When? And what was the "secret project"? These devs are talking about exactly what I want from new cRPGs...

Skyrim has a whole lot of fucking nothing though. Underrail and Fallout 2 especially I’d say are pretty fucking large in scope but still have quality dense content. A crpg can’t afford to have swathes of forests and copy pasted ruins with just randomly generated shit in them, it just doesn’t work.

Speaking of cRPGs, is Kingmaker good yet?

Yes

>Skyrim has a whole lot of fucking nothing though
Yeah, welcome to every open world game ever.

All these new isometric games are too busy. I can't see shit on the screen.

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Still have to finish this gem. It's more of an action RPG but I think it fits the theme? The female barbarian is my favourite so far, she has some quirky and interesting dialogue too.
I'm all for sandbox, in cRPGs if that means more freedom eg. player choices. Things I would like to see in the future:
>more nonlinear storylines
>party management (ressources, psychological factors like: motivation, anxiety, etc;) maybe even settlement management if it fits the game theme
>crossovers with rogue-like gameplay elements could be fun, I'm thinking of need to sleep, eat, semi/perma wounds to the character, some procedural generated content
>co-op gameplay

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>actually being this much of a negative nancy

If everyone had your attitude we'd still stuck with horse & cart, everything can be expanded upon in new ways. Just because you personally don't like something doesn't mean it isn't good, but enjoy being stuck in the past with a jaded mindset if that's what you want, though.

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It's DnD rules, so no for me.

The only one I'm interested in right now is Disco Elysium and I'm perfectly prepared for it to be bad.

>If everyone had your attitude we'd still stuck with horse & cart
If everyone had your shitty attitude of "New and expanded = Good", we'd all have died from monorails by now.

>everything can be expanded upon in new ways
It certainly can, but when that reduces the quality, it shouldn't.

>Just because you personally don't like something doesn't mean it isn't good
Yeah, it does. Why would I give a shit what anyone else likes?

>but enjoy being stuck in the past with a jaded mindset if that's what you want, though.
I still hold out hope that people realizing the open world meme is garbage is within this industry's future

based

I'd like a more non-linear CRPG. Especially something mixed in settlement building elements. Imagine being able to build up your owned player-owned castle in BG2.

cRPG thread? cRPG thread.
I'm currently trying to play NWN with a wizard, but he completely sucks ass. This whole archaic system of "one spellcast per sitting on your ass" kinda puts me off that game, and also the fact that you can recruit only one henchman.
I have a slight suspicion, that this game was created and designed around the multiplayer.
In that case I have to ask some advice on how to git gud as a wizard in this game.
>inb4 just roll druid/cleric

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You gave money to beamdog so you should cast anhero on yourself, faggot dipshit

Turn-based > RTwP

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I want more turn-based combat systems, I can't get into RTwP no matter how many times I try.

Maybe something fun like urban fantasy with turn-based combat. Shadowrun was pretty fun.

There's an indie crpg builder survival game on steam but I can't remember it's name

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>Pillars of Eternity

yikes

>who needs a story or a villain when you can roam around the woods and ruins with 5 dipshits?

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ToEE is great

the revival is stupid because it shows that developers haven't learned anything in the last 20 years.

I'm currently enjoying PoE and you can't stop me, fag. Also, Kingmaker's morality choices are generally fucking shit.

The new Torment sucked, but Wasteland was good after they fixed it up a bit. How was Tyranny? I'm thinking about getting it

>barbarian
I think that class is even superior if you wanna go magic during the game, because of stat growth I think.

It's not about the system, but about the engagements.
A lot of JRPGs use turn-based combat and suck fucking balls.
Look at Pillars, for example: pretty much every encounter is the same: you just do the same shit all over again and again.
Then look at Into the Breach: each encounter is a puzzle and has a great impact on your run.
And then ther is Fallout Tactics: each enconter is governed with level and envitonment, you can effectively use ambushes, stealth and everything else.

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it forces you to go against the evil overlord you're allied with so it's annoyingly limiting

>even then, the villain is a fucking retard in the game
PoE writing fucking sucked.

Underrail is awesome and I'm hyped for the expansion. D:OS2 sucked balls though and thats where PC RPGs seem to be headed.

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besides pillars are there any other fantasy rpgs with guns?

>yet
That shit was good a while ago.

Look at this dude talkin bout Into The Breach, fucking based

>you can't stop me
I may only pity you, user. It could have been a great game (and it still has it's hights), but so many thing has gone wrong.

BG1 was the best "modern" CRPG and its a pretty sandbox-y game in that you can explore 90% of the map at your leisure. PoE is cancer by comparison.

"No!"

>take 20 minutes to fight a trash mob in tb
>same fight takes maybe 5 at best in rtwp
Yeah, no.

Did you play Div:OS2?
Dragon age:Origins is good too

Hogs of war was the shit

>filtering
Deadfire has some of the worst writing and companions of any Western game, it's Dragon Age 2 tier, maybe worse. Mass Effect 3 has more likeable companions than Deadfire, and I'm still seething over how shit that game way.

