Anyone else annoyed with how characters in Smash are depicted?

Anyone else annoyed with how characters in Smash are depicted?
Like why the fuck is Mario so angry? He's always been a cheery dude, and even in Melee he was a little pissed, but since Brawl he's just always pissed off. And we've had the same edgy throat cancer Mario voice clips for three games now when even Luigi got new ones.

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Mari is about to pound someone's teeth into their esophagus and you want him to be cheery?

>when even Luigi got new ones.
he did?

>Like why the fuck is Mario so angry?
Mario would look like a psychopath if he was smiling and cheery while beating the shit out of other people.

>Joker
>doesnt summon different demons like what Persona is known for
>instead hes just budget Dante right down to the devil trigger mechanic
He would be the worst edition if Cloud didnt exist

Sonic is still a smug son of a bitch in the heat of battle but he has 2 spindashes. Why?

This
That's why there was the psycho villager memes back in smash 4

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Im sick of mario's shitty ass voice from brawl onward

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>when even Luigi got new ones
Mario, Luigi, and Wario have all been using the same voice clips since Melee.
I don't like how Bowser and the DK characters all use generic animal noises instead of their actual voices. It's even weirder when you have Bowser in the same match as Jr. or one of the Koopalings. Thankfully this didn't happen to Banjo and Kazooie.

All of Kirby’s fucking shit tier representation really cements this idea. Everything has to be from a Sakurai game otherwise it won’t get represented in any meaningful way. I’m still angry that Kirby is forever bottom tier because Sakurai can’t swallow his pride and change up his moveset that quite frankly isn’t fun to use.

Don't forget how he portrayes several of the AT characters wrong and makes them look weak like Starfy

Sakurai’s bias gets more and more tiring with every game.

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Forgot about Starfy, holy shit what a trainwreck of an assist. It's done more damage than he realizes.

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Joker and Arsene could very easily be model-swapped to MC and Thanatos, too. Fuck P4.

The only thing in your list that is just blatantly misrepresenting the character are the realistic animal grunts for the Kong’s, Bowser, and K. Rool. It makes them out to be viscous wild animals when in the games they make goofy noises and are relatively silly characters. Meanwhile Ridley finally makes it in and all four of the characters I named are louder and make more noise than him. He’s literally known for his screeching and wild behavior and Smash represents that horribly because he’s so fucking quiet.

Mario is pissed because so you know he has to get serious and play for keeps. No binging or wahooing in this battle.

his melee voice is so much better

M64 voice lines will always be the best, I wish I could somehow put those in the game.

It’s fucking bonkers how blatantly biased the representation is.

but he would bing and wahoo in melee and smash 64, brawl started the super serious edge mario

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Mario smiles during some of his animations, his idle stance is just focused

Two non Sakurai alts are in for Meta Knight.

Alts =/= characters
I would have killed for a Dark Metaknight echo.

or better yet
Galacta Knight echo that's just Brawl Meta Knight

This, Melee was the last time we had the N64-era Mario, complete with the same voice clips and tan.

Hell, Melee itself was basically a swan song for the N64-era as characters like Fox, Falco, Captain Falcon, the Zelda characters, Bowser etc.. all had their designs and/or voice clips from that era.

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>not even an echo
T-thanks, sakurai. I’m happy that development time went towards another fire emblem character.

>Kirby stages:
>whispy woods
>whispy woods, again
>the ENTIRETY OF KIRBY'S DREAM LAND
>>bonus points: the above was going to be a Mario Land stage

Honestly there's tons of this shit. Metroid and DK have no stages in Ultimate newer than Brawl because they only got one stage in both versions of 4 and they were horribly gimmicky. Meanwhile Kid Icarus and Fire Emblem both got new stages, an honor usually reserved for the likes of Mario/Zelda/Pokemon/Animal Crossing.

Just look at this poor guy. Four games in and he's still stuck fighting like a bootleg Falcon instead of the magical swordsman warlock he could have been had he not been a last minute inclusion in Melee.

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>>Luigi is wimpy and LOL GOOFY
He's like that in the Mario games too.
>>>Bowser transforms into some OC donut that he envisioned as a kid
What's wrong with that? It's not like he's always in that form.
>>>Lucas is still pushed as a crybaby when he got over his weakness and became brave a third of the way into M3
He's only really portrayed like that in SSE, where he also becomes brave and defeats Wario (iirc)

That too.
Anyone other than Chrom.

I'm confused on what this is showing

Mario was the best in Melee in terms of presentation imo. Martinet is getting old so I don't expect much of him unless its a mainline Mario game.

The first Kirby stage is based on Kirby 64 and features Dedede's design from that game in the background.

I can’t blame him. Outside of Squeak Squad and Amazing Mirror (which he played a part in development for) Kirby has been shit ever since he stopped working on it.

Is that a Gmod player model?

Kirby 64 came after the first Smash.

>He's like that in the Mario games too.
Not to the extent that Sakurai does it.
>What's wrong with that? It's not like he's always in that form.
It was the slow start where Smash became less about a crossover and more of its own thing. As someone who likes the crossover aspect, the Smash original stuff is hit-or-miss.
>He's only really portrayed like that in SSE
Palutena's guidance for him has Viridi berate him for being a crybaby. Ironic considering Smash Four was a extension on the Uprising canon/lore.

>Wario is a zany EMBODIMENT OF GROSS DID I MENTION HE'S GROSS
user it’s not misrepresentation of Wario. His WarioWare version is being represented in Smash which very much is le wacky zany fart man. Nintendo doesn’t give a fuck about Wario Land.

>Squeak Squad
>Not shit

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He was added to brawl late in development
though I agree that many old smash characters could really, really use an update

>Viridi calling him a crybaby
Lucas had the worst life out of everyone on the roster. Everyone in his life including him is fucking dead. What a crybaby.

Kirby isn't the only one with this problem

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I recall the comments he made about Dragon Quest mechanics were viewed by the fans of that series as something he got wrong.

>Palutena's guidance for him has Viridi berate him for being a crybaby. Ironic considering Smash Four was a extension on the Uprising canon/lore.
Viridi is a huge bitch, that's totally in-character.

This isn't quite as bad as kirby since it's 4 games to 2 instead of 3 games to 9. Also there was a Country Returns stage in 4 that didn't get brought back. There also is the problem that the Returns characters would at best make for a assist trophy

>Nintendo doesn’t give a fuck about Wario Land.
And my boycott of WarioWare hasn't stopped since I played the samples in Wario World and hated them.

Outside of Bashmaster, Cactus King and Fredrik, Rare DK is the only source to pull for characters. You're right about the rest and most of the Rare songs are the remixes of Jungle Hijinx.

Japanese fans? Was it how they arranged the spells from the trailer footage?

>Nintendo doesn’t give a fuck about Wario Land.
This

>nintendo doesn't give a fuck about Wario Land
it hurts lads

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Anyone else annoyed how this irrelevant shitter got in over someone like Bomberman?

Real talk, why the fuck is Banjo playable? He's an irrelevant character from a dead franchise

Actual iconic characters like Bomberman, who has over 70 games mind you is only an assist trophy, but this ugly bear who has only 5 games, 2 of which weren't even in Japan gets to be playable?

Unfucking acceptable, you can't seriously defend this.

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Yeah I get that. And for Brawl (while it did bother me back then) I can accept that, but this is Sonic's third returning entry and he still has 2 spindashes. I'm grateful his down smash is cooler because its definitely something he'd do and its not another spindash but he could be much much better. I also wish Tails could carry him as his up special but thats just a personal request for fanservice.

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>squeak squad
>good
You haven’t played any of the good modern games, friend. Squeak Squad is one of if not the worst mainline game in the series.

Don't reply to him.

Cope Banjofag

No, it was all fans of the series that talked about it and it was not about the order.
Basically Sakurai talked about the series in an interview but the way he described how the spells can be learned and the shields of the heroes, fan noted he got it wrong and was brought up even here.

I don't remember Squeak Squad being bad. It had cool abilities and nice enemy designs. Though I do remember the final boss being pretty lame. I'd still take SS over vanilla Star Allies anyday.

Who the fuck even is Bomberman? Fuck him, got replaced by a franchise people actually care about (Castlevania).

Give it a rest already, you've been pushing this Bomberman-Banjo rivalry for ages and no-one bites.

Let me regurgitate the same old points you never have any answers for, just so you can get one (You) and feel like you're not a complete failure.
>Bomberman's 70 games on average fail to break even half a million and required tons of games to get any level of recognizability
>Banjo's 5 games on average broke a million sales and his two N64 games basically cemented him as an icon for the console

It's not a hard argument to make that Banjo is way more iconic - he made a bigger splash in less games and less time.

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Snake.
Sakurai: Lol, all he does is hide on a box.
Has Sakurai at least played a metal gear solid game?
I mean, i think he at least did considering his moveset, but the way he acts during SSE and the world of light intro scene makes me think otherwise

The absence of Dixie still hurts me. And most of the DK themes are Jungle Hijinx.
youtube.com/watch?v=hfy6cU9Mku0

> Banjo more iconic
Fucking retard, also STOP USING NUMBERS FROM 2004 FOR BOMBERMAN!

