What is the best metroidvania game Yea Forums?

Axiom Verge, fo sho.

Hollow Knight
Rain World
Super Metroid
Metroid Prime
Hyper Light Drifter

Those are my top five. Been tempted to get Environmental Station Alpha, could never really get into Axiom Verge for the price it costed, and I'm still iffy on if La Mulana is really as good as people say it is

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Ori and the blind forest, Rabi-Ribi

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I liked Metroid Fusion

Checked

castlevania harmony of dissonance
metroid fusion
hollow knight

my top 3 don't hate

no but turrican is good

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I can't get past the fucking crab

Gotta keep climbin. God, I loved that fucking crab

1. Super Metroid
2. Metroid Fusion
3. SOTN
4. Zero Mission
5. Aria of Sorrow

None of your bad games are actually bad.

>every metroidvania should be like super metroid

thats a Psycho-Nics Oscaroid

which Metroid 2 remake, idiot

Playing Environmental Station Alpha makes me realize how much I miss having fun weapon powerups.

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Environmental Station Alpha
Treasure Adventure Game/World
Salt & Sanctuary

Fusion from nostalgia of being my first Metroidvania, but that's because I hated the original Metroid and avoided the Metroid franchise up until I bought Fusion alongside Prime from hype.

Portrait of Ruin is a close 2nd for me.

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>t. absolute shit taste

Could Fusion have worked if it was more open-ended than mostly linear?

Dust: An Elysian Tale

what about hyper light drifter make a metroidvania exactly?

I hate this shitty "metroidvania" name. Either create a new one, like "Map Exploration Adventure" or just use "metroid like". Just because Castlevania plagiarized Metroid shouldn't give it the right to be half of the genre

rain world seems so good but I fucking hate that game

AM2R is good, nigger.

It's fucking stupid to call them Metroidvania games as Metroid originally had this game style and Castlevania was much more linear and nothing like Metroid. This is some fucking newspeak garbage. They should be called Metroidlike games.

Fuck off Kotaku

I don't think that's what they were taking issue with user

the name existed for nearly 2 decades, if you can't accept it by now then literally kys.

stop same fagging so obviously and stop being a filthy zoomer.

Metroidvania isn't a bad name because Castelvania stole from Metroid, it's a bad name because SotN is overhyped garbage.
RPG elements don't belong in Metroid

based and namepilled SOTN was 97 super metroid was 94 no reason why its castlevania since it didn't make the mechanics that make up the genre

he clearly says AM2R as good and the remake as bad
only stuck on him since i am going for the no hit medels

>Metroidvania
Aria of Sorrow for the GBA. Circle of the Moon would have won out if so much of the game wasn't dependent on levelling. The power difference in XP is ridiculous.
Didn't play any of the DS ones, mind. The original SOTN is a sloppy bukkake mess of a design.

>Metroid-clone
Super Metroid is still the be-all end-all. Prime loses too many movement abilities, even if I like the amount of flavour text. Otherwise, probably Hollow Knight. Loses that arcade focus that regular 2D Metroid has, but the emphasis on slower pacing pays off for me.

Does Kirby and the Amazing Mirror count?

Unironically this.

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I personally prefer Valdis Story for the combat system alone.

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it would be good if it had native dpad support for my dualshock 4 but it doesn't so I didn't play that piece of garbage

Portrait of Ruin. Aria of Sorrow is also really good

what a dumb nigger just use x360ce if you want to use something other than a xinput device i play most things with a ps2 controller

Holy shit that game was bad

Any news on ghost song?

Its fucking frustrating as shit but once you get past the steep difficulty curve my god is it satisfying.
Safe to say it's much harder than Hollow Knight in that regard in that one fuck up will end you and make you feel either like a retard or pissed at the fact that something was waiting for you at the end of a tube.
Definitely worth a try, though.

>too many bosses
holy fuck you MUST be baiting

Fusion works fine, it might have been better if it was more open though.

I'm still hoping for a sequel with random SA-X like encounters.

>any news on ghost song
Yeah.
It's still a never ever
Fuck I wanna get it, the music is too good. youtube.com/watch?v=CHCybVe2p9I

yah

I've tried it. It's very interesting but it's extremely difficult. I was filtered very early on. I understand why it's so difficult. I played on PC for a bit, maybe I'll give it another go if the Switch version goes on sale.

I’m not downloading more bullshit to play a shitty looking fan game I hardly care about when I can play other games I actually do care about that actually respect the end user enough to support their controller from the start.

It supports XInput, if you're using a DS4 then how do you not have a wrapper for it like DS4Windows already?

>shitty looking fan game
grapes something something foxes

Fuck it, I can't decide so I'll just list the ones I've enjoyed enough to replay multiple times.

Super Metroid, Zero Mission, SotN+the entire line of GBA and DS vanias, AM2R, Kirb and the Amazing Mirror, MegaMan ZX, Rabi-Ribi, Luna Nights, Bloodstained and Kurovadis.

Because the ds4 revision has PC drivers so many games and programs just support it straight up. Asmr2 supports it too but only analog control which is retarded. If the creator was dumb enough to expect people to play a 2d metroid game with an analog stick, I imagine the quality of his game is low

>Kurovadis
>Look it up because I've never heard of it.
>This is the first thing that shows up on google.

youtube.com/watch?v=WuTJcdcBC10

Wtf is this actually a good game or is it some weeb sex game?

2d games are best played on keyboard anyway

Super Metroid if it wasnt so super metroid.

I really liked how ZM felt becuase it was smooth and bite sized but super trumps it in everything but ease of access. I think ZM is the intro to the genre because its easy enough but also rewards sequence breaking quite well still.

HK is good but a bit to slow for me so I cant play it as consistently.
I enjoy classic-vania more than sotn but I hear really good things about some of the handheld ones.

>1 man team bruteforcing his way after a successful kickstarter... 5 years ago
I don't know if I should sympathise or not, the game is shaping up nicely

Play the most avant-garde Metroidvania out there.

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I didn't really play Super Metroid until I'd spent years playing Fusion and Zero Mission which both just feel significantly better to me control-wise. I just can't get into it.

If there's one thing i'll ALWAYS miss, is the run button. It just doesn't feel right without it.

If you emulated it with a keyboard, I had the same problem. With a gamepad it's fine.

Super has a learning curve thats pretty steep.
It has far more fluid movement and control of momentum which is why its so good along with having one of the better map designs.

ZM and Fusion are far easier to pick up and kick as because it all is extremely responsive and snappy but lacks any real heft like SM that makes you feel like a big ol suit of armor.
THe run button in SM alone makes it better imho and I had the same opinion as you for a decade at least.

What are some good metroid-like games on PC?
I don't want to emulate.
I played
>momodora
>ori
>rabi-ribi
>touhou luna
>rain world
>bloodstained
>hollow knight

Which is?

Mummy Demastered has a straight PC port, and it's fine. It's okay. Nice sprites.

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Run button, Samus's sound design(the 'omph' spund the suit makes), and the Speed Booster actually going pretty fuckin fast. Pair that with some items and techniques, both intended and unintended.
Super Metroid is a pretty rare lightning strike of game design.

Are you me?

How is Shantae? I heard it's too linear to be considered metroidvania?

Are there any that capture the feeling of isolation as well as Metroid? Or just games in general with that feeling? I've struggled to find something that makes me feel similar.

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Axiom Verge is probably the closest.

Add it to your list,

Shantae is just slow, boring, shallow and plays itself. It's designed for 8 year olds, man.
Mummy Demastered has issues (bosses are sponges, no full heals ingame) but none arise from being aimed at toddlers. I suspect it's from the Aliens Extermination team.

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Is guacamelee one?
It looks neat so I might try it

Hollow Knight only has seven mandatory boss fights (False Knight, Hornet, Broken Vessel, Watcher Knights, Dung Defender, Uumuu and The Hollow Knight).
Three of these (False Knight, Broken Vessel and Dung Defender) can be skipped if you know a couple of tricks.

Under what fucking chain of logic are you bound where you consider seven boss fights to be "too many" in a Metroidvania game?

Aria of Sorrow and Rabi-Ribi are the best ones. Simple as.

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It's ok, worth of one playthrough at least.

Hollow knight is the only good metroidgavnia game.

there are like 4 Shantae games and they all suffer from that?

There are Rabi-Ribintellectuals, and then there are fucking retards.

>"B-B-BUT DUH ANIME GRAFFIX..."

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>What are the best metroidvania games?
>"uhhhh metroid and vania hehe xd"
Thats like saying Dark souls is the best soulslike.

