Oh right, this happened

well... that's my private Tails stuff...

borg lookin ass

They jumped up to it quite quickly too;
>Sonic 3 - straps a rocket to the bottom of Sonic's plane
>SA1 - builds a transforming plane that uses a chaos emerald as a power source
>SA2 - creates a fake emerald almost as powerful as the real one
real asspull.

>came back to the thread too late to see this
I mean, I seen the archives but damn.

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I don't think his body was actually modified, looked more like he was just wearing those things to look like a cyborg.
This isn't even the first time Tails had an arm cannon.

I personally prefer when he can run, spindash and fight. His character in recent years is just disappointing.

Tails running, spindashing and fighting is something he learned from Sonic, who he looked up to as a role model after he adopted him and brought him out of the awful life he was having. I think it was an extremely well written character and relationship.
You know what I'd love to see? A Tails game in the form of a 3D platformer with a plot based around Tails's origins.

It makes sense to me. The plane needs an emerald for power and he won't always have one, so he tried reverse engineering one to create his own power generator. It's very similar to the chaos drives powering the GUN robots throughout the game.

I'd like to see another Tails Adventure personally. Maybe make the controls a bit smoother but retain the whole toolset and progression method.

Yeah, but the kid makes a Chaos Emerald good enough to Teleport at will.
It's more than just making a fusion engine or a chaos drive.

>Sonic Colors: Eggman hits Tails with a mind control ray
>"Oh hey are we gonna have a cool boss fight against Tails?"
>NOPE
>Sonic Lost World: Deadly Six turn Tails into a robot
>"Oh hey are we gonna have a cool boss fight against Robo-Tails?"
>NOPE
Pontac and Graff are fucking hack writers

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bet robo tails can't beat my oc

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Maybe the issue is Sonic Team not willing to actually make the boss fights.

so did this.

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Sonic team will not allow Sonic and Tails to fight like that.

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>Sonic
Snarky and narcissistic, but his heart's in the right place.
>Tails
Wingman who keeps Sonic grounded in reality, but is still extremely smart.
>Knuckles
Stoic yet somehow hotheaded, not stupid but pretty gullible.
>Amy
Creepy stalker fan girl who eventually grows into her own character, but never loses that edge.
>Team Chaotix
Fine except Charmy, just make him a little less annoying while still keeping the same little kid attitude.
>Shadow
Basically just SA2
>Rouge, Big, Silver, and Blaze
Fine as is, perfect as background fillers.
>Robotnik/Eggman
Near perfect, serious and goofy both can work depending on the tone.
>Everyone else
Need not apply.

Call me an adventurefag but this is how every character should be written from now on.

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Fridge, very nice. I was just looking at their Coco stuff.

what is it

Shadow's personality doesn't work outside SA2 as it hinges on him hating humanity on Maria's orders.
I unironically find the way he's written in 06 to be the best. He's always calm and seems to have a good read on any situation he's in.

Yeah Secret agent Man Shadow is best Shadow

Nothing else from him interests me, but it's a nice Tails, so it goes in my Tails folder

Especially true for Knuckles.

That's fair, never even bothered with '06 so I wouldn't know. I just think Shadow's distant and brooding nature is more tolerable when coupled with his misguided attempt to avenge someone who just wanted the best for him, rather then just being a clone who's edgy just for the hell of it.

Which game had this?

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Cyborg Tails

Lost World is one of those games I kinda just don't feel anything for. Same with Forces. They aren't miserable slogs, but they're just so goddamn "eh." I honestly think that's worse than when Sonic was a dumpster fire. At least then it stuck in people's minds.

yeah but what did it happen in

Thats what you get when you tell sonic team to throw shit at a wall and hope for the best.
>secret rings
>black knight
>forces
>shadow
>heroes
>lost world
>sonic 4
>unleashed nights
mediocre snooze fests

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Blaze needs to go back to being stubborn and hotheaded without being shackled to Silver. Other than that, agreed.

If we're talking purely character writing then Shadow was best around 06-ish

also Amy being a "creepy stalker fangirl" is obnoxious shit only really done from Heroes onwards. Fangirly tendencies are important to keep but it's clear in the Adventure games she's got her own shit going on beyond just wanting to bone Sonic at least.

yes

I feel that way about Lost World but for me, Forces was just downright offensive with how much it dumbed down the boost gameplay compared to Unleashed and Generations. Forces was literally the "boost to win, straight line" meme come to life.

Sonic Lost World. The Deadly Six kidnapped him and tried to turn him into a Cyborg.

>charmy

...user...just let him know the blissful peace of death.

Sonic Heroes Shadow best Shadow.

I dare say Tails has suffered the most under Sonic Team's incompetence. Where most characters are simply shoved to the side or forgotten under their shitty writing Tails being the "sidekick" is dragged into every adventure without any real purpose so he's delegated to the science ex machina, cheerleader, and someone to get "hurt" to try and fail to build "tension" before never following through with it anyway because that would require creativity and making a new boss fight that isn't the same one they've been rehashing since colors.
Dumb asses at Sonic Team can have the bright idea to have a player's OC follow Sonic through a level but can't put two and two together and have Tails do the same thing even though thats what he was made to do in the first place.
Why'd they have to do my boy so dirty?

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Pontac and Graff: hey look we pay attention to Sonic lore. this is just like your Sonic Undergorudn cartoons isn't that cool?

I feel like the only person on planet earth who unironically still likes this game, at least later into the game

I assume it was vaguely similar to the comics' concept of roboticization

The concept wasn't bad at all but
>Lv 30 max

You're the worst kind of idiot. Can't I just remember the good times with Sonic instead of the bad? Mediocre is NOT worse than trash fuckhead. If we never had ShTH/06/Storybook games/the GoW part of Unleashed and only had the best of Sonic being S3K/Mania/Advance series/Rush/The boost part of Unleashed/most of Adventures, it wouldn't matter if Sonic got stagnated. People wouldn't be saying "Sonic was never good" they would have to say "Sonic was more interesting back in the day" which is far less damaging to the franchise than the tripe you said.

