This game is not that good with very lacklustre combat and terrible platforming, the first god of war game was better...

lmao, wow, 4 years! You should definitely be allowed to compare them.

>this thread

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Mind hack?

>It's the only good DMC game.

I would say it's the only one which feels complete, balanced, and managed to achieve its vision.

The other games are good, but they all have something which significantly lets them down in some way, be it shit bosses, shit enemies, being too same-y, too easy, dice games, unfinished etc.

I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC1.

1 > 4 > 5 > 3 > DmC > 2

>No more examining bookcases to learn the lore

Man, this

I miss being able to click scenery in games and get a text comment on it. VA quips just aren't remotely the same.

Played the entirety of DMC1 last night, shit's legit, fuck you

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It was God tier for 2001 faggot, now its well... decent but its not fair to rate as 2019

I getcha.

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Yeah wow Nostalgia blinds most people Who knew huh?! Fag

it's goggles not glasses

What are google used for?

You mean flock off feather face?

How is he related?

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>you lived long enough to see faggots hate on DMC1 and even see it as bad as DMC2

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It's a very revolutionary game and it's still satisfying in terms of fundamentals.
The dogshit camera and built-in input delay hamper it quite a bit though. It's my least favorite to actually play, outside of 2 of course (although 2 actually has more responsive inputs).

No one in their right mind would put it at the same level as 2.
Even if you don't like 1 for whatever reason, 2 is soul-suckingly bad.

DMC 2 Rebellion was so cool, I'll be forever mad about the DMC 3 design bring the one that stuck.

Mind Hacc?

>I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC
Nightmare was kinda bad, the camera wasn't all that great, Sparda didn't have a scythe mode to replace the DT sadly, Dante kinda feels tanky, not enough defensive options other than jumping/dodging and air raid, Mundus could've been a better boss.

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Fuck off mathosis parrot

>I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC1.
I can.

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Don't know who that is.

What's with Kamiya ane final bosses being giant shit? Holly fuck, Mundus, Father Balder with his fucking navigate the bullet or whole Jubeleus fight with fucking jump promts. Why there can be just me vs boss, without space harrier and other shit

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>Why there can be just me vs boss, without space harrier and other shit
That's what they did in Bayo 2 and people said it was underwhelming. Brainlets.

How's Bayo 2 btw? I heard they got rid of QTE but made her Witch Time the game.

FUCK YOU, YOU'RE WORSE THAN THE BLOODBORNE PLATINUM GUY, I HATE YOU. WHY DO YOU HAVE SO MANY PHYSICAL GAMES, FUCKING WHY, FUCK. IS THIS YOUR HOBBY? COLLECTING PLASTIC AAAAAAAAA, AAAAAAAAA, AAAAAAAA

Based

>What's with Kamiya ane final bosses being giant shit?
It's a must do. the final boss needs to be huge and flying in space, otherwise it won't be epic at all and won't pose a threat to the heroe.

Nah, it's still good. It's one of those games where it just feels really good to swing the sword, and a lot of games mess that up.

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>How's Bayo 2 btw? I heard they got rid of QTE but made her Witch Time the game.

Yes, Bayonetta 2's enemy design is fucking awful.

You know how people love to complain about punching bags in DMC? Well Bayo 2 must be their dream game. Enemies constantly break out of combos, reflect/dodge and throw attacks at you with extremely bad telegraphing. This often makes it so that the game gets reduced to wait for attack > dodge > witch-time > punish.

It's really fucking boring. Umbran Climax is cool as fuck since it's like Bayo's own DT but also makes Torture Attacks basically useless.

Next game should give Dante a whip of some sorts

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>This often makes it so that the game gets reduced to wait for attack > dodge > witch-time > punish.
Wasn't the first game like this? Or it's even worse than in 1?

Way less bullshit than Bayo 1, it's a pretty straightforward action game. It's way harder to hit enemies outside of WT, to the point that even NSIC doesn't disable it, so the whole game is dodging and punishing until you have enough magic to activate the "devil trigger" that allows you go be aggressive. Fun game with a way better campaign than Bayo 1 but the combat system is not as well designed.

The first God of War is absolute trash that somehow feels like it predates DMC.

>a CPU co-op flight mechanic fight against a boss you've already fought three times with a few new moves and the same finisher as Bayo 1 is a worthy finale for a PlatinumGames title

Jubileus > giant blue tranny

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1 still has the best Dante design, although coatless 1 is my absolute favorite.

Honestly, I kinda hate how simple 5's outfit is. I feel like by now, he should be wearing all sorts of complicated anime shit. I had the same problem with Nero's design too.

I wasn't fond of 4 Dante's outfit for a long time but it's grown on me since.

nigger

> I kinda hate how simple 5's outfit
Same thing as 3's outfit lol

weeb

Never understood shirtless Dante, is it for gays or girls?

Played it only on HDC PC release, didn't see any playthrough/gameplay video before. Can't say nothing about rating it below or above 3/4, but it had its own charm definitely, and it feels really great. I wish that atmosphere was in other DMC games and still had gameplay of 3/4.

Weapon model can't make the game better.
Also 3 rebellion is fine, guess you liked one from 2 because saw it earlier.

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>Same thing as 3's outfit lol
And I don't think 3's outfit is that good either.

for gay girls

>Combat
5 > 4:SE > 3:SE > 1 >>>> 2
>Level design
1 = 3:SE > 4:SE > 5 >>> 2
>Story
3:SE > 1 > 4:SE > 2 > 5
>Music
3:SE > 2 = 1 > 4:SE > 5
>Enemy design
1 > 5 = 4:SE > 3:SE >>>>> 2
>Atmosphere/aesthetic
1 = 2 > 3:SE > 5 > 4:SE

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>>Music
3:SE > 2 = 1 > 4:SE > 5
Jesus

*Blocks your path*

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>Also 3 rebellion is fine
Pre awakening Rebellion? Mostly, it's kinda cool in a silly metal way.
Post awakeneing Rebellion? It's fucking ugly as shit m8, it's no DSD tier atrocity to be sure but it took until DMC5 to make it look passable and mostly because it actually went back to the 2 base design a bit.

I'm not sure myself, maybe they thought it was cool and what teenagers found hip at the time in Japan

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I've been marathoning through the series for the first time ever for the past couple months.

DMC1 was fucking great. You can still feel the Resident Evil's DNA in it, which makes it comfy and intriguing to play. Really like its enemy design too.
2 was just as disappointing as people told me before hand. Shame, since some designs were kinda neat, but that's it.
DMC3, now THAT's a game. Not a fan of how you practically had to grind your shit in order to improve the QOL in it, but the story and combat were pretty good.

I'm still only half-way through 4, but it really seems like a step down in every single way. It seems to lack focus, and it is waaay too easy as well. The map and enemy designs feel very cheap and generic in comparison to predecessors, and the atmosphere is a bit too lighthearted IMO.

Why is DMC1 the only game in existence that gets treated like it was released simultaneously with games that came out years later that had all the ground work done for them. At one point in DMC1's development Dante couldn't even use guns and swords at the same time

>very lack luster combat
I'm going to go ahead and make an assumption that you haven't gotten very far in the game, that or you are blindly mashing your way through Normal as you make this thread. Thing is, DMC1 has great gameplay, the problem is it's not what you expected because you likely played the later games first like an idiot OR you just do not know how to play it. If you haven't beaten the game on at least Hard you really have no right to judge the gameplay. The fun of DMC1's gameplay doesn't come from jump cancelling combos, it comes from dealing with the well developed enemies. Something that was lost in the later games. Ninja Gaiden takes more cues from DMC1's core mechanics than the later DMC games did. The Style Meter was not meant to be a game defining mechanic in which the entire core of the gameplay was built.

