Which developer do you think puts the most effort into their games and who has the biggest attention for details...

>RDR2 had dogshit gamepla-

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V is good too, R* games just age like finewine

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chapter 1 has multiple dialogue options and ways to proceed in missions. these features almost entirely disappear after chapter 1, only showing up a few times. it was really disappointing

i really dont know what people are smoking. RDR1 john controls worse than Arthur in every way possible. I feel like Yea Forums is some alternate dimension or something.

it's literally the reverse with RDR2 you fucking retard. Hell the game opens with a 3 hour linear section.

if only you can use reshade on gta online..

was it really?

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Oh my fucking God, why do you people have to be such a bunch of whiny bitches about everything Rockstar makes nowadays. Fucking joyless boomers who can't get over Vice City, I swear.

no, i dont know why that guy is bullshitting.

>RDR1 john controls worse than Arthur in every way possible.
I do not understand how someone can have this opinion. Compared to John, Arthur feels extremely sluggish, clunky, and delayed. I think 1 feels a lot better to control.

well i guess you're retarded

So what, you have no issue with chapter 1 letting you select multiple dialogue options, and letting you select different options in missions, and then the game hardly having this at all after that? I don't understand why your standards are so low, that you can just accept that. I was really expecting the entire game I would be able to select different dialogue, and I was expecting that in most missions I would get to have a choice about different ways to proceed in a shootout.

>Rockstar
The only really good game they've ever made was GTA2.

>So what, you have no issue with chapter 1 letting you select multiple dialogue options, and letting you select different options in missions, and then the game hardly having this at all after that? I don't understand why your standards are so low, that you can just accept that.

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Yea Forums is the only place where I see people actually defend the controls in 2. Everywhere else complains about them.

Lemmings is better.

I am confused as to how you think it's such a weird opinion. 2's controls have so much more input lag and lumbering animations and forced walking. You really expect everyone to prefer it over 1, which feels more responsive?

Well fuck. You got me there. I forgot who had made Lemmings.

no you're just bad

It has nothing to do with skill moron. Even if you are amazing, the input delay and slugishness feels like shit

>It has nothing to do with skill moron

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this
>interact with something in red dead 1
>tap button, teleport to action
>interact with something in red dead 2
>hold button, character shuffles around to activate animation, cant move for a few seconds if putting something on your horse

Yeah you're just ignoring how much more complex interaction in RDR2 is overall

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>greeting and antagonizing is new
youtube.com/watch?v=ZTRSeOxX80g
was in gta sa too

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the hold button shit is so bad. i dont get how people just brush it off, it makes the pace of the game so much more fragmented than it has to be, in an already slow game. its like the game is asking "do you want to do this?" for almost every single fucking action

Yeah, and it's fleshed out more in 2, cope

>complex interactions
>Arthur is polite
>Arthur is an ass
>Arthur commits a crime(robbery)

Wow, so many ways to interact with others.

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look at those goalposts go who knows where they'll land next!

i wasnt even talking about interacting with people in the first place, i meant like opening chests or skinning animals

almost every conversation goes fucking nowhere. i think the feature didnt even need to be included.

What other triple A action adventure open-world game even allows the MC to interact with any NPC to this kind of degree? Only RPGs, but RDR2 isn't an RPG, so the fact Rockstar went all the way into implementing something like this into a type of videogame genre that isn't well know for NPC interaction is an impressive feat. You fucking imbeciles don't even know how to use a scope of reference before you analyse anything.

okay but just removing it would make the game worse. I on the other hand think it helps to give the NPCs more soul and allows for gameplay moments like in my webm that contribute to the overall feel of why people like the game.

weed

Not only that, but the actual button for the input tends to be extremely variable depending on the interaction, for reasons I do not really understand. I don't get why most interactions (talking to a seller, skinning an animal, opening cabinets going to sleep, etc.) couldnt all just be mapped to the x button. Why not? Instead you basically always have to look at the bottom right corner of your screen for every input. Its just stupidly convoluted button mapping.

