I'm at Iifa tree and so far

It's the best game out of a series composed of almost entirely overrated garbage games

Town interactions make the other party members feel more like characters.

From the OST to the dialogue to the environments, everything is brimming with charm. Also Zidane was a very refreshing MC especially following 7 and 8. The ending was tinged with appropriate sad sentiment and went out on an unapologetically joyous note that it nailed. It's good shit even if I don't give a shit about Eiko or Amarant.

Because it's the last classic FF and was followed by one of the worst.

Setting and sound are great. But the gameplay is trash and don't give a shit for story on games.

following*

X is the best FF, though.

8 is fine. Hating it is a meme. The idea that there are people who hate 8 and love 10 makes me sic.
It's BARELY ff and it's nothing special.

Because Eiko is cute, and also makes me want to fuck a rat?

Because people only played the first disc when the game has an interesting premise and battle speeds are still acceptable since there are few enemies to a battle and oftentimes your party isn't full. What quality is there is mostly blown in the first chunk of the game. You can tell the people who haven't even played the game if they don't mention how slow the battles are (due to having to load, so everything ends up in a giant queue) and how terrible the graphics were out of cinematics. They really tried to give everything fine detail and instead it's a pixelated fucking mess.

>level scaling
>draw system
>fine
its dogshit. bottom 3 mainline at least

I still think the rest of the game in generally fantastic but the games battle speed is a fucking snails pace. Replaying it on the ps4 atm and the fast forward key is a god send

>20 years later people still don't know how to play FF8 because they have ADD/are illiterate/need to mindlessly grind 50 levels off the bat because they're JRPG scrubs

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It's easily the best FF out of the entire series.
>Great story
>Memorable characters
>Amazing soundtrack
>Twists and turns along the way
>Settings and environment are top notch and perfectly fit the Medieval fantasy theme

Fuck I get goosebumps just thinking about the game.

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when i was a kid and replayed it later i never noticed the slow battles and never complained

maybe its because i like games and not a whinny retard?

cope. and let's not forget
>rinoa is worst girl in FF and an absolute retard
>"dude we all grew up together but forgot lmao"

Kids these days are too entitled and expect games that you can play in quick succession.
They need to stay far away from RPG's which are meant to be time consuming.

The zoomer seethe for turn-based combat makes my dick hard

>people still think it's Lifa tree instead of iifa tree

Level scaling was meh. The junction system was great.

>cope
Says the guy complaining about the draw system and level scaling when there's simple ways to mitigate it. Don't get mad that everyone else has figured that shit out except you.

Yuna is much worse. The memory thing is foreshadowed like 4 seconds in.

You retards. Final Fantasy 1 is more responsive than 9 is. 9 has some terrible issues with loading during battle so you will have characters "readying" themselves for a random amount of time. This readying also has a minimum. While this is going on, the bars still fill for you to give another command. What can and does happen is that you end up being able to input commands long before the character is allowed to do anything. It's sluggish and unresponsive feeling. Every other Final Fantasy avoids this. Every single one.

The story absolutely drops everything interesting it had and becomes horrible schlock.

>>"dude we all grew up together but forgot lmao"

because....

>"Hurr we made a promise as children and you were actually one guy but you forgot because you were a clone of the other guy lol"
>"Hurr you were from another planet of other people who looked like you and the guy trying to kill us was your brother but you forgot lol"
>"Hurr you're a dream of your dead dad's dream who turned into a giant monster with the memory of you inside it but he forgot lmao"

...are all so much better.

>You retards. Final Fantasy 1 is more responsive than 9 is. 9 has some terrible issues with loading during battle
to me, the camera changes and the monster roaring and showing is soul.

figuring it out doesnt make it any less of a shitty system. level scaling is the laziest way imaginable to balance something.

I tried to like FFIX but good god it's a chore to play. Everything is so absurdly slow.

>>"Hurr you were from another planet of other people who looked like you and the guy trying to kill us was your brother but you forgot lol"
ZIdane didnt forgot, kuja took baby zidane and left him in gaia before Garland gave him his functions.

>The story absolutely drops everything interesting it had and becomes horrible schlock.
You say you only made it up to the iifa tree so how do you know the story gets dropped?
If anything it keeps getting better the longer you play. It rewards you for sticking with it.

>can't choose your party members

The game goes from 10/10 to 6/10 as soon as you can

>cope

Attached: I don't like FF8.png (803x178, 35K)

>suddenly remembering the official FFIX strategy guide

What the FUCK were they thinking?

>all these triggered VIII contrarians
I love it.

The funniest thing is watching people try to argue over the quality of the FF games' stories. They're all laughably bad fanfiction.net-tier garbage.

It's like watching people argue over which one of the Transformers movies has the best plot.

>slow battles

This is definitely true. Probably has the worst ATB in the series because of how slow it is. I don't know what you're talking about with the high mp costs though.

>figuring it out doesnt make it any less of a shitty system
You haven't even explained why it's so shitty

>level scaling is the laziest way imaginable to balance something
It works in FF8 because levelling up isn't the only or even the primary way of getting stronger.

>ff game
>protag's backstory is a major revelation

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It's like entering a thread about Final Fantasy and reading discussion about Final Fantasy. The funniest. Same as with a less-than-2-hour-long live-action movie series about cartoon fighting robots. Gotta enter those threads to read them discussing written plot elements.

You should enter a thread and read people discussion (what you think is extremely high quality writing) too!

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They do? I don't know anybody that likes IX over VII or VIII and it's probably one of the least talked games.
I personally consider it the last actual Final Fantasy as X went alredy off the rails with the change of concept.
Still, pretty weak.
Story is decent by FF standards, but characters are too childish which can ruin the plot.
I hast the least side-content and, to make it worse, is just a copy of VIII's
Also, the character evolution is the most dumbed down as it relies almost solely on equiping items to memorize the skill and that's it.

By now i had 120 mp with Vivi. Fira costs 12 and I had to use it in every battle. At least I can stock ethers.

It has all the things that make final fantasy unique airships,black/white mages,crystals,dragoons etc. It’s the most final fantasy a final fantasy game can be.

People generally like three kinds of protagonists, user:
1. Relateable
2. Perfect
3. Surprising

When Final Fantasy games last more than 40+ hours, marketed towards children and teens through the 80s and 90s playing the game a few hours at a time per day, a LOT of plot elements get to/need to be explored. "Revealing" backstory for literally everyone happens to keep interest from start to finish. It's a role-playing-game that you read. It's not Space Cadet Pinball.

Attached: Exdeath.jpg (1920x1200, 1.16M)

soul

IX should've been remade, at least for better proportioned characters.

i think ffix should keep its artstyle just in modern graphics

>better proportioned characters
Anatomically correct realism was not the point of Toshiyuki Itahana's chibi style.

Attached: Alexandria Comparison.jpg (1959x910, 468K)

>complaining story driven rpg game has lots of cutscenes

wew lad

and yet, 8 is getting the remaster 7, 9 and all the other fags can only dream about.
WE WON

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Use the girls to cast life/cura on zombie/dracozombies. You can kill Stropers in one go with a Soft. Play the game smart.

8's pc port also doesnt work worth a fuck
7's works more or less fine
9's is great
and even then 3 4 5 6 9 10/10-2 and 12 got redos before it

>to me, the camera changes and the monster roaring and showing is soul.
It is, for the first few times. After that I just sit there wishing it would hurry up so I could get on with the fight.

I always thought it was classic sword n board fags that didn't like 7 and 8's more modern take on the series. I also may be full of shit.

Go fuck yourself with a male idol inside a luxury car you fucking faggot .

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your language just show what you are

Grinding hard, was farming them high level green dragons with lvl 5 death... for about 20 or so levels. I am ready to fuk shit up.

Attached: Screenshot_20190727-141526_FinalFantasy9.png (1920x1080, 860K)

Great setting, fun characters and story, good music.

While I enjoy 7 and the first disc of 8 thats how I feel
4 5 and 9 are my favorite partly for the settings
They also have more fleshed out equipment systems opposed to 7 and 8(although materia is tied to the equipment system so it gets a bit of a pass but 8's junction flounders trying a similiar thing)

t. no clue what I’m doing.

Constantly revolving party so everyone gets screentime was one of the best things about FF9

You got me.

Attached: Screenshot_20190727-142203_FAQr.png (1080x1920, 260K)

Trying to 99% this game.

Too bad it didn't give you reasons to care about half the party while they were at it.

9 is more about the equipment rather than the level
Also if you want to know the autism of optimized ff9 look into the stat dividends you get from leveling up with certain pieces of gear equipped
also
>grinding
>in any FF outside of maybe 1-3

>>slow battles
change the setting speed noob
>>mp costs too high
yeah spam magic to win, rpgs need strats
>>can't choose your party members
you can

I played 8 when I was 12, and, I hated because who the fuck wants to play with character that looked like was part of backstreet boys, and that shit romantic bullshit, also, no airships, no moogles, no fantasy. 7 was okay, had a good variety of locations, interesting world to explore, and characters didn't look they were part of a boy bad.
One of the reasons why I hate FFXV is because everyone looks like they are part of a south korean soap opera, specially with the main characters, with their matching clothes.

What 1% are you leaving out?

Nostalgiafags
9 fucking sucks
5 is the best in the series

Not quite sure, I probably will or have missed a thing or 2 though. The jump rope is one I still need to do

Already too late for him. Optimized stats need to be gained from proper equipment at level 1. I.e. Stopping and petrifying forced encs.

i get people having opinions but jesus christ i dont get ultra shit taste by choice, ff X is literally the worst , shit characters, shit sport, shit linear map, shit mechanics, broke the classic 9999 dmg, broke fantasy setting, its the worst thing in the final fantasy franchise

the only good thing in X is the music, but thats cuz Nobuo its a fucking god, and its not better than other FFs music

I have no idea about this, so yeh prolly to late to min/max. O well, my goal was to beat it and get mostly everything done. I can accomplish this still I think.

Just use the ethers

Can you use the ai upscale mod on a pirated copy?

>LE BOSS THAT DIES TO A PHOENI DOWN MEME LMAOOOOOOOOO

Is there a worse thing in all of videogames
If you dont do it you feel like an idiot, if you do it you get robbed of an exciting encounter
Fuck you FF devs fuck you

Vivi and Steiner are the only likeable characters, Freya has a cool design I guess but everyone else needs to die in a horrible fire. The artstyle for most characters is just dreadful despite what nostalgiafags say but I do like the setting
OST is completely mediocre past the first CD which does have some great tunes, nowhere near as consistant as most other FFs
And if slow battles weren't bad enough I have no idea what they were thinking with the Trance system, shit is baffling

>le
What year do you think this is?

Nah, all it would need is a graphics update.

>slow battles
It's a turn-based game, not Devil May Cry.
>mp costs too high
Gosh, it's almost like you have to use strategy on when to use your resources.
>can't choose your party members
You can change them just the same as you can any other Final Fantasy game.

I mean you still have to dance with the boss to steal everything from it
ff5-9 all have a boss you can 1 shot with phoenix downs
>tyrasaurus
>phantom train
>gi nattak
>gerogero
>soulcage

7 and 9 aren't getting what 8 is getting, not even close. 7 should have got what 8 is getting now, especially before the clusterfuck remake. oh well!
barely any changes had to be made with 10 and 12. 3-6 remasters look UGLY
squeenix knew what they were doing
youtube.com/watch?v=5EdmHSTwmWY

recently bought the steam version and have been playing with the Moguri Mod, game looks fucking fantastic, still not found a reliable mod that downsizes the battle UI though
as an aside, with the 9999 and speed booster, how fast can you complete the game from start to finish assuming you skip all side quests and cutscenes and just mash though the dialogue?

Attached: 6093439_p0.jpg (1002x862, 244K)

You can get most things done still yeah. The thing about getting the optimized stats is that you need to remain level 1 throughout your entire playthrough, because the best stat boosting equipment isn't available until late game.

3 and 4 remakes are fine just different, its only 5 and 6 that are garbage fires
9 is about the same as 8, just some hd models and a new coat of paint which is just barely more than 10/10-2 got

definitely within a day
somewhere like 5-6 hours if you know the puzzles

>Why people like this game so much?

because you're a faggot OP

VIII is getting eng/jpn voiceovers too. Unknown if it's just for FMV or the entire game. I think there's a couple more unannounced new features

>VIII is getting eng/jpn voiceovers too.
Not confirmed.

You're delusional if you think doing VIII last is "saving the best for last". Its popularity has greatly diminished everywhere over time. SE skipped over it in favor of other games in series constantly.

It was a walking simulator before XIII solidified that being the de facto mode of operation for ff games.
Look at the world map list (not even a real world map). Its a straight line. A hallway. I know its like that for a theme in game but its still shit.

lol no
Its great battle system is not enough to save it
You are better off playing a dungeon crawler

Fuck fonts with indistinguishable lowercase Ls and uppercase i's for confusing me like this

Attached: fry scream.gif (323x301, 12K)

It being a story driven RPG makes the abundance of cutscenes even more unforgivable.

>plebs hating on X

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It is Lifa Tree though.
Its the life tree, the world tree, Yggdrasil

I tried the Switch port. I couldn't make it past the tunnel maze. The game is fine. But the port is terrible. It would take a whole 20 seconds from the start of the encounter to when I could select my first move. The pillarboxing is ugly. The low res backgrounds clash with the high res character models. The text boxes are too big. There's the music glitch. The cons make it near unplayable.

