The reason why fighting games aren't popular is not because they are hard.
Once you've played one match with each character you have seen it all.There are no bosses to kill, no weapons and armor to craft, no levels to traverse and secrets to be found, no stats to allocate, no different builds to try.There's no variety.
To a normal person fighting games are boredom, tedium and repetition with zero depth.
Until fighting games address this they will always be irrelevant and boring.
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Agreed. Fighters need to stop sucking esports and the fgc cock and bring back the fun shit like team battles, world tour mode, minigames, crazy match modifiers and special rules galore, photo modes, character creation, stage creation... Hey, you know what game has all that and is more popular than ever? Smash.
>replying to pasta
>thinking Smash is a fighting game
Yep, all forms of idiocy in one post. Makes sense if the poster is an idiot.
>I'm bad at fighting games
I see.
he has a fair point though
This entire thread reeks of zoomer
I dont believe it's necessarily hard moreso that it's nuanced. Some just don't get it. Others aren't competitive or rather find a setting given stupid powers with lenient difficulty than plunge into the depths of that zeitgeist of the fighting genre. A demonstration of skill, execution, and technique.
There's a surprising variety to the fighting genre too so I imagine others just never found that title which made everything click for them.
Video games are inherently for children and people in their early 20s.
Pretty much this. All that cool shit you see the pros doing with their character? Yeah that can be you... in 5 years. No one wants to dedicate that much time until the game gets good. It's a meme that FF13 "gets good 20 hours in". Try 20,000 hours in SF.
If anything SFV showed it wasn't hard enough. They removed half the moves from every returning character's set that they are so gimped you have no real options anymore, making the game just that much more boring than it already was.
Zoomers are infinitely better than Millenials.
-Gen X'er
literally all of this applies to chess as well humanities oldest most timeless game
conclusion: you're just a dumb zoomer with a short circuited brain
>entire thread
>4 replies omitted
Hoe does it feel to be literally braindead?
how can you say Smash isn't a fighting game when the game's 1v1 mode gets streamed online with more viewers and hype than your fighting game?
Yes, Dota is a nice fighting game.
>to a normal person fighting games are boredom, tedium and repetition with zero depth
yeah that's pretty much it, the intrinsic reward of improvement is not good enough for most players. I think Killer Instincts shadow lords mode was a good step for people looking for a more progressive experience, gearing, items, etc. Issue is that shit takes time and takes away from the time you could spend making the actual meat and potatoes better. So basically to attract a "maybe" audience you need to commit big time while the core most of the time will never even play single player content
are you familiar with sour grapes? That's the cause of all other fighting game players feelings towards the success of beat'em up siblings.
Chess is a turn based game.
>inb4 speed chess fags
this 'smash isn't a fighting game' meme isn't correct
so you're talking specifically about traditional fighting games? that's true, smash isn't one of those. I only want people to realize that it has depth.
The reason why fighting games aren't popular are because they are front-loaded with a lot of bullshit you need to learn and practice before you come remotely close to becoming "competent" let alone good. After Fighting games went so retarded on superficial combos, everybody dropped them except for the tiny niche. Combos are routine, static, boring.
Same went for RTS games. 90% of the build phase is static, and so dull that pros mash the mouse button on units at the gold mine to artificially inflate their pointless "APM" number. Nobody cares about that shit.
FPS games thrive because of their "purity". Intuitive tactical decisions you come up with on your own as you are learning the layout of the map, the dynamics of the position of people all over the place making encounters never exactly the same, you are able to rely on your reflexes and coordination. One button that does a simple thing, the simplicity of point&click with a mountain of potential decisions behind it at both a low level and top tier level of play.
Meanwhile a fighting game has dozens upon dozens of unique moves, however nearly all of them are fluff; you have maybe two moves that are good opening moves that lead into worthwhile damage (those big canned combos). Every fight is a static, empty box with two characters, said characters have a very specific optimal gameplan. Said gameplan is not one you really naturally come across but something you literally stumble upon after lots of time in a Training room against a fucking punching dummy and fumbling against other idiots at low ranks. You always get those "newbie killer" characters with some gimmick at lower levels, because fighting games are really about learning a bunch of bad habits when you start. They are not intuitive. They are bad.
