HURR THESIS DURR ANTITHESIS

>women whoring for savages instead of mothering children to rebuild civilization

Vulpes did nothing wrong

t. butthurt non-german

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all germans and pseudogermans, save for nietzsche who cast aside his germanity and larped as polish, were objectively bad for philosophical thought
>including marx in the image
I rest my case

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Hey user, why did you destroy the Sorrows' innocence?

To do God's work.

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But Caesar, if you just reenact history, after a few hundred years you will end up with the same system that caused the Great War in the first place.

For me?
It's got to be House.

#notalllegionaires

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I think schopie also larped as german too lmao.

I get the impression that Nietzsche rejected Germans because of his break with Wagner who embraced christianity and german nationalism.

Imagine not being independent

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Wittgenstein is pretty comfy

But he's renacting history with knowledge of it's failings. Unlike Lanius, he intends to slow down once he's got Hoover Dam, as then he'll be one of the most powerful people in the wasteland, and he can make a Heir at his own pace.

you can't just manufacture historical Dialectic, especially if you intend to be the self-aware antithesis at the same time.

Gonna be real hard to sire an heir when his skull's painting the inside of his tent.

He's literally surrounded by spear chuckers, where's he going to get an heir from?

But user, you can't not reenact history. It's is humanely impossible. Every empire collapses in the same cesspool of degeneracy and weakness that we experience today, the next empire will experience at their decline ad infinitum.

/legion/niggers defending their retarded ideology that will fail as soon as that ultimate nigger Caesar dies from brainasscancer.
Hell his hegelian dialect meme of thesis and antithesis creating a hybrid ideology of both conquered NCR and Legion is so incredibly flawed even in the most successful synthesis, it still fails when the retard dies. I would be more sympathetic to Legion niggers in these threads if they could actually justify their autism instead of sperging out about getting dumpstered at Boulder City

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that doesn't mean we should resign ourselves to live in trees forever. the idea is that each empire should be closer to perfection, last longer at its zenith, before tumbling into degeneracy.

The alternative was to turn them into eternal prey always being oushed around and running away from every confrontation while the genocidal maniacs in the wh*Te legs fester and grow in the holy land.

This.
Even The Survivalist told them to strike back if someone tries to fuck with them.
Daniel is a fucking faggot.

Can you cure Caesar's tumor in non legion endings?
My courier would like to uphold the balance of power.

>and basically, you're fucking stupid.
I hate that you can't argue back or get him to stop patronising you with 10-Int. Bravo, Avellone, your voice is really coming through.

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you always have to fight the legion and confront lanius in non-legion endings

>gets handed the platinum chip
>I'll just give it to a complete stranger so he can go unsupervised into a building within my territory that we have no idea about, I'm sure he'll destroy it like a good boy
>hey courier, I heard a noise, that must have been you destroying it, what a guy you are
Is Caesar retarded?

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Yeah I don't mind killing L*nius, I want to keep Caesar alive to hold off NCR.

Fucking a slave and educating the child? It's not difficult.

Can you lock yourself out of main quest by killing all the questgivers?

the game defaults to the question of "what will lanius do without caesar?" but i'm curious what would caesar do without lanius?

He didn't seem to give much shit about losing Vulpes.

You can betray whoever you want, you'll always have Yes-man. But you do know the Legion will make it personal at a betrayal, and their main goal is Vegas? They'll target you first and foremost.

Lovely. Marcus Aurelius and Commodus all over again.

The courier is effectively immortal by the end of the game.

>that doesn't mean we should resign ourselves to live in trees forever
Why not?

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They can't even kill Joshua.

i thought sawyer was the one who wrote the legion stuff

>stop advancing the human race.

Advancing ever further into degeneracy and alienation

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>German who larped as German
Hmm

it's amazing how similar anarchy-primitivists and communists sound.

Actually you can ONLY manufacture it.
It's a post-factum interpretation imposed on reality that only ever makes sense as a rhethorical device. Using it for persuasion and propaganda (which is basically all what Hegel ever did, even if he didn't openly admit it) is the only way it makes sense. Unless you're the brainlet getting persuaded.

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Well both are just larping anti-westerners, the only real diff is what those joyless fucks pretend to like in order to attack it.
You'd never see Linkola in a forest unless it was for a photoshoot.

Only superficially, they aren't similar at all.

Yes man is immortal.

christianity and german nationalism have a shaky relationship. Nietzsche was spot-on with christianity however.

>larping anti-westerners
What? You do realize both rose from the western tradition itself?

I don't think I've ever joined Caesar's Legion, nor have I joined the Stormcloaks. I joined the NCR first time around, then never bothered to do the main quest again.

>le I'm gonna kill him xD
well i'm gonna kill le House and the le NCRcuck haha yayy i didd it
kys you're not a tough guy for killing an NPC in a bethesdashit game

he was a fisherman for decades

I don't have anything against NCR but when you word it like this you really sound it like an NPC.

And?
They wish to destroy western societies and replace them with their larp horseshit.
Anprims are the worst because they're so full of shit "there's too many people, euthanasia now!" but then they all go "oh no not Africa/India/China that'd be raycweest". Cocksuckers the lot of them.

>the legion displays anything but unanimous opinions subject entirely to the will of a braindamaged retard who shuns technology on objectively incorrect principle, and who tried to mirror his band of actual homosexual deviants after an ancient garbage civ that collapsed because it was inherently doomed to fail from day 1 due to lead poisoning amongst the entire aristocracy
Back in the pit, porch monkey.

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Either way, the key point is that the classification is done post-factum. Claiming to be the historical agent himself, while being conscious of being one and claiming to work current events so as to fit them into a dialectic frame, is nothing short of having a god complex.

And you sound like a juvenile virgin.

>this is "advancing" the human race
i don't see how outsourcing every job and fill every day with surrogate activities is an advancement. I also don't see how the inevitable purge of human genetics is an advancement either. AI will get rid of humans whether it's evil or not, that's just how it works. Horses replaced by cars, and so on. Transhumanism is cuckoldry.

now you know you can sire children that will want to eventually kill you.

history is more than walmart's latest sale, burger.

But it's the west that sustains life in africa.
Kill the west and population in third world will collapse on its own

communists have no problem with industrial society, they just think the problem is how much money the bottom humans are allowed to play with.

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Romans were aware that lead was bad.

>literally kys to make your problems go away
ok retard.

? There will be no more history if these "advancements" continue.

What makes you think I'll kys and not just kill you?

>bottom
>"humans"
silly user

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I see reading comprehension is hard to come by when you live in the woods.

This poster is yet another victim of sino-phobic propaganda being pushed by the US of A.
China has jackshit to do with communism besides the flag at this point.

roman authorities suspected the lead was toxic but did nothing about it, the upper class including both nero and julius continued drinking wine made with lead pots and containers until the very end

You misunderstand the purpose of uniforms. You wear a factions clothing, you are a fully-fledged member to be treated as such.

you're included in the "bottom humans" you fucking retard

They were forced to wear it pretty much at gunpoint.
It's the same as people confessing to shit they didnt do under torture.

Neither can the Courier.

filthy, dumb, bugman scum
kill your daughter just for fun
eat some rice you worthless gook
we'll mount your corpse on a meat hook

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What would have House even done if Legion hadn't got btfo at Boulder City??

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I have no problem with a healthy dose of luddism, but the problem is not technology itself, it is our relationship with it. I don't mind robots and smart cars, the issue is that people nowadays equate technological boom with how accurately your smartphone can predict what kind of porn you like.
What you cal "AI" will NEVER replace humanity, artificial intelligence is, to use a communist term, a spook. To think that there is even an ounce of intelligence in a software that was trained to detect cars in an image is an insult to mankind, and is a concept that has been entirely marketed by Silicon Valley to sell more shit. The problem is that we are being lied to, we believe that singularity is right around the corner, when in fact a simple look at how computer vision, for instance, work will show you that it's really not that ground breaking to begin with (it's a simple optimization problem). That's when we are entering the field of idolatry, where people suck the dick of artificial constructs because they think that if a twitter bot says racist things, it means it has a mind of its own.

>YEAH KILL EM

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I really love the last part here because it boils down to
>leftists wants us to be less racist but they didn't say please so I'm going to be more racist, yup that's totally how it works

unabomber is the worst fucking meme and his manifest is garbage

>artificial intelligence is, to use a communist term, a spook.
yet

Is that so? Well fuck him, then.

lol Chinks push way more money into Africants and that's ignoring the other two you dishonest fuckwit.

no, because when you talk about progress in AI, you are talking about a horizontal progress. You are sticking more training algorithms into a software, so the software will be able to detect cars, filter spam, and turn pictures into paintings at the same time. But in the end, the building blocks remain simple optimization problems. You are never going to have life spark out of a math book, right? same here. An AI software is nothing more than the sum of its parts, and it will be so for the foreseeable future.

