means that the part that some people dislike and might call menu busywork, can also be a major part of the appeal for others.

You might have one end of the spectrum be chess, or Into the Breach for a game example, where your team and abilities are limited if not fixed and battles are more like pure exercises in strategy, and something like LUCT or Disgaea at the other end where there's an absurd amount of optional, flavorful, but not necessarily essential or even optimal content. Where the "best" team you could make would probably be an entire party of archers but I'd just as soon not play at all rather than do something like that because there are all these interesting classes and weapon arts and spells to choose from, even if they're suboptimal.

tl;dr consider that there are many reasons why someone might want to play an SRPG, and the appeal will differ between people. My advice would be not to try and have your cake and eat it too; pick a broad end of either spectrum, make sure you communicate well what type of game it's going to be and where the main appeal lies, and you should be fine.

>I have ADHD: The Post

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that's not even ADHD, that's pure retarded
you can speed up enemy movement in the options menu at any point in the game

it's a shitty mechanic anyone with a modicum of taste hates it

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>here come the OLD THING GOOD people claiming FFT is superior to advance.
No so much OLD THING GOOD as SHITTY HANDHELD SHIT IS SHIT

Love the first one to death. Game had a lot of charm and a surprising amount of difficulty in certain missions, especially if you were going for the hidden items in the stages. Being able to choose branching paths for your characters to develop was also nice. I usually replay it every year or so, just to screw around with different team comps. Diego is almost always a Sniper, though, just for that chunky sound effect of the arrow pulverizing an enemy when it hits. The second one, while full of interesting ideas, never really managed to appeal to me as much as the first one, or many others in the genre, did.

I hear what you're saying, but my goal here was never to make the next big SRPG or lots of money or whatever. It's just a hobby venture. A game with mechanics I think would be interesting, and which are already mostly planned out. But when I get to the point of release, I'll be sure to explain the game to the supposed audience.

>SRPG mmo
Never. MMOs suck by default.

Oh yeah I read the post about making it for yourself after typing up that entire thing. Absolutely, if you're doing it for you then by all means make it according to what you want to see.

but please do us all a favor and shell out a couple extra bucks for a good artist/composer, a little presentation goes a long way.

Oh for sure. Don't want another Fell Seal on our hands.

I wouldn't go that far. The idea behind FFTA's laws seems to be encouraging you to have a diverse team/set of options to work into different battles, rather than finding and focusing on one of the games broken strategies. The problem is I remember the laws feeling strict and the whole system comes across as off putting with how punishing it seemed to be. I also think FFTA2 did a slightly better job with it and overall for the 'Advanced' formula, in that laws were mostly optional challenges and generally easy enough to avoid breaking, outside some RNG bullshit like uncontrollable knockbacks and such.

I hated the judges.

FFT anyway is balanced so that there's always interesting decisions to make on every turn. Also, FFT and I think TO should have per-unit turn order, so it should be at least somewhat rare to have to sit through a long sequence of enemy turns.

It also comes off as patronizing and artificial as hell.

I loved FFTA but it always irked me that the MC didn't change his appearance to match his job. Soldier forever.
Never played FFT.

It's the same for all Tactics games, including Tactics Ogre and Fell Seal. At least Ramza's (FFT) and Denam's (TO) appearance change depending on the story progression.

I got used to the style pretty quickly, it's a lotta fun and worth it imo

Because the laws in FFTA are really vague and are only there to fuck you over. Prime example? Let's say there's a law that says Holy is forbidden. Easy right? Just don't use white magic. Except healing items like potion also count as Holy. Obviously this is fucking bullshit, what the card actually means is no healing. But you would never know the first time around

To add to that, skills affected by an attribute modifier from a weapon, i.e. Excalibur, will also count as an holy violation. It's fucking retarded.

I do remember once fighting one of the anima, I think they were called, under a law that just prevented it from doing anything except sitting there until I beat them it to death. That was pretty fucking satisfying.

How are the difficulty patches? I think 1.3 was the big one. Saw an attempt to port it to the PSP version and wanted to try it the next time I play FFT.

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The crystals sprout things? IIRC no fire/no sleep fucks them over as they can take red cards.

Have you ever played through any Advance Wars on Hard Campaign? Some of those maps will fuck you in the ass. Progressively learning and earning S ranks is really satisfying.

Never played Advance Wars, no. Sounds interesting though.

FFT and and the two Tactics ogre games have by far my favourite video game stories.

Mrgrlgrlrl

You can have two PSP connected to play solo co-op, this also works if you open two emulators and try to connect them inside your computer with AdhocServer. I remember doing it a while back but I forgot how.