Jesus, you can't be this fucking stupid, get some help.

youtube.com/watch?v=h1tkgCFG_ec
It's such a shame we'll never get a Ganondorf akin tot his. Fags will say he's fine now because he has epic sword smash attacks, but his aerials, tilts, and specials are pretty much all Falcon's.

Zoomer faggot

> One of the games that revolutionized multiplayer in gaming, as it allowed up to 4-8 players before it became a staple, hell some games could even have 10 players
> Hi-ten Bomberman was the first HD game ever made
> First third-party to crossover with a Nintendo property
Learn your history Amerimutt

REEEEEE MARIO'S OVERALLS ARE TWO SHADES DARKER THAN THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO BEE

Snake's highlight is him rescuing Peach and Zelda and then bum rushing a room full of Mr. G&W. Lucario finding Snake in a box was kind of funny though too.

>I don't remember Squeak Squad being bad
It's not bad, it's just mediocre.

Squeak Squad was just mediocre and doesn’t do anything very interesting. I agree with Star Allies though, it fucking sucked. If you ask me, the best modern games are Return to Dreamland and Robobot, with Robobot being so good it gives Super Star and Super Star Ultra a run for their money. If Star Allies is your only exposure to the very modern Kirby games, give the 3DS games or RTDL a go, they all follow the same basic formula Star Allies does, but all of them do it ten times better. Star Allies was a mess and obviously rushed.

Only the first two games was million sellers, and even Tooie lost Money for Rare, the GBA games didn't do shit and neither did N&B

Your pet peeves, by franchise

>Wario
No new songs in Ultimate even though WarioWare Gold just came out and had high quality versions of tons of old songs from Wario de Mambo, Body Rock, Drifting Away and new songs like Wario Deluxe's theme
Still only one (ONE) Wario Land song - despite the fact that WL1, 2, 3, 4 and Shake It all sold/shipped a million copies minimum (warioforums.com/threads/new-wario-series-sales-thread.2511/#post-50038)

>Donkey Kong
Only stages are Jungle, River or Jungle-River. No minecart stage (think Big Blue), no sunset themed stage from Returns
Retro stage is 75M - who the FUCK likes 75M? The one time Sakurai doesn't go for the bland opening stage, he picks this hunk of shit.

Hell they don’t even have demons or Shadows fucking spirt battles
Jack Frost as a level 9 ice climbers would be easy addition

Smash for Wii U was the perfect opportunity for a Return to Dream Land stage, but instead we received The Great Cave Offensive, Kirby's worst stage.

>Alph instead of Louie
>pacmans alts still suck

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>disses 75m
>wants a fucking minecart stage

>Lucas is still pushed as a crybaby when he got over his weakness and became brave a third of the way into M3

Lucas is plenty happy and cheery looking in Smash 4/Ultimate, though? It's only Brawl that portrayed him like that.

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Joker obviously seems like a rushed job and judging by the footage of DQ Hero showing many of his normals being copy-pasted from Link, Hero will be rushed too. Feels like the DLC has been subpar compared to 4's so far in terms of quality. There's no justifying reusing animations and attacks on fucking DLC characters when the base game newcomers are unique even Isabelle is.

> No new songs in Ultimate even though WarioWare Gold just came out
Too new dumbass, the game was near completion at the time WarioWare Gold was released

current ganondorf is too popular to be totally redone
cry all you want, it will never happen

>Punch-Out!!
Only 5 songs, 2 of them lackluster remixes, and no character battle themes like Don Flamenco's or Super Macho Man's. As well as no Major Circuit theme even though there's Minor Circuit and World Circuit. And another thing, the "Player Down" Music doesn't play on the Wii songs when someone has one stock left when the Street Fighter songs and 8bit Mario tracks speed up when someone has a single stock left (and those are separate audio files in the game so it'd still work). Also Aran Ryan and Disco Kid aren't spirits for some reason.

"On average"
3,650,000 + 1,490,000 (BK/T's sales) divided by 5 (the amount of Banjo Kazooie games TOTAL) = 1,028,000
Even with those turboflops taken into account it's still a million selling franchise. That's way better than Bomberman will ever do.

>Sonic music
>they decide to add fucking Scrap Brain Zone
>no music from Sonic Rush, a nintendo exclusive, with an absolute top tier soundtrack
how the fuck does anyone fight to Scrap Brain? And Emerald Hill Zone too what the hell?

Just play Falcon, fag. Clones have been cancer since melee.

Why is not this song on Ultimate, Sakurai? You coward!
youtube.com/watch?v=9RJIcYXWdHc

> Implying Bomberman isn't a million selling franchise
Absolute retard, I now furfags are stupid, but you simply cannot be this dumb.

>the one Sonic Rush song in Wii U was removed

>DQ Hero showing many of his normals being copy-pasted from Link
objectively false
he has a shield and suddenly everybody trying to call him a clone

>Sonic still has 2 spindashes

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>No Sin and Punishment Music
>Isaac assist removed for no reasons
>No Mistery Dungeon Music

I hope Nintendo doesn't stick to the "main" character only for the Smash roster. One of Super Smash Bros's biggest problems is a complete lack of PoC/women representation. A large part of this is due to the lack of non-white characters among Nintendo main characters.

I'm almost certain this is the same guy that posts against K. Rool.

>Isaac assist removed for no reasons

It's back though

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Why the fuck is megaman silent on smash?

He did talked on the past, why turn it into some mute moron?

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>Lucas is still pushed as a crybaby when he got over his weakness and became brave a third of the way into M3
Even though Sakurai plays hundreds of games a year, he only plays the beginning of games, he doesn't have time to beat every one. He mentioned this in an interview. Ever notice how stuff in Smash is almost always based on the beginning of games? They're the part Sakurai remembers. It's honestly not a bad idea either, as it's the part most people are most likely to know.
>Wario is a zany EMBODIMENT OF GROSS DID I MENTION HE'S GROSS
That's a Japan vs US thing. Wario was localized a lot different here. Over there he's basically zany and gross.
youtube.com/watch?v=hbMxAH8hrZc
youtube.com/watch?v=PjYMZ4ebR78

Meant Isaac in Wii U, Saki in Ultimate.
>Only 1 GS track

I wish they went with the trailer version of the minor circuit theme instead of just the minor circuit theme - it incorporates the player down theme AND it has the better build up

>ganondorf is bad because i lost to him
based

> No Sin and Punishment music
Tons of assist trophies doesn't have music, even someone who has been there from the start like Starfy or Custom Robo

Hell, even Bomberman didn't get music despite the franchise is jampacked with ton of good tunes. It's like they didn't give a fuck about AT representation

Because he's silent in the original NES games, that's what he's based on in Smash.

What was even the reason behind this? I can't imagine Naganuma would have a issue with it

Meant Saki

You need to go back.

Mega Man's concept in Smash is basically what would happen if he walked right out the NES and into an HD game.

>"wowee! ganon isn't a clone anymore! happy soiface!!"
>proceeds to drop the game after the first week and whine about something else on gamefaqs
>meanwhile, ganondorf fags lose their main
This is why it won't happen. You whiner fags don't play the game and don't understand shit about the characters you bitch about. This isn't just a fanservice sim, it has to function like a game too.

>Absolute retard, I now furfags are stupid,
Check yourself before you wreck yourself.

"On average"
Reading comprehension, user. Banjo's sales on average are better than Bomberman's sales on average.

Banjo has -5- games, two of which sold several million each. On average, he is a million-seller.

Bomberman has -70- games, and very few of them have ever broken a million. On average, he is a sub-million seller.

absolutely no reason whatsoever
naganuma didn't get a say. the song belongs to sega

Ganondorf players are one of the easiest to counter. Why do Smashfags have such a tendency to go "git gud" when most of them are shit at their own game?

>ZSS has a crawl which looks just like it did in Zero Mission
>Samus doesn't have a crawl to begin with, much less a morph ball crawl
I don't understand, it would help too given how fuckin tall the character is.

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Well I definitely wouldn't want his Megaman 8 voice back in. His voice in 11 is fine though.

Why even remove assist trophies in the first place? Can't they just port them from the previous games

If all of the Pokemon Pokeballs from Smash 4 are in Ultimate, why the fuck aren't all the AT from Smash 4 in Ultimate then? It sucks for franchises like Advance Wars and Sin & Punishment that barely has any content in Smash , AT was the only noteworthy representation they had

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Smash Four's DLC was literally copy-paste too. Each DLC character had a base to work on, even Bayonetta* the Realizable. Smash in general has always reused animations since the first game.

This was when Sakurai was hellbent and at his highest point of diva-ism.
>I'm not going to let just anyone into Smash Bros.
I don't think he wanted Mega Man, but felt obligated to do so under his terms. That same line rubs me the wrong way, Smash Four in general made me dislike Sakurai with every one of his interviews.

In the adverts, he was gross. In-game, literally none of the gross shit appeared. I get him being zany but to me Wario also had a strong, macho personality and his appearance in Smash isn't that. He's also way too small and shorter than Mario. He should be at least Luigi's height.

