Who was the better buttmad loser?

How can you be on Yea Forums and not know the face of "villains who did nothing wrong"

Keep his initial characterization, no stupid tweests. He actually believes the things he says.
Have him and the Phantom Thieves come to an understanding/compromise.

Wait, nevermind, I'm just dyslexic or something.
He's daddy problems the character

Adachi murdered 2 people

The jews murdered millions more, your point?

Adachi did nothing wrong

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murder is not okay no matter what your motivation is

Wrong, the tv did it

Adachi
Based incel villain from the best game in the series

When are we going to get a Persona 5 Arena where both Adachi and Naoto berate and belittle Akechi

Adachi was the more straight up murderer, Akechi "cheated" by killing the shadows

>Make good points on how the PT should not brainwashed people into submission
>No lol just kidding I'm the culprit and assassin who makes everyone berserk
This is the last time I put my faith into Atlus storywriting and characterization. Fuck them all.

Probably never. Seems P5R want him to redeem himself.

How old was Akechi when he killed Wakaba?

>Protagonists kill thousands of Shadows
>Adachi is the villain

You're a shitposting retard if you think his points where good even when the game already proved it wrong.

>Make good points
haha no.

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How did the game prove it wrong? If anything the end-game twist actually paints the Phantom Thieves in a worse light because their targets just became docile and open to control from the villain.

>BRAINWASHING INTO DOCILE GOOD
Kys

I can't be the only person that legitimately likes Akechi

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>How did the game prove it wrong?
The cast were put in situations were the only safe way to get out of it was to change the targets heart. please play the game user.

I like him as a party member, a lot.
Story-wise he's dogshit.

nah i think you're dogshit

For what reasons?
If you're a fujo then kill yourself.

>please play the game user
You clearly didn't.
Kamoshida was the only one targeted out of self-interest. Futaba also had a personal connection though she technically wasn't part of the group at that point. Everyone else was sought after in order to raise the PT's profile and/or deliver "justice", it wasn't self-defense.

This, I couldn't give two shits about his edgy speech but he was a lot of fun while he was in the party.
I'm excited to see what they'll do for him in Royal since they seem to be adding a lot more interactions within the cast.

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Didn't he try to statutory the first girl?

P5's plot was already full of BS imo. The whole twist of Akechi killing a cognitive Joker made 0 sense since the guard shadow took a convenient amount of time to die, it implies the Phantom Thieves should be able to leave the metaverse whenever/wherever they want which undermines all of the escape sequences and there's no way Akechi wouldn't have been able to tell he's just entered the metaverse when he's a seasoned veteran of the metaverse.

Not to mention, who the fuck captured Joker in the first place? Was in police that were let into the metaverse? Was it shadows who took him into custody just for someone like Ahechi to say "oh yeah, we caught the Phantom Thieves and no one involved in the capture wants to be talked to or referenced so please don't look into it"

your opinion is shit especially when the game spent an hour explaining the entire twist.

It's clear they came up with a tweest later on and then had to bend the story around it to make it work.

The only that's clear is you being a retard

adachi is a much better character than akechi but that’s mostly because persona 5 is woefully undercooked. and considering a lot of what makes adachi great comes from golden and shit like ultimax. i think we gotta give goro more time to cook. adachi will still probably come out on top but it’s not really a fair fight right now, is it?

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>when the game spent an hour explaining the entire twist.
They touched on none of the inconsistencies between how the metaverse worked in this particular instance.
Here's another one for you - why is it that when every palace owner completely remodels the entire place with even Sae turned the courthouse into a Casino with even the backrooms being graffiti but it just so happens that her cognition has that hallway and interrogation room is exactly the same as the real world complete with a detention center guard when Sae's cognition even changed the courthouse employees to casino workers?

Only a single place is changed.
The source of Sae's distortion is the courthouse, everything else remains the same.

OP, most definitely

around 13-14.

>Akechi
>loser

Adachi is not a Jew.

Me, cause you just spoiled the game for me you fucking cunt. Aaaaaaagggghhhhhh!!!!

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Yeah, he lost hard

>the guard shadow took a convenient amount of time to die
This is the only actual inconsistency.

