I feel heavy right now

It's a great game but seeing idiots seethe over it on Yea Forums is way too funny desu
>b-but i self inserted as Walker so game blames me for playing it!

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t. didn't play it and puppets his favourite youtubers opinions

the game is clearly talking directly to the player in the loading screens

You have a conscience, I guess?
I don't know, user. I got feels from the game, mostly when I got to the part with Lugo's hanging, I fired into the crowd like a motherfucker, as did a LOT of people according to Steam but I'm a bitter person anyhow, so it didn't affect me too bad.

>"Williams justified the scene by saying that the plot device was intended to evoke players' anger, and that a valid way to end the game is simply for the player to put the controller down and stop playing."
damn...what an artistic genius....

based retard poster parroting someone else's opinion

I really don't blame u for playing like that. If u enjoyed the game the way u want, You got your OP's support.
> in the end, it's just a game

>wow bro if i try to break the narrative early the game punishes me because i have no way to progress bro fucking stupid retart babbys first art game bro i should have major plot points spoiled early on lololol

they play into increasing paranoia walker has. the conrad imagery at the start of the game is part of the paranoia as well. someone is constantly watching and judging walker's actions, hey wait a sec didnt we do this in the prologue already (another element of the paranoia). it is a story about a soldier going insane. not commentary on morals.

It really is.

Good game. OP you can't play it "right", just go through all outcomes and decide which one you like more.

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>getting asshurt by loading screens
Lmao try paying attention to what's going on in-game

His own morality is a part of him going insane, it's pretty clear that everything bad Walker did was made with good intentions

How is it bad?

youtube.com/watch?v=XjdDyvGE8gE

It inspired some kino SFM

That's very stupid but it would totally make sense considering the "second" time you get to that segment Walker says "didn't we do this before?"

What really carried this game for me was nolan's performance into walker slowly becoming more unhinged with the combat barks and behavior while fighting.

Because I didn’t pay $30 to not play a game.

never said that. he just never denied and said the game is open for interpretation

>we gotta use wp to clear out the enemy or fight our way out in an almost impossible battle
>railroaded

yeah that's kinda how I played it too, sounds like the game did the trick

it's a great fucking game

Yeah but you can still keep playing? Saying that dropping the contrommer is a valid ending may be artsy farty but that they try to elicit the player's anger in a game about a broken man becoming even more tIsted and full of fire is perfectly legit.

but you paid 30 bucks to kill ragheads in a video game. bit fucked.

They didn't have the budget for the second route and apparently the xbox coumdn't handle the fight correctly or something anyway.

honestly most complaints would have been addressed if they took the time to create a "bad" ending for trying to fight normally without using a gas and having the game end prematurely there, since then the decision is tied to the character and not the actual player arbitrarily deciding that the story ends when you stop playing

>please tell me did I play it right?
it doesn't fucking matter
you get berated for every decision

>What can be told from the feelings I'm having right now?
that you're a faggot who likes 2deep4u-tier pretentious bullshit

>Kill walker
But why? He was the only person who could still walk away from all of that

>with tons of dots suspiciously grouped together
that AND the game only shows soldiers walking/standing around there

You can kill the snipers?

>AA12's on FUBAR

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>Nobody forces you to play the game if you're only interested in some gun - n -run types or somebody who ain' ready to handle consequences placed in the games

what consequences? There literally aren't any consequences aside from "HURR DURR U A BAD GUY FOR TRYING TA BE DA HERO LOOK HOW HORRIBLE EVERYTHANG U DO IS JUST BECAUSE YOU WANT TO BE A HERO!"

idk, it's from the wiki

But the choppers scene takes place far after Walker's first delusion. The whole game after that intro would be the "purgatory"..

You're the judge at the end how can you be berated?

He, I dunno. Yea Forums would probably still shit on the game for forcing you to use the WP to get to the rest of the game.