How is Knight of Lodis compared to LUCT?

Played FFT for the first time recently, I liked the story for the first few acts, but by act 4 I felt like it got pretty stale.

How do I break FFT? I've got calculators, monks, ninjas, samurai. What's the combination to fuck em all up?

No TRPG/SRPG which has a "facing" mechanic has ever used it in a way that adds enough complexity or depth to justify it's inclusion.

The majority of them boil down to "you have better accuracy if you don't attack from the front", and it literally wastes hours of cumulative menuing for fucking nothing.

shit

I agree. How would you feel about it if a unit can only counterattack in the direction they're facing? So that as the attacker, you'd be incentivized to not attack from the front so as to not be counterattacked. I guess it ends up being about the same though, in terms of decision making. In either situation, there's never any reason you'd want to attack from the front, unless you have no other option.

It would be cool if some classes got a bonus to attacking head on, like knights or something.

FFTA2 and Fell Seal remove the accuracy bonus and replace it by damage modifier. It's a shitty trade off, in my opinion, as it makes evasion completely useless in the early game and in the late game, it allows for absolutely ridiculous evasion build. That 50% evasion faggot in FFTA2 was a nightmare.

Obviously raised damage (via hit rate) from behind isn't a good idea, because that just incentivizes always attacking from behind (like we already do). But if attacking front vs. sides vs. rear led to things like % chance to reduce move rate, reduce counterattack damage, or other exotic statuses, that could spice things up. Just keep damage out of the formula, because damage is in the top tier of things smart players prioritize.

You could have a leg sweep attack that only works from the side etc.

How about, attacking from the front "locks" a unit into place for that turn? Attack from the sides or the back and sure, you get better hit rate or whatever, but they can move wherever afterwards. But if you attack from the front, you can prevent an enemy from going anywhere else.

though I can see this being bad news for your own units. You'd need a way to break it off.

FFTA and FFTA2 have the Ahriman monster family who have reliable status inducer skills that can only hit enemies facing the user. Maybe we need more of that.

>Ahriman
Had to look up what they were. Fits perfectly for needing "line of sight" so to speak. What you described immediately made me think of medusa or some sort of hypnotism.

Need a blackthorne shotgun move to counter that,

>Medusa
One of the Lamia class in Tactics Ogre does just that, petrify everyone on the map looking at her direction. Shame it's the only move in the game that does directional shit, besides maybe a back strike skill.

Vantage Master has increased damage based on facing and I think it works well, personally.

There's a lamia/medusa type enemy in LUCT that has a skill that tries to make all your units turn to face her. They then follow it up with a move that has a chance to petrify anyone facing her. Thank fuck it's got a low success rate because it's a nasty combo in theory, and you're probably all facing towards the enemy anyway.

Oh yeah, rogues have a sneak attack skill that does more damage on back attacks. Lamias also have a special skill that turns everyone on the map to face her. I think it only works on males iirc.

I really need to use some monster units next time I play LUCT. I only ever use humans and it seems like there's some cool shit I'm missing out on. Though it doesn't help that there are no actual nonhuman characters, just generics.

Octopuses and golems are very solid, especially early game. The rest is basically ass.

>No TRPG/SRPG which has a "facing" mechanic has ever used it in a way that adds enough complexity or depth to justify it's inclusion.
>The majority of them boil down to "you have better accuracy if you don't attack from the front", and it literally wastes hours of cumulative menuing for fucking nothing.
What a dumbfuck ignorant comment.
1. You can only move once per turn.
2. You (usually) cannot simultaneously move to exploit a rear vulnerability and move to a better defensive position.
3. You must choose to either strike head-on at lower hit-rate and move to a superior defensive position, or maneuver for a higher hit-rate but sacrifice your position.
4. Awareness of the environment, turn order, and capabilities of your allies and enemies can change and mitigate the risk of the more aggressive maneuver. That is: good use of tactics. In a tactics game.
5. You are one dumb motherfucker.

I always use at least one dragon/golem, they're insane tanks with big dick damage skills, even at range.

I wish you could get necromancers earlier and less painfully, the idea of recruiting all-undead parties is pretty cool too. But holy fuck Cressida is one of the most flat out unfair characters to recruit, and you can't get a generic necro until pretty late game depending on the route you took.

With humanoids, avoid fairies. Stick to lamias, lizards and orcs (lol). Early on, they'll only have access to a very limited number of classes also used by humans, but later on you'll get exclusive classes that can only be found with them. The actual monster classes are decent with great stat growths, thanks to having to compensate for a lack of equipment.

>blame yourself...or God
*Tips fedora*

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>all this shitflinging for "strategies" in a piss easy single player game

You've cleared Deep Dungeon on FFT 1.3, I assume?