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>character looks mad in a fighting game
ofc he does, he'd look insane if he didn't

I found the solution to this problem. Add an F-Zero character that takes Dorf’s clone move set, and give Dorf a new move set. Problem solved.

Mario has always been competitive. You don't know shit

>That's a Japan vs US thing. Wario was localized a lot different here. Over there he's basically zany and gross
What this user said. I onlz just learned this myself fairly recently, but yeah Wario has always been the gross pee poop guy over in Japan.
Heres a well written article on the subject
sourcegaming.info/2015/08/11/wariofart1/

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Many Mega Man games haven't broken a million either, yet the franchise is still about 30+ million in total

Try and take all the numbers and put it in once dumbass

Mario: Always angry
Samus: Sounds like a robot when dying
Yoshi: Never makes his iconic noise
Bowser: Doesn't sound anything like he does in any game
Dr. Mario: Seems even angrier despite always smiling all the time in his game
Young Link: Alts are shit and all made up when there are plenty of different swords and shields to give him
Ganondorf: Moveset is unlike any game he's in
Sonic: Most boring moveset ever, everything is a variation of the spin attack. No classic Sonic alt.
Dedede: Sounds retarded
Rosalina & Luma: Should just be called Rosalina
Cloud: Limit should just charge while dealing and receiving damage like his home game, waste of a special
Inkling: Victory music doesn't continue like Cloud's does
Ridley: No tail pogo
Isabelle: Has no voice
Banjo & Kazooie: Kazooie's voice is too deep, like they just used the raw voice sample before being pitch adjusted

>Banjo
>More iconic than Bomberman
Cope

We have achieved peak autism, gentlemen.

Forgot one
Bomberman: not playable despite shit like Banjo is

Because OP... If everyone was smiling looking happy while kicking the shit out of each other it'd be fucking creepy. Take this gif for example. This makes Pacman look like a maniac.

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>no mystery dungeon music
it fucking sucks doesn't it bros

See Banjo did shit for gaming compared to Bomberman, you absolute zoomer retard.

Imagine thinking 5 game bear, 2 of which Japan have no clue about is more iconic. Fucking Mutt

Do enough people care for that to be worthwhile though? I like the idea but it isn't realistic.

If you think I didn't want both Banjo and Bomberman in, you're mistaken you divide and conquer autismo.

It has nothing to do with being a diva. Mega Man is clearly based off the NES games. Which are the most well known and praised Mega Man games. If he had a voice and was like X or some shit I would vomit.

Bomberman IS in Smash Ultimate, just turn Items on

>all the salt over Banjo getting in
can't wait for all the new music he'll get, not to mention Spirit Battles, unique stage and whatever extra goodies he gets on top of that

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Ok, nigga, I’m sick and tired of hearing this shit. You know what Wario is in WarioWare? A greedy, egotistical, son of a bitch and the fucker always has muscle definition in Ware art and the first two games show him weight lifting. Hell, pretty sure the first boss minigame is that one about Wario punching the ball.

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>Banjo did shit for gaming compared to Bomberman
Nope, Banjo piggy backed off of what Mario was already doing hence why it died off so quickly since people could just play Mario. Also Banjo is not boomer so I'm afraid you're just gonna have to cope

>Cloud: Limit should just charge while dealing and receiving damage like his home game, waste of a special
The special transforms into Finishing Touch at full charge. Play the fucking game.
This is some of the most autistic shit I've read all day, christ.

>Mega Man is clearly based off the NES games
I know that, but you have idiots saying he never showed emotion or spoke as if Smash's take on him was the de-facto portrayal. It's less about Mega Man and more about that quote when he showed up. Sakurai at that time was bitchier than normal, look at his interviews then and look at them now, a little more toned down.

Wow a whole 5 million, even when you put that number into perspective 5 million for 5 games, that doesn't even beat out DaS1 which is supposed to be a bit more niche targeting due to difficulty setting and mechanics. MHW alone outsold it, REMake 2 outsold the series, Nier Automata outsold the series as well, and if you want to be a "salesfag" I shouldn't even sneeze out the names Tetris and Minecraft

I wish Link and Zelda got the Hero treatment. Even Ganondorf could have gotten TP as an alt like Ike and tons of other characters have.

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I hate Banjo though

He's in the middle of a fight. That's why he's angry. Fucking weirdo.

I honestly think Sakurai doesn’t enjoy Zelda games. That’s the only thing that can explain it’s half assed representation.

>Metroid
Samus various suits aren't available as alts.
Only 1 track from Prime 2 and 3, which is just the brinstar jungle floor remix from prime 2 MP.
Dark Samus's theme isn't in when she's in.
>Punch-Out!!
Little Mac being one of the lightest characters while having to fastest airfall speed. Fucks over his recovery by a shitton. Also no boxer themes. Doc Louis should appear alongside Mac in taunts.
>Zelda
Skyward Sword never got any representation in the form of character costumes despite being the last major Zelda title before 4.

Ridley's design in Ultimate is my favorite rendition of the character, very expressive in his animations, etc. But I feel like his moveset doesn't really reflect how it feels to fight him in Metroid. Take a look at K. Rool for example, sure he sucks but everything he does feels like its straight outta DKC.

Ridley in Metroid is constantly flying around and fucking you up in the skies, and I remember specifically that part of his boss fight in Prime was getting him to the ground and he became much easier to hit. I feel it would be best if his moveset reflected that in Smash: give him mediocre smash attacks and only a couple good get off me tools, but then also design certain moves to get Ridley's opponents off their feet. Then give him great aerial mobility and amazing aerials, along with a hover like Peach, but keep him lighter than other big body characters as a result. He'd basically be an anti-Little Mac in this regard

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Banjo literally inspired the entire gamecube era fuck off

shitpost

The biggest crime with Punch-Out is that is has no Assist Tropy, it's the only Nintendo series with more than 2 characters that doesn't have one.

It's a waste in 99% of situations anyway, especially since finishing touch is trash. He has way too many abilities in his game to just make shit up, like having him stand in place and charge a limit which he never does besides against Sephiroth and it's not supposed be like he's channeling his energy like Smash implies, it's because he's pissed off.

A lot of Smash characters have a lot of problems when it comes to their interpretations, even just on a basic level. Olimar, DK characters, and Bowser don’t have a voice for absolutely no reason. Sakurai seems to think the Power Suit weighs down Samus.

Really?

> He really thinks this
Mario 64 and Bomberman Hero came out before BK zoomer retard. Banjo did shit

When talking about 3D platformers, it was only Mario 64 when mentioned for games like Jak and Daxter

>no air-pogo
>side b is dragging people across the ground instead of his tail-charge thing
>down-b is a near useless pierce attack
>awful and confusing recovery

Captain Falcon Moveset was taken on a fighter from the planned game before it became Smash, Falcon would gain some own attacks in the Anime (which are not in), Ganondorf received Falcon moveset, but that would have been more fitting to Black Shadow (who has also his own moves in the anime)
>Ganondorf: Wizard
>Black Shadow: Brute + Magic

ok lets play a match i bet youll lose bc youre trash

>Banjofags and Crashfags bring up sales numbers at very possible oppourtunity
>Nooooo we cant have 2BEE Sneve and Sands Underfail in the game
I mean I dont want either of them in the game either but you cant have your cake and eat it too. You cant be opposed to characters like that but also suddenly be a salesfag

This one mod basically made his side special an aerial command grab. If you grabbed it on the ground he would start flying up in the air with the opponent, who he could then throw in four directions including straight down offstage. They tried balancing it by making it so that if you whiff the move you get sent into freefall

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Zelda has pretty good representation in every department other than characters. All of the stages span throughout the entire series and even a lot of the music remixes are good.

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Name 10 games. It was a entire era so it shouldn't be hard

I really thought Springman was gonna make it in the minute the first Ultimate trailer dropped with the Inklings. Maybe he'll get a promotion in the next Smash Bros if there's ever an Arms 2 or something.

>unique stage

That is the only thing I don't like. I hate Spiral Mountain because it's so fucking boring. It's a dry uninspired tutorial area. The top of Grunty's castle is much better where you fight her. Or how about Click Clock Wood with the different seasons? Or how about Freezy Peak? Or how about Witchy World? Good options, but Sakurai chose the "safe" one which is of course the worst of the lot.

This is my worry with newcomers in Smash, they getting garbage stages. Especially if theyré third party meaning the time and money wasted on getting them is also wasted on a crappy stage. This is why I worry about Sora from Kingdom Hearts ever getting into Smash, Sakurai will chose Outset Island from Windwaker....sorry I mean Destiny Island which is a boring shit stage (it's so boring that not even the creator of the franchise has ever made it playable because he likes to get out of there ASAP).

Or how about Crono from Chrono Trigger, yeah lets give him the generic boring fair instead of COOL levels like Magus's Castle or The End of Time? You get where I'm going with this? Shitty stages for newcomers. Really takes the joy out of everything.

Not like there's any shortage of great options either. Bald Bull would've been perfect.
>dominates the platform he's on forcing you to dodge
>incredibly strong charge
>but can be 1HKO'd with a strong enough attack at the right time

Banjofags are fucking backstabbers, they shittalking characters like Geno and Isaac now despite all of them being on the same boat for years, and let's not forget the whole Grinch fiasco.

