Well Yea Forums? Should developers ignore fans?

>Dont get mad it's just a clickbait
First fucking sentence. Gaming "journalism" everyone.

SJWs are fans. So, yes.

Lol he's defending ME3, fucking game journalists.

>Creative vision
It's a AAA product

>Mass Effect 3 feels like ground zero for toxic fan entitlement.
>check date
That this seriously posted today?

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ME3 was a shitfest, the ending was the least of it's issue but the reason why it was changed was that it went against everything they had built the franchise to be (also the game was clearly rushed out the door because daddy EA hates the idea of spending more money than necessary and would rather have their IP's burn to the ground), the whole idea of your actions having any impact or mattering at all was thrown out the window that game
There is no such thing as "toxic entitlement", people spent their hard earned cash on a promise that failed to deliver, same with GoT, people have spent years dedicated to watching that show only for the writers to clearly not give much of a shit and fumbling the last season of a TV show that had gripped the world

>That
*Was
Damn it, I haven't drunk that much yet.

Hi Kirk, I'll pay your rent this month if you agree to a fight with me. I want the world to see me beating the shit out of you in a legal manner.

devs haven´t been listening to fans for over 5 years now
thats why they continue to put more and more sjw/feminist shit into it instead of actually making new and good games

>BioWare has a lot to answer for, basically. Mass Effect 3 feels like ground zero for toxic fan entitlement.
God I fucking hate these “journalists”, so fucking much.

>western aaa
>creative vision
kek, everything is made by a committee, by the checklist

getting the excuses in early, nice.

I wouldn't have a problem (mostly because it has always been the case) if the implication wasn't "don't listen to them, listen to us instead".

>Don't listen to the fans
>Listen US, the journalists who don't play games!

They've been ignoring fans for 2 generations.

If developers listened to Yea Forums we'd never get a single good game anymore.

If you think video games are art and you are making your game as a piece of art, absolutely. Art should represent the vision of its creator, independent of external factors. Don't be surprised, however, if your game doesn't sell.

If you do not believe games are art, and are making a game with intention to sell it for profit, you should absolutely listen to fans within reason. Monetization model drives game design, so you want to make sure the product you make will be purchased by fans.

>don't listen to those those who fund you
>instead listen to the BROKE ASS URIANLIST MASS SHITTING MEDIA

>GAWKER MEDIA
BTFO AND LOSING ALL MONEY,
AIN'T WORTH SHIT,
NOBODY WANTS TO BUY IT,
IT'S SELLING UNDERVALUED,
THE SJW GARBAGE IS BEING FIRED
>UNIVISION COMMUNICATIONS WHICH BOUGHT GAWKER DOGSHIT
>FUSION MEDIA GROUP
>Deadspin, Gizmodo/io9, Jalopnik, Jezebel, Kotaku, Lifehacker, Splinter
BTFO AND LOSING ALL MONEY,
AIN'T WORTH SHIT,
NOBODY WANTS TO BUY IT,
IT'S SELLING UNDERVALUED,
THE SJW GARBAGE IS BEING FIRED
>SALON MEDIA GROUP
>worth 1.5 Billion in 2006
BTFO AND LOSING ALL MONEY,
AIN'T WORTH SHIT,
NOBODY WANTS TO BUY IT,
IT'S SELLING UNDERVALUED,
THE SJW GARBAGE IS BEING FIRED
>NeoGAF
IN THE YEAR OF 2017,
SJW's INFESTED THIS BIN
CORRUPT SMEAR MERCHANT "JOURNALISTS", PEDOPHILE MODS,
AND FINALLY A RAPIST "FEMINIST" ADMIN,
DOWN WENT THE SHIP OF SJW FAMINE
>VOX MEDIA
>The Verge, Vox, Polygon, Curbed, Eater, SB Natio
BTFO AND ALWAYS LEAKING MONEY,
'1%' INVESTORS DESPERATELY INJECTING HONEY,
EMPLOYEES DOING WALKOUTS, LAYOFFS, WHINING
THAT'S WHAT YOU GET WITH SJW FAMINE
>ThinkProgress
AMONG THE TOP THIS PROGRESSIVE DUMP ONCE WAS,
ITS FINANCES COLLAPSING FROM THE CONSTANT BRAWLS
SJW's SEETHING, INVESTORS KEEP BLEEDING,
I'M APPLAUDING, GRINNING, CHEERING!

GO WOKE, GO BROKE
GO WOKE, GO BROKE

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Why?

I don't think WoW Classic will ever drop below 50k players, by nature of the fact there are still people playing Everquest 1. That said, I would not be surprised if the WoW Classic numbers look something like: September 2019 10M, November 2019 4M, September 2020 50k.

>HBO would never remake the last season of game of thrones because that's absurd
Why? If they made an awful final season why NOT redo it properly? It would make them more money and make the fans happy.

Yeah they need to listen to their hearts.
Their pervert dirty hearts.

Unironically yes
Devs should listen to no one but themselves and paid playtesters so that it doesn't fuck with their original image of the game. not """journalists""" or sjws, no one

>ME3
>toxic fan entitlement

What an absolute fucking shitstain. Corporate cocksuckers need to fucking hang.