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should have been a lollipop to go with the soda joke

I'd like it if every little thing wasn't tied to the touchscreen. The concept of a Sonic RPG is not bad at all. When I saw that even running away from battle was a touchscreen minigame, I turned it off then and there.

Because they do everyone except Eggman dirty.
And even then, they portrayed his take over and empire in the most boring way in Forces. 90% of the world should be Eggman Land 2.0s or Sonic CD Bad Futures, not just chrome and whatever else they did.

Liyerally no one played sonic lost worlds

>Sonic CD Bad Futures
Well it kinda was in the cutscene shit they halfassfully did, but not in the gameplay at all. Like, half the game is fucking revisits of old fucking locations, which people seemed to shit on Mania more for that instead of the 3D game with "impossibly" more effort. Literally none of the levels felt like it was meant to be in a war zone outside of "Town/City".

>"impossibly"
Fucking autocorrect, "supposedly"

>Well it kinda was in the cutscene shit they halfassfully did,
It must have been extremely half-assed since, as you said, they didn't get much milage out of it. Green Hill is probably the closest other example and that's just water replaced with sand. And even then, the concept Green Hill was more ominous at least (to say nothing of the fact that an 8-bit game had a more effective ruined Green Hill).

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Sonic only manages to teleport because he opens his heart

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>cheerleader
Literally what I said this afternoon!

what the fuck is happening

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>Not even a machine can tell the difference!
>Dr "Man with the master plan" Eggman deduces it's fake before Tails even enters the room

Yeah sure he did

The bastard son of Mettaton and Tails.

>That expressionless look
He has an uncanny resemblance to Paul Von Oberstein
Meterex Saga remake with Sonic characters as Legend of the Galactic Heroes characters when?

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>Sonic 3 - straps a rocket to the bottom of Sonic's plane
Technically the Japanese manual also has Tails create an emerald radar (or something of the like) to help find the floating island.

i- is there more?

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tails possessing the girls to get ahead in line

...How the fuck does this make any sense. Sonic had all the chaos emeralds at the start of the damn game in S3K. Unless it's for the Master Emerald (which they knew nothing about beforehand), how is this true?

What's worse is that his perfect characterisation is in Sonic X and Archie Sonic, but Sonic Team ignores that in favour of the cheap Sheldon type writing that they give him.

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Now I'm not a furfag
>B U T
That needs my semen inside of it.

Don't know.

The games aren't really consistent with whether or not the emeralds remain after Sonic turns Super or not.
In this case, they presumably scattered, hence the radar.

The manual refers to it as a "jewel radar" which means it probably picked up the master emerald when the death egg knocked the floating island out of the sky.

Wtf is this?

>The games aren't really consistent with whether or not the emeralds remain after Sonic turns Super or not.
He still has them in 3's opening.

Oh, forgot that.
In that case, maybe it was the Master Emerald (unless it can sense Special Rings as well).

He's fucking SUPER SONIC in the literal second you play Sonic 3 and Knuckles. What other Emeralds is Tails "looking for" to find Angel Island? The Super Emeralds AREN'T powered until the Chaos Emeralds are collected and sent to them directly, so it would have to be the Master Emerald, which they had no idea existed before getting there in the first place.

Either that info is horseshit or they fucked up with the plot of the game.

...

Why even write them into situations where they could logically fight and then not do it? Just don't make a fucking "Robo Tails" if you are going to do jack shit with it.

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No, it's false. The ending of Sonic 2 was a direct connection to the beginning of Sonic 3.

The Death Egg was knocked out of orbit after Sonic defeated Eggman, it fell to the planet, and landed on top of Angel Island (it's the entire reason Eggman desperately wanted to get the DE back in orbit in the game) and Sonic and Tails chased after him (literally continuing from the good ending of Sonic 2 (where Sonic went into his Super state and gave a thumbs up to the camera)).

This info is bullshit until proven otherwise.

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>Sonic and Tails chased after him (literally continuing from the good ending of Sonic 2 (where Sonic went into his Super state and gave a thumbs up to the camera)).
Actually, the Japanese manuals describe it taking place an unspecified amount of days after Sonic 2
sonic-jam.org/sisghzs:md-sonic3-index
(The link also has the original Japanese text in case you want to look for yourself).
The english manual makes no mention of whether or not time passed. Also
>English manuals
info.sonicretro.org/index.php?title=File:Sonic3_MD_US_mhs_manual.pdf&page=6

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Daily reminder that Sonic and the Black Knight was unironically the best Sonic Game in fucking years.
>unique setting for Sonic
>good writing and premise, every character is done well
>while it has a few meh levels the gameplay is solid overall
>absolute banger soundtrack
>best iteration of Tails
>some of the most unique and imaginative 3D levels to date
it built upon Sonic Unleashed's complaints of weresonic being too slow and clunky so they fit sonic's sword combat in with the classic fate-paced style
it also doesn't look or feel like unfinished garbage like 06

Did you play it muted?

absolutely everything about lost world was dumb and forgettable

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>Either that info is horseshit
>This info is bullshit until proven otherwise.
Is googling this shit really that hard for you? Here's the source: info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3_manuals
Tails invents a jewel radar on his own time after Sonic 2. The Death Egg causes the floating island to crash into the ocean, creating a tsunami, and resulting in the master emerald being reveled by the impact. Eggman soon becomes aware of the master emerald I guess by his own technology picking it up, and it also comes across Tails' radar, which he assumes is tied to the tsunami he had seen a few days beforehand. Sonic also wants to investigate because said tsunami caused an ancient ring to wash up on shore that hinted to a "lost floating island" or some shit.