No it doesn't. You can remain loyal and purge the two rogue archons, for Ms. Kyros' glory.
Or even serve one and remain completely within your position.

Arcanum

even the real world is like that, a whole lot of fucking nothing

>TB games
>trash mobs
Weeb here, do Western games really do that? Maybe it's because I'm used to FFT and Ogre Battle but they don't have that shit.

Baldur's Gate 1 > Baldur's Gate 2. 'tis a fact.

>trash mob
Blind you are.
You see, user. That is the problem. Thash mobs are the cancer. Each battle should be engaging and meaningful.
But here you are, being blind and stupid.

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japanese games are full of trash mob random encounters
its practically a staple of first person dungeon crawlers

Deadfire has badly written companions especially if you compare it to the ones in the first game, but all the other characters were good. The factions are actually the best written since New Vegas I would say, they are well realised and make sense within the setting, their roles in the conflict make sense. Deadfire has the most interesting factions in a game since New Vegas in fact.

Are there more sandboxy crpgs around? They're usually very streamlined.

I already played that one too

the problem with wrpgs is that they're obsessed with being "simulations." a cave will have wild animals in it so they throw a bunch of spiders or whatever at you whether it's an interesting encounter or not.

????

that sounds better than jrpgs where encounters can just randomly happen in the overworld

i remember you could pick up everything in this game. i was like 10 years old or something and never played RPGs before, i was filling my inventory up with plates and forks and similar garbage. good times.

Literally what the OP article is about. Divinity 2 has some sandboxy gameplay elements, but it's not open world.

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>each battle should be engaging and meaningful
But then you wouldn't have many battles. Most of your time would be spent walking around, reading dialogue and playing dress-up.

DOS2 is not at all sandboxy, just because you get to play around these tiny areas that doesn't make it sandboxy, specially since you have no other choice for progress outside of the main questline, I'll admit it's less linear than others tho, and I like the level of interactivity you've got with the world.

I think he meant Divinity 2 not OS 2 user.

Oh that's like 20 years old tho.

That's Beyond Divinity, Divinity 2 came out a decade ago.

Did the game not sell well enough for the dev to go full time? I've heard about the expansion for years.

Oh you mean the one that plays like a single player mmorpg?

>its practically a staple of first person dungeon crawlers
Wait, I thought this was about grid-based strategy RPGs, not weeb DRPG clones.

>single player mmorpg?
The gameplay was good though unlike mmorpgs.
Especially the pre patched thousand cuts skill was great.

That's just your assumption.
Look at Darkest Dungeon for example.
Even at low difficulty every expedition could cost you precious men, time and resources and pretty much every other encounter is crucial.
At higher difficulties every battle is meaningful.
And there are a hell lot of battles even in the short expedition.
Now compare that to some default JRPG with a shittonne of healing potions, resurection items and a bunch of frogs and rats that just bite random party member as a default encounter.

The only remotely decent/ interesting faction was the Royal Deadfire Company.

divine divinity

he went full autismo in integrating the expansion into the base game and it's about half as big as the base game so it took longer than expected

Just because a battle is challenging, doesn't mean it isn't trash.
Doesn't really apply to DD, though, as it isn't a RPG.

>pillars of entenrity

Fucking terrible taste

If it's meaningfull it isn't trash encounter.

>secret project
>from inxile
>inspired by rust and dayz
sounds awful

shut up obsidiot

barely any jrpgs have random encounters now

I'm playing Baldur's Gate 2 and enjoying the rtwp combat. Its not perfect and pathing is a sizeable issue but its mostly clear what is happening in battle save for what buffs the enemy has. And there is just enough micromanagement that it feels tactical without feeling slogged down from pausing too much.
I know people shit on rtwp but I feel like it has a lot of potential if iterated on. Its just more delicate than turn based to get the right feel.
Also, fuck Mindflayers and packs of Gauths.

The only random encounters in Deadfire were the random ships sailing around. Every fight on land in that game was a designed encounter, because one of the main complaints from the first game was that there were too many trash mobs.

>Larianiggers in charge of having good taste

Just because you can die to it, doesn't make it a meaningful encounter. A meaningful encounter is something that has actual links to the plot. That 34th random mob of demonic hyper-rats don't suddenly become meaningful just because they nearly, or did, kill you.

Pleb filtered
Based patrician

>larianiggers will defend this

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>It's the realism argument again
Might as well start arguing for drinking, eating, sleeping, shitting and pissing mechanics. Not to mention everything has to obey the laws of physics now, so no more magic.

>just because you get to play around these tiny areas that doesn't make it sandboxy
That's exactly what sandbox means.

Sandbox just means you can interact with the environment in many fun ways.

Open world is the one that requires a large scale.

The length of your leg? That's silly.

As a big fan of the Pillars of Eternity games, please trust me when I tell you that Tyranny is horrible.

Try Icewind Dale

PoE1 was good.

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Open world should also mean seamless. I don't think it counts for games like fallout 1&2 personally.

Thats what I plan to do after BG2. Was thinking either that, Kingmaker, or temple of elemental evil.

