This is the latest tier list combined from tournement results, matchup spread and frame data

FUCK TIER LISTS
FUCK MIKE TYSON
FUCK ZERO
FUCK LEFFEN
FUCK SUPER MACHO MAN
AND MOST IMPORTANTLY
FUCK TIER FAGS

BASED

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>Smash Community begs for K.Rool and Ridley to be in the game

>No one plays them

>everyone in a community is the same

more like casuals play them and people who want to win don’t

>combined from tournement results, matchup spread and frame data
tracing back on the image shows that it's based on 11 people's opinions
why would you lie to the internet like this?

Weird to see K. Rool that low. Everyone bitching that he was "broken" at release is funny but I never thought he would be that bad.

Noob counter traps, made even more effective in laggy online that only noobs play

Curse of being a heavy.

>ganon has escaped bottom tier
i'm proud of my boy

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why is mac so low? didnt he get buffed?

Also why the fuck is shulk so high? What the fuck happened in 5 months to suddenly make him a top tier

little mac will never break out of low tier. his weakness is simply too damning and his “major strength” isn’t even that major. in tournaments all it takes to shut down little mac is a platform and some patience. he can’t use his crazy strong grounded attacks if he can’t get to you.

People played K. Rool for a while, and he’s still really popular with casual players, but people who play to win aren’t gonna pick bad heavies.

Lucina

Lucina is pretty honest desu why would you want her nerfed

Tier lists should be sorted by how fun it is to face them as opponents.

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Just to fuck with my friend. The guy has spent over $300 on fire emblem gachashit.

She's too honest, she's one of the most boring characters play and to face. No exploitable flaws, moveset is just different kinds of sword slashes with no moves that'll force you to change up your defense, and her existence makes the character she's an echo of almost irrelevant.

>Villager only spams fucking fair and bair
Really based character dude!

A motherfucker just won as Ice climbers.

Vee doesnt know shit son.

>Tier lists should be sorted by how fun it is to face them as opponents.
>Pit is based
>Dark Pit is cringe
Explain.

link?

I agree Kirby is bottom tier, but he's definitely higher than Little Mac if not just because he can at least edge guard.

Faggot

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My studies show Dark Pits spam side B more often.

Based, fuck smash.

People sleeping on the Samuses just a little bit, players YB and Quik show there's some more potential to discover from the character, but no one noteworthy stateside seems willing to put the time into them. I'd say leans closer to high-mid instead of the low-mid as seen here, just a minor difference overall I guess

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I don't believe Ridley is actually that low, he belongs in solid mid tier.

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Anyone who speaks in that type of hyperbole should be ignored. Don't even bring them up as if they had any merit.

It ain't looking good bro
>Terrible disadvantage state
>Mediocre framedata, no great get-off-me tools, not even nair is fast enough to break a combo
>Has both lighter than average weight for a big body AND middling air movement, coupled with no good landing options means he gets juggled for days AND gets killed early
> Side special is telegraphed like a rocket launch, extremely easy to avoid and punish, if you land it the opponent can mash out of it at early percents and it won't kill midweights until the mid-100%s
>Linear gameplan, either
dthrow->everything or nair->everything, not good enough to make up for its predictability like Palutena's gameplan is
>Dair is a worthless move through and through unless you're going for a very risky edgeguard
>Skewer is too much risk for the reward it gives, high damage means nothing if you're unable to read the opponent's get up option

Unless he gets major buffs Ridley's only gonna fall down further as time goes on. I hate it

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Being able to hold B to go straight into monado arts quickly and even switch from art to art in and instant made gave him a ton more options.
In the past Shulk would pick an art before neutral engagements and you'd be able to read his game plan easy. The way it is now you can play much more unpredictably.

Yeah all that is true, but I still think he's mid.
I just can't understand what they were thinking with that Dair, it could have easily been a forward moving tail lash from his Super Metroid boss fight or it could at least bounce like Belmonts or Greninja.

My nigga climbing the tier list one day at a time

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>nu-Yea Forums uses tryhard as an insult
unbased

wow I can't believe bowser is that high

SOMEONE PLEASE SAVE KIRBY, 2 DECADES OF MEDIOCRITY
THIS IS NOT OKAY, FUCK FOX

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It's sad to see Mewtwo and DK that low while characters like Shiek and Dedede place higher. Something tells me they should get better results.

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Why did Olimar tumble?
Wtf is playing Lucario?
When is the Ink meme ending?

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What buffs would you give Kirby to make him a top-tier, without making him completely busted and while staying true to the core of the character?

olimar had his dumb ass up smash made unsafe on block as it always should have been

you'd think they would take care to try to make one of their biggest, original characters not literally the worst fighter in every game
you'd be wrong

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Falcon just got buffed in a big way last patch
Give it time user

le tipper face can't function in a game without wavedashing it's just that simple unfortunately

CF being high mid is also where he was in melee for the majority of the time.

