Including mods which one is better?

2 with or without mods. I could listen to Kreia all day

2 by a considerable margin.
1 only has HK-47 as a good character, the rest ranges from bad to mediocre. It is however great if you have a sub 100 IQ.

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Well, I've played KOTOR1 five times, without any mods.

I tried playing KOTOR2 with the missing content mod. But the pacing and UI were so terrible I just gave up. I should try it again, but now the thought of playing that starting area keeps me from even wanting to touch it.

I always romances handmaiden as a teenager. Replaying now I don’t know what I was thinking.

Canderous is rad as heck, and Jolee is pretty fun.

I tried to romance Handmaiden but never got enough influence with her perhaps. But Visas said she loved me at the end of the game

>To believe in an ideal is to be willing to betray it, it is something no Jedi or Sith has ever truly learned
What did she mean by this

problem is you can fuck yourself over if you don't get him first.

Theres a skip peragus mod

It's bugged IIRC. Had to do tremendous effort to make it work, and even then it only skips the space station part even though I consider Telos to be of the same tutorial stage.

Peragus is the best shit. There should be a skip Talos mod instead.

We had a great one yesterday but this one is not off to a great start. We'll see.

Talos? Telos.*

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Mandalore is straight up better and Kreia is leagues ahead of Jolee.
There isn't a comparison writing-wise that 2 doesn't win.

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Post something good to make it better then

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First pic is better by a large margin

You don't have to use your brain you fucking idiot, it's a Star Wars game. Are you a literal retard?

at least you admit to being a brainlet, nuStar wars should be right up your alley

Post more of these pics

t. brainlet

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”Permanent detention” sounds like something out of a bad children’s movie.

Again the first pic is better, second is way too edgy

This is your brain on Disney

2 is better even without restored content.

SWTOR

If you are convinced that what you believe is 'correct' or 'right' in all circumstances you should never fear to challenge it. Since the ideal s ultimately correct you will not be able to change or corrupt it. Hence you can test the strength of the ideal by 'betraying'it.

2 is much better in every way, and also patched to actually run fine on modern systems whereas 1 is a pain in the ass to get working.

1 is okay
2 is an unfinished masterpiece and still the best Star Wars game.

1 is comfier and therefore better

>Why have you approached me?

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The first one is better, 2 might have better writing but there is hardly any 99% of the game is combat and its quests are short and shallow as fuck

1
If you want to play planescape torment just play planescape torment they had no right to deconstruct Bioware's vision

2. It’s not even close. 1 is generic as fuck and has virtually no identity beyond winking at the camera saying “just like in the original trilogy LOL”

In 1 you have a team working together for a single goal like friends and in 2 everyone in your crew hates each other. That's why 1 feels comfier

I don't comprehend why 1 is despised by some of you. Half of you make it out to seem as if a star wars rpg not suppose to completely original.
Of course there going to borrow certain plotpoints from the og trilogy. It still manages to do alot of interesting stuff that we've never seen before.
Hell it gave the star wars universe alot more backstory and lore. The wookies and sand people for example.
Both games are great for there own reasons.

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I've played KOTOR a bunch of times. But I figured out pretty early on that I like it because it feels like what Star Wars should be. At a time when the prequels and Disney shit is ruining it. Good music, good characters (except Bastila and Carth) and just mindless adventure. KOTOR2 didn't give this feeling for some reason. So I never finished it.

I think that's fair. 2 is the better game in my opinion, but it tried to transcend star wars, which is bound to divide opinion, while 1 was happy to be as star wars as possible

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I like 2 more because
>more skills, options in combat, balancing
>more open ended character backstory
>cooler companions
>characters have specific motivations
>more options in dialogue
>turning companions into force users
>planets aren’t all boring like in 1
>better looking weapons and armor (moddable for both games I guess)
Overall the only major downside of 2 is that the end of the game is really rushed and ends abruptly.

So, what game exactly is supposed to showcase Bioware's "good writing"? Because KOTOR1, BG1 and DAO haven't really done it for me.

1. The worlds are so much more interesting in 1. Korriban alone makes it great

People who claim Bioware has good writing are just people who think dialogue options are "deep." If anything, Bioware games are loved because they don't try to be too deep. Obsidian are the ones who try to make things deeper, which is why KOTOR 2 has a mixed opinion.

They don't have good writing when it comes to overall plot or anything like that. They have good writing in the sense that going around talking to people and having dialogues with characters is done well and is usually at least somewhat interesting.
Nobody claims their writing is deep or meaningful or anything like that (or if they do it's just because they're idiots).
Obsidian does more interesting and unusual things with their writing, but they also tend to screw up on more basic things like the overall structure and tempo of the plot. That might just be because their games were so often rushed out and butchered, though.

>tfw no Kreia mommy

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>balancing
You can't be serious about this part, surely?

it's not good writing as much as good storytelling, pacing, presentation etc. they know (knew) how to present their middling-to-decent writing in the context of a game to make the story clear and engaging, and more importantly to make people care about the characters.

good b8 user

>balancing
I remember a dark side Sith Master playthough where I could just crush everything with no effort.
Quite often I'd have a fight in a room, then move to the next room only to find I already killed everyone in it though a closed door.

bump

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I probably like 2 better overall but I still like 1. Together they make a great contrasting package.

2 w/ restoration patch > 1 w/ restoration patch > 1 vanilla > 2 vanilla

1 is better, because it's a space opera adventure that's fun and satisfying. 2 seems determined to shit on all that, and it left me feeling empty and apathetic. 2 is also worse in terms of gameplay, because its companion AI is completely fucked and will ignore all of your queued commands.