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>whats the best kart racer
>mario kart
BUT THATS CHEATING hehehe

Shantae is ass. It's just extremely simple and lacking in ANY sort of depth.

Phroah Rebirth, which is also free.

info.nicovideo.jp/gamemaga/pharaoh/

Best gta clone must be gta 5 then

The GB game is pretty decent. Pirate's Curse is really simple, but really well rounded as well.

a very unconventional metroidvania, that you've probably never classified as such because it isn't a side-scroller, is Gauntlet 4 quest mode
explore top-down, kill things, open pathways, collect incremental powerups and items that give you access to new areas
same stuff, different game style

No thats SA

Rain World

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La Mulana and La Mulana 2 are the most interesting, while Portrait of Ruin Lv. 1 Hard Mode is the hardest.

But if your answer is anything other than Super Metroid or SOTN then you're just wrong. Or terminally contrarian.

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see

What, you want my personal experience?

I played Shantae 1 through an Xbox emulator (I don't know), Finished Risky's Revenge and got through most of Pirate's Curse before calling it quits out of boredom. Didn't bother with Half Genie Hero but people said it was a step down from Risky's Revenge.

Yeah, I'd say they all suffer from that. There's just nothing to them. I swear their levels are built with Mega Bloks. They're the Remember Me to Super Metroid's Devil May Cry.

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well the best castlemania of course

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Neither game invented the genre, stupid. It has that name because those two games are the best.

This looks better than bloodstained tbqh. Has soul.

took a look at it since I was reminded, yeah, this mother fucker is still going, and honestly the stuff he's been showing off has me interested.
Hope it goes well for the guy, hoping it doesn't turn into a Bannerlord situation with him anyways

I enjoyed lunar legends
But Metroid fusion because of the damned sa-x and me being little gave me reccuring nightmares where she pops out of nowhere(complete with bgm) and kills me

But Metroidvania games exist mainly to describe the two titular series. Whereas GTA clone, Doom clone or Soulslike implicitly means copies.

What was it called before those games?

Probably just Adventure or Platformer

I'm still scraping my way through La Mulana without a guide and it's killing me inside.

Action adventure. Kind of like how there was a "sidescroller" genre until everyone started doing it.

based

>Mummy Demastered
Can I play it if I haven't seen the movie?

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>ctrl+F "cave"
>no result

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Motherfucking Demons Crest.
>levels you can backtrack through with multiple paths leading to other areas
>cool new powers and upgrades to acquire so you can both stomp previous areas and also find all new pathways
>opportunities for light sequence breaking with clever ability use and other tricks
>shops and minigames to waste time in when you arent killing everything in you way
>multiple endings depending on completion, one of which is only 20 minutes in and the bad ending so to speak
>your reward for beating the game with full completion is A FUCKING SECRET BOSS THAT RAPES YOUR SHIT FORCING YOU TO BUY EVERYTHING YOU CAN MUSTER AND USE EVERY ABILITY POSSIBLE JUST TO HAVE A FUCKING SLIVER OF A CHANCE AT IT

It's worth it though. There will never be another experience like La Mulana. Except the sequel which is literally just a direct continuation.

Every third hallway ends in an optional boss fight or gauntlet. The game focuses way too much on combat for such simple mechanics.

You shouldn't ever watch the movie.
The game is completely unrelated. No characters apart from the movie's villain appear.

>adventure action

It's ACTION ADVENTURE

Demon's crest is kind of soulless and bad, but Gargoyle's quest on the GB was a masterpiece.

/thread

They are both great fuck you.
You are why well never get either ever again.

>harmony of dissonence
Why? It's better than CotM but I don't understand how you like that game over the other DS and GBA Castlevania's. Not hating, a legit question.

Zelda 2

Nah

Assuming I'm not allowed to use any Metroid or Castlevania games then I'd have to say "A Robot named Fight" is my top. It's a metroidvania/rougelike and goddamn is it good, I had to 100% that shit.

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I've played indie games that are better than demon's crest so that's not a big loss. Castilla sure as hell doesn't replace Ghouls 'n Ghosts though.

Of course it has soul.
Soma has all the souls!

Same it's amazing.
Fuck you.

?

Her trot is surprisingly smooth...

Why do people like ESA? Your singular main attack is so boring.

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I used a guide once and I regret it, even knowing that it would have taken me who knows how many hours to figure out for myself

There's nothing wrong with simple combat mechanics. There's a large variety of enemies, and you've got a simple and consistent toolset to deal with them. You've got a four-way attack, a dash, and you can pogo off enemies (you can even spend some fights entirely airborne). There's optional attacks and spells you can unlock too.

And you're exaggerating about the frequency of mandatory combat encounters.

Personally I think there are too many long, empty corridors between them. The map system is absolutely retarded too, and unlike la mulana all the rooms look the goddamn same.

you posted it

1. Super Metroid
2. Symphony of the night
3. The GBA Castlevanias
4. Unironically Bloodstained
5. Hollow Knight
6. Zero Mission
7. Metroid Fusion

It's nothing special, get over it.
HK is way too long for what it brings to the table.

The grapple beam dude, the grapple beam is absolutely glorious and changes everything.

All you niggers have horrible taste.

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play more games user. Hyper light drifter is more of a zelda than a metroid.

Try Aquaria, Teslagrad, Kirby and the amazing mirror, Salt and sanctuary, valdis Story, and motherfucking la mulana

>Hollow Knight
Imagine if your first game was this trash instead of the hundred of great metroidvania out there like La-Mulana, Rabi-ribi, Environmental Station Alpha and so on

Fight me

>metroid fusion
Patrician taste

In no particular order:

Super Metroid
La-Mulana
Hollow Knight
ESA
Rabi-Ribi
Valdis Story
Bloodstained (Aria/Dawn of Sorrow replaced)
Zelda 2

It could have, to a degree.

The devs decided that Fusion would have 0 sequence breaking, and did everything they could to prevent it. The game even uses an event++ system. It's linear because it has a story and strict sequence of events.

There COULD have been a few nonlinear sections though. The post-Gravity Suit section of the game is important in that it's the point where you first go off the rails and start doing things you're not supposed to, and the freedom is the payoff that the whole game has been leading up to. IMO it would have been amazing, and truer to the spirit of Metroid, if they allowed for some sequence breaks after this point.

I guess you could say that the secret message is that sequence break. Maybe the devs considered or were at least aware of it. Shows that they knew what they were doing, and it's great game design.

What Fusion really needed was an Etrian Odyssey style classic mode. Inside that mode all the story would be removed and you'd have access to classic sequence breaking tools like IBJs and single wall jumps.

Based.

I loved how fast the Speed Booster was in Super. What's the oomph sound though? Not sure what you mean.

>What's the oomph sound though
Pay attention to the sound of Samus's footsteps. Paired with the Speed Booster, it's pure sex.

I only like the metroid part, not the vania part.

Bloodstained or Portrait of Ruin are objectively the best because every other fucking game these retards are listing here aren't even metroidvanias.

SM > AM2R > MF > MZM > MSR > M2 > M1

SOTN > AOS > DOS > POR > HOD > COTM > OOE

Lurk moar.

Rain World is a great game but fuck me does it have some pure bullshit

>come out of pipe in lefthand corner of screen
>start climbing pole
>offscreen invisible Lizard snaps me

Hard to say. The crappy unengaging level design for them tends to really pull me out of the game, even if I like it. Long empty halls with 2 or 3 big enemies you can just jump over and fuck off is not exactly fun. If I had to say, maybe Mega Man ZX/A or the GBA Metroids since they actually have something resembling level and map design.

No fuck off. Metroid games are Metroid games.

Castlevania games that aren't Classicvanias are Metroidvanias.
Everything else is a Metroid-like. The smallest off shoot of games trying to cope Metroidvanias are Igalikes.

Guacamelee 1 and 2 are fun af.

It's fun

Agreed, while Rain World was my best game of 2017, the screen transitions are absolutely unfair, and not in the game's ''nature is unfair'' way, they're just bad. Like getting grabbed by offscreen enemies like you said, you unknown death chasms. But from what I've seen from dev footage, it's an engine problem, so we are stuck with it. 9/10 game, would be 10/10.

I'll leave this webm here, to showcase the extremely well polished AI.

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6 games, 0 bad game.

I felt that way about some of the optional areas in Axiom Verge. There's plenty of places where you walk in and have to move immediately or you will get hit. If you leave to reset the room, it doesn't reset the enemy positions, just their health, meaning that if you don't already know it's coming, you take the toll. Especially frustrating on hard difficulty.