> it implies the Phantom Thieves should be able to leave the metaverse whenever/wherever they want
>there's no way Akechi wouldn't have been able to tell he's just entered the metaverse
>who the fuck captured Joker in the first place?
> that hallway and interrogation room is exactly the same as the real world complete with a detention center guard
All of these are explained, play the fucking game without skipping through dialogue.

you must be a brainlet because its super fucking obvious that "le master detective" is the traitor

The only thing Adachi did wrong was fuck with Yu personally by attacking his friends, otherwise he was in the right

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Adachi was /ourguy/.
Akechi's a fucking bitch with daddy issues. Can't even die right if speculation about royal is true.

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What was the point of capturing Joker in the Metaverse anyway? Akechi could have just told them where Joker lives.

>This is the only actual inconsistency.
It isn't, even. The only reason why Kamoshida's cognition of Anne dissipated instantly was because the dude's shadow openly admitted that was merely an imitation, and he even had the real Anne right in front of him, so it didn't behave anything like a normal person in an area with no distortions. The anime even kept that detail.

In a place with no distortions, everything is pretty much exactly the same way that it is in how the palace owner perceives reality. The only thing that would affect that landscape under any circumstance is the palace owner. In Sae's mind, there is a real Joker in the interrogation room, a real guard is standing outside it, you shoot them, they bleed, etc, and nothing would change that perception until she perceived them elsewhere. This is the same principle by which the PTs had to nab Akechi's cognition and tie him up in the middle of the operation after Futaba confirmed that they had crossed paths, and why he wasn't very strong, because Sae didn't know about his Persona user abilities or anything like that.

We don't even actually see the two cognitions he shot disappear from the palace at all, in the anime cutscene all you see is the transition from the palace interrogation room to the real world interrogation room. We know this because when the two cognitions fade out you see the real Joker sitting there. Makes 0 sense if that was supposed to represent the cognitions literally disappearing from the room in the palace.

The closest thing to an inconsistency with the interrogation room is the confidant rank up, but there was still precedent for palaces bleeding into reality at random moments earlier in the game, so they can get away with it.

They wouldn't arrest him in the real world without evidence. Catching the Phantom Thief red-handed right in front of them is a completely different story.

>The closest thing to an inconsistency with the interrogation room is the confidant rank up
Not even this is an inconsistency because confidants are about give-and-take relationships, not just social bonds like the previous two games were. The interrogation room scene served the purposes of both Akechi and Joker in that both believed their plans were succeeding, therefore it ranked up.

>They wouldn't arrest him in the real world without evidence.
What evidence do they have in the Metaverse?

Had to capture him in the middle of what the cops described after the fact as a bizarre phenomenon for anyone not part of Shido's game of telephone to be on board with arresting him, which was instrumental to how Joker's capture and death needs to play politically. When you have the testimony of two dozen officers you can do that.

It's why after that happens they force their way into the shop and bring Sojiro in no problem.

Seeing a masked phantom thief bust through a casino window while holding a suitcase full of something he presumably stole, right in front of them? Keep in mind they just need to arrest him for the plan to succeed since Goro was always supposed to murder him and fake the suicide in the interrogation room, but they needed to have enough justification to get him down into that interrogation room to begin with.

>When you have the testimony of two dozen officers you can do that.
More like 200 officers going: "We captured this guy wearing costume jumping out of this magic casino right next to our station. Instead of directly taking him to the station right there we had to leave at this very specific place when his costume magically turned into a school uniform." Seems credible.
>Seeing a masked phantom thief bust through a casino window while holding a suitcase full of something he presumably stole, right in front of them?
A casino that doesn't exist in Tokyo holding nothing (Ryuji had the case if I remember correctly) is somehow related to Sae possibly being attacked. Okay.
>Keep in mind they just need to arrest him for the plan to succeed
With Goro's connections that wouldn't require exposing hundreds of policemen to magic.

user, you're acting under an already predetermined line of thinking on your part ("This is unexplained/inconsistent/stupid") which is causing you to unreasonably reject all explanations instead of just going with what sounds reasonable. The whole plan is to publicly let the PTs take the fall so that Shido's credibility is built up. Which sounds more reasonable on the news: "Police raided a cafe and arrested a random high schooler whom they say is the leader of the Phantom Thieves, please trust us, honest" or "Police capture the leader of the Phantom Thieves red-handed in a daring attempted robbery near the federal courthouse"? Don't try and force yourself into mental backflips trying to go "yeah, but" because all they needed to do was create a story that sounded plausible to the average person.