EQ1 was a million times better than WoW was at any point in its lifecycle

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That's what they want. They literally write this to piss you off, otherwise they wouldn't have picked ME3 of all things. Don't fall for their low quality bait. I honestly wish there was a rule on Yea Forums to permaban anyone that posts things like these. I wouldn't be surprised if the same person writing that article is the one spamming it here.

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>linking clickbait sites
Kill yourself
Based

have sex incel

t. poopsocker

Corporations like those only care about saving face. But honestly, if they were smart they'd make an "expanded finale" animation series that's 20-30 episodes long and doesn't step on anyone's toes. Unfortunately, this is HBO we're talking about, the same people that cancelled Carnivale.

dilate

>it's artistic vision to have the same ending with different filters and subtle dialog changes.
based retard

to this day the stance "journalists" took on me3 baffles me.
>fans sold a shit product on unfulfilled promises
>complaining that they were lied to is "toxic"
>"journalists" either fail to understand that fans will be less likely to buy things from bioware in the future if they've been burned or think fans should buy shit anyway because it would be toxic not to give away your money
what confuses me is their motivation. what do they actually stand to gain by being so anti-consumer? what's their game? is it just inflammatory for the sake of being clickbait or are they just stupid?

Nah. Even if you excluded the entire end-game raid content and every xpac, it's still better

Pretty much this with the added bonus of "Publishers should stop listening to the media". Devs I think are more or less balanced in their approach. Publishers, however, are the ones looking to demand ________ for marketing reasons and homogenize in order to upscale their revenue projections.

>Should developers ignore fans?

If they do their games won't sell simple

It's not an excuse. Blizzard fucked up classic but keel ignoring their fuck ups for all I care. You people legit make me sick defending them.

If you promise shit, expect to be held accountable for such promises.

>what do they actually stand to gain by being so anti-consumer? what's their game?
umm why are the guys who get paid by devs and publishers to shill their shitty games against customers???

Game devs have been in bed with the journos since basically the dawn of the industry. It's not about the consumer. It's about getting you to buy the games they want to talk about or are paid to.

This is an unspoken rule that basically all great creators follow, they just never say it out loud because they don't want to scare off their audience.

95% of all fan requests are dumb and retarded ideas.

>clickbait
>no archive
Hi Kirk
Advertising is against the site rules.

I am still mad.

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It's access media. They defend the corps to retain access. And their views are heavily skewed by having a different sort of personal investment. Their livelihood relies on maintaining access to review copies and interviews, they aren't playing these games after buying them with their own money and out of their own interest in the franchise.

So nothing much would change?

Oh yeah, it's the customers fault devs make shit no one wants.

Wait a minute

This is the retard who thought Nero was Dante and then tardraged on twotter about toxic DMC fans.

Yep. I don't remember who it was, but at one point I heard a guy on a podcast talk about how they always fought over who would go to Japan because they would put you in the best hotel, get hot escorts to be with you the entire time, and so on. And if you say no, they'll just blacklist you from doing anything so that the company you work for is ultimately forced to fire you. Without actual laws to stop this, it won't stop. I don't remember who it was, but I am pretty sure Disney barred an outlet from their screenings because they wrote a negative piece about Disney's shady business practices.

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Consumers cannot be entitled, they are paying for a product. It's more like developers think they are entitled to immunity from criticism

Art should never succumb to the will of the people. However, since video games aren't art, but a product made for consumption, consumers have every right to demand a product that will make them happy.

>Part of the issue here is how our industry feeds into this entitlement.

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>Should developers ignore fans?
nah, but also not to take everything seriously what fans say

Wait, really?

yes, always. all producers of all media should. 'ignore' is not even correct; they should in most circumstances deliberately defy their audiences wishes. because nobody consuming a work actually wants what they think they do.

All journalists must hang

>implying art in general isn't also made for consumption
everything is art retard, doesn't mean you still can't sell it

>Mass Effect 3 and Dragon Age 2 mark the exact moment that Bioware turned to shit
>It was entitlement to be dissatisfied with them

Friendly reminder how bad ME3 actually was.

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Yup. This guy is a legitimate retard. No wonder he's assblasted about fans.

As long as they don't listen to SJWs too. FFXV listen to fans get ruined, Valkyria revolution ruined and Nioh dumped down. Listen to SJWs and ethics department SE will ruin their FF7R. If japs are smart will make their games like 80s and 90s and stop sucking into the politically correct cock and will stop caring about cero ratings. Fcuk "fans" and fuck sjws. the same "fans" that are happy about tifa censorship and other events censor.

>If a game doesn’t run well, it’s “bad optimisation”.
Um, how is that wrong, clickbait video game site? If a game is targetting 30 fps and regularly dips down to single digits, it is poorly optimized.

No, not everything is art, and no, art is not made purely for consumption like a TV or a burger is.

Fuck off.

I posted the archive link several replies below dumbass

Based
But also bluepilled, if you're online and aren't using an ad blocker in 2019 then you should hang.

They should, but for the very opposite reasons of OP.

I feel zero remorse for the fags who felt that they got cheated by Bioware with ME3

If you didn't see the signs of what they will become during Dragon Age 2 and SWTOR you deserves all the shit that got flung into your face.

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mobile.twitter.com/mckkirk/status/1006039506485534720?lang=en

Yup its the same fucking guy. Anyone from DMC5's reveal will remember this dipshit spazzing out.