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Black Knight was better than most people thought it was, but holy shit it is NOT the best Sonic game in years. It had a very interesting setting but the gameplay was definitely buggy and too on-rails. It had it's fun moments honestly but if the gameplay had been more open I feel it would've received far more praise. The soundtrack is 10/10 tho.
Also seeing as Arthur turned out to just be a fake Arthur, doesn't that make him Metal Sonic? If so, isn't it a missed opportunity that Eggman isn't Merlin? If they had gone with that, would that mean Merlina would be his granddaughter if he had banged? Doesn't that raise many questions about canon Eggman's love-life?

>spoiler
Given that canon Eggman's line is confirmed to still exist in the future...

Unironically TGT is written better than most Sonic games or most games in general

>the gameplay is solid overall
Nope. It's the epitome of a game ruined by waggle shit. Maybe if it had supported multiple control styles like Colors did a year later, it would have been more bearable.

forgot pic

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Wow, and none of this was inside the damn game itself
>inb4 they couldn't get something so detailed into a game about a blue rat
Ok I guess all those other cutscenes in the game never existed then. God I hate Japan and their over convoluting EVERYTHING they make. You can give me this info all you guys want, but I'm certain no one that played these two games knew about this and came up with the same conclusion I did that the ending to beginning of S2 and S3 respectively, nicely tie into each other, reaching the same goal.

This is likely why Sonic 06 was the killing point in over story telling in Sonic. Just over doing pointless detail just to justify shit no one really cares about to that degree, is why I feel this is got so out of hand like it did.

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I'VE COME TO MAKE AN ANNOUNCEMENT

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>God I hate Japan and their over convoluting EVERYTHING they make
It's no different than any other game in the 90s giving backstory in the manual. Quit throwing a bitchfit just because you were wrong.

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>Ok I guess all those other cutscenes in the game never existed then.
All the other cutscenes use the in-game engine.
>but I'm certain no one that played these two games knew about this and came up with the same conclusion I did that the ending to beginning of S2 and S3 respectively, nicely tie into each other, reaching the same goal.
How would Eggman be able to rebuild the Death Egg that quickly, especially since you don't know it's still active until you reach Launch Base.
user, I'm not one to discourage using imagination to fill in the details, but Sonic has had stupidly complex stories since day 2 and the games up until roughly SA2 (or Sonic 06 at worst, since that's a clear reboot) are actually consistent to an extent. Heck, the genesis games were building up lore around the Chaos Emeralds, the Master Emerald and even the Special Rings (until Knuckles' Chaotix got retconned) which came to a payoff with Sonic Adventure and Chaos.
And even working off of just stuff in-game, Sonic 3's plotline is probably more complex than the average platformer.
So basically, stop being a little bitch.

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SA2 for the switch?

That looks cool! What game?

Sonic Lost World.
Don't bother, it's just for a single cutscene.

>Eggman canonically fucked

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>It's no different than any other game in the 90s
I actually never believed in the manuals (English in this case) because they were always fucking wrong 99% of the time, even in the likes of Mario. "Sally Acorn" in CD and among others, made it clear the manual were inaccurate bullshit.

> Quit throwing a bitchfit just because you were wrong.
Suck my dick. I don't give a shit about "what it was" I doubt SEGA fucking cares or remembers they made that shit up for the game. If it isn't in the game I don't fucking like it, no matter WHAT era of Sonic it hails from, I've always been like this. Suck it up or shut up, I still hate Japan's retardation doing that kind of shit.

>All the other cutscenes use the in-game engine.
Ok. And? That should have been in the game. They even made a nice little scene of Knuckles sitting in the forest of AI just fine, they could have made it clear with Tails using a radar to find AI all the same, it's not that hard.

>How would Eggman be able to rebuild the Death Egg that quickly,
Nigga, are you seriously asking what EGGMAN can do when he can built mega structures out his ass per game without question? The Eggman wasn't 100% destroyed (or at least, wasn't shown in game to have been, or in your case, stated in some Jap manual saying so) and was only damaged and knocked out of orbit (which we DID see in Sonic 3, twice).

>, but Sonic has had stupidly complex stories since day 2 and the games up until roughly SA2
Compared to what? Castlevania? Ninja Gaiden? Hell, even Yoshi's Island had more to build up the plot of the game at the beginning on the SNES. And you're telling me the Genesis couldn't do the bloody same.

No, it's called bullshit. It's ALWAYS been horseshit, and fuck drones like you always denying otherwise. Sonic Team always has done this "over thinking" shit in Sonic and I fucking hate it, and have for YEARS. This doesn't hurt S3K however, since I don't need this pointless info to enjoy the game. But it's fucking pointless nonetheless and I'm calling it out as such.

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GET A LOAD OF THIS

>Wow, and none of this was inside the damn game itself

The game shows the island starts floating after the ME is returned. How could it not do that beforehand if it was

A. Being weighthed down by a huge ass spacestation
B Moved to the Hidden Palace for safekeeping?

Even SA2 stays weirdly consistent with this factoid. The Emeroods are much more powerful when put in the Shrine of the Master Emerald (Like say powerful enough to piss on the moon) than when they're just sitting around.

The only thing the japanese manual mentions is some information that ties into Adventure about the civilzation beofre Knuckles killing themselves, Sonic and Tails nearly getting hit by a tidal wave caused by the island hitting the sea and some shit about a weather machine that never really pops up anywhere in the game.

I miss my wife, tails.