They just want to turn them into modern serfs.

We will have molecular/quantum computation in the future.
Just because we're on a technological plateau right now doesn't mean it will always be case.
For most of history there was very little progression that could be 'felt' by a common man.

nice try yangie

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isn't quantum computing essentially just an drastic increase in computing power? what you get is that each qbit can carry however many times more information that a normal bit (which only carries one state, 0 or 1). This is like saying true AI will arise because we have multiple cores in our PCs.

Same shit happened in Europe 150 years ago.

notice how most NCR fags type like mentally unstable virgins? And legion bros are usually calm and collected kek... ncr fags are all fat and ugly n legion bros are groomed and well built

Caesar wasn't written by Avellone or Sawyer. He was written by John Gonzalez

What separates the brain from a processor if not more computing power?

>communists
Its far more similar to fascism than communism

soul

just kill everyone and it'll be fair

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>too stupid to not shit the place up
>buy air instead
>claim the people who gave you the opium addiction you deserved were ever as dumb as you
Sad!

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It's literally saying leftists exarcebate the issues they pretend to work against to satisfy their egos. Nothing about saying "please". Are you illiterate as well as a brainlet?

Legion is founded on heavy militarist-imperialistic morals with huge cult of personality attached to it.
When the first battle of Hoover Dam happened, Legion still had a chance to transform into a functioning society.
During the events of New Vegas however, Caesar is close kicking the bucket, and he's the only one who has a real "plan" for the Legion, will Legion dissapear forever after his death?
I don't think so, mostly because Lanius is portrayed as someone highly respected among Legion and everyone would jump to fire if Lanius ordered it.
His "continuation" of Legion however would be just about creating an army,and less of a society.
So my take on the Legion is: Long gone oppurtinity that is no longer plausible that it could lead to anything worthwhile.

Honestly this is the type of brainlet wall of text I'd expect to encounter on /pol/.

and how does this exacerbation works, according to him ? because "leftists" were loud and "dogmatic"
wich is odd because let's say that you could put a number on someone's racism say that a guy is 60% racist. If a white leftist were to be obnoxious about afirmative action this shouldn't change that number because it's not a black person being obnoxious. But Ted because he is smart and not at all insane thinks that this number will go up because white leftists are rudes losers.

what in the utter fuck are you talking about

>western society has always been industrialized

Rent free, too bad it makes no sense since Avellone didn’t write Caesar.

He has like 40 DT but he's still killable with weapons, some of which ignore DT. You can also just plant a stick of dynamite on him.

Shouldn't you be telling that to the NCR? Not that it matters much since both the NCR and the Legion would absolutely nuke each other if they had working nukes.

>Are you illiterate as well as a brainlet?

Are you?

it took you one hour to come up with this reply?

Or "synthesis," as I like to call it.

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House is by FAR the best option, you CANNOT debate this. MAYBE independent if we assume 10 int 10 cha fully upgraded transhuman courier gigachad.

NCRetarded is the NPC choice and Legion is the edgy 13 year old choice.

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>women whoring for savages
That's the Legion though

House wants to abandon Earth.
He doesn't even care to fix up Freeside.

>be 13
>don't get very good grades in middle school
>social outcast
>play Fallout: New Vegas
>talk to Caesar for the first time
>have no idea what he's talking about but it sounds really smart and also his faction is edgy
>start remembering the stuff he is saying about decimatio meaning decimation and latin and hegelian dialectics and stuff
>repeat these things to teachers and other students
>suddenly every teacher is telling me how smart I am
>feelsgoodman
>start talking about how every person is only as valuable as what they can provide for the country
>teachers are even more in awe of my intellect
>use the words thesis and antithesis instead of opposite to sound even smarter
>holy shit I am so smart
>everyone I meet tells me how smart I am
>mfw I got +50 IQ just from playing Fallout: New Vegas

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You know there is a whole other place than the Freeside around the Vegas gate, right? It's called Westside.

marx wasn't german.

Westside's a dump.

why do they have posters featuring poorly rendered CGI characters?

Caesar is retarded. There is so much nuance and complexity to events and the results of said events transpiring. He's literally just shitting words out of his mouth.

Prussian?

>muh tree and nature
>muh bush

tfw you realize that the NCR commander only had to tell Yes Man to stop in order not to be thrown off the Hoover Dam.

it seems like critics of avellone and old obsidian are some of the most unabashedly low iq posters ive ever seen

caesar is aware about it, the legion is not

OH NO NO NO

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>13 when new vegas came out
underage subhuman, go and stay go

HURR WATER

>13 when New Vegas came out
lmao kys boomer

>why yes, I am a New Vegan fan, how could you tell?

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I never got the thesis/antithesis thing because that is assuming that only 2 things ever happen at a time.

>13-year-old in 2009
gtfo doomer

communism is basically anarchoprimitivism where you get to keep your technology and industry. the progression through the relations of production (slave system, feudalism, capitalism, socialism) are just a series of steps to get that industry and technologically socially situated and oriented in such a way that we can return to our small communal societies we lived in before the invention of agriculture.

The main difference is anarchists of all sorts think you can just blow up enough of the state and the state will die. Communists realize the state exists for a reason, its beneficial to society under the present conditions, else it would never have existed to start with. Therefore, destroy the state, and a new one will return. The communist then seeks to work through the progression of the relations of production, developing the productive forces maximally under each step, until finally the conditions are right for communism

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>13 years old
>ever
yuck

Caesar is a dumb piece of shit. His army is fucking pathetic and there is no feasible way he could take California assuming he takes all of the Mojave with ease. NCR is too strong on the home turf, and Caesar's men get bodied by Rangers every single time. Rangers know California because they are native and they have been patrolling there for a long ass time. There's also New Reno which basically sports it's own private armies (crime bosses each having their own men under their control) Vault City which is basically an impregnable fortress, and Shady Sands itself which is canonically the largest city on the post-apocalyptic United States.

I don't even think Caesar's army breaks the 10,000 mark in total soldiers. Meanwhile JUST Shady Sands has a population numbering in the tens of thousands.

Dead end dumb antagonist. Everything about him screams pseudo-intellectual ragetard. No wonder Yea Forums loves Caesar so much; they can relate.

>until finally the conditions are right for communism
when is that?

>antilegion are the real legion

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>be normal human being
>read some books as a kid
>get captured by ooga booga tribals
>ooga booga tribals at war with the entire fucking neighborhood because they can't stop shitting all over the canyon walls
>can barely even use guns to scratch their own ass let alone shoot them
>teach them how to hold the guns and how to hide behind things to avoid getting shot
>become Ooga BooGod
>conquer all the other ooga boogas

You faggots all know he's right though, especially about Bethesda's darling, the Brotherhood.

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You forgot
>Find an excuse to kill the only guy who knows you're not an Ooga BooGod

incels are so weird
>kaxynski
What a white-sounding name lmao

Depends on how exactly history plays out over the next decades or even centuries. Nobody knew when the time was ripe for capitalism, but the time did eventually come when the old feudal relations could no longer withstand its pressures. Same with communism.

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when every group can be self sufficient and have access to more or less the full capacity for human productive output

The orthodox view of this, before lenin came along convinced he could speed it up and make it happen faster, was that capitalism would progress untill a single entity had accumulated all the wealth, and itself handled all production, distribution, everything (think super-amazon). A single monopoly on everything. At this point socialism would occur, as the idea of capitalism is impossible under these conditions anyway, it would already be one single massive self contained planned logistics operation. All that would be required is a quick change of leadership from a few ruling elite to the people.
After this point a period of government by the people would run things. Because profit is no longer a factor over time the mechanism would be fine tuned for convenience and things would be more and more produced locally to increase the logistical efficiency. This would further develop until one day things are so decentralized that people stop bothering to think about the overall coordinating body and the planners and representatives and such simply stop attending.

kys zoomer scum

You don't know is what you are saying. Incidentally,Capitalism didn't follow after the fall of feudalism. Mercantilism did.

this must be what nazi sympathizers actually believe

Everyone who is pro-NCR has never done a high-karma legion ending, and if they had they would know its the best ending by far.
>Civilisation finally brought to the wasteland
>The legion drove back the NCR
>The legion occupied all major locations...Peacefully lording over them.
>Caesar leaves the Boomers alone.
>Caesar routed the Brotherhood from the Mojave
>Caesar allowed the Followers safe passage through-out the wasteland
>The legion didn't take notice of Goodsprings
>The Great Khans left, and created an Empire in Wyoming
>The Legion offered the Kings incorporation and mercy
>Novac citizens left alive, the trading settlement occupied
>Caesar keeps Primm open for buissness
>Caesar leaves the remnants alone, allowing a peaceful death.
These are all things the game says.

