So are Dragon Quest fans happy with how Hero turned out?

>Remove random crits and instead have every 8th smash crit guaranteed

You realize all this would do is make a Hero player repeatedly spam smash attacks until the 7th smash attack to have a crit ready for the next one?

dude just nerf crits and strong moves lmao

I think they wanted to have their cake and eat it too with this move. Now you know what it feels like to be the monsters that cast it, instead of fucking Kiryl wasting all of his MP.

>That one guy that casts Wack on a whim at the start of the match and gets the kill at 0

Got to drive in the fear of it into the noobs that haven't played DQ yet.

Only an option when the enemy is offstage, at which point they sacrifice buffing themselves with spells or applying offstage pressure. It's not a perfect solution, I admit, but it's still better than RNG.

Exception applies when you're playing great stage offensive or some such, but I assume you don't really care at that point.

I honestly think Hero would overall be better under the circumstances I've listed. I'm not trying to nerf the character, I'm just trying to make him more consistent.

Where the fuck is the DQV rep? Do the japs hate DQV?

And boring
He is mid tier anyways because of the inconsistency, let us non competitive types have fun

What does magic burst even do? Everyone keep bitching but i never saw it in action

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Large, slow explosion. It can edge guard really well.

No, DQ V is one of the most popular games in the franchise and DQ V Hero, Bianca and Pankraz are super popular characters. They just felt that DQ IV Hero would be a better Zenethian rep since he can wield the Zenethian gear.

It is so easy to spot fake DQ fans on this board

Is having a more usable fair/bair/dtilt at any given moment really more boring to you than having a random magic burst? Sad.

Madason isn't the hero

DQ5 MC is not a Hero

I'm very happy, especially because now everywhere I go online people are asking where to start with a game series I've loved for a while and this wouldn't have happened without Smash because 30 years ago NoA fucked up the marketing.

Literally not a hero.

He's still the game's "hero", he's just not the chosen hero.

Uses up all MP and it's power is determined by how much MP you had as well as range. It has a start up though and anything that deals hitstun will knock Hero out of it, while still draining all MP. It makes a good surprise, or edge guard. My last kill with it was jumping from ledge into Down B and not even looking at what I was picking. They couldn't react to it. They died at 30%

I think his critical hit rate will be nerfed to like 1 in 16 come the next patch. It's incredibly strong.

Uses all of Hero's remaining MP to create a huge ball that damages exactly the number of MP hero has. If Hero has 72 MP, he's going to deal 72 damage.

Yeah I know thats what I meant
He also wouldnt use Kazap as that a hero only skill and he doesnt have a sword in any official art so it would look weird

>Literally spoiling it for everyone
They didn't pick "Hero" as the DLC character. They picked the multiple reps from DQ as the DLC character. Because they didn't pick the DQV rep, it was just convenient to just call that slot "Hero". They could have easily just call it "Eleven" with palette swaps.

>Generic ass moveset
What did she mean by this

Its a 27 year old game
I dont give a fuck
Specially not about smash babbies that only NOW care, fuck those people

The issue is the inconsistency not the rate. If they made it every 8th instead of on average one in eight, I don't think anyone would care. It would allow you to both use it and play around it strategically. Reducing the rate does nothing to help people feeling cheated when they get hit by a random crit.

I know, Hero's smashes suck and you'll not easily be hit by them, but the fact that a crit can shield break and is unpredictable is a problem.

Also on that not, alternatively, reduce the shield damage on a crit to that of a normal smash. In fact, I suspect they'll eventually do that.

DQV is almost three decades old, user. The statute of limitations on spoiling it has been up longer than most people on this board have been alive.

"Hero" in DQ is an RPG class with it's own set of abilities, not just a title. MC of 5 is monster tamer, not a "hero".

Unfortunately I would put some of the blame on SE as well. While FF was making it's 4th game for the SNES, DQ was stuck on the NES in 1993. A fucking death sentence for the west, since everyone had already moved on at that point. The west was just never going to like the more cute designs compared to FF monsters, combined with western games giving us stuff like Doom and Mortal Kombat. No matter how much marketing NoA could have thrown at it.

>double mp cost
>halve mp bar
>only 2 spells in down b menu
There. Fixes.