>Ok. And? That should have been in the game. They even made a nice little scene of Knuckles sitting in the forest of AI just fine, they could have made it clear with Tails using a radar to find AI all the same, it's not that hard.
Knuckles' scene was also in the in-game engine.
This was also an era in which games' didn't put much stock in story outside of RPGs. The Mario games didn't have intro sequences more complex than a text box until the remakes gave SMB3 and SMW a new one. Mega Man had somewhat complex ones, but mostly they were some variant of "Wily is up to no good!".
Plus, putting the story in the manual means that you get to the game faster.
>The Eggman wasn't 100% destroyed (or at least, wasn't shown in game to have been, or in your case, stated in some Jap manual saying so) and was only damaged and knocked out of orbit (which we DID see in Sonic 3, twice)
Yes, but we didn't see it in Sonic 2, and until you reach Launch Base, there's no indication of it in-game. It's only mentioned in the manuals, which you're criticizing.
>Compared to what? Castlevania? Ninja Gaiden? Hell, even Yoshi's Island had more to build up the plot of the game at the beginning on the SNES.
Unironically, yes. The Sonic games have outright paragraphs functioning as little mini-stories that introduce concepts. Tails, the Floating Island, etc are all built up and explained in the manuals. The manuals also constantly mention a tribe that abused the emeralds and paid for it, which Sonic Adventure confirmed to be the Echidna tribe.
Also, did you know that Knuckles' Chaotix was about Eggman studying rings and creating his own Dark Rings? Which is why that game has all sorts of rings? You probably wouldn't it in-game and you sure as shit wouldn't get it from the english manual.
>This doesn't hurt S3K however, since I don't need this pointless info to enjoy the game.
Then why are you so butthurt about it? If it bothers you so much then ignore it, as you yourself point out.

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I see Amy finally accepted her place as his breeding sow

>A. Being weighthed down by a huge ass spacestation
... I hate to bring science into a series with a fast blue rat in it but I'm more than certain a Deathball the size of the mountain/volcano isn't anywhere as dense as a mountain filled with manga (which is still heavy ass rock and other minirals) plus the REST of the damn island, which was 4x the size of the DE. The Master Emerald has the power of the universe, and you're telling me it couldn't keep the island in the sky?
No, right after your fight with Knuckles Eggman steals the ME, uses it to aloft the DE, with Knuckles sending you to the Sky Santurary, you can clearly see Angel Island falling out of the sky (meaning it was already in the sky when the DE was on Ice Cap Zone/Lava Reef Zone. It wasn't until WELL AFTER the DE was in space at this point, was returning the ME back to Knuckles did Angel Island return back to the sky. Actually play the game before posting, it could validate your claims more if you did.

>B Moved to the Hidden Palace for safekeeping?
Controdicting yourself isn't smart, user.

And I don't get why you keep mentioning SA2 when I'm taking about some random trival between the events of Sonic 2 and Sonic 3K that no one that actually played the games, actually knew and cared about in the first place. That it's literally pointless tripe because it didn't present itself in game, just like the whole two worlds tripe NO ONE likes that SEGA has claimed canon (since you wanna keep talking about future games for some reason)

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>... I hate to bring science into a series with a fast blue rat in it but I'm more than certain a Deathball the size of the mountain/volcano isn't anywhere as dense as a mountain filled with manga (which is still heavy ass rock and other minirals) plus the REST of the damn island, which was 4x the size of the DE.
Yes, but the Death Egg is falling from space. It probably fell at such a velocity that it forced the island down (and wouldn't you know it, the JP manual also explains it as that basically).
>you can clearly see Angel Island falling out of the sky (meaning it was already in the sky when the DE was on Ice Cap Zone/Lava Reef Zone.
Nope. Angel Island is not visible in Sonic's Sky Sanctuary. It's in the background of Knuckles' version, but that's after Sonic's story.

>Knuckles' scene was also in the in-game engine.
Lacking reading comprehension I see. So you're claiming it must have been impossible to narrate Tails using his radar he magically has, taking Sonic by the Tornado, and ending up where the actually in game starting point cutscene starts, yes?

>This was also an era in which games' didn't put much stock in story outside of RPGs.
>Ignores what I said about Castlevania, Ninja Gaiden and Yoshi's Island, which all predate Sonic 3K

>Yes, but we didn't see it in Sonic 2, and until you reach Launch Base, there's no indication of it in-game.
It doesn't have to, the fact you do find it later on the same island you just so happen to be exploring on, seems to validate why Sonic and Tails even came to the island in the first place (outside of Knuckles taking your emeralds after the fact).

>Tails, the Floating Island, etc are all built up and explained in the manuals.
Yet it still couldn't be arsed to be put into the game, depite no reason not to outside of "reading outside sources for a game about going fast" for kids at the age of ~10.

>The manuals also constantly mention a tribe that abused the emeralds and paid for it, which Sonic Adventure confirmed to be the Echidna tribe.
Again, why does this matter in the game when it DOESN'T show any of this shit? Yes, SA1 actually showed it in game, that's good, they even EXPLAINED it in game, with Tikal, which was better than leaving it out of the game and stating it on some outside source. Again, 3 other games did this shit without issue, and if you're seriously going to claim S3K is not as technically advance enough to do what weaker hardware could do (with Yoshi that's actually arguable because of how detailed the game was over S3K), you got to be shitposting.

>Then why are you so butthurt about it?
Because I hate Japan being incompetent with over thinking lore when the games not only don't make any mention of it, but what's in game does it better and more seamless.

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>Yes, but the Death Egg is falling from space. It probably fell at such a velocity that it forced the island down (and wouldn't you know it, the JP manual also explains it as that basically).
If the manual "explains this" then it didn't "probably" do this, it "did this". Don't backpedal with bullshit by using "muh manual". It wasn't in game, there was no indication of this, and you'd tell if it was the case by seeing the sky scroll up as you played the damn game, which was never identified as such ever happening..

its fine sonic characters are more kemono than furry

>mental gymnastics to try and convince yourself you're not a furry
embarrassing

Pontaff is one of the worst things to happen to the Sonic Franchise

I would rather they have Sonic and Shadow spitroast Elise while Mephiles and Silver have a Dabbing content than have that hack write another story

nah furry characters look ridiculous, nice try tho

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I completely agree. The game is even well written. Its a flawed gem.

Rivals isn't canon, Nega is from Blaze's dimension.