Best girl

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>jrpg
>gameplay

Its a shit game and most people realize this after the rose tint wears off.
It wasn't a good game. It was just the first big game you played on your first DVD player. That is the only reason people like it. Orphan came out as a launch title too, its utter shite but people defend it because of the nostalgia with it being a launch title on the fucking PS fucking duex

It is Iifa Tree. With an I.

It is referenced in the Ultimacia books as Lifa Tree. on other maps of the gameworld it is clearly an upper case cursive "L"

Show me on the doll where the iifa tree touched you.

Excalibur 2 at least

on my horn

yeah ok but that Eiko cunny though

Eiko is NOT for lewd!

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Kuja's boipucci tho

Attached: Kuja.jpg (649x1000, 602K)

he has nice hips too bad about the face

I enjoy 9 but replaying it not long ago was only bearable after using the turbo mode of the emulator to speed up battles. Its crazy how long even the basic attacking takes compared to other games. I really like the equipment/ability system but its a chore mid game when you want specific very strong abilities on everyone which just means you swap the same armor to anyone who can take it.

There actually is a way to do and get everything, including excalibur 2. Its just extremely precise and tedious as all hell

>not installing the mod that lets you get Exalibur 2 by getting 99% of treasures OR getting there in the time limit like how it should have been to being with

I think everyone's face looks weird in FFIX not just Kuja

Attached: Kuja.full.109588.jpg (800x674, 657K)

I want to pet her

by precise and tedious do you mean just idling the game until the timer rolls over?

It's like you kids never played with a GameShark.

Fair point
But Eiko´s cuteness still comes through fine

But she wants a man so she absolutely is.

I used it on the PS1 FF games, but it always made the last boss freeze for some reason. I remember I used a lvl 99 code for FF8 and didn't understand why the fuck I was weaker than before.

>out of all the characters in the game, identify with Eiko the most
>nobody gives her a hug

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gamefaqs.gamespot.com/ps/197338-final-fantasy-ix/faqs/41181
Theres a legitimate way to do it

Literally just finished this game like a week ago.

The pace is absolute ass. If it wasn't for the speed up function on the new ports I don't think I could have finished it. Half the cast is useless and could have been cut at no loss to the story. Battle system is fine, pretty basic stuff. I liked the gem system though. Music is pretty good. Vivi is the best character in the whole series. And I thought the final dungeon was one of the coolest thematically and aesthetically in the series.

It ranks basically in the middle of the FF games I've played. Some high highs and some low lows

10=7>4>9>15>1

>great party members
Yea man, Amarant, Freya, and Quina are great.

waiting for 100 hours is equally as legitimate.

>Identify as the little girl

bait: the post

He's perfect in everyway

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>100
its almost 20k hours for it to rollover user

No, gamefaqs.gamespot.com/ps/197338-final-fantasy-ix/faqs/41181 the autismo levels for this game are through the roof

I dont get the satisfaction if i cheat, if you do, im fine with it. Doesnt work to me

>Zidane, the so-called hero, is #metoo incarnate
>Everyone fatshames the Queen and calls her ugly
>Every male character talk about how much they want to fuck the 15 year old princess
>People assuming Quina's gender

This game is PROBLEMATIC.

Attached: Eiko.jpg (259x194, 9K)

No b8 m8. Just my opinion

Nostalgia filter.

deviantart.com/jmariofan7/art/FFIX-review-598982715

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>because of the great party members

Garnet:
1) Runs away from home because she's afraid her mother is trying to kill her and take over the world
2) Risks the lives of many, many people and causes numerous deaths along her flight from the castle (yes, I count all those Black Mages on the ship as deaths)
3) Upon arrival in Lindblum suddenly proclaims that she refuses to believe her mother is evil and trying to take over the world, despite proof of her unprovoked attack on Burmecia, the slaughter of Black Mages, and the attempts to kill the kidnappers
4) Runs all the way home because apparently she wanted to just talk to her mom
5) Through her stupidity, she gets captured and tortured. Millions of people die from the results of her entirely preventable course of action. That is why I hate Garnet.

I've got that kind of time on my hands, I'm not worried.

I know that picture is bait but its still wrong on multiple things

ok user if you feel like leaving something running for 833 consecutive days and occasionally save incase the power goes out you ps1 dies/pc restarts or whatever may happen

>It's BARELY ff and it's nothing special.

This says otherwise.

translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.finalfantasywhatever.com/2012/10/final-fantasy-ix-review.html

>because of the great party members,
Yeah no. Garnet, Freya, Amarant and Quina are horseshit. They have their one moment with the exception of Garnet in the game and after that its nothing.
>sublime soundtrack
Just no, its good but even ff5 that has 10 tracks is better
>overall great story
Another no. If the game would have just ended with the Eidolon war, sure. But there has to be other worlds, fucking artificial genome angels of death and some old fart fucking everything up for everyone. Oh yea and add the ass pull real final boss and all this equals good to you? Whatever you say pal

I has 50 additional hours of gameplay :)

Nigga you got so ethered you had to move goalposts, just admit you dont know a thing about ff8 and we are good

>It's BARELY ff and it's nothing special.

This says otherwise:

translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&tl=en&u=http://www.finalfantasywhatever.com/2014/07/final-fantasy-x-review.html&sandbox=1

It’s not bait.

He was talking about FFX user
Hes not that wrong about it.
Chocobos airships spellnames and summons are the only things that tie it to the franchise
Both 7 and 8 are like that aswell though but they both retained some of the more wild enemy designs compared to how tame 10's are

Not just that, you have to READ most of it. What a shitty game!

ffix is overrated fucking trash that has to rely on dozens of throwbacks to prior games because it lacks any identity of its own

>Vivi and Steiner are the only likeable characters

Vivi’s okay, but Steiner’s schtick got old really fast, it didn’t help that he was involved with Garnet’s idiotic “run back to Alexandria to “try and talk to mommy” BS subplot

The music in this game is fantastic.

>>rinoa is worst girl in FF

Luna managed to take that title

I know that, I mistakenly posted the wrong link, I meant to post “Final Fantasy? Whatever”’s FFX review link.

FFIX sucked.

The peak of FF was VII in third place, X in second place, and XII in first place.

No IX’s music is really generic, VII, X and XII had better soundtracks, XIII’s and XV’s music where better too and those wasn’t even Uematsu’s work.

Nether of those girls pulled the BS that Garnet did:

She quite literally goes back and hands her entire selection of eidolons to her mother after all the hard work Tantalus did to get her ass out of the kingdom. In the end Garnet is the one responsible for giving her mother magic nuclear weaponry that annihilated two countries, seriously hurt Lindblum and then Alexandria itself killing god knows how many people.

But hey, we're talking about a game where a war criminal is never confronted about the shit she did and is left to stay as an unbeatable mary sue.

Neither of them were a idiot princess who risks dozens of lives to escape her murderous mother, witnesses tons of evidence of her mother's genocidal tendancies, then decides that no, her mother can't be mean and she'll just run all the way home and have a friendly chat with her and get to the bottom of this. Thus rendering massive sections of the game pointless and the sacrifices of many, many people useless. Not to mention all the people that die because of it.

Because she's just. Stupid.

Okay, I guess she's not technically the protagonist....oh no, wait, I had to walk her through large sections of her stupidity, didn't I? And compared to any other character in the game, she got the majority of storylines over significantly better written and more interesting characters. And unlike FF8, there was no voice of reason telling her she was being stupid, selfish child that needed to grow the hell up. We were supposed to feel sorry for her.
Seriously, FF9 puts in castles and airships and apparently that's all it takes for people to worship it as the second coming.

To be fair, Garnet didn't KNOW what Branhe was going to do and the summons were taken away from her by force.

>But hey, we're talking about a game where a war criminal is never confronted
Beatrix was just following orders

>>slow battles
>he didn't install the moguri mod
Yikes.

Then why use experience and levels in the first place?
It's a shitty system whether you admit it or not.

Why haven't you switched to the superior series?

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All right, I'll explain why I hate Garnet and don't get why people like her and hate Rinoa.

Rinoa:
1) Starts out immature
2) Gets called out on it
3) After making a giant fuck up, learns from it and shapes up
4) Mostly risks her own life, though others have to fix her mess - something she remains aware of thereafter
5) Has the crappiest luck in the universe, but does not directly serve as the cause of any future problems

Garnet:
1) Runs away from home because she's afraid her mother is trying to kill her and take over the world
2) Risks the lives of many, many people and causes numerous deaths along her flight from the castle (yes, I count all those Black Mages on the ship as deaths)
3) Upon arrival in Lindblum suddenly proclaims that she refuses to believe her mother is evil and trying to take over the world, despite proof of her unprovoked attack on Burmecia, the slaughter of Black Mages, and the attempts to kill the kidnappers
4) Runs all the way home because apparently she wanted to just talk to her mom
5) Through her stupidity, she gets captured and tortured. Millions of people die from the results of her entirely preventable course of action.

But sure, keep calling Rinoa “worst girl”.

Absolute assmad samefaggotry

But she ran away from home because she knew her mother was going crazy. It's not such a sudden about-face, Garnet already knew this was going on and was frightened enough that she ran away from home rather than actually talk to her mother (something you'd assume someone that had an otherwise perfect relationship with their mother would do first). Had all of the stuff we'd just witnessed not happened, and Garnet had come to Lindblum without ever fearing her mother or seeing evidence of her mother's atrocities, then the "My mother isn't evil!" reaction would make sense.

>Beatrix was just following orders, she dindu nothin

That’s not an excuse, especially when she’s bragging about it, she’s basically a poorly written Cecil, Cecil never did any of the BS Beatrix pulled.

>shitting on a character for things out of her control

I can see the bias against Garnet.

because I have beaten all of them but 7 and 10

>Cecil never did any of the BS Beatrix pulled.

so you never even got past the opening sequence of 4? Pathetic.

I clearly meant X.

There is also the fact that Cid KNEW the Queen was after the Eidolons, no joke, quote directly from the game:

"Brahne was after the eidolons. That much, I knew."

*Sigh* So let me get this straight Cid Fabool, you knew that the queen was after the Eidolons yet before all the events that transpired you never bothered to share this INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT information with the cast, ESPECIALLY to the daughter of said queen who has said Eidolons WITHIN HER (that you should be well aware of) so that they would be more cautious?

Why is this autist complaining with himself about Garnet.
Just post the word "bump" in your post if that is what you want. Its clear you are arguing with yourself to promote posts.
If not, you 2 should get a room. You type and think the exact same.

I know, the first link was a mistake, I posted the correct link in the second comment.

>>shitting on a character for things out of her control
>I can see the bias against Garnet.

Out of her control? Brahne would have never gotten the Eidolons if Garnet didn’t run home like an idiot after making all that effort to ESCAPE from home.

All three of those are some of the least "final fantasy" games in the series

>EUfags had to get to the final dungeon in under 5 hours of actual gameplay to get Excalibur II
>all while playing an unoptimized piece of shit compared to NA
Jesus, poor guys

People don’t seem to be getting my point that there was a much better more interesting way the game could have gone instead of Garnet’s stupid subplot that you had to play the whole damn segment out despite how obvious her adventure was going to turn out. It was just painful and drawn out for a foregone conclusion, and it ruins Zidane and Garnet’s love story that the game pretends is a big deal when it isn’t, because she ABANDONS him.

Its a fictional reality that is based on fairy tales. The heroes are those of a fairy tale. Why did you think they would end up getting sentenced for war crimes at the Hague?

No there's not there's only ways to exchange one way of grinding for another. Not even the same user and I know that statement is complete bullshit. VIII is legitimately the worst Final Fantasy that exists.

>All three of those are some of the least "final fantasy" games in the series

Who decides what Final Fantasy is? Sakaguchi?

Nostalgia goggle wearers always bring this up like it means something. This is the same guy that nearly tanked his entire company with that awful movie and then went on to make blue dragon and the last story. Sure. His opinion is gospel.

The golden age of FF (VII, X and XII) were all made/written/designed by people way more fucking talented. Same went with Mistwalker. Lost Odyssey was mostly made and written by others (Daisuke Fukugawa, and good parts of the plot (like the text stories, world concept and characters) were done by Kiyoshi Shigematsu), while the games Sakaguchi did have more input on are the ones nobody fucking remembers. What input Sakaguchi DID have on the good entries with his name slapped on them were so absolutely minuscule, and usually rewritten/designed by other people anyway.

The story, simplicity and ascetic. In terms of gameplay It's the ATB at it's worst.

Garnet ran from Brahne based on her own evidence, her own experience and her knowledge that staying is worse for herself, he mother, its citizens and the entire world. It aligned PERFECTLY (but coincidentally!! lol!) with her uncle's, Regent Cid of the other powerful trade nation Lindblum, plan to use the troupe Tantalus to "kidnap" her away from what HE, TOO, could tell was an increasingly psychopathic queen of Alexandria.

The game proves both of these royals' decision to have Garnet leave and not return was the best choice for absolutely everyone involved. But Garnet has a sudden mood-switch and acts like a child, ordering her personal knight to guide her back to the Queen just to talk to her and have no other goal whatsoever, thinking it'll all be fine despite all the compounding, building and extreme level of evidence proving at every step this was the wrong decision to make causing her mortal risk when she was otherwise entirely safe (and loved).