My favorites are
>Sotn
I think it's a big complete game, weapons feel different enough, movement options are great.
>Zero mission
Fun little romp
>Super
Epic SNES game
>Aria of sorrow
Super awesome game full of fun and variety
Next I'd place fusion AM2R. Great Metroid games. Especially fusion, pretty interesting environments and bosses. Am2r's flaw being it's too repetitive, fusions being it's too linear.

Dawn of sorrow was only ok. Kind of dull setting and characters.

Nintendo's recent Metroid 2 remake was sort of bad. Only metroidvania I've dropped so far. Excited to try order of ecclessia and hollow Knight tho

You are retarded. The main aspect of Metroid AND gba/ds Castlevanias (and Sotn) is 2d exploration based on ability progression. It's called Metroidvania because those two franchises were the main exponent of this playstyle. Rpg elements have nothing to do with it, goth atmosphere has nothing to do with it. You stupid brainlet zoomer

You're right

No you dumb tard. They're called Metroidvanias because SotN was such a departure from the other Castlevania games that people had to figure out how to separate it from the other shit in the franchise.

Metroidvanias only apply to all the shit Iga made. "vania" is something all these modern metroidvanias heavily lack.

I agree, momodora, on example, is more similar to metroid than to castlevania.
It doesnt have shit loads of abilities and items.

>Momodora
On a side note, I enjoyed it a lot more than expected, it's small but polished.

It's called that because SOTN departed from the arcade style that Caatlevania did, in favor of the Metroid exploration we know. But SOTN has rpg stats and a shitton of equipment and farming, sadly, which is why there's people who prefer the Metroid part more.
IGAvanias are more "Metroid'', with the exception of Order of Ecclesia, which is 3/4 oldschool Castlevania.

At what point does a game stop being a metroidvania and start becoming an open world game?

metroidvanias are a maze

Rain World is a 2D open world game.
Hollow Knight basically opening up 90% of the map after walljump MIGHT edge it to that spectrum.
Super Metroid and Rabi-Ribi's movement tech also pretty much opens the map to the point that they probably are in that spectrum too.

The fact that it's limited to movement tech that most people won't do makes it distinct IMO.
I think that the best kind of metroidvania is the one that has a clearly defined route that anyone can beat, but has a bunch of hidden tech for skilled players to do whatever sequence they like.

Said no one ever

Personal favourite is Hollow Knight

>Lyle

It's too bad they had to remove this track

youtube.com/watch?v=jSTwI4z1jz8

Tried it, horrible garbage

Problem with Momodora is that Metroidvania needs a lot of content, that's the whole point of genre.
But yeah good game

The best metroidvanias/metroid-likes always have female protags. Or if they're not females, they're genderless robots.

Prove me wrong.

Alien Isolation

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you already posted it, on both accounts

Hell yeah, Aria of Sorrow

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Ori and the Blind Forest
Cuphead
Iconoclasts
Guacamelee
Circle of the Moon

>nobody ports metroid or good castlevania games on steam
I know there is a castlevania bundle currently on steam but I heard all those games suck, true?

CTR
Diddy Kong Racing
Wacky Wheels
SkunnyKart
Sonic Racing All Stars etc
The Wacky Races (Dreamcast)
The Saboteur OR Saints Row 2

Rain World is a 10/10, perhaps 11/10 once you learn the controls and understand it, but it is NOT a metroidvania any more than Flashback, Another World, Oddworld: Abe's Odyssey/Exodus, et.al. are metroidvanias.

These are so short they're hard to really be called metroidvanias. Same thing with Ori, it's basically over as soon as it starts getting interesting.

Unironically get good.
You can see """invisible""" lizards with a little patience, and wait a few seconds before taking a tunnel to see if something is on the other side (it will detect you and come after you)
Original NES metroid has rooms like that also but usually you only lose like 15 energy so it's not the end of the world

Wickebine Kingyouden
The secret boss elevates it to 11/10.

Am I the only one who liked dawn more than aria despite its many many many flaws?

Portrait of Ruin

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>Rain World is a 2D open world game.
Also fucking wrong.

Anyone play Forma 8? I've tried it a few times and I never get further than the obnoxious bomb deflector gameplay. Does it get any better?

Charlotte!!

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Salt and Sanctuary is too fucking good.

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>all these responses saying Hollow Knight
I really need to play that game already. I've had it downloaded on my Switch for months now.

God damn, her back must get really fucked up by that.

>Metroidvania

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yeah

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One of my favorite GBA games of all time. Used to play this and Dragonball Advanced Adventure all the fucking time.

What am I looking at here?

Why does no one like Ori?

>inb4 it's not a metroidvania

Shit taste. Ori is one of the best games in this genre over last few years.

The only good part of that game was the bash.

is it now? I think it was PSN+ a while back, maybe I should try it.

>Search fusion
>17 results
Bitches, Fusion is a nice, game, but not a metroidvania. It's linear.

I haven't played the game, because I don't like the production. The music and visuals all have a cheesiness to them. It appears artificial. Like they're trying to be as sappy as possible, by using all the animation and film techniques they learned in school. Overly contrived, I guess you could say.

As for the gameplay, is it truly a Metroidvania style game? Or just platformer? Because from what I can tell, it's more akin to Ryaman, than Metroid.

>I don't like the production. The music and visuals all have a cheesiness to them. It appears artificial
how one man can be this fucking wrong holy fuck

Best:
Other M
Federation Forces
Prime Pinball

Worst:
Super
Prime 1,2
Hollow Knight

I'm just saying what I'm getting from trailers and screenshots. I always check back on this game during steam sales, and when I watch the trailer, I'm put off. They're trying too hard to be whimsical and wondrous. It's a very clean style, I'll give them that. But it feels very pain-by-numbers. You know, by the rules. You do this, and do that, and it induces this emotional response. I don't like how they're using what essentially comes down to a science to manipulate me into feeling sentimental. It's an aesthetic science. Very formulaic, after much trial and error.

I look at the image of the fat thing holding the cat thing, and I'm repulsed. So you're really going to have to sell me on the gameplay. But the only ones I hear talk about the game never say anything about it. They call it beautiful, they call it cute, and they say it's hard.(But said by women mostly, so I take that with a grain of salt) They never actually say what makes the game fun.

Kill yourself faggot

Castlevania Dawn of Sorrow is the best metroidvania ever made hands down.

The proper term is tansaku game

>white creature with black eyes
get that shit away from me
and take hollow knight and rain world with it as well.

>not a white creature
have me instead then. :)

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I only played Super after Zero Mission, and going back to play super after that feels like everyone just has nostalgia goggles for it. Just sayin'. It's not bad at all, and there's a patch for the controls to bring them up to speed.

playing this atm. Still can't believe it's a Metroidvania

God, this trolls me every time. Why does this piss me off so?

Based and ascension pilled

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to upset you user. I'm just confused about it. I see absolutely nothing super is better at compared to the GBA games, and I'm not saying you're wrong, but good lord, I don't get it.

What the fuck

Don’t get me wrong it’s one of the greatest games of all time but how is it a metroidvania?
There’s literaly 0 powerups to collect besides a fucking lantern that you don’t really need

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This counts as a Metroidvania? Can't really see why.

One of my all time favourite games though

And to clarify, I don't think super is even close to a bad game. It just makes me wanna play Zero Mission.

I too, enjoy being oneshotted by dick-for-face horses

My dick is diamonds now, who is she?

Graphics and music are undeniably better in Super.
The GBA's sound chip is too limiting to create the bassy tones Metroid's sound design is typically known for. And the colors were over brightened to compensate for the original GBA's lack of backlight. But not only that, the style of the GBA game is more comic booky. The backgrounds especially, breaking the moodiness of the world, for a more campy affair.

not the guy from before but if you look at a game like sotn, then look at hollow knight and you are like, man all im doing is killing dudes over and over.

I’m seeing quite a few Ravi-ribbis
I assumed t was just another ironic weeb game that people played for “muh anime tiddies” can any seasoned high taste anons redpill me on it?

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>Graphics and music are undeniably better in Super.

I disagree on both cases, especially in music. The whole audio in the game has a strange sort of audio "blur" (for lack of a better term. Is this an effect of compression?) to it that sounds unappealing as hell imo, even compared to games at the time.

Your other arguments are subjective and I can't fault you for those, but I don't consider those to be bad things or to detract from it. Different is not necessarily bad.

you better be talking about control freak and not any faggy physics patches

I am.

Yes, it's the sound of compression. Fun fact, some people remaster SNES game music, by finding the original samples, and remixing them uncompressed. It's pretty sweet.