Fighting games are the poster child for being as wide as an ocean, but as deep as a puddle.
Sakurai himself said it wasnt. He said its a party game
Also plot.
Somebody couldnt git gud
Fighting games genre is a niche genre. It always has been. FFS I hate this notion that if something isnt fuckhuge with casuals like fortnite that there's something wrong with it. I hate what fighting games have become. People play fighting games because they are difficult and rewarding. Making it easy appeals to literally nobody.
Fighters don't need any of that shit. Play something else, bitch.
There are so many buzzwords in this post I don't know if it's even English anymore.
>fighters don't need players
play samsho if you dont like combos nerd
Fighting games still have un-intuitive controls
It's as if they're still in the snap back aiming era of FPS games
The most popular games are extremely poor for character distance and playing tactically, not just EXECUTE EXECUTE EXECUTE pre-determined optimal combos
They've tried to cover this up with annoying flashy special moves, but it really doesn't make it
The only games that did this well regressively re-integrated this into their setup, making them utterly irrelevant
Suprisingly, no one wants to either
A: Have super move cutscenes every god damn match if they get too easy to do, they get stale as shit after the 4th time seeing them
B:Have them impossible to do for a new starter, and being an integral part of a character to be functional damage wise, this becomes frustrating and makes them lose interest quickly
Progression should be tied to how well a player can use the tools he has, not whether or not those tools will decide to allow him to be used first
>The reason why fighting games aren't popular is not because they are hard.
Show me your completed challenges. You have ten minutes from the time I post this. SHOW ME. AT LEAST ONE CHARACTER.
Of course they need players but wanting a niche genre to have Fortnite numbers is retarded. Fighters keep dumbing shit down for newcomers and it literally doesn't change anything.
>Fighting games still have un-intuitive controls
except Smash
Smash is practically the only fighting game done right; easy to learn, hard to master
The reason fighting games aren't popular is that when you're learning something your intuition is to try things and that will just get you killed every time in fighting games. They are way too easy to play completely wrong
>The reason why fighting games aren't popular is not because they are hard.Once you've played one match with each character you have seen it all.
You're a fucking retard, just stop.
>Fighting games still have un-intuitive controls
If you're shit at games, sure.
Momochi actually was able to figure it out, coming to the same conclusion as I did in the past of how fighting games should be designed. Hopefully Capcom and the others can learn from this and make the upcoming SF6 good.
Sounds like you play shitty fotm garbage, user. Not everything that glitters is gold.
>"user, why don't you play fighting games?"
>"Most of them die about 3 months after launch, also they tend to delay future content to justify selling season passes"
>"You're just asshurt that you're bad at them."
Every. Fucking. Time.
>I'm an explorer and I have a narrow view point of video games
that's all you said.
I'm trying to learn and I haven't won a single match online since buying samurai shodown
when do I start having fun? because all I've done so far is raise my blood pressure
online is for learning, not winning
samsho sucks
>BUY THE CHARACTER SEASON PASS
>Get it, only has 2-3 characters, all are kinda meh
>SEASON PASS 2 HAS 5 CHARACTERS
>By time the second character comes out game is dead, character you wanted to main is last in the line
>itt a Yea Forums user attempts to justify and reason with just how much of a casual they are
Keep trying, I'm not convinced.
>every fighter focuses on combos
Listen to yourself
the nature of online play in fighting games is that most of the time you will only end up matched with no-lifers
just focus on learning, you probably won't win ever
I feel bad for Cassandrafags
>Once you've played one match with each character you have seen it all.
Wrong.
The resason fighting games are not popular is that they look too simple for how complicated they actually are. This post is proof of it. What OP wrote reads as "these games are boring because there is no immediate feeling of progression, its pontless and repetitive".
Most people look at fighting games and only see two characters hitting eachother and health bars going down, and approach it like they would a casual game, but when they realise they have to learn all this other shit to actually get good they see that there is no point putting time and effort in something that feels so insignificant.
youtube.com
Play UNIST.
agree they are hard games to enjoy
It's because of lag
>lag built into the ps4
>Lag caused by online
>built in game lag at what, 8 frames regardless of what you do?
>wireless controller lag
>TV lag
All that stacked on top of each other makes your inputs always miss. It's legitimately the reason I don't play modern fighting games.