All this ends with the completely obvious result: Garnet loses everything, MILLIONS if not more are murdered with absolutely no cause or reason why, specifically because of the impossibly powerful magic Garnet, herself, knew she would be giving directly to this queen. Destruction, all by ignorant and dismissive choice, which renders the entire first 2/3rds of the in-game political and social actions utterly pointless to no positive outcome. The last 1/3rd of the game is simply fantasy where nothing mattered to begin with, it was all just Kuja using emotions to kill everyone faster due to orders, the characters of the game all were completely irrelevant. Only the reaper and Garland's thousands upon thousands of years of experience mattered.

But hey, 15-year-old pear-shaped ass, amirite?

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>not leaving the game running for years and years to force the clock to overflow

>But hey, 15-year-old pear-shaped ass, amirite?

Well. Honestly its the only thing that matters

>if I keep on repeating it, then it will eventually be true

>want to avoid level scaling
>junction magic for stats

>want to avoid drawing
>refine items/cards
oh wow so hard

I've not made that observation (made 20 years ago) in this thread before, user.

And, to be honest, I liked FF9. it was a fun game, I've replayed and beaten it fully probably something like 5 or 6 times. It has a wonderful world, beautiful music and it's wonderful to explore. The fairy tales and fantasy of thief + princess love, the magical innocence of the mage, the destructively naivete of the powerful knights, the political structure of how personal bias can ruin national interest, the comfort of the Chocobo forests and lagoons, the treasures and writing, I can go on and on. It was a fun game to play. But it's not like I can't be critical of some very obviously poor character decisions obviously written into the game by human authors so the video game I was playing could continue forward into Zidane's backstory and the true ending of this universally-significant soul-based story of the return of two overlapping planets (which was a far more dull plot than medieval magical story of a compassionate thief and a magical princess having an adventure in their teen years).

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>Then why use experience and levels in the first place?
Because it's the established RPG advancement system which is an alternative to new system. Having both allows for different methods of advancement and keeps a familiar one in place while still incentivizing using the new one.

of course its bait, it ends with his backstory, unlike the other two

soft kills stropers, phoenix down kills zombie dragons. make sure quina eats a stroper or dragon to get lv5 death

>Junction Magic for stats
Have to get magic from drawing or refining items/cards
>Refining items/card
Which means you now have to grind out getting items/cards instead of levels, which means you have to play that awful triple triad bullshit that literally cheats to win cards or kill monsters which in turns levels you anyway. Either way it's a fucking grind to do either. No matter what you do all this game is is a grind fest.
On top of that you also forgot you can skip a lot of the useless monsters by completing SEED exam, but if you do you soft lock yourself out of collecting certain items for making certain characters end game weapons. The game is awful user, there's not a single argument you can make that can't be refuted in defending it.

I have to agree
Garnet did everything wrong

For someone who fell off after FFXII, who is Luna?

Incorrect. I've played Triple Triad against humans and it's clear the AI in VIII actually favors you. Imagine getting beat by AI commanded to lose to you. If you want to avoid killing enemies you can Card them instead which gives AP but no EXP.

>that awful triple triad bullshit

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>rinoa
>Giant Fuck up
That giant fuck up was running away mid-escort to fucking space and causing the moon to literally bukake literal demons from the moon onto the planet below causing to be absolutely flooded by monsters which in turn causes untold millions of deaths.
>has the crappiest luck in the universe
Luck has nothing to do with it, everything she did she did because she was a stubborn, immature, retard who went out of her way repeatedly to cause problem when all she had to fucking do was shut up, do what she was fucking told, and not run the fuck off.

Garnet on the other hand while being also a mentally retarded bitch at least made up for her mistakes by helping unite three kingdoms against her Mother/kuja and then even going personally to deal with Cid. Whereas Rinoa literally learns fucking nothing except she wants Squall dick.

But sure keep coping.

I feel like every PS1 era (and into PS2) ff game had some sort of long convoluted sidequest that you could easily ruin by accident.
I know people say it was to sell strat guides but I honestly think Square was just incompetent at designing longer scenarios that need to be tracked all game long.
Or at least the ff people at Square. Minstrel Song shows they can do that type of thing amazingly.
For some reason every FF in that era had some sort of bullshit.

>coping

way to completely make me disregard all you posted underage fag

The entire point I'm making is that you have to grind out carding enemies instead of drawing. You can try to move that goal post all you want, that point still stands.
>Triple Triad favors the player
>Card Rule Random favors the player
Yeah ok.

The entire scene you mentioned of the moon occurred specifically and explicitly because Sorceress Adel possessed Rinoa while she was being sent into space (based on all decisions except Squall's) so she could be sealed and not cause the planet any problems. It wasn't her choice to make any actions whatsoever once she was launched into space. And the space-launching was seen as the safe and wise thing to do by everyone (again, except Squall, who just wanted to be with his gf).

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The combat director got pulled off the game for FF8 mid-development.
Sakaguchi pulled him off FF8 to make FF9 side by side, allowing him to direct the entire game as a promotion. I don't blame the guy for taking it.
FF9 was the worst selling FF since like 4. It hurt everyone involved with the game at the time. Combat director didn't get involved much anymore since then. Sakaguchi quit the company.He takes rivalries very personally.
Part of him pushing so many FFs was because he didn't want the series to have a lower number of entries than DQ.
So Kitase took control of the series and it skyrocketed. And he took it personally.
FF9 is probably one of the most mediocre game in the series. Apparently 9 only exists in the state it does because Sakaguchi got jealous the series got bigger after he stopped being in charge.

Also let's not the mention that 9 was actually being developed as a spin-off (You can clearly see that because of it's chibi artstyle) Infact most of the team knew it was a spin off until it was decided it would be a mainline game hence FF8 sabotage and poaching. Which is why alot of the spin off in FF series have a similar artstyle to 9.

The Only Reason People defend 9 is because it was their first FF Game.

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I'm pretty sure the bird people in Crystal Chronicles is adapted from some of the Tantalus troupe models mixed with the rat people..

The AI player cant have more than one card over lvl 7 unless you have lost them your one or more of your owns. So Random shouldnt be a problem. With Same and Plus comboing you should have easy time making sure the AI wont beat you. That is of course assuming you have functional brain.

1. If you're not a guy who enjoys a good story you shouldnt be playing FF games, or JRPGs in general honestly.

2.Almost everything about IX's gameplay far outclasses its predecessors, with the exclusive exception of its battle speed. Which is alleviated by simply having patience, something that should be common for people who enjoy JRPGs in general. Thats not to say it doesn't have its share of flaws that easily turn into gripes (Uncontrolled trance, poor iteration of a card game, RNG in its main mini-game if you even call that a gripe, etc) but its singular glaring flaw being its battle speed (something easily fixed with turbo and ultimately fixed by its remaster) is probably a pretty damn good indicator that its one of the better of the games.

First off, I was born in 1990 you zoomer faggot, secondly refute anything I stated as untrue.
Cope
Harder.
They did, but nothing compares to Triple Triads bullshit. Random rule is when the game literally cheats and if you don't know what I mean, you will if you ever play it in FF8. It's absolute bullshit.

Garnet didn't unite anyone. Brahne united that continent when she started acting like a psychopath towards absolutely everyone. We only get poorly written dialogue that
>the citizens of Alexandria still loved their Queen despite the millions of deaths, genocidal murder and destruction of more than half the continent after brutally torturing and outright ripping the new power out of their beloved princess.
>You hear that? Look, they brought flowers to her funeral!
>They loved her, even though the city was demolished, family is dead, the countries are furious, Burmecians and Cleyrans as a race are practically extinct, all for absolutely zero positive result for anyone anywhere for any reason.
>Sad to see the queen go!!! ;;;(
Garnet did not serve a positive role in this game. She simply became the next royal once the game was over, where she married the plebian alien brother of the planet's greatest threat to existence. But it's okay, she's the 16-year-old queen now, she can make wise decisions.

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RIP the Coffee Man

To answer your essay however, you're actually wrong about the Eidolons and misunderstand Garnet's powers. Garnet in the game, can't even summon a single fucking eidolon in the beginning of the game. There's no sense that this is just a gameplay quirk. Garnet is blatantly incapable of summoning the eidolons at all.

So what danger did she think there was in going back to her own mother? Only her own life, which she was brave to risk, and her freedom. It was a courageous thing to do to go back to Brahne to try and diplomatically stop a huge war.

To get further into the nitty gritty: Brahne uses Odin when Garnet is in Alexandra, after capturing her and "extracting" the eidolon. Garnet only even realizes what the eidolons can do when she sees Atomos used against Lindblum and is mortified. You can't blame her for not realizing these unusable summons can level cities in the wrong hands. She simply had no way of knowing that would happen.

Not exactly a big Garnet fan but you sell her short as a fucking awful character.

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It's detrimental to the actual gameplay since the higher your level the harder it becomes, which makes it an outright useless mechanic only there to inconvenience the player just like in The Last Remnant.

I defend IX because despite all of it's flaws it's still a charming and fun game. And my first Final Fantasy game was the first final fantasy. 8 was awful, there's no defending that it's a bad game with everything wrong with it. I can understand if you like the game in the similar way I like 9 despite it's flaw etc. But at least 9 was a game with a passable story. 8 was an incoherent mess from it's story to it's characters. The only thing even mildly redeeming of the game is the music.

So its no different than Tactics advance ALWAYS giving the ranged damage ban card if you bring archers along?
I remember never losing in Triple Triad ever. You want a real bullshit minigame: the card game from FF9.

FFIX is liek 13 hours of cutscenes for 50-60 hours of gameplay.
And worse, a lot of those cutscenes are frontloaded and most of those actual gameplay hours are probably going to be near the END of the game.
Final Fantasy IV is like 2 hours of cutscenes for a 25 hour game.

FFIX: 20%-25% cutscenes.
FFIV: 8%-10% cutscenes

In other words, for every 2 hours of game time, FFIX has 30 minutes of cutscenes, while FFIV has 10 minutes. And again, FFIX's are front-loaded, with the early game ratio being more like 85% cutscenes. So for the first 2 hours of FFIX you'll have 15 minutes of gameplay while the first 2 hours of FFIV will be 15 minutes of cutscenes.

This is a massive difference. And if you do similar measurements for SNES games you'll find they are more in line with FFIV (just a bit longer). FFVI has like 4 hours of cutscenes but like 40 hours of gameplay.

>playing JRPG
>go through a dungeon, killing random encounters, getting some xp
>get to a boss
>impossible to beat without going back and grinding trash
what a good genre

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I understand user.

Im just saying sabotage contributed to how shit FF8 was. And how Sakaguchi is just a straight up bitter asshole who wanted his series to be as big as DQ in Japan.

>Which means you now have to grind out getting items/cards instead of levels
Which is infinitely easier/faster than grinding levels because you can use items you find or outright buy or play cards for 20-30 minutes and be set for 80% of the game.

Except for literally the past 3 games before it that also used ATB, which is the exact reason why characters must "ready" before an action, you blithering fucking retard. The only difference is the difference in attack animations, thus the minute difference in speed. Yes its slightly longer than the 2 3D games before it, and much longer than the much simpler 2d one (VI, the best FF anyway). No its not that big of a deal so long as you're not an ADD-raddled mouthbreathing speedfreak. In which case FF hasn't been the JRPG for you long before IX came to be.

Just say you don't like ATB over the old systems, but don't pretend IX committed some unforgivable sin and oust yourself as not knowing what the fuck you're talking about.

The only reason Cid and Burmecia allowed Garnet to become queen in the first place was because they knew she wasn't like her mother. Without garnet they would occupied the entire nation and caused civil war after that. Even if Garnet's only use was being quiet and sitting on a chair, she was still infinitely more useful and competent than Rinoa was in that she could actually do that without fucking everything up like Rinoa did.

>hating on Steiner
What shit taste

This but unironically

It's still a grind, you dodging the point is not going to change the fact that it's still a grind no matter what action you take.

>The Only Reason People defend 9 is because it was their first FF Game.
Nah, it's because it's fine as a storyfag game. The story is not actually great, but it's well-presented with a good translation, cool cutscenes, and unique aesthetics (which are baroque in detail but with this kind of fairy tale vibe)
The gameplay pacing and combat are sub-par to anyone with an ounce of taste who has played any other game in the series, but it's not actually broken or anything. Everything works like it's supposed to and there's at least a fairly typical amount of depth for a Final Fantasy game in terms of abilities and such.

The only flaw in 9 is the areas being linked to the disc. Once you get to disc 3 (I think) you can't really travel freely or finish any unfinished sidequests.
Entire areas are locked out.
It just sucks in a jrpg with an overworld.

Steiner would be 100% better if they didn't treat him and his entire character arc as comic relief.

Only if you try to grind absurd levels like a JRPG scrub. Is that your first instinct whenever you play a JRPG? What kind of brainlet can't handle a FF game to the point where they're grinding 30+ levels off the bat without even trying out the primary advancement system?

But they don't? He gets plenty of serious moments later in the story after he goes through development.

I actually liked the fact that this is probably the only FF title that stars a protagonist who knows "steal" from the start and nabbing equipment from enemies helps your characters progress permanently thanks to the new mechanic introduced in 9.

dude Steiner sucks. I mean sure he's fine by the end and he's always cool to Vivi, but god fucking damn he was retarded for a long time. Yes. I get it. He's insecure and compensating. You can stop fucking hammering me over the head with it, writers. Christ.

yeah exactly, long after he has worn out his welcome. He didn't need to be a stooge Zidane is carefree and humorous. Steiner would have been a fine straight man as a contrast to Zidane. But no he needed to be a sputtering, bumbling idiot for some reason.