RDR2 isn't an RPG, you don't need to have every single goddamn NPC you interact with giving you a side-quest in order to justify its existence. Sometimes its just nice to be able to interact with NPCs in order to feel like you are in a real tangible world, not in a theater play.

It sucks, it feels so fucking shallow how interacting with almost any NPC just gives canned dialogue. They shouldnt include it if its not well implemented and feels almost totally useless after doing it a few times.

>open wardrobe in singleplayer
>triangle
>open wardrobe in online
>square

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>RDR1 john controls worse than Arthur in every way possible.
Imagine being this fucking delusional. 2 is clunky as shit.

RDR2 feels even more like a theater play than other games because the conversations actually feel more artificial and repetitive. It doesn't add to the illusion of a real world, it destroys it and makes it feel more robotic

Probably because the interaction system is too complicated to work that way hurr

i actually played through rdr1 one year before 2 came out. I have no nostalgia for it. What I stated is objective fact. I don't give a fuck about your rose tinted glasses.

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Why?
>X to talk to sellers/clerks, skin animals, sleep in a bed, open the outfit menu, open drawers, loot bodies
>square to pick up or put down items

Explain how this wouldnt work for almost everything in the game

still looks tighter and more responsive than 2...I dont get what you are trying to prove. Are you seriously claiming moving around in 2 doesn't feel significantly more awkward and fumbly?

Its a "ilusion" of a real tangible world for Christ sake, of course its gonna feel repetitive after you spam that dialogue buttom a hundred times. My God, listen to yourselves and think about what yor asking. Theres so much that even a triple A studio can do before the player goes all of its way in order to break the ilusion a gameits trying to convey. Do you expect Rockstar to write how much lines of dialogue and record how many hours of voice acting in order to not feel repetitive anymore to you?.

what the fuck is this clip supposed to show?

No, they shouldnt have even made the option in the first place

In case you're wondering why these threads are infested with rabid fanboys its because their general died months ago and they are still seething about it.

Because sometimes X is used in different contexts, it's not hard.

lol cope

...X should be used for most contexts. Its called a "context sensitive button"

So you'd rather they remove a very promissing feature of the game instead of try to build on top of it taking in all the criticism players have with it in order to make said feature more refined and polished in their next game? Dear Lord, I'm glad you people are not game designers.

why? Because you're shit at video games?

Why make something more complicated than it has to be? The button mapping in this game is just retarded

>I'm such a fucking retard I missed the ladder so that means the game has bad controls.
Fuck this shit thread I'm going to eat dinner.

If it doesnt work in the game, it shouldnt be in the game. I dont give a shit about its future prospects. Each game is its own thing

They will follow the Valve route. GTA 6 Wil be the last of the serie.

Fuck no, I may have shit on it earlier for a lack of variety, but that's the only issue I have with it.

not him but i see no problem with having it in the game, its shallow but it doesnt ruin the experience. arguing about that instead of actual flaws is dumb

If it doesn't work in the game, you make it work in the next one, only in the last case scenario you remove it entirely. This kind of backwards mentality that every single thing that doesn't work must be purged off the game its half the reason triple A games are being streamlined by the hundreds.

The only things I really dislike about RDR2

>choices
>no animals in trees
>strict guidelines

>choices
I enjoy that choices were introduced in GTA era games, but I dislike how most of the choices don't matter. Let this guy live or kill him - doesn't matter.
>animals in trees
No squirrels or birds are ever in trees. Always on the ground. Not a big gripe, but something Ive noticed.
>missions
Have to do everything straight the way the game wants you to.

The choices frustrate me the most. Letting the guy fall off the cliff or picking him up has no change except for honor.

Can't believe no one posted this. This website just isn't the same anymore.

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Half of their games have been incomplete and or poorly optimized.

>attention for details
>still can't figure out character movement

Based

Not only can they not figure it out, but they are actually getting worse.

Pro tip: none of them were ever good, you were just young

thanks for the giggle

To be fair, DaS was incompletely BECAUSE they put too much detail in the first half of the game.
youtu.be/CjmTL39l9fM?t=77

>What is, "Literally anything Bethesda"?
Seriously. Even if their story and writing is mostly shit, they get the world interaction right.