LOL you know how many sites I can't go to cause of my ad blocker. Always telling me to disable my ad blocker.

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>Then there’s Mass Effect: Andromeda, a game taken down by gifs. Development focus was on creating worlds and learning how to use an entirely new engine that isn’t well-suited to RPG development. As such, the facial animations suffered and people took the piss in gifs. Back in the day, it was a given that RPGs didn’t look as nice as other games because of the scope.

Is this mother fucker implying that Andromeda had good story telling, gameplay, or world design? Because it didn't. The animations were just easy to latch on to, especially when attached to the stilted dialogue of those scenes.

of course they should
it's called artistic integrity

After linking directpy to it you dipshit. Fuck off Kirk.

According to you. You do realize that tv manufacturers put a lot of thought into what the tv actually looks like right? And have since they first came out?

>a what is art conversation on Yea Forums
no no no please stop this is embarrassing and nobody will win

Absolutely. Video game players are complete retards for the most part. Just look at you guys.

>toxicity
>entitlement
The word Entitlement seems to be solely used by passive aggressive defense forces nowadays

>dude all of the games they have been producing before ME3 are all undefendable garbage surely they will pull through with ME3 right???

retard

>bending its creative vision to pander to the baying masses.
What vision...? Three endings that differed in color filter?
>This rarely happens in any other medium – sure, you could point at the Sonic movie changing his appearance over criticism, but it’s the video game crowd once again. Elsewhere, people have petitioned to have the last season of Game of Thrones remade, but HBO would never do that. Because it’s absurd.
Yeah no fucking shit? Patching games after launch is hell of a lot easier than changing a movie or a tv-show after launch. Jesus christ I hate gaming journalists.

fine fine, i was mostly shitposting to get a rise anyway.

not using archive links should be a bannable offense i m o

Can't wait for all the (((journalists))) to lose their shitty jobs to robots.

I'd rather read articles written by a legit NPC than by the empty shell of what used to be a human being with a soul.

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Good, fuck those shitty sites.
Any site that tries to block me for using an adblocker immediately goes into my blacklist.

i suppose i should be more clear. i know game journalism is and always has been a joke, what confuses me is just how ineffective this particular avenue of corruption appears to be. it must be possible to shill without being explicitly anti-consumer, right? i mean you'd think an article effectively titled "fans absolutely fucking despise the latest mass effect game and are boycotting it en-masse but i think they're wrong and stupid" is doing a rather bad job of shilling for the game. if i worked at ea and were trying to handle the journalism relations side of things i'd probably ask them to not write article after article drawing attention to the negative backlash or constantly insult the loudest and most passionate fans. maybe i'm wrong but it certainly doesn't fucking seem to be working out for them currently

They can. But no whining about sales later.

So? TVs aren't art. Fuck off, once more. If you are seriously arguing that a technical appliance designed for mass manufacturing and use is art, you need to kys.

That, and Marketing teams. I feel like tons of games get ruined because marketing wants them to change things one way or another.

>"Fans just don't know how difficult game development is so they should have no input"
>Proceeds to give input on the difficulty of game development while having zero idea of what he's talking about
What's amusing about these type of articles is that they constantly compare us to other industries, but I don't remember the last time I went to a movie (Outside of a Marvel Studio Production) where the CGI effects where still unfinished with placeholder models, or an entire act is missing. You may get shitty books or shitty movies that do a poor job of delivering a product, but that product is usually complete. These journos only come to the defense of big AAA publishers that regularly sell us an incomplete broken product at launch and expect us to be okay with it. And a majority of consumers usually are, but there's at least been a slow backlash recently.
And it's when these backlashes occur that these articles come out. If the industry is the state that is in now, it's because of these fucks rushing into the rescue on those poor publishers. They cover up or ignore the technical flaws of a game's launch by putting a 9/10 score out and not even mentioning it. The worst part is when they use that same game years down the line and call it "worst game in the series" (like this guy did with MGS4, critically acclaimed by the press, now it's the worst game?). They demonize and label the consumers for being offended, or they just straight up ignore the controversy and let the story die out. They don't use their position or influence to steer the media into a better place. They stay quiet, complacent and encourage this bullshit, and the only reason us "gamers" are starting to get louder and louder is because these fucks aren't doing their fucking job.

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It's an effort to discredit word-of-mouth and amplify the influence of advertising. Same reason they have such a hateboner for piracy. Don't listen to those people who have actually played the game, listen to the publishers and their mouthpieces.

Didn't stop them from bitching about DmC when that flopped.

Maybe people should just stop buying western "AAA" games?

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Fans are usually fucking idiots, they don't know what they want and will keep buying any shit as long as you slap the name of their favourite franchise on it.

Christ he's targeting people who disagree with them by posting their accounts and directing his shit-eating fans to attack them. Even towards actual devs calling him out.

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>why are fans so entitled and toxic
>WOW LOOK AT THIS GUY MAKE SURE TO DIRECT HATE HERE

>All of this meaningless drivel over nothing
If a GAME has bad GAMEplay. The devs fucked up. End of story. No further debate required. I don't care how hard the devs worked, I don't care how mean the fans are. If a GAME has bad GAMEplay. It's a fuck up. No reason to avoid that issue by crying about when and where fans should be listened to.

lmao could you imagine if any developer took advice from Yea Forums

Stop using twitter and stop posting screencaps of it on this board please.