He's still treated as a joke after that

>It's still a grind
Yeah if you absolutely need to be prepared for everything like you seem to need to be. If I can be a retarded kid who got all the way to Ultimecia without learning any junction skills then it can't be that difficult for anyone literate and willing to read.

Steiner's whole schtick is he flat out doesn't care what the others think of him (except his waifu) and he just does what he thinks he should, how people see it be damned.

He's fucking awesome and his big brother role to Vivi was touching.

It's easy to overlevel yourself.
Take the training-chamber with the dinosaurs at the start for example.

It's no excuse.
They should've committed to one or the other from the start instead of trying to mix them both into a clusterfuck of a progression-system.

big strong man that isn't so sure of himself as he looks like one of the 5 or so staple archetypes Japan loves.
It is their Jesus archetype. It links common man with heroic men.

You're claiming Garnet's biggest use is fanfiction theory of other rulers' motivations that occurred after the game's ending credits.

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>story of a compassionate thief and a magical princess having an adventure in their teen years

That isn't a plot.

Git gud

The best parts of FF9 was always the world, never the characters.

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The problem isn't Steiner's characterization it's that all the characters get sidelined after disc 3's start. There's a great section with the love letter, Garnet's coronation and Brahne's funeral... but then everyone except Zidane gets to do fuck all relevant.

I love FFIX but I will admit this is bad. The game may as well end after that for everyone except Zidane and maybe Eiko. Amarant gets development but it's bad. Steiner was fine.

I beat this game in less than week after I bought it out of pawn shop for $5 in 2002.
I was twelve at the time, I was around level fourty just casually playing the game and had no issue beating it what-so-ever. At the time I had skipped drawing summons off of bosses for the majority of the game, because I didn't realize I could do that until after you had to rescue squall from Seifer at the drill complex by a friend telling me about it. I still breezed thru the game with no issue. This game is not complex, it's not even hard if you intentionally fuck up. It's just boring, grindy, and shit.

>It's easy to overlevel yourself
>just keep fighting t-rexes for no real reason other than to level up instead of actually playing the game!
yeah you definitely sound like a JRPG scrub

that and the cutscenes with the classic Final Fantasy summon monsters wrecking shit

I agree, but I hope you are not implying what I said is wrong? FFIX's world is underrated as shit. I love how Lindblum has this history of keeping Alexandria in check if you examine the monuments, and this is why Brahne has such a hatred for them.

I just gave you an example.
You just keep deflecting.

>this game so ez!
>but why so grindy?!

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The game is coded this way literally because it had to load spells and effects.

There's more than one person in the thread. Throwing everything out and going WOW YOU'RE REALLY SSJ ZIDANE AND THE CHOSEN ONE TO FIGHT EXDEATH takes away anything interesting or nuanced about the game. Rogue Galaxy did the same thing. Shit sucks.

Show me in any of the other FF games where you can have all ATBs full, all commands issued, and the player is sitting there and waiting while just trying to do normal attacks. You clearly can't even read well enough to comprehend that I have no issue with ATB. I do have a problem with implementing it in a way where the bars are essentially meaningless because the game can't keep up with the player regardless of the bars being full or not.

I cucked myself in the Adel fight. If you save you soft lock yourself if you have a really shitty party. I had a similar problem in space where I had to struggle to survive at all as I did zero junctioning. I can only blame myself to an extent, but the game does an extremely shit job explaining it all.

t. spammed GFs for 80% of the game to win

All the best tracks from X are by Hamauzu.

>FF 9 sales
Had nothing to do with sakaguchi pulling Ito for 9. Had far more to do with both the lack of marketing and the diminishing market for a more traditional FF game due to the diversion set forth from the previous 2 entries. You obviously know yourself that the game started as gaiden to be a love letter to the series, and was a side by side development that released sooner after 8 than 7. It sounds like you're blaming Sakaguchi and Ito for the shortcomings of Nomura and Nakazawa because you know god damn well 8 is nowhere near as good as 9 but you like it more for whatever poor reasons related to your taste.

Why? You already said it. Because you played it first. You might not have played 8 as your first installment but your biases here and the conclusions you've drawn due to them are obvious. You have no right to call 9 mediocre.

If there's anyone you should be mad at for "sabotaging 8" it should be Nakazawa for destroying all the good work Ito was already doing by implenting that retarded ass draw system.

>level scaling is only an issue when you sit down and grind for no good reason
>OH YEAH WELL I SAT DOWN AND GRINDED T-REXES FOR NO GOOD REASON AND BECAME OVERLEVELLED

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There's so much world to FFIX. I wonder how many people didn't even know Daguerro even existed.

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that is a fantastic look at the internet culture from 15 years ago

You are an idiot

>Take the training-chamber with the dinosaurs at the start for example.
...you have to kill only one of them and then you move on?
I have the suspicion that you might be retarded, user.

X-2 is the best final fantasy

Nice get. Also Quina's theme is godlike.

A lot of people probably fall asleep from the cutscenes and don't make it all 30 hours into the game when you finally get the airship and can go anywhere.

The best way to play FF8 is by drawing spells for an hour or turning monsters into cards and transmuting them into spells and running from enemies.
How you don't think this is a shit system is beyond me.

Be an apologist for all I care and take your image-macros with you.

Literally no one complained about this at the time. The cutscenes are great as is the story.

No one considers that the golden age but you dude.

FFIX is my favorite game and I wanted to show it to my roommate.
The autist just wanted to grind in the first area. He didn't want to leave there until he was lvl20.
I should have known. The fucker makes cryptic remarks about liking speedrunning and shit. His autism was off the fucking scales.

He only plays phone games nowadays so he just likes skinner boxes of pressing buttons and seeing shiny lights. And winning a random jrpg battle did that for him.

It was very disheartening to realize in real time my roommate has mental deficiencies like that.

>How you don't think this is a shit system is beyond me.
Clearly, because you can't even write a single sentence laying out what's supposed to be "shit" about it.

>these two things can't possibly be done at the same time!
But they can user and 8 is just that. Again the point is if you do one of the other things the game is grindy. In my first playthrough I just happened to grind levels, then there after found out the other ways are just as grindy to achieve the same effect. Keep coping.

Clearly you're incapable of comprehension since you're an apologist.

Take a hike, I've wasted enough time on your dumb ass.

The only "grind" I ever did with FF8 was
>go to the beach outside Balamb Garden
>Draw 100 Water from Fastitocalons
>Junction it to HP
Ta-dah! 2000+ HP on Squall meant 700 HP Renzokuken spamming for the rest of the game.

FF8 was Renzokuken spamming. Always. Every fight. Let Squall kill absolutely everything with Renzokuken. Because it was cool.

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I just entered the thread to call you out. Not apologizing for anything. Just calling you a coward bitch.

Coward. Bitch.

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You can buy mana restoration for pocket change. Ethers are a balance so you're not just nuking everything and every melee character can hit insanely hard. Steiner is a fucking monster.

I don't understand the autism at Square to ignore the fans who like the old games, and literally everyone says the golden age is SNES/PS1. They just don't see a traditional FF game as profitable, but they fail to see what it would do to help the brand by bringing back in the millions of older fans.

But now I typed that I realize 90% of the older fans moved on, perhaps even from all video games, and any dumb enough to stay would eat shit if it had the FF name on it. My mistake.

Many of my irl friends have also become that, some of them see grinding as a plus.

>The best way to play FF8 is by drawing spells for an hour or turning monsters into cards and transmuting them into spells and running from enemies
No, that seems to be your idea of how you think a majority of people play the game when they don't. Most people just beat on fish at the beach for 5-10 minutes and they're set for the first disc and then use the resources they gain naturally after that. Or they play the game like a normal person and pick up spells/items/cards/resources naturally off the bat.
If you have to grind for over an hour just to get through the game you're doing it wrong/are being a JRPG scrub.

Considering how successful Bravely Default was I think it's more unwillingness considering a lot of modern JRPGs are disgustingly over the top cgi fuckfests.

>great party members
u wot? most of them are trash character-wise

>what is octopath
>what is bravely default
>what is FF dimensions

I sympathize with you, but realize that BD while successful probably sold like half of what FFXV did at best. Unfortunately the hype train and OPEN WORLD is a big seller to dumb kids. I don't know if there's even an audience for a truly great FF game anymore.

I can get it. Grinding in something like Dragon Quest is honestly fun because the systems are set up to make it fun. And the monsters are enjoyable characters on their own.
This was the starting area of an FF game. He was just killing the stuff in the forest.
For hours. I tried to tell him about DRAGONS he could grind on and he wasn't interested.
He's the kind of person to buy 99 of the lowest tier healing item "just in case."

Square has plenty of great JRPG series that are more like classic FF than FF has become. But they're B-tier games. FF hasn't been remotely traditional since X at least.

If it were easy it wouldn't be grindy. Grindy means you're doing things abnormally just to advance naturally. Unless you're talking about grinding being the thing some nutjobs do so they never have to worry at any point in the game, which is what I'm talking about when I throw out the term "JRPG scrub".

I didn't complain about it, but it's why I quit without finishing the first time I tried. And I bet there are a lot of people who quit before the evil forest given that it's like an hour into the game and you've had maybe 2 or 3 battles. You didn't hear any of those people complain, they just quit and went and played something else.

Dragon Quest is finally getting its time in the sun in the west.
They get tons of marketing now and they sell really well, for a jrpg that is.

>he doesn't buy 99 potions
look at this dip

Amen to that

You and like 10 other ADD kids. If it were that bad there'd be any complaints about it online.

>not junctioning the water to your attack stat
>not just refining tents into curagas to get 3500+ hp before leaving for Timburr

Thats probably because their love-letter to the series that's absolute peak traditional FF (IX) was one of the worst selling.

They have numbers to prove people didn't want that kind of experience anymore and preferred the new direction the series was headed, and thanks to pretty much every game since then, will likely never change their opinion on that matter. I'd say you're mostly right, the mainstream crowd that enjoyed the old games turned into a niche crowd as the series progressed.

Though like these anons pointed out, square still luckily has the capacity to create those more traditional experiences, and will occasionally do so to satisfy the niche. Which most of us should be at least a little thankful for.

You're right about everything except FFIX's sales. FFIX had bad sales because it was the 3rd FF game on the PS1 and didn't come out that long after FFVIII, and FFX was just around the corner on PS2/the PS2 was about to come out. It was a swan song for the PS1.

There's plenty of examples where a game coming out at the end of a console cycle gets bad sales. IDK why they didn't just make FFIX into a PS2 game, it looks good enough if you enhance the models. Would've been an amazing seller then.

>Grindy means you're doing things abnormally just to advance
Well yes, the draw system is something I'd call abnormal for a game. If you wanted to do magic you had to draw for hours to get a decent amount of usable spells. And once you learned about refining then you could just grind out carding enemies and items for the same thing. Regardless
you're
still
just
grinding.
I can't tell if you're just baiting at this point or you legitimately have a mental illness and need adult supervision to take a shit.

That makes no sense. All PS2 models are backwards compatible and this was known beforehand. Even if a new console was about to come out, people still could've bought and played FF9 on PS2.

X wasn't traditional in any sense, though.

Honestly, that never really crossed my mind but you're absolutely right. It makes perfect sense, and I agree with that notion. I have no idea why they didn't decide to let VIII breath and just release IX for the PS2. Maybe it was because they already had plans to take advantage of the hardware with X? Not sure. Though I do feel like the direction VII and VIII (And even VI to a degree) was probably still at least some factor in IX's lack of sales.

>Well yes, the draw system is something I'd call abnormal for a game
Which is why you can refine items for spells
Which is why you can refine cards for spells
Both of which are infinitely less time consuming than drawing spells
Alternatively you can junction spells to magic to make drawing pull more spells at once and cut down on the time drawing. All of these things are alternatives to levelling up the traditional way and are left to the player. You can do all of them or none of them and still get through the game abusing GF summoning if you want.

>I can't tell if you're just baiting at this point or you legitimately have a mental illness and need adult supervision to take a shit.
Says the guy who can't figure out how to play FF8

It's also not the plot of FFIX ,despite many "casual" fans of the game claiming so.

>if i add lmao at the end of my sentences it will drive the point in so much better
low iq

No one bought a PS2 to play FFIX...? I thought everyone knew that most of a game's sales are in the first weeks/months. If they released FFIX for the PS2 it would change its perception massively.

Point taken, I mostly just think the turn based combat and story resembles the old FF more than the games after. What's stranger is the later games, are nothing like FFX either, so it stands out as kind of its own thing now?

They didn't want to step on FFX's toes (I'm sure this game had a massive budget)
They didn't want to spend even more money upgrading FFIX's graphics (may as well make a wholly new game)
Just wanted to get it out the door in some form
Dev team was probably exhausted/conflicted with the movie and other drama at Square at the time.

It's a real shame as if this happened, it could've saved us from decades of garbage, if FFIX "only" selling 5m copies was what made Square abandon their traditional design.

>Magical princess
Yeah, but more of a tragic heroine lragely robbed of her chance to dictate most of her fate.
>Compassionate thief
Sure, but more of a tragic alien with a similar situation but also a fucking doomsday machine.

Makes sense why they gelled so well.

>Forcibly ignores the part where I said refining is the same thing.
All this coping, but in the end it's still just grinding and you making shit excuses.
Apparently I have with enough knowledge to make you autists seethe at facts about it.

X already went into development when IX was still being worked on. Made by different teams also. IX was being produced by a seperate team stationed in Hawaii. X had a massive budget and the PS2 was just around the corner, they were pushing on that big. IX just came out with unfortunate timing on the market.