You haven't shown why RDR2's layout is overcomplicated to begin with. You're so deluded you're attacking the game with circular logic

t. joyless

except NPC interaction in Beth games is just dialogue trees

It’s a shame, really.

theres no reason why the inputs for the interactions need to be so variable. you still have not explained why this would not work

>Because you're shit at video games?
Why is this always the go-to defense of RDR2 fanboys? Do you think a fucking button prompt to execute a basic action/animation is hard, and that's the reason people are complaining about it? I understood what the other guy meant with no problems.

I don't understand why the simplest criticism has to be met with attacks on a person's competence and basic understanding other than blind fanboyism. There's always one of you shitheels in these threads (maybe it's even the same autist).

No, onus is on you to prove your argument that it is unnecessary, first. I'm sure the accolades are enough argument for why they would be included.

Why are you always posting the same tired complaints? It isn't that you find the game hard to control, no you can't be wrong it's Rockstar that's shit!

That was their downfall, fool. It all went downhill after VCS/Bully. SA was the peak.

>This is the best they can do 14 years later with next gen hardware.
I'm sorry kid, You don't know any better.

whatever helps you cope

>No, onus is on you to prove your argument that it is unnecessary, first.
I did that. I showed how virtually all the interactions could be done with X and picking up could be done with square. Thus showing how the extremely variable inputs are unnecessary. There is no reason why skinning and opening cabinets need to be different buttons. No reason why there are different buttons for "buy" and "sell" at a seller (or "bath" and "room") when it would be better to just press X to open up a buy and sell menu like basically every other game. Other games like Witcher 3 and Skyrim have one button for virtually every interaction and it works far better and more intuitive. The extremely variable input in RDR2 is 100% unnecessary.

Its dumb of you to bring up accolades because many reviews actually do point out the clunky control scheme

>I showed how virtually all the interactions could be done with X and picking up could be done with square.
Lets see your design document

8 years in development.

>Witcher 3 and Skyrim

lol obsessed

And you have no argument against it other than that you don't like it ;)

>Lets see your design document

Refer to this post. . I see no reason why it wouldn't work.

wow that's like a tiny fraction of the interaction scenarios the game offers, great job

Directional pad to interact with generic NPCs,
X to talk to merchants, skin animals, sleep, open the outfit menu, open drawers, loot bodies
Square to pick up or put down items

why does it need 3 buttons instead of 1
the bumpers already swap through interaction options

almost any interaction you can think of aside from greet/antagonize NPCs could be done with the X button. Can you name one where this wouldn't be the case?

Let me put the hammer down little zoom. They accomplished more within 2 years for SA than they ever did in that 8 for RDR2. Not only did SA do it better, But it was during their pioneer years, They had little experience but made one of the greatest games of all time, In just two years (2) with shitty tech. What has RDR2 have to show for it's 8 years? Nothing we haven't seen before in SA. If you want we can dive into the shitty controls and glitches? Maybe the bad writing and mission design too? How about RDO?

But then you're completely changing how the NPC interaction works and now need to justify how you would improve upon it with that layout

You still haven't come up with something better.

it's funny if you have a very dark sense of humor. I just think it's shameful.

Looking Glass

Anything could be done with a single button, but it's about the number of systems and how they interact, not everything needs to play like a shallow Ubisoft abortion

R* is just autistic, they are extremely particular about certain details while ignoring other aspects and having really bizarre design decisions.

Based retard

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>game is bad objectively because it doesn't pander to my particular criteria

You sound like the autistic

>hard
There's that word again. I don't think you know what it means.

Speechless.

So you have no argument against the controls other than "its shit" and trying to pass that off as objective criticism lol I think we're done here

Oh you mean the detail of online interactions being destroyed by an oversight? Wow that sure is autistic

Yeah I'm sure speech is hard for you. RDR2 has tons of shit that SA doesn't, but you strike me as the kind of retard who would say RDR2 is derivative of SA because they both have physics systems or some shit

Playing gtao2 is pretty autistic

I'm saying "hard" was never part of the equation, you retard.