>A meaningful encounter is something that has actual links to the plot
You are wrong. A lot of "linked to the plot" encounters are basically cutscenes.

Open worlds, at least the way modern Bethesda does them, offer no real sense of progression.

sandbox also means you have means of progression besides following the main questline, unlike in DOS2.

PoE 2 as well

I fucking suck at Baldur's Gate's combat. Any tips so a retard like me can enjoy the rest of the games?

Except Morrowind. Morrowind fucking nailed it.

PoE2 was better.

That's something Gothic really nailed.

poe is trash, both games

That's a problem with modern developers, not inherently the idea of open worlds.

Let's agree to disagree.

Pleb

Can't wait for Baldur's Gate 3 senpaitachi

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don't listen to these shills

the answer is no, it's still a broken buggy mess and unbalanced as shit

You couldn't go anywhere or do anything in Gothic unless you wanted your ass kicked, whereas in Oblivion and Skyrim (to an extent), you can enter what should be the most dangerous areas in the game at a low level and do fine. Loot randomization and leveling further harm sense of progression.

>"The very obvious one would be that you tend to miss a lot when you roll the dice, which is fine when you’re playing on the tabletop, but it’s not so cool when you’re playing a video game," pcgamer.com/baldurs-gat...-divinity-and-dandd-5th-edition/#comment-jump

>"Dungeons and Dragons’ leveling system is too slow for Baldur’s Gate 3" nuclearcoffee.org/dungeons-and-dragons-leveling-system-is-too-slow-for-baldurs-gate-3/

>"have talked about how spell slots might not be the most intuitive thing. One of the things with Dungeons and Dragons, which I think is very important, is the method by which we do things is not as important for tabletop players as the actual effect on the table.”"pcgamesn.com/baldurs-gate-3/dungeons-and-dragons-6th-edition

can't wait for it to be shit

It is really bad.
>atribute system is fucking retarded, the same attribute governs the damage of a fireball and a sword swing and the most intellectual people around are barbarians; basic minmaxing all over the place;
>most of the encounters are the same fucking trash, every party member does the same sequence over and over again;
>pretty much every other dialog is a fucking out of the ass lore dump; like this:
>-how's the living there, lad?
>-it's been so harsh sinch the Iasd'asdhs invaded from their lifeless lands of nothginness. A great lord U8p'ausdh the son of Yuahibnl, lead the invasion. My brother died due to asdkjhafg during the war. His face was so pale we called him Caishfdk Hhim - that means "your mother will die in her sleep tonight you stupid faggot".
>every other party member is an insufferable faggot

haven't played a fun one since dragon age origins even though it was very generic story-wise.

>Fallout Tactics
Mein neger

Which cRPGs have the best story?

it's gonna be fine

anything from black isle

Well he used those legs to walk her home gently.

I liked the loredump
Then again I played this game when I was stranded away without internet

here's your bg3 bro

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you worry too much

I'd like to clarify the meaning of "meaningfull encounter" (because I'm a faggot and somebody does not agree with me on the internet): being relevant to the story is one thing and being engaging gameplaywise is another.
If an encouter has no impact on the story, the immersion suffers.
If an encounter is not engaging (like you just spam "attack" if FF games) gameplaywise, the game sucks - it just ends up being the wrong media type for the story to be told, I believe.

dilate

>game so bad it got removed from story
Yeah, no wonder WOTC are careful with their IP.

Quick rundown?

God damn. Is it even possible to write a sex scene that isn't cringey bullshit?

Sex is fucking cringe. Think about it logically.

It was better than 2 but not by much

You faggots had to have worked on the game to lie this much to poor anons. Quit trying to trick innocent people into playing that terrible game.

My dream CRPG:
>Story lite, seamless open world
>Half the party is made by the player, the other half is recruited creations of other players found in taverns and towns usually
>Baldur's Gate style equipment system where upgrades are rarer but meaningful
>A few 'beacon' spells to create points you can teleport the party to like a bonfire mechanic, moderately costly to cast
>Your own created party members can always be revived if they die but other people's creations die permanently if not revived in 24 hours
>No quick saving and loading, if the party wipes out then your party creations wake up at the nearest inn or church, lose a significant amount of Gold for dying
>Could be turn based or rtwp, I like both

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I have no trouble with the lore, but loredumps are fuckign disgusting. If you ask a guy where to buy a sword in the city and he ends up with some history lesson of the region, you know something went horribly wrong in the dialog design.

NOOOOOOOO

wrong about the dialogue, it's like you played the prologue and that's it

That guy's cuirass is so retarded it's hurting my brain

>Quick rundown?
Nothing much, the game was basically bad and was removed from stores because the dev didn't want to pay for servers, despite being more on the singleplayer side.

Add in dynamic NPCs & creatures that live lives and do things driven by mixing AI sandboxing & good scheduling and I'd play.

I like a game world to feel alive with things happening regardless of what I'm doing.