Make it three, so you can get to all of them with only one move of the stick. It sucks being the third spell and knowing that if it was any of the others, you might have gotten it off without being hit.

That's because opponents generally don't look at what Hero players are choosing on their menu. It's basically tunnel vision as they charge in thinking the other guy is hesitating.

You made him bottom tier congrats

>it's normally treated as a joke move but it's stupidly good in Smash.
I wish people stopped saying this because it's not fucking true. The joke is NES/Famicom Dragon Quest 4 the character Cristo/Kiryl uses Beat/Defeat or Wack/Thwack a lot. Against common enemies death spells honestly work wonders. The issue is he will use it against bosses for the first 4-5 rounds when he should be healing. Which lead to a lot of player death. So the joke isn't how useless Thwack is because it's honestly not a useless spell. It's that character AI casting it against bosses that's the joke.

I think they didn't use DQV's Hero because he doesn't mainly use a sword in official art

Also
>make all specials deal only 3/4th of their current damage
I don't see anything wrong with that.

I don’t play hero, but I think that’s too many nerfs. Just make the spells 1.5 x what they are now. Hero is a crapshoot.

If people are gonna pretend that DQV is their favorite game in the series, then they should know WHY the DQV MC isn't one of Hero's skins in Smash. If they end up getting spoiled when people remind them, they shouldn't have acted like retards in the first place.

Can wait until Dragon Quest Awakening floods the series with dating mechanics and waifus
>wait, isn't that just DQ5?
I'm talking MORE WAIFUS, at least 12

So it's Marin Karin then?

At this point everyone immediately assumes DQV is the best one. Even smashfags who never played it.

I am not happy with the movelist being mix of all 4 games only 8 can psych up for example

Why do you need that many nerfs for a character that isn't even the best character?

The other games just didn't decide to use it because they didn't need it.

Wont happen until Horii dies
Funny how there was a collect the girls game made out of pokemon before DQ which still doesnt have one, and probably wont.

I just beat P3 a week ago, if you actually change Mitsuru's tactics she hardly uses that

Im more bothered by psyche up costing MP, its redundant with oomph anyways, they should take it out.

It was always a meme
When I played P3 all those years ago Marin karin was actually really useful most of the time, and your healer is supposed to be stupei bitch anyways

Only when fully charged/buffed. Also, missing the smash leaves Hero incredibly wide open for a counter attack. Seriously, he's just asking for a beatdown since players just keep spamming it over and over again and missing.

Don't really care about Smash but he seem like a nice addition plus lots of nice fan service to the series. Guess my only "issue" is how DQ3 and 4 hero opens with picking male or female. So having them be all male when DQ3 could be male and DQ4 be female would be nice. But am someone that played as female DQ4 hero recently.
Pretty much. It's a well known joke in Japan. So much so Dragon Quest Heroes has him and his ultimate attack is just him being pissed his death spell doesn't work.

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I distinctly remember using psyche up in 7

Are you angry about that?

Holy fuck why is this shit not nerf yet? I usually spam projectiles to stop hero fags from using menus, Tfw wii fit/Isabelle main. Also can we talk about how bounce is fucking op against projectile heavy characters, I can't do a fucking thing while it's up

But the chances are working against the hero here. 1 in 10 chances to shield bust is actually pretty rare. And if it doesn't shield bust, he's now vulnerable. And even if you shield bust, you're now relying on another 1/10 chance to crit smash. People have a tendency to remember only when it works but never when it doesn't.

Angry about what?

LOL LETS RELEASE A CHARACTER WHO IS ALL ABOUT BEING RANDUMB!!!!11!

twitter.com/tisakata/status/1156438915085029376/video/1

I don't see how anyone can even try to take this game seriously with this character present

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>Has the most Specials in the entire game
>Generic

Magic burst needs nerfs, normals need buffs. Anyone with a brain saw this in hour one.

looks pretty based to me

these salty retard nips will get him nerfed dont worry

Yes.

That.

Because it uses up all of your MP, which is your most vulnerable state. Even if you do get a kill with it, you might die in just a little bit later because your normals are pretty bad in most cases. At this point, you are trying to fight for MP back and getting knocked off stage is a death sentence. Yes you could get it up on last stock, so that won't matter, but then a bunch of the rest of Hero's kit is the same.