But also, the GBA also has the same compressed sound, if not worse. The GBA sound is tinnier, on top of being compressed to. So I don't know where you think the SNES is worse in that regard. Go back and listen to some of it. It's an old game now, so maybe you have a nostalgic bend as well.
youtube.com/watch?v=hlrOAEr6dXc&list=PLA4B22C847C11C106

>Your other arguments are subjective
Well, if you're going to play the subjectivity game, then you're no fun to talk to. But also, if you're going to play the subjectivity game, then at least stop stop calling out Super players as overly nostalgic, and suggesting that the control patch is "up to speed".

Meanwhile Zero Mission's music all sounds like this.
youtube.com/watch?v=YeBxTwBBoRo
to describe this music as a buzz would be a complement.
metroid fusion is actually pretty great by comparison, it's just zero mission's soundfont which sucks balls. It's not bassy, but it's definitely melodic.
youtube.com/watch?v=29njjEQhohc

Fusion also doesn't suffer from other problems has with ZM. The art style in that game is excellent, easily as good as Super, with great spritework and detailed backgrounds.

Not him but the control freak patch is actually great. It doesn't fuck with the game's mechanics, but it gives you much more comfortable inputs.
>optional auto-run
>aim is one button, usually L
>if you have an item selected and you press shoot then you just fire a beam. If you hold R and shoot then you use the item.
>R + shoot always triggers a powerbomb
>x ray visor on a dedicated button
all of the original tech is still there though

I've played both ZM and Super recently though. Super's audio had me thinking my ears were messed up at some points. I've heard some of those remasters, and they're pretty damn great, but that's not the music as you hear it in the game. I don't think Zero Mission's music is the pinnacle of audio fidelity either, but I do think it comes out better than Super's did. For what it's worth, I think Super had better composition overall as well.

Sorry you got upset about me playing the subjectivity card there. I didn't have any arguments for that, but I didn't think that they were particularly better or worse, and I definitely don't think you can measure anything objective with that, so I decided to talk about something I could actually discuss.

Sounds nice. I never tried it, but doesn't it alter the gravity to make it more like Zero Mission's weight?

The basic hack modifies only the controls.
romhacking.net/hacks/405/
Another version combines it with a physics mod.
romhacking.net/hacks/3211/

The 'powerups' are very scarce, and you have to experiment to find their true purpose like Explosive Spears, Hallucinogen Mushrooms, Bubbleroot, Lanterns, Squidcadas and the list goes on.
The metroidvania part is growing your skill in controlling the slugcat and discovering new movement tech like a walljump in Super Metroid. These are your real powerups, learning how to deal with the world with the tools you're given, some of which you don't even know are tools, hence, the experimentation part. Shit like knowing that the smokebomb is extremely toxic to centipedes, and will likely kill them in one throw, or Vulture masks scared off lesser lizards when held and worn and learning to slide, longjump and roll

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>Megaman zx
Good taste

ZX is a good game but the metroidvania elements are pretty fucking bad desu

HK

Environmental Station Alpha as for classical-style Metroid (map is incredible dense with stuff and secrets, also it has SOUL), and my all-time favorite Rain World, which is arguably a semi-metroidvania, because the main staple of the genre is nonlinear exploration, and RW is all about that.

Not him but I actually prefer the fact that it has level design built into the maps itself, compared to most metroidvanias which have the most handwavey platforming you can imagine and makes you question why it has platforming at all. It was flawed and could be improved on, but definitely a step in the right direction.

How the fuck you even typed that Hero COre looks ugly? It's art direction is spot-on.

Some of these changes are just silly to me. But this one in particular, " Walljumping should be a bit easier on a d-pad", is concerning. Because walljumping was perfect in Super Metroid. That is, once you understood how they functioned. Once you realize that the wall jumping command is one after the other, and not at the same time, then it's great. Making it "easier", sounds like casualization to me.

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Mostly this. You feel a cohesive narrative and theme, something that most recent metroidvanias lack.

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Are you saying that you don't understand why Rare chose to make it like one, or that you don't agree with people who say it is?

Unfortunately Ori looks a lot like those artsy fartsy walk simulators Braid managed to unleash. You know, like all the effort went into the visuals and a shitty "story".

So people expecting a cutesy wutsy disney game got fucking rekt by all the instant death bullshit and people who'd appreciate the top tier gameplay never gave it a chance. Thankfully I left my pretenses at the door, gave it a shot and was plesantly surprised.

I only care about making item selection easier, desu. And I didn't even notice the wall jumping controls had been changed, the tech I'm used to still works fine.

Environmental Station Alpha.

Metroid Zero Mission and Environmental Station Alpha.

Zero Mission for being the only Metroid game to have actual intended sequence breaking and done so in a very natural way

Environmental Station Alpha for having some of the most satisfying and fair boss fights I've ever played, the game is consistently difficult but not in any cheap or unfair way I've experienced with other Metroidvanias.

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the level design in this one kinda sucks, but top tier aesthetics and music

super metroid literally teaches you how to sequence break stop repeating this meme

>using the subject field
newfag

This, and Dawn of Sorrow

He's probably some zoomer who thinks simple or lo-fi graphics are inherently ugly.

Aria of Sorrow is better

absolute cringe post

Avoiding the subject field only makes you look like someone trying too hard to be accepted. A tool who succumbs to peer group think.

>Super Metroid literally teaches you how to sequence break stop repeating this meme

I can't remember a point where it did, other than teaching you wall jumping. I'd like some sauce with this dinner you're serving me user.

I hated the platforming in this game desu and how so many secrets are just easter eggs and didn't give you anything.
The post game content is insane though

>Can I play it if I haven't seen the movie?
No, you're not allowed. It's illegal to download the game unless you can pass a 100 question quiz about the movie with at least 95% correct answers.

teaching you wall jumping is teaching you how to sequence break
and having sequence breaking organically integrated into the level design and primarily reached through tech is a hell of a lot better than just putting hidden blocks everywhere

>S Tier
Aria of Sorrow
>A Tier
Portrait of Ruin, Dawn of Sorrow (With the rom hack), Bloodstained
>B Tier
Circle of the Moon, Symphony of the Night
>C tier
Dawn of Sorrow Vanilla, Order of Ecclesia
>D Tier
Harmony of Dissonance
>Obligatory Mention of Mirror of Fate Tier
Mirror of Fate

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Super Metroid teaches you to wall jump and shinespark, both key sequence breaking techniques. You can use wall jump to enter Kraid's hideout without high jump boots and you can use shinespark to get to the wrecked ship without the grapple beam, just to name 2 examples.

swap OoE with CotM and I'm with you.

This might sound odd, but can you explain why Aria is the max? I'm not disagreeing, I just want to know what you see in it.

>simple mechanics
You haven't beaten the game
You don't need complex mechanics for a good game, an array of simple mechanics combine to make a complex game

It is soulless, even worse - it tries to make artificial soul.

Hm, never considered that. I should replay Super Metroid with this in mind then. I always felt too lazy to sequence break but this might give me the motivation to try out something different.

Thanks anons.

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>You can use wall jump to enter Kraid's hideout without high jump boots
Actually you don't need this, if you're slick enough you can do a midair morph to get into Kraid's lair without high jump. Just one of the reasons I love Super's physics.
>you can use shinespark to get to the wrecked ship without the grapple beam
If you're even slicker you can just pull off a precise wall jump or bomb jump to do this. But that has a 2-3 frame window, shinespark is much more practical.

>having sequence breaking organically integrated into the level design and primarily reached through tech is a hell of a lot better than just putting hidden blocks everywhere
I agree. Zero Mission's sequence breaking could be okay if it used better indicators for what walls can be speed boosted through, like some inconspicuous cracks or something. As it stands, the only way to know whether you can boost through a wall is to just try it or bomb every wall to see if it shows speed boost blocks, so Zero Mission's sequence breaking feels completely unnatural and overly convoluted.

I fell for the "no rabiribi is really good isn't a meme"

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I feel you, man, I beat this trash. Well, grass is animated nice, I guess, but arhitecture is full-blown WoW-tier shit.

Ever since I learned how to do those tricks, I skip the high jump boots and grapple beam pretty much every time I play through the game.

Powerslave on the Saturn is the peak of the exploration genre

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Cave Story is not a Metroidvania, it's more like classic Castlevania games with its set levels instead of an open map

Metroidvania is defined by having a big world to explore that opens up gradually as you get more powerups. In Rain World the entire world (besides one part) is already open to you and the only progression you get is by gitting gud and learning. I feel like "Survival Platformer" or somethign fits better as a genre

Batman Arkham Asylum

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Correct.