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mercantilism still occurred during the feudal era, feudalism ended when the bourgeoisie abolished legal class and killed the monarchs.

Mercantilism was the period in late feudalism where power began to accumulate in the hands of a new class through refocusing of war and conquest to trade as the primary means of wealth accumulation and control. But they were still legally distinct, still legally lesser, under the aristocrats.

This is the reason for all the liberal 'muh laws' indoctrination you have surely received in school and in entertainment. Every time someone morally pontificates about how everyone should be equal under the law, what they mean is 'there should be no superior legal class which has privileges over me through the legal system', and what they mean by that is 'i should be able to enjoy my position on the top by virtue of my wealth with out any noble being able to tell me otherwise'.

The primacy of top legal class was replaced with primacy of top production class. After the bourgeoisie revolutions the aristocrats were simply replaced by capitalists who could now use their wealth to influence law and government for their own benefits the same way the aristocrats did, wealth changed from being measured purely in lands and serfs, but to resources and factories. A similar set of things, but in a new guise, a more highly developed form, as the new relation of production is always more highly developed than the previous.

as mercantilism is both the peak productive capability of the feudal system, and also the seeds of its downfall, so too are the kinds of large super corporations the peak productive capability of capitalism, but the seeds of its downfall as well.
Each relation of production prepares the way for the next.

>1+1=2
>1+1=3
>the answer must be somewhere in between
hegel was a full blown fucktard

Except that egomaniac piece of shit dictator called Ceasar is still alive.

Legion is made up out of an amalgation of conquered tribes, right?
Why do they never speak in accents or have any strange behavior?

And you know, getting enslaved if you have the wrong genitalia and used as a rape slave

other than that though its not that bad teehee

Only proof you've never sided with the legion, you save him from his tumour in the quest-line, if you dont or decide to kill him one of his advisers gives you the quests instead with legate becoming leader, which is arguably a better outcome for the legion.

the legion has male slaves as well.

>Legion uses slavery as is clearly shown
>NCR uses slavery as is clearly shown
The legion is open about it and gives clear ways and options for slaves to advance, the NCR just lets loose violent slaves back into their system when done so they can be caught again and used for slave labour once more under the guise of 'imprisonment' the powder gangers were forced to do hard labour and make railways. How is that better than than the legion, I'd argue worse.

Only proof you have a slave mentality. I've played this game through every faction. You still end up with one edgelord sack of shit who controlls everything. "The Tyrant is the one who is allowed to commit crimes against you."

Doesn't look impressive.

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>"The Tyrant is the one who is allowed to commit crimes against you."
Exactly my point, the NCR uses slave labour in the NCRCF, and then they go back in by shooting everyone. The one's responsible for the break out (Cooke's gang.) Aren't even at the prison, the people at the prison are innocents who decided to stay and simply arm themselves for protection the NCR should have tried negotiating, but they instead execute them. Meanwhile the legion always offers the people who they want gone incorporation and confederation into the Legion, Caesar is by far much more diplomatic. The NCR have committed more crimes against its citizens than The Legion has.

>hard labour in response to criminality is worse than unprovoked kidnapping and rape

yikes!

ingame is never impressive because of hardware limitations.

how do you know it was unprovoked?

Yet they've managed to make about every other settlement look bigger.

>praising Nietzsche
Fucking YIKES.

who cares

>>unprovoked
Legion: "Hello we're the legion and are much more powerful than youre tribe, join us peacefully or else we'll be forced to make an example of you to avoid unneeded bloodshed in the future"
Tribe: "No."

'Criminal': "Hello, I was forced to steal this Brahmin from the Brahmin Baron to feed my impoverished family."
NCR: "Because of this we're going to send you off to a kangaroo court where the corrupt judge and jury are payed off by the Brahmin Baron, and when are are proven guilty you will be sent hundreds of miles from your family who needs you and to the Mojave to do slave labour for us and our imperialist war."
'Criminal': "Due to other people breaking out for similar reasons I will arm myself and organise with my fellows in brotherhood and not join the anti-NCR terrorists in hope I can one day join my family."
NCR: "We're sending in conscripts that dont want to be there to execute you all, and not the jail-breaker terrorists."

virgin

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>Responding to an argument with a meme
Guess I win then, profligate.

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>he is mocking ME!
>mocking ME!
>why is this happening? he isn't allowed to do this! muh arguments!

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slick

I win, profligate, you have resorted to projecting your loss on towards me.
Now lay down and let me put this slave colour on you.

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>Caesar
>Taking any form of criticism

Caesar is a massive faggot who would order his Praetorian's to attack you for dismantling his retarded statements.

Cool how FNV predicted incels 10 years before they became an internet phenomenon

this
He's an insecure, arrogant little pseudo-intellectual bitch boy who uses his power to boss people around. He was essentially a big fish in a small pond that kept filling his pond with small fish to make himself look even bigger.

>NCR drones cant dismantle Legion arguments and then say that the Legion would kill them for dismantling their arguments, and then they talk among themselves calling the Legion bitches.
God I love FNV threads for these reasons, its always so fun.

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>Nobody knew when the time was ripe for capitalism, but the time did eventually come when the old feudal relations could no longer withstand its pressures
The difference is that no intellectual group called "the capitalists" devised the idea of "capitalism" by critiquing "late stage feudalism" and predicting some sort of bourgeois revolution.

There's a lot of magical thinking in Marx's pseudo-historical scientism. He took Hegel too literally and made some sort of religion out of his philosophocal ideas.

Legioncucks are just numales too scared to be alt right in real life so need to do so in video games.

>American GIs are faggots that murders the SS for no reason even though most of them were incorporated into the German army against their will and aren't even aggressive towards random Europeans they encounter.
oh, you're a complete fucking Rtard. Got it.

every time we dismantle a legioncuck "argument" legioncucks go further into denial. People who are constantly smelling their own assholes don't care when someone says the room smells like shit.

NCRdrones are just trannies too scared to suck the dicks of authority in real life so they have a slave complex in video games.

Dismantle one then:
>"As a young man I was taught to venerate President Tandi of Shady Sands. 'The Founding Mother of the New California Republic.' Did you know her Presidency lasted for 52 years? And that her farther, Aradesh, was the Republics first President? Does that sound like democracy to you, or a hereditary dictatorship?"

>italian fascists are faggots because they murdered militant workers who were incorporated by communist-controlled unions against their will (and often were brutalized for not wanting to join) who weren't even killing every land or property owner they encountered
How does this statement look like to you?

this doesn't actually happen

women slaves in the legion are from conquered tribes, not women in legion owned territories

Wait, there are people who genuinely side with anything other than House/Independent?
Why?

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house is an incompetent retard and the biggest larper in the game

he saved Las Vegas from the bombs, how is he incompetent?

Caesar is a fucking retard. The West before the Great War was the thesis. The East before the Great War was the antithesis. The wasteland after the bombs is the fucking synthesis. And now he believes he'll do "Hegel's will" by repeating the same fucking thesis and antithesis from before the war. He's a retard and didn't understand shit from Hegel.

Because House is possibly not Immortal as he looks like he's on the verge of death already and has been in a coma for two centuries, and people who dont go independent and instead go with the NCR have a slave complex and people who go with Legion instead of independent want some friends.

What's his name again?

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>the biggest larper
That's the PC who does a Legion run because they think it's going to be some based 'if hitler won' fantasy.

xxxtentation

chief keef

I'm tempted to post the dachau reprisal pic just to piss off /pol/acks, but I'll probably get banned.

>House is by FAR the best option, you CANNOT debate this
That's precisely why I never wanna do it.

Caesar implies that it's a bad thing, but both of them were elected, and they both led the NCR to prosperity in a destroyed world. It's a democracy by definition since they were voted in by the people, and it's not a dictatorship, because the president does not hold absolute power.

Aradesh started out as a leader, but was elected by the people later. They chose him. Same with Tandi. Caesar tries to argue that no one would dare vote against them in the election, but that doesn't mean they don't have democracy. No one wanted to vote against them, because they were good leaders. Tandi literally built the NCR. Why wouldn't they venerate her? She was a great leader.