I say they do it. Completely ignore all the fans, do what you want and then after the chapter 11 gets filed, live as a better person, having learned an important lesson.

Several devs need to do exactly this so there can be many examples for real developers (the kinds whose brains actually work) to learn from.

sure if they hate money

>get message telling me to turn off ad blocker
>right click, hide element

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user
and i mean this in the kindest way
what the fuck is wrong with your font rendering?

>Didn't stop them from bitching about DmC when that flopped.

and all that whining was done back when all this SJW shit wasn't even a thing to motivate those retards to write inflammatory articles for brownie points too, they just do it out of spite for the fans of the original series for liking the japs' design over the west.

further proving that game journalists (and most journalists in general) are human garbage.

I saw the signs but I was already too deep into the story with love for the previous games. All I was hoping is that they wouldn't fuck it so hard. It just needed one more game to be decent to bring it together.

Of course as we all know, it was one of the worst fuck ups ever. Even if you forget the ending, there was so much else wrong with it.

>thats why they continue to put more and more sjw/feminist shit into it instead of actually making new and good games
It's more because devs and marketers know that the controversy they create with sjw/feminist shit will actually benefit them if they play their cards right. Just look at what Disney has been doing lately with their films. They kick the hornet's nest with divisive identity politics, and then they sit back and watch those sweet, sweet (You)s flow in. Normies get curious about all the hubbub and end up paying to see their shitty remakes/sequels.

The DmC articles were a clear cut case of paid for "journalism".
All of them made sure to talk on and on about how the fans were boycotting the game solely due to how it looked when everyone was actually shitting on its awful gameplay changes, performance and of course writing.
I will never forget them thanking a certain publication for their 9/10 review only to be met by a response stating that their review wasn't out yet.
The cherry on top is that when it did it was a fucking 9.

Because You(s) really help sales - ask DICE.

TURN ON FONT ANTI-ALIASING RETARD

No anti-aliasing.

Are you in the spectrum?

imagine listening to journos

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yes, i would love to see the game industry collapse

>Even if you forget the ending, there was so much else wrong with it.

Is ME3 the first game to guilt-trip a black homosexual relationship on your character?

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They do generate interesting....discussions.

Paid for on behalf of Ninja Theory, but I also firmly believe that journos really wanted to push the idea that Ninka Theorty was a groundbreaking studio to further push the idea that games are art.

>black
Spanish

I don't think so. Is twitter hate on Yea Forums new to you?

>Should developers ignore fans?
The loud obnoxious and stupid kind?
Sure.

Anyone mad at this article is being outplayed. It was written with the intent to be as provocative as possible, so that everyone would be sharing it far and wide, showing how much they hate it.
The website who published this article has terrible traffic. This is a desperate measure.

>I will never forget them thanking a certain publication for their 9/10 review only to be met by a response stating that their review wasn't out yet.

DmC threads were ultra comfy and everyday it brings new crazy and exciting happenings.

God I fucking miss back when it's cool and justified to hate on a shit game dev and not get bombarded by a trillion trannies and shills labelling me as /pol/ for hating on a shit game.

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What a fucking faggot lol. I swear there are zoomers on Yea Forums who are more mature than the middle aged losers on twitter.

...

What did they change in ME3 ending?

I don't completely disagree with the sentiment. Feedback is not equally helpful and the mob feedback that's mentioned in that article comes from every side of the conversation.
It's just not helpful.

It's not new when it's specifically towards a bait thread. That post is within context to this thread.

Journalism in general died with Internet.

No that's also the way NT are marketing themselves in general. Just look at their latest game for example, the studio has done nothing but attempted to create that image for themselves for quite a while.
Games "journalism" is not about pushing agendas or anything, these people are simply advertisers and clickbaiters. It just so happens that it's this kind of thing that gets you clicks. If being a literal Nazi was the thing to be then they would immediately become that. Don't be fooled.

They added a Deus Ex Human Revolution type slideshow.

Because they started hiring shit bloggers to write articles

100% YES

Just make what you want and listen to the market. Ignore what customers say, watch what they DO

The thread isn't bait. It's got an articles about some nobody in the OP sure but it's entirely possible to ignore it and just talk about how devs should treat feedback if at all.
Discussing how said nobody is a faggot and acts like one on twitter is just gossip. Go gossip elsewhere.

>fan entitlement

FUCK OFF NO OTHER INDUSTRY DOES THIS

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>Nioh

To be fair they learned their lesson; 2 is the same game as 1 (character creator notwithstanding) instead of listening to the loud Soulsfaggots and turning it into a bland 1:1 Souls clone.

The movie industry is starting to do it.

Essentially, stop letting Twitter and other social media pressure you into making design choices.

This article is especially aggravating because, despite the idea expressed in the first paragraph being correct (it's true that most of the criticism you'll hear about any game isn't useful), the entire rest of the article uses generic industry-shilling examples like DmC and ME3.

I see you haven't been following movie industry

Man i dont remember any of the endings
might have to replay the series

Futbol clubs in Latin America do this.

Why does the /pol/ character have boobs?

movies also pushes this shit, just go to Yea Forums and see the exact same responses made by trannies and politics shills when discussing a movie with forced diversity.