It was a smart system to allow you to get more Red Orbs (one of the game's biggest factor for S Ranks) while playing. It resulted in some cheesy tactics, sure, but it was never the central mechanic. The later games took this mechanic to the forefront and this is where you start to see enemy HP bloat out the ass on higher difficulties. This also resulted in dumber enemy AI because enemies now exist for your Style Meter. And let's not even pretend getting S/SS/SSS in DMC3 and onward is actually a hard task

It can feel a bit sluggish, sure, but saying DMC1 has 'lackluster combat is just false. Especially when it was the game that kick started its own genre. You don't do that with 'lackluster gameplay.

>Weapon model can't make the game better.
True, but I never implied it did. Also DMC 3 Rebellion is not fine, that ribcage is fucking hideous.

>something that's over in less than 2 minutes total on any difficulty
meanwhile
>*blocks your path on Very Hard and DMD*

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I always love when the combat theme changes like midway through the game.
When youtu.be/Pl7IA7uUCVM plays after the castle shit got real. Same happens in dmc3

As if your shit taste is any better

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But I didn't post anything

The underwater bits are kino

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The Arachne rooms redeem the shitty mission design and Dullahan corridors of Mission 15.
Can't say the same for any underwater segment in 1, as much as I like the game even Lucia's underwater level in 2 is better.

I just assumed your taste, honestly I would've put 2 at the top and 1 at second place, but eh they're all good in my opinion, 5 is the only one that's actually mediocre

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Damn I was right all along.
Wish this stupid fad never made its way through Japan.

Alright, now you're just being dumb on purpose. DMC1's underwater sections can't even be considered "sections", they're slight distractions. The total time you're underwater in the Ghost Ship sections for both missions is exceedingly low and the underwater section before Nightmare 2 is literally two straight lines of swimming. If you actually think Lucia's underwater part in DMC2 is better you have clearly not played either game in a very long time. The fact that Dante in DMC1 doesn't have to deal with awful underwater puzzles AND A FUCKING INVISIBLE BOSS ON DMD says your opinion is wrong.

>DMC1's underwater sections can't even be considered "sections", they're slight distractions.
You do understand that makes it even worse, do you?
>If you actually think Lucia's underwater part in DMC2 is better you have clearly not played either game in a very long time.
Replayed the entire trilogy not even a year ago m8, not gonna change my mind on this, I'm sorry.

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I played DMC1 for the first time about 3 years ago. It's a great game that has done things other action games since still haven't recreated. It feels "dated" if you've played games it directly or indirectly inspired first, which leads to me on my first playthrough thinking DMC1 would play like the fucking DMC4 Combo MADs people linked me like a dumb fuck. You go into it knowing what it is (A reworked RE4 with demons and swords and shit like that) and you appreciate the enemy design, boss design, pacing, level design/connectivity, use of atmosphere, and introduction of the juggling (at least in the form it exists in DMC) and style mechanics in the first place.

Trust me, I'm all about combowank. 5 is my favorite DMC and the Void is arguably my favorite new addition (along with Warm Up) but the real reason 5 is my favorite is that it's the first game since 1 that feels like a complete, balanced game without a glaring problem. Rushed story, sure, but only 3 ever had an amazing story and 5 tried to tie together everything that came before while passing the torch more overtly to Nero. 5 has the best enemy design & boss design since 1. While it has a lot of mediocre level design there's points where it shines and is better than 3 & 4 in that regard like M4, M7, M8, M12, & M15. 5, 1, & 3SE all have legitimate claim to being the best in the series, but 1 & 5 are there on one release apiece, whereas 3SE was the second go-around at 3 and is on that level because of a large amount of new content (Vanilla 3 didn't have playable Vergil outside of M19 or Bloody Palace, which are huge).

Could 1 & 5 do with SEs that add as much as 3SE or 4SE? Absolutely, although only 5 is likely to get one. I just think the two of them do what they set out to do without faltering significantly (whereas 3 no matter how well it executed on the combat & story has notably worse enemies, bosses, and level design than 1 overall).

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So you actually prefer very slow swimming, tedious underwater puzzles, and a legitimately invisible boss fight over shooting a couple of enemies with a Needle gun and getting on with the game? Whatever man, you do you.

>Why is DMC1 the only game in existence that gets treated like it was released simultaneously with games that came out years later that had all the ground work done for them.
Because literal fucking zoomers were not even alive when it came out, and thus try to project the modern, often way more streamlined and casual design philosophies on top of the classics.

It just gets fucking tiring to see people act like DMC1 was a one off fluke of a game that didn't matter. I'm so god damn sick and tired of the attitude of "the series really started at 3" shit I've been seeing for the last 7 years.

As a "zoomer" who played all the games just before playing 5, DMC 1 is awesome but 3 was my favorite and still is even after 5

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>as a "zoomer"
like half of Yea Forums are zoomers, who cares

>Combat
If you're talking across all characters, then I'll agree here. 4SE's cast is all completely different from one another and have something unique to offer. If it's just Dante, 3 shits on 4.
>Level Design
Not going to argue here although I'd perhaps equalize or switch 4 & 5, since there's some great levels in 5 that balance out the Qliphoth corridors and boss-only Missions whereas I'm not sure if there's any standout levels in 4 (in a good way). 5 also has much better Secret Missions than 4 so that might put it over the edge.
>Story
Can't agree on 5 in last. It clearly suffered from rushing its last act, not giving its non-PC cast besides Nico much to do, and having questionable motivation for Nero right up until Vergil shows up, but it has a ton of great character moments and some strong new additions to the lore overall (such as the separating/combining nature of Yamato & Rebellion). I wish Before The Nightmare and the V Manga were part of the game instead of supplementary material but given how clearly they started to run out of money going into the last quarter of the game I realize that wouldn't have been possible.
>Music
5 is my favorite, I can't lie. It's the only game in the series where I can say I really like more tracks than I can count on one hand without going back to the OST to refresh my memory. 1's has grown on me over time but 5 is on top, then 1 & 2, then 3, then 4 (which has almost no memorable tracks for me). 5 has a couple stinkers in Subhuman & King Cerberus but that still goes into how much more memorable I find the music in it. DmC's OST seems solid from what I've heard.
>Enemy design
Spot-on. I think 5's is better than 4's to fight but I think 4's have more interesting visual design; Blitzes are the coolest looking enemy in the series.
>Atmosphere
Can't argue here at all. I like the "modern city infested with demonic shit" aesthetic in 2. Infested Chopper is an infamously bad boss but it's a cool concept.

Just beat this on VH, what's the problem with it?

The point is that Mission is a slog. People complain up the ying yang about a section in DMC1 that lasts less than five minutes between both Missions while Mission 15 of 3 is one of the most tedious Missions in the entire series.

The mission felt pretty short to me. There's only like 2 or 3 mandatory fights, and the spinning blade Halls are pretty short. I'd take it over trying to fight Sin Scissors underwater on DMD.

>I'd take it over trying to fight Sin Scissors underwater

Literally just shoot them with the Needle Gun, you can kill both of them within seconds of entering the room by just shooting the gun at them.

The combat is good though, the level design and atmosphere is good too.

How the fuck do I git gud at DMC5, particularly with Dante? I've been practicing in the Void and I've been getting better at Style switching on the fly and JC-ing but I'm nowhere near high-level, because I drop shit all the time and nothing I do is really all that intricate, just basic stuff like launcher into JC Aerial Rave, air taunt, Trick, continue from there or launcher, High Times, Trickster, Trick, and so on. I've been trying to work in switching to Balrog Kick mode, JC-ing the dive kick into Swordmaster Style move but I find that to be really tricky, which should tell you what level I'm at. What should I work on first?