Wild man

>Ignores what I said about Castlevania, Ninja Gaiden and Yoshi's Island, which all predate Sonic 3K
Ninja Gaiden, I'll admit is the exception.
Outside of Rondo of Blood (assuming that was out at the time), no, Castlevania wasn't that story-heavy at the time. Yoshi's Island had a complex opening, but after that, the game is pretty loose with its plot.
> It doesn't have to, the fact you do find it later on the same island you just so happen to be exploring on, seems to validate why Sonic and Tails even came to the island in the first place (outside of Knuckles taking your emeralds after the fact).
The point is, how would Sonic and Tails know it was on the island? In Sonic 2, the screen fades to white and we just see Sonic falling from space. No sign of the Death Egg. The Japanese manual is consistent in that Sonic and Tails go to the island out of curiosity and they don't yet know that Eggman was even there, much less that the Death Egg was still a factor.
>Yet it still couldn't be arsed to be put into the game, depite no reason not to outside of "reading outside sources for a game about going fast" for kids at the age of ~10.
See my "games focused on gameplay rather than plot" point. Also said "outside resources" include the manual that came with the game, so unless you bought it used, I don't think that was a problem (in Japan at least, but that's a Sega of America issue).
>Again, why does this matter in the game when it DOESN'T show any of this shit?
Do you just not get the concept of world building? Especially when down the line they decide to expand on that shit.And if you're not interested, then you can just ignore it. And while 3 other games may have done it, that's three games vs how many that didn't? Especially Super Mario World, the game right before Yoshi's island?

source?

rikose on twitter

danke

Enjoy your delusion, furfag

>Because I hate Japan being incompetent with over thinking lore when the games not only don't make any mention of it, but what's in game does it better and more seamless.
Actually, funny thing: Sonic Retro points out something that proves that Sonic 3's story doesn't take place immediately after 2: The Tornado's booster is there in 2's ending, but not in 3's intro. And it's not like they didn't have the sprite or anything since it does show up in 3's ending.
info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3_&_Knuckles_chronology_and_endings#The_Intro_Sequence
But why would they remove the booster if they're going after the Death Egg?
The manual comes with the game and explains shit about the game. Why should I not count it (except when localization fucks with it, which isn't the case here)
But consider this: The island is on the ground at the beginning of the game. The Death Egg is on the island until the Death Egg launches, due to Eggman stealing the Master Emerald. Without the Master Emerald, the island stays on the ground until the ending where the Master Emerald is place back on the island. Without the Death Egg weighing it down, it goes back into the air.

I wish, but every game since Rivals 2 (which is mostly just the Olympic series but still) and even Eggman Nega's Sonic Channel comic use his portrayal from Rivals 2 (though he's still Blaze's arch enemy for reasons).

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Yeah you're right, that pic does look pretty ridiculous

Alright, first of all. Seething? Calm down.
Second,
>Mediocre is NOT worse than trash fuckhead.
Actually, this is something called having your own personal opinion. If he prefers having fun with a bad game, over wasting his money through a boring slog, then so be it. I get that you need to satisfy yourself by insulting people, but maybe next time you can understand that people can have opinion on Sonic games without being a spastic about it.

>The point is, how would Sonic and Tails know it was on the island?
Oh, I don't know, maybe because you could have seen it FALL FROM FUCKING SPACE??? Or, you know, how it literally sticks out like a sour thumb sitting on top of Lava Reef's mountian top? It's literally right there on the S&K title screen. How CAN'T you see that massive ass ball with a mustache?

>games focused on gameplay rather than plot
If that was even fucking accurate S3K wouldn't have cutscenes you fucking trogilate. It would have just done what Sonic 1/2/CD did ffs.

> "outside resources" include the manual that came with the game,
Ah sorry, I totally forgot the Japanese Maneul came with my AMERICAN copy of Sonic 2 on the SEGA Genesis. Silly me, I guess your right...

>Do you just not get the concept of world building?
I do. Very much. So much in fact I'd make sure if something was fucking relevent I'd put such info INSIDE MY FUCKING GAMES. By your shit logic they shouldn't even have bothered in SA1 and scrape Tikal from the game entirely just to put the Knuckles' clan backstory in a fucking Dreamcast manual. At least be consistant with your shitposts. Fact of the matter is, Japan's bs doesn't matter when the games doesn't fucking bother pointing it out in game. Coming from a Metroidfag, I guess that Japanese exclusive hint of Ridley killing Samus' mother was obviously so important enough that the only way Americans could ever find out about it outside of importing from Japan, was doing some convoluted duel system trading type shit just to see one image.

hardly the same thing, but the ending to the mobile version of Sonic 2 shows the Death Egg crashing on Angel Island

The jewel rader is probably a DBZ reference.

>But why would they remove the booster if they're going after the Death Egg?
Maybe because the only reason Tails used it before was to get into space fast enough to get Sonic onto the DE in the first place in 2? Lo and behold, he uses it again to save Sonic from impending doom the same exact way he did in Sonic 2's ending. He doesn't need it on the surface of the planet, he could have dispatched it when heading back to the planet's surface. (But, I will say that's at least one thing that does show it's not 100% straight from the ending of the last game to the beginning of the next, but that's it, which is highly over lookable, which many people clearly has done, so the point does still stand it should have been in game if it was that important of a detail, which is really isn't)).

>The manual comes with the game and explains shit about the game.
Repeat after me. NO ONE. FUCKING. READS. THE. FUCKING. MANUELS. Don't you understand why they started gutting them into like 4 pages by the 2000s and stop fucking making them since the late 2000s? People constantly states no one fucking reads manuals, it's even joked about in cartoons and other medias ffs. Why the fuck is some ~10 year old kid going to want to read some shit instead of playing video games???