Seethe'in Steven!

fans put smash on this godly petiole they take it too fucking serious someone said that a newcomer is like applying for a job. No it's not

Spiral Mountain is the only level that Sakurai played.

>still stuck fighting like a bootleg Falcon
They have three moves in common.

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But he’s exactly the same character in the games.

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>2 FUCKING SONGS
I'm still mad

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>One more character would had not hurt
>Wind Waker and Young Link has previous Link moveset and not their unique items like the masks
>Ocarina Ganondorf uses a sword from a trailer, which did not used in the game
>Zelda and Breath of the Wild Link moveset are ok
>

>DK has made up stages, made up visuals, all jungles and 75 m
>Metroid has three lava stages, Brinstar and Brinstar Depths have visuals that I have no idea where they fucking came from, Prime is represented by the fucking bug room
haha.....

Still mad that we didn't forget when you doomfags sided with refusteves for that 5chan "leak"? Typical

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Man why the fuck wasnt prime Phazon mines or something

and thats a good thing

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Metroid is sorely lacking in a lot of potentially amazing Prime remixes.
youtu.be/UNc0_P_-hxU
Not to mention almost every stage is an uninspired lava one, with the only non-lava stage being based off of, you guessed it, a basic tutorial level.

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>Said trailer was not even for Zelda, it was for promoting the Gamecube

And so is Crash Bandicoot but that doesnt change the way people percieve him based on Japanese vs American advertisements
Look I want a more Wario Land based Wario as much as the next guy. If Wario could carry people with one hand like DK id fucking cream. Itll likely never happen, though. Wario Land is fucking dead and nintendo doesnt give a shit

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What’s wrong with Spiral Mountain? It’s in Kazooie, Tooie, and Nuts & Bolts. And besides we’ve seen very little of the stage, there could be an area transition gimmick. Who knows.

Parasite Queen room doesn’t even look like it does in the game lmao
No Phazon Mines or Phendrana is gay as fuck. DS got cucked hard in Brawl too, thanks for the transformation gimmick Sakurai.

go drink some bleach, shit for brains

But this isn’t even about Land. In Mario games, he’s rude and greedy and a strong brutish type character. It’s not about having transformation moves or Land songs or Land stages or the shoulder bash and ground pound. It’s just about the basic personality of this character. Not even a single reference to his universal main personality trait in Smash, greed.

why isn't it some weird level from later in the game that would confuse players and not represent the series as a whole well? WHERE ARE MY TENDIES SAKYRAI?

Seconding this, it ain't anger just being focused on winning.

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Rumble Falls is terribly atrocious.

Don't forget how every stage has to be a fucking boring jungle.
We should have Dixie, Funky, Crank, Pauline, and Classic DK and Jr. together like Ice Climbers.
Fuck this underrepresentation.
The Donkey Kong series literally put Nintendo on the map.

Why should it matter if it “confuses” players, though? Isn’t this a crossover game for the fans? I feel like they should focus on fanservice and not just a basic as possible rep for the series, and the stage itself is already very generic visually compared to others in smash

Sakurai for some reason feels like every stage has to be from the first stage or early in the game or people "won't get it".

Despite Melee basically just taking what they could and doing their own shit with it and people loving it over 20 years later.

How do you represent greed in a moveset. The one time they could and did represent his greed was in Brawl with the trophies in SSE.

His animations, not just the move set. Have him fondle some coins for a victory animation, or make his pummel the Shake It grab and coins fly out.

>no Donkey Kong Jungle Beat level where you fight on Storm Hill
god why that level was fucking art. nearly every level in that game was art

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>One of the only games that dont take from the first stages is Pokemon
>Consistently has the best stages in the game
>No new stage for ultimate
ITS NOT FUCKING FAIR

The representation of DK should be better. Stages and music more varied, freaking Dixie Kong.

But spiral mountain is fanservice. It’s in all of the games. From the footage we’ve seen it also has Mumbo, Grunty, and Bottles and possibly more. Why would you want a random one off stage like Rusty Bucket Bay? Or Grunty Industries? That just wouldn’t make sense.

>urgh, why can't banjo have a more obscure area as his stage?
>grrrr this specific room from metroid prime doesn't represent metroid as a whole well at all
literally how do they win? what would make you stop bitching?

>Sakurai for some reason feels like every stage has to be from the first stage or early in the game or people "won't get it".
user, the Rainbow Mario 64 stage introduced in Melee is literally the last one, after the Clock one.

STINKY STEVIE COPE AND SEETHEY

didnt ness become a god at the end of his game user?

Just listen to Mario's voice clips in SSB64. HERE WE GO and WAHOO, all the cheery things true to his character in his own games. The problem is Brawl went full serious mode and they've been reusing his voice clips since then so he's remained a grumpy grunting character since. I dislike Wario and Bowser's rough guttural voices too since Wario's a lot more high pitched in his own games and Bowser has his own grunts in the Mario games which sound very different from Smash's.

Also I would've liked it if Cappy was actually part of Mario's moveset. Get rid of FLUDD already, I'd take the fucking Tornado over that thing (one of the reasons I prefer to use Dr. Mario actually since I liked Mario's controls in 64)

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Yeah. That was Melee. Look at stages from Brawl and onward.

And then sakurai has the nerve to act like he hates his own Kirby games and wants nothing to do with them.

He did merged with his universal magicant.

To be fair, how do you represent someone being greedy in a fighting game? Warios movements communicate that hes a boisterous piledriving asshole in Smash, but Warios greed is generally displayed by what he does in his games (collecting treasure, shaking enemies down for cash, etc). I dont think that would really be possible without him outright saying stuff like MMMM MONEY

He's also depicted as being a thief, when that's not true at all.
I have a feeling Sakurai only played Persona 5 for like the first hour and then based everything off of that.

>Little Mac
I never liked how pissed Little Mac looks. In Punch Out Wii he would at least be smiling when he won. He struck me as a people's champ in his own games, but in Smash he's just a short angry boxer who sounds japanese despite being from New York.

>Bowser
His final smash being from Melee is stupid. There's enough content to pull from to give him something better. Give him something related to air ships.

>Kirby series
Sucks that we don't see much from the Kumazaki games since they were the best Kirby games we've seen in years. Also Meta Knights final smash became a canon move in Planet Robobot but Sakurai decided to change it to something completely new for no reason. At least we finally got a Masked Dedede final smash.

>Link
I don't like how they went all in on a BOTW moveset for him. Smash is supposed to represent an entire characters history and abilities, not just one game.

Link: Return him to how we was in Brawl/Smash 4. Leave the remote bombs to represent BOTW. Give him his tunics back and have BOTW be an alt costume.
Young Link: Give him a moveset based on mask transformations
Toon Link: Give him a moveset based on Wind Waker

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I don’t give a shit about Banjo I was just saying why someone might not want another stage
and you’re gonna have to explain to me how some dark room represents prime well

Isn't the Halberd reached late in the Kirby games?

Yes

Luigi was literally Mario tone with an higher pitch before having his own tone in Mansion.

Halberd is also from a...Sakurai-directed game.

I miss the bing bing wahoo man.
He just sounds so happy when you play him in 64, going HERE WE GO when doing a back throw

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I think they changed up Link due to both the presence of YL and TL. They had to do something to justify having 3 twinks.

The Halberd debuted in Kirby Super Star, Sakurai game.

>Wily Castle
>Reset Bomb Forest
>Gamer
>Magicent
>Rainbow Road
>Gerudo Valley
>New Pork City
It is only certain series that really get the shaft.

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It's strange. With some characters, Sakurai seems to go all out with a faithful representation such as Megaman, but with others, he seems to insist on putting his own filter on them, such as angry Mario or refusing to use Bowser's usual voice actor and insisting on animal noises. Maybe that's how he interrupted those two with the original SMB and hates their modern selves.

To this day I am surprised that Dark Pit is in the game. Fucking bias

oh boo hoo, they threw in a cheeky extra that probably took a day to make
booooo hooooooo

>pac-man has a ton of decent material from his World games
>none of it is represented in the game, not even with spirits
Why the fuck not?

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Megaman can talk, also some custom moves as special variations would had helped in Ultimate.

youtube.com/watch?v=chuUxbtu2hw

Where is my boy Super Kong?

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a moveset based on mask transformations is the shittiest meme shit I constantly hear spouted to "round out the zelda roster", not only would it take a LOT of fucking effort it would feel awkward and trashy. Why would you spend all that time shoving in another Link that would take as much effort if not more than Pokemon Trainer or Zelda+Shiek at the bare minimum when you can have another Ganondorf/Ganon. Toon Link is a choice because he has his own subset of games including the four sword ones, DS games, Minishcap, etc.

Nah, you get 30 remixes of the Pac-Man theme instead.

He takes first party characters for granted since they're obligatorily there and he can do whatever he wants with them. Alternatively it's all because of Brawl and it's too much effort to update the characters from the characterization made in that game
Third party characters require a little more care on his part since they belong to the third parties who actually have the power to pull them away from Sakurai if he gets too liberal with his interpretation of them, not to mention they probably have somebody at Capcom or whatever giving specific instructions for how the character needs to be portrayed. Cloud is probably the strictest third party character considering how FF only comes with 2 tracks and Cloud's still voiced in Japanese when the FE duo finally got dubbed voices in Ultimate

a skin for DK

The tie is different color, user.