>The combat is good though
It is in its own way. I think most people criticizing its combat just started with 3+ and don't want to learn something different

>5 that low in story after 4, 2, and 1.
Look, I'm not going to pretend it was a Masterpiece but I think you're not giving it enough credit. It was a bit rushed in places and the pacing was somewhat wonky but overall it did a good job with what it was trying to accomplish and had great character moments that are some of the best in series in terms both of spectacle, weight, and theming. Also nicely tied up a bunch of loose ends left hanging by previous entries. It's flaws were clearly a lack of budget rather than inherent lack of depth and adequate writing. 4's story is an incomplete mess with too many plotholes to ignore raising more questions and answering none. 2's story, as much as I love Lucia, is nonexistent beyond 'lets go beat up this bad guy who is doing the bad thing' and 1 isn't 'bad' by any stretch but objectively it's just a standard revenge story with a ton of cliches and awkward moments. To top it off, 1 Dante isn't stoic as 2 Dante but having gone back now playing it again he does feel pretty...bland aside from a few key moments. The moment when he snaps at Trish after her betrayal is one of my favorite scenes of all time.

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His playstyle is fun as fuck and you all have bad taste.

No better feeling than doing a Royal Fork on a bunch of downed enemies.

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He's fun and unique but feels as incomplete as 4 Nero without any chance of him returning. We may see his playstyle return but it would be with a new character that has new summons and some new twist to add that depth V lacks.

This is probably just me being harsh, but I felt the story's purpose wasn't justified enough (bringing Vergil back). That was it's main focus and all, but it felt like there wasn't a point in it and it barely was fleshed out enough at all, compare it to 1 which has a story purpose of Dante becoming the legend his father once was, or 4 where it's Nero accepting his demonic nature (like DMC3 Dante) and being the young kid of the crew, and 2 is higher because at least someone did cry while in 5 no one did. The only way I could make 5's story higher is if we get more Vergil screentime in later entries, but right now, on it's own, it's just meh. I would've liked it more if Urizen and V were their own characters and Vergil was just going to the top of the Qliphoth to regain some semblance of power and fix his mistakes after he realised how much of a fuck up he was with the trauma he got from the Nelo Angelo times.

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youtube.com/watch?v=Eul2RPetJP4

THIS. Admittedly, he's a bit unrefined and feels shallow especially in comparison to the uholy depth of two of the most fleshed out movesets in action games, but they can easily fix that in later installments with a new character that plays similarly to him with their own twists to the character.

He's definitely nowhere as bad as people make him out to be. Especially on harder difficulties where trying to buttonmash with him just gets your shit aggressively pushed in by most encounters, making the player actually not play like a retard and think about what they're doing.

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Meh. It just doesn't feel like you're controlling his demons and V is too basic. Astral Chain seems to be doing the whole familiar thing way better.

Do you think the next summoner will use a cane? cause I'd like it more if they did something else, like maybe a claw or something

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I'm so happy that summerfags will finally go back to school in less than a month.

> 1 > 4 > 5 > 3

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Astral Chain is based around having a familiar thing though isn't it? I hope that it feels good to play.

You switch between 5 different Legions which have their own abilities and attacks and can be both controlled and allowed to attack on their own, and each Legion does different things with your 3 weapon types. This is on top of using the chain between you as a physical thing that can trap enemies, and how enemies have weak points that require positioning.

It's the first game to actually feel like an evolution on Chaos Legion (more so than V I'd think) while taking inspiration from Wonderful 101 & Automata (the latter mostly because the director was game design lead on that game).

>but they can easily fix that in later installments with a new character that plays similarly to him with their own twists to the character.
God, I want this so badly.

>people actually want more and more useless protags

I'm so fucking tired of this. I wouldn't mind if these fucking morons would actually take the one GOOD cue from DMC2 in give the cahracters their own campaigns instead of forcing them all into one.

Honestly, I'd rather get another game where you only play as Dante again, and maybe Vergil too. But if I had to have another protagonist, I wouldn't mind someone who plays like V but with an expanded moveset.

I'd like to see Lucia playable again too.

Fuck Nero, Fuck Dante, Fuck V and Vergil.
We should get a Trish game instead

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>imagine Trish getting pinned against a gray wall, that's the same color of her fucking boring bitch-ass character who imperonates moms becuase she's literally an unholy wretch with no dignity whatsoever, while at the same time the demon-whore who suckled Mundus' big red tri-balls and had so much piss-stained demon cum splurged all over her hair, it got dyed blond, is being fisted with pizza up her matrix-2000 black fetish pants ripped apart, so hard the term yeast infection gets a new meaning, and with her last whoreish, skanky, breaths she coughs up the crusty, hell-cum out her ps2-octagon mouth, leaving her dark soul unfilled, yet her ass stuffed to the brim

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based

1 still has the best atmosphere and level design in the series. I wish they kept the gothic horror feel in the later games. For all the shit 2 gets, at least it was somewhat faithful to 1 in that regard.

So it is written.

1 has more 'best' things than that, but 2 did not keep faithful at all. None of the later games did. In fact every DMC game since 2 has been the same "it's a city level" approach. DMC4 tried to do the castle thing but the game was overly bright and k-poppy. In fact I would go as far to say DMC4 being the worst offender in this department.

Man I miss pre-release threads

We've had a bossfight against every playable character in the series except Lucia (Unlikely as she's not really part of DMC anymore), Nero, and Trish. What would a Nero or Trish boss be like, Yea Forums?

based. Give her Alastor.

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I don't think DMC's enemy design doesn't take its horror aspect seriously. It definitely does, at least 3 and 5.

I do miss examining your surroundings. That sort of stuff gives a ton of flavor to the game and doesn't take a lot of money. 3 still had plenty of that but it completely died away in 4 and 5.

>In fact every DMC game since 2 has been the same "it's a city level" approach
Are you proposing that every DMC should've been set in an abandoned island? Also I'd say that DMC3 was very faithful to 1, 10% of it was set in a city while 90% of it is in Temen-ni-gru. and DMC4 was barely set in a castle most of it was from one place to another with crazy weather changes and night and day shifts

This is way too accurate. Also see: Viewtiful Joe 1 and 2

>it comes from dealing with the well developed enemies
Enemies are mostly garbage in DMC1.
They are a very cool concept but shit design. It took DMC4 to make DMC1 enemies good.

Great bait

>I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC1.

Come the fuck on now. You can prefer it over the new games all you want but 1 has glaring fucking pacing issues, terrible writing, a god awful swimming segments and a out of place rail shooter segment in the FINAL FUCKING BOSS of the game.

>t. don't know shit about enemy design

>I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC1.
Balance.
AI.
Story.
Grenade Launcher.
Gimmick/Color-coded enemies.
Griffon.
Nightmare.
Mundus.
Story.
Dialogue.
Backtracking.
Platforming.
Shit enemy design.

I mean, I respect the game a lot, but it did not age well.

>Gimmick/Color-coded enemies.
You mean the same shit in DMC3, you fucking retard?
And there's nothing wrong with the AI or enemy designs in 1, backtracking wasn't tedious and the story wasnt bad.

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>Unlikely as she's not really part of DMC anymore
>he doesn't know

>Enemies are mostly garbage in DMC1.
Even the puppets in 1 are better than the mooks in 3, although I understand having mixed groups of enemies is supposed to make up for that. But fighting the puppets felt more dynamic since each one would change up its attacks. The Shadow in 1 is still fantastic though.

I don't think there are any issues with most of what you mention. I liked 1's more minimal story, it felt like you got more of the story while actually playing instead of just through cutscenes. The only issue I agree with is the grenade launcher because of the bug to get out of its recoil making it OP if you want to abuse it, too many people abuse that bug then say the game is balanced poorly.

What's the issue with AI and enemy design?

>Implying they're not just going to give Vergil summons

>You mean the same shit in DMC3
DMC3 does not have enemies the game forces you to kill with a specific weapon.
DMC1 has such enemies and abusing the game is required to avoid it.
>And there's nothing wrong with the AI
Except every enemy is literally a non-threat as all of them can be looped
>or enemy designs
Sure, they are plain and broken for the most part. The game actively encourages you to bypass enemies instead of actually challenging them - Critical Hit is the most notorious example of that.
>backtracking wasn't tedious
For you who were too busy jerking off to your shit hipster mindset - may be. For me, running through the same hallway for the tenth time was pretty fucking tedious.
>the story wasnt bad
There's literally no proper story, retard. It works as lore, but as a story, it's a combination of retarded characters making retarded decisions, doing retarded things, and saying retarded lines.
DMC4 at least had a coherent story but I bet you place it below the bullshit DMC1 had.