>How would you feel about it if a unit can only counterattack in the direction they're facing?

Done in Vanguard Bandits IIRC

Was that supposed to be hard? The only challenge Ive faced in the game was the Slums level and the Execution site because you dont have good jobs by that point.

Why does that imply someone has ADHD? Action speed can be sped up. Tactics moves at a snails pace compared to Fire Emblem.

>compared to Fire Emblem
No shit genius. You can totally skip animations and even the enemies' whole turn. Turn based games are not for the impatient

Fire Emblem is a turn based game you idiot.

Based illiterate zoomer

>Does it get any better, or is it the same kind of "things happen because the plot needs them to, character actions bypass character motivations" shit like the first game was the whole way through?
I played at least half of the main story of that game and it didn't really feel like it was going anywhere since it was all over the place.

I tried playing Stella Glow to scratch the itch but it was futile, I even bought the android port of FFT. New game fucking when?

Try voidspire tactics, vaguely scratches the itch.

Fell Seal is the latest of that genre. The art style might turn you away, but the game is really solid. There's a GOG installer floating around on the internet if you want to try it out first.

Play Tactics Ogre, if you haven't already

Play Nectaris Military Madness

No you cant I'm at the options screen right now. Stop lying.

They're all really good. War of the Lions is the best, but honestly, every tactics game is like a 9/10, you're talking decimal points of difference between the quality here.

I'm going to shill a shitty game I found on Steam for a second: Fell Seal: Arbiter's Mark

The story is generic trash, but it's a straight clone of FFTA except with the difficulty turned up. Absolute meatgrinder of a game, they really nailed the tactics element. If you can ignore the story and characters you might get a kick out of it.

>vastly superior gameplay
proceeds to not explain why the he thinks it has superior gameplay.

In the PSP version there is

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Be right back, committing genocide.

Based, Shame she's a bit tricky to get. At least she's not Cressida tier retarded.

New races and classes, less harsh judge penalties, a better overworld and slightly more balanced classes. Also some much better side stories than FFTA. I enjoyed it

>that art style

No thanks.

Get that Wallister born of Galgastani stock out of here.

nah

Is it even possible to get a "good" ending as King Denam in Tactics Ogre?

generic viera red mage

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I mislike your tone, user.

I love and hate Wesnoth. It's a fun little hex game, but the devs philosophy in regards to RNG is fucking backwards. It's *too* random. A good player can lose to a shitty player because the dice can just straight fuck him despite him making perfectly optimal moves. RNG should be an accountable point, not a deciding factor in a specifically competitively balanced tactics game.

Like I said, ignore it. It's worth the price for the mechanical depth alone.

>letting Catiua die
you monster
a guide is highly recommended, it's easy to say the wrong thing 20 hours ago.

*blocks your path*

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It's deeper than a system that doesn't take positioning into account because it encourages you to move your units as a group to cover your flank and think about where you're moving around the environment. It's a little simplistic and could use more gimmicks to keep it interesting (like turtle units that take very little damage from the back), but games are still better off with the mechanic than without.

I will fear no reproach.

Growlanser (that one that came out for PSP) is legit challenging. It has some unconventional battle system though, IIRC the battles go in real time and if you want to change your orders you pull out a menu or something. I do remember it requires you to plan your strategy, it's far from being mindless.

Dual-Wielding knights are fun. Double stat breaks can trivialize bosses.

I remember restarting my first save because I went chaos route thinking it would let me get her only for her to get penetrated by Vyce

is himeko sutori any good? looks good, but I'm wary of full price for steam games.

what trpg has better maps than FFT?

>Growlanser
Almost an RTS due to its real time actions. You have a party of 4 and depending to the conditions (like rescue NPCs or go to a certain point in the map), strategies change. You may have a party of 4 but there are allies that will help you during missions, making the missions a mayhem sometimes.
Definitely one of my favorites.

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it's awesome if you like looking at shit

actually all of the generic viera characters are qt

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Jesus man, you’re all kind of wrong and retarded. The AI’s turns altogether takes 45 seconds at most,

Using one right now but damn they're so fricking slow

This far in and not a single mention of Frimelda? Best side story, best FFT girl

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That was the moment I realized LUCT had topped FFT for me.

>You must...You must kill them. All of them. Spare no one
>I understand

That was the point where shit got real and I really fell in love with the game.

I liked FFTA better because the job system was more enjoyable, and it was harder to make absolutely broken character (though it was easier to make do nothing characters). The story is better, with debates still raging on about Marche's actions. Some people dont like the Law system, but Laws become very useful if you understand how to use them.