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First one is okay as long as skillchecks are still a thing. It discourages savescumming for the sake of better rolls.
The second one is also true. Levelling up takes forever. It's fine in tabletop because the focus is on the "tabletop freedom of action", but when it comes to a video games it feels like a drag.
Spell slots are great. It makes resting before some location/encounter meaningful or levelling up as a class that gains spells on levelling up only.

>first one is okay
no it's not, it means everything will have its HP bloated to shit because after they remove missing everything dies too quickly

I've ended my run after the court. It was too much for me. I assume you just turned your blind eye to how it is.

Problem with skill checks is most cRPGs are save scum fodder

More cRPGs need to use check point systems,

real time with pause is shit because of action economy. the more depth the combat has the more shit rtwp becomes. if you have a party of 6 characters and a round lasts 6 seconds that's 180+ actions per minute to control every character in real time. rtwp only "works" in baldur's gate because half your party is martial characters who have no abilities other than auto attacking.

nice what game? can I get female party members that wear a thong like that?

Oh, it was about attack rolls? I assumed it was about rolling a dice at every skillcheck.
Like your 18 lockpicking rogue managed to roll a 1 at disarming a 20 dc trap and the whole party died.
If it's about missing on attack rolls it's the whole different thing. It could be solved in different ways and I'm not sure what to think about it.

you're not casting a spell every turn in D&D

>kingmaker
Why would you want to learn obscure rules from some tabletop for 1 game. I spent 2 hours understanding the rules and got bored out of my fucking mind. The combat itself is literally just point and click so whats the purpose of such depth.

As long as cantrips are free yes you are.

What's wrong with it?

>I spent 2 hours understanding the rules
It's basically a DnD system, user.

What's wrong with that?

DnWho?

>Man I love doing nothing for 5 minutes just so those 10 low level enemy farmers with pitchforks can each take their turn climbing ladders and reposition themselves!

Turn based crpgs were a mistake

I'm not sure I'd put it that way. RTWP can suck if there is too much to use actively. Characters can be deep as long as a lot of it remains passive or controlled by AI.

A lot of the reason PoE1's combat suffered compared to Baldur's Gate was too much active management meant pausing took a chunk out of the fun factor of watching it play out. If Martial classes have more situational abilities instead of constant use and Mages don't have incentive to use 'per battle' spells then the player gets to be choosey about how it plays out. And watching the battles actually be real time is fun.

It's just a delicate balance. Too much pausing and it takes too long and feels awful. Too little and it can feel like FF12 where the game plays itself save for only boss battles.

Has anyone tried Tower of Time? It has something like bullet time.

Placement/proportions and the faulds of the "plackart" that just kinda seems tiny and merged into the breastplate. Like the artist just drew lines over it and said "fuck it whatever". It's obvious that whoever drew it saw few armors from google images and knew the aesthetics but they didn't know the actual separate parts of the harness and why they bend where they bend. Most obvious way to recognize this is to see that his armor ends on the hips instead of his natural waist, leaving his crotch and thighs exposed.

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Better then
>Everyone just auto attacks

The only game that ever did RTWP remotely well was a fucking JRPG of all things, due to its gambit system.

Trying to get your party in a RTWP game to do anything correctly requires you to micro harder then a WC3 player, with even jankier pathing AI.

there are no cantrips in 2e

>pathfinder
>obscure
secondaries are a fucking blight

They really are.

dungeons and dragons is a shit ruleset so the dev understanding that and being willing to make changes is a good thing. tabletop rpgs are bad by design because tabletop players are retarded faggots who think if a game is too well designed it's "not a real rpg."

>Character by Character Turn based
Mediocre
>RTWP
Shit tier
>Battle orders and turn simulation
God tier.

Both games aggressively pulled me out of the make-believe. The dialog options and player directing is so shit on both games. I don't even care if the gameplay and balance was bad, the heart of cRPG is the writing.

Yeah, why auto attack trash mobs and clear them out in 5 seconds when you can do it in 5 minutes!

Retard

D:OS2 co-op has really been jamming. It's not my favorite singleplayer RPG, but I've still enjoyed it alot.

That said, Underrail kicked ass. Gib Expansion.

>Trash mobs
Thats the crux of the issue desu.

Or you could just not have trash packs and instead create appropriate encounters.

D&D might be shit but Original Sin games are ten times worse.

Yeah dude, luckily as soon as the MC enters the forest all bandits, wolves, goblins and other creatures immediately vanish or become magically enchanted and form small militias.

That makes sense

I don't know about 5th edition but in 3rd edition a level 1 character with no bonuses only has a 55% chance to hit a completely stationary target which is pretty retarded when you think about it.

Maybe you should lay off the weebshit.

But it makes sense for wolves and goblins to hunt in organized packs

simulationists are literally cancer

which is a trash pack. Thanks for agreeing that they have a place

It compensates low HP and high damage

>open world
Stopped reading here. Your dream game is shit.

Seems like you have a low IQ idea of what trash is, maybe you should stick to your zoomer MMOs. Clearly D&D inspired vidya isn't for you.

What did we think about pic related?