It still kills me people say DMC2 is better than DmC. I dunno how one of the worst PS2 games of all time is better than a average action game.

Puppets are a non-threat as soon as you understand how to fight them.
Shadow can be looped as soon as you understand how to fight it.

I agree that Puppets are of the most threating "starter enemies" in the series but Scarecrows in 4 are better "starter enemies" - precisely because they are balanced around being only a part of the threat instead of the entirety of it. They become dangerous by making you think they are harmless and can be left alone.

>AI
It's very simple and can be looped way too easily.
>enemy design
It's generally obnoxious and it's mostly geared towards bypassing the challenge instead of encountering it.

As a combination of the previous two points - you can fight the Shadow "fairly", or you can just beat it by pressing jump and shoot buttons as it loops itself into spamming spikes.
Against Frosts, you have a great choice of abusing the game (Grenade Launcher) or abusing the enemy (Ifrit) to fight them. You literally aren't supposed to "challenge" them - ever. So the whole concept behind the enemy, no matter how cool it is, goes out of the window due to shit design.

>There's literally no proper story, retard
You might be the retard. The cutscenes set up a decent chunk of story and the gameplay itself tells more about Dante's struggle with trauma. Just because it doesn't have hours of cutscenes and is influenced by cheesy action movies doesn't mean there's no story or it's bad.

I place DmC and DMC1 at about the same spot.
Both have shit story, but DmC is being pretentious about it.
Both have mostly shit enemies, but DMC1 had loads of outstanding concepts.
DmC has better levels. platforming and combat system.
DMC1 has better bosses (even if most of them are shit), atmosphere, and general gameplay variety.

I'd say they are about equal in my book but I hold a lot of respect for DMC1 while barely any for DmC.

Hell, DmC has deeper combat mechanics than DMC1.
>5 weapons and 3 guns that can be used in real time
>Dodges and just dodges as well as snatch
>Larger movesets per weapon/gun
>Universalized delayed combos allows for combo mixing
>Half the weapons have air combos
>Vergil

If you're not starting every playthrough of DMC1 on New Game regardless of difficulty then you're doing it wrong. One thing the ninja gaiden fags always understood, new game plus is for plebs.

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>the gameplay itself tells more about Dante's struggle with trauma
Excuse me, what?

These. DMC1 is good because it's a RE game with swords and demons. 3 still had some RE influences, mainly in level design but 4 and 5 dropped them completely. I loved 5 but I wish level designs just hallways
>games lose their value with time
you need to go back

>this game is not that good with very lacklustre combat and terrible platforming,
Nah. Just played it for the first time last October. It was a blast!

>the first god of war game was better.
Well duh

>Dmc 3-5 are all good but I don't get how people rate this above 4.
Because 4 was unfinished and gets worse as the game goes on. It was my favorite combat system in the series until 5, but the level design was half-assed.

is there a mod to disable the BP timer yet

user, you are fucking stupid. Stop your projecting and read a book, you uneducated moronic swine.
I literally can't argue with you if your taste is so fucking shit, your inner hipster/nostalgia makes you think the story was *good* in DMC1. DMC1 is THE fucking reason the whole "you don't play DMC for the story" meme was born as every game after 2 made story an important part of it and literally no one says "you don't play DMC2 for the story", because the statement ends before the last three words.

>DMC3 does not have enemies the game forces you to kill with a specific weapon.
Neither does DMC1...
>Except every enemy is literally a non-threat as all of them can be looped
>if you abused the bugs than the AI is bad
>The game actively encourages you to bypass enemies instead of actually challenging them - Critical Hit is the most notorious example of that.
Yes the game encourages you to finish the mission as fast as possible, is there a problem?
>For me, running through the same hallway for the tenth time was pretty fucking tedious.
It really wasn't that bad to me
>There's literally no proper story, retard
It's literally about Dante taking Revenge for his family, and facing his past, the story works as a Videogame and there's nothing wrong with it, and I put it in equal ground with 4.

I genuinely don't replay this game as often as I'd like purely because I know this mission will piss me off.

>Puppets are a non-threat as soon as you understand how to fight them.
I've beaten the game multiple times on DMD with no items, and have still been killed by puppets on normal because I got too cocky. They aren't really meant to be a constant threat as you get better at the game though, that's why they're mostly just used at the early part of normal and phased out later/on harder difficulties. They're kind of like tutorial enemies.

Most single players games have AI that can be exploited. Don't think you can do much about that unless you just make everything completely random.

>or abusing the enemy (Ifrit) to fight them. You literally aren't supposed to "challenge" them - ever.
I think they mostly just wanted to force you to use both weapons sometimes. Don't really know what you mean by abusing the enemy or not challenging them though.

>Neither does DMC1...
Frosts require you to exploit oversights in the game to kill them with anything but Ifrit.
>is there a problem?
Game encouraging me to play less of the game is not a good game.
>It really wasn't that bad to me
Well, I mean most people complain about DMC4 backtracking while giving DMC1 a pass despite the latter having more backtracking by a big margin.
For me, though, I see that it's present but I can play the game. I would prefer less of it, though.
>It's literally about Dante taking Revenge for his family, and facing his past
That's lore. The story is shit. Also at no point does Dante "face" the past, come on. He might "encounter" the past but he literally does nothing about it - there's nothing like that in the story.

The whole game is about Dante's trauma after his mother and brother were killed. How could you miss that? A lot of the level and enemy design is pertaining to this. Dante fighting his twin after facing himself in the mirror, the Phantom constantly haunting him, etc. Even the description for the Nightmare boss says it drags Dante to an alternate dimension to use his past trauma against him. My favorite aspect is after he defeats the Nightmare and then starts up that giant heart as a metaphor for overcoming trauma.

It is good though. I played DMC1 first for the gameplay but still appreciate the storytelling. It's odd that it makes you so angry, maybe you have some issue because you're afraid of being seen as a hipster for some reason just because you said you enjoyed something.

What was bad about it? Be specific and use examples.

>with a way better campaign than Bayo 1

My ass

You're reading too much into the game.

>Frosts require you to exploit oversights in the game to kill them with anything but Ifrit.
You can still Kill them with Alastor, and they don't really have much HP anyways so I don't see how the game is "forcing" me to use Iftit at all
>Game encouraging me to play less of the game is not a good game.
You're not playing less, just going through it faster which makes sense for a game that has a timer on it's missions and on it's hardest difficulties
>Well, I mean most people complain about DMC4
The problem wasn't the backtracking, is how you played the same levels in reverse, I didn't really hate the backtracking itself, just how they did it was the problem
>That's lore. The story is shit. Also at no point does Dante "face" the past, come on. He might "encounter" the past but he literally does nothing about it - there's nothing like that in the story.
It isn't lore because it's events that happen in the fucking game, there was no other before it for it to be "lore", he does face the past he goes and accepts that he lost his brother, and mother and goes to defeat the asshole behind that, what's bad about any if that?

me

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I don't think I am. I think you might just feel embarrassed to recognize the deeper and more serious themes of 1 because most people view the game as "silly pizza man does Shakespeare".

>Don't really know what you mean by abusing the enemy or not challenging them
Ifrit trivializes Frosts, meaning there's no challenge in fighting them.
Sin Scissors are a notoriously tedious enemy to fight and the game gives you "Critical Hit" - an arbitrary and mostly passive thing you can do to avoid the encounter in its entirety - it's not a bad thing on its own, but it shows how the game approaches its enemy design.
By comparison, DMC4 gives you a "proactive" alternative to dealing with Mephistos' bullshit by decloaking them, a "reactive" alternative by parrying their attack and retaliating, and a way to embrace the bullshit and just power-through. The game wants you to act upon the enemy, as opposed to encouraging you to skip it entirely.
Frosts have several traits that are vulnerable to different weapons in a different sense. They are no longer absurdly broken for everything but a single specific approach that trivializes them instead.
Blitz can't be looped like Shadow but it also provides you with a way to diminish or even avoid its main gimmick while with Shadow you'll be firing 'dem guns.
This is what I mean by saying "it took DMC4 to make DMC1 enemies good"

>the first god of war game was better

I never thought about it, but i think i agree. DMC1 is still good for what it is.