>muh objective criticism
Ah, so you ARE the same faggot who posts on these threads rabidly defending this game. I shudder to think there's more than one of you chucklefucks spouting the same line.

>RDR2 has tons of shit that SA doesn't
Care to name some? Animals and weapon degradation? Is that it? Pathetic.

Only because you keep posting the same easily btfoable bullshit in every thread. You don't get a free pass to be a faggot

>heh... Doesn't count kiddo

You are rediculous

>go to a bar
>hold L2 to open options with the bartender
>triangle button is to order drinks and square is for food. if the bar also offers lodging, that is circle
>press square. now you hold triangle to get one meal or square to get the other, or press circle to go back to the drinks/food options
How is this not completely fucking retarded? any other game you would just press A once to open a menu for what you can buy and then easily select it. in RDR2 you have to look at the bottom right for the prompts for everything you do. There's so many dumb examples like this, like how when you sleep there are different buttons for how long you want to sleep. it actually makes the game less immersive because your eyes always go to that corner.

>Anything could be done with a single button, but it's about the number of systems and how they interact, not everything needs to play like a shallow Ubisoft abortio
Even with the systems in RDR2, almost everything could still be done with the X button. You are not really making any point here.

Lmao, That's all you have isn't it? You can't even refute it. i'll give you those measly two features, Any more?
For every feature RDR2 has SA has two more.

>any other game you would just press A once to open a menu for what you can buy and then easily select it
Newsflash, you can do this in RDR2 as well

Prove it if you're so sure

Yeah I don't have any response to illogical autism

>I get to be irrational and incapable of following a conversation because I'm butthurt
Are you fucking stupid? I'm not even the guy who posted the original complaint. I said I understood what he meant, and that your argument about it being "hard" doesn't have fuck all to do with anything.

uhh what? I never said GTA was bad, and I never said my opinions were objective. I really enjoy the GTA games, but I would say most people can agree that R* makes some really bizarre design decisions (horrible matchmaking, the inability to sell free cars, bad sport system is horribly designed and implemented, the new casino car not including insurance, the instant spawns for Oppressor while your mechanic takes forever and can't come to you unless you are a half mile away from your personal vehicle, one person leaving a heist resets the whole thing, frequent random bugs and glitches, passive popping and abuse for years, hats work fine in singleplayer but are still consistently bugged years later online, etc.)

What are you on here buddy?

You’re a retard holy shit. HAHAHA

I know it's hard to wrap your underdeveloped brain around, But SA is simply superior. You would know if you were alive in 04, Little guy

Okay well you wasted your time defending a stupid point

>playing r* games for the official online

Peak zoom

>I can't prove my point so ur dumb lol

Ebic

My posts had more to do with calling you out on your bullshit argument about difficulty.

Projection won't help you now, You made an ass of yourself, Take the L and sit down.

Well if it isn't too hard for him to wrap his head around then what is the issue with the controls?

Easily Rockstar. They set the standard

I accept your concession. There are ways to critique a game without being a faggot about it you know.

I mean there is nothing really else like GTAO. I don't play it that often because it does get a bit grindy but it's definitely a fun and unique game.

user, stop giving bitter and jaded people the ability to affect you, you'll be a lot happier that way. That's advice coming from a happy Boomer

This looks terrible though. The ai is so retarded.

>this thread
ive never seen anyone as retarded as rockstar fanboys

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Sorry i hurt your feelings, Kid

any dev that has more people working on a game then a small team automatically disqualifies if you ask me.
And that's not even talking about the fact how lots of devs outsource nowadays.

;)

Do you have brain damage?

Something can simply be contrived or tedious. Example: grinding in games. Complaining about such things doesn't mean people are saying it's too "hard" for them. Do you genuinely believe that's the only reason to ever dislike something? I can't believe I have to actually ask this question.

a rooty-tooty point and shooty.

for having such an "alive" world, all you could do with nps was respond positively or negatively, or bump into them. sure if looks really good doing missions where everything is scripted for you, but beyond that theres not much except sprinting around shooting shit, collecting mario coins.

This one Rockstar shill also saves every single reference of Japanese developers talking about Rockstar and thinks everyone who doesn't like RDR2 is a zoomer.
It's a very sad case of schizophrenia affecting our youth.