It wasn't until after Tandi died that the NCR started to slip into the grip of the senate. Under Tandy the NCR saw unprecedented economic growth and political expansion. That is why she was elected.

INB4 legioncuck goes further into denial.

WeWuzGreeksNShieeeeet

Boone is a fag and his wife was built for legion cock. It’s always great to trick him into killing his friend then kill him

Independent > NCR >>> House >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Institute >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Legion

Was gonna criticize you on placing the instidute so far back, but then I remembered that their entire gameplan was to just dig around underground and hide, despite obviously having the resources and technology to rebuild society entirely.

Legionfags are just larping as edgy fascists who want to choose what conventionally most people today would think of as evil as the most "intellectual" choice even though the writers were obviously not as nuanced as they could have been and wrote the Legion as assholes. It became popular on Yea Forums because Yea Forums is filled with far-right incel types.

NCRfags are boring liberal progressives who get upset that there's an RPG out there that even dares to question the moral orthodoxy and get off of the fact that they can call everyone else a LARPer because the NCR is the only hollywood approved "good guy" faction and is basically the status quo. They are really butthurt about legionfags because they disrupt the orthodoxy in their minds and they are so insecure about the frailty of their own position that they feel like they have to cry about it on every thread. Possibly commie trannies.

Everyone else is just having fun and don't care about thinking deeply about some dumb video game. House is basically min-maxing quests.

>The people's backing
Tandi has the peoples respect, yes? How is this any different from the respect Caesar has from his troops? Speak to any in the camp and they all follow him loyally and speak highly of him and the legate.
>A 54 year rule by one person unaccountable by any sort of other power, namely the senate saw the NCR prosper.
So what you'e saying is that the NCR ever since it stopped being ruled by a populist dictator and went into democracy it has ceased to prosper, you're implying democracy is a flawed system within a wasteland of scarce resources without plenty where everything wants to kill you? So, why empower the nation doing things you see as wrong? Could it be that you're applying modern day morals into a setting that has nothing to do with the modern day?
Old-worldism truly is a mental dis-order, stop being in denial.

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>legioncucks further into denial

House is for patricians that realize enlightened despotism is the superior form of government

Legioniggers are professional mental gymnasts confirmed

That user made a good point and you faggots don't even try to refute it

>Everyone is silly but me, le centrist
yikes

NCRdrone thought process:
Argue with some one --> Cant come up with response --> Go into denial --> Project denial --> Excuse them of having a political affiliation opposite to their own --> Fail to make fun of them --> Insult them --> Repeat
You drones have not won a single argument against the legion in this thread, its fruitless to argue with you at all. Enjoy the NCR's Imperialist wars.

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The legion doesn't respect caesar lmao they are literally whipped and conditioned to follow Caesar's will or they will be put to death. Caesar even confirms this. No one dares speak out against Caesar either, or else they get straight up killed or tortured.
>implying I was implying democracy is a flawed system
reading into things that aren't there is a legioncuck speciality. Keep seething and make sure to stretch your ass before your decanus mounts you in your tent tonight homoboy
>legionfags canonically gay af
cringe

>samefag

Nope.

>NCRdrones
Doesn't exist. No one sides with the NCR

I'm not a legionfag, but the NCR is a fucking joke state and there's no reason to pick them over House

NCRdrones attacking personality instead of points, cringe.

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How can NCR cucks even compete?

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You're not going to convince someone who thinks an absolute dictator who kills anyone who may be an even mild threat to his position is in any way equivalent to a democratically elected president. Like, it's not going to fucking happen.

>yikes
>centrist
Cringe. No, I'm not a centrist, I'm fairly right-wing and reactionary. I'd go with the legion if it was not so poorly written. Although the NCR with its "founding mother" is just gay, utopian progressive bait. I wanted it to go away on principle, but I didn't side with the legion because it was just stupid. I just don't understand how people get so attached to these silly factions

nice paint skills fren

Same with me, I usually go independent or house, I just despise the NCR more than I do the legion.
(Mainly due to to NCRdrones in these threads.)

Democratic presidents have term limits user, and the office shouldn't pass from father to daughter like a monarchy

Yes, I am sure the most influential philosopher in modern history would never reach the heights of your vast 13 yo zoomer intellect.

>install cut content mod
>free Benny after murdering every L*gion dog I can find, saving him from getting crucified or raped to death
>he comes back a couple days later and tries to murder me in my power armor and accompanied by Cass and ED-E with his fucking peashooter for no good reason
I understand why they cut that out

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I don't particularly like the legion but you NCR fags have made a very poor showing today.

That was Caesar's finishing point about the NCR, that they ran better being ruled by one person long term, that when they went for a series of democratic leaders, a thousand competing interests pulled it many different ways and squandered what it was.

>We don't allow chems
>But you're allowed to use these chems
>and cigarettes
>NCR is shit because its a corrupt dysfuncitonal bureaucracy where the left hand doesn't know what the right one is doing
Even the parts about the Legion you thought might have been principled political positions are just the same shit as what their enemy does. Arbitrary shit that helps no one decided by some asshole based on his uneducated opinions.

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Benny is a snake, why would you want to even free him?
The game is very clear that he always tries to screw you over.

>That user made a good point
He was corrected on his wrong point and instead of conceeding he's moved onto something else entirely that will be slapped down. It's a depressing tactic incels love.

But user, they Legion isn't poorly-written, they're just fascist. It's realistic for them to be irrational savages that operate on self-contradictory logic.

>Democratic presidents have term limits
Not necessarily. Plenty of functioning democracies don't have term limits, America didn't have one until 1947

If the Legion are fascist then the Mongols and Turkish hordes were also fascist. Learn definitions you fucking mong

>punished degenerates via corporal punishment, enslavement, or death
>amalgamates tribals into his society in order to force them to change for the benefit of mankind
>places a strict hierarchy on the usage of modern technology to ingrain the lesson that the overuse of technology nearly wiped out our entire species
>bans the use of chems
>brings peace to raider filled lands
>places high priority on birth rates, women need to be mothers and homosexuals need to find wives
>Is actively hostile to the NCR
>knows that the Legion is only a temporary part of history, resolves to permenantly change the culture of the American Southwest through dialectical warfare so that the NCR doesn't just become a cyberpunk dystopia

Yeah, I'm thinking he's based.

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IN HOC SIGNO TAURUS VINCES

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>I'm right wing so even though the NCR is obviously the best alternative I'll keep screaming 'both sides are the same' because it makes my tribal thinking feel more objective
Cringe. What a loyal doggy.

How did he move on? He directly quoted you dude, I never thought I'd defend a legionfag but you NCRfags are becoming insufferable.

>Herbs and naturally occurring plants counts as chems
No? They're not artificially manufactured pharmaceuticals

>overextended corrupt mess of a nation
>liable to fall into civil war
NCR is the same shit as the Legion, they just wear pants

define what fascism means for you, please.

Is there any particular context to this image? I've seen it before and I think there is, but I can't remember.

>you can murder everyone in Cottonwood Cove with a couple of radioactive barrells
>doesn't even require a skill check
based Obsidian giving us a quick and easy way to dispose of those L*gion faggots.

Admittedly fascist is the wrong word to describe the Legion. They are similarly (self-)destructive and degenerate though.

>literally just a gang of thugs that out-thugged the regular bandits
Just wait until Caesar fucks up and realises he needs to tax people to fund his war machine instead of relying on plunder. Megalomaniacs taxing the fuck out of their people to fund their quixotic wars is as common as it gets

You're describing progressives and anarchists. I don't know if the Legion were written as fascists, but they behave more like slightly more socially conservative anarcho-commies to me. This is why I didn't like them.
>the NCR is obviously the best alternative
>both sides are the same
No, both aren't the same. The NCR was clearly written in a way that makes it more "morally" appealing and civilized because that was the writer's bias, but at the same time their whole project seemed pretty stupid and unsustainable.

What happens if you play Honest Hearts as a legion boy? How could that DLC even work for legion players? Do you just go in and kill everyone?

>NCR
>Fascist
Yeah no they're not a corporatist dictatorship. The NCR is closer to fascism than the Legion, and House is pretty much a technocratic fascist all in all.