This. As soon as i knew how much you have to learn i immediately dropped sfv. Fighting games learning curve is too steep. Forget learning optimal combos, you have to know frame data, character matchups, meaties, setups, frame traps etc and all this other bullshit. I just wanna throw hadokens and do shoryukens but nope, gotta be autistic and learn all this other dumb shit
Who cares? As long as a fighting can maintain around 1k or so active players, you have way more than enough to maintain a bustling and thriving community.
How does destroying a genre to appeal to casual normalfags that will hop to whatever the next shiny thing is within a month benefit me in any way pastafarian?
Let me guess, you got bodied online.
There's your bossfight. You failed. Don't be such a bitch about it, just admit it's too much for you.
If you think SF5 is too hard then gaming in general may be too much for you. I might have agreed if you said Tekken or some anime fighter.
Mario Kart is a party racing game, Smash is a party fighting game. The only difference is that once you yank the RNG partiness out, MK becomes shallow and boring, whereas Smash stops being party and becomes a proper, if unorthodox, fightan.
Funny you add tekken, i found it easier to pick up than sfv.
Play Samurai Showdown
opposite for me. it was easy to grasp the fundamentals of street fighter.
anti airing, frame traps, tick throws, shimmy, footsies, etc..
in tekken, I got combos down but I don't really "get" it.
whenever I start a match I kinda just KBD and wiggle around trying to wiff punish.
Picking Eddie and button mashing your friends to death doesn't really count.
I think SFV is harder to get into than UNIST honestly. With SF you have to join a discord just to get access to up to date google docs that show possible combos and stuff. Most of the training challenges in the game are on ancient patches the game even tells you don't apply to current versions of characters.
Meanwhile in Under Night you can do level 3 challenges and at least have an idea of what to hit people with and how to spend meter.
is this accurate?
>genre is dead because it doesn't have zoomer tier skinner box mechanics
you might be onto something
But MK11 sold like nuts
The challenge combos in SF games usually aren't what you want to do. It's just to show off what is possible.
After you learn to cancel normals into specials you have achieved the highest level that SF5 requires.
Yes, but what happens with every popular fighting game is that most of the people who buy them play the singleplayer and just leave in the first month. Happened with DBFZ too.
There's the competitive high you get going against others and seeing an improvement in playing. There's also the other modes that you can get enjoyment for. Shit on MK11 and their monetization but you have to give them kudos for their single player modes, especially story mode. And sometimes it's just fun to play with friends.
Also there's always massive tournaments being run with people making thousands of dollars and making a living out of it.
Even using SFV as your example of "fighting games". Good bait.
...
is it not a fighting game?
>MK11 and their monetization
Learn Yomi
I wouldn't compare fighting games with single player shit. Fighting games aren't as popular as other multiplayer shit because it takes time to learn.
You can jump into any moba right now and get your dopamine from an easy kill or CSing sound effects. You can jump into a BR and get lucky loot/circle and make it to top 5 or even win. Fighting games just require too much practice; parents, children and women don't care to learn.
All that said I main fighting games, they're very rewarding. Much better than team game trash as well.
Some people have the nerve to stay with one or a set of games for several years and 1000s of hours, since (you)r opinion on what a fun game doesn't match that you come to argue on the mongolian basketweaving imageboard.
Wut
I guess i put a lot more time and effort into tekken 7 than sfv, but tekken just clicks for me. Its always been apart of my life since childhood so that could be a factor as to why i understood it more than sfv
I used asuka
>90% of the build phase is static
i see somebody didn't play brood war in his life.
>Fighters were niche, but most had a level of depth and we're willing to experiment.
>Every fighter from the late '00s on have been more and more casualized and sales have gone up while companies bloat their own esports scene
>Fighting games get a shit rep from anyone with half a brain as a result
I hate esports.
For all the elitism/muh casul/muh hardcore shit you see on this place, threads and the comments like these prove Yea Forums is full of shitters who shouldn't be trusted to make an informed opinion about fucking anything.
My tween nephew who grew up with Minecraft, CoD and Fortnite plays SFV with me for hours on end. You guys just need to stop being butthurt little bitches because you literally couldn't git gud.