Like I said, these people don't actually play the game. Shulk is already complicated enough with all the property shifting he has, nobody would play YL or Joker if they had something even more complicated.

found the pasta

Never said it had to be a transforming character. Just change Young Links specials to make him more unique than Link.

Neutral B: Fire/Ice arrows
Side B: Goron Roll
Up B: Deku Flower jump
Down B: Zora Barrier
Final Smash: Something related to Fierce Diety Link

>BUT user LINK HAS A FIERCE DEITY COSTUME ALREADY
yeah, and Chrom still appears in Robin's final smash. I don't see an issue here.

based happy ultimate lucas

Movesets of characters can't be altered too much because people become autistic about them just look at link, there are 20 franchises with 72+ characters unless you want the next smash to be a reboot don't expect many changes nor additions, not only that some of the changes you want make not sense or are unrealistic and stupid like giving black shadow ganondorf moves when that doesn't make sense anumore because he doesn't use swords, wario land has been irrelevant since 10 years, punch out newest game was from the fucking Wii, young link was in ultimate because of the "everyone is here", not only that you need to remeber that sakurai needs the approvals of originals dev teams of the IPs in smash is why pokemon doesnt really has shiny alts, why the hero was gonna be silent, why cloud only has 2 songs, etc if the devs doesn't play ball then nothing can't change.

>>Lucas is still pushed as a crybaby when he got over his weakness and became brave a third of the way into M3
Huge mother fag here, and while this was the case in brawl every game past smash 4 portrayed him as confident and stronger. he's still rough around the edges but he's far from being shown as chapter 1-3 lucas and is more like his 7 or 8 nowadays
and plus the only character to refer to Lucas like that is a goddess with a larger ego then most planets who only gives a shit about trees.
>Ever notice how stuff in Smash is almost always based on the beginning of games? They're the part Sakurai remembers
In most cases I assume you're right but with mother 3 he puts in endgame shit like the masked man, New pork, the absolutely safe capsole ect.
I don't think sakurai knows the games beat by beat but to say that he only represents mother 3's beginning is abit absurd.

How do we fix Cloud? both in terms of moveset and representation of his series

I always thought it'd be really cool if YL's final smash was something like
>YL gets final smash, slashes through opponent
>Cutscene starts, opponent lands dazed in an environment like pic related
>Sequence grows more intense, clocks getting closer and faster as an impossibly huge Fierce Diety Link looms over them before slamming down the big fuck you sword on them
It would fit with the faster final smashes they're starting to implement with Ultimate

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yo why didn’t they get dk to have his voice
ganondorf’s voice actor does dk and came in for new lines, i want the scooby doo ass retard screeching in smash, shit’s funny as fuck

Make him more cheerful, give him an english voice, more music, and have him cast a few spells as Specials rather than limit breaks.

>Movesets of characters can't be altered too much because people become autistic about them
I don't think there's a single Samus main who wouldn't be happy with a moveset revamp, a lot of us just try and deal with the hand we're given, I like the way Samus plays in Ultimate but I'd be lying if I said I'd take it over a complete moveset redo that implemented more beam types, power bombs, speed booster, etc

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Agreed completely. Maybe it's time for the actual devs to take a hand in Smash. Iwata gave him a little too much freedom and it shows. Only now does it seem like Nintendo is trying to balance him out with picking the DLC. I still believe that Joker was his pick in exchange for the rest of the pack. That interview/tour of Atlus speaks for itself.

is a better moveset for sonic really too much to ask for? he has TWO (2) spindashes

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>Better alt costumes based on party members
>More songs holy shit. 2 songs is pathetic.
>Add spirits for party members. If you don't want that at least add spirits for the Midgar summons. Not sure why this wasn't a thing in the first place.

All this relies on SE not being awful though, so it will never happen.

>Lucas gets PK Love in his normal attacks
>Ness doesn't get PK Rockin
What gives?

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The problem is that Toon Link doesn't actually use any interesting shit from his games and is just Brawl's version of YLink.

his psi effects I believe are based on rockin's colors, that along with them being rounder compared to lucas' diamond shaped psi effects are meant to show that.

>Thinking Metroid can crawl
user, please

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>sakyrai make luigi too green, remove sukrai immediately
You fags are in for a ride when the next director is inevitably worse than Sakurai. That's how it goes every fucking time.

I really just want Project M Samus with more beams and neutral B changing according to beam choice. Change should be expected, and fags should just fuck off to previous games if they're that autistic over older movesets. Every smash game is mechanically different enough to where you have to adapt to changes anyways.

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Doombros have been telling stevefags to fuck off even before, during, & after the 5chan leak. It seems like you either forgot or are a falseflagging stevefag.

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if Sonic was rushed for Brawl why is his moveset still the same

why are we forbidden from having Bowser and Donkey Kong's glorious voices

why do some characters feel like dinosaurs

ness danks memes

project m is so chad

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Different beams changing properties of certain moves ala side taunt would be the dream but given that some mod implemented it I don't think Sakurai would ever want to put it in an official game based off that alone.

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I'm not that other user, chill.
And hey, better to have tried Smash with a new director than to keep Sakurai for every game.

At least Bowser got a revamp in 4
It was such an arbitrary choice however, Bowser and only Bowser

>why do some characters feel like dinosaurs
because some of them are dinosaurs

I don't see it. Ness' effects are still pink in Smash while PK Rockin is usually red,blue and yellow

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how do i even get into project M? Ive been meaning to for a long time now

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Looks like an angry autist in this pic, like you just called his imaginary pokémon wife ugly.

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Than Ridley would be fuckingn broken. I’m glad Ridley is in, but it’s clear Sakurai was telling the truth when he said that if Ridley was added, limitations had to be made. In smash 4 I remember him talking about how “he couldn’t fly around freely” and yeah, we clearly see that with Ultimate Ridley. A character with amazing ariels, air movement, and a peach hover would be ridiculous. A slightly lower weight than the heavies would not balance out how broken he would be.

I think he should get the Bowser treatment to represent his character better, the flud and the cape are also outdated. He should get cappy and a groundpound.
Donkey Kong should also get a few changes in voice as personality, as well as a new side b like a barrel throw or a roll

>Minish Cap Toon Link never ever.
I just want Link to fight alongside my boy Ezlo with the Four Sword. Fuck the Master Sword.

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>getting rid of the cape
im fine with ditching fludd, but reflecting projectile spam is too good to pass up

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You need either a Wii or a PC capable of emulating.
If you want you can look into P+, which is basically a continuation of Project M after all these years. They've already done shit like give Bowser a fireball.

Sure you have doomfag, cope and seethey with your former pal mr stevie

here's a super useful video that helped me out.
ignore the cancerous intro

>replace cape with Cappy toss which does the exact thing as the Cape (reflecting and flipping characters around), but it's now a ranged special and you can hold the button to make Cappy stay stationary for a while

This is interesting. Do you mind telling us more about Falcon and Black Shadow’s fighting styles from the anime? I’m curious to find out about his more “faithful” moves.

i'm mentally retarded
i forgot the link
youtube.com/watch?v=AtCRgH-iO9U

Here’s how to make Mario more SOULful:
>Neutral Special remains Fireball, but now you can hold it and do the Firebrand from Mario and Luigi
>Side Special is a Cappy toss. This is a quick and persistent projectile that can be used for area denial, and can be bounced off once for an extra lift.
>Down Special becomes the Star Spin from Galaxy. It gives Mario a brief vertical boost, is a powerful close range attack, and reflects projectiles.
>Up Special is the Hover Nozzle. Gives more horizontal distance than vertical distance. Has a windbox that pushes people away horizontally.
>Neutral Aerial is his dive, which can synergize with the Cappy throw.
>Smashes now include hammer whacks
>Mario is visibly more expressive and happy in general
See? Kino

Sakurai is an egotistical fuck that was revealed during Smash 4's development. I am glad people are finally wising up.

He isn't annoyed he's focusing on getting the shit done. It's the same in actual Mario games.

why in the FUCK did they keep Samus in her Other M armor? Ridley & Dark Samus look perfect but I miss bulky Samus so much bros. Her Other M armor is too smooth for me.

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Donkey Kong got done dirty the most
>stages are just jungles or rivers
>took five fucking games to get the main villain
>donkey Kong doesn’t have his voice for some reason
>none of his moves are from his games

DK current dash it is, but his, Diddy and K.Rool grunts dont fit.

>Only just got his roll from DKC a game ago
>At that time Dixie wasn't even on the radar despite fulfilling the so-called rule of relevancy at the time
>Still got shafted in Ultimate

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I'd throw Dixie into obscurity forever to get Funky or Cranky in instead

>donkey Kong doesn’t have his voice for some reason
The closest DK should ever come to a voice in Smash is his JP voice. His 64 voice is shit.

In reality Doctor Mario is the serious one.

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In his games he's actually happy.

Casual.