>muh naturally occurring
That's exactly the arbitrary shit that I'm talking about. The NCR emulates old world American government. The one that classified alcohol and cigarettes as less harmful chems than marijuana and classified cocaine as satan spawn. The legion has become the very thing they swore to destroy and they're completely oblivious to it. Stimpaks are not supernatural heresy. A pc skilled in science can literally brew them out of the same chemical as what healing powder is made from. There is no justification that is any better than the justification for real world drug prohibition.

here

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DUDE, JET LMAO

Is there a big mod that restores cut content? All i've been able to find is a bunch of mods that all restore some bits and pieces. I want the big package.

forced assimilation

>a corporatist dictatorship
I don't think most people who describe fascism as "corporatist" understands what they even meant by that. They didn't mean it in a capitalist sense, but in a "society as a living body" sense. Corp=corpse/body. Fascists were guild socialists and totalists.

>It doesn't bother you, enslaving people?
>Why would it bother me to enslave these wretches? They have no purpose, no creed, no honor. They live in pitiful squalor, undisciplined, intemperate. To enslave them is to save them - to give them purpose, and virtue. Honestas, Industria, Prudentia - even the virtues of slaves are beyond the Dissolute on this side of the river.

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House is the most fascist out of the lot, replacing ethnic nationalism with old world nostalgia

Perfect emulation a NCRtard. Good job, user.

>ethnic nationalism
Mussolini's fascists weren't ethnically obsessed either. You're confusing him with the nazis.

Hard to take them seriously when they use machetes and wear football gear

Hegel was a trash philosopher. Dialectics is a scam.

>absolute faith in the enforcement of rule by a gang of violent thugs
Yeah it must feel really safe to be traveling around Arizona under the watchful protection of people who have been brainwashed into exterminating everyone they deem "profligates" and "degenerates". A bunch of horny, hungry or sufficiently poor legionnaires can be standing next to a road with a small caravan passing them and they can just invent a justification for deeming them [insert cult's chosen word for infidel] so they have the emperor's consent to rob and rape them. That's the reason why they use those words. They've been taught to dehumanize their opponents in their own minds so they wouldn't hesitate when harming them.

Mussolini was ethnically obsessed, Hitler was racially obsessed. Doesn't matter, both are shit compared to Salazar anyways

the only reason I joined the Legion was because I wanted to dress up as a cool roman boy

>The legion has become the very thing they swore to destroy and they're completely oblivious to it.
... Alcohol is also banned under the Legion. They ban the processing of chems at a very strict level because the entire post apocalyptic world is addicted to them and they want to forcibly end it.

You're missing the entire point of why the legion is so strict against technological usage. No, the fact that they aren't "dude muh drugs lmao" doesn't mean they're exactly like the NCR.

that's pretty gay

>Mussolini was ethnically obsessed, Hitler was racially obsessed.
Eh, I guess. What I meant is that Mussolini was a more traditional nationalist. Hitler was completely racially focused.

>Salazar
>goes out of his way to avoid world war 2
>succeeds
>proceeds to plunge his country into a 13 year unwinnable war

To be fair, he was probably the best out of all fascist leaders.

I get where they're coming from. Times are shit, so people are liable to find escapism in toxic habits like drugs and booze. House takes advantage of this in Vegas. Best to nip it in the bud

I have never seen a right-winger of any kind without contradictory beliefs. Progressives and anarchists operate on internally consistent logical frameworks and sound philosophy at least. I'm not sold on anarchism myself, but I have more respect for them than I do for any right-winger.

Is the Legion the strongest tribal faction in the FO franchise?

>unwinnable war
They were winning fine, then Salazar died and the P*rtuguese fucked everything up.
That said, Salazar saved Portugal

>They don't mean corporatist in a capitalistic sense
They did. Fascism was meant to be a Third Position ideology, corporations just become part of the state or totally privatized based on the whims of the dictator
>Fascists were guild socialists
Now that's a hot take

>leftists have internally consistent frameworks
This has to be bait.

Anarchists deserve no respect for their meme ideology

Then don't reply to him, goddamn.

back to resetera tranny

DMX

>Progressives and anarchists operate on internally consistent logical frameworks and sound philosophy at least.
Pfffftttttt, as someone who was raised in a progressive society and considered himself an anarchist for some time. You're wrong. You can tu quoque all you want but if you're gonna sit there and tell me that anarchism and progressivism are logically consistent frameworks then I'm just gonna have to laugh.

That'd be the brotherhood

>modern guns in a game set in a post apocalyptic 1950's america
this triggers me more then any booby mod on nexus ever could
might as well just play any other fps game at this point

>Yeah it must feel really safe to be traveling around Arizona under the watchful protection of people who have been brainwashed into exterminating everyone they deem "profligates" and "degenerates".
Yes, actually. Because they kill raiders. Your just making head canon about how the Legion messes with Caravans all the time despite the fact that Caravans admit they feel safe in their territory and prefer it over the NCR

The Brotherhood is a tribe, not a "tribal" faction.
Like those of Arroyo's tribe and Khans, that sort of thing.

Why is Yea Forums incapable of keeping track of time?
22 years of age does not an underage individual make.
People born after the first halo came out will be over 18 in a couple months.

the duality of man

It doesn't matter. The fact that it's arbitrary makes it just as bad. Pre-war MRE food, stimpaks and coffee are not addictive nor do they have negative health effects. Rad-X and Radaway are essential health chems for wastelanders and Fixer is literally the antidote to addiction, yet all of these are banned. But one of the most addictive substances known to man, tobacco is perfectly okay and you will almost always find packs of cigarettes on legion soldiers' bodies. There is no rhyme or reason to that enforcement and you can't pretend there is after just a moment of thinking about it.

>Post apocalyptic 1950's America
That's just bethesda's autism. The world ended in 2077 and in fallout 1+2 most of your weapons are just models of modern weapons. In fallout 2 there's actually a few different H&K weapons you pick up, you even get a M249

Besides technology, what separates them from tribals?

Looks like you're the only one obsessed with rape. There hasn't been a single conquering army in history that hasn't raped captives.

> Progressives and anarchists operate on internally consistent logical frameworks and sound philosophy at least
lmfao they really fucking don't. If they did there wouldn't be an argument about the USSR and Communist China being successful projects or not.

The USSR under Stalin was a literal ethnic/racial empire that expanded its territory and ethinically replaced natives with russian colonists. They denied homossexuals from entering the party because they were considered degenerate and had money and markets. It's hard to say if they were even "left-wing" by most rational observes. In fact, it's barely any different that any other state empire.

Lefties can't even agree on the idea that they were practicing "state capitalism" or something else. Even today, the idea of what is capitalism or socialism is nebulous to most left-wingers, and left-coms, market-socialists and center-left progressives can't see eye to eye on most things except that

"capitalism bad",
"capitalism means bad thing that prevents socialism from being a thing" and
"socialism good"
The whole thing is a joke.

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Brotherhood has more in common with highway bandits then your average tribal.

Legion is based.

I know this is the NV thread of the day, but I just finished NV and I'm about to start F4.
I know the game is trash, so are there any mods you would recommend? I played NV without sex mods because the story was fun, but I don't care about 4, so I'm open to anything

>The fact that it's arbitrary makes it just as bad.
It's not arbitrary lol, I'm trying to explain to you that the entire ideology of the Legion is partially based around not being over reliant on technology. Chems like Rad x and Radaway are chems that need to be produced in a well industrialized society in a lab.

Well that's fine, because as soon as Caesar needs money and supplies to keep up his retarded war of ideology against the NCR they'll have the big man's approval to violently extract "tribute" from any caravan that passes through legion territory

I just explained how they've been taught to refer everything they want to oppose as degeneracy and their opponents as profligates. That's textbook cult behavior meant for the members to justify to themselves irrational or immoral behavior towards non-members. You're using anecdotal evidence to somehow generally prove that something doesn't happen that has been basically designed to happen. There is no rule of law. There is a rule by people and when people have the power to do anything to anyone with no consequences based on their own semantic definition of who deserves what, then all you really have is raiders who are protected by the so-called government. Anything the do is justified because they can decide it's justified. Even if they believe something they did was wrong the can decide afterwards that it was right because the innocent civilian they harmed was made into a profligate post-mortem.

Pure conjecture

In the world of FO, it's largely a disparaging term for being backwards and to live in isolation within a community, most of the time having strong religious beliefs about the Old World.
It's basically a stereotype.
Boomers are technically tribals but do not conform to the stereotype.
Omertas don't count since they have discarded their tribal roots

Oh that's funny. Okay then, Caesar's war is funded on pillaging territories they conquer. So once that runs out, where are they going to get money from?

That's idiotic and still hypocritical because cave fungus is the only "natural" (as opposed to technologically produced) antiradiological remedy in the game and even that one is banned. They and you have no argument. They are retardedly inconsistent and hypocritical just like the NCR and there's nothing you can do about it.