Hey OP, forget these Negative Nancys for a moment. As someone who really liked this game, there is no way to "play it right". Certain decisions can make things slightly less worse, but the whole thing is still a tragedy. Spec Ops: The Line is a critique of the idea of virtual killing as entertainment. When you boot up any game that features violence as its core loop, you're engaging in a power fantasy, unnecessarily killing hundreds of people because you want to feel powerful, because crushing your enemies is what makes an average Joe like you feel like a hero. SO:TL is turning this around and pointing out how pathetic that is.

People who complain that there is no good option are missing the point. Walker's mission was just to do recon and head back to base. He could have retreated the moment things got hairy, but he kept pressing on even as he only made everything worse. Like the player, he wants to feel like a hero, even though he isn't. As the player, by choosing to play the game, you've chosen that you want to kill hundreds of people in order to feel powerful. You keep playing even though it's apparent that you shouldn't be. By playing the game, you have made the wrong choice, and the only right choice is to stop playing.

Yeah, but the chopper scene is final thing he would remember from the real world.

>As the player, by choosing to play the game, you've chosen that you want to kill hundreds of people in order to feel powerful.

Truly another Holocaust. :(

You're the kind of retard why everything in media these days is nothing but happy endings, disney remakes and inoffensive capeshit.
Unironically go shove a shovel up your ass and neck yourself faggot.

I like to think that the epilogue where walker survives and leaves with the US soldiers is actually the prologue and the game itself is walker recalling the past events. and because hes ao fucked in the head theres a lot of discrepancies and all the choices were already made. in a sense this present walker is observing the past walker from an outside perspective, hence the third person camera. but hes still the director, a sort of puppeteer ordering himself around in his menories, trying to reconstruct the events that transpired.

the 2 dudes commenting your every "decision"

Uh oh looks like we got another smooth brain Spec Ops The Line thread brewing, let's get the BASICS out of the way so we can have a decent discussion for once.

>No, the game is not guilting you, in fact you and Walker are credited separately in the opening credits. Your profile name is a 'Special Guest'.

>Yes it is obvious to anyone that looked it was Civilians you were bombing, however Walker as a character would not of hesitated, more so apparent had that moment been a cutscene as opposed as 'ac130 level' gameplay.

>Don't self insert.

I have played a thousand virtual killing simulators before The Line and they ended fine, with me being a hero. It's the game who is wrong.

Yeah but it's aimed at arabs and americain this time so it's fine.

This

>Spec Ops: The Line is a critique of the idea of virtual killing as entertainment.
too bad every single argument made by the devs is based on logical fallacies and pretentious college-tier babble

youtu.be/5_6LvKWy5vo

The question is, does he deserve to?
Is that a life worth living? Walker going home isn't neccessarily victory, as he still has the memories and the mental scars, not to mention the guilt.
The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and I kinda like the game touched on that.
Ignore the people getting angry over the game going "hey this is kinda fucked that you were super willing to do this", it was because a few other games had edgy shit in it for the sake of edginess and the devs wanted to show you what actually happens. imagine no-russian but you have REAL consquences beyond "PLOT TWIST U GET SHOT ;OOOO"

Who was in the wrong here?

>college tier
As apposed to what? Youtube rant tier?

>tfw got the platinum on the PS3 even with all the loading screens and stick controls

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Listen to heart of darkness while playing bulletstorm and you'll have an infinitely better experience. The was pretentious unoriginal garbage when it came out and was never good despite year after year of 14 year old redditors discovering it

They are just as guilty as Walker. Iirc the game imply that they are following you because it give them someone to blame for their fuckup.

You brainlets just don't get it that Walker is a metaphor for God as he is visiting Earth as Jesus and is horrified of what people are doing to each other.

>>Yes it is obvious to anyone that looked it was Civilians you were bombing
care to explain why the silhouettes of the people you were observing were clearly heavily armed soldiers and NOT civilians?

>you don't have a choice
Fucking christ you absolute retards refuse to get it don't you. You know the only time the game acknowledges the player is in the opening credits? Your account name is credited as "Special Guest", you are not a participant in the narrative you are simply an observer too it. You troglodytes cannot understand the simple concept is that is it Walker making the decisions to move forward, the only choices you make as a player is ''moral'' choices for Walker. Walker chooses to disregard his mission objectives at the very start of the game, within 5 minutes of gameplay, everything else you do in the game a consequence of his decision making.