>what is duck hunt

>STAR ALLIES BAD, ROBOBOT GOOD
I hate this meme, it's a complete double standard.

I think they pitched Kazooie down so Talon Trot wasn't mega annoying like it was in B-K and B-T

I have no fucking idea what this pic is showing.

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Does NOONE here play the sports games where Mario is a pissed off tryhard?

I swear smash fags are THE most autistic group of faggots the gaming realm has ever spawned. Let's forget that chjaracters like K Rool and Simon feel like they practically jumped out of their games. LEts forget that if it wasn't for Sakurai we would've been stuck with Pac-Man's Ghostly adventures design. Let's throw that all out the window just cause some characters in an 80 character roster aren't EXACTLY 1-1 with their games. It's a fighting game. Sometimes you have to improvise and sometimes for the sake of balaence/design reasons not every move makes a smooth transition. Get the fuck over it.
AND FUCK OFF BOMBERMAN FAG. BANJO GOT IN. COPE HARDER.

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I think Smash is generally very good at depicting its characters but they kinda fucked up with Samus and Dark Samus a bit.

Like even ignoring the issues of their movesets, why are Samus' taunts so bland? Why is she still wearing the Other M suit? Why does Dark Samus have the iconic Metroid 2 crouch pose and not Samus? Where is her evil laughter? Why is her theme not in the game?

Because Other M was the most recent Metroid game and the game already started development by the time SR was released.

Bomberman was THE definitive 4 player multiplayer game for a decade before Smash came into existence

>Why does Dark Samus have the iconic Metroid 2 crouch pose and not Samus?
This one's the one that really fucks with me
Imagine if Samus wore the SR Varia suit in Ultimate and had a ton of cool "silent tough gal" animations and some great taunts

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> Smash
> The definite 4 player multiplayer game now
Come on, it's clearly Mario Kart. Normalfags have played that compared to Smash

>His 64 voice is shit
GARBAGE taste

If Sakurai didn't want a character it wouldn't be in the game. He literally said if Namco made him use the Ghostly Adventures design, Pac Man wouldn't be in Smash.

The abilities couldn't decide whether they were going for the single-button simplicity of most of AM/the originals or the complicated bullshit of Super Star. They got stuck in this uncomfortable medium where some abilities are fun and varied and others are a fucking chore to work with. Nobody likes High Jump, nobody likes Beam, everyone loves shit like Animal and Sword.

I'll give you some enemy designs, but trust me, the gameplay basics aren't great.

A different Banjofag here, ignore that fag. We all know Doomguybros have been on our side from the beginning, fuck Stevies and I’m still hoping you guys get your pick

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> His 64 voice is shit?
Which one do you refer to?

youtube.com/watch?v=UWINseIbbdQ

youtube.com/watch?v=_CQoWJo3Wjc

YA
HO
HO

I love how Sakurai is literally living rent free in your head. There's nothing in his interviews to suggest that Sakurai doesn't have the upmost respect for every franchise represented in smash and you are clearly looking for malice that simply isn't there. You may disagree with how he chooses to represent a character, but there's no evidence to suggest that he would do so with contempt outside of your own autistic head canon to justify your obsession.

The one that doesn't sound extremely forced.

Why do people push to mega revamp movesets? Part of the reason Falcondorf is there is because that character is attached to that playstyle, and it wouldn't be the same thing if Ganondorf was changed to canon, even if Black Shadow was added to fill the Falcondorf role. Especially since Ganondorf is the least cloney he's ever been

Just bringing Ganon up as an example, I've seen plenty propose to completely change how characters play here for some reason. A move or two a game is fine but not a whole entire moveset including specials. When Yoshi was changed to stand up-right, his moves were still functionally the same.

pussy faggot

Yeah but still. Also, how does that make sense with BotW Link?

>Imagine if Samus wore the SR Varia suit in Ultimate and had a ton of cool "silent tough gal" animations and some great taunts
Man, I fucking wish. Just checked and it appears that all of her taunts have been pretty lackluster. I do kinda miss Melee's though.

>YAHOO
>OOMPH
>WAAAOOOOOOOHH

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Because he's fighting for his life. Mario is getting motivated

You forget that BOTW had been in development for years and was delayed multiple times. Notice that the Inklings are based entirely off of 1 and the only Splatoon 2 reference is the little cat.

>Smash Four in general made me dislike Sakurai with every one of his interviews.
Smash 4 is where it all deteriorated, but I think it's gotten even worse since then. His PR speak legitimately disgusts me every time I hear it, knowing how little he's said of the underrepresented franchises within Smash.

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Maybe the next Smash has another director. (?)

Again
Rent Free. There is literally nothing in any Sakurai interview that even remotely shows distate towards any game, and it's almost certainly a figment of your imagination/biased mindset of being mad that a character you like either isn't in the game or isn't portrayed how you want them to be.

They obviously didn’t pick the SR suit because it’s too visually distinct for her normal look. Like it or not, the OM suit is much more palatable.

And before you say ‘but BOTW Link’, he has two other versions both wearing the green tunic, a green tunic alt, and BOTW was an absurd success nearly all the existing install base of the Switch owns.

Sure. I think the best idea would have been to composite the Samus design, sort of like what they did with Ridley. Just take the shoulder ridges from other game suits and put them on the Other M design, make it a bit bulkier, and viola.

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BOTW is a Wii U game, Switch version is just a port

Also, the game was in development years before it came out

...This is wrong though? What about that Returns level ?

Fuck you, Bomberman sucks. It's only gotten worse over time as they try to add in bullshit like platforming too. Its genuinely just not a good game series.

Spoken like a true zoomer

Stop being stupid. Sakurai has not said anything about the way he treats series because he wants a clean track record.
Japanese fans were pestering him on why Kirby only had stages from his games and he completely avoided the question.

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> Salesfagging about skins of all things.
The fuck does sales have to do with alt skins? Fuck off retard.

Being a salesfag is stupid in of itself since there are many flopped characters, but fucking skins? Absolute moron

Anything but. It's a tough pill to swallow but one you'll get eventually. Bomberman is not good and he isn't iconic in any way.

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I often forget that Bomberman has legitimate fans and is an actual series. I was primarily a PC gamer growing up, but we owned an N64 and we got Bomberman 64. The game sucked. Me and my 3 brothers all legitimately found ourselves independently hating it, even when we played multiplayer. I think we ended up selling it to buy some other game.

I am not gonna call the entire series bad like that other user, but I guess my view of him was soured quite a bit by Bomberman 64 and I sort of mostly forgot about him since then.

Call me a zoomer all you like, it won't make bomberman any better or any more relevant.

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>because he wants a clean record

Or maybe you're looking for something rhat isn't there? Are you saying he hates the newer kirby games or something? Because theres nothing to suggest that he does.

He had games last year and two years ago retard, with more to come in the future

tfw her silhouette in the announcement trailer is using her non-Other M varia suit, you can see the football shoulder pads
I was really expecting it to be an alt costume or something, but nope

>The leadup to release filled with futile hoping for a Samus alt
God damn. At least Ridley got in

Funnily enough, both non-echo Metroid characters Ridley and ZSS have alt costumes, while Samus and DSamus have zero.

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>Love Lucas and Ness as characters in their games
>They have the most boring and fucking braindead playstyles besides samus or link
>On top of that they use moves in smash that they can't even use in their own fucking games
>But they made duck hunt, little mac and megaman extremely characteristic of their own games

I just don't get it.

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Can the DK characters talk? Or do they just get translated when people play?

That kid youtuber Ryan has a kart racing game coming out. Want him in Smash too? He is a lot more relevant than Bomberman.

but user, bowser and dk had animal noises in their older years, that's just how they're portrayed in smash. the 90s style.

> Love Lucas and Ness as characters in their games
You didn't even care about their games before Smash, fuck off fake fan

> Retards shitting on Bomberman for no reason and not knowing what he did
Zoomers like you deserve death

> One of the games that revolutionized multiplayer in gaming, as it allowed up to 4-8 players before it became a staple, hell some games could even have 10 players
> Hi-ten Bomberman was the first HD game ever made
> First third-party to crossover with a Nintendo property
Learn your game history you dumbass retarded mutt

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Hey, fuck off. All I said is that I didn't like Bomberman 64 and didn't shit on the character or the series.

If Joker wasn't rushed, the only explanation I could give is that Sakurai has such a Persona boner that he wants to make his own Persona fighting game, and he just gave Joker the move set he had in mind for that game, where other characters would pick up the rest of the representation. Joker's move set works if he's only representing the themes of Persona 5, not so much if he's trying to represent the whole series.

Literally none of that has anything to do with Bomberman being a good game.

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...Joker IS only representing Persona 5

>Samus
>He can't into B-reverse Charge Shot and morph ball bomb movement
Oh well

If you look at the dog when you land back air or neutral air, he actually looks extremely fucking mad. Duck looks mad as fuck when you land tilt attacks. Same goes for grabs.
Gotta love the shit eating grin whenever you launch a can though. It's perfect. Especially when it zooms in on a final stock kill.

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I think the intention is to make him look serious and focused, not necessarily "pissed". I honestly don't have a problem with it and I think its in his character.