Freedom ain't free.

Once again, headcanon. If he's following what Rome did then I really doubt he's going to murder the commerce of his empire.

>They've been taught to kill junkies and raiders, so that means they're going to just start slaughtering caravans just you wait
No
>There is no rule of law
Yes there is. There are laws in the Legion. If you're caught with chems they're confiscated, if you're a junkie yourself then you're put to death.
>Their own semantic definition
You have literally no idea about how jurisprudence works, do you?

>Now that's a hot take
It really isn't unless you're an utterly indoctrinated communist. Yes, you could argue that the fascist went against the syndicallists but they also developed their own socialist and national syndicallist ideals under Sorel.

Of course you'd argue that they weren't sincere about their beliefs or the ideology's development was a sham to puh back against communism, but you could argue the same about Lenin and Stalin considering what "socialism" was achieved in the SU. So yes, the Fascist movement was oficially a patron of guild socialist ideals. You can even find this on wikipedia.

>Caesar's war is funded on pillaging territories they conquer.
Also through commerce throughout his territory and the settlements he owns...
>What happens when the war stops
War never changes, user

This. People need to learn the difference between corporatism and corporatocracy. Hell, most continental euro countries still operate with some elements of corporatism left over from the 1900s

You're slow in the head, aren't you? Where are they getting everything from, if not from pillage? Wars don't pay for themselves. You need money, or at the very least materials. And people. Those happy legion peasants are going to have a machete shoved into their hands as soon as Caesar has need of them.
Except it was just established that taxes are incredibly light. But war isn't cheap. It all has to come from somewhere, and as soon as the towns full of shit dry up they'll have to change that.

"Their own semantic definition" as in "this person who I now want to arbitrarily harm deserves is because he's A PROFLIGATE". Your unconfirmed utopia contradicted by the behavior of every legionnaire present in the game is as much of a headcanon as someone's hypothesis that people are people and will do harm when given absolute authority with no accountability. Ever played through the main quest the route you're supposed to take? What's the first thing that happens when legion soldiers and a literal civilian caravan interact? That's right. They attack without warning. If that happens in a neutral area where they are without support, then the only thing that can be expected in an area explicitly under their rule is that but worse.

It's called "mutated cave fungus" for a reason. It was produced by radiation induced mutations. The Legion also wants to purge mutants.

>Fascism was influenced by guild socialism and national syndicalism
Yes, but that doesn't make them national syndicalists or socialists. Fascism became it's own movement. There was fascistic syndicalism , however, iirc but fascists were also influenced by a lot of capitalistic thinking a a third positionist ideology.

Yes, they were corporatists.

>Where are they getting everything from, if not from pillage?
Don't they have a slave economy? If they are to get enough territory and factories, they could sustain a large and well armed empire even if their expansion is set back. They could even retreat and consolidate on a region and call it "neorome" or something.

>It's called "mutated cave fungus" for a reason. It was produced by radiation induced mutations. The Legion also wants to purge mutants.
Remember the part where I mentioned the word "arbitrary"? Of course you don't. Everything is a mutation and you will never draw a line between what is and what isn't. So not only is what they ban arbitrary, even what they wish to eradicate is arbitrary. It's literally "stop liking what I don't like" -the ideology. No wonder someone on Yea Forums thinks it has any merit.

We've never actually seen how Lefion territory operates, it could be completely self sufficient and those other anons are just memeing the Legion as complete tribal retards

Yeah, it just doesn't mean what you think it does. Straight from wiki:
>Corporatism is a political ideology which advocates the organization of society by corporate groups, such as agricultural, labour, military, scientific, or guild associations on the basis of their common interests. The idea is that when each group performs its designated function, society will function harmoniously — like a human body (corpus) from which its name derives.
Again, you can cry about it being just fascist jargon for state capitalism or insincere, but the actual concept of fascist corporatism didn't alude to any of this, it was anti-capitalism. For some reason this simple concept ruffles a lot of feathers.

>Where are they getting everything from, if not from pillage
Idk, probably all the massive amounts of trade and the settlements he owns in his regional empire? Yeah, I'm pretty sure he gets a fair amount of income from that.

>Those peasants are going to be forced into the army
Oh no. Conscription to ensure that your raider free land stays raider free. How awful.
>Towns full of shit are going to dry up
No? They haven't even invaded California yet

Try Horizon, it completely overhauls and rebalances the game to make it actually fun. Skill points are back, settlements are more useful, and builds actually matter now.

Makes sense in theory, leave each element of running the country to the experts and focus on your own shit

So is there any reason why you wouldn't go NCR?
They started from zero yet already did 90% of the work in restoring civilization and are by far the most powerful faction.

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>this person who I now want to arbitrarily harm deserves is because he's A PROFLIGATE
Except profilgate has an exact definition under their society and they actually have a strict rules of law? Dude, your headcanon here is just impressive. Delusional, even.

>What's the first thing that happens when a Legion raising party sees an NCR caravan
Gee, they kill the NCR Caravan as per their purpose in disrupting their commerce?
>in a neutral area
Lol, they're explicitly in enemy territory

>Overextended
>even more corrupt than the legion somehow
>actually helping Oliver and Kimball like a cuck

>It's arbitrary to be cautious of mutations and old world technology
Once again, you're missing the point of the legion so fucking hard. It hurts.
>Stop liking what I don't like the ideology
How many more times am I going to have to give you a basic run down on their ideology before you take your head out of your ass?

Bro all of them attack me on every playthrough before I get to Vegas regardless of what I do, fuck them and Caesar gets a grenade on his throne

>be independent settlement
>suddenly the NCR army shows up
>they "accept you" into their territory
>lmao now you gotta pay taxes while we do fuck all for you

So you're saying the legion is just a gang of cucks who are too beta to stand up for themselves? All the more reason to cleanse the wasteland of their existence.

>Hey you've got this really good thing going
>I'd better take a shit on the floor and kill your dog just to even things out
Chris Avellone is a writing god and a genius. Obsidian is a good studio and makes games that aren't kevin smith tier prose-dumps and are absolutely functional games that you should play. People who hold a torch for obsidian aren't obnoxious ignoramuses in the slightest.

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Well, if we're just going to quote the wiki let's look at corporate fascism then

>Fascism's theory of economic corporatism involved management of sectors of the economy by government or privately-controlled organizations (corporations).[citation needed] Each trade union or employer corporation would theoretically represent its professional concerns, especially by negotiation of labour contracts and the like. It was theorized that this method could result in harmony amongst social classes.[33] However, authors have noted that historically de facto economic corporatism was also used to reduce opposition and reward political loyalty.[34]

Yes, there are privately owned corporations under fascistic economies. Privatization is capitalistic. The natscos privatized a lot of their industry

I wonder if this poster thought he had some kind of logical consistency when he made this post

Fuck them both, my robots fren and anarchic freedom will save the wasteland and let the strong and intelligent live as pure functioning community in the Mojave

Also it makes one fine motherfucker

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Yes that is called civilizing I believe.
Taxes are a superior source of income to loot and tribute.

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So once they hit a wall they settle down with towns of slaves to farm the land? That seems incredibly inefficient compared to just taxing existing towns, and would make for nice targets for NCR to torch once the legion is on the back foot
>Idk, probably all the massive amounts of trade and the settlements he owns in his regional empire? Yeah, I'm pretty sure he gets a fair amount of income from that.
That's called taxation. And we just established that taxation is very light. So no, they're not getting much money off that.
>Oh no. Conscription to ensure that your raider free land stays raider free. How awful.
So much for being left alone. Almost as if the Legion isn't the anprim paradise people like to portray it as, being shanghaied into Caesar's retarded ideological war against NCR

>profilgate has an exact definition under their society
citation needed. I seem to recall them calling my pc that word without doing the slightest bit of reseach into who I actually am.
>explicitly in enemy territory
Nevada isn't an NCR territory yet. That doesn't happen until after the NCR ending.
opposing natural phenomenon and technology is literally "stop liking what I don't like". They don't seem to know what the definition of mutations are and in regards to technology they outright admit the aversion is out of ignorance.

>And we just established that taxation is very light
*Compared to the NCR, meanwhile you're complaining about conscription lmao

Fuck Benny
Fuck Mr. House
Fuck Caesar
Fuck Lanius
Fuck Vulpes
Fuck Elijah
Fuck Dean Domino
Fuck Dog/God
Fuck Joshua
Fuck Salt-Upon-Wounds
Fuck the Think Tank
Fuck Mobius

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Even 2241 New Reno has a better economy and stability than 2281 NCR.