Yes but you need to provide arguments for your points. Throwing up your hands and declaring "its too tedious" without further thought suggests you just couldn't do it

Yeah, it is the best random NPC interaction in any open world game to date

Nope that's a different guy, I just post 4k pictures and blurry webms

What about the plays, or the hunting, or the hidden Easter eggs, or side missions, or little random events people have found? How is the game being a shooter equal a detriment in your mind?

It looks pretty good in my webm were some random guy gets his head blown off just because in an unscripted interaction too

all of those except hunting are a one time thing
cool the first time but meh if you see them again

Those don't count

It really surprised me how fleshed out the shooty in RDR2 actually was. Can't wait to do fpb kbm

lol cope

If the fags at R* really want a "Living, Breathing world." They should let real AI handle it, Scripted events are the opposite of real, But no, Shiny graffix sells better

Okay retard

>They should let real AI handle it
is there an example of this?

Pass it on to your boss, Shill.

Says the neet, crying in his 5th thread today...

t. Bootlicker

rdr2 is the opposite of a living breathing world. it feels extremely staged, like a theme park.

>le rockstar of david
Fuck off nigger. GTA V single player is barebones. They don't even let you buy houses for fucks sake. Wow how much care

No it doesn't

I'm not sure, AI is still new. I always figured game devs could of helped refine it, But they put effort elsewhere. NPC AI is very dated

>What about the plays
what?
>or the hunting
follow the waypoint and point and shooty
>hidden Easter eggs
but none worth mentioning?
>or little random events people have found
ingame cutscenes?

theres a reason no one talks about it anymore

you pointed and clicked. and if you are just talking about the physics, yeah they are fine. but all three of those npcs just walked into a door (headfirst) crouch walking to their pre-programmed destination, not bothering to even look in your direction.
its like a marvel movie, looks good, but the fight scenes suck and sometimes dont make sense

Yeah, look at your posts

No need to get salty, Dan. AI could write a better story than you

Not the webm in talking about, the one where I got to fuck around with an NPC to the point some guy blew his head off

lol RDR2 is one of the best stories in vidya

yes it does
exactly what i was thinking

>Throwing up your hands and declaring "its too tedious" without further thought suggests you just couldn't do it
No, it doesn't. Are you fucking insane? This is never anyone's first thought. Pressing buttons that show up on the screen is the bare minimum to be able to play any game. A person couldn't even write or read if they aren't capable of that.

I know this is Yea Forums and asking for the bare minimum of intellectual charitability is fucking gay, but you're actually making yourself look like a retard for making that extremely absurd assumption.

lol cope

Ok, Sure.

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I accept your concession

No way, Are you the same kid i btfo earlier? SA is the superior game, Pleb

Quantic Dream is unironically the best when it comes to effort and detail.

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Is it?

ye

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why?

>Lets all run through the chokepoint!"
This is why we need better AI.

Your post makes no sense, what else do you expect the AI to do given what the engine is capable of?

open door, shoot through windows
realisticly i dont think ai will ever be good

they do shoot through windows

birds are always in trees, just it's almost always the small birds like cardinals. They fly away (usually through other trees so you miss them) when you get within 200m, it's just the aggro distance that's fucked more than anything

this

is retarded

Same problem persists in all their games, If it was GTA i would expect a SWAT team using tactics, In RDR at the very least try surround the building shoot through the windows, Try to draw you out. Or lob a cocktail in there for extreme measures, Running in one by one is just foolish,
You ever see that pic of the corpses piled up in saint denis bar? That's a good example.

>webm
made me fucking mad

amazing insight

anyone who says rdr1 has better controls is a total moron with nostalgia goggles too tight. look at how john can't even turn around in a straight line even when moving the analog back and forth. It looks really awkward, while in rdr2 arthur has much more smooth directional turning

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Thanks, user.

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Holy shit I forgot how fucking terrible rock shit fanboys. Worse than the gay station nation and nin tendrones combined

God damn you a fucking pathetic

they only sit on signposts

Here is my pick.

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