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Hollow Knight is one of the shittiest examples of a modern Metroidvania. Ori, Salt & Sanctuary, and Iconoclasts, are all far better.

Circle of the Moon is so fucking hard m8, I love how open ended the whole game is but god damn the tarot card system with random drops can really tear your dick off.

>Zero Mission for being the only Metroid game to have actual intended sequence breaking and done so in a very natural way
Super Metroid's sequence breaking is FAR more natural. In Super Metroid I figured out a lot of sequence breaks on my own just by looking at the level design and thinking, "Wait... could I do that?" and then figuring out I could. I've watched videos of people sequence breaking in Zero Mission and it's just tons of speedboosting through random walls and ceilings, which always made me think, "Well why the fuck would you even think to do that?"

oh shit that looks awesome

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Shantae and the Pirate's Curse is a good Metroidvania.

The other games are not really worth playing.

IMO ZM sequence breaking's main problem is that it doesn't have the same skill cap as Super. Cool level design like Red Tower, the Moat or Lava Dive Room can't exist with ZM's mechanics. I think that's why it leans hard on the crutch of invisible breakable blocks.

Fuck MWYAH Part 2 though

As much shit gets thrown around sometimes in these threads, I seriously think you lot are better people to talk to in a thread than most other game genre types. Actual discussion is a blessing here sometimes.

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If Metroidvanias are actually exploration platformers then I'd say Rainworld qualifies. The progression is just tied to the player learning new techniques rather than the character. In some ways, that's more rewarding. You have all the tools you need from the start and on future playthroughs the world is your oyster to do with as you please, whereas in something like Metroid you get artificially gated at certain times by power-up requirements no matter how skilled you become.

My favorite is Batman: Arkham Asylum

Man, don't get me wrong, I LOVE Iconoclasts, but it's a stretch to even really call it Metroid-like, it's extremely linear, and the main appeal is the story.

Hollow Knight is definitely more 3D Dark Souls than Metroidvania though, to be fair.

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I'm against shitposting anyways, so if anyone seems like it, it's probably just me being wrong or an idiot.

I'm saying the artificial gating is what defines the genre and why I feel Rain World doesn't fit. If you tell someone who's favorite game is Super Metroid to play Rain World, they'll likely be put off

If Fusion is a Metroidvania then so is Iconoclasts.

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I just bought it and it feels like the story grinds me to a halt every ten steps. Does this ever stop?

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>artificial gating is what defines the genre
Well, you can also say that arcade shooter is defined by score system and you can't have one without leaderboards. I feel that "exploration " is more broad definition than "artifitial gated exploration".

Is OOE even a Metroidvania?
It's segmented levels and they are mostly linier. Pretty sure a Metroidvania has to have only 1 or 2 big interconnected levels.

Yeah, okay, I can see your point.

i've been told that it's almost impossible to beat without a guide

I'd say only the endgame is a mini-metroidvania.

>All these Aria recommendations
You guys are alright

I get you, we can jsut agree to disagree. Rain World is an amazing game regardless

>Batman: Arkham Asylum
Man even though I enjoy the latter games, I do miss the Metroidvania gameplay of the first one and it did have the most memorable location too.

I wish 3D Metroidvanias were more prevalent.

Generally good movement/mobility upgrades and good map design go a good way for me. I don't really recall any area in Aria that I disliked going through, other than the last area, but that whole section's pretty short. Having come off of Harmony of Dissonance right before playing Aria and absolutely hating the map in that game probably swayed my opinion a bit when the map wasn't just awful in Aria. Oh yeah, for context, the list is from me having played the games for the first time a few months ago mostly in order. Using an example from a game in the A tier, Portrait of Ruin's two clown levels at times made me want to stop playing for long stretches of time, while the rest of the game was really fun. Aria doesn't have any section like that for me. In terms of movement, Black Panther's just one of the best things in the series in general, along with things like the back dash from other games in the series, and the high jump from Circle of the Moon, moving around the castle just feels good to do.

Souls are a fun system with a lot of different combinations and unless you grind, it can give you a different experience each time. There's a lot of stuff to experiment with and it's my favorite system in these games just from the sheer amount of options it gives you, and Dawn and Bloodstained also having these puts them higher up there for me, although they miss the mark slightly in other regards. The only real complaint I have about the system is the amount of souls that are just "+x to y stat", which Dawn kinda fixes by having soul leveling.

I don't think Fusion is a Metroidvania in the traditional sense of an exploration platformer. It's more of an action platformer with levels that happen to be connected in a coherent world.

That's actually one of my biggest beefs with SotN. The abilities you get across the game are terrible. Gotta love "Mist" being just for those barred gates and "Wolf" which is only used to crawl through one hole.

The best Metroidvanias gradually expand a moveset that makes you feel extremely powerful by the end of the game. Shantae and the Pirate's Curse did it really well even if it's very Fusion-inspired in terms of linearity. End Game Alucard is indistinguishable from Early Game Alucard except for the janky Bat ability.

I do still like SotN but a lot of that is the music.

I played it last year and while the general Dini aesthetic and constant references to lore was great, I didn't enjoy myself for most of the game. It just didn't click for me.

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Iconoclasts. It looks kinda cutesy and childish, but it's actually a pretty good game. Takes a while for the story to get going, but it's very Metroid like. I had a lot of fun playing it and it's got some interesting puzzle bosses and good music.

I finished it in March, and I found that the game was unappealing at first, but as time went on and the world was expanded upon and more gameplay options were available, I was having a lot more fun with it.

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Agreed. City and Knight were good, but I feel like they fell into the open world trap. Asylum was a much tighter experience overall and despite many similarities, a very different game from its sequels.

Metroid Prime > Super Metroid > the rest

If you want to feel like every upgrade is useful and intuitive, I highly recommend Environmental Station Alpha.

The game is focus heavy on exploration and movement. Every upgrade I've found so far caused me to see the world in a different way and never really felt useless. Even the Hook, one of the first upgrades you get for basic traversing, never lost it's use even way into the insane end game.

It definitely is during the castle portion. You also need to backtrack to previous areas with the double jump and underwater movement to fully complete them and rescue all the villagers. It's the least metroidy of the metroidvanias, but it's still there.

Also Metroid Prime 3 isn't really interconnected because of the gunship system, but once you get through Norion it pretty much works the same as the other two Primes. OoE works fairly similarly to that.

But yes, it does work better with a big interconnected map though. Games like Portrait of Ruin and Metroid Prime 2 with sections within sections work too.

I mean it is inspired by Fusion, yeah.

I feel like the ability progression is pretty subpar though, which was disappointing. And as much as I love it, every playthrough is blighted by having to go through the Tower.

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how is ESA structured in terms of linearity and sequence breaking?

>I wish 3D Metroidvanias were more prevalent.
8 weeks til.

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>hollow knight
>too many bosses
Aka 2hard4u

HK is the BEST metroidvania you pleb

It's really oldschool with its puzzles. If you don't have note pad and pencil in hand to write down all the clues and shit you'll be lost.

The tower is tolerable on repeat playthroughs desu, but god that area would be so improved if it was just given like one more shortcut to make going around simpler.

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I've had it on my wishlist for a long time and your post made me go and buy it. I hope you'll take responsibility.

The story is fairly linear but there's a lot of opportunity to sequence break with hard as fuck platforming. The post game is also some La Mulana levels of puzzle solving to get to the final ending

That sounds like my kinda thing, I'll check it out.

I love Super Metroid but I still wish shit like the Wall Jump/Space Jump was less infuriatingly hard to do.

the wall jump is piss easy, but yeah it needs to be easier to recover from a failed space jump

Not him, but HK takes too much inspiration from Castlevania and Dark Souls to be enjoyable for me. What I look for in a good Metroidvania is interesting navigation, platforming, and navigation-based puzzles. Hollow Knight is too combat-focused and the navigation itself isn't really that enjoyable or interesting, so it just feels like a slog to me. I'm sure it's great if you like that kind of game, but I seek a very different experience from a Metroidvania.

I have the weirdest boner right now

>On all levels including physical, I am a horse.

axiom verge

I think HK's movement abilities are really cool but you're right that it's light on puzzles.

Why is the Hollow Knight shilling getting worse? I'm 100% able to accept it's a great game but to act like it actually succeeded in reinventing the wheel seems dishonest.

stay away from Ori you fucking nigger, you clearly unable to appreciate a good game.

Personally I don't agree with you on some of those points, but I respect your opinion. Thank you for taking the time to reply, my dude!

>Why is the Hollow Knight shilling getting worse?

Bloodstained was better

Bloodstained is also pretty fucking linear.