Now I'm convinced the people who shit on the draw system are just brainlets. Why didn't you just play the game until your GFs learned one or two refine abilities? Did you not take the time to read GF abilities or some shit? Turning monsters into cards is laughably inefficient too yet you thought it would be better to farm up 40 fucking AP for that shit skill.
The game is so fucking easy, especially the first disc, that you shouldn't have any problems in fights even if you didn't junction magic.
The major thing that makes the junction system shit, is that it didn't account for absolute retards like yourself with an IQ in the double digits

Is it a shit game, or do you have shit taste?

>I thought everyone knew that most of a game's sales are in the first weeks/months.
And? The other sales don't just vanish into thin air, they still contribute to the total amount of copies sold.
You said people didn't buy 9 because PS2 was about to come out. That's like saying people didn't buy Pokemon B/W2 because of the 3DS.

I can see where you're coming from, but I think it's much much simpler than all of this. It just doesn't look as good as 7 or 8. Character design wise, world wise etc.
FF got its biggest push with 7, which sports a very charismatic Antagonist that everyone immediately knew about.
8 showed FMV with Edea and other cool stuff.
9 got coca cola ads and that fat queen dancing.

7 = cool dieselpunk world show in trailer
8 = cool future setting shown in trailer
9 = castles and stuff shown in trailer

7 = guy with a big ass sword
8 = guy with a sword that's also a GUN
9 = some kid with a monkey tail

And so on. I like 9, but I'm not surprised it wasn't a huge success.

>refining is the same thing
It's not. You have to actively draw from enemies to get a slightly randomized amount of magic for each draw. Card is a junction command that has a chance to fail/gets better the weaker the enemy is before attempting. Enemies drop items when you defeat them so you can refine those to get spells or even just outright buy items to refine into spells without fighting anything.

>Apparently I have with enough knowledge to make you autists seethe at facts about it
you clearly don't, as shown above

>it's not
It is, you're trading one grinding technique for another. In the end it's just grinding for the same outcome No matter how you children want to phrase it. It's grinding. If you want to keep going in this circle we can until the thread 404s.
>Still seething.

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>So what danger did she think there was in going back to her own mother? Only her own life, which she was brave to risk, and her freedom. It was a courageous thing to do to go back to Brahne to try and diplomatically stop a huge war.

Then why didn’t she try this BEFORE running away from home with that whole staged kidnapping?

If her mother was so darn pleasant that Garnet could have just talked her out of it, why run away from home in the first place? How much more evidence did she need, combined with what she'd already known about her mom that drove her out of the castle in the first place?

>Ultimacia
You mean Ultimania. And no it doesn't. It refers to it in this image as the Tree of "Eva" which is how you're pretty much supposed to pronounce "iifa". Meaning life/living in latin.

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>It is, you're trading one grinding technique for another
Some of which are more efficient than others. But why would that matter in the context of something being "grindy", amirite? Nevermind that none of those thing require you to sit down and do them for hours.
Let's just agree that you're too incompetent to follow directions properly and can only complain about FF8's systems because people have to explain it to you.

>"only" selling 5m copies
Like I said I still think VI, VII and arguably even VIII pushing the best numbers at the time and having a VERY different direction/vision for the series also helped with that decision.

Didn't know X was also into development at that time too, that explains why they wouldn't have bothered to try getting IX on it.

>The major thing that makes the junction system shit
Don't you mean "Makes the draw system shit"? The draw system not gelling with the rest of the game and turning into the modus the normies coming in off the back of VII got caught up in is pretty much the crux of VIII's gameplay issues, aside from it being brokenly easy. Wonder who's fault that was. Couldn't be the guy who included it in the game. Was probably sakaguchi for pulling Ito from VIII to work on IX after most of the battle work for VIII was already done. :]

>It just doesn't look as good
You mean "Different". It didn't look like what people wanted/expected after VII and VIII when nomura came in and hot-topic'd everything into a sensation.

There really isn't though. You're mistaking a little bit of world building for actual content. 9's planet sucked. It starts out lean, then half of it gets destroyed, then half of what's left gets blocked off by the tree roots.

What purpose did she serve in Lindblum? She thought she could get Cid to help, but he's a fucking oglop because of his own idiocy.

There was simply no threat to anyone but Garnet herself by taking the risk to go talk to her mother. After going through what she did she had a perfectly in character change of heart that she could talk her own mother out of what she was doing, and this combined with feeling homesick obviously led her to do what she did.

I get what you mean, but they didn't exactly market FFIX super well, as you imply here, and it was cut into hard by its previous two entries, as well as the PS2 being on the horizon. Your comparison of BW2 isn't really fair as that's a direct sequel to another game.

It's hard to argue where FFIX was "cool" enough to be as successful as 8 or 9 which is basically what you're getting at, but the game had plenty of mass market appeal with its incredibly good graphics and setting. And it still sold 5m copies. I still say it was hurt mostly by timing and would've easily sold 10m copies as the first PS2 FF.

>MP costs too high
Are you bitching about Garnet's summons or something?

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Its a shit game. It is virtually impossible to reach a fail state. And for a video GAME, that is some weak shit. A normal jrpg battle is 3-5 people on a line fighting monsters. X lets you have all of them at all times with no penalty for switching them out.
The world is a straight line.
The world building is terrible. I'm supposed to feel for a fallen empire that might never have existed because of Tidus? fucking Tidus?

Its like if Ronaldo was transported to Oz, then killed the Witch because he really really did good at the world cup that no one in Oz knows about or cares about.

Just a terrible game that was upheld because people had never seen 480p "high definition" graphics.
Unlocking the Al Bhed language piecemeal was the single fun aspect of the entire endeavor.

No, not just different. Simply not as good.
Character and costume design is one thing, but keeping their chibi proportions in the FMV and showing this off on TV ads was a incredibly retarded idea.

To further add to that. Go ahead and check the title screen FMV which showcases the map names here. Lindblum's capital L looking different than the I from Iifa Tree.

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So you are saying in english its the Lifa tree. Lifa, being a play on the word Life.

No it is not.

>cope
You are a retarded piece of trash that needs to grow a brain.

I see Tifa Tree.

Change the speed setting matte.

Pretty much this though i would say great characters in general. The supporting cast was fucking amazing and Kuja was a great relatable antagonist.

No I am saying it's the Iifa Tree, with an i. And it is.

>>mp costs too high
That's why you max out your autism and grind enough chocobo hot and cold points to buy a Protect Ring before you cross Gizamaluke's Grotto. You never unequip Half MP on your mages and suddenly the game feels more balanced.

Slow battles? What you thought FF7 and FF8 were fast?

So you think them being taller and lankier would have somehow made it better? Or that somehow that would make it appeal to more people when it was already radically different from its most recent predecessors?

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I played the fuck out of FFX and you really make me feel retarded for ever having any problems as a kid. You aren't wrong about it being fucking easy. I must've died to BFA about 20 times, good lord how.

I love and hate the combat in that game, mostly love. It's so easy to bust open and abuse, with about 1000 ways to do so. At the same time there's just no challenge, or incredibly grindy challenge in the super bosses. It was best when you're going in blind and don't know what the fuck you're doing.

Its been Lindbulm all this time?
I've been saying Lindblum for decades.

> In the end it's just grinding for the same outcome
So what JRPG prevents any kind of grinding at all? You keep whinging about how grindy things are but there no need to grind FF8 since you can GF summon your way all the way to Ultimecia.

>That giant fuck up was running away mid-escort to fucking space and causing the moon to literally bukake literal demons from the moon onto the planet below causing to be absolutely flooded by monsters which in turn causes untold millions of deaths.
Thanks for proving you didn't play 8 you absolute fucking moron.

Nah the stories are great and you're a fucking idiot who follows other people.

Kuja was a mustache twirling piece of shit. How was he relatable at all?

Why did you stay on the path? Why did you only explore the planet on Disc 4?
>The book didn't have a lot of content
>I read the Chapter titles and then I skipped to read the final chapter
>but when I went back to read some chapters that looked like they had interesting titles, it's like I already knew what is was about!
>There was nothing left to explore! It wasn't a novel, more like a novella.
Go read a magazine, i guess.

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Yes, in the japanese version it is called that. There's also some spots in the game where it's called that, as well as the ultimania. Might be a mistranslation.

Realizing my party was there for every fight weakened my liking of the game.
Seeing the "world map" and it being a straight fucking line obliterated it.

NO
FUCKS
GIVEN

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I dont think that map is in line with the text in game.

Why did they kill off Queen Brahne so early? She had all the credit of destroying Cleyra, Lindblum and is the main villain for the best parts of the game. You don't even get to fight her. Much better villain than Kuja.

he's relatable if you're an edgy tryhard

FFVIII's FMVs have no dialogue though. They can't possibly be voicing the entire fucking game.

>To get further into the nitty gritty: Brahne uses Odin when Garnet is in Alexandra, after capturing her and "extracting" the eidolon. Garnet only even realizes what the eidolons can do when she sees Atomos used against Lindblum and is mortified. You can't blame her for not realizing these unusable summons can level cities in the wrong hands. She simply had no way of knowing that would happen.

Except for the fact that she ISN’T THE ACTUAL GARNET TIL ALEXANDROS OF ALEXANDRIA, she’s actually Sarah of the Summoner Tribe from the Outer Continent, whom fled from there with her biological mother when Garland attacked the village with the Invincible warship, she shipwrecked in the Alexandrian harbour and her biological mother passed away, she was adopted into the Alexandrian royal family to replace the real princess Garnet who had died from illness, this was when Sarah was six, and keep in mind Eiko is that exact same age and you don’t see Eiko fearing her Eidolons for no reason and doing something idiotic.

Yes Sarah had Amnesia about her real heritage, but that doesn’t mean that she should fear the summons or not understand that there is a world outside the castle walls, subconsciously she should know this.

Lindblum being the mistranslation in english I mean then, didn't word that too well.

because she was just a pawn in a much larger game. And when you realize the queen of one of the most powerful empires on the planet is just a pawn to someone else she doesn't seem like hot shit.
Garland showing up out of nowhere to me was awesome. Linking 9 into the original was a great send up.

I prefer 7 and 8's mechanics over 9. Materia and Junction system are cool as fuck and let you experiment and come up with your own shit.
In 9 you only learn abilities by wearing equipment for a little bit until you unlock the option permanently on a list.
It feels a lot less immersive because of that. Putting materia into your equipment is a physical act, the menu for it is simply an abstraction. Shooting gods into your veins like a heroin addicts gets abstracted the same way. (well it's more like they force themselves upon you or something? GF are weird)
But what about 9? How does Zidane "activate" poison resistance because he wore poison earrings 3 weeks prior for a day?
Yeah, I do think so. At least for Zidane and Garnet.

Test

That analogy was shit. And even ignoring the crappy fourth disc, ff9s planet was threadbare and disappointing.

There being a mistranslation on the evidence you used to say the tree is the Iifa tree doesn't help your argument.

>It keeps happening!

>hating on Freya
You wanna go, m8?

The only reason Brahne has access to those powers is because Kuja helped her. He is not really a villain, he is also a pawn in the Terra scheme but trying to break free. That's the reason this entire game even happens. Garland wants to continue to gather more souls, Kuja attempts to gather the jewels to summon Alexander in hopes of destroying Garland, using Brahne as his pawn to get there.

Garland was the only cool villain in ff9. I was so excited that this Christopher Lee looking mother fucker was here to replace that insufferable pansy, kuja. Only for those hopes to be dashed pretty quickly.

its pretty much all of the classic final fantasies put together in a blender

>steampunk-ish world like ff6
>revolving door party like 4
>party setup is nearly identical to FF1 (thief, warrior, white mage(s), black mage, the only outliers being freya and quina)
>eidolons/summons are actually sapient beings ala ff4
>zidane and kuja are cecil and golbez 2.0
>has sort of a love story subplot between zidane and garnet but not to the same degree as squall and rinoa
>brahne tricked and played like a fiddle by kuja like gestahl was by kefka

those are all the references i can think of off the top of my head

I agree, and it's fucking pathetic ever since, we've never gotten another FF game that isn't just a straight line, or in FFXV's case a giant empty sandbox. Fucking terrible.

I mean I don't disagree, but did she really have to die? She was one of the best characters in the game. She got way better development than fucking Garland at least. It just seems like wasted potential. I guess this is also just because the game really peaked in disc 1 and 2 IMO.

How is this disputing what I said? Garnet doesn't remotely know her eidolons could kill anyone, let alone be extracted out of her and used to level cities. If you're going to nitpick anything nitpick the whole "extraction" ass pull really. Like seriously, how is Garnet meant to know about all this?

There is literally no version of the game where it's called Lifa Tree instead of Iifa, I already showed you the link of Eva = iifa and backed that up with an Ultimania scan. Get over it. It's Iifa.

Did you even play VII and VIII?

Cloud’s and Squall’s backstories were far better executed than Zidane’s.

Cloud’s works great in Final Fantasy VII, since the entire game builds up to that one climactic moment from the very beginning. But in Final Fantasy IX, it's completely tacked-on, and only done because this is post-Final Fantasy VII and paying customers expect at least one terrible and momentous mindfuck of a revelation before the credits roll.

Garland and Brahne were far more interesting characters/villains than Kuja and it's disappointing how they barely get any credit or popularity. Garland especially is barely seen in the damn game I swear. I would've preferred if he subverted expectations and killed Kuja on Terra.

Thanks, someone gets our point.