Not really, no. DMC3 is one of my all time favorite stories in vidya.

>It is good though
It's bad though. It does not make me angry - you make me angry because of how stupid you are, user.

GoW1 actually hasn't aged that well, most of the enemies are annoying as fuck to fight and the platforming sucks.

>You can still Kill them with Alastor
Technically you can. Not having hitstun on attacks is not fun in DMC1, though, and it takes a long time to kill them.
You can launch-loop them, though, which is a clear oversight, meaning you have to abuse the game to fight them without Ifrit.

idk i just mashed buttons with him

>i am angry because you enjoy something
I think you're the one losing in this situation

I legit found turning into Sparda and flying around pretty cool the first time I played it.
It would lose its novelty on repeat runs

I still think it's pretty fun. Dodging all the attacks, learning to vortex him as he flies by, using the DT dragon. I only really dislike it on DMD because of his extra health, and having to do it repeatedly if trying to do a no item run.

Mission select (and secret mission select once you found them) would be a godsend for any DMC rereleases.

GUYS

Yeah, I don't mind it not being there so much with DMC1 because I can go through every mission including secret ones in about two hours on normal. But I still kept a save for the Mundus fight because sometimes I would just want to do that again.

>Even the GoW director said his game was more shallow and casual, so people could enjoy it as something cinematic.
And that vision continued through GoW4.

>V were their own characters
Lol anyone who shits on the story this is what their problem is. If you read the manga and novel then it wouldn't be as bad as you make it out to be.

>an arbitrary and mostly passive thing you can do to avoid the encounter in its entirety
I think it was more of a way to just show off. It's not that much faster than doing a couple quick helm breakers because you have to wait for them to get close and start an attack to score a critical hit. I don't understand how you came to the conclusion that getting critical hits is skipping an enemy.

>DMC1
>mostly shit enemies
you've gotta be shitting me

It doesn't seem to be up anymore but there was a video interview years back when DMC4 released where Itsuno said the only game similar to DMC was ghosts n goblins. what did you think he mean by this

Horrible post, zoomers don't deserve rights

I did, I still feel like the story would've been better if Vergil was still Vergil, and didn't go with the splitting demon and human halves. It also would've gave us more Vergil screentime and made him a better rival than Urizen 5 times over, I don't hate 5's story I just see it as a beginning for more Vergil when we could've just gotten that in the game itself. I get that Vergil is stubborn and that he was dying but they could've went with him chasing the throne and made Urizen some new Demon king since Hell just lost Balrog to Dante, and he could realize from him that he could've been like Urizen, craving power like a monster, and than becomes a good guy, rather than how messy the story was.

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I don't think they're going to change that. They're not really trying to compete with DMC, but offer something to people who can't get into DMC.

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shut up retard, later zoomers have no taste while early zoomers can appreciate.

>later zoomers have no taste while early zoomers can appreciate.
I think it's the opposite. It seems like later zoomers who play the series in order can appreciate 1. It's the early zoomers who played 3 first when it was released that say 1 is bad and tell newcomers to just skip straight to 3.

DMC, God of War, Shadow of the Colossus, etc. were all shitty meme games overhyped to the moon by kids too young to have played anything earlier.

How could he have gone after the throne if he was dying man? He was weak and wanted to fight Dante only. And thats at surface level. only after he split himself we saw that he didnt actually want to die and had flashbacks to him and dante before he said that. V allowed us to see a vulnerable Vergil and splitting himself allowed he, himself to see how much he fucked up.
Vergil didn't want power to rule, he wanted power to protect himself. Him going after the throne wouldn't make sense. Vergil needed something drastic to get him out of that power mindset, he was wandering through hell for a long time getting bullied by lowly demons.

While I never thought 1 was bad, I was tempted to skip to 3 because it was a prequel then play 1. Thankfully I decided against it or else the transition would have been too jarring.

I dunno, most early Zoomers seem to have a similar taste to late Zoomers, with the exception of some oddballs
>It seems like later zoomers who play the series in order can appreciate 1. It's the early zoomers who played 3 first when it was released that say 1 is bad and tell newcomers to just skip straight to 3.
As an early Zoomer, I disagree, I would never tell anyone to skip 1 immediately just because it's "dated"

If you're a faggot you prefers Ifrit to Alastor, tell me why right now. How can you pass up the speed that Alastor provides?

>Father Balder
>t. didn't learn dodge offset
main reason for it is that Kamiya fucking loves arcades and thus wants to shove shitty copies of his favorite games, especially space harrier, into every game he works on

most likely fun the first time around but as you get deeper into it you realize how fucking shallow it has become due to retarded changes.
WT is now the core mechanic and is required to be able to even fucking hit enemies (thus the highest difficulty doesn't disable it), style points are now entirely damage based and ranking centers around super tight time limits that aren't even consistent bewteen stages, magic got fucked hard due to not-DT being the only viable usage of it and weapons have less depth to them.
In total the game shifted from hyper aggressive playstyle to purely defensive.

>Wasn't the first game like this?
no. inf climax is all about DO and being aggressive as fuck. Crowd control was insanely important against elites

That could be part of the problem too. I understand the logic behind telling people to play in order of story, but I think that would only make sense with something like a visual novel where gameplay doesn't change so much.

>As an early Zoomer, I disagree, I would never tell anyone to skip 1 immediately just because it's "dated"
Of course not every person will do it, but I can't see any other reason for some people to tell others to skip 1 and go straight to 3. Unless they're just trolling.

because Ifrit destroys 3/4s of the bosses in the game.

>I can't see any other reason for some people to tell others to skip 1

The fanbase at large just pretends 1 doesn't exist and is a curious experiment at best.

>How could he have gone after the throne if he was dying man?
The Qliphoth exists to give power, that's what it was doing with Urizen, and thats what it did to Dante when he was unconscious. Vergil could just take some of that power for himself, showing how he's still power hungry and decides to go to the throne because that's where the blood is and would greatly help him get more power. throughout the game you see how he kinda loses his humanity the further he goes, and you get to even have good rival boss fights with him, and when he reaches Urizen he sees how both of them are alike, craving power and seeing humanity as nothing but weight that must be cut away. And realised that he doesnt want to be the monster that he is making himself, he doesn't want to be like Urizen, and embraces humanity. This sounds much better to me

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Which is stupid since it was unique compared to the rest of the series. The evident RE influence, the eerie setting drawing from actual horror, and it's structure are all unique.

Vergil wouldn't even have been able to reach Urizen for the power, he was dying. He needed some quick shit to reach Urizen. And if his own brother can't convince him about humanity what makes you think a random demon would?
Vergil just wanted to kick his brothers ass in a fair fight, he didn't even want muh power anymore

People also just don't want to learn 1, so many people are influenced by the "DMC3 anticipation" meme that most new people, if they even play 1, will just begrudgingly go through Normal and shelve it forever. You'll not get the most out of any DMC game with a single playthrough.

>Vergil wouldn't even have been able to reach Urizen for the power, he was dying
Than how come the Qliphoth was able to pump Dante with Demonic power all the way from the bottom? It could work, and if you're writing the story it will work.
>And if his own brother can't convince him about humanity what makes you think a random demon would?
Because Urizen would offer him to be his Nelo Angelo, in exchange for more of that power that he seemed to crave, which shows how both are similar. Vergil gets his painful memories and his humanity comes back, making him realise how much if an idiot he was the whole time
>Vergil just wanted to kick his brothers ass in a fair fight, he didn't even want muh power anymore
That was his objective in 5, it wasn't much like that in 3, and it could still be his objective in this story with how he is chasing power and being a rival boss to Nero, Dante and maybe V

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>what is vergil's doppelganger

I think DMC1's enemies are drastically overhyped.