I never got far enough to find out, I guess. I got bored with the game pretty early on because it was such a slog just walking through these unnecessarily huge areas with nothing particularly interesting to do in them other than just arrive at the next boss fight. It really is so much more a 2D Dark Souls than it is a Metroidvania.

The perfect metroidvania would be like Dishonored or Dark Messiah but nonlinear w/ branching story choices
prove me wrong

>shit controls
>shit animation
>shit artstyle
it's not even a good game.
>shilling getting worse
leddit AND summerfags

Not him but the complete disrespect of Our on Yea Forums made me realize most supposed metroidvania fans here are actually just pixelshit fans and don't actually give a shit if a game is good.

*of Ori

I totally agree but i haven't played it. I'm just saying I'm not some memeing idiot. It's amazing how blatant the shilling is though and no one bothers to address it anymore cuz it's almost become a mainstay.

Its neat, it has a slow start though, more than the typical metroidvania

>super metroid like games >> igavania
For one, i fucking hate always having to grind for better loot, stats, gear in igavania games. It really blows when you realize you have to grind for souls or weapon or stats instead of enjoying the exploration and being rewarded for exploring everything.
It really slows down the pace of the game.

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Bash was so fucking cool though

It isn't that good and it reeks normiecore.

The problem is that a lot of "metroidvania fans" are actually Castlevania and Dark Souls fans. They don't want a Metroid-like exploration platformer game, they want a Castlevania-like action/boss-fight game that happens to have an interconnected world. That's why Hollow Knight is so popular on Yea Forums while Ori often falls by the wayside, because Hollow Knight is 2D Dark Souls while Ori is a semi-linear Metroid style game. Everyone is also really excited about the inclusion of more combat elements in Ori 2, but personally it worries me a lot. It sucks that no one seems to want the kinds of Metroidvanias that I do so they're becoming more and more rare as time goes on.

metroid fusion
it has the best atmosphere and the increased linearity actually helps build the tension and the story

SOTN easily.
It was my favorite ever since it came out. Its crauy to think that a game this far ahead of Super Metroid came out only 3 years later.

Despite the fact that a myriad of games left SM behind by now. Really the only redeeming factor is nostalgia. Swampy controls and enviroments that can be summed up as one corridor after another with an occasional obstacle in it, and different colored backgrounds isn't just much to impress anyone with these days.

get good, you can beat every igavania at low level

same

...

does this nigga really believe sotn has better level design than super metroid

It is pretty lacking in the exploration aspect though, especially if you compare it to similar games, the platforming is pretty fucking good though. Maybe it would've been better as a level based game instead of a metroidvania.

>Swampy controls and enviroments that can be summed up as one corridor after another with an occasional obstacle in it
But you just described SotN.

At least Super Metroid has obstacles, whereas in SotN platforming is a joke and every enemy melts upon touch.

I love Ori! It's one of my favorite games! I can't wait to play Ori 2 in february!

>Maybe it would've been better as a level based game instead of a metroidvania
fuck no, first game was perfect and I hope they won't fuck up the sequel somehow

>I hope they won't fuck up the sequel somehow
They said they're adding more combat elements and boss fights.

Just youtube Quadrobics, if you incels wanna see more of this. Some pretty tight girls do it.

Its not because its hard without the better stats but the character feels like trash when playing. Yourstarting gear feels trash and certain areas just require you to have a bigger health pool.
Sure people who have played the game multiple times can find ways to make it less grindy but it just feels cheap to have players farm instead of rewarding them for exploration.

They hired the AM2R dev as a designer. Ori 2 is going to be godtier.

damn that's pretty cool
>AM2R
was it finished?

AM2R>>>>>>>>>>>Hollow Knight trash

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Yeah, three years ago

>normiecore

It's literally mechanically better than most of the trash that gets suggested in these threads and ur punishing it for not conforming to ur psued aesthetics.

Not sure why...but it bugs me that her crotch area of the panties looks like a triangle...
...Like a piece of pizza...

>It sucks that no one seems to want the kinds of Metroidvanias that I do

It's ok user u can just come out and say it. It sucks that no one wants new games.

Oh this. So much fucking this.
I played Super for the first time this year after and I couldn't believe that this is the game some idiots praise as the best.
you nailed with the different color comment.
its literally all copy paste with a different background color.

and the controls FUCKING SUCK! so fucking slow and clunky.
meanwhile in SOTN its so fluid, you have plenty of available attacks that are also fucking fluid as well as great and varied enemies and enemy design.
"Super" metroid on the other hand has controls and enemy design that looks as if its not an SNES but an NES game. Its so fucking outdated.
but most importantly its so fucking boring like jesus christ. there's literally nothing exciting or fun to it.
at least traversing the castle was just fluid fun that kept the player going constantly. super metroid even fucks with basic traversal. those fucking bumps you mention are so fucking pathetic.

Really nintendo? long ass corridors and suddenly a little bump because apparently running all the way through was not gamey enough? thats what you call game design? because thats about it! and the elements are so dull as well. really? another door with another color for another gadget to open it? gee I guess i walk into the other direction now...

fucking trash piece of shit and fuck everyone who reads this and ever listed super metroid as their favorite. you all have absolute shit taste and need to let go of your fucking nostalgia already.
nobody with more than 5 brain cells would play this over any metroidvania castlevania or even hollow knight.

Super Metroid is a fucking bluebrint on "how to make it better" and literally every game that came after did.

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I like the art on this one user
pirating right now

I'm a little bit worried about the fact that there's so many abilities that they had to go and add a quick select wheel for switching/equipping them. Hopefully that doesn't mean that you have to break up the flow too often to switch shit, but I'm more worried about how it implies that bash might not be as integral since it's now possible for the player to not have it at hand. I hope they have enough sense in them to design levels in a manner that you don't have to fiddle with shit too much and that bash is still as important.

You assumed right.

super metroid is the ultimate pleb filter, just like classic sonic (for largely the same reasons too)

La Mulana or Environmental Station Alpha, it switches between the two. Harmony of Dissonance would be third.

I mean the first game had triple jumps and air dashes as abilities you unlocked with points.

Though I never used them so I have no idea how bad they broke the game.

>Harmony of Dissonance

Seriously? Explain this faggotry.

>Hollow Knight
>Too many bosses

lmao

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I like ori a lot but its barely a metroidvania.

>They're trying too hard to be whimsical and wondrous.
Absolutely redpilled
Imagine missing out on good games because you don't like small white creatures with black eyes

Try other metriod like games then like am2r or axiom verge.
One thing igavanias have over metriod like is tge combat. Why cant these fks figure out a way to shoot every direction instead of only 8 fucking directions.

There are people here who gave up on La-mulana because they can't fucking read.

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I like it. It requires positioning. Why would you need to learn how to duck and aim upwards at the same time if you could just click on the enemy?

Or because it's fucking impossible.

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>big map
>platforming
>good controls
>smooth animations
>backtracking
>unlocking of different abilities
>a little bit of rpg elements
how the fuck it's not a metroidvania you retard

they did, in samus returns

>How do I into La-moolaynay

(you)

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Most people who shit on it haven't played it for more than a couple of minutes, and only know about the graphics/music memes. The compositions are great (I've posted a couple below, ignore the chiptune voicing and listen to the songs themselves), and the saturated colors are only an issue on emulators. A legit copy on a GBA or SP looks and sounds great, and it's my favourite of the SOTN-style castlevanias. It's harder than SOTN and Aria/Dawn, doesn't have the shitty dashing from CotM, and no divided bitesize levels like Ecclesia/Portrait. Portrait is pretty solid too though just because of the amount of content with plenty of unlockable modes and play options. Juste was cool too.

youtube.com/watch?v=FKbZfBLgLJo
youtube.com/watch?v=XfGH6T1Swrk

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yeah and it sucked

DotA2 is a platformer. Big map, gotta go up and down ramps sometimes you can fly over cliffs. Good controls. Animation is as smooth as chunky peanut butter. Unlock abilities and items. And even some rpg elements!

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how? you wanted to shoot in more than 8 directions and that's exactly what you can do in that game

>dotard is a cock gobbling mongoloid
why am I not surprised

Ironic that you're complaining about Metroid having "only" 8 directions to aim in while praising the combat of a game series where you can only aim in a single direction.

Not while moving.

Play it yourself and you'll see. It gets a lot of unfair criticism.