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Bored me

nice deflection
>youre a zoomer for preferring classic crpg systems
lmao

it's retarded and makes things more dependant on rng which in video games encourages quickloading

Plenty of CRPGs back in the day were turn based you zoomer, or are you one of those guys who thought fallout started at 3, and don't remember when fallout went RTWP and was utter shit because of it.

Shit

the only good one was TOEE

Mediocre, tried too hard to be a torment game, but it didn't have the charm of Planescape: Torment.

basically the worst thing about rpgs are the fans. rpg players all all fucking retarded, especially tabletop rpg players.

>refuse to use maps with miniatures so rules have to be dumbed down to not care about positioning and limit movement
>think martial characters having special abilities is weeaboo so spellcasters always end up overpowered
>obsessed with "muh narrative freedom" so every game has to be 90% sandbox with a 4 hour main quest
>won't let go of objectively bad mechanics like rtwp and dialogue trees

wrpgs will never be good as long as devs keep listening to these neckbeards.

Those are not as crutial as skillchecks. I would not savescum unless the RNG happens to be consistently bad for me in a long fight.
I'm not sure what to thing of this change so far.
Like it may be changed to some retarded QTE or something.

If you can go to endgame areas any time, then they aren't endgame areas, and it's not progression.

>Less strict storyline
Ok I guess
>more sandbox world
Fuck no
>with emergent gameplay.
>yes please

A tightly knit world with actual depth over empty “open world” games any day.

>refuses to use maps with miniatures
huh
Roll20 is hugely popular because it allows the creation of maps to be played fully with positioning rules.
>thiinks martial characters having special abilities is weeaboo
no, teleports behind you shit is weeaboo. Im fine with a barb grappling a dragon even if it seems retarded
>4 hour main story quest
have you ever even played a crpg?
>objectively bad mechanics like rtwp
casual successfully filtered

ad&d was the last version of dungeons and dragons that encouraged the use of miniatures and it was the last edition where you actually had to be behind someone to backstab.

Pilled and Turn based.
>Why would you want to learn obscure rules from some tabletop for 1 game.
>Pathfinder
>Obscure
>Not enjoying learning new systems
I see today is brainlet day.

There are a lot of good games that this Autist wouldn't play that also happen to be broken buggy messes. What a shame.

I started playing BG and just get blown the fuck out at low level, all my party members just miss and die, I've been savescumming like mad. Am I retarded? I've played NWN1+2, DOS2, and some other CRPGs, never had this issue at low level annihilation.

>Am I retarded?
Yes.

Based user. ToEE has the best turn-based combat to exist in crpgs, bar maybe Original Sin series. Everyone should try it.

no that's just low level d&d. give all your characters ranged weapons.

low level AD&D is deadlier than f.a.t.a.l.

Absolute best, engaging characters, world and it just leaves you with sense of "woah dude"? The answer always will be Planescape: Torment.

Original Sin games have garbage combat don't do ToEE a disservice by comparing them.

You just described Dragon's Dogma.

Have you tried not playing D&D 3.5?

>Kingmaker
>last shadowrun games
that is some garbage taste, buddy

>obscure rules
nigga, that is just D&D 3ed
sorry for your low IQ brah
but the game IS shit tho, not because of the rules your tiny brain can't comprehend

Haven't played OS2 yet, but the first one had very enjoyable combat with just the right amount of options and tactics, which was a nice fresh thing when it came out. Dunno what's your gripe is.

>actually questioning it
Y I K E S

Enjoyed it. Game is actually built around RTWP, different enemies require different tactics and positioning is vital.

PoE fags seethe really hard about it because its not RTWP like Baldurs Game so they think it has trash combat, when OS has the best crpg combat by far.

I'm a PoE fag and I enjoy Underrail, the last two Shadowrun games, and those are all turn-based.
So much for your shit theory.
Good combat can be RTwP or Turn Based. Original Sin is shit and the writing is even worse.

>rtwp only "works" in baldur's gate because half your party is martial characters who have no abilities other than auto attacking.

That’s a good thing though. Fuck POE for having 0 passive abilities even for fighters and millions of pointless active abilities you have to manage, game is anti-fun in that respect

>Tooltips all mention something called 'd20'
>Never tells you what it is
Sorry faggots not everyone has played 30 year old tabletop games.

it's anti-fun because of rtwp. I played deadfire in turn based mode and it was actually fun.

in d:os you just spam the same 3 spell combos for most of the game
in d:os2 you just spam damage spells to break magic armor

That’s great for you but I’d rather play properly developed games in rtwp that are fun to play rather than go back and play deadfire again in turn based

Similar but crpg style tactical combat. Pref six party members. And death isn't game over.

>>-it's been so harsh sinch the Iasd'asdhs invaded from their lifeless lands of nothginness. A great lord U8p'ausdh the son of Yuahibnl, lead the invasion. My brother died due to asdkjhafg during the war. His face was so pale we called him Caishfdk Hhim - that means "your mother will die in her sleep tonight you stupid faggot".

the fuck are you talking about
the best part about it was the backstory with waidwens legacy and the godhammer

I posted Wasteland 3 threads some time age and every shat on the game, now suddenly everyone is excited, wtf Yea Forums

The first time I played poe1 I hated it and couldn't get into the more or setting. I came back to it two years later and loved the lore and setting. It's an acquired taste? I don't know.