Mac is fundamentally fucked. He has no air game, projectiles, or jump in a game where air and jump is the life blood of winning. The only thing he has is smashes and speed.

>in every game
he actually doesn't know lol

>Honest
Yeah she's honestly better at everything than everyone else in the game
Also has a sword
Also has no interesting movies, everything is just "slash attack"
Also invalidates Marth's existence

Why does this character exist in her current state

if you're about to bring up brawl I don't give a fuck
moving goalposts, whatever, I don't care, fuck off with that shit

Marth is still high tier in Ultimate with the tipper. Thats fucking strong

Lucina just removes any reason to play him because "Im Marth without the power limiting high skill ceiling gimmick lul"

>brawl

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oh, you're just a shitposting retard then, ok

he's above average because his overall kit is actually good and usable unlike damn near half the cast who are basically joke character tier

ever heard of the nintendo 64? that was a console that came out before you were alive I'm sure but kirby was extremely broken in that version of smash bros

The ultimate balance isnt as bad as you say it is. There are some absolute trash tiers but there's more above average than below average.

oh, I thought 64 was like pikachu > falcon > fox > the rest in an order I didn't know, my bad
you don't need to post in a cryptic autistic manner though

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you're honestly right the balance in ultimate is pretty decent idk why I said half the cast
in tr4sh that was definitely the case though

you might not have known about kirby if you didn't really play the game because it's pretty agreed upon in that community that picking kirby is just poor sportsmanship because he's so busted

>Jigglypuff will literally never be as good as he was in melee
Thank Sakurai

Air mobility.
Not Jiggs level, but better than what he's got.

Make Inhale better and faster.
Imagine being able to confirm into it.

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I agree actually, you should be able to confirm into inhale
It should be a given that you get to use your opponents B at all times

Same shit with smash 4 Bowser on release. People just suck fat dick at smash

king k. rool is bad but not that bad, jesus christ

>lucina still in top 5 because???
>joker in top 3 simply because of MKLeo
>inkling still top 5 because???
>chrom and roy still that high because ???

Is it weird I hate facing more characters in High than top?

CF is about the same here as he is in melee post buffs

what do the numbers mean?

>the game will literally never be as good as melee

>joker in top
Am I just playing him wrong? He's really not that good.

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he's put there simply because the best player plays him, no one else gets results with him

Falcon is great, he's just different, but man, I still miss ground-to-air momentum

Retard

Is mewtwo actually that bad?

he's definitely not as good as smash 4 mewtwo, i'd say he's middle mid tier above the belmontsttfttttttftftfftft,

How is he not? Combo food for the entire cast with slow moves.

they gave him a fuck huge hurtbox on his tail

NINTENDO, BUFF MY THICK BOY NOW

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Pikachu is the busted character of 64.

Pikachu is even more busted than Kirby in 64, I dunno what the fuck you're talking about.

Like seriously try edgeguarding Pika, it's impossible (Kirby and Jiggs only have a slight chance if Pika takes a predictable trajectory back to the stage). Better hope your combo kills, because Pika's sure will if yours doesn't.

Faghot

Kirby and PP being that low is upsetting, especially since they don't even need that much to be at least mid tier. Literally just improve their mobility and decrease PP's endlag.

Plebs are sleeping on Sonic again.

Being a tryhard means you have to explode your head by doing one of the most simple actions because you keep over-complicating yourself

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This, leo is a beast and is the only good joker player

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Tryhard means you try to win you word changing nigger

Someone explain the numbers to me.

How are Icies, Zelda, and Rosetta low tier, while Murabito, Gaogaen, and Bayonetta are mid tier, despite all of them having the exact same value of 2.0?

user something is wrong when incineroar has better aerials than ridley

I always thought it was funny how all of my secondaries are in bottom tier consecutively. All three of them were right fucking beside eachother: bowser jr., K. Rool, piranha plant.

This is of course referring to the previous tier list, since now isabelle has butted herself into the middle of it.

My main is low tier, but I also run a pocket Lucina. I wonder where Banjo will land on this list.

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I might take up sonic. Anything I should know if I do?

DO: Go fast
DON’T: Go slow

Spin to win

Thank you

Every time it still amazes me how kirby can be so consistently bad

>he

And where do you put the word “hard”?
You also ignore that the keyword is “try”, illiterate cumbag

Sonic, only because I really hate fighting him.

>tfw they nerfed both k.rool and piranha plant
>kirby, once again dead last

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>Each character in my 5 man squad-strike team is in a different tier

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>Luigi
>braindead

Piranha Plant got buffed, idiot

I just started using Bowser a couple of days ago and he's pretty fun and kills really fucking early. Also, he's fat as fuck and lives forever.