My biggest nintendo character "voice" gripe is post n64 donkey kong. I despise his new voice, his DK64 voice was fucking god tier and I even prefer his weird animal noises from melee and OG smash over this current voice.

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Late but
>DUDE BLACK SHADOW COULD BE GANONDORF'S REPLACEMENT
>Black Shadow's machine is one of the fastest in the game
Provide a character that isn't Black Shadow or fucking Blood Falcon or something retarded like that.

Why would a not good series influence gaming so much then? Sell millions? Make crossovers? Have a ton of promotion and Worldwide merchandise and food products?

I know you are a retarded troll, but at LEAST bait better moron.

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Even then, he doesn't even represent his game's gameplay, only the themes. That'd be fine if we already had some wild card user, but here it's just so weak.

It sure does

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>implying anyone does that online instead of just sitting there, spamming [rojectiles, spamming forward air, then waiting by the ledge for back-throws
Which projectile based character am I describing? Fucking pick one, that's all the online boils down to anyways.
user, playing Ness in melee is what got me interested enough to play Earthbound, then mother 3.

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You mean Scooby Kong

I feel like if Rex did get in his moveset would be some ungodly mix of Mii Swordfighter and Joker. Joker himself was somehow just Sheik with a limit break.

>primarily sword moves
>tether move as recovery
>Side special projectile
>Pyra/Mythra barely factors into it except for some kind of Blade Special mechanic (max out meter, next special attack is handled by them with full super armor)

Not that I wanted him in, it's just funny thinking how fucking lame Sakurai's movesets for his most wanted characters are sometimes.

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unfortunately, pac man is never gonna get good alts, namco is autistic in keeping him yellow

Wario in general. I fucking hate WarioWare. Shallow Newgrounds tier minigame shit with everyone making a bigger deal over "t3h kawaii lawli :3c"
I hate his gay biker outfit. It looks fucking retarded. I hate the fucking gay J-Pop garbage music taking up 90% of the tracklist on his two Pac-Land MSPaint tier stages.

In a parallel universe, Sakurai gets kicked off of working for Smash Bros and then proceeds to hang himself.
Who works on the series now?

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Does it matter? Everyone will still cry "soulless" and whine about their favorite literal who not getting in.

Iwata's ghost forces him out of the afterlife, and Sakurai possesses the next idiot dumb enough to try make a Smash game.

They basically took the personality Samus had and just gave it to ZZS. I’d just make ZSS a victory screen desu. Still in the game so you get the porn but not actually a damn slot

Fret not. Once Sakurai steps down as director, we'll get a shittier man with shittier bias to run Smash :)

>no Mother 1, the best in the series
>Melee and not 64
You smell as badly as your taste does

Only defense I can add to this is New Kirby is represented with 2 final smashes. Masked Dedede and Ultra Sword.

>we will NEVER hear bowser say "showtime" in smash
youtube.com/watch?v=RIjfkmkPxt4
Fuck you hackurai

>a complete double standard
Care to explain why?

why does dk look worse in this game than jungle beat and sound less expressive
he’s got gross clay looking fur and a voice that doesn’t tell me much

>MUH
>SLOTS
ACfag begone

How would sakurai mess up your most wanted realistically (like if banjo had bear noises)

>porky has no mech abilities
>realistic steve

mario is cheery when fighting a realistic dragon and a giant fucking turtle its not that weird

Fuck that, why won't we get Toad affected by the blorbs hahaha that would be funny :)

I hope if steves in he doesnt end up with a dq like flat floating platform stage

>Elma most of my other most wanteds got in, relatively unscathed too
only gun attack is a clone of Bayonetta's neutral B
Ghost Factory is just a Down B counter
mostly uses dual sword attacks
personality is revamped from 'pragmatic but skilled fighter' to 'literally can't contain her murderboner'
no true form outfit

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Mewtwo isn’t really evil he just wanted to not be fucked with

>mewtwo
>evil

Defend this

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Roy’s dad canonically bangs a manakete if that means anything

How about you and your "joke" fuck off? Now that would be pretty funny

>Gorilla
>Monkey

Replace pk flash with rockin and make his final smash pk flash(luigis brawl fs basically) because pk flash is actually nesses move and acts like luigis brawl final smash

>I don't think he wanted Mega Man, but felt obligated to do so under his terms
What is this autism? Mega Man is probably the 2nd best represented 3rd party in Smash after Castlevania. He got an absolute shit ton of new remixes, 2 new Assist Trophies, the most spirits out of any 3rd party, a super fan servicey final smash, in Smash 4 Mega Man had the most mii costumes, do you not like that they essentialy HD'd an NES sprite or something? That has nothing to do with Sakurai not wanting Mega Man and more to do with you not liking the direction they went with the character.

Steve fag here
I wanted banjo and steve
Hating characters is lame yo

I think ZSS is fun, she shouldn't be the only Samus in the game that has a shred of personality to her. It's almost like Smash wants them to actually feel like seperate characters when they're supposed to be the same person

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Where would Banjo and Kazooie be in this list? Bear? Is Kazooie will be ignored in this list?
>Hedgehogs and Phazon things together
No space?

Banjo would work like duck hunt so bear
Also sonic is a phazon being and dark samus is a hedgehog both seem similar to eachother so they need the same category

>then waiting by the ledge for back-throws
More like
>waiting by the ledge to spam forward air

>MegaMan got 17 new remixes
>Castlevania got 13 new remixes
>each have one stage each and tons of old tracks besides, so a whole bunch of the new tracks will never be heard unless you play those two tracks obsessively

>meanwhile some franchises have 2-3 stages and got no remixes whatsoever
I don't dislike either franchise, I just wish they spread the love out more. One new remix per franchise minimum would've been nice.

>Not posting this edit

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wtf are you on, we never backstabbed Geno or Isaac, grinchbros stick together, bitch

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LETS DO IT

god ultimate is so washed out

Kirby, like Mario, Yoshi, Samus, and DK, is a product of being from the first game, where resources were more limited and the movesets more conventional to fighting games. If in the sequel they give some characters a serious rework you can expect them to use a little more of their game material and become a little more complex.
>Mario can glide/ground pound after using his Cape in the air
>Yoshi gains egg missiles by swallowing opponents that are more powerful than his conventional eggs
>DK throws barrels
>Samus can either switch beams or shift between morph ball and regular mode, with morph ball being its own separate, possibly limited moveset

That image is funny though cause samus ftilt in 4 was legit one of the best in the game due to its great range. Too bad it had bad hurtbox shifting issues

MEMWEBLEUGH

>Not to the extent that Sakurai does it.
Are you kidding? If anything, the Mario spinoffs get way harsher on Luigi for being a goofy wimp. Thousand Year Door, Dream Team and Luigi's Mansion are all about how he's always scared and clumsy and put upon, and Mario Galaxy's Luigi sidequest was finding him cowering in different levels.

>Sakurai didn't put Chrom in Smash 4 because he was having trouble making a sword fighter different from Marth and Ike and outright highlights Chrom just being an Ike clone
>puts him in Smash Ultimate and takes pains to at least make him the most individualized echo after Ken, giving him a unique special

I wish he had his more aggressive voice linesI do love SORRY though and his Great Lord or Exalted Knight armors as a skin option.
Also that he had more than just Awakening Aether for his Final Smash and cutscene Aether for his up special. They could've replaced the Counter that everyone has with Aegis, an anti-projectile skill he does have in his own game that could translate into a projectile reflect, or replace his Flare Blade with something like the spear toss he uses in his other crossover appearances.
I wish he also had his Crit/Luna lunge too, but giving him that kind of horizontal movement ability would probably make him too powerful.

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Would like a boost meter gimmick for side special that he does tricks to fill it up probably by taunting in the air after attacks.

Return to Dreamland sucked it had the worst level design of any Kirby game until vanilla Star Allies

Melee is just an HD n64 game

They took Gliding out of 4 for a good reason

I wish they changed Robin's Final Smash and victory animations, god Chrom was so low effort it hurts. Give Robin some kind of Grima-fueled outburst like his Codename Steam Special
youtu.be/NKEFw-uJ_ds?t=371

WHY CANT WE JUST GET A BLUE GHOST ALT

>out of all the unplayable characters, Isaac was treated the best as a revamped Assist AND a costume
damn

Am I the only one who doesn't like game and watch changing forms. It makes him feel like less of the character we've come to know and more of just a collection.

Why? I'd rather not trade in representation from all of marios game for odyssey shit. Also i have no clue why fluid is his down b instead of his up b. It's literally used to hover

What if he could swap between Pyra and Mythra, give it a unique toggle like Inkling's reload
>Mythra has higher attack speed for better comboing, and changes his specials to be more vertical oriented(with the usual weakness of being useless if there's something like a platform above where Rex is aiming a light arrow or whatever)
>Pyra is slower and better at launching and doing raw damage per hit, and has more mobile attack options for better in-fighting approaches like Burning Sword or horizontal flaming projectiles like Prominence Revolt

Obviously Pyra's sword would also have fire properties while Mythra's wouldn't, for the sake of the handful of things that fire can meaningfully affect like Red Pikmin.