>With Goro's connections that wouldn't require exposing hundreds of policemen to magic.
You can't arrest the leader of the PTs in a way that anyone not part of the conspiracy will subscribe to WITHOUT the presence of some kind of unexplainable trick, especially not after how Okumura died. I mean there was even an entire section of the game after that happened where you were just going to school and listening to teachers lecture about how people fear things they don't understand. There being a conspiracy doesn't mean that conspiracy is somehow all powerful and can just make things happen. Remember the guy that had to fill out Joker's papers confirming that his death was a suicide? The guy he reported to wasn't even in on it.

>all they needed to do was create a story that sounded plausible to the average person
So make something up. There would be zero fucking proof for the story anyway. With Goro's plan you risk Joker getting away by just using his phone and leaving prematurely while exposing an unreasonable amount of officers to the existence of the Metaverse.

>by just using his phone and leaving prematurely
You can't do that.

So how do you get out?

>With Goro's plan you risk Joker getting away by just using his phone and leaving prematurely
Play the game retard

You have to go to the same place where you got in. You can't just leave from anywhere.

The fact that Ann and Yusuke got out of the Museum begs to differ.

You can still take people in and out with you, but since the PTs all entered at the same spot and Joker was running off by himself there was no risk of him prematurely leaving; he had to get to the exit point.

Imagine being able to look up any of the game's cutscenes on YouTube, including the fucking hour long series of cutscenes that they wrote specifically for people too retarded to understand without it being spelled out to you, at any time, literally right now even, and instead of actually doing this you spout bullshit that's obviously factually wrong.

>So make something up. There would be zero fucking proof for the story anyway.
Do you have any idea how dumb this sounds? Whether or not Goro has physical proof of what happened is no longer an issue when a bunch of officers of the law can corroborate your claims. After this happens, law enforcement has no problem issuing a public statement claiming that they arrested the leader of the PTs. You have 0 issues convincing any of your peers that you arrested the right guy. Then it follows that there's also 0 issues with the same people putting out a statement about how he killed himself later on.

>With Goro's plan you risk Joker getting away by just using his phone and leaving prematurely
And that also makes no sense, since Goro knows where Joker enters the palace from. Worst case scenario they could just stake out the entry point making it physically impossible for him to ever leave, and Goro can just funnel fucking food/water in and shit/piss out using the nav app.

Lots of people really don't like to read and retain a lot, especially fans of jrpgs. Just compare P3 to P5 - there's as much story content in the entirety of P3 as there is in P5 leading up to but not including Kaneshiro's dungeon. It's not coincidence that the people that seethe about P5 eternally will turn around and call P3 a masterpiece.

>fans of jrpgs
>don't like to read and retain a lot
Then they're not fans of JRPGs obviously.

Possible I guess, but only because the Metaverse rules are so ill-defined. I guess Goro also didn't know that the Palace should collapse and they could escape the Metaverse that way

>when a bunch of officers of the law can corroborate your claims
Or have the "genius" boy detective and the SIU director claim the same without going through all that trouble.
>Worst case scenario they could just stake out the entry point
I mean they could have and captured them all. Would have required less police force too.

Reminder that anyone who says “Goro” is a tranny fujo from /pg/.

>"Some people are born with a little thing called 'talent'."
Adachi was right.

Adachi was an edgy incel, but he was one of the most refreshing JRPG antagonists out there. His 'justification' was the only shitty part about him. He would have been even better if, in a series where they always try to make their game reflect societal issues, he was just a guy completely aware and satisfied with his shittiness.

I thought Persona 4 was rubbish in comparison, but Adachi really came through as a superior villain to Akechi.