Kimball and Oliver's imperialist campaign is the worst thing that hapoen to the NCR, nearly every Soldiers wants to go home chilling in California.

No retard.
New Reno is a city state.
The NCR is a proper country.

BASED

>fuck Joshua
God I wish

>Actually believing I'm an NCRfag because I'm pointing out that tribals gonna tribe
So NCR has high taxes because they need to pay for the war. The Legion can get around this because they're sacking everything. Even people, most of the Legion are tribals that were violently conscripted. So once that all runs out they're fucked.
I honestly cannot make this any more clear. It all has to come from somewhere. So if the Legion stops fighting or loses big, they'll have to raise taxes and conscript their ramshackle empire. There is no getting around this. The NCR can't, and the Legion can't either.

>citation needed.
This is in fucking real. Citation needed? Did you play the game? Have you just ignored everything part of the conversation we just had. Okay, where to start.
>People who abuse chems
>People who abuse old world technology
A profilgate is someone who lives in extreme excess and the legion very clearly sets up what they mean by that. They tell you all the time.
>Nevada isn't NCR territory yet
You seem to not understand that the Hoover Dam is occupied by the NCR as well as Helios 1 , and then all their multiple military encampments in the area across the river. Yes, they're in enemy territory. No, you don't have evidence of the NCR being abusive towards their own caravans.
>opposing natural phenomenon and technology is literally
Pretty sure that mutations as a result of genetic experimentation or nuclear warfare aren't natural phenomenon and they're aware of that at least. They aren't anprims they still allow for certain forms of modern technology, they just put a limit to it's usage for the important fact that ad infinitum technological expansions almost destroyed mankind in it's ambition.

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>Implying you need to be a gigachad to replace house
with the dam and new vegas you can basically outsource everything you can't do to teh NCR and watch them fix your problems for you while you drain their economy, you can also move into legion territory and expand east.
Picking house says fuck all this logic lets leave earth asap while pissing everyone off in the process.

>Privatization is capitalistic. The natscos privatized a lot of their industry
Hitler wasn't a fascist. It adopted some of it's ideals later on but the ideology wan't there. Just the fact that you mix these two together shows how little people care about what fascist really thought and just accept weird communist propaganda painting it however it liked.

Fascist theory as it was being developed aimed to completely nationalize all private assets. They have also made experiments with unions owning certain factories. It's hard to know what it would end up looking like because it ended.

And no, I'm not some conservative boomer retard trying to say that fascist were actually "left-wing". They were evidently reactionary and anti-left and started as an anti-communist movement. However, it's ideals as it developed were extremely labor-oriented and ultimately aimed towards some sort of guild socialist organization.

Again, Lenin just as well attracted Shell and other private companies to the USSR to develop it in the beginning. Something that's not very explored for some reason. And it ultimately never came close to developing any sort of socialist worker's republic. yet you'd call this socialism because the communists in charge of it said those were "socialist republics". Fascism and even National Socialism has as much right of calling themselves socialist as the communists by this optic. The only resistence against this notion is communist and it's adjacents strong hand in keeping the monopoly of this very nebulous political construct.

Dialectics is easily the most basic understood concept for anyone who has spent 4 seconds in actual law school

I never said you were an NCR fag, when we talk to caravans they compare the NCR to the Legion and say that Caesar has lighter taxes.
>Most of the legion are conscripted tribals.
Many from a young age, and they place supreme emphasis on birth rates hence the banning of homosexuality and limiting of women to being wives or concubines. They have settlements. They're not totally reliant on conquering other lands lmao, I can't stress that enough to you ya thick fuck

>No, you don't have evidence of the NCR being abusive towards their own caravans.
*Legion being abusive to their own caravans

but this is retarded, we didn't live in peace and harmony prior to civilization, you can check native American tribes with their constant raiding and warfare to see what tribal life is like, pro tip: most of their men die a violent death

Marx's original idea of communism said that the government only existed to protect private property, and if there was no private property, there was no need for a government. Therefore, people would live in communities where everything is shared.

Debateable. If fascism to you was only Italian fascism then yes, but I've heard from modern neo-fascists that national socialism is just the German version of fascism although within that spectrum there seems to be a pretty esoteric debate about this.

thats what I find hilarious about retarded nu commies. They somehow have managed to ignore the blatant trend that every commie revolution ends with all the conspirators being lined up and shot by their own kids, who became the "next revolutionaries"

>trying to reason with anarchists
user please. We all know that collective societies were classless utopias led by matriarchal pacifist egalitarians. Just look at this one abo tribe, see? This is what humans will behave without the state, except we will also have iphones and toilets.

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You do realize the 'national' in 'national socialists' stands for NATIONALISM right? Why do you think Germany had to change the beginning of their anthem?

Post your faction

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> that national socialism is just the German version of fascism although within that spectrum there seems to be a pretty esoteric debate about this.
This is what happens when a group of autists try to revive a dead ideology. it didn't happen to communism because it managed to create a cult around it and enough literature that one could be trapped their entire lives in it without reading anything else.

I meant fashion shit

DOYYY CAESAR, HURR AVE AVE, PROFLIGATE, CROSS
IS THAT ALL YOU SKIRT-WEARING FUCKS CAN SAY?

>I never said you were an NCR fag, when we talk to caravans they compare the NCR to the Legion and say that Caesar has lighter taxes.
You are thick as fucking pigshit. I'm not even going to bother reiterating why the legion has lower taxes at this point, I've already said it ten times already
>They place supreme emphasis on birth rates
They're not dogs. You don't get litters of soldiers per slave girl. You pop a baby out and it's going to take years before you even get cannon fodder. That's not nearly as viable a solution as you believe it is.
So now we're back to conscription, which goes back to the exact same problem as taxes. They're okay initially because of superior tactics against tribals, which are then assimilated. Once they run out of those they're either going to conscript from existing territories so they can die in a meaningless, unwinnable war for no gain, or they can start arming the toddlers with machetes.
Also, if you pull legion troops to the front lines and away from the territories the bandits are going to move back in. Keep that in mind

>routed Brotherhood
>offered Kings mercy
>good

>fashion
>it's just Mr. Radical

>brotherhood
>good
spotted the tincan man

... And? Nationalism isn't left or right wing inherently.

>He thinks that fascism as an ideology really ever left
It hasn't. Neither has communism even after the revolutions of 89

I can't get over how House gave me more money for a fucking good springs snow globe than the platinum chip

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How are they bad? They are basically a plucky order of hedge knights in this game.

>retarded technoscavengers who think that all technology belongs to them because people can't use them(or misuse them)
>not bad
oy m8
ya have a loicense for that power generator?

t. last man

>They have lower taxes, therefore they don't have enough taxes to sustain warfare without plundering
War always involves taking other resources you fucking autist lmao. You're so set on your caravan shoah it's actually hilarious
>They're not dogs, it takes a generation of constant breeding to have such a massive boom in population
They've already gone through 1 generation and experienced a massive population boom and they're going to continue doing so in an intergenerational sense. Guess you're just too high time preference to understand this
>They're going to run out of tribals therefore they're going to lose new population
No? Lmao
>Bandits will move back into legion territory if they concentrate all their forces in one place
Yes, but they don't have a shortage of manpower.

Still, no need for imperialism

>It hasn't. Neither has communism even after the revolutions of 89
Have I ever said this? Communism is as alive as ever. It consolidated as a quasi-religious ideology after the commune of paris. And with the USSR it had a shitton of funding for itself. The fact that the Fascists movements lost during WW2 and even the "imperialist capitalist empires" like the USA who supposedly antagonized the communists allied with them to defeat the fascists meant that the ideology was completely marginalized from mainstream academic institutions.

Fascism exists today as a shadow. Communism as an organized, formal international institution. Comparing the two is like comparing a satanist cult with mormon christians.

>effortlessly proves the image correct in a single sentence
Develop some self-awareness before making a fool of yourself in the future

No screenshit but basically my current courier :

>Legion Frumentari but always with luck glasses
>Trouble maker Outfit + bandana in town
>Desert Ranger Armor when exploring
>At the battle of Hoover Dam, I will take the Legion Duster and go full cloak and dagger.

Not really, all couriers die.. when their save corrupts.

>Communism as an organized, formal international institution.
I seriously hope you don't think the PRC is a communist state.

>Fascism exists as a shadow today
>Communism is as alive as ever, an international institution
I'm sorry, am I still living the cold war? Communism collapsed. There are no communist states anymore. The revolution of 89 ended the USSR. Deng Xiaoping ended Maoism. Cambodia is a monarchy.