>Actually, this is something called having your own personal opinion. If he prefers having fun with a bad game, over wasting his money through a boring slog, then so be it.
Then it's called returning your game to Gamestop and getting your money back you fucking zoomer. But I forgot zoomers today don't have this luxury anymore, sad for them. But then again, you could just pirate games you retarded fucks if you don't wanna pay for boring games. I do the same for bad games, so tough shit.

what was it

>, you know, how it literally sticks out like a sour thumb sitting on top of Lava Reef's mountian top? It's literally right there on the S&K title screen. How CAN'T you see that massive ass ball with a mustache?
Actually, it was in Launch Base Zone. When Sonic and Tails stopped it from launching at the end of 3, it fell onto Lava Reef (as seen in the S&K title)
> If that was even fucking accurate S3K wouldn't have cutscenes you fucking trogilate. It would have just done what Sonic 1/2/CD did ffs.
It mixed plot with gameplay. The cutscenes were short and always in-game. Certain sequences like Eggman stealing the emerald didn't even take control from you. It had cutscenes, but also retained a gameplay focus.
>Ah sorry, I totally forgot the Japanese Maneul came with my AMERICAN copy of Sonic 2 on the SEGA Genesis. Silly me, I guess your right...
Again, that a Sega of America problem, not a problem with Sonic 3 itself.
And you don't honestly think that information in-game can't be warped either? Look up Streets of Rage 3 for one example..
>.Fact of the matter is, Japan's bs doesn't matter when the games doesn't fucking bother pointing it out in game.
It came with a manual that came with the game. Not their fault that Sega of America decided to cull 90% of it.
> I guess that Japanese exclusive hint of Ridley killing Samus' mother was obviously so important enough that the only way Americans could ever find out about it outside of importing from Japan, was doing some convoluted duel system trading type shit just to see one image.
It helps give context to why Ridley is treated more importantly than most of the rogues gallery.
Again, all of this is due to Sega of America cutting the storyline. I'm not defending THAT (look up Knuckles' Chaotix story to see how well and truly they can rape a storyline) but this is mostly on them removing that information than it is Sega of Japan not putting it in-game.

>but the ending to the mobile version of Sonic 2 shows the Death Egg crashing on Angel Island
You mean the Taxman one? So a mobile game can have more care for story telling then a game with story telling made 20 years ago. Wow. Thanks Taxman for doing something so difficult Sonic Team couldn't have bothered with since it was so important in the first place apparently.

>Secret agent Man Shadow is best Shadow

Too bad these days he just a asshole who rides Solo, because according to Sega, Team Dark isn't an actual team and Shadow doesn't even see Rouge or Omega(and seemingly the rest of the characters) as friends, only assets the he can use to accomplish whatever mysterious "goals" Sega gives him since G.U.N doesn't exist anymore

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>Coming from a Metroidfag, I guess that Japanese exclusive hint of Ridley killing Samus' mother was obviously so important enough that the only way Americans could ever find out about it outside of importing from Japan, was doing some convoluted duel system trading type shit just to see one image.

I agree with that since IIRC the manga was in japanese and only available on the website. Still I don't believe there is anything in the Sonic games that can't be gleamed from playing the game. Even the backstory in the japanese manual shows up in Sonic Adventure so you don;t need a book to figure this out. Even the Underground Cartoon and the penders comic came to the same conclusion that Knuckles is the last of his race of Echidnas, something that happened before Sonic Adventure ever became a thing. Not easy to realise why when Sonic 3 goes out of it's way to show you ruins and untamed wilderness like every second stage.

>NO ONE. FUCKING. READS. THE. FUCKING. MANUELS

Yes they did. The reason manuals went out of fashion is because in-game databases and lore became easy to fit in the game due to technology. Still sucks that you have to read that shit to understand what should be a easy to follow story but eh.

>it was in Launch Base Zone
...Which was on top of the fucking mountain, leading into Lava Reef, coming after Ice Cap.
>It mixed plot with gameplay. The cutscenes were short and always in-game.
And I gave at minimal two scenes that could have easily been in game to show Sonic and Tail's reasoning to head to AI, yet it wasn't done because it wasn't importance enough to be in game.

>Again, that a Sega of America problem, not a problem with Sonic 3 itself.
So you're saying the Japanese version of S3K actually has it in game? If it doesn't it still is the games problem. Japanese having japanese info doesn't matter outside Japan you fucking weeb.

>It came with a manual that came with the game.
In Japan, no where else. If it was that importantly, it should have been in the damn fucking game.

>Again, all of this is due to Sega of America cutting the storyline.
No, that's called horseshit. There's a reason I said Sonic 3 AND Knuckles, they could have added that shit in after SEGA giving them a break by splitting the game in half, there's no excuse.

>Yes they did.
No, they did not, because everyone I met, every media I watched, and the fucking fact companies don't even make them anymore, proves, no one did. My fucking 20 year older brother didn't read them even before I was born. HE was the one telling me don't bother with the fucking manual. Because Americans don't fucking care about reading shit at the age of fucking 10 because VIDEO GAMES were for playing, not fucking reading.

>Maybe because the only reason Tails used it before was to get into space fast enough to get Sonic onto the DE in the first place in 2?
If it took place directly after 2, then they probably would've made straight for where it landed rather than take a pit stop to remove something that'd get them there faster.
Also, as a side note, Sonic isn't Super when they initially reach the island, he has to manually activate it again.
> but that's it, which is highly over lookable, which many people clearly has done, so the point does still stand it should have been in game if it was that important of a detail, which is really isn't)).
Its still more than just assuming it takes place directly after because it just so happens to begin with Sonic and Tails flying somewhere.
>Coming from a Metroidfag, I guess that Japanese exclusive hint of Ridley killing Samus' mother was obviously so important enough that the only way Americans could ever find out about it outside of importing from Japan, was doing some convoluted duel system trading type shit just to see one image.
user, there is a theme in these answers, but I don't think you're picking up. Hint: It has to do with America.
>Repeat after me. NO ONE. FUCKING. READS. THE. FUCKING. MANUELS.
Just because you don't read the manual doesn't mean nobody reads the manual user.
Especially when you get threads where anons post the DK64 manual and all of Cranky's dialogue in them.