The Metaverse rules are defined as well as they need to be, provided you're paying attention, which you clearly aren't. Hell, you obviously haven't played the game at all considering literally every single palace has a big "we're going to die if we don't get out now!" scene as the palace is collapsing while they rush to the entry/exit point, with the only exception being Madarame's because the boss fight happened outside of the museum near where they entered.

>PT are brain washing hur dur
They aren't though, they're basically just making it so they don't have fucked desires by stealing their treasures, they technically don't even need to beat the shadow to do, the shadow just so happens to always get in the way

>Yea Forums venerates an incel
What a surprise

even Sakurai likes him

The idea that the PTs are brainwashing is a very uniquely western idea, primarily American. In Japan it's seen as simply removing an impurity so the person's conscience can come back. Morgana outright explains it that way.

>The Metaverse rules are defined as well as they need to be, provided you're paying attention.
They are mostly defined after they have any relevance to the plot.
>while they rush to the entry/exit point
And they almost never reach it and somehow are still abler to leave the Metaverse, just at wildly different locations. They rush to their exit as 1) it's not inside a collapsing palace 2) they know where they will end up at, but that doesn't really indicate that they can only leave at the same place where they went in.

>And they almost never reach it
They reach it all the time.

>that doesn't really indicate that they can only leave at the same place where they went in.
Play the fucking game for fuck sake

>They reach it all the time.
Bank, Pyramid and Ship have cases where the whole team or team members don't exit the same place they entered.
>Play the fucking game for fuck sake
Morgana can enter and leave the Metaverse whenever. Ann and Yusuke didn't need to leave through the same point they came in.

>Bank, Pyramid and Ship have cases where the whole team or team members don't exit the same place they entered.
Objectively wrong in all cases, play the game.

>Bank: they fall out of the sky onto a busy street crossing
>Pyramid: the enter in front of Futaba's room exit directly outside Leblanc
>Ship: Ryuji ends up away from the rest of the team

>>Bank: they fall out of the sky onto a busy street crossing
Are you seriously stupid enough that you don't understand what gravity is? It makes things go down toward the ground. In this case, toward the entry point which is in cognitive Shibuya.

>>Pyramid: the enter in front of Futaba's room exit directly outside Leblanc
You don't see them enter in front of Futaba's room, and in fact they drive in from the desert like they always do which indicates they entered at the same spot.

>>Ship: Ryuji ends up away from the rest of the team
Momentum from the explosion. Only contrived in that the explosion conveniently pushed him out the exit, but it doesn't violate the rules.

tl;dr play the fucking game

It's interesting how thoroughly Yea Forums fails to describe what happened in the story of P5, even compared to a lot of other jrpgs. Maybe it's just P5's popularity factor that clouds its judgment.

>Are you seriously stupid enough that you don't understand what gravity is?
You are missing the point, the street crossing isn't the place they entered.
>You don't see them enter in front of Futaba's room
>youtu.be/tnCFZmD0Bdg?t=4874
Maybe you should play the game.
>Momentum from the explosion.
Enough momentum to blast this guy several feet without leaving any damage.

It's because people literally do not play the game and rely on fifth-hand recitations from other people who have watched shitty Let's Plays done by retards, then proclaim themselves to be experts on the subject. Like just look at how many obviously wrong things there are in this very thread, I'm not even talking about things that are ambiguous or headcanon, but things that are literally explained clearly in the fucking game that people get wrong. Why? Because they didn't play the fucking game.

>>youtu.be/tnCFZmD0Bdg?t=4874
That's only the first time they enter genius, and notice how Morgana tells them not to fucking do that again because they can't tell where the fuck they'll end up if they try to enter a palace inside the area that's being warped, in this case Sojiro's house. That's why they enter from outside the house in future instances.

>they can't tell where the fuck they'll end up if they try to enter a palace inside the area that's being warped, in this case Sojiro's house. That's why they enter from outside the house in future instances.
Nice headcanon. He only complains about Ryuji not being cautious enough. There is no indication that they don't enter her palace from the same place again.

Adachi is the better character for showing degrees of maturity and astute sense of his position in the world. It took Golden and Ultimax to get him to this point though so it might not be a fair comparison to Akechi

Fucking these. Akechi actually had strong points that gave him high moral ground over the PTs and their hypocrisy. By making him the villain, the writers took the easy, cheap way out.