Kenny used to be based
youtube.com/watch?v=BC-MKzl1mig

>someone posting my mad so I don't have to
>pretty sure Disney barred an outlet from their screenings because they wrote a negative piece about Disney's shady business practices.
They did, the LA times no less. They only reversed course because there was a huge stink about it

if you had any kind of reading comprehension would would know its a resetera false flagger

(((hollywood))) started this trend and it's been leaking into every other hobby.

the joker meme really got hijacked huh

>I don't remember the last time I went to a movie (Outside of a Marvel Studio Production) where the CGI effects where still unfinished with placeholder models, or an entire act is missing
I do, Justice League

>(((hollywood))) started this trend

more like the leftists, they have been forcing their retarded identity crap down table top games and comics for a long time even before hollywood.

They can't hijack something that was created by themselves in the first place.

well there's a lot to be said for valuing the vision of the developer over the urge to gratify the player at every turn. a great example would be, well, most of the decisions in the second half of MGS2, almost all of them frustrate the player and I'm sure they got negative feedback about them but as a result the game is great. same goes for a lot of SMT games, and a lot of the old Fire Emblem games. I could name a lot more but you get the idea. let's read the article-
>Mass Effect 3
never mind, into the trash with this article

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>hijacked
Gamers Rise Up was always MOCKING the idea of gaming enthusiasts 'rising up'.

You can also ignore everything in this thread about this nobody and discuss the issue at hand.
But while other posts adressed this nobody and journalists in general, you chose not to weight in with your opinion, you did that with an specific twitter post. Why is that? If only seeing a twitter layout triggers your anger, it means that you should spend less time in this site altogether. Surely you have other means of passing your time. Something that won't get you pissed for no good reason. Unless you enjoy getting angry at whatever, then please proceed.

I had never seen this video before.
I know it's a parody but Colin Moriarty said things along those lines after ME3? I thought many people considered him to be /ourguy/.

nah, they are trying to destroy the meme because it works
look how they co-opt everything else
>triggered
>soiboi
>NPC
you can tell when something really gets under their skin when they start using it themselves
Soon trannies will start telling people to dilate.

What are you talking about? I'm not angry, just trying to prevent derailment since I think it's an interesting topic. Stop trying to justify your gossip dude.

stop making serious posts to reactionary "fuck all X threads!!!" underage posters, all they ever do is blindly repeat the same cool phrase they seen on Yea Forums and never process that statement with their own brains.

Don’t waste your time, I forgot everything and looked up the plot on a wiki and it was beyond shit. The end is awful and later games ruined everything that made the universe interesting. What a fucking dumpster fire.

This

Reasonable and high IQ post.

going from mocking those types of people who genuinely think of themselves as gamers to mocking any sort of fan backlash seems like a big change to me

>BUT WE WORKED HARD ON THIS GAME.

Besides the obvious of >desk job is hard work, anytime I here anyone use this excuse reminds me of the Teen Titans episode where Beast Boy has to team up with his old leader of Doom Patrol to save their friends. The leader is just smashing the shit out of everything but they don't even get to the door. He starts raging at BB for being ungrateful cause he is working hard and BB just says " Hard work is getting us nowhere! Robin taught us to work SMART!" Commander lets BB lead and they actually save everyone.

The point is, hard work gets you nowhere. So the idea of these devs doing "hard work" in a job that requires you to sit at a desk all day for a shit game really shows just how fucking stupid they are and why all their complaining is bullshit.

>they are STILL fucking stuck on the ME3 ending
>YEARS after literally everyone who fucking matters has shown how poorly it suits the series
>YEARS after ME3 showed that Bioware was, in fact, dead
>FUCKING YEARS

Gamers are dead.
Gamers don't have to be your audience.

This. Listen to "women" instead.

>Fans tricked Bioware into making Anthem a bad game by posting ME:A gifs
Someone is ACTUALLY paying this faggot to shitpost

They bring up clicks and adrevenue

>Are you in the spectrum
You should be saying "on the spectrum" instead of "in the spectrum". You're welcome sweetie :)

Clearly there's a difference between the main fans and the retarded vocal minority

I unironically agree, just for a different reason. Devs should make the games they want to play and if someone else wants to play it too, cool.
That way you end up with passion projects and experimentation and other good things. Shit that isn't created to make money but to engage. Making what other people want never works out because you don't -know- what other people want. You can guess, and you'll probably be wrong. You'll also never make everybody happy with it. The promise of making a game for a group of people just leads to watered down focus grouped horseshit.

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>Mass Effect 3
>creative vision

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This.
>devs make whatever they want
>publishers stop catering to the media
>fans stop buying shit they don't like
Simple, right? But nah, apparently this is utopia-tier thinking. Retards will continue to give devs they hate money, devs will continue to bend to the whim of 18 year old nerds who don't know the first thing about game development, and publishers will continue to force in artificial changes to make their product appeal to a wider audience.

The important question isn't what they do, but why they do it. Reason being, if you want to try and replicate some success or avoid some failure, you need to know why it succeeded or failed, what it was about it that made people buy or shun it.
If there were actually a solution to this problem, we would all know about it. Instead people use words they don't understand like "big data analytics" and "machine learning" to make it sound like they have a solution.

some fans are worth listening too.
99.99997% should be shot and their corpse left to rot, they aren't worth a burial. even then i'm still being generous with that number.
companies like bioware are just niggers who will ruin everything on their own terms.

these are the facts.