seething retard, take this 7 on your way out

>Still I don't believe there is anything in the Sonic games that can't be gleamed from playing the game.
Except what I was "bitching" about this entire time. If you could actually prove anything from that damn manuel was actually shown in game in S3K, then this whole comment chain would end here. (It is actually cause I'm done with this pointless shit) But if you can't, tough shit. I don't care what fucknig games did afterward here, that's not the bloody point. The fact that SA1 does do more to explain in game than out is nice, but that's not relavent to S3K, nor does this negate games after SA1 that falls into that same trap again.

then they probably would've made straight for where it landed rather than take a pit stop to remove something that'd get them there faster.
Oh gee, in game it looks EXACLTY like they did do just this now doesn't it? Sans the missing rocket booster, which coming from a game 2 years after the last, I doubt any kid (like myself at the time) would have enough noticed as a discrepancy "because it doesn't actually matter being such a small detail"

>Sonic isn't Super when they initially reach the island
Which is true, but there's really no reason to stay in the state before hand just because he could, he just used it to get to the island faster due to his impatience.

>Just because you don't read the manual doesn't mean nobody reads the manual user.
Especially when you get threads where anons post the DK64 manual and all of Cranky's dialogue in them.
See above. And yeah, one fucking collectathon game is the sole proof millions of kids from the 90s read the manual. Storytiming a fucking manual on a 18+ year old site /= "Everyone in this thread totally read every inch of the manual for info not present in the game (which most of the damn time wasn't even accurate).

Nice try retard.

>...Which was on top of the fucking mountain, leading into Lava Reef, coming after Ice Cap.
Where exactly is it show where Launch Base is in relation to Lava Reef? It certainly wasn't right on top of the mountain, where it ends up in S&K.
>So you're saying the Japanese version of S3K actually has it in game? If it doesn't it still is the games problem. Japanese having japanese info doesn't matter outside Japan you fucking weeb.
>In Japan, no where else. If it was that importantly, it should have been in the damn fucking game.
user, you seem to be missing the point. It doesn't matter if it was Japan-only, The information there is canon. It's the devs fault that SOA went full retard and cut it. This also happened to Sonic 2. Sonic CD is probably the only instance in which a JP plotline got through (mostly) unscathed. Why? I don't know. Them's the breaks.
>Because Americans don't fucking care about reading shit at the age of fucking 10 because VIDEO GAMES were for playing, not fucking reading.
That's the Sega of America way of thinking.

"You thought you could trick me with that fake Emerald?"
"So how did you know it wasn't the real one?" (TAILS!!)
"Heh, because you just told me Fox boy!"
>his face when

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>Sonic 2
>Sonic CD
>Sonic 3
>Sonic and Knuckles
>Adventure 2
>Colors
>Generations
>Mania
>The Racing games by Sumo
>The Advance/Rush games
Those are the only good Sonic games, prove me wrong. Every other game is either shit or mediocre.
It is baffling to me how this franchise is basically keeping Sega afloat. Especially after shit like 06, Shadow, those weird Wii games, and Lost World.
Don't get me wrong, I understand why the series is so beloved. The games I listed are fucking incredible,but I feel like the bad outweighs the good.
I feel like the reason people still care about Sonic is because he was once viewed as a worthy rival to Mario, but those days are gone now.The overall quality of the franchise has changed. If one of the newer Sonic games had been his debut, nobody would give 2 shits.
If Sega had kept the rhythm of the 16-bit games going, we wouldn't have all this bullshit.
I have faith that the series will get great again. Mania was a beacon of hope, and if Sega doesn't follow it (or at least try making games for other series), then they'll be bankrupt within the next 30 years.

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>dude let's wipe out all that character development from SA2 and Heroes in an interview lmao
Thus spoke Izuka

>theyre unironically writing essays arguing about the sonic the hedgehog lore

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>Where exactly is it show where Launch Base is in relation to Lava Reef?
The fact it's covered in fucking snow? And where would a trypical Island have any show to speak off? Oh right, on top of a fucking MOUNTAIN. Which you clearly see on the title screen of S&K, which is where ICE "CAP" is part of, and leads into Launch Base.

>The information there is canon.
Just like the two worlds shit, right? Which everyone totally loves that it's canon, despite NEVER being shown in game. It seems like, many smart people, don't like it when info not present in game, get's claim is canon now does it?

>That's the Sega of America way of thinking.
Good, because SoA is far more competent than SoJ since that's how Mania fucking happened.

>no omega

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>It is baffling to me how this franchise is basically keeping Sega afloat. Especially after shit like 06, Shadow, those weird Wii games, and Lost World.
It acutally isn't, that's not the Yakuza games or the Pachinko arcades they sell in Japan.

wait it did?

>Oh gee, in game it looks EXACLTY like they did do just this now doesn't it?
Sure, except for Sonic being normal.
That said though, I will conceed this point. Not because of what you said, but because I got curious, looked up a video and found that S3&K does add the booster to the intro. That does make it more likely for someone to come to the conclusion it takes place immediately after.
>Which is true, but there's really no reason to stay in the state before hand just because he could, he just used it to get to the island faster due to his impatience.
Why would he drop it, only to get impatient and use it again. You'd think he'd stay like that the whole time to get there quicker.
>See above. And yeah, one fucking collectathon game is the sole proof millions of kids from the 90s read the manual. Storytiming a fucking manual on a 18+ year old site /= "Everyone in this thread totally read every inch of the manual for info not present in the game (which most of the damn time wasn't even accurate).
That's till more people than you.
As for the parodies, I only recall Fairly Odd Parents really making that joke. Maybe Home Improvement, so much that the game didn't have a manual (which is actually one of the first things usually brought up about it).