Akechi is barely a villan, more like a shitty plot tool to make Shido look even worse. Game would've been better if Akechi wasn't a thing at all, you were allowed to kill him yourself or he got a redemption and came back to the party, the way it happends in the game is fucking retarded.

He's also a massive homo faggot and thirsts for Joker's penis

His description of how the world works was accurate, but he wasn't in the right because he was just bitching and moaning instead of learning how to cope.

Now if you were referring to the OP image, then yes, he is literally in the right.

>The fall killed them, not the guy who pushed them off the cliff.

He wasn't even THE villain, Shido was. They squandered Akechi's detective potential by making his success a sham, made him Shido's hitman, and then got him to backpedal immediately upon defeat by making it clear he regretted that turn of events all along.

>His description of how the world works was accurate, but he wasn't in the right because he was just bitching and moaning instead of learning how to cope.
Yep. Adachi's redpilledness is diminished by how much of a whiny bitch he was. It'd be better if he was just going through the motions without trying to justify why he did anything. Ultimax Adachi is best because he's through and matured with all that shit and wants to do his time like an adult of the world.

>Akechi actually had strong points that gave him high moral ground over the PTs and their hypocrisy
Being le enlightened centrist is not the high moral ground. The bad guys were being colossal assholes, the PTs were stopping them and fixing things, Akechi was just wagging his finger going "but you're not doing it the right way!" which is the moral equivalent of sucking your own cock.

Adachi is a lot better because he is essentially a dark reflection of a Japanese worker.

>Being le enlightened centrist is not the high moral ground. The bad guys were being colossal assholes, the PTs were stopping them and fixing things, Akechi was just wagging his finger going "but you're not doing it the right way!" which is the moral equivalent of sucking your own cock.
Okay, fedora tipper. The problem with the PTs methods was that they were literally brainwashing their targets, a method that was always questionable. Giving that kind of power to isolated groups is a fucking awful idea. As shown by how mid-game, the PTs start acting like fucking cunts trying to rise in popularity and get the biggest score they can. It's a classic case of power corruption and it did corrupt and that's why the PTs were taken advantage of. It's asinine to look solely at the results and ignore the dangerous procedure.

>The problem with the PTs methods was that they were literally brainwashing their targets
Objectively wrong, stop inserting your American headcanon onto a Japanese game.

>As shown by how mid-game, the PTs start acting like fucking cunts trying to rise in popularity and get the biggest score they can.
And they dealt with that internally without Akechi's bullshit.

>by how mid-game, the PTs start acting like fucking cunts trying to rise in popularity and get the biggest score they can
Really? They hesitate against Okumura especially because it's only about the popularity. Haru is the reason why they finally decided to make him the next target.

>Can't even die right if speculation about royal is true.
They're gonna bring him back? How?

Given that the people they were brainwashing were committing actual felonies, I think forcing them to realize the severity of their own actions and confess to their crimes is a very humane way to deal with them. I mean you can make the whole Clockwork Orange argument that forced morality isn't actually moral, but they could have just as easily left them as vegetables, so at least they're leaving their targets the option of redeeming themselves. Hell, they could have just gone full Punisher, and the fact that they didn't is what gives them the moral high ground over Akechi.

Find out in Royal

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How do you know they just didn't steal his pants?

I think I kind of agree with this guy Akechi did have SOME point. Even if his argument was flawed, his character prior to his betrayal was much more interesting than most of the party imo. Except Futaba and, Yusuke maybe

For what purpose?

>Daddy problems(Male)
>Incel
They both suck

Trophy.

That girl Yosuke had a thing for? I thought he tried to really rape her, and pushed her through on accident when she resisted.

The first girl was Namatame's mistress, and that was an accident. The second girl was Yosuke's crush, and tossing her in was intentional. Adachi was legitimately the only person who took the "you will see your soulmate" part of the Midnight Channel rumor seriously, twice.

>even his fucking outfit is that faded beige
>does LE SIDELONG SNEER
>low-key plots to kill the older lawyer woman
Jesus shit

>Adachi was legitimately the only person who took the "you will see your soulmate" part of the Midnight Channel rumor seriously, twice.
I don't think that had anything to do with it, did it?