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what's ironic is that despite SM's flaws, SOTN is an even bigger joke of a garbage game, with shit powerups, shit and unnecessary leveling, shit and unnecessary gear, awful random health consumables and other stupid fucking items, healing by throwing shit on the ground and picking it back up, being able to cheese every boss with "summon spirit" infinitely, with a combo that anyone "trying" to figure out magic will figure out, total lack of difficulty / bizarre difficulty curve, absolute garbage level design (COOL MAP, COOL ENVIRONMENT REALLY, COOL BUT GARBAGE LEVEL DESIGN hugobille.com/blog/progression-in-symphony-of-the-night EXPLAINS BETTER THAN I AM GONNA BOTHER IN THIS POST)

the biggest difference between super metroid and asshole vania sotNIGGER is that in an area like where you get the high jump you wouldnt have to go all the fuck the way bakc around to leave, or where you get bat, like a shaft would open above you to fly up and out, instead you have to go back through like 30 screens in the fucking library to leave and get back around. Or the telescope would do something, or that confession booth would do something, or being able to sit down would actually do something in a certain area like open a secret, or that spinning bookcase effect would be used in more than one fucking place, or whatever. The whole game is tighter and less stupidly designed. It's very precise. SOTN is the compelte opopsite, very loose, very , like, 10 people can play it and have totally different time through it depending on what gear they have on. some people think that's a plus but its retarded that someone could RNG something like getting a really fucking strong weapon early without farming for it when people normally have to grind for it, and it comepletely trivializes the game even harder than it normally would be.

>indie 2d platformer
woooooooow

if you hold down R you lock samus and place and can aim in 360 degrees. did you play the game?

>you can only aim in a single direction.
Except there are many movement options such as backdash, double jump, etc. The combat and movement feels very tight.

Daily reminder that if you complain about Super Metroids controls then you need to git gud or go back to candy crush :)

I've played it and I can't imagine anything setting it apart form the rest. It's so generic. I hate Aria too but even that's better.

Look, this is Castlevania. Having two decent songs means it's a low point. It came right after Circle of the moon which, aside form eing fucking impossible to play on an actual GBA, came with way better original songs AND tons of fantastic remixes of obscure music like Clockwork Mansion.

Samus Returns lets you shoot while moving completely uninterrupted and only makes you stop to aim with more precision. Meanwhile, in Castlevania, you can only attack in ONE direction at two heights and pressing the attack button makes you stop moving for the duration of the animation. So how the fuck is Castlevania's combat better, according to your own criteria?

personal favorite is either Hollow Knight, Super Metroid, or Valdis Story

>Rain World
>Hyper Light Drifter
both good but neither are metroidvanias

I love Super Metroid, Symphony of the Night, Aria of Sorrow, and Bloodstained primarily. That being said I like them all but those 4 are my go to’s

Use the throwable axes on him and learn the safe spots.

Indie? It's Microsoft. And it's their first genuinely good game.

X is the natural position for shooting shit. Monster Hunter knows.

>So people expecting a cutesy wutsy disney game got fucking rekt by all the instant death bullshit and people who'd appreciate the top tier gameplay never gave it a chance
summer is fucking everywhere jesus crist

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'cause it has restrictions and forces you to get close? Aside from a couple of extremely poor boss designs in Bloodstained and Ecclesia you rarely die from being too close to the boss.

>ah, you were at my side all along

who cares, the controls are remappable

unless you're saying you cannot do it while moving which is still wrong

Sales and reception are not the same thing, bud. You know you can buy a game and then not like it, right?

It's a gorgeous game, but the gameplay is fucking bad. And it's boring as shit, too. I forced myself to finish it recently after dropping it twice over the course of 3 years and the only cool thing about it is the springing off projectiles ability thing. It just doesn't compare to better titles. it's definitely a metroidvania though, rest assured

>reception
you literally said nobody bought it and nobody liked it because it's too cute and too hard.
Aren't you one big fucking retard

They were just two examples. Nearly every song is memorable. Circle of the Moon isn't bad (I liked the fusion between classic and SOTN style), but needing to double tap whenever you wanted to move sucked, and generally the movements/physics were off compared to the rest of the series. Dash movement should've been the default instead of very slow movement and vertical jumps with almost no horizontal movement.

Hexen

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So Metroid's combat is bad because it's too restrictive and you can "only" aim in 8 directions and you can "only" aim more precisely by not moving, but Castlevania's combat is better because it has more restrictions?

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THE BAIT HERO WE NEED TO KEEP THE THREADS ALIVE
THANK YOU SIR

Hardly, because then you get the run button on A or some shit. How are you going to run and jump at the same time? It's not possible.

Have you boys ever played Thing Thing or Soldat? Or any twin stick shooter such as Geometry Wars?

I wasn't him, but I can read what he said. He said the reason nobody talks about the game is that most people who bought it got something different than what they expected and dropped it, and a much smaller percentage of the people who bought the game actually loved it. He implied that if Ori was marketed differently then there might have been a higher percentage of people who bought the game and loved it and it would therefore be more frequently talked about. He wasn't saying that Ori didn't sell, he's saying that its sales were distributed through the population poorly and that causes it to not get suggested on Yea Forums very much.

I still prefer it to pressing R or L over and over. That's the same as curse of darkness where you have to flip your way through every corridor.

The biggest crime is that the bosses are boring. Almost nothing but giant versions of regular enemies. No time stoppers, no painters, none of that cool shit.

just put the run button on x nigga

I wouldn't want Metroid to be like that.

I have. I know what you're getting at. I think Metroid is fine as it is.

>"Map Exploration Adventure

reminds me of the snorks from STALKER

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>Cuphead

>Cuphead
>Cuphead
Are you fucking kidding me

how the fuck do you want this game to be marketed?
Good game can't be cute? Game with good art and music can't have a little bit of challenge?
Even my fucking casual as fuck GF finished it twice and she still listens to OST from time to time.
fucking moron goddamn

You want me to hold down X to run while jumping with B? That doesn't look very comfortable.

Default is the best layout, and the only one that works. They knew what hey were doing.

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Metroid wasn't the first to use the "metroidvania" gameplay structure

I'm not saying I agree with him, I'm just saying you missed his point and saying the game sold really well doesn't actually disprove anything he was actually saying.

I actually like that the controls are mapped in a way that you basically have to choose either running and jumping or jumping and shooting.

Exactly and you know why?
Because he can't form his thoughts properly and instead spouts some fucking inept shit.

what nigga jumps with b? use the a button dummy

Ori

B is run, A is jump, X or Y to shoot.

See? This guy gets it. People nowadays can't handle unorthodox controls, even when they are superior. Uprising comes to mind.

I know this is bait
But unironically prime pinball is a great game

Guys, how's The Mummy Demastered? I know the OST is pretty fucking good.
Also, Hive Jump is on sale (I think) on the Switch. Would you recommend that one?

Hello my fellow, there's only 8 months of waiting left

>X or Y to shoot
But then what button do you use to cancel your item selection? Do you just press Select 6 times after every time you use a missile?

>You know you can buy a game and then not like it, right?
???

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He was talking about rebinding them which usually means B is jump and Y is shoot. Unless you want to go full Jet Force Gemini and put jump on X.

I went into my brother's save file once and put shoot on like L. Good times.

finally a good thread, thanks

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It was fine, I don't really play pinball games so I don't know if it's better or worse than others.

Whichever face button is free, I use for item selection. Select is a cancel.

I want to buy it to show my support, but they announced it would be exclusive to the microshit service on E3. I hope they fix that.

I wonder how many games have 96% of positive reviews on steam. Is there a site to look it up?

Again, not endorsing anything said. I'm just pointing out what he meant. Ori is a clearly beloved game, but I do get annoyed when people equate sales to quality. I knew this one guy who would always use pre-order numbers and day one sales to say that means a game is factually high quality; I told him that pre-orders and day one sales are a sign of good marketing and not necessarily a good game but he couldn't wrap his head around it.

God I wish that were me

sales are a merit for quality but not in every case.
You can't disregard them completely.

Even though I like Metroidvania games and one of the genres I play the most, they're rarely games that outright blow me away. It's almost like they're at the medium baseline

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I think sales in the first week are not really indicative of quality because no one has actually had enough time with the game to know if it's good and they're just buying it based on marketing and expectations. If a game continues to sell well months later, then I'm willing to accept they're a mark of quality or at least an indication of positive reception to the game. But when the headline is, "This game sold really well in its first week," I just put zero stock in that for judging quality or reception to a game.

>but they announced it would be exclusive to the microshit service on E3

It comes out on steam on february 22nd

You're joking, right?

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Ori falls by the wayside because over half of Yea Forums won't play it because it's not on Switch or PS4.

...