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I don't hate the Kuja/Memoria turn at the end but I do kind of agree with the Garland point. I always felt that Pandemonium as final dungeon and Garland as final boss, considering he is the catalyst of just about everything that happens in this game and prior to it, would have been best.

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>There was simply no threat to anyone but Garnet herself
Not that user, but, uh, it seems the entire planet was threatened by Garnet returning to her already confirmed insanely murderous mother. Confirmed by first-hand prior experience, confirmed by trusted relatives, confirmed by first-hand witnessing her own Summoning destructive powers, confirmed by all (except Steiner's) conversations and advice, absolutely everyone confirming her already-made-decision of "leave Brahne, do not go back, there is no positive outcome."

You can dismiss it as a 15-year-old's immature decision due to running away from the idea her mother is "evil," but the audience has already established a dislike for Brahne and are simply affirming Garnet is stubborn-minded to go against all, even trusted, advice. Garnet has her values as a character, when it comes to support of the plot at ruining the political environment be being dumb, and she has her value as the pawn of a political child of unkown magical power...but despite all her data collected that "leaving Alexandria was the right decision to make and becoming more and more obvious going back would be a mistake," she still went back against-all-odds. And failed. She did not recover from the failure, she learned nothing from the failure, the world forgave her of her failure and all ended well strictly due to story-written compassion of her ruled citizens. No one was punished for the mistakes they made and the enormous costs involved to enact them and the result of what those mistakes brought. It all ended well.

We're only left to assume the Doomsday-Device alien pervert King and the Nationally Nuclear magical Queen "learned their lessons" by learning of their births and will never act poorly again.

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You’re giving IX way too much credit.

>shits on FFX
>but loves the Al Bhed stupid sidequest
Now THAT is some shit taste

You're not wrong user, but thing is, the whole point of this discussion was "god Garnet is a fucking idiot for letting Queen Brahne get a gold of her eidolons."

However... Garnet had no way of knowing her eidolons were that powerful, that they could be extracted at will, or that Brahne would use them to destroy entire cities. The last point would be an argument, if Garnet knew the first two. Just abandoning your own mother and country because of a "feeling" that she might do something bad, in a world where no one has actually fought a direct war in 100s of years (read the lore) makes no sense.

Garnet was naive yes, and definitely stubborn, but the other user was pretending as if she willingly was giving Brahne her eidolons. Yes, it was a mistake, but it wasn't that irresponsible.

>How was he relatable at all?

Because his motivations are simple. He is envious of his brother and doesn´t want to be replaced. He has a conflict with his father.
He treats the whole thing as a game and then discover he is just as mortal as all those people he has killed and he is scared and doesn´t want to die. Childish and cartoonish as that may be i consider that relatable.

X was the gateway drug that allowed FFXIII to exist

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Coz they played it when they were 9 and it gives them fuzzy wuzzels and causes them to not think critically.
It's a weak Final Fantasy game.

The PS1 title had TONS of content on its continents and you're simply being dismissive to say it didn't. At best, you're whining that "all you could do in the chocobo forests was dig."

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She killed millions and ruined 80% of the world's lives. She had to die; you can't let that person live, manipulated or not.

Except no.

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>But at least 9 was a game with a passable story

I don’t think 70% of the game being rendered completely pointless counts as a passable story, I’m not just referring to Garnet’s stupid actions I’m also referring to Kuja’s whole hunt for the Eidolons and Alexander, Kuja achieving Trance rendered the whole Eidolon hunt completely pointless when Kuja could have simply researched Trance and focused on obtaining it, it’s not like Trance is a unknown concept, even Steiner of all people had some knowledge of it when Zidane first trances in the Evil Forest.

Not disagreeing at all, on the contrary. She was a fantastic villain and incredibly evil bitch. She didn't even apologize on her deathbed for genociding all those poor fucks in Cleyra and Lindblum. My suggestion is simply to not kill her off until later.

Hell I don't care if she faked her death. I'd have been happy if she came back sometime in disc 3 as a surprise twist to fight both Kuja and Garland. If anything she only dies when she does for the plot's convenience and because having 3 villains would've been challenging, as is Garland is barely used.

It really didnt. List some of the side content in ff9 and compare it to a game like ff7 or dq7. Hell, list off the complete number of populated towns and compare it to a ps1 or 2 jrpg. This wasnt just a problem with 9, ff8 and 10 were just as bad. These three games were kind of the beginning of the end. When square insisted ff would be the prettiest girl in the ball room and focused more and more on graphics and story instead of actual substance.

>cool cutscenes

That is just all flash and no substance.

Kuja is unable to naturally attain trance and didn’t know the eidolons wouldn’t work against Garland. Garland was very afraid of gaia’s eidolons power, ordering Kuja to destroy madain sari as a result. It makes sense he’d seek out the thing his master fears to overthrow him.

There are more flaws than that as other people will point out.

Look at literally any FFX map, they started that railroading bullshit

>He gets plenty of serious moments later in the story after he goes through development.

You mean the later point in the story where he and several other characters get pushed to the sidelines like Freya?

I only just realized, Kuja wanted the Pumice to summon Ark? Wow, 20 years later and I'm still figuring shit out in this story.

As to your post though it does make sense he doesn't know about trance. It's a myth, no one else in the world you meet ever goes into Trance. Kuja himself only manages to do it because of the Invincible and its souls in storage, he would not be able to do it by himself.

Ironically it's the protagonists who show him trance isn't just a legend. If not for them he'd have to go collect some fucking shitty peridots and summon Ramuh on Garland.

Populated towns? It’s honestly not so bad.
- alexandria
- dali
- lindblum
- south gate
- burmecia (rekt state tho)
- cleyra
- treno
- conde petie
- black mage village
- daguerreo
- esto gaza
- bran bal

You claim her decision was palatable because "we/she didn't know Summons were so strong." But, we knew they were strong. She knew they were strong. Very strong. And even if Garnet is right, that "mom isn't evil, there's just something controlling her to act this way," she's making a HORRIBLE mistake to think the same scenario couldn't happen to her, too. To go back and have her controlled to use the known strong Eidolon Summons she had the ability to summon. You don't give yourself to the enemy, regardless of how weak or strong you think your assets are. She made the choice to go back anyway, and it turned out even worse than people predicted.

Being wrong, or young, won't absolve Garnet's choice to go back after successfully leaving. She wasn't even uninformed, even if you can claim she wasn't omniscient. There was zero, absolutely zero reason to return beyond, "let me appeal to the villain by begging to just stop."

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Wrong.

Exactly.

Actually FFIX hammers you over the head with a bunch of stuff.

Writing isn’t really Sakaguchi’s specialty.

Except yes. 100%.
Which FF was more lineal before X?

Accept no.

yes you are

Kuja wanted to summon Alexander. It is the strongest known eidolon in Gaia’s history and was summoned 500 years ago ending in disaster. As a result the jewel was broken into 4 pieces, one given to each kingdom (alexandria, lindblum, cleyra and one piece taken by summoners to madain sari). This is why he pushes Brahne to take control of the kingdoms and collect the jewel pieces for him.

>When square insisted ff would be the prettiest girl in the ball room and focused more and more on graphics and story instead of actual substance.
They did do this, I will agree with you on that. And they failed.

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Contrarians. IX was a disappointment after VIII, especially returning to the chibishit character design

Burmecia is literally not populated. And several of those towns you only visit once. Yeah, I'm goal posting a little bit, but to me an rpg town is a place to go back to for new dialogue and events and stuff.

The first part of your post is all that matters.

She "knew they were strong?" How? She literally can't summon them. No one has ever seen them before outside of Madain Sari. That's all there is to it. She had no idea what she was capable of.

As I've said already the only thing she was risking was her own life and freedom. And I presume she though Steiner would maybe step in if that became a problem, or the other Alexandrians which did happen with Beatrix eventually.

Yes it was dumb and naive, but it wasn't a "plot hole" or illogical, once you understand she had no idea she basically had the atom bomb in her stomach.

He sends the party to Oeilvert to get the pumice piece which can be synethesized with another piece to summon Ark. That's the entire point of that quest. It was after Alexander seemingly died (?).

If the in-game animation is anything like what it is in the lore, a giant gundam who can nuke you from space, probably as useful as a castle that is immobile for attacking Garland, just saying.

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I love aki ross, because not only was sakaguchi a fool for devoting so many resources into "digital actors", but he was so wrong that literally the opposite of what he predicted came to pass. With real life actors digitizing their likenesses for video game characters.

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>no u
Okay, kid

Better story, characters, setting, atmosphere, music, graphics.

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Oh yeah you mean post Alexander summoning. He wanted access to the mount gulug since summoners or “mole
people” used to live there. The gulug stone opens it up, it had been sealed off for years. Basically Kuja still searching for a stronger eidolon yeah, probably not Ark.

Oh, I was confused, I guess the pumice piece was just something the party gets unrelated to the thing Kuja wants?

It's kind of funny then, as Kuja passed up the chance to have fucking Ark. He had no idea it existed. I guess that needing Hades to synethize it might've been why.

Garnet's lack of knowledge that she was Sarah of Madain Sari is not the same as her knowledge that giving her gems allows her to summon Eidolons in battle.
That's your answer.

>She can summon since the very beginning of the game, but at insanely high MP costs
She...WE know she has the ability to summon from the very beginning, they're just so obscenely powerful that we can't do it (yet). We've always known her magical powers were extreme and unique. Lorewise, yes, she knew she could summon, just not yet. Even when you apply game mechanics, "Dagger" the "white mage" can begin learning new summons (before any summons are ever taken from her) from equipment and items.

Remember the fight where Steiner shows up to stop the kidnapping at the beginning of the game, and there's a Bomb behind her? Garnet can summon 4 different Eidolons (but can't because the MP cost is too high). It's the earliest we know she's a summoner.

And yet the material you used to bolster your argument shows the nation of Lindbulm when it is Lindblum.
It makes your argument look flawed.

Yeah it is unrelated. Kuja sends you out to collect the gulug stone. The pumice piece is never a factor in the story.

Wanting more than 15 minutes of gameplay in 2 hours means you have ADD.
Seriously you fucking kids are the worst. The story is not that good. FF9's presentation is sheer arrogance and disrespect of the player's time.
I was like 18 when I played FF9 for the first time, and had basically outgrown it anyway.

I stopped enjoying it around the last time you fight Beatrix, I liked the soundtrack all the way though. Great stuff

>X was the hallway drug that allowed FFXIII to exist
ftfy

Attached: Garnet and Zidane daughter.png (1500x1100, 1.42M)

It is lindblum in eng, lindbulm in jap. It is iifa in all versions. But go look for yourself if you don’t want to believe it.

Then why does IX pretend like it’s such a big deal?

It has the book ends with the “I want to be your Canary” play, the main theme “Melodies of Life” is a love song like VIII’s and X’s main themes (both games had much better executed love stories by the way), which plays throughout the game even serving as the World Map theme!

Not to mention that most of the commercials, ads and premonitional materials had the Zidane/Garnet scenes with the love song playing in the background:

m.youtube.com/watch?v=SeBLSds3cEc

m.youtube.com/watch?v=TV_OvLgK6_w

m.youtube.com/watch?v=bdqxhny4PFI

m.youtube.com/watch?v=LZFxLj2sQk8

m.youtube.com/watch?v=c02OKUZWBzA

Except no.

he was fine for SNES era when the stories were just fun and cartoony, not these elaborate 10 hours worth of cutscenes kind of game.

Attached: ff9.png (621x128, 30K)

9fags are the bottom of the barrel pleb scum of all Final Fantasy fans.

>and this is why Brahne has such a hatred for them.

Yet this never gets mentioned in the story.

It seems like Brahne only hates them because she’s just a poorly written generic, stereotypical, moustache twirling cartoon villain that Sakaguchi threw in.

Attached: Garnet wake up.jpg (804x1200, 97K)

This game is about memories and life. It’s not a love song like VIII. Replay the game and pay attention to its actual message.

Did she know she could summon? Nothing in the game confirms that. I don't even recall voices in her head or anything like that.

The MP cost is blatantly accurate to the character. She is incapable of summoning the eidolons period. So she naturally doesn't think Brahne will use them to nuke several cities either. At no point does Garnet say early in the story anything about summoning her eidolons. It's a fucking plot twist when Brahne uses her to get the summons in the first place.

FF9's story is great. In case you hadn't noticed we've been debating it in this thread for hours.I like FF8 but the lore in that game is fucking stupid. God came down from Heaven and there was a war 1000s of years ago? An orphanage of amnesiacs? GFs are a political issue? What? It's not a bad game necessarily but its story is a mess. For me, I think it's highly entertaining, but it's obviously got a much worse story than 7/9.

Brahne doesn’t fit in a story that want’s be taken seriously and dramatic.

>lil horn
nice touch

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When you pull up pic related in game and scroll thru the destinations they are all in a single straight line with no deviation.

There is a story related reason for this, but it is still bullshit and people complained about the lack of a real world map when it came out. But you weren't born yet.

Attached: maxresdefault.jpg (1280x720, 113K)

Correct. This is the whole point about Garnet, her childhood as the adopted girl, and her Eidolons.

They cut off her horn.

Because of that, she couldn't speak to spirits and souls anymore. She knew about Eidolons and that she had Eidolons inside her, around her, that all kinds of spirits existed. She just didn't have a clue what they were doing or what they wanted or were saying. And since adopted mom and dad had zero clue about them as well and no one existed around her that could reassure her (or tell her that she's different), she became terrified of them and mentally blocked them off. They're there, she knows it, she just doesn't know what they'll do so she refuses to call them.