>people bitch and meme about k. rool and ridley for years
>when they get in they're both low/bottom tier trash

Maybe Sakurai was right all along

If you play Joker just know you're a nigger and no one will ever love you. DLC fags deserve the rope.

What if I play Banjo?

K. Rool would have dethroned Ganon as For Glory: the character of that mode still existed in ultimate

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I dont even play this anymore but its nice to see my main Shulk is doing good.

>Marth
What went wrong?

>Captain Falcon will never be able to do this again

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Puff is female. This is undeniable.

>shitter
r/lgbt is more your speed homo.

You truly think that any of this Tier List or the competitive aspect of Smash (Or any fighting game for that matter) TRULY matters?

From all the sales smash got, just a third part of them give a dam about the competitive aspect or the tier list... most people play in all the stages, four players, with items on... most likely offline.

The competitive player live in their own special world, and good for them, is fun to watch, but let's not pretend they are the base consumer.

I just realize, how huge is the gap between Marth and Lucina in relation to all the other echoes. That ONE difference turned out to be a big one in the end it seems.

Give him wall jumps like Ninja Kirby has. Also make the final hit of his dair actually connect, give more power/knockback to his uair, replace the fair with an attack that is actually useful instead of being disjointed, give inhale more priority over shields in exchange for easier escape when eaten, the ability to inhale projectiles/items and gain abilities from them, and replace side b with a more useful special ability like Beam.

Lucina

>K. Rool
>bottom

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>Pickachu absolute top
ESAM was right all along...

>Launch Joker is considered weak
>People put him in low tier
>MKLeo picks Joker up
>He starts dominating the meta with him
>Suddenly Joker is the new Bayonetta
Tier fags BTFO

So what's your experience with how often you encounter characters in this game, Yea Forums?

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Falcon was good in Melee and had a shitton of combos. Ultimate Falcon's combo game is pathetic. The only move that actually combos is up air into itself.

>Donkey Kong and K. Rool that low
No.

>Falcon can no longer aerial falcon punch
I do that kinda shit all the time what do you mean?

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>Fun to fight against
>Duck Hunt, Wario, Dedede, Peach, K. Rool, Ice Climbers, Villager, Yoshi
>Fun to fight against

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>Flowchart muscle memory zero-to-death off of a tether grab
Practice for 10 minutes and he becomes braindead

>and frame data.
So real data, real data, and then random opinion hypotheticals? You almost had an objective list and then you muddied it the fuck up.

OP lied
This is the combined result of 10 Top Player tier lists, as well as Zero's ( Who can't be considered Top anymore but was included anyway )

At 0:06s notice how Falcon loses all of his running momentum when he jumps? He didn't do that in Melee or 64. You could dash, then jump and go super deep, like in

>tfw spending hours arguing about tiers and character performances
>then exclusively playing with 4-8 friends with all items, hazards and Final Smash meters on

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Tier lists are often subjective in nature. A character with bad frame data that has a gimmick that makes it win against a common pick in the current meta will be ranked higher than a character with good frame data but a poor matchup to common meta picks. Unless you make a tier list for every combination of "character X vs all other characters" based solely on win rates, you can't just look at the data and rate them in a generic sense; there's going to be some opinions in there.

He's already a solid character who can play as rushdown or campy, but also becomes has a gimmick gauge™ that lets him become the undisputed best in the entire game when it's full

And MKleo always abuses top tiers. His reasoning for picking up joker in the first place was he's overpowered. Ike was top tier too when everyone didn't incorporate parrying into their play yet either.

You're pretty much a moron to think a character isn't good when they've seen tournament results literal weeks after being released whereas tr4sh bayo and cloud didn't win any majors for a fucking YEAR after being released each. Didn't even place top 8 for 6 months either.

Even if you disagree about him being absolute top tier, the fact that he is solo mainable in such a counterpick heavy game is enough to establish him as at least a high tier.

How is Wario so high tier on everyones list? I tried getting into him since soimeone said he plays like a heavyweight version of puff but his moves feel really inconsistant, specifically his up tilt and up air feel like they dont hit opponents when it should be hitting, and sometimes they hit when it looks like it should miss
also funny how mewtew was s tier on everyones list on release and he has received nothing but buffs and is bottom tier now

>frame data is random opinion hypotheticals
>the only data that's objective and hard coded into the game

Wario has safe & versatile pressure from his great Air Speed & Aerials that can combo start & let him get a quick 40%. He has decent ways of getting around shield from the aforementioned pressure & speed making him difficult to punish him Out of Shield, to Chomp being possibly the game's best Command Grab, to UpThrow combos.
He's also a ticking time bomb that has access to 30% kill confirms once every 2 minutes or so, and 60% kill confirms once every minute or so. Wario has the mobility to platform camp and play lame if needs be, to wait until Waft is charged, but that side of his metagame hasn't even been explored that much and he retains a lot of potential.