What do you decide as a player?
- Shooting the first american solder you meet.
- Saving the surrounded civs or sneaking by to get to CIA faster
- The two hung guys
- Shooting the water truck man
- Shooting the civs who killed Lugo or not
- Deciding what ending Walker gets.

That last point being important as you are placing judgement on Walker in a sense for his actions, as you've observed everything he has done:

1. Disregard his original orders to find refugees
2. Begin combatting with the 33rd
3. HE DECIDES TO USE THE WHITE PHOSPHORUS AND BLAME THE 33RD
4. He chooses to help CIA water man and doom the few left in the city
5. Hunting and killing the radio DJ
6. And importantly, he was the one to decide to chase down Konrad.

>Durrr why didn't Joel leave Eli with the fireflies I didn't have the choice durr
Yes because Joel made that choice and that's the point of TLOU's ending is that Joel made an inherently selfies choice, dont bother debating about if sacrificing Eli would of actually cured anything, it doesn't matter. Walker is the same, he is the one to keep pushing forward, he is the one calling the shots, you're just a passive viewer, and the fact that drooling retards still can't accept the simple fact that you are not Walker, and that Walker makes decisions on his own is stupid.

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simple logic

yeah, and they're berating you no matter what you do

I was referring to the final group up the back, the one everyone still gets assmad about.

HoD isn't the same experience at all bit OK.

They're not even alive for the ending, you and you alone choose Walker's fate. I don't get what you're talking about.

IMO walker shooting konrad and him telling walker "after all you've done you still get to go home, dont be too hard on yourself" is a way of walker to make peace with his actions and blaming them on konrad instead, wether he deserves it or o not doesn't change the fact that he was the only one that could do it, him surviving doesn't really make a difference so might aswell let him live

Heart of darkness is much better and while you consume actual literature you can also play a game that is not complete shit

First of all, lying to the player is never acceptable. What did it accomplish? None of the major notes of the story relied on lying to the player, and in fact, it would have been more satisfying if we had been shown things as they were, while slowly becoming aware that the character we were controlling was perceiving the world differently. It would then be easier to blame the player because we were enabling a character that we knew to be delusional.

Second, the white phosphorus thing was juvenile, we weren't given any other option. There should have been an option to go down and fight. Make it a near impossible fight, throw so many guys at the main character that it is simply not fun. If you die during the fight, then have the MC break the fourth wall and comment how much easier it would be to use the WP when you reload, maybe getting more and more insistent each time you reload. Make us WANT to use the WP. But then if someone did get through the fight, let them have it, I know they didn't want a divergent story line, but they didn't necessarily need to have one. Maybe the soldiers execute all the civilians as you get close, so the character can still feel some guilt, albeit much less, even if he succeeded, your buddy could get angry because you should have just left like you were supposed to and these people would still be alive. The main story would still be intact for the most part, but then the game wouldn't be making the player feel like shit for doing the only thing the game would allow you to do.

And yet, in the ending after that, when the soldier asked him how he survived, Walker asks: "Who said I did?" And the screen fades to white.
The way I choose to interpret is that the Martin Walker he was before died. This new one is a shell, a broken husk haunted by the events of the game, and he will be until the rest of his days. The plethora of mental issues ranging from PTSD to Survivors Guilt is a volatile cocktail.

>They berate me no matter what I do!
Boohoo faggot, the game doesn't even berate you it berates fucking Walker, your title in the game is "special guest" for a reason. This game was made to highlight the very real consequences of war and how it can affect the psyche, if you don't like that go play any of the other mindless kill simulator FPS/TPS games that are out there instead of bitching about a game that actually consistently follows its own narrative. You knew what you were paying for when you bought it retard

>Grr, how DARE the game make a fool out of ME? In MY safe space?! This is video games, where I get to be GOD! What does this game think it is, challenging MY authority?!

>Game credits you
This is the game's way of confirming that you are an active participant, and not just an observer. The game is very much blaming you. You were in control the whole time.