They're very much glorified RE enemies. They can pose a threat in the beginning but they almost all have a "solution" on how you're supposed to deal with them in the most ideal way, and after that they're no longer much of a threat. Also Ifrit is just way too fucking overpowered, but I guess that applies to most DMC gauntlets. DMC1's difficulty curve is also kind of fucked, even on DMD the game can go from insanely easy to absolutely fucking ball-bustingly hard such as Nightmare 3. There is almost no golden middle-ground.

Personally I think DMC5 beats DMC1 in enemy design, especially since DMC5 has way bigger crowds of them and mixes up different types a lot, it's just more interesting to me.

god of war 3 on the ps3 was better than any dmc game

Ifrit is devastating with its special abilities. Inferno and Meteor do so much damage. Just charging up your attacks feels satisfying sometimes too. Though Alastor is better a lot of the time when dealing with crowds.

>They can pose a threat in the beginning but they almost all have a "solution" on how you're supposed to deal with them in the most ideal way, and after that they're no longer much of a threat.
>once you figure out the best tactic to defeat an enemy, they're not as hard
whoa

Father Balder with the trinket equipped that makes each enemy/boss spawn enraged is extremely fast paced and super kino.

What I'm saying is that there's a pre-designed specific solution for enemies on how to best deal with them. I like how the latter toned this down and instead put a bigger focus on the fighting itself. DMC3 still has some of the elemental weakness stuff but it's nowhere near as prevalent.

I went through 2 just to finally appreciate 3, do I get a medal?

>Than how come the Qliphoth was able to pump Dante with Demonic power all the way from the bottom?
Because the only reason Dante got pumped up with blood was because the tree mistaken him for Vergil. And without yamato the tree wouldn't have been able to get into the human world and wouldn't have gotten that blood.

>Because Urizen would offer him to be his Nelo Angelo, in exchange for more of that power that he seemed to crave, which shows how both are similar.
That's dumb he didn't even want to be nelo angelo in the first place. He was forced too.

>That was his objective in 5, it wasn't much like that in 3, and it could still be his objective in this story with how he is chasing power and being a rival boss to Nero, Dante and maybe V
So a retread of 3? People already complain about it being a retread, your idea just makes it even more blatant.

Dunno why this is an argument though, what happened happened. The story is fine but rushed, you can't call it shit just because you didn't like that V wasn't his own person.

>I can't think of a single bad thing about DMC1.

The camera you dump ass

>What I'm saying is that there's a pre-designed specific solution for enemies on how to best deal with them. I like how the latter toned this down and instead put a bigger focus on the fighting itself.
I see what you're saying. I just find it more satisfying to kill things quicker as you get better at the game, which is how 1 did it. Later games seem to make it take the same amount of time to kill things as you get better at the game, you just look flashier while doing it, and I don't think that feels as good.

The problem is we compare games in the same series to one another such as Devil May Cry and Devil May Cry 4 where it is often the case that the games are designed by completely different people. As far as I know Hideki Kamiya did not have direct involvement in any subsequent entries in the series after the first game. People are less likely to compare games by the same people that may in fact have more in common when it comes to success of design philosophy because they're not branded as the same series. Hironobu Sakaguchi's move to Mistwalker and work on The Last Story while meanwhile Final Fantasy went in the XIII-direction-of-things is another good example of this.

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>Because the only reason Dante got pumped up with blood was because the tree mistaken him for Vergil.
They could just make it pump power through the arteries or whatever they are and the story I made up could go smoothly.
>And without yamato the tree wouldn't have been able to get into the human world and wouldn't have gotten that blood.
Than make it so someone had a Yamato shard just like Balrog did.
>That's dumb he didn't even want to be nelo angelo in the first place. He was forced too.
Yeah, that's why he denies becoming a slave again for power and embraces his humanity.
>So a retread of 3? People already complain about it being a retread, your idea just makes it even more blatant.
Where did I say it should have the same motivation as 3? I just pointed out how 5's Vergil motivation just seemed odd, but could stay in anyways, you can make it that he is seeking power and fighting Dante, Nero and V because he wants to see if he has gotten strong enough, while still going to the throne to gain more power and beat Dante like you like him to do, and when Urizen offers him the power he wants, he realised he didn't actually want it
>Dunno why this is an argument though, what happened happened. The story is fine but rushed
I'm just saying that 5's story could've been better in many different ways it doesnt need to be my way
>you can't call it shit just because you didn't like that V wasn't his own person.
The fuck does V have to do with it? It's about not having enough Vergil not lame ass V.

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>games lose their value with time
>SOME games lose their value with time
NOT ALL

Hey stop dissing Code Veronica

It is
But fucking section where you need to navigate a bullet into his head hat counts as death if you fuck up is cancer. Why can't I just fight boss without this fucking segment out of nowhere

Can we appreciate that DMC1 had the most flavour text of any Resident Evil? Seriously the amount of stuff you can click on to hear Dante's thoughts is insane.

>glaring fucking pacing issues
It's paced perfectly
>terrible writing
I don't play games for story, but for what it's worth, I find the script and delivery very entertaining
>god awful swimming segments
I like them, they're atmospheric and provide a unique palate-cleanser
>out of place rail shooter segment
Who's to say it's out of place? Did you make it? Again, it's a nice change of pace, and once it's over you're back to business as usual

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>The evil darkness is whirling with its mouth open.
>This must be the Gate of the Underworld.
>Exciting...
Always gives me a little chuckle. I liked inspecting stuff from the castle and getting more of its backstory that way too, reading that during the night the inhabitants would start going crazy and doing atrocious things made it ominous once it became dark after defeating Griffon.

>Hironobu Sakaguchi's move to Mistwalker and work on The Last Story while meanwhile Final Fantasy went in the XIII-direction-of-things is another good example of this.
Sakaguchi is a businessman, not a creator, and a poor one at that.

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>Not liking fixed camera angles

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>They could just make it pump power through the arteries
The tree sucks blood from humans, it wouldn't have recognized vergil or dante enough to give them power. Also urizen would have no need to do that since he's the only one who wants to be strong

>Yeah, that's why he denies becoming a slave again for power and embraces his humanity.
But what teaches him humanity? He witnessed what Mundus did to his city, burning everything down, and didn't change. He raised the tower in 3 and didn't care. V being his humanity made him see things in a different light, he was desperate to get back to his true self. Vergil needed something big to get him to see how stupid he was being.

> 5's Vergil motivation just seemed odd
How is it odd? He split himself because he wanted to survive

>he wants to see if he has gotten strong enough
Vergil can't go through the story fighting nero and dante, he's dying user from mundus aids how the fuck could he do anything?

>not having enough Vergil not lame ass V.
>V, Urizen and the central story isn't enough
And we're getting playable Vergil later anyways.

>Defending the shooting segments
Jesus Christ, man.

I I wasn't ready and I didn't have time to get used to the controls and it wasn't what I was prepared for and I took damage and I died because I missed the QTE and I didn't get a perfect platinum grade and Space Harrier sucks and and and

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>The tree sucks blood from humans
And that's all it needs to do, that'll make it easy for anyone to get the blood by cutting up the arteries and drink it
>He witnessed what Mundus did to his city, burning everything down, and didn't change
He did change, that was the reason he was a power autist
>He raised the tower in 3 and didn't care
Because there wasn't anything to change him other than ataining what he wants
>Vergil needed something big to get him to see how stupid he was being
Yeah, a reflection of himself would be enough one to remind that he has made himself a slave of his own desires instead of a master, there doesnt need to be a splitting to haves schtick.
>How is it odd? He split himself because he wanted to survive
His motivation to defeat Dante, to survive is an instinct that every creature has so it doesnt much count as a motivation on it own
>Vergil can't go through the story fighting nero and dante, he's dying user from mundus aids how the fuck could he do anything?
He isn't dying in the story I made up, so it could work
>V, Urizen and the central story isn't enough
>And we're getting playable Vergil later anyways
You barely feel like it's Vergil, and it would be better if we got complete Vergil for most of the game rather than some exaggerations of his two halves

>2 is soul-suckingly bad
for someone preaching enlightenment you are wearing pretty thick shades.