The global communist hegemony ended decades ago. Who's left now? Vietnam and Cuba?

>forced assimilation
You can't just make someone drop the accent or their behavioral ticks through force.
The original Rome was changed by the tribes it absorbed, but Legion is all give and no take.

Germanized jew. Was kind of anti Semite, called some people "jewish niggers" in some private letters.

It's lead by followers of the communist ideology. It's as communist as the US is a liberal state.

But I wasn't even referring to "states". Just like mormons don't have an independent mormon state to be an internatinonal institution. It has churches, it can hold international conferences in the open, and it is allowed to proselytize on most western liberal countries. It can even create it's own communities and occupy academic institutions. Just like mormons, communists have this level of tolerance in today's society. Fascism doesn't. The WW2 alliance against it never ceased.

>A profilgate is someone who lives in extreme excess and the legion very clearly sets up what they mean by that. They tell you all the time.
I have found nothing to confirm this definition. even the wiki has no sources for its definition: "not a legion citizen and hostile towards the legion". So I suppose you can stop accusing others of having headcanon now or embrace the hypocrisy that you seem to want to defend.

>It's lead by followers of the communist ideology.
that's debatable

>War always involves taking other resources
And then you run out, and then you're fucked. Actually fucked, by the way. It doesn't matter how big your army is if they can't even feed themselves. There's not much point arguing this point since you seem to believe that resources are infinite so long as they're taken from somewhere you don't need to define.
>>They're not dogs, it takes a generation of constant breeding to have such a massive boom in population
Nice work putting words in my mouth faggot. A baby with a landmine underneath isn't going to much in a war. You'll need 14-15 years at the absolute minimum. And war can really decimate populations, it's very much possible that the amount of babies you crank out can't replace the dead legionnaires. At which point you're actually fucked, again.
At least you accept that if a legionnaire cannot be on the frontlines and defending territories at the same time. There's hope for you yet.

How do I wear faction armor without reseting my reputation?

why dont you do it right
like some other men dooooo

Yes, it's also debatable if the Vatican actually follows the catholic ideology.

Communism is just like christianity. Many kings called themselves christian and lead "christian kingdoms", but in the end they were just warlords and feudal oligarchs. Having christianity as your state religion doesn't mean it will be a perfect theocracy obsessed in implementing its ideals.

Nietzsche said christianity was platonism for the masses. I'd say communism is just that but even less sustainable and more self-contradictory by the elites (who pretend they aren't elites) who try to implement. Possibly because unlike plato who just soght a perfect state, communists say they want the perfect human independent of the state. They're a weird brand of totalitarian anarchist.

Because I don't want the kind of civilization they're trying to restore.

Imperialism is how you build civilization

>tfw when you revive a dying thread by Legion shitposting and triggering >>>/leftypol/ NCRdrones

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that's why he burned his best general and threw him off a cliff, he's incredibly petty

>ask House if he doesn't want to know what happened to Benny because the fact that he managed to get his hand on the chip might mean that he has some sort of edge
>House calls me a vengeful ape
Bro I was just askin...

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>Have a general who knows your not a God unlike your tribals
>Possibility of him spread the truth around, threatening your power
>He becomes a liability
>Also wanted new stock to become new head general, tribal stock, further ensuring your men's loyalty and boosting morale
>Replacing him would just piss him off and provoke him into spreading the truth that you're not a God
>He looses a battle
>Find an excuse to kill him
>Kill him
How is this petty? Its Hegelian Dialectics jk its common sense

>you can check native American tribes with their constant raiding and warfare to see what tribal life is like, pro tip: most of their men die a violent death
sounds pretty based

What do the light colors that arent influence mean?

>he didn’t come out the birthing matrix at 20
Yikes!

House's brainlet-led pointless stagnant exploitation < Legion's unsustainable conquest left irredeemable by Bethesda's deadlines < NCR's refusal to deviate from a broken system < Courier's robotic independence < Elijah's technocratic dictatorship of infinite abundance and absolute security

>map
So with the Divide being unpassable, the Legion just has to take the Mojave Outpost to cut off NCR from resupplying Vegas?

Its not 'impassible' its just the cost of moving through there would be so great, that if you managed to do it just to cut off the NCR supply lines it would be an extremely Pyrrhic victory

If legion were to strike the Mojave outpost, they would never be able to hold it as the NCR could concentrate forces to take it back. Maybe raid it and then turn that corridor into a legion trap. But if that was the legions goal they should have kept nipton alive/not burned as an operating base.

And that's why the Legion doesn't need to move through there.
It's unpassable so all the Legion has to do is move south through Nipton and strike at the Mojave outpost since it's the only road that connects NCR to Vegas.

Tribal raiding is extremely ritualized and isn't nearly as bloody as industrial wars.

Sad that sticking with House gives you an american duster instead of the casino duster

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Im guessing you accidentally responded to the user that explained the Pyrrhic-ness of moving through the divide? As he said nothing due to the viability of the Legion attacking the outpost.

>ask friend for his modlist
>bunch of questline mods from this someguy dude
>skeptical about it
>actually play them
>they're fucking kino
at least the bounties series is holy fuck

You're a dumbass. Modern weapons, as we know them, featured in Fallout 1 & 2. Play the first two before you whine about something like that -- Fallout definitely isn't set in a 1950's United States either.

>Divide is impossible to move supplies through
>Mojave outpost is the resupply corridor
I was imagining the strategy.

>>The Legion offered the Kings incorporation and mercy
And ended up enslaving them after they refused.

And the alternative was?

Hey.

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Elijah's cloud HOLOcaust**

I'm gonna start a new character, should I go unarmed or melee?

>not going House and playing both NCR and Legion to a pawn's end and eliminating them and their shitty plans for the future when the time is right

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Tell them to yield control of Freeside and just do their own business.

this but independent
>tfw idolized by both the legion and the ncr

You didn't nuke the beautiful Mojave at the end of Lonesome Road, did you?

Well that does it. After seeing both sides' arguments and concluding you are all faggots, I will go with Mr House in my next playthrough.

Their business was lording over Freeside though, telling them to yield would have propagated the same result with them attacking, asking them to become apart of the legion would have still meant they got to stay in freeside, although they'd have to get rid of their jackets. This is what ceaser offered and it is by far the better option.

Better dead than forced into a skirt.

What is the logical order to the the dlc in?

hh > dm > owb > lr?

>Wearing barbarian clothing
Barbarian

yes

That's how I did it the first time but desu I'd do anything to delay playing DM so I usually play OWB before that.

Dead Money --> Honest Hearts --> Old World Blues --> Lonesome Road

he would've been the best leader after caesar inevitably dies, Lanius is only interested in leading troops, not a state. Caesar killed the legion's future when he booted Graham

Graham would have shafted the legion the moment he had his religious epiphany.

>Implying Lanius rules alone
Lanius doesnt even give you you're quests after Caesar dies, its one of his advisers (I forget his name) and everyone also holds him in high regard as well as Lanius, its also heavily implied that Lanius takes advise from him, as he is clearly educated. You're just assuming Lanius just goes: "Fuck building an empire like Caesar wanted too like securing roads and building a new Rome out of Vegas, I will directly tell everyone else to stop these efforts so I can raid and pillage the NCR." He has an intelligence of 7 if you check his stats, he's not dumb, he just likes war. (Not a single point of luck, funnily enough.)

Should I get the Steam version or GOG one?

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what are you talking about, even the bloodbath of the 20th century was a walk in the park compared to a single generation's worth of life among the Yanomamo or the Jivaro, at least proportionally, with 50-60% of their men dying. The percentage of young Russian men who died durnig WW2 is nowhere near that.

yeah but after recieving that much power, it would be hard for anyone to not sperg out and try to take full control of the state, it's not like Lanius is even tempered. Hell, he could even get backstabbed by his own advisor, that's a very likely scenario with historical precedent.
Graham's religious practice would only be a minor setback, since he was very well seen by the Legion, and him being pretty charismatic, would convert them pretty fast

they're so tonally jarring I find it hard to return to them

>dude they were just following orders dude

I was always a fool
for my Johnny

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>buying games from euroshits who capitulate to whiny (((SJWs))) every chance they get
no

Doesn't really matter since unlike FO3 the steam version doesn't have gfwl.

kys

The House Duster is 200 times better than the generic 21 though.

If Steam version, install the 4gb patcher
better ram usage

this run is going to be so fucking comfy

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