Modern Shadow is a joke. I mean he was a jerk in StH but it still referenced his backstory a bit. Modern Shadow is just some unholy mashup of Boom and what I assume is lizuka's knowledge of Sonic (Which involves pictures of Shadow smoking and using guns online)

it's like the second coming of Sonic X characterization. Even Silver's affected by it now, going from naive to literal bratty retarded kid not to mention Cream is dead. And TSR isn't even Sonic Team. Blaze's new voice makes me diamonds though

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I like how they keep trying to rewrite out the Venture era as canon, yet Shadow EXISTING means it was canon. There's going to likely reboot Adventure if that remake does actually happen, reteconning all the shit that happened in the original games, including Shadow's origin.

It's kinda weird because back in the day one could argue that Shadow is a much better and more complex rival than Vegeta

Nowadays Shadow is a Vegeta clone while Vegeta himself became more like 06 Shadow

Does anyone else here likes Shadow the Hedgehog game?

Laputan Machine

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> Oh right, on top of a fucking MOUNTAIN. Which you clearly see on the title screen of S&K, which is where ICE "CAP" is part of, and leads into Launch Base.
Which is why the area around Launch Base has less snow.
I know Ice Cap took place in the mountains, but I dunno if it takes place in Lava Reef's volcano.
>Just like the two worlds shit, right? Which everyone totally loves that it's canon, despite NEVER being shown in game.
I don't like the Two Worlds thing either, but there's a difference between something that's said in an interview (and an anime series) and something that's in a manual that comes with the actual game. Mostly because one is more infinitely more accessible than the other.
>Good, because SoA is far more competent than SoJ since that's how Mania fucking happened.
I'm not going to pretend Sega of Japan were competent, but cutting story details is different from approving a third-party to make a game.
And didn't Izuka also have a hand in Mania?

I find it to be a guilty pleasure.
I won't pretend some/most of the missions aren't awful though. it's just fun to casually run through levels occasionally.

i know...

Private Tails stuff?

In hindsight it wasn't as bad as 2006 and needed a lot of polish and rewrite and it could have been a great start to a spinoff series

Get rid of the guns or make them a bonus in certain levels, shadow doesn't need Guns, limit the endings to at most five if not less, make it so you don't have to start over everytime , redesign the Black Arms to fit the sonic Universe more(Eclipse from the comics is a good example), make the Gritty nature of the Game a lot more subtle while making it clear that its darker than the average Sonic Game

Basically, Don't try to make Shadow into CJ

Why are you telling me this? I'm not a designer asking for opinions. Anyways, I disagree, I think the guns were fine for Shadow, made the gameplay better imo, the only thing I find weird is that Eggman is second fiddle on story over those gun guys

I mean, Heroes was fine, and unleashed nights were perfectly servicable beat em ups gameplaywise. Not sonic, but it *played* fine

Every boss fight against other main Sonic characters (besides obvious villains) in other games were universally panned.

Sonic Adventure 1's character battles were a fucking joke.
Sonic Adventure 2's are slightly better, but still mediocre.
Sonic Heroes' team battles are a fucking joke.
Sonic 06 has shIT'S NO USE

They never work, user. Let it go.

Sonic vs Blaze in Rush was alright.

There have been good ones too.
>Sonic/Blaze in Sonic Rush
>Silver in Generations
Fake Team Hooligan in Mania kinda counts?

I cannot remember anything but the Sonic OVA rehash part. What was it again?

>Sonic Adventure 2's are slightly better, but still mediocre.
>Didn't think Sonic vs Shadow on the Ark wasn't the coolest shit (If a little easy)

I think he meant gameplay user. I wish people cared more about actually being good gameplay, and not surface value shit. Sonic 06 "looked cool" but it's fucking shit as a game.

>Everyone else
>Need not apply.
Naw nigga, I want me some Fang.

The problem was that it was an average Platformer in an era where there was tons of great Platformers

Sure Crash went to shit in 2000 but you had games like Mario Sunshine Ratchet and Sly Cooper and Jak 2

I think what pissed a lot of people off even more about it was that it outsold most of those games and wasn't that far off from Mario sunshine , so people expected a lot more from it

It had a Metacritic score of 72 which isn't bad but for a franchise as big as Sonic is disappointing, let's not forget that all three of Ratchet Jak and Sly were retired the moment that a game hit a similar score

I don’t care, Sonic Lost World is THE under appreciated Sonic game

Yeah. You know about that, right?

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This is low key my fucking mind trying to get the AI Sonic Advance 3 to work

Heroes was fine when it wasn't glitching the fuck out, which would happen frequently if you weren't specifically trying to avoid it.

How is Dr. Eggman a roboticist if he primarily uses some sort of magical tech that turns organic beings into robots?
Seems sort of roundabout.

He can do other things, too.

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Every single time Nega appears outside Rush he's confirmed to be from the future, retard, Rivals is canon too, Nega is just both a time traveler and an interdimensional terrorist

>Even Silver's affected by it now, going from naive to literal bratty retarded kid
How so? He looked pretty mature (for Silver standards) in Forces

How were unleashed day staged any better than secret rings, or any of the other boostshit for that matter?

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Tails with shota dick

>Sonic/Blaze in Sonic Rush
>Silver in Generations
Man nigga
OVA reference and giant ball of debris finisher are cool as fuck

>Storybook
Fuck you, I unironically enjoyed Rings. I will also argue to this day that Black Knight would have been better in every single way if they had given you the fighting style all about speed first, instead of making you unlock it, in a fucking Sonic game.
Black Knight also gave us Blaze's best theme in the series, it just needed to be a full length track.
youtu.be/gPS3id-KG8Y

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If bowser can have a kid than Eggman can have a goofy cartoon niece or whatever, why not?

Why are Adventurefags so god damn retarded?