"I think torture and slavery are wrong. The best way for me to demonstrate this belief is to torture and enslave people."

Makes no fucking sense.

Is two was given the same polish that one had I believe it would have been the better game. Both are great in my book though. I’ve put more hours into two myself.

>Second is far more serious and mature
No, it's just more negative and nihilistic. Not the same thing.

2

Note: They are both great.

I wish Handmaiden's default clothing had some stats, like Atton and Mira's jackets. It looks cool but immediately gets replaced.

Her mother's robe is alright but not as good as her default outfit and the stats aren't a good fit (+2 charisma for a pure brawler?)

>that pic
You do know that the guy in KOTOR 1 is an insane old man who used to run a school, right? That kind of dialogue makes sense for the character.

To engage in echani courtship rituals

Welcome to mature writing

2nd one is best but they're both lit.

2 because it has a sense of mystery. 1 just felt like a standard space adventure

2 was my first
>WRPG
>Obsidian game
>Game with a plot

I'm blinded by nostalgia so probably nothing will beat 2 in my mind.

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>Take off your clothes and let us begin, user

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Obviously 2 has the cut content mod, but is there anything worth mentioning for 1?

>is there anything worth mentioning for 1?
Carth memes?

Maybe if you divorce it from the reality that not even insane people talk like that, then sure.

I'm somewhat glad KOTOR 2 came out before it became fashionable for every RPG character to be bisexual so my Jesus Jedi could have good banter with Atton without having to worry about accidentally going down a gay conversation tree

>options in combat
Too bad you can't use them to their full effect, due to the AI overriding your decisions the instant you switch to another character. Of course, that doesn't turn out to be much of a problem, because...

>balancing
The combat is easy as hell. You need to compensate for the shitty AI by crafting overpowered weapons, but once you do that, you're in basically no danger.

>more open ended character backstory
Really? To me, it felt more like my character had an extensive, pre-established backstory, and I was being asked to decide how I felt about it without being given enough information to do so. The first encounter with Atris is a great example. The characters have a history with each other, but I don't know any of it, so I can't really make a decision about what I want to say about it.

>more options in dialogue
Most of which are just different ways of saying the exact same thing and elicit the same responses as the other options.

>turning companions into force users
To be honest, I thought that felt a bit contrived. It would be okay if maybe one or two of your companions was secretly Force-sensitive or something, but having half your party be like that felt artificial.

Best thing about 1 is that it led to 2 being made.

Similarly the best thing about Fallout 3 is that it laid the groundwork for New Vegas.

New Vegas would have been better as an isometric game.

The charisma bonus is to help her low foce stats when she goes Jedi

>killed everyone in it though a closed door.
Why would you tell lies, Mr Lounds?

KOTOR 1 had better, more likeable characters and the levels were better i'd say.

KOTOR 2 SUPPOSEDLY had better writing... it was one of those "truly, what is good, what is evil?" sort of storylines if i remember correctly, but i found most of the characters unlikeable and stoic and the levels, even though they were much larger than 1's, felt less enjoyable to explore. KOTOR 2 did improve on some things from the first, but you probably wouldn't notice due to how many bugs kotor 2 actually had.

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Kotor 1 was an absolute joke if you focused on melee or the force, while also being a bitch if you focus on ranged or a skill monkey.
TSL is also piss easy, but it does at least mean you can diversify and finish the game with any build you feel like.

It’s not like that’s enough to matter though.

Why the fuck do people meme about the RCM being such an important part of the game being playable? Beyond Malachor V, there's very little it adds and most of that is unpolished shit that should've stayed out like the shoot-out ending on Nar Shaddaa or the endless HK-50's that attack you.

Also what the fuck is 1's restoration patch? Why would 2 as vanilla be so poor when RCM adds so little in the end?

Great, except it's worthless.

Charisma (for companions at least) only increases the difficulty class/damage of your offensive force powers. Problem is, her base charisma and wisdom are so shit that even with a 2+ bonus, every enemy is going to pass their saves every single time, and the damage will be weak shit anyway.

The only force powers Handmaiden should be using are those that buff herself or her allies, so she can be better at carving shit with lightsabers. These powers don't scale with charisma, at all. Force points is linked to wisdom and not charisma, so you don't even get to cast more often.

Charisma is completely wasted on Handmaiden. The robe's only other bonus is a weak 3 defense stat. She's best in one of the (ugly) jedi armors that allow force powers.

I mean in terms of mods for 1. Not 1's existence I'm general.

>reality
We're still talking about Star Wars, right? You know, the saga that has Yoda and stuff?

>*Overloads power conduit in your vicinity*
Where's your God now?

going from 14-16 is a pretty useful bonus

>Problem is, her base charisma and wisdom are so shit
She starts with 14 charisma. The 10 wisdom can be worked around via skill, buffs or crystals

Someone can give me a rundown about KOTOR2 mods?

peragus is actually pretty easy to blitz through. Telos is a fucking drag though.

>bought KOTOR 2 in the summer sale for nostalgia
>rolled a twin pistol packing jedi consular
>do Nar Shaddaa first
>by the end of Nar Shaddaa I'm level 18 (3rd level jedi watchman) with top tier scope/cell/chambers in both my mandalorian blasters, have Kreia force storming the fuck out of everything buffed by her lightsaber