I wish they didn't bungle the feel of the setting in poe2.

Tyranny has some very good aspects and ideas, but overall the game is not that great, I still enjoyed playing it though.

>RTWP
KILL YOURSELF
FUCKING KILL
YOURSELVES

RTWP IS SO BAD

IT'S TERRIBLE

GIVE ME TURN-BASED AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

so you want to play dumbed down games being held back by rtwp

Turn-Based is for baby seethers like this moron. It's good to be Patrician and appreciate the superior gameplay of RTWP

>Story lite
You don't like RPGs

>more multiplayer
Kill me. Who the fuck plays these long ass games in multiplayer?

I do. But the story would be low level while the game built an immersive background world. Much better for an open world.

Doesn't mean there isn't dialogue, decision making, and consequence. Just that the story takes a backseat to exploration and dungeon delving.

That article it's terrible. The last thing the genre needs it's that devs start copying that piece of shit Divinity because it sold a lot to fucking retards.

>DD2 never

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If the real world was fun, I wouldn't be playing CRPGs.

Both are the same shit
>lmao just buff the crap out of your party before every big fight, watch how you critical miss and throw some nukes and dispels, rest and repeat.
>wait half a hour for the other niggers to end their turn and after that cast a heal and a attack that may miss.

This, level/encounter design is everything, it's baffling that not much attention is paid to it.

RPG doesn't mean visual novel.

>hit a trap, quickload!
>sleep is interrupted, quickload!
>key spell interrupted, quickload!
Quicksaving is the death of risk and consequence which means low tension.
>just don't use it!
Its like giving people a bazooka with infinite ammo and saying 'Well yeah its easily and readily available, but don't use it'. Design should be restricting the excesses of human impulse and forcing acceptance of consequence. Its like saying people should get to immediately revive at the boss if they die in Dark Souls.

Getting people to accept 'imperfections' in their playthrough would be a gigantic move forward in CRPG's and most gaming. Couldn't save the kid because I made the wrong dialogue choice? No loading. Just accept that lack of control.

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stop save spamming

>Well yeah its easily and readily available, but don't use it

stop save spamming

>Well yeah its easily and readily available, but don't use it

That's because giving important stuff like opening a lock or casting a spell a random chance to miss is bullshit.
Of course I'm going to load the game when a trap my thief should be able to handle gets him one-shotted but developers should just say "you can't do this without failing" instead of putting in a 20% chance of success.

Why do you want to take away my escapism? In life I have no control. My life fell apart and I don't know what's going on. But in the wonderful world of crpgs, I have choice, I have control, and my decisions matter.
Why would you take that away from me, fren? Why must all of life be suffering?

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what if they did an action RPG where you play as Dorn and there are fully nude elf babes that always end up breaking his heart, and instead of any dumb loser RPG stuff you can "rev" up your sword to unleash killer combos

When will they abandon the awful D&D ruleset? I refuse to play any games bound by it, the only CRPG I have enjoyed so far is Arcanum.

Arcanum is terrible, consider suicide.

You lost me at action rpg.

That depends on how its managed but the level of variance provided by chance is what makes things feel different on subsequent playthroughs and gives a nice tension due to potential chaos.

It's a good life lesson to be able to deal with a lack of total control. People who develop anxiety do so because they try to mentally control what they cannot as opposed to letting it happen and accepting it.

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Not that user but you shut your whore mouth. Arcanum was, and remains, excellent.

RPG stats are old and lame, so boring and sleepy. You should be able to let Dorn unleash his blackguard fury with killer combos which you can unlock with "hero points" you unlock from defeating enemies. Maybe you can restore health by spending some "quality time" with elven babes in the cloakwood, if you know what I mean!!!

It's a shitty game people only like because of ancillary bullshit like being able to fuck a sheep or reading newspapers, the combat sucks, the story is lame, and the game is bugged to shit.

It's one of the only few decent CRPGs, no other game approaches it in terms of player agency and world reactivity, it has a far more interesting setting and plot than generic D&D fantasy schlock.

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I do that in Lobotomy Corp if it's a new hire.
>one of my elites died? god FUCKING damn it retry day
>some random piece of shit in Training died? fuck you i'm not resetting this god damn day for him I FUCKING PASSED IT

If I just let what happens happen, and accept the bad luck rolls from those random chances the other user mentioned, then I never would've finished a single rpg. Some of us are cursed with horrible luck.
Have you ever missed 8 90% chance-to-hits in a row? Have you ever done that, and seen the enemy land crit after crit in between your misses, all those crits when you have high crit defense and it really shouldn't be happening?

We need to get rid of quick saving

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about. You must be thinking of some other game. You're clearly mistaken and probably mentally ill.

You sound like you need your Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in your life, user. He will protect your dice rolls.