>momodora
This is a game with heavy emphasis on visuals. Other than that it's just a cute little game that's fun enough. It sounds like you're playing the wrong ones to be wowed by

Ive only played 3 metroidvanias but they're some of my favorite games
>Rain World
>Hollow Knight
>Dead Cells

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Why don't you niggers just call the genre 2DARPG?

That's a good point. Ori would be comfy as fuck on Switch, though.

remove amerikeks from this pic and you will get more accurate list.
Also what are this, digital or physical? Does it count PC games?

>Kinect Adventures
How can this be?

Go to the steam list of all games and order by rating.

I was just posting the first Metroidvania image I had at hand. I do like the game but it's not my favorite. I have no clue what's my favorite, probably Aria of Sorrow, but I played a lot of them and all the obvious ones, along with really shitty ones as well.

Because not all of them even have RPG elements. Metroid and other Metroid-likes are exploration-based action platformers. It's only Castlevania and the Castlevania-likes that implement RPG elements. It's the number one reason that I hate the term "Metroidvania," because Metroid and Castlevania have two very different approaches and they should actually be separated from one another, genre-wise.

dead cells is not a metroidvania so is rain world you dumb fag

Everyone has been through this a million times, Metroidvania is a shitty name but nobody seems to come up with a better name that isn't a mouthful. It just fucking stuck from lack of alternatives

You're wrong. Metroid was the first to do away with the RPG elements and Castlevania brought them back. The first "metroidvanias" (before they were called that) all had RPG elements and it was a staple of the genre.

What were the first Metroidvanias before the original Metroid?

People need to stop being stupid. I've always called it action adventure. Like Souls is a typical action adventure.

so that's the opposite of normiecore then

Metroidvania literally only has the -vania in it because of the RPG elements that SoTN brought in.

Action Adventure is too broad of a term, most Actions Adventure games aren't "Metroidvanias". The best I can come up with is Action-Exploration Platformer, but, again, it's a mouthful.

Shit like wonder boy 3 and that arcade game with dragons. Dragon trap? Anyway other franchises like Knightmare kept the RPG elements alive looong before SOTN came around.

>And it's their first genuinely good game
looking at recent E3 probably the only

>>Rain World
It's an open world platformer, but not a metroidvania. It was even discussed earlier in this thread, metroidvanias usually have item-based gated progression in some form, but Rain World is just purely skill-based platforming.

>>Hollow Knight
More of a 2D Dark Souls than a metroidvania. The gameplay primarily consists of you fighting your way from one boss to the next, movement/navigation isn't particularly interesting, and there are few if any puzzles or navigation challenges.

>>Dead Cells
This is a 2D action-platformer roguelite, not a metroidvania. Exploring a map in 2D is not the only thing that makes something a metroidvania, and the fact that the map is randomized on each run and can't be memorized and practiced squarely disqualifies it from being a metroidvania.

the God has spoken.

>most Actions Adventure games aren't "Metroidvanias"

I disagree. Can you name an example so I know where you're coming from?

Dude Ori 2 looks amazing. Though I guess I have a soft spot for giant monsters.

Both of those came after Metroid user-kun. Maybe you're thinking of Super Metroid?

Metroidvania was originally a term that Classicvania fans used to make fun of SotN and other Igavanias. The fact that it turned into a genre name is kind of a fluke, and one I find a bit frustrating.

>Metroid released on Famicom on August 6, 1986
>Wonder Boy III: Dragon's Trap released on Master System in 1989
Try again.

If you want specific examples there's always google. I found a few. Point is the genre existed before Metroid so the term makes no sense. That's like calling every platformer Mariofall.

Like Crash bandicoot is a good Mariofall.

Well I guess I have to be specific - the only good franchise

hollow knight

On that we can agree. That's one more than Sony ever gave us. Unless we're counting Patapon which they ruthlessly murdered.

Classicniggers forever seething back to /vr/.

I like this game, but it's such a "Yea Forums title". It has a lot of neat ideas, but they aren't executed as well as they could have been, leaving the game feeling a little unpolished towards the end (take a look at the Large Cavern compared to the Nest of Evil), but since it's the least renowned of the series it's constantly praised on Yea Forums.

Also, I always felt the game got too easy once you got the ignis glyph, there's no point in really using any other glyph since they are all either awkward to use or deal barely any damage.

Well Sony funded Demon Souls

have sex

You know, it's a very generic broad term that applies to a lot of games. It's basically a non-genre almost. Shit like the Zelda games, Shenmue, GTA, Tomb Raider, you can probably call it that to the DMC clones since they lack a name as well, but that's another conversation entirely. It's just not a very descriptive title and it's usually employed very loosely. I understand what you're saying on how on a technical level the term does sort of fit the bill, but historically the term is just applied to something else and it wouldn't be very descriptive when using it and people understanding you that you're referring to "Metroidvanias"

No it wasn't, you dumb fuck. When SOTN came out the classic franchise had fucking 64 to compete with it. The difference in quality was so obvious that I remember reading articles on why "3D realism would never surpass 2D perfection."

I'm not a Classicfag. I'm a Metroidfag who gets annoyed at all the Castlevania clones that get lumped in with Metroid via the term "metroidvania." No one distinguishes between the metroid- part and the -vania part and they act like SotN and Super Metroid are basically the same type of game, but they play so vastly different from one another and have such different design goals.

Basically everyone agrees the term is shit, but until anyone can come up with a better one we're stuck with it. And this conversation does come up a lot.

Sounds like you need to play Hard mode.

Most of those are just adventures, right? The action part to me means games structured like Mega Man or Castlevania with the focus on action. And even if people like exploration, the focus in all of these games will always be the action.

Metroidvania was originally the term to differentiate SotN from more traditional Castlevania games because SotN was seen as aping Super Metroid.

Meant for

You are entitled to your opinion good sir.

However, I am entitled to mine and in my opinion you are an idiot.

A quick glace at the fantastic atwiki website shows that Japan never used the term.

In truth I didn't even hear the term before like 2000. Before that, we just called it "Metroid". SOTN was teetering on the edge of being a Super Metroid ripoff, what with the similar map and save rooms.

>Metroidvania
It's CASTLEROIDS. You're talking about Castlevania games that play like Metroid, not Metroid games that play like Castlevania. The precursor modifies the successor, not the successor modifiying the precursor.

Well, they are both, that's why they're called Action Adventure. Just Adventure games is like the point and click games or the japanese menu-based adventure games, or VNs and the sort. This is usually just the limitations of labels and languages, all games are a lot of conflicting and multiple things but for the sake of brevity we apply these labels and then argue profusely when a game starts going into a grey area and shifting away from one genre to another
It's all so tiresome, in the end it doesn't even mattress

I'd rather use "spacetits explorer" term, it suits the genre better

It's exploration platformer.

Luna nights

AHEM FUCK METROID AND FUCK CASTLEVANIA

SOTN ripped off Super Metroid

The PS2 games ripped off DmC

That mercurysteam reboot ripped off God of War

We've come full circle now because Bloodstained ripped off Castleroids

Talking about Iconoclasts...

I saw in a dev interview that there's a secret that he put into one of the spaceships that he doesn't think anyone found. I think I found it but was wondering if anyone else here had?

Agreed. I like originality so I'd rather play something that doesn't resemble another game. But that's why I like Metroidvanias, I suppose. Like Super Metroid doesn't play ANYTHING like La Mulana, yet they're both part of the same genre.

>The PS2 games ripped off DmC

how can the PS2 games rip off a game that didn't exist until the PS3?

Fuck you I don't remember which letters to capital. It's SotN but why care?

La Mulana is fantastic but some of the puzzles in 1 are impossible to figure out on your own. 2 is a lot better about it.

>Sounds like you need to play Hard mode.
I've got a game that's part way through hard mode, but I just kind of got fatigued out after playing it so much, I guess. Maybe when I really feel like playing it again, I'll continue on hard mode, but I'm not expecting it to make me love the game.

>Like Super Metroid doesn't play ANYTHING like La Mulana, yet they're both part of the same genre.
Here's some other food for thought, Shadow Of The Colossus and Mario are both technically platformers

Dawn of Sorrow
Castlevania Harmony of Despair (if that counts as
"metroidvania")

The only real difference is that in mario, you're generally not supposed to jump on bosses to kill them.

Shadow of the Brothers? Mario of the Colossus?

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Fine faggots, i'm reinstalling La mulana for the 3rd time
I'm gonna give it one last try without a guide

?

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Is Fusion even really a Metroidvania? It doesn't feel like it opens up to let you explore on your own until the very end and at that point there's nothing to do but run around and get a bunch of useless items (like a trillion power bomb tanks when you only really need like 2 for the entire game).