It wouldn't matter even if the damage was reduced by half, the size of the explosion is more then enough. Also, fine, take it. Kaswoosh will still edge guard better then it ever could.

WHAT THE FUCK

use it off stage or to edgeguard and they're fucked basically

notafan.png

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What if Magic burst is changed to not go through the stage floor?

Except you can easily get enough MP for literally anything when you hit any of your normal attacks. There's basically no risk involved.

>Hero gets banned by FGC
>nobody will care about him anymore
>Yea Forums will be eternally seething

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DQV is only my favorite DW because it's the only one I've finished.
I want to play another one, though. I didn't like 9, really, but I loved 5, especially the monster taming part.
I dunno which I would try next, maybe 8 or 11?

Not even a Dragon Quest fan yet and he's fucking fun. I'm gonna go play those remakes on the 3ds now

His normals don't need buffs when every special he has deals 25% minimum.
>b-b-but he can run out of mp!
Impossible unless you use Magic Burst. The sheer amount of MP you have from the start and how fast you get it back in normal gameplay means it's very unlikely to even run out

Who is talking about banning him? I don’t see it anywhere but here, gotta assume it’s some autist trying to force it.

Its pretty easy if you spam powerful spells.

I'm a big dragon quest fan and I love all the fanservice Hero got (though I feel it wasn't as much as Joker got) but I absolutely hate how broken he is. I really hope they fix it.
It is not enjoyable to play as him or against him because he can just, knock someone out in only a few hits.

It's the Purple Chaos Blast looking move iirc.

They have done that with other characters, so maybe.

Already people have figured out that Hero has trouble retaliating when being juggled. If he doesn't have MP, he has no real "Get off me" moves. Shulk had no problems putting him in a state where he couldn't do anything but get knocked around the stage, since his normals are pretty bad, some of them also have no hitboxes where they should, including his dash attack.

I'm not much of a Dragon Quest fan but I like Hero in Smash, just a bit OP with their RNG use, will definitely be nerfed next update for sure.

Except for getting magic burst at the precise moment to use it. I mean, this isn't a 'pick whatever spell whenever I want' move here.

He's fun as hell. I don't see why people hate him so much. That menu is hard to use in the heat of battle without being either predictable or leaving yourself open in general.
I've fought a lot of heroes and I've used him a lot and I'd say he's just normal A tier, maybe A+ against certain characters with no means to reflect or projectile war with him.

Yeah, honestly Hero is a lot of fun. Not surprised he triggered so many though

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The frame data shouldn't be buffed, but some of the hitboxes need fixed to match where the sword is. Dash attack, uptilt behind him, up smash, all of these are broken. Down Smash is slightly smaller then his sword, but I think this one is intentional.

I said it's a case of selective memory here. People only remember the times his RNG has fucked them over but not the time when it didn't. The law of probability it working against Hero here, so roughly 4/5 of the time, Hero's RNG is ineffective.

His F smash fucking sucks, it has no hitbox on the top for some reason, its a worse doriyah, good luck ever landing that agains anyone competent

Yeah, the only things that are for sure is when you wanna go for a buff like Oomph, Psyche up or Heal. Everything else you've gotta pray to the RNG gods that you get it at the right time and quick enough.

>character is SLOW
>character has no kill throws, basically 0 combos
>character has to manage a resource
>character has rng that will most likely not give him something helpful
>said rng can be negated by rushing him down anyway

>but character can *sometimes* kill at low% if everything aligns his way, like a good character but with a lot of extra steps
HURR BROKEN

Yeah I'm thinking it's you guys that's the problem

He's a pretty good example of a character that is going to be bodied super hard by characters with amazing aerial game. Shulk, Pikachu and the like can make it so he can't react to anything, since his aerial frame data is so bad and trying to down B and hope is too risky, since you can Kaklang or Kamikaze. Spacies also shut down his spells completely and can turn his recovery against him. I would say he's going to be even less on the list, B tier. He'll get some lucky wins because he got his really good spells off, but most of the time he's going to be bodied before he gets the chance.