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I think there's a threshold of justified fan entitlement, and several games will disappoint some of the fanbase but only a very few games are so bad to piss everyone off to the degree that nobody can even justify it. ME3 was one of those games, and ME3 wasn't some fucking auteur art game it was committee prodiced AAA EA garbage.

they handled it completely wrong though, it's not a refutation to his point. They basically called out the majority of their fans and then dared them not to buy their game.

Oh I am definitely not defending Bioware. ME3 and Andromeda were definitively watered down focus group horseshit marketed towards people who don't like video games. There isn't an ounce of passion left in that studio because all they fuckin' do is listen to their California-liberal forum users. Anyone who wanted to make WOW COOL SPACE GAME is long gone.

>Dont have to listen to fans.
Then I won't buy it. You're not entitled to my money.

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I don't get it, whats wrong with is bio it looks a little weird with the "a bunch of cells" and "exist" but nothing near deserving a jesus

You don't understand he's satirizing it to some degree so he's a hideous transphobe.

just a coincidence goy

To a certain degree, yes. Not 100% though. Fans that bitch and moan about balance in a PvE game, for example, are bitch scum that legitimately want to impose THEIR idea of "fun" onto everyone else for the sole reason of MUH BALANCE. Balance is a hot topic in any game but when it comes to PvE it's much less severe, but faggot fans will try their best to have you believe otherwise.

An example of this? Warframe. You are a god in that game regardless of what you use most of the time, but people and the devs still bitch and moan about balance in what is just a simplistic PvE game. This is just one extreme example, but yeah, devs shouldn't listen 100% of the time.

On the flip side, they SHOULD listen to fans when it comes to PvP games such as fighting games, but the idea is to listen to constructive criticism of legitimate problems in balancing or other bugs/glitches.

Notice how the author did not include the media along with fans. They are not calling for developers to work in a vacuum, they want to be the only voice that has influence.

Journalism had been dead for decades prior.

>devs should listen to crying gay faggots LGBT and feminist
>they shouldn't listen to people who buy games

That makes no sense whatsoever. They add all of that shit because they're full of activists who want to push an agenda. The execs go along with it because they're told it'll widen the audience and bring in more revenue.

absolutely they should stop listening
who wants to keep pandering to a bunch of racist incels all the time?
sounds soul draining.

They've been doing that for years. It's never about the fans and if they do do something, it's usually a bone or two to keep them quiet while they pander to the non-fans. Speaking with your wallet is a very strong tactic against these types of business practices. I'm not even talking about the diversity bullshit, that is its own can of worms that I laugh at as a black man who's played vidya since he was three, I'm talking outright dumbing down games and then calling fans entitled when they complain.

Gamers rise up, game journalists are trash and should be put in the gutter.

>This was Biowares creativity and the evil masses with their entitlement were just crying babies about it.

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Oh my fucking GOD ITS THE SAME FUCK WHO WROTE THIS

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Why are journalists so entitled?

Do you think the vast majority of people who aren't entitled would go for a degree like English or Journalism?

You now remember BioWare wrote in a literal Narutard-tier weeb space ninja villain known as Kai Leng, who steals Commander Shepard's cereal from out of his pantry and sends taunting emails about how badly Kai Leng can beat up your dad.

doing god's work, user

Sometimes devs listening to fans ruins the game like how Reddit ruined Ace of Spades. Or how Creative Assembly listens to the MP crowd too much, ruining the fun of the SP campaign.

To an extent developers unironically should not. Don't make what your fans think they want, make what they will want.
Of course there are limits to stupidity. If shit is going too far then you better listen.

Why is gaming journalism filled with people that hate video games?

Because you click it

it's because they have to suck corporate cock for "exclusive access"

I didn't click anything

That actually made me laugh.

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You don't make the world better if you tell people what to do. You have to make sure that people who don't or can't care are helping too.
Which is why recycling is stupid.

I was joking
Most video game journalists don't actually hate games, you just have brainrot.

you know you can get around those in about 30 seconds, right?

Bioware would still be alive if they didn't listen to their dumb racist incel gamer fans

Is DA2 really that bad? I didn't like 3, but I was planning to play 2 after replaying Origins for the 3rd time

Is Capcom just not rich enough to get journos to suck their dick endlessly?

It’s worse than Inquisition

>Blue Checkmark being retarded
What did you expect?

>Should developers ignore fans?
it's fine by me, make whatever you want. Don't complain when your studio goes bankrupt though

>10M
What kind of shit are you smoking? How can you be so delusional? I'd be surprised if it can reach 1M

Yes. A true artist don't change his or her art just because some people don't like it, and honestly, it would stifle the industry if everyone just changed their art to conform to the loud minority. And in that regard, this is how you discern the difference between someone who wants to share their creative vision to the world and someone who just wants to make money.

Oh god it's so awful

...they weren't already? News to me...
>unskippable cutscenes
>the old 'you won the battle but the enemy beats you in a cutscene afterward'
>plots are still 'muh heart, muh sole'
>MMOs still the same shit with shit systems

I'm struggling to think of a single example where fans were 'listened to' in recent history...