Later, when mom nearly kills her by extracting all the Eidolons inside her and begins using them to murder everyone, she feels justified in being afraid of her own powers that she knew about. It isn't until Eiko and other more wise and spiritual people begin to assure her that she can be friends with these super-souls that she ever accepts the willpower to use them in combat. Point is, she always knew about the fact she had Eidolon nukes inside her. That was never a plot hole. Her decision to invalidate the entire first half of the game's efforts to extract her was the ignorance of Garnet til Alexandros.

Attached: Waterway Gate.jpg (864x1250, 393K)

Literally doesn't change the fact that there's a romance between Zidane and Garnet you dipshit.

Where are her shins and feet?

It's implied in the game if you read the monuments on South Gate as Garnet, and it's not like it's OOC. It just gives a reason for her hatred.

I agree Brahne needed more development, but it is there if you search.

Its info you learn yourself if you explore the towns and read the lore. All of it is in game.

>But you weren't born yet.
Nice assumption, dipshit. Thanks for proving how retarded you are with no actual argument.

There is. That doesn’t make it a love story or love song. Replay it, friend.

Attached: Payback.jpg (618x563, 179K)

>Did she know she could summon?
Yes. She was scared of them, so she made it seem like she couldn't. That "MP cost" practically vanished after the clowns removed them and she re-learned them from the stones, now accepting that Eidolons didn't have to be used to murder like her psychopathic mother used them to do.

You had me until "Eidolon nukes." You say yourself, she had no idea what the eidolons are and blocked them out from a young age. Why would she think they're capable of nuking a city? That is completely illogical.

The engine and art style is so cozy. I don't even mind sporadic trance modes but maybe they could do-away with the unexplained costume change and pink.

The plot really falls over itself on the last quarter especially.

Would really enjoy a crystal heroes kind of remake in the same glory.

Except it does, deal with it.

The assumption doesn't change the fact that the destinations on the world map page are in a straight line and you in each area just move in a straight line thru the zone.

Your hurt feelings don't change this from being true. And I showed you the actual screenshot of the map in question so I don't know how my argument is invalid.

because they had information on what Alexander was and her being the Princess would know and would not be a pakled like you and would put 2 and 2 together.

>there is a love story in spider-man therefor the movie is a romance/love story
Ok.

Attached: Love jar.png (1040x800, 1.04M)

Whatever

Zidane and Garnet never really felt like a love story to me, it felt more like Garnet pining for the freedom Zidane has and Zidane being horny for one of the most desirable (attractive, royalty) girls in that world. The ending is pretty much the only time I felt like there was anything substantial between them.

>they had information on Alexander
What? When? And why would she jump to the conclusion that having "voices in her head" = able to summon a giant dinosaur to stomp on a city? That makes no sense.

You stupid fucking nigger. You get all the cards you need to make game cakewalk before you walk to the fire cavern. So you crying about random rule is absurd. If you are a retard, it doesnt mean everyone else is too

Coming from the guy who doesn’t realize that you don’t have to draw once you get the ability to convert items into cards.

Also why are you blaming Nomura for VIII? He was just the character artist. Heck he actually improved VII before it was first released because Sakaguchi and the others were going to have some of the players characters randomly killed in the scene where the party parachute down into Midgar:

Nomura reminds Kitase of his plans for the final ff7:
“Three characters of the player chooses! In the scene where they parachute into Midgar. You wanted to die there! You and Nojima-san were all excited about this. I was the one who said “No way!” And stopped you guys. The player chose for the endgame.“

:D sometimes Yea Forums is a great place

>How about I Super Shredder your shit?

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“Final Fantasy? Whatever.” Does.

So do people who don’t have “Final Fantasy Disease”: encyclopediadramatica.rs/Final_Fantasy_Disease

Do you not know how most princesses are taught? They are taught the history of their nation first and foremost. Her home city was a fucking dormant eidolon.
She would know. She would have knowledge of how they shaped the world in the past and would muse to herself why those summoners were either gone or went into hiding.

Its like you faggots lack agency and can't think for yourself.

I accept your concession. You were more graceful than I would assume.

Very simple idiot.

You have zero proof Garnet knew she had eidolons that could level cities, let alone that Brahne could extract and use them. There's nothing in "Alexandrian history" about this and you're just pulling this out of your ass because your theory sucks.

>OPEN WORLD is a big seller to dumb kids

Only the west thinks that, XV was praised for that in the west but the east and Japan hated it.

Attached: Zidane cute.png (1040x800, 1.06M)

>when you're socially inept and lacking in human interaction so much that even the most basic love story is lost on you
I swear you people are going to be the reason the world embraces a police state when the alternative is letting you run free amongst us

user, Garnet knows about her summons and the more time she spends adventuring around the planet, the more she is told directly who she is and what they are. Before Garnet ever makes the choice to ask mom to please stop, she is aware and certain of what she has, what they CAN do and what her mother WILL do if she gets them (her).

And she STILL goes back to face instant failure, doom and torture-to-near-death. IIRC, she doesn't even see mom. She's captured by the jester clowns and mom doesn't give a shit about her daughter, just demands to know if the Eidolons are out yet. EVERYONE, including Garnet, was right to know this wasn't going to end well. She still went.

The only way it's passable in script is to have Garnet claim naivety as a 15-year-old child who refuses to accept that her mother went insane (justifiably manipulated or not, mom went crazy and evil). Justify that decision all you want, not a single person (except Steiner) in game or playing it thought, "yeah! I'm sure she'll convince mom to stop and those summoned monsters of lore and FF history won't be bad magical news!" I can only say this again:
>Garnet knew about her Eidolons
>Brahne knew about her Eidolons
>Cid knew about her Eidolons
>The planet knew about her Eidolongs
>Kuja was using Brahne to get his hands on her Eidolons
>Everyone knew Eidolons were a big deal, super powerful, godlike beings
>This was ALL KNOWN to Garnet herself BEFORE she left Alexandria and reminded to her constantly BEFORE she decides to go back to Alexandria
It was a bad choice and Garnet's character to have her decide to do it makes her simple.

While HER character is simply demeaned by writing this into the plot, it doesn't ruin her, necessarily. But what it DOES ruin is 100% of the actions of everyone before she runs home. It made it pointless. All we got was FF9 cast member dialogue between characters.

Attached: Alexandria2.jpg (1250x930, 344K)

Keep assuming, pally

>But they're B-tier games.

You think Octopath Traveler is “B-tier”?

>FF hasn't been remotely traditional since X at least.

Uhhh... XII?

Attached: Vivi.jpg (768x1024, 272K)

>Would've been an amazing seller then.

I think if more people played FFIX it would be more controversial and wouldn’t have such a vocal minority praising the heck out of it because more people would notices IX’s issues.

In aesthetics, maybe, but that played just like XI but with no online.

IX certainly pretends it does as shown above.

No no, this is a great post but you still have it completely wrong.

Garnet breaks down upon the sight of seeing Brahne use Atomos to destroy Lindbulm. This is the first time Garnet literally ever sees an eidolon besides when she's a child, and that memory is suppressed obviously.

Cid also does not know about eidolons. What the hell? Cid thought he could beat Brahne even if she declared war because of his airship fleet. That's why he was caught by complete surprise when she summoned Atomos and forced him to surrender to Alexandria. I mean seriously, you obviously know a lot, IDK how you missed this part.

Garnet also does not know. The only reason Brahne knows is because Kuja is telling her exactly what to do, and tells her how the eidolons even work. The only reason KUJA knows is because of Madain Sari and the summoner tribe that he destroyed himself, and he manipulated Alexander being summoned personally.

It's not hard. Garnet returning to actively hand the eidolons over to Brahne would be terrible writing and is not true.

I've not played it and I'm not knocking it, but do you think that game really had 10% the budget of FFXV? All I'm saying.

She knew she had them and she was mortally afraid of what they could do. She is like 15 and internalizing a fear she can't actually conceptualize. Its safe to assume she would think they were the penultimate power around.
Specifically levling cities, no. So powerful she can't conceptualize their destruction.

Its like claiming people are dumb because they would fear Cthulhu. You don't need to know scientifically what he can do, you hear he is an Old One and you know to avoid.

I mean you could provide some examples of Zidane and Garnet's interactions being more than "Zidane hounds after Garnet while she thinks wistfully about freedom or protecting her kingdom" instead of making strawman accusations against me. But that would require effort and thought so I'm not surprised you didn't or won't.
I'm not even saying they don't exist, (I'm pretty sure they do) but nothing in that game made me think they genuinely loved each other until the end of the game.

Attached: Zidane and friends.jpg (700x576, 378K)

>the offline MMO is the "traditional" one
nigga you went full retard.

>she had no idea what the eidolons are and blocked them out from a young age. Why would she think they're capable of nuking a city? That is completely illogical.
No, I did not say she "didn't know what they are." I said she
>knew about Eidolons
>knew she had Eidolons inside her
>knew that Eidolons existed outside her
>did not know what they were doing
>did not know what they wanted
>did not know what they were saying
>was scared of them as a result
They weren't cute (mostly). They were obviously powerful and since she couldn't understand why ONLY SHE seemed to be able to interact with them, that ONLY SHE had them inside her and absolutely no one else, that the Treno booksmart teacher was teaching her ALLLLLLLL about Eidolons and how she was special, she just didn't want to be a threat to anyone. So, she "blocked them off" which the game justifies as high MP (but still doable).

I'll say it again:
She knew about Eidolons, that they were strong and outright worshipped, and she knew she was entirely special to be able to summon them. She knew since her own childhood. From memories of Day 1. When she left Alexandria, she was reminded of all this that she knew, too. She still went to beg Brahne to stop (and failed), knowing all her fears about what would happen would come true. She was naive.

Attached: Alexandria Library.jpg (1250x868, 299K)

The way she smiles at the end when seeing Zidane is a direct parallel to her face of shock as she ropeswings into him to meet him.
That is the development. It is subtle and you have to play the entire game to see it so I'm not surprised most people don't see it.

There's quite a few times Garnet is questioned about her feelings for Zidane, and she gets tight-lipped the moment she's asked. Meanwhile, Zidane begins to realize he isn't on his usual game as a womanizer and is increasingly showing concern for Garnet's wellbeing. It might be them drooling over each like Yuna and Tidus, but it's still there well before the ending.

when you word it like that FFX just seems like a really shitty retread of Garnet in Yuna. Just blared at the player in stereo so they would get it.

This would be a good theory, IF Garnet first escaped Alexandria because she felt afraid Brahne was going to extract the eidolons. She escapes because she wants to go see Cid and see if he can help her. When that fails she goes home.

At no point does she suggest these voices she hears, which is a very minor sub-plot in the early game, are important. Brahne being able to summon the eidolons is a complete swerve no one in the world saw coming except Brahne and Kuja.

You can read what I just said, but regarding that she knew about eidolons, even that much is very surface level and I barely remember Tot saying anything about eidolons in the flashbacks. Why would he tell her this as a child? She had no understanding how it related to her.

Attached: Snack time 1.jpg (868x1228, 625K)

>What? When?
Do you know who this guy was?

Attached: Tot_FFIX_Art.jpg (480x480, 37K)

>she was in love with him from the beginning and doesn't show it again until the end
Yeah thanks for proving my assumptions right about the game being barren of any substantial romantic interactions between them.

Attached: Snack time 2.jpg (868x1228, 754K)

user, the game has in-game cutscenes of Doctor Tot reading out loud to Garnet about what Eidolons could do.

Attached: Snack time 3.jpg (868x1228, 668K)

Okay, but it's a big leap from that to "my own mother will extract Godzilla to destroy France," you see?

I like it in spite of its flaws. My only main gripe was that the world outside of Mist Continent felt too empty considering you cross four continents.

or better yet, if FFIX had actually been good more people would have played it.
I bought it because I'd heard it was a "return to the pre-FF7 style of game" but was really disappointed when all that really meant was that it had a pre-modern setting.
- Didn't like the characters.
- Didn't like the plot, really hat to force myself to care about any of the shit that happens in the first like, 2 discs.
- Didn't like the setting. Felt like a Disney fairy tale world rather than the Nausicaa style fantasy world of the earlier games.
- Found the combat boring as hell, which at the time I attributed to simply Final Fantasy ATB fatigue (I'd played 1,4,6,7, and 5 by that point), but looking back it was more likely due to the slowness of the engine and the layout of the game (and how few encounters there actually are compared to all the cutscenes and city-wandering content).
- Everything in this game is a god damn chore. Stealing, for example. When I saw that the protagonist was a hero, after my initial puzzlement I thought it was a great idea. Until I actually discovered that there was just a lazy pattern of being able to steal an item from a boss that you won't be able to get normally until a later dungeon. And that the whole process of stealing itself is boring as shit and makes boss fights way more boring.

Some people like doing chores and tasks. They like ticking off boxes and unlocking achievements. It doesn't matter whether the task is boring or exciting all that matters to them is the dopamine kick from completing the objective. FF9 is a great game for that kind of person, as are many modern games that use the same design philosophy. But it's not for me and never was.

Any specific Garnet scenes though? I remember Zidane going all "omg I can't stop thinking about her" but to be honest I expect that from a character like his.

I didn't say any of that. Just that her smile to Zidane is clearly framed in a way that it should resonate with the player. When she met Zidane her face was not warm and smiling.

You have genuine autism if you can't see the thematic significance of adding that portion of the cutscene in relation to the characters thru the game.