Bro meta is so deeeeeo we're totally art now

>Special Guest = Active Participant now
spec ops threads always attract stubborn idiots.

>make a fool out of ME?
How did it do that exactly? You'd have to be stupid to not have realized that you were shooting unarmed civilians unless you're just some CoD kiddy. How dumb can you be to think that the only way to dislike something is to not understand it? Does that mean understanding something means you automatically like it? You're a fucking idiot if that's what you think.

Wait, you mean you didn't see the last choice and the true ending?

Dude

You need to go back.

>tfw you got the true good "ending" by refunding game because the gameplay was shit

That's exactly who the intended audience was. Dudebro COD kiddies, hence why it was marketed as another generic third-person military shooter. Not a deep, intelligent, well-lived person like yourself, user.

It expands on them in the last scene (with its choice).

>Heart of darkness is much better
Maybe but they're still fairly different stories in different mediums. No point in not trying them all.

Reminder that Xcom: The Bureau did it better

Indeed I went out of my way to inflict maximum misery on those virtual people.

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>Crediting people is a way of implying they had absolutely nothing to do with the game
Yep that's how that works. That's what credits are for.

Even then, you knew this game wasn't gonna suck your ass for killing people so if it bothers you so much why did you play it in the first place? Are you that much of a sensitive bitch that you can't handle a game criticising you? If you want mindless killing there are plenty of other shooters to play bud

>Crediting people as a special guest is a way of affirming that they are the focus of the story at all times even though this story introduces you WITH captain walker, and not AS. you control walker through combat and some decisions, but you can argue certain scenes that the game "railroads" you into are Walker's decisions, otherwise you wouldn't have a game.

First of all, unreliable narration or heavy allusions to it, was used in Dreamweb, Ico, Sands of Time, Deadly Premonition, DmC: Devil May Cry, Haze to some extent - and I didn't see anyone complaining.

>Development Babies crawl now implies the babies coded from the womb itself

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Most games when they have "you" in the credits are congratulating the player for playing their game, not shaming them you stubborn idiot

youtu.be/5_6LvKWy5vo
The show isn't that great but if you've watched it and played the game, it synchs up almost perfectly.

>First of all, lying to the player is never acceptable.
I disagree, see Gardian Ape in Sekiro.

>What did it accomplish?
It put you in the perspective of Walker, which is clearly out of his mind. The twist isn't about the illusions Walker imagined, but rather on how he is going to react when his beliefs are shattered. Letting you see what Walker see is a good way of making you understand him.

>It would then be easier to blame the player because we were enabling a character that we knew to be delusional.
It become increasingly obvious that Walker is dead, with straight out hallucination toward the end and some subtle one at the beginning, including Walker being represented on a billboard for water.

>There should have been an option to go down and fight.
Devs tried to implement that but they realized that they didn't have the budget and that the Xbox couldn't handle the arena. I get your argument tho, it would have been better. But I still like the game the way it is desu.

>Maybe the soldiers execute all the civilians as you get close,
The soldiers are supposed to protect them.

How so? Him an heroing to kill Konrad as well is identical to the ending of Fight Club, and him leaving Dubai broken is identical to Heart of Darkness. The only different ones are the two other ones, and even then they're just basic subversions of those endings.

Except Spec Ops botches it by having witnesses to the funky bluepilled shit not reacting the way redpilled persons would.

>Him an heroing to kill Konrad as well is identical to the ending of Fight Club

You kill Konrad if you shoot him but if you let him shoot you, you're the one who die.

>him leaving Dubai broken is identical to Heart of Darkness.
That's a bit too light to allege that it's the exact same ending.
>and even then they're just basic subversions of those endings.
how is shooting up the rescue party a basic subversion?

>Your account name is credited as "Special Guest"

Where did that happen?

When you enter Dubai, there's a bunch of credits.