Does anyone know what his weight is?

fucking this

I feel like Hero is going to be everyone's alt at some point because he is the ultimate wildcard choice. His down+b is something no player can reasonably predict for. If someone needs to shake things up in a match because they are getting stomped on, he would be their first go-to choice.

Very.

It triggers my autism that they just call them Hero

It feels like they rushed him out. Some of his normals are missing obvious hit boxes. Up smash is the worst in the game, it can't hit anywhere slightly to the side of him, F-Smash has no vertical box at all, it's hitbox doesn't activate until the sword is in front of him. D-smash's hit box is slightly smaller then the sword. Dash attack is the same as F-smash, it has no hit box at a certain point, which is silly because it does before and after. Uptilt has no hit box behind Hero. It's like they designed the spells first and then forgot that he needed normals.

That's what he's called everywhere. Are you upset that they call Pokemon Trainer by that name?

I've been fighting my buddy who uses Palutena and I'd agree that air game is the roughest with him. You've gotta do some wacky mindgames to win in the air but he can do it although with a lot of risk.
It might be because I'm coming from maining Zelda but I've been having a good time with Hero. The A tier might just be because I've been starved of playing a decent character out of stubbornness.

Play DQ idiot.
Hero is a title.

Come on you can at least nerf that magic burst, it covers nearly the entire screen

Only because he was giant when using it, its usually not that big

Magic burst has about a 7% chance to appear every time he opens the menu. If he manages to put you in a situation where it would be useful AND it happens to appear, I would hope it would be good

I'm gonna be honest here and just say even if he weren't a big boy during that he'd still get the kill because it's magic burst

Also can't say I'm a big fan of his spells stacking like that

you're a fucking retard if you think they were going to give him decent normals with how strong his specials are, he is well designed.

No I think they made his normals pretty fucking bad on purpose, its their idea of balance.

>People still mad
E V O L V E

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Welp, this is it Yea Forums, think i'm just gonna end it here, I dont think I can take this shit anymore.
>just lost 4k in stocks
>family wants to stab and murder and kill me until im dead
>keep hearing niggers giggling 10 feet from my window every night
>get gang stalked every single day
>older brother has recently came out as a tranny and has admitted he has sexual feelings for me
Since you guys have always been my favorite board, and kept me entertained. I'll return the favor. I'll be streaming my suicide in about 10 minutes. In the mean time, I shall answer any questions, suggestions, etc

stream URL + quick rundown:
pastebin.com/KnjnkLW8

Thank you all, frens.

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Yeah, seems like he's slightly below average to average in general but the menu is such a potential game changer that it can instantly overturn the vast difference in stats/moves/frames.

all hero needs is a mana burst nerf and MAYBE a twack nerf. keep 80-100mp mana burst the same, but anything lower makes the move very shit or much smaller, so you're rewarded with keeping such a high mp count for one move.

Id love to see you kill yourself but Im not going to use chinkscord
Sorry

No, his normals aren't just bad by design. I mean that they actively forgot hitboxes. The frame data makes sense, but certain things look like they should hit, but don't. If the sword didn't actively move through a target and just not do anything, I would completely agree.

Otherwise, everything looks good for design in a balance sense. He has poor frame data on almost all of his moves except his kicks and neutral. I just want his visuals to match what i'm getting. Nothing is worse then dashing, seeing sword look like it's connecting and nothing. Something has to be jank when the hit box is up at the start of the slash and disappears in the middle and then is back at the end. That isn't right.

It's my first DQ game and I find it pretty boring. Move the genre forward a bit or something. A new coat of paint on a kiddie JRPG isn't fun.

what are some examples of this? the only one i can think of is up tilt not hitting properly which is big

tell us your story user

Pretty much just uptilt, dash feel unintentional. Smashes might be completely intentional because of crits, but it still feels like F-smash is missing a bit at the tip, which prevents you from hitting someone on platform just slightly above you, which will always feel bad when all other swordies F-smash hits that, except for Links, obviously.

I don't get why he even has random crits. None of the other RPG characters have it.

Well all the other RPG characters draw from DQ in some way, and DQ had crits as far back as 1986. I can't find conclusive examples of videogames that had crits before that

Man shut the fuck up man. NOT VIDYA.