That was legitimately the whole point. That's the only reason why he went after the two girls, because they were on the Midnight Channel. The reason why he got mad was because he saw them associating with other men, when he thought they were supposed to be his soulmates.

literally it's the inverse, though. adachi was the one who got a redemption arc in ultimax.

akechi was a serviceable enough vidya villain, the kind you'd expect to see in a JRPG. adachi is an actual well-written character, though, and is much more of a threat.

adachi.

on a semi-related note, who else sat throuhj the english dub of Phantom Blood and couldn't think anything other than "why is Adachi fighting Dio?"

Are you sure? He was working the mistress's security detail, and he had to talk to Saki for the investigation into her death. The impression I got was that he was getting pushy from a mix of incel tears and wanting to abuse his authority as a cop. I don't think it was ever specifically said that he saw them on the midnight channel, and he would have heard about the mistress associating with other men through the original story.

Nah, he confirms it when they confront him the first time.

No, he doesn't. He says she had "caught his eye", he never says where it was from. With Saki, he knew he could push her in if he wanted to, so he tried to abuse his authority because he knew he could just throw her in without consequences if it didn't work out for him. The only time he mentions the midnight channel is when he says that it was the kind of fishy rumor you hear a million of as a policeman, but that he discovered the power to push people in all on his own.

>Adachi and Naoto tagteam
Why do I suddenly want this?

Mistress security detail was him talking to her to confirm the rumors about her affair being publicied on TV. He was a fan and she was highly flippant about it. To the point he got pissed and tv push happen.

Saki was a typical hateful cunt of a teenager and was belittling him from the get go. He let his anger get the better of him and tossed her in. she deserved it

Let's be honest, murder might be murder but if people are being that hateful you'd all push them into the TV as well. Far too many people get away with doing horrible shit and don't get punished for it.

user, why the fuck would he bring up the Midnight Channel rumor if it has nothing to do with anything? If she had caught his eye without the Midnight Channel being relevant then he would have no reason to even know that it existed, because the TV power would be given to him after he shook hands with Izanami-no-Petrol. He brought up the Midnight Channel rumor because it was relevant, because that's where he saw Yamano for the first time, same with Konishi.

>why the fuck would he bring up the Midnight Channel rumor if it has nothing to do with anything?
Watch the scene again. He's explaining how he discovered his power.

>If she had caught his eye without the Midnight Channel being relevant then he would have no reason to even know that it existed
Okay, let's just make this easier on both of us.

youtube.com/watch?v=uV4IMR0aWjs
Timestamp is 44:42.

>TV power would be given to him after he shook hands with Izanami-no-Petrol
She didn't actually TELL him about the power, genius. And the fact that she was the one spreading the rumor in the first place wasn't common knowledge.

>He brought up the Midnight Channel rumor because it was relevant, because that's where he saw Yamano for the first time
She was locally famous as a reporter in the town she was posted. Where are you getting the idea that this was the first time he saw her?

>same with Konishi
Okay, now you're just being stupid.

>Watch the scene again. He's explaining how he discovered his power.
user, the Midnight Channel rumor has jackshit to do with discovering the power itself. You don't get the power by watching the Midnight Channel. He could've been leaning against a TV and accidentally slipped in partly. He only brought it up because it was relevant to how he thought about the two girls.

Burden of proof is on you.

>shake hands with Petrol Mom
>receive power
Are you seriously trying to argue that's not in the game? It's literally the first series of cutscenes when you reach Inaba. The entire true end hinges on remembering this.

>Light
>Top of his class
>Son of the police chief
>Respected by everyone
>Loser

Akechi was better, he wasn't as big a fuck up and managed to kill more than one guy.

Right works better for the themes of P4 . He’s an antisocial man who worked hard because he thought that would make him happy and successful, but he ends up in the boonies all alone. He has no friends and thinks he’s entitled to something greater in life. He’s the anthesis to the theme of connecting to people. Which makes him the perfect foil to the MC while also being slight reflection to the audience of the game. The game devs are basically telling you to go out and make some friends