Yes. A true artist doesn't change his or her art just because some people don't like it, and honestly, it would stifle the industry if everyone just changed their art to conform to local standards. And in that regard, this is how you discern the difference between someone who wants to share their creative vision to the world and someone who just wants to make money.

They should ignore fans opinions but strictly adhere to critics whims.
Don't listen to the people who buy your product, listen to us, who hate games and just want to reshape entertainment in the image somebody else might like enough to sleep with me.

>since I'm paying for this art, could you make the flowers more blue?
>uh yeah no I'm actually a true artist, so

So uh, could you go back in time right quick and tell Picasso to make his art look less like vomit? Thanks

Donald Trump is a child rapist.
scribd.com/doc/310835987/Donald-Trump-Lawsuit?campaign=VigLink&ad_group=xxc1xx

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>Blizzard
>World of Warcraft
>Diablo Immortal
They didn't listen alright. What did it get them?

wrong. Mass Effect 3 has no ending. imagine spending 10 years of your life, and being told all of your choices matter, only to have NONE of your choices matter....and then be called an entitled toxic gamer because you didn't get what was advertised.

yeah, articles like this can fuck off. This is why I pirate most (most) games now. They stopped caring about fans and started serving us shit.

That's exactly how it's always worked and how it should worked, and most people buy the art anyway regardless of whether the flower's blue or not. You don't like it, make your own. That's how the world works, nobody else will change for you.

I knew the fucking Irish were up to no good

Oh shit, if a woman said it, it must be true.

kek

You should like you've never produced anything of value in your life, and you excuse this by having everything be wishy washy, open to interpretation. You're a true artist, so whatever you do isn't actually at risk of being bad. Pretty smart.

They don't call them "starvign artists" for nothing. Sometimes you gotta eat so you do what the client whos paying you asks. Otherwise starve. or get sued for fraud.

>it would stifle the industry if everyone just changed their art to conform to local standards.

isn't this what they are doing because of the shareholders? Can't have a titty in this M rated game. Mee too has the industry changing a lot of games.

RIP nordbro

If they want to commit suicide with their company then yes.

We consumers put them with work. Ignore us then you wont get paid.

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You sound like a games journalist

to some extent
if you listen to everything retards say, you're going to end up with a pile of shit
but if you dont listen to anything people say, you're going to end up with a pile of shit no one wants

God I hate every thing about social media.

Wrong, you fucking imbeciles. This is a better analogy
>hey, ill pay you $60 for a drawing of blue flowers
>here is a drawing of red flowers, and i cut part of it off
>why would you do that? i want my money back now
>go fuck yourself, now let me ask my art critic friends to publish a piece called "why patrons are selfish assholes: the artist's plight"

Nah, in a competitive market you're actually supposed to listen to their feedback and then sort through to find what's valuable for your company.

You think it died with the internet, but in truth "journalism" has almost always been bullshit. The internet just gave people to the potential to see through all the lies.

Mate I basically agree with you 100% here but how you've said it is so embarrassing I want to headbutt a bullet

That was the intent

It's obviously a bad idea to give consumers what they want. Catering is part of how a market economy works. What are you, some kind of capitalist bigot?

This. During the early days of ww1, there were 20 year old photigraphs of Ukrainian bodies used to illustrate the fallout of Germanys march through Belgium.
The press have been lying as soon as somebody figured out people trust what they say, which would be around day 2 of the written word.

It really is THAT awful. They made the game within a crazy short time frame AND were trying out all their awful new ideas as well.

It's all art, but you don't get to advertise something as one thing then sell another and insult your paying customers, you also shouldn't be able to take something made by people better than you, and fuck it up, then pretend it was always like that. Me3 did both.

Well fucking played my man. Over and ou-

More
>support the developer!
and pro digital distribution, anti physical copy propaganda.
Games should go back to being sold physical only and all the positives that come with that. Anyone that doesn't want a physical copy can pirate, but they'll have it even better too since games will be better.
They make more money with less effort and while producing a lower quality game and they still bitch. They have more pay pigs than ever before because of digital distribution which they pushed and paid the "journalists" to help push which lowered the barrier of access so now most people that play games are people that otherwise wouldn't play without paid digital distribution, they wouldn't even bother pirating.
The top 6 most expensive games to make were sold physical only when they came out.
The superior to LCD, LED, and OLED TV technology, SED, didn't come to market because of a lawsuit

He wrote it fine, would you want a food analogy?

Listening to fans, casuals and sjws is why many modern games are such horseshit. IT is the reason why for example WoW became trash.
This is an undisputable fact so you better let it sink in comfortably.

>make shit movies
>bomb
>blame the audience
I guess games are indeed movies.

>still complaining that bioware changed the trash ending of mass effect 3 after nearly a decade
Those EA checks must have fucking huge.

Also I bet there's an article on that website applauding Ubisoft for catering to people that demanded that the canon straight relationship they created in the expansion be changed.

What a strange concept. People want changed when you produce trash. Who could have thought?