There is unironically nothing wrong with RNG in games (especially pseudo fighting games) and if you can't handle it just get good

Wizardry. When a Ninja crit is decapitates enemies. But that's what Dragon Quest based it's combat off of.
Mostly because Dragon Quest has always been about luck/RNG. From magic spell range, crit, death spells, even a casino. Yes games like Wizardry had it before but Dragon Quest popularized how it all works and every RPG out of Japan post Dragon Quest based itself off that.

>gotta assume it’s some autist trying to force it.
It's Leffen, so yes.

>character has a chance to instakill at 0
>has the ability to kill regularly at low percents
>can break full shields with one attack
>deals 30+ damage with a projectile that you can store and only requires a fraction of the charge required for other characters
>has a stronger pikachu down b that deals like 40%
>has a recovery that prevents literally everyone from grabbing the ledge AND you can combo out of it
>has a reflector that lasts 10 seconds AND you can move and attack during it
>has the chance to get the mushroom effect and get big for absolutely no reason at all
>has the ability to cover literally every option and even kill with a single move
>has the chance to get a tremendous speed buff for minimal cost
>can heal himself instantly
>has the ability to make anyone sleep, even if they're off stage, basically taking the stock right there
>has the ability to buff his damage numbers even more for big fuck you damage
And you retards are asking for buffs? Hahahahaha.

Hero is the original "anime swordsman". So that's basically why he's OP.

I wanted female Hero, not male!

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KAZAP
WOOSH
SIZZ
BAZINGA
KRACKLE

ONE ODF THOSE IS NOT A REAL SPELL. GUESS

Bazinga.

PUFF-PUFF

krackle

I'd replace Solo with Madason.

PUFF-PUFF is my favorite spell in all of Dragon Quest.

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Bazinga is from DQ 9 dumb dumb

>Remove random crits and instead have every 8th smash crit guaranteed
this would basically "reset" the list of stale moves. Stale move list is 9 moves. Lets say at move 1, fsmash does 30%. By move 7 it's doing 19%. Move 8 allows it to do a mere 34% only for the 9th move to be 18%. Makes no sense. Then it's just useless to have crit.

Because it rarely come up on the menu anyway and it leaves you more open to dying offstage than Little Mac.

Do you keep falling when you use it or do you hover in place? If you're falling during animation, does the explosion follow you?

Fuck yea, still getting the hang of his million moves but I'm pleased as punch

you stay in place

Play Dragon Quest 11S

Cool thanks. I've been having fun playing as him but still haven't experimented with using down special offstage.

He's pretty slow to get moves out, but his aerials have great coverage and his specials are totally nuts. His up smash stinks though.
You can tell they tried very hard to stay faithful to the source material. The random crits are honestly a bit dumb but I get why they were included.

Fireball (neutral B) damage is definitely getting nerfed. Side B will probably see a nerf. Up B is definitely getting nerfed. I don't think Down B will be touched. Would like a slightly faster back air but I doubt that will happen.

In any case, I'm maining Banjo no matter what

I've been feeling like his nair is really inconsistent, whenever I shorthop to throw one out it's a tossup on whether it actually hits and that's on characters tall enough to get smacked with it

Overall he's lacking the range on his normals a lot of the other swordies get for free, his aerials in general have a shitton of landing lag, and his frame data is god awful, but the specials almost make up for it

>play online solo
>match up with another Hero, he has items on, Arena Ferox
>he gets a good lead
>grabs assist trophy, it’s Nightmare
>everything is pitch black
>he uses kaclang on whim, maybe for security, idk
>manage to find my way over to him
>open menu, and the RNG blesses me
>Metal Slash
>manage to get his last stock at %20 in the dark
Most fun match I’ve had in a while

Having a bunch of generic spells is more generic than having a few unique moves, yes.

I'm extremely happy but on the other hand I fear he might get nerfed to the ground on the next patch.

I don't give a shit about smash.

Honestly his reach in general with his air's just feels akward because unlike swordies who's attacks just have a single solid active frame 'sweep', it ONLY counts when Hero's blade physically connects with the opponent. This along with the delay of attacks coming out in general leads to very jank attacks overall. At least his side B and forward smash and dtilt are all really good options, so you can kinda play with just those and down B when the option arises.