The hd ports are shit. ALL OF THEM

>He isn't dying in the story I made up, so it could work
So pretty much just change everything?

>and it would be better if we got complete Vergil for most of the game rather than some exaggerations of his two halves
Nah I like that Vergil had to rely on his humanity and others to finally learn what being human is. He was so desperate he got rid of the part he thought he didn't need but ended up needing it anyways.

I must be weird then 1 is still my favorite 3 is a close second 4 is alright 5 is fun to play but that's about it.

It was the first of it's genre.
Also the RE vibes were great.

Honest to god fucking question here, what is people's issue with DMC1 swimming sections? I'll be the first to say I would prefer if they were not in the game because I don't think they add much value to the overall experience. However when people talk about the incredibly small segments of swimming in this game people make it out to be like it's at least 10 minutes of your time.

First time
>Jump into water, swim into ship, swim up, you're out of the water, pick up Needle Gun
Second Time
>Swim into the whole, just fucking shoot the Blades while they swim awkwardly towards you and your Needles track them
>swim down hole, swim out of ship, done
Third time
>swim through some tunnels full of Red Orbs, swim into next shoot, just spam the fire button while swimming towards the Sin Scissors and kill them without any effort, done

The grand total amount of time you'll be underwater is probably less than three minutes. What the fuck is the huge deal people make out of this?

DMC1 isn't in the same genre as 3/4/5 unless you mean the genre of "Action" in which case it's not the first.

This is the correct order.

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To be fair things were retconned as given by the title of the old artbook.
I guess learning about his nephew helped him cheer up.

If you want good combat you play Yakuza games. Stop wasting your time on trash.

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Yeah things make a lot more sense with the new ordering. I still don't get why it wasn't like that to begin with.

>So pretty much just change everything?
I mean Vergil is still back, and the Qliphoth is there too, just that Urizen and V are their own thing so, it isn't a huge change other than making Vergil the rival boss instead of Urizen
>Nah I like that Vergil had to rely on his humanity and others to finally learn what being human is. He was so desperate he got rid of the part he thought he didn't need but ended up needing it anyways.
Eh, that's just your opinion, your entitled to yours as I am entitled to mine. Having Vergil see an example of what he could've been seems better than torturing Vergil for more months, and the rival fights where he ends up running away and losing could teach him about the thing he is missing with his quest to power, a heart.

DMC1 is the first game under the hack and slash umbrella. It set the standard for future hack and slash games much like Street Fighter 2 did for fighting games. Character Action is such a stupis name because it doesn't describe anything about it's mechanics, hell even Stylish Action game is a better description than Character Action. Hack and Slash works because that's what you can do in DMC it's just that DMC is more rewarding if you're more disciplined with your hack and slash tools.

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>V are their own thing
He wouldn't have existed lol

>Vergil see an example of what he could've been
That's what v did though, he saw what being power hungry and losing humanity did to him

>rival fights where he ends up running away
Yes lets make vergil lose for no reason? sounds like 3

In my opinion, Alastor steadily becomes less useful as you get better at the game. Ifrit and Sparda are both capable of ending fights much more quickly when you have a decent understanding of how to avoid attacks, and air raid spam loses a lot of its effectiveness on the higher difficulties.

you're kidding right? yakuza is brainless banham shit

>He wouldn't have existed lol
V was just a summoner playstyle, that was the idea at first, him being Vergil came in second, he could still exist as a duel entity of Urizen, a yin to Urizen's Yang. Which symbolizes Vergil's struggle with accepting his own identity and humanity
>That's what v did though, he saw what being power hungry and losing humanity did to him
I didn't like how we had to sacrifice real Vergil in exchange if that
>Yes lets make vergil lose for no reason? sounds like 3
He doesnt have all his power back, that's why he is going up to the throne room, to get more power, and what does this have to do with 3?

>V was just a summoner playstyle, that was the idea at first, him being Vergil came in second
Pretty sure it's the other way around. At some point they debated whether they needed to make V playable at all.

Nah, otherwise pic related wouldn't exist at all. them being unsure of including it was because how hard it was to make such a playstyle.

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This series is a total joke

>V was just a summoner playstyle, that was the idea at first, him being Vergil came in second, he could still exist as a duel entity of Urizen, a yin to Urizen's Yang. Which symbolizes Vergil's struggle with accepting his own identity and humanity
Nope V was always going to be an iteration of Vergil, concept art has him with his animal friends as well. The women was just the artist experimenting, the person who posted that even said so.

>I didn't like how we had to sacrifice real Vergil in exchange if that
V is like 70% vergil with the rest his demon autism.

>He doesnt have all his power back, that's why he is going up to the throne room, to get more power, and what does this have to do with 3?
Then why bother have him pitting him against people stronger than him? What lesson is he supposed to learn lol. What I mean by 3 is similar to how we fight Vergil three times and he always loses but never seems to learn any lesson by it. Even by the end of three he's still pretty stubborn.

>Nope V was always going to be an iteration of Vergil, concept art has him with his animal friends as well. The women was just the artist experimenting, the person who posted that even said so.
Than they could just change that fact, because as I said it is best if we had Vergil more in the game than his two halves
>V is like 70% vergil with the rest his demon autism.
Your missing the point, I want Vergil because it would make for a better rival boss than Urizen who you fight 5 times in the game, splitting him took away every chance for that.
>Then why bother have him pitting him against people stronger than him? What lesson is he supposed to learn lol.
He's gaining power throughout and he's testing how much stronger has got, and one of the boss fights will have him in constant DT, that would show how he is slowly losing his humanity. But these are just fantasies for some game that doesn't exist.
>What I mean by 3 is similar to how we fight Vergil three times and he always loses but never seems to learn any lesson by it. Even by the end of three he's still pretty stubborn.
He doesn't lose in the first fight, he doesnt lose in the second fight because they were interrupted by Lady and Arkham, he did lose in the third fight though. And it doesnt need to be like 3 since you'll be fighting him as 3 different characters and with diffrent moves

I just finished my first playthrough about an hour ago, haven't really played DMC much prior. I'll admit barring the odd janky platforming or swimming section I really enjoyed it, can see myself going back to it on harder difficulties at some point. Next I'm going to try 2 despite all objections, I need to see how bad it is for myself

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The thing about 2 nobody mentions is not only is it awful, but of the 3 (yes three) characters Dante is the worst one to play as. Lucia's campaign is tighter and her gameplay isn't as bad for being something more fresh (and because you aren't comparing it to how much better Dante felt in 1), however her underwater sections are so awful that they offset that. The best way to play 2 is on DMD with Trish (who plays like 1 Dante) but you need to beat Dante's campaign twice to get her so fuck that.

Vergil will probably be getting V's style since having Dante,Nero and V would be to much for just a 20 mission game.

>Vergil because it would make for a better rival boss than Urizen
but we did got Vergil twice and Urizen was something new instead of fighting Vergil again

>He's gaining power throughout and he's testing how much stronger has got, and one of the boss fights will have him in constant DT, that would show how he is slowly losing his humanity. But these are just fantasies for some game that doesn't exist.
We don't even play as him so I'd be pretty impersonal and we wouldn't have been able to see what he's thinking unlike v

>And it doesnt need to be like 3 since you'll be fighting him as 3 different characters and with diffrent moves
You got that in bp

show me 1 (ONE) pre 2001 action game superior to DMC1

i was only 7 when this game came out.. makes me sad that i'll never experience something similar. not many games really have.

I don't know about superior but there's two PS1 games that were pretty close to pulling off what DMC did in different ways but kind of fell short: Rising Zan Samurai Gunman and Tai Fu.