You are the only one claiming that, you see?

Don't talk shit about Freya and Quina.

>In aesthetics
Even then, only sort-of. Ivalice was great until they added all the stupid non-human races.

Her smiling a smile of pure joy at seeing him again, while dressed in an all white dress.
Its like you faggots don't understand fairy tale logic. The game is a fairy tale brought to life. Literally. That was the mission statement of Sakaguchi when making it.
Every theme and scene is wrapped and presented as a page from a fairy tale.

The princess in her wedding dress looking dress smiling at the lovable rogue protag is as fairy tale and about love as it gets.

There's the bit where Eiko is asking Garnet and probably would have coaxed an answer from her before the others came into the scene and Garnet went to see them.

>until the end of the game.
Honestly I feel that way for FF9 as a whole. The ending is actually pretty great and really ties everything together nicely. At least, as nicely as I can expect from a Final Fantasy game.
But holy god damn is it a slog to get there.

How do they make it any less traditional aesthetically? Previous games had their share of non-humanoid races, it's always bee a thing given the high-fantasy inspiration for the franchise.

Enough.
You're trying to convince me (and others, it looks like) that "Garnet didn't know how strong Eidolons were" and that "Garnet didn't know Brahne could extract them from out of her." But you're wrong on both points.
Garnet knew that Eidolons were strong.
Garnet knew they were "inside her."
Garnet knew if Brahne did get her insane hands on those Eidolons, it meant national destruction, proven over and over and over again.
She RECOGNISED the Eidolons Brahne was using during those destructive scenes, despite having never "summoned" them before.
Even if we, the audience, aren't given a scene were someone of supreme spiritual understanding confronts Garnet face-to-face to tell her "there is a method for Brahne to extract Eidolons from you" Garnet can already infer Eidolons can be extracted from her (or, that she can simply be controlled to summon them anyway). She KNOWS what will happen, no matter how, if she goes back to Brahne. She knows her Eidolons will be used for war.

Garnet is aware, she's simply frightened. She is desperate. She reverses her plan to escape from possible misuse by her mother by going to simply beg to her already confirmed insane, remorseless and blind mother to be calm and stop, knowing full-well SHE, herself, is the reason Brahne has this much power in the first place.

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Zidane and Garnet have a scene on a boat in Maiden Sari where Zidane admits the reason he's followed her all this time was simply because he wanted to be with her, she's rather taken aback by this
during their return to Alexandria in disc 3, she wants to see Zidane several times
when her and Eiko complete their job at the wind shrine, Eiko asks her if she is in love with Zidane, she gets flustered and dodges the question
disc 3 is really where their relationship starts to get more intimate, much of their character development is based around each other

>her smile to Zidane is clearly framed in a way that it should resonate with the player
All that does for me is frame her as the mischievous princess seeking freedom that the game tells you she is. Presuming that it's a romantic gesture seems a bit odd as well as something you can only really determine in hindsight. That's why I'm asking for anything throughout the game that displays a budding romance instead of one that's presumed but never really explored/hinted towards.

>You have genuine autism
You certainly sound like an autism expert since you consider girls smiling an unmistakable sign of romantic interest.

>pear-shaped ass
Eh, not really pear-shaped, just a petite (yet still cute) tush. Girl still has time to grow into a goddess of curves.

Attached: Garnet's ass.png (165x278, 90K)

>What purpose did she serve in Lindblum? She thought she could get Cid to help, but he's a fucking oglop because of his own idiocy.

Cid WAS going to help, or are you forgetting he still had the soldiers and airships? Also Cid knew that the Queen was after the Eidolons this whole time. What pisses me off is that it’s implied by Garnet later that Doctor Tot KNEW something was up with the Queen and Alexandria and left the castle to get info and speak with Cid and find out about the Eidolons, but instead he screws off in Treno with no attempt find out who the mysterious white haired man (Kuja), who seems to be the cause of the Queen’s behaviour, is, and he just plays along with Garnet’s stupid “I just wanna talk to Momma” subplot and willingly let’s her go back to the castle even though he himself didn’t want to stick around in Alexandria for no explained reason. Seriously Sakaguchi couldn’t have written that Tot found out about Kuja and the Queen’s plans involving the Eidolons and warn Cid about it, leading to the kidnapping and then Tot being in Lindblum when the party get there in Disk 1 to warn Garnet, Zidane and everyone about the Queen being after Garnet’s Eidolons, thus stopping that whole stupid “return to Alexandria” plot.

>There was simply no threat to anyone but Garnet herself by taking the risk to go talk to her mother. After going through what she did she had a perfectly in character change of heart that she could talk her own mother out of what she was doing, and this combined with feeling homesick obviously led her to do what she did.

Yeah, no threat except to the all the people who got killed by the Eidolons. Also why would Garnet be homesick for a place that kept Garnet cooped up, Garnet wanted to be free and explore the outside world, if she was homesick, she would be homesick for Madain Sari (subconsciously).

>Her smiling a smile of pure joy at seeing him again, while dressed in an all white dress
Yeah at the END of the game, which I mentioned specifically. I'm looking for character development throughout the game, not just her smiling at the beginning and then their bittersweet reunion when she thought he was dead.

>girls smiling an unmistakable sign of romantic interest.
While not all smiles are a sign of love, some can be signs of such. Of course, there's a lot more body language to take into account than just the smile.

Then you took a wholly wrong interpretation of a very clear telling of a princess and a rogue.
It probably explains alot about your posts. You presumably took the wrong lessons and inferred the wrong things about most of your life.

Its a fucking fairy tale my man. We tell them to literal children because they are simple enough thematically that even a child can understand them.

And you didn't understand it.
Big. Fucking. Yikes. Lad.

blame the writers not their characters

the beginning of her character development is when she decides to flee and get kidnapped. Her entire story doesn't revolve around Zidane. She is her own entity.
But she clearly has deeper feelings for him than the rest. And as a 15 year old girl it isn't out of the realm of possibility for those feelings to be young love.

This entire thread is mired with autists that either don't understand the human condition from a conceptual point or are from 3rd world countries so the ideas of innocent young love are literally foreign to them.

>X lets you have all of them at all times with no penalty for switching them out.

That’s called strategy, don’t act like the active time battle system of the previous games were that great, “Final Fantasy? Whatever” certainly didn’t like it.

translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&tl=en&u=http://www.finalfantasywhatever.com/2014/07/final-fantasy-x-review.html&sandbox=1

Bad taste. Ffx is the best of the later Era games by far.

Not him, but to say that they fell in love right from the start is a bit of a stretch. Garnet was playful with Zidane, but then became quite annoyed with him when he got grabby, while Zidane was flustered that he couldn't talk his way into her pants like he had with other girls. It's not until a good way into the game that they even start to think about each other and realize that their grievances for one another are being replaced with "I want to be with him/her"

Well VII, X and XII’s stories were.

>FF9's story is great.
No it isn't. It's OK, not great, and was only barely worth replaying the 50-60 hour game to finally see the ending.
The first few hours are just a mix of contrivances and setup with very little connection at all to Zidane or any of the other characters. You run into the main villain basically by accident. The tone will be all light and playful and comfy and then suddenly some horrific event happens portrayed in high detail in dramatic FMV cutscenes, but where neither the protagonist or the player have any real personal investment. So it's like, oh hey look Odin just destroyed Clerya. Darn it. What's next?
And then there's the one-note characterization; the kind of thing that was fine in the SNES games when there wasn't that much dialog or story in the first place, but in the novel-length PSX era it gets really annoying having all these exaggerated 2-dimensional characters around for 40 hours.
>I like FF8 but the lore in that game is fucking stupid.
haven't really played 8. I think I played the demo at one point but that's it. Have played every other FF up through 9 (although 2 and 3 were a long time ago and don't really remember them)

>While not all smiles are a sign of love, some can be signs of such
So we're supposed to assume, with barely any kind of exposition on Garnet's character or personality, that she's in love with Zidane from that moment at the beginning of the game? I don't agree with that unless you can provide some actual compelling evidence.

Game is pure trash.

Hard question to answer because the devil is in the details and it would take forever to list and explain them all. All I can say is that FF9 is most assuredly NOT what FF4 or FF5 would look like if you remade them PSX-style.

Never said that, was just talking about girls smiling in general obviously.

Strategy would be only allowing it if the active party members die in combat and the switch should be forced to be held until you end the fight.
As is you can just switch out whenever. You can even do it so the enemy doesn't really get an action in between.
Its like every character has a health pool in the tens of thousands.

Literally no one but you is claiming that. People make a point, you strawman that point with things they didn't say then you yell at them when they don't support the argument YOU claim they have.

There is a reason the word autism is getting thrown around like crazy. You got it son. You got it bad.

>That's why I'm asking for anything throughout the game that displays a budding romance instead of one that's presumed but never really explored/hinted towards.
the entire game is about their romance slowly blossoming
Zidane and Garnet are fasinated by each other, she sees him as a world weary rogue who is an expert on a world she has never known and looks to him for guidance, but she doesn't let him get away with his attempts to get all touchy with her, he tries to put the moves on her but ultimately puts his womanising aside to do what's right
their main source of friction early on his Zidane chastising Garnet for her naivete and coming across as treating her like a child, leading to her drugging him with a sleeping weed, showing she has learned a few tricks from him
during the second disc, their relationship is more based on mutual trust, she chastises his attempts at flirting and he tries to come off as cool in front of her, they share some moments like Zidane telling Garnet the story of his past (probably the only person who he has ever told) and the scene of him and her on the boat in maiden sari
after disc 2, they both yearn for each other after they are forced to be separated, Zidane at this point is in love with Garnet but can't get the words out, Garnet is also implied to feel this way about Zidane, but both put their feelings aside, after the events of Alexandrias destruction and Garnet getting her voice back, its clear her and Zidane are closer than ever, at this point, the two are clearly in love with each other
it wasn't love at first sight imo, it took a while, but they got there

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We were talking about XII though, not IX.

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>You presumably took the wrong lessons and inferred the wrong things about most of your life.
Is strawmanning the only thing you can do in response to a general inquiry on game knowledge? You clearly can't refute anything I'm pointing out and are baselessly throwing out accusations. Get back to me when you learn how to have a discussion with normal people.

So instead of pointing out those things like did you just whine about people "not understanding" that Zidane and Garnet are clearly romantically interested in each other?

To be fair, dude, you seem to be ignoring a number of scenes that clearly show Garnet and Zidane falling love with each other and saying that there wasn't anything until the very end when there clearly was a lot of stuff happening prior.

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He wasn’t. That was just bad writting. The with a Brahne and Beatrix.

FFIX tries to be seen as a serious, emotional, dramatic and realistic story, but has over the top cartoon antagonists that are way too evil to be realistic and don’t fit, the only actual interesting grounded, complex character was Garland and he gets shafted, Garland is a much more morally ambiguous antagonist than Final Fantasy usually serves up (give or take a Delita). His job demands he get his hands dirty, but Garland is absolutely certain that his doing it for the sake of his world's survival absolves him. It's unfortunate that Final Fantasy IX's atrocious pacing robs him of the impact he should have had, and as a result he ends up playing third fiddle to Brahne and Kuja -- a pair of far more typical and less interesting villains.

Seriously the Terra Gaia Story was so interesting but it get thrown so forcefully into the game and way too late, it was a complete waste, and would have been integrated well with Zidane and Garnet’s love story, but screw that let’s toss all that away so we can get more of that white haired, thong wearing douche with serious special snowflake syndrome whose motives amount to a temper tantrum and suddenly pretend that he’s a “tragic and misunderstood” person.

I don't know what else to tell you if the penultimate closing cutscene of the game having the princess of the realm in a white dress smiling at the protag as he crashes a party doesn't instantly give you the overtones you need to understand the scene or the characters.
No, I started by citing the ending cutscene. You know, the one you get when you beat the fucking game. That one.

The scene is undeniably a throwback, but their first interaction was not the moment they fell in love.

See, this is how I know you have bad taste, because you tried to use Quina as an example and didn't do Eiko. You fucking fool.

>what is octopath
So that's one game in 20+ years?
Plus it's a $60 game that really doesn't look like other $60 games these days. I haven't tried it yet so won't leave any other opinions.
>what is bravely default
Handheld kiddie game. Yeah I know it's a fine game, clearly some passion went into it (at least the first one). But despite claims it's really not a mainline FF game.
>what is FF dimensions
A fucking mobile game? Are you kidding me?

>Literally no one but you is claiming that
I'm not claiming anything though, I'm the one asking for examples of Garnet and Zidane's romantic interactions during the game, and one of the answers was "bruh she smiled at him at the beginning and then the end of the game". That's unacceptable considering I asked for stuff during the game and already disqualified the ending because like I said, that's the only time I remember them genuinely being romantically interested in each other.

But numerous examples have been posted already, so why are you still acting like it's only the ending?

Am I? I got at least one guy claiming Garnet smiling at the beginning of the game was her showing romantic interest, which is an absurd prospect considering we barely know anything about her at that point. Some other guy made an actual list of events that I was going to check out, but if the idea that Garnet is in love with Zidane from the moment she smiles at him in the beginning of the play I'm casting doubt and attacking that instead.

I never said it was. I just said her smile to him being a parallel to their meeting isn't an accident.
Chekov's Gun and all that. Nothing in the game is there by accident.

oh sorry, right no in the case of XII it's pretty good aesthetically but has a real problem of overt pandering to horny 13-year-old boys and being consistent with the kiddie-GBA games.