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>Have you ever missed 8 90% chance-to-hits in a row? Have you ever done that, and seen the enemy land crit after crit in between your misses, all those crits when you have high crit defense and it really shouldn't be happening?
I played Xcom too senpai. It's not your fault.

Arcanum will never be good no matter how much you shill your broken game on a mongolian basket weaving forum.

>playing a dwarf with low beauty
>have to calm everyone down by saying "good sir/madam" and impress them with my good manners
nah sorry it's a perfect game

You SHOULD play Pathfinder Kingmaker anons! It IS a GOOD game I do NOT play it BUT it DOES have my BEST wife Valerie! You SHOULD play Pathfinder Kingmaker AND romance Valerie! (You should! You should!)

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I will after I'm done with Baldur's Gate 2 and also Icewind Dale.

>posting/linking a known far left news outlet
fuck off shill

hehe not so pretty when she gets her face carved up

IF I play that game then I will bully your waifu and send her on a suicide run. A suicide run at a trash mob, so that her death means nothing and achieves nothing.

>Less strict storyline
>more sandbox world with emergent gameplay.
jesus christ.. thank god I don't pay for games anymore

Thank YOU user! You ARE a GOOD user! Jaheira IS a GOOD Baldur's Gate 2 wife! Accalia IS a GOOD Icewind Dale wife!

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Valerie IS still the CUTEST wife WITH her scar! She IS the CUTEST wife WHEN she IS bullied! It IS good TO bully Valerie AND make her FLUSTERED anons! (It is! It is!)

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You mean dwarf fortress?

>wolves see group of humans
>flee like actual wolves
>goblins see group of well-armed mercenaries
>decide that there's probably easier targets out there and flee

that's how you do it, makes more sense than a lone bandit suiciding himself into your dragonriding demigod

Play Dragon Quest 3.

That games havent even surpassed Ultima VII from 27 years ago in this regard is fucking disgraceful.

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Is Spellforce 3 any good?

The future of crpgs is probably being able to toggle between the two with a single button like the kingmaker mod. No idea why deadfire didn't do that (but it's shit so oh well).

Nastassia IS a GOOD wife!

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Divinity Original Sin 1/2 are the evolution the cRPG needed instead of relying on old systems like PoE
Prove me wrong.

Divinity was fun with friends but boring as shit for solo play, it has too much downtime, time where if you have friends you can discuss strats and whatnot but if youre alone youre just watching the CPU rearrange 200 pieces.
RTWP is top tier for solo play but if you try and play with other people, spellcasters need to pause every couple of turns and you end up annoying each other.

Yeah, RTwP is great. I love it.

I had way more fun with Pillars combat system, both in RTwP and Turn-Based. Original Sin 2 is a devolution with its garbage loot and armor system.

Yeah, but do you remember how fucking butthurt people were with Kingdom Come on release?

>That games havent even surpassed Ultima VII from 27 years ago in this regard is fucking disgraceful.
This. Some new games can't even surpass Ultima IX.
Nastassia is the best wife.

I mean, for that to happen shit has to be very clear on what the consequences will be, otherwise quicksaving still has an important role in CRPGs if you want to actually play your role.
Latest example, while replaying bg2 recently

>get Anomen in party
>get his sidequest eventually and its about a man thats been fucking with his family and killed his sister but youre not 100% sure he did it
>only 2 options are "yeah lets go get him" and "nah just let it go we can know 4 sure"
>decide to tell him we should go get him because I figure I'll get to investigate wether he did it or not and get to the bottom of this
>get to the place and he goes homicidal manian without letting me talk to anyone beforehand, making me lose reputation and turning him evil when it wasnt clear at all thats what was gonna happen
>have to load save from before and change what I tell him

I can think of hundreds of such scenarios where by unclear wording or whatnot I do shit that goes against what I wanted to do / against the alignment I'm trying to RP.

I can't believe they made a steampunk techno magick setting and decided that the crux of the story should be "were'd dah dwarfs go???" I stopped expecting anything when it devolved into going to the magic elf tree to find the good elves and going to the other magic elf tree to find the bad elves. Outside that one civilization the edgy elf son genocided the tech side of the story pretty much evaporates into thin air

I love dos2 but I'd rather its style stays as a branching path rather than the main style of crpg.

is it just me or are crpgs boring as fuck

Space Ranger HD is what it's probably close to you if you don't mind the lack of visual to represent it.
You can just ignore every main quest and just whatever you want while the main villan do conquer planets and influence the galaxy.

I can't disagree with you on that, the armor and loot system are garbage but it seems they were aware of that too late,
OS1 was a CC fest too, but i liked it more for that, rather than "burst a character armor so you can CC him".

I was talking about more on interactivity with the world, moving barrels to find hidden keys/switches and all those elemental interactions that you can do on combat.

Yeah, true player "responsability" should only come with true player agency, really.

I agree. And combat would have to be better formulated away from trial and error as BG2 tends towards. Worth it in the end.

Sex is icky and unfeminist!