>Tai Fu
I remember playing. Never really got far into it though.

>Vergil will probably be getting V's style since having
Not possible, V's playstyle is too much to be rolled into a Vergil for no logical reason, and do you really want him to have tattoos and black hair?
>but we did got Vergil twice and Urizen was something new instead of fighting Vergil again
Fighting Vergil back to back wasn't a good thing it felt like one fight with a character switch, and Irizen could still be a boss
>We don't even play as him so I'd be pretty impersonal and we wouldn't have been able to see what he's thinking unlike v
The rival fights would show it, him getting the Yamato back by taking away the Bringer from Nero would serve as some nice scenes, and a fust fight with Dante would be sick too, and we'll be seeing how he thinks because his personality is still similar to both V and Urizen.
>You got that in bp
But you can also get that in the main campaign and have it be in different enviorments and different moves

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These threads will not stop being made until you admit dmc was never good.

>DMC threads forever

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How do I get good at DMC1? Bought the 1-4 collection on sale and the first spider boss kept beating me up. I kind of get the whole timing inputs for different attacks now but I guess I just suck at movement and getting in and out to attack his face. Pls no bully guys I've had interest in this series for awhile and finally want to step up to the plate after all the V hype.

jumping on his back works but the much safer consistent option is stingering his face, you can reflect his fireballs back at him with stinger for massive damage and you have much more control over your positioning on the ground
air raid also chunks him hard on anything below DMD

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Phantom's weak point is his head and abdomen. You've got to attack those parts to deal damage. You can charge up Ebony and Ivory by holding the shoot button until your arms glow for some free shots without using Devil Trigger. You can also use the Stinger ability when he's charging up his fireball to make it explode in his mouth, stunning him and dealing damage. You can also slash the fireball back at him if he shoots it at you. Just gotta learn when you can get your hits in, keep taunting to build up your Devil Trigger gauge whenever you can. Devil Trigger gets a little wax and side lined in the later titles but it is monumentally important in DMC1.

DMC1 still feels like the only game in the series where I'm forced to understand the full capacity of my moveset, as well as the enemy's, in order to win on higher difficulties
Nightmare, for instance, being better to fight with Ifrit so as to keep the cores intact for the next fight is something which doesn't outright make the game easier, but it is a piece of strategy you could naturally pick up on and which makes a part of your arsenal feel useful

Compare with the fist weapons in 3, 4, and 5 and I just never felt the same thing
I'll swap to them to get a higher combo score and that's it, there's no other particular use for them besides that
At the end of the day, bosses are beaten by trickster dodging around until you see an opening and then wailing on them with blademaster and tricking away
Then you build up SDT and chunk them for half their HP to win

I do 3, 4, and 5, but 1 is the only where where it feels like every single possible thing the player could do was taken into full consideration and given its place to shine

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Shoot him even when he's blocking to build DT. When he gets close, take a baby step in and then step back out to bait him into slashing, then stinger his face. The rest is just about learning his moves really.

This is all true, but my personal tastes in games have me prefer games where there are so many options that I can handle a challenge in whatever way I personally see fit, being able to figure out either the best way in my moveset to deal with an enemy or boss or find the way to do it with the weapons I want to use. Cavaliere is my favorite Devil Arm so I want to use it, and so I have to find out what moves are useful against each enemy type or boss; sometimes it's easy (Artemis just eats shit to it) and sometimes it's difficult. Sometimes I just use whatever weapon feels the most natural to fight a given enemy; Ice Age makes Furies trivial but I prefer using Flint Wheel to parry them because I like Balrog Kick a lot and I prefer following it up with Air Trick into its midair Swordmaster for the best damage off that parry.

1's philosophy is very smart and why it has stayed worthwhile (whereas I feel like 5 kind of steps on 4's toes in most ways) and I completely get the appeal of it to certain people's tastes. Personally, I rate the series 5 > 1 = 3SE > 3 = 4SE > 4 > DmC:DE >>> DmC > 2 because of my preferences, but I feel like 1 & 5 are the best overall releases in the series because they feel the most complete; 3SE is on their level but it added a lot of the content that makes 3 so replayable (costumes, Bloody Palace, Vergil).

Thanks fellas.

>bosses are beaten by trickster dodging around until you see an opening and then wailing on them with blademaster and tricking away
So you do things in the most boring possible way?

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Yeah, DMC1 has cool enemy concepts but shit enemy design. It's not that hard to comprehend unless you're dumb.

nigger, DMC1 has arguably the best enemy design out of all games. aside from 5 all the other games have mostly shit enemies

No. DMC1 has color-coded enemies, gimmick enemies, enemies the game itself suggest you better skip rather than fight, enemies that can be trivialized and looped.

It took DMC4 to make DMC1 enemies good, read the thread, you dumb hipster.

>Not possible, V's playstyle is too much to be rolled into a Vergil for no logical reason, and do you really want him to have tattoos and black hair?
He doesn't need to change his appearance or anything
Just integrate his summons into gauntlets and use his doppelganger
V could have just been bare bones because they were using him to prototype for playable vergil

>Fighting Vergil back to back wasn't a good thing it felt like one fight with a character switch, and Irizen could still be a boss
Agreed, we could have gotten one less urizen boss fight. Have Nero and Dante fight him once and then the ending with vergil
Could have had a unique boss or have vergil appear earlier

>The rival fights would show it, him getting the Yamato back by taking away the Bringer from Nero would serve as some nice scenes,
what we got in 5
>and a fust fight with Dante would be sick too,
wish we got the fistfight before the battle
>and we'll be seeing how he thinks because his personality is still similar to both V and Urizen.
So you want V to act like vergil but not be vergil? V is liked because of what we know in the story and his background.

>But you can also get that in the main campaign and have it be in different enviorments and different moves
isnt that just like fighting urizen 3 times? new moves and different environment?

Couldn't have said it better

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>DMC1 still feels like the only game in the series where I'm forced to understand the full capacity of my moveset, as well as the enemy's, in order to win on higher difficulties
Imagine being this dumb and pretentious

That to me sounds like you favor restrictions and optimization over freedom to experiment when it comes to the mechanics.

Not everything needs a free camera angle. It suited 1 just fine.

>Just integrate his summons into gauntlets and use his doppelganger
>V could have just been bare bones because they were using him to prototype for playable vergil
Can you explain to me how would that work in gameplay for Vergil?
>what we got in 5
Yeah but Nero thought it was Urizen that took his arm, while in my story he'll be chasing Vergil for payback and heading up to Urizen to try and stop this mess
>So you want V to act like vergil but not be vergil? V is liked because of what we know in the story and his background
Yes, V is symbolic to Vergil's humanity, and Urizen is his demonic side. They both fight each other and V would try and return to Urizen to regain the balance of the being they truly were, all that teaches Vergil to accept his humanity without the need to split him in two
>isnt that just like fighting urizen 3 times? new moves and different environment?
Yeah, but this time it won't be with a mediocre boss

It's hard as fuck on DMD. I cheesed it with items.

plae DMC2 is the beast, donte is good and bets in geaem play game p,.ls

bootey,m boynnetta 2 is baed pls dfon itlko play gfame i LIKE DERVIlmay 2 beterr befcaterhndv ghsnsd

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I agree, DMC1 contrarians are unbearable.

Even DMC2 Dante hates DMC2.

That was manageable on Normal, and narrowly so on Hard, but man was the Mundus fight agonizing on Dante Must Die difficulty. While it's phenomenal when it comes to visuals and the sheer scope of powers involved, you have no chance to practice that first phase's combat anywhere else, and it must be done every time before you can reach the extremely difficult (though more conventional) second phase.

Dude, the camera in 1 could blow. Fighting Phantom for the first time can be obnoxious because of that.

>abusing the enemy (Ifrit) to fight them.
Just because Ifrit has an advantage doesn't mean the blades are a total no-go. Ifrit, for example, has very short range.