They should also stop listening to journalists too

The "gamers are dead" articles from 5 years ago had a deeper meaning than what you originally thought.
It meant "it's time to groom a new generation of braindead corporate drones that will suck our cock no matter what".
The whole "don't ask questions consume product and get excited for new product" however retarded the source may be is 100% legit. That was their intent. You're the devil for getting in the way of profit.
It's already a miracle they haven't called fans mongoloids for demanding Sonic's movie design to be fixed, and it's even a bigger miracle that the director caved in.

No it's not you dumb faggot, I'm an actual honest to god artist. You do what the client pays you to do, if you're one of those abstract retards who started doing nothing nobody buys your garbage unless somebody happens to set a precedent. Half the time you see those crappy artists who sell a painting that's solid blue for a few mill it's usually money laundering or child trafficking. Any artist worth anything gives the patron what they want, that's how business works you filthy fucking commie.

If you're an indie developer doing it for the art or just being new and creative, sure. Be open to criticism but otherwise go with what you want.

However, if you're a multi-million dollar AAA company who's obvious primary concern is repeating the same safe marketing appeals (or the hot new fad) loaded with day one DLC and lootboxes/micropayments for the sole purpose of making as much money as possible? Nah, there's really no purpose not to having good PR unless you're literally too big to fail like Pokemon is.

The odd part here is that this culture has benefited absolutely everyone but consumers. It's a cycle where creators get it in their head that any fan critic is basically like that Stephen King story where the author gets tortured because the fan doesn't like where he took a story. There's an absolutely massive victim complex among these people already, and corporate suits want to encourage it because they, never caring about what fans actually want, love to have a group that would normally be on the side of people who give a shit and care about their work dismiss any criticism as upset fanboys.

The masses are retarded. Almost no great works of art were great because the creator got advice from common plebs. Developers absolutely should not listen to fans.

high art is not the same as a consumer product made for the masses. You can easily have a consumer product that ends up considered a higher art than intended, but it doesn't work the other way around as easily.

I’m convinced we will have a song of ice and fire animated series of movies in the next 10 years.

consumer goods are not an investment

Developers? Fuck the developers. When i buy a game i buy it to enjoy it, not to make sure some goddamn code monkey gets to have enough money to keep existing. Fuck developers and fuck gaming "journalism".

It's one thing to make something for the masses, and another thing to actually ask the masses what they want. Spielberg is a god of making art with mass appeal, but a pleb's opinion of what makes his art good ends up with shit like Jurassic World. People don't actually know what makes something good, they just know when they like something and attribute that positive feeling to surface level, tangible details of the art rather than the real meat of it.

You're working under the false premise people making products have the competence to make good products.
They're shitting on the audience because they know they cannot match the absolute sheer quality of past products no matter the tools they possess. The audience isn't too demanding, they just suck.

I'm not denying they suck, I'm just denying that the answer is to listen to fans and the media. Part of the problem is that they're listening to a certain subset of fans and media that are telling them gameplay doesn't matter as much as story, for example. I also don't think shitting on fans is the proper approach.

wew, journalists are fucking parasites

I like how he admits to making a clickbait title in the first sentence.

Why listen to fans, who will always be judgemental based on previous entries, when you could just listen to THE GLORIOUS CHINESE.

ALL
HAIL
OUR
CHINK
OVERLORDS IN
VIDYA AND MOVIES

Professional vidyablogger and he entirely missed the last couple of years live service model with analytics out the ass? They're "listening" to fans more than ever, even in single player games like the last Deus Ex they comb through every input and variable for tweaking the service to maximise the consumer's spending and manipulative Skinner box satisfaction.

This article isn't talking about fans, though. It's talking about rabid SJWs and shit that don't actually play the games at all.

>by nature of the fact there are still people playing Everquest 1
whoa whoa whoa hold up. There is a HUGE difference between WoW and Everquest. That's like comparing a pre-school to a corporate office. People stick with Everquest because of the community, not the game. The same reason people still play MUDs. WoW is neither of those and the community wasn't shit for all of about 2 weeks after retail launch in 2004, then the normies flooded in and went full-on fucking wrecking-ball to the online community that games like Ultima, Everquest, and Neverwinter Nights nourished into a wealth of quality individuals and interactions.

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Yeah and you're probably a literal who unlike most game directors and producers. They do what they want, and as it turns out their games are purchased by millions of people. Hilarious that you call me a commie when I'm defending creators' ability to freely express themselves.

Can you reallly defend an EA game's "creative vision" when the product you're getting was almost certainly creatively stifled by the higher-ups telling the devs to do the bidding of the shareholders?

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This anger is beautiful

DEVELOPERS RISE UP

Yes please, that way they can go broke even faster and we can get rid of shit games

There is no should or shouldn't. If you want to make more money, then of course, listen to the majority, but if you actually have a creative vision, then no, what the people want shouldn't matter. The reason these developers end up catering to the people who complain is because they honest-to-goodness do not have some grand vision and are just cranking out assembly line video game products for a paycheck. If they're going to do that, it'd be better that the game was at least mediocre. Doing that will NEVER create a great game, but both parties know that already, the fans just don't want a shitty game.

Judges, it's time to stop listening to the jury

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He is completely right.
These pieces of shit should just crash and burn.

what the fuck happend to vg247?

Give to your fans what they need, not what they want but still don't be an asshole toward your fans either.

Yes, but not because they want to push shitty mechanics or use their game as a vehicle for political education.