I mean, the environmental interaction is cool and all, but it gets kinda repetitive and Deadfire has some of that stuff too.

I didn't like underrail for whatever reason. Could never get into it

>all these contrarians shilling RTwP
One of the few times I'm glad devs don't listen to Yea Forums.

I dont like isometric rpg gameplay. It feels very clunky.
PoE felt borderline unplayable.

>Dude, what if there was a CRPG but open-world
Ahem...

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I want a CRPG that plays like BG2 mixed with XCom management. Like you have an adventurers guild where you can upgrade facilities and recruit new party members. Then you just wander out questing in a BG-style semi-open world.

The biggest obstacles to successful CRPG's isn't making the games, it's the CRPG "fans" who hate CRPGs and will relentlessly shit on them if they don't cater perfectly to their specific, contrarian brand of autism for completely banal reasons.
At this point I absolutely wouldn't blame devs for completely abandoning the idea of making a CRPG purely because the target audience is mostly a bunch of impossible to please retards.

The thing I hate most about RTwP is that it fills the game with trash mobs, whereas TB encourages devs to make each encounter a unique challenge.

Visual novel. Not vidya

That's a Diablo clone

>adventurers guild
>Reeing in grognard intensifies

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I like trash mobs as long as there is some longer strategy. Like taking damage from a small encounter means drinking a potion or using a spell now rather than later.

Varying levels of encounters can be nice to watch your party destroy stuff with minimal management sometimes too.

>nu-men era

RTwP is the most Reddit system of all time, so anyone with even half a brain prefers Turn BASED.

I like them both. Different strengths and weaknesses. Two fine wines.

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based varietybro

rtwp has literally zero advantages over turn based with a fast forward button

Faster combat means random encounters can be put in as time allows. It's also entertaining to watch your own creations and members AI destroy stuff.

>r*ddit loves PoE
>Yea Forums hates it
really makes you think

I will always be convinced that rtwp is okay with smaller party like 3 like kotor but anything more than that seems like a hassle

>>Yea Forums hates it
Nah

I like rtwp for larger parties and turn based for four or less.

for me constantly pausing to micromanage a bunch of characters who aren't just fighter that attacks things is annoying but I can see your side of it

I can understand that. Rtwp micromanagement needs a sweet spot to feel good.

I'll jump into the pile of shit with you; Divinity OS are the most Reddit games ever, turn based games.

It's self aware, humorous world was not what I was looking for. I liked the mechanics of it but I want games to make an honest attempt at crafting a memorable world. Cheap humor feels like a copout. Like a blizzard game.

Based & objectively true pilled

Just look at the squabbling ITT over turned based VS rtwp or some people REEEEEing at even the thought of mixing in proper open world, sandbox gameplay like the OP originally wanted to talk about

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these are literally the only good WRPGs

>BG2
>Planescape Torment
>Divinity OS2

You cannot prove me wrong.

>Obsidiots will defend this

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>PoE2 was better.

Wonder why it flopped then? Must have been the gay fish

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Turn based is easier to balance do well, RTwP is superior if executed properly however there are way more pitfalls that can ruin an experience.

>Fallout
>Ultima

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The best system would be a hybrid of RTwP and TB. Do RTwP for generic fights but TB for major ones. If players want to they can choose to only do one for the whole game.

>pillars of onions
makes me laugh every thread

>linking to rps
archive or fuckoff sunshine, you must be new around here.
also
>imagine actually wanting less story in your crpg
you are literally just asking for a worse game. you will not ever have "emergent gameplay" to any real degree. shelve that dumb hope and come back to it when they figure out significantly better ai that can be implemented in games to be a real time dm, because that's the only way you're getting it.

>. If players want to they can choose to only do one for the whole game.
that typically leads to balancing issues

I thought a rtwp system where you were limited on 'action points' could be cool to regulate micromanagement and let the player decide what they want to be autocasted for free or manual for points. Say one point returns every two seconds with incentives for not using any for a while, like a buff.
/Flame shield on

That's called turn based combat.

No. It's real time with limited pause. Everything is still happening simultaneously. But choosing a specific spell costs a point.

best rpgs ever:
might and magic 6
fallout 1 and 2
bg1 and 2
icewind dale
mount and blade warband
wizardry 8

New Sorpigal is my hometown.

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if you have a fast forward button turn based becomes as fast as you want it to be without any of the drawbacks of rtwp

I'm really having fun with kingmaker.

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>being this stupid

An example of a game with this? That seems odd to look at it fast animations all the time.

The best game from the CRPG revival

RTWP is indeed shit. Anyone who claims to like it is either a contrarian or an escaped mental patient.

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It's good for modern combat.

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i fucking love this game and wish it got a decent sequel. Such a nice blend of types of games.

Real time WITHOUT pause. Just customize their script and let them have at it. Maybe a few special plays you can call during combat.

Yeah. That's the stuff. Watching my creations bust some ass.

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Based

have sex

there are some turn based jrpgs with it. I don't know of any wrpgs. deadfire sort of had it but it wasn't fast enough.

Like Dominions?