>play gief
>having a hard time
>switch to Alex when he comes out
>doing better but still hard
>switch to Juri
>then Ed
>then Falke
>maybe I just suck at the game
>finally check tier list
>all those characters are literally bottom barrel tier
I guess I’m just attracted to shit character
it's someone in their 40s saying he prefers that attitudes of people in their early 20s and younger than the attitudes of people currently in their early to mid-30s. Basically kids who grew up with N64 and Playstation as their main kid consoles are the worst.
>EXECUTE EXECUTE EXECUTE pre-determined optimal combos
thing is, there's never a universally optimal combo. you gotta think on the fly about stuff you want. do you want a bit more meter? do you want a knockdown for okizeme? do you want an unsafe ending on your combo to bait your opponent into doing pressure only for you to whiff punish it because the combo actually ended a bit early and there's some space between the two of you?
there's never a pure best combo, there's always variants. git gud
Tiers don't matter too much, bro
yeah this is the turnoff for me.
I loved Street Fighter 2 as a kid. The single-player mode was kind of fun but the main draw was playing semi-competitively with friends and family, where you tended to have a more organic spread of skill and some sense of the social setting where you'd only be 100% competitive dick with the friends who you knew could take it. You might take it easy the first time on your 10 year old cousin who'd never played before, or just sit and advise while he played your little sister or whatever.
With online play it's all up to the matching algorithms.
I dont care. I'll always love and support fighting games financially because I love playing them. Catering to people who dont like fighting games is a strategy proven to not work at all.
>dead
genre isn't dead though, it's just not very popular. It's consistent and niche
Tier lists have little to do with low-level play. That applies mostly to the highest skill ceiling possible, meaning tournaments. Even then you can find people play Gief at very high level, and I bet there are some good players at least at diamond level playing those characters you've listed. Shotos like Ryu and Ken are decent starting characters, especially because of Shoryuken shenanigans. I decided to go with Urien now that I finally understand how to use charged attacks. When I was a kid I had no idea what the fuck I was doing with them. I'm still practically a noob though, considering I've only took fighting games seriously like a couple of months ago.
will i enjoy it if i play skullgirls? who should i main in UNIST if i main Cerebella, Big Band and Beowulf in skullgirls?
I was gonna say something about how pasta threads like these are a brilliant way to cast a wide net into the summerfag influx, but this is Yea Forums and this shit works year-round.
Wald
There are so many zoomers and normalfags that they don't even know its a pasta.
Samurai Shodown is the dumbest fucking game.
The characters with short jumps like Charlotte can spam jump all fucking day and since the game has no universal anti-air option for some reason unless you have a DP there's nothing you can do.
Why the fuck can't you deflect a jump in? Why the fuck are jump ins so safe compared to grounded attacks?
Maybe have a special animation where they fall on their ass because you knocked them out of the air with a deflect.
The game is so close to being good but bad anti-air options and the fact a character like Kyoshiro can have a jump that fucking floaty while Charlotte or Darli can jump heavy all fucking day and win because of it.
Some day. Some one. Will make a fighting mmo. And the two types of games will work together better then anthring ever seen before
>The reason why fighting games aren't popular
oh no. How awful. As someone who plays fighting games i am truly devestated.
Based on what?
how would it work, though? fighting games, by design, are 1v1 ordeals, how do you make a massively multiplayer 1v1 game without making it into a serious tournament kinda thing? or would it be a "slobberknocker: the everyone vs everyone bar fighting game" where all the players are in one fight, optionally split into two "teams"?
>either buy the game on release or miss the boat
>online is usually good for the first 3 or 6 months afterwards is dead, with few exceptions
>all these fightings games being released one after another(at least 4 per year) even from the same company that leads to oversaturation, players jumping fighter to fighter often and a lots of different communities which leads small fanbases
>most fighters dont have crossplay which damages more the communities
Then you have sheeps that follow tourney players and the only thing they know is copy paste their teams and tricks, and when they cant do it they give up. If some streamer of tourneyfag says the game sucks, sheeps wont play that game.
And then fighters barely have any single player and when they do is some bore ass story mode instead of different types of modes.
And then dlc shit, like characters that are omitted from the main game to get extra cash later.
There are other things to complain, or excuses, but fighters have their share of problems, the ones I greentexted are the worse part right now.