Killing rescue team makes no sense whatsoever by any take on story perspective, but makes perfect sense from gamedesign perspective (something akin to post-endboss ultra999level optional boss in its optional dungeon in jrpgs). The game even baits you by giving you jackhammer (you have to give away as per story). That's ludonarrative dissonance intentionally pushed to absurdity. The game basically asks you why the fuck you, personally you, are even here, referring to the fact that developers don't know jack about you, and single-player games are one-sided medium of communication anyway, interactivity or not. That is literally the whole point of the game. It questions your motivation to explicate that however anyone imagines target audience, you personally are most likely not it, and the developers are effectively talking to the wall and their own fantasies as to whomever might play their game.
That's the ACTUAL meta of the game.

what are some good tps?

or at least work as well as spec ops? it was my first game and the stop and pop shooting was fun enough for me

that video is great, spec ops isn't a bad movie, doesn't work as a game though

>Killing rescue team makes no sense whatsoever by any take on story perspective
youve been killing american soldiers the whole game and every seemingly good decision ended up in a disaster. dont tell me there wasnt a thought in the back of your head contemplating whether these ENEMIES, who now were supposed to be friendlies, were just plotting on how to get walker disarmed and then executed. shooting the rescue team is giving in to the paranoia and the player is walker.

"Gentlemen, welcome to Dubai" (as a reference to the very beginning of the game) doesn't fit. He clearly doesn't regard them as enemies. Except, by throwing back through all the game to the beginning, as well as being, in this context, stereotypical badass catchphrase, it emphasizes, the it's exactly what it is, and has been on along, a GAME, as opposed to interactive story. It's a gamey ending. The player seemingly chose to regard Spec Ops as a game, by deciding to take rescuers down. By giving jackhammer up, the player would seemingly choose to regard Spec Ops as an interactive story. The point is, the player has his individual interpretations, and whatever they are, at the end of the day, the developers don't KNOW any of them, they can only guess.

I never saw the welcome to dubai thing as an ingame reference to the beginning but rather as a novel juxtaposition between the uncorrupted walker and insane walker. first time it's said it's snarky but sincere. in the epilogue it's more of a self fulfilling prophecy like this is how we do things in dubai and you are my enemy.

Im just going to come out and ask it, is Spec Ops: The Line the Evangelion of video games?

Your theory (Walker becoming what he fought with) is corroborated by the jacket. What I can reply to this is that the game wasn't made or even written by the sole person, and, ultimately, several distinct authorial intents can be discerned in it, intents giving same symbols radically different meanings. In other words, I am saying, the game itself is due to having been directed, designed and written by several persons, that's all.

No that would be Devil Survivor 2

>I am saying, game's content itself is ambiguous (multiple meanings) due to

No that would be Nocturne

>Push buttons
>oooaoooo it's a video game
>Push more buttons
>oooaaaooo this video game sucks

No, I played it through and enjoyed it. I’m saying that I paid to be entertained so I did the 8 hours of entertainment (which was satisfactory as I did it in one day with a real for lunch). I wouldn’t have stopped playing because of “moral outrage” or not using the WP.

WALKING TALL MACHINE GUN MAN

Maybe the game has a message about Hard Determinism since no one is going to stop playing unless they already are aware of the game.

Closest game apart from killer 7 that we can call art. An excellent social commentary piece on the state of violence in games and in the world it’s quite powerful and I understand why zoomers and younger millennials can’t understand it they grew up in an age where war hasn’t touched them but soon it’ll all change...

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It's a game dummy. If the objective is to kill and rape hundreds of people, I'll do it

What if the objective could be refused and the game actually recognised your choice.

Depends on the reward/outcome
Yes, I meta game

>they grew up in an age where war hasn’t touched them but soon it’ll all change...
This is by far the edgiest thing I've read all month.

What is the correct ending in your opinion? I've always thought in the end Walker choose to off himself but if you let military kills you there is that nice quote Conrad say, while you're dying: "there is a line men like you and I have to cross". Its kino because he mention the name of the game and i usually end it in this way.

Based and redpilled

What if the bad ending gave you:
>AIDS?
And the good ending gave you:
>man nipple milk?

The bad ending is the objective the game presents (the aforementioned rape and murder), while the good ending is the somewhat secret ending which you refuse.

Read a book you fucking nigger

Why read a book when I can look at fat pussy?