You could even incorporate something like the ability "cooldowns" where they become more effective if Rex lands a bunch of normal attacks first, and also get a little boost if he uses them right as he lands a normal strike.

>Yahooooo
>yahoo
>yaho
>yah
>ya-ya-ya-y-y-y-y-y-y--y

I like minecart stages. They have great music, they're reasonably reoccuring and you could do a lot with them

>stage is like big blue but not curved
>rocket barrels provide fallthrough platforms
>Every now and again the carts do a massive jump and land in a different order, changing the stage layout
>enemy kremlings can come from either side to harm fighters or moles can try to blow up the tracks

>music includes
DKC
Minecart Mayhem youtube.com/watch?v=u2y12kv-n-o
Life in the Mines youtube.com/watch?v=2gKSRg47E4A
DKC2
Mining Melancholy youtube.com/watch?v=4Qp0_NE8M1c
Disco Train youtube.com/watch?v=yUGU_Zlf9tU
Haunted Hall youtube.com/watch?v=ECXfyAN0JQU
DK64
Jungle Japes (Mine Cart) youtube.com/watch?v=IMDyIubszlE
Tropical Freeze
Sawmill Thrill youtube.com/watch?v=ZcnMB0vLhzI
Trunk Twister youtube.com/watch?v=_ZAbPnqiiRg

Anything to get a DK stage that isn't more of the same

>Link: Return him to how we was in Brawl/Smash 4.
Don't you stick me with that shitty Gale Boomerang again that thing has always sucked

Me, and I'm putting Goku in.

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pls add veheta as an echo

nope fuck you, enjoy your rehashed final smash ;)

I actually prefer the Smash voices for the DK cast than their voices from new DK games. They don't make them feel out of character, unlike Bowser.

Also I agree that Ganondorf could use a revamp but you have to be careful and subtle about how you carry it. Many of his current moves can be kept or altered only minimally. A brawler warlock is a cool concept and it would be a shame to do away completely with it.

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you know the filters in the camera mode, i wish you could just have them while playing matches, the Vivid filter literally makes everything look better

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>Also i have no clue why fluid is his down b instead of his up b. It's literally used to hover
or better yet, rocket nozzle.

>>Yoshi's current final smash takes from Melee's intro of all fucking things
Someone didn't do further research. Yes, it's based on the Melee intro, but it's also based on the baby Yoshi's last attack in Paper Mario 2.

My man have you heard smash diddy, the most obnoxious fucking stock clips they could have chosen
unironically have to mute the game when I meet him online

And Diddy sounds like a grating, flaming homosexual. In Diddy Kong Racing and Donkey Kong Racing, he just sounds like a cartoon monkey.

also does Joker ever use a grappling hook in P5 or was it just shoehorned into smash to create a viable moveset? I don't remember him ever using one

Yoshi's representation is probably more than enough, but probably not quire FE-Tier. Yoshi usually gets a new stage each game, which I think is more than fine enough for him, considering the Yoshi series probably has much less identity than the other Mario spinoffs do.

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Another thing I don't like is that they threw away all the custom moves(except Explosive Flame) in the transition to Ultimate. I am not suggesting to keep it as a mechanic but some of these moves could have been carried over to the standard movesets of clone characters in order to differentiate them more. For example Toon Link could have used his sliding Spin Attack custom, Ganondorf could have used the Warlock Blade, Dark Fists and Wizard Dropkick, Chrom could have borrowed the diagonal Aether Ike had, and so on.

It's weird, he actually has been shown using it a lot in the special edition re-release of P5 that's not out yet.

though if Yoshi needs another rep...

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Bomberman's great but Konami already had Castlevania and MGS as representatives, and fact of the matter is that "mascot" characters like Bomberman, Rayman, Crash, etc. are all very visually similar in a lot of ways. They're all almost the same body type and would be mainly brawlers and based around their platforming games. I'm glad we got Banjo and I'd rather have these cartoony mascot types than more damnable anime swordsman, but I understand the lack of preference.

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I can't stress enough how disappointing Poochy would be. The Yoshi series is 100% fine as it is, fighter-wise when the only options are Poochy, Baby Mario, and Kamek.

>angel island is still the only remix

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Oh yeah Mario Kart 64 came before smash (December 96), but before that Bomberman had cornered the market on group multiplayer

Because he's in a fight, dumbass.

Imagine how intense it would be to play to this music.
>parry into true combo right as the guitar starts playing
youtu.be/lGaIq94zR6o

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>Shadow DLC with remixes of Supporting Me, All Hail Shadow, I Am, Never Turn Back, and Radical Highway.

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because its a fighting party game user. Remember strikers? that shit went beyond, but this is a fine medium.

soo like villager?

>fully expected Robin to throw out Ruin on final smash
I was so dissapointed

oh and for true story

no one could be this stupid and not realize aside from giga bowser, all that shit was already something that has been done.

>brawl lucas was all about tricky movement and crossups with aerials
>brawl lucas also had jank that made him even more fun like zip jumps, magnet bouncing, and a jab lock setup
>tr4sh lucas removed the jank, took out old combos but introduced new and better combos
>tr4sh lucas had a new jablock setup and a better bair and dair
>ult lucas has all his old combos gone, moves don't combo reliably; has to rely on stray hits linking into stray hits
>justify gutting his kit by kicking up the knockback on all psi attacks and specials

At least dsmash doesn't deactivate when the first hit is blocked which is cool I guess, but my boy feels so boring in this game.

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youtube.com/watch?v=-oFdEgvoo94
>I'm Diddy
>I'm Banjo
I'm still bothered by how Diddy and Banjo can actually talk in this, but they're fitting.

>Ganondorf not an asshole
>K. Rool not evil
>Wolf in the same tier as those faggots
This image is terrible. Just be honest you're one of those fedora tippers who wants to imagine all villains as secretly good guys.

Most of Pac's music in Smash are from other Namco games you chode.

Going by series

>Donkey Kong
Shitty stage selection, no Dixie echo, but mostly okay now K. Rool is in
>Zelda
BotW Twink Link is gay. Ganondorf should really have a projectile special and hover in the least. Sheik should never have been fucking added. We should've gotten Ghirahim in 4, it's awkward that Skyward Sword is the one game not to have a character in some form. Ironically I have no complaints about the stages, music or whatever, that's fine.
>Punch-Out!!
No ATs, very bland stage, Mac is a little OOC
>Wario
WarioWare is for faggots. Really gay the biker costume and farting is what we got. No Land stages (even that mod for Shake King would've been cool). Very shitty Land music. This might be the worst represented series period and Nintendo clearly gives no shits about Land or Wario period.
>Mario
No Bowser castle, some really awful generic stages
>Kirby
No post-Sakurai shit, obvious bias
>Pac-Man
No fucking Maze stage? Pac-Land is shit.

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For fucks sake just let his Dair link like it would in brawl. It would actually be amazing now that SDI isn’t nearly as overtuned as it was in brawl.

They're fighting each other to the death, of course they are going to be pretty stern. Do we really have to explain to you how temperament changes depending on the situations one finds themselves in? Are you really that underdeveloped and immature?

I kind of wish they gone with the Yoshi stages that are based on different aesthetics like Yoshi's Island underground levels.
And Shyguy. Yeah, I know he originated from the main Mario series, but he seems to be more in-line with Yoshi, especially since most variants originated from there.

For Poochy, I guess I can understand that besides he might basically be Duck Hunt Dog, it's hard to think of what kind of moveset potential he has. However, if Sakurai can think of some movesets for WFT, DH, etc., I don't think it's that impossible for Poochy. However, I wouldn't say Yoshi desperately needed a second rep. Poochy could at least be an assist trophy.

>Baby Mario
God no. If anything, give me stork if we're going to shove babies in this.

Well Roy's a half dragon.

Young Link’s Final Smash really deserved to be Fierce Deity. If the costume was really a big deal, then they could have removed it. It looks notably worse in Ultimate than in 4 anyways.

>it's just a reused remix from mario and sonic

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user you understand that if assists were accurate to their Canon powerlevel rodin would break the game right.

My biggest complaint about Joker was
>P5 has a ton of interesting locations
>Any of the palaces, especially Sae's as it's iconic, could have even gone for something wacky like fighting in the middle of the street or Shujin Academy
>They choose fucking Mementos
>They don't even do something cool like fighting on the Morgana bus as he goes through the tunnels with shadows as stage hazards
>Instead they give the stage a generic layout with a ripped texture from the game as a background and call it a day

>Over 30 years of reference material
>Still a Captain Falcon clone
>Finally gets a 'new' move
>It's the sword from a fucking E3 tech demo

I'm still convinced Sakurai's only experience seeing Ganondorf is the tech demo. It explains why a character that's traditionally use a ton of magic across all of his appearances is suddenly a fist fighter.

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In 8 he actually sounds his age, though. 11 he sounds way too fucking old.

Samus moveset is so boring and uninspired, fucking Mii Gunner plays more like she should.

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It's more like Ganondorf wouldn't have gotten in Melee if he wasn't a Falcon clone, and now that he originated as a Falcon clone he stays that way for consistency with the playstyle while slowly making him more unique as a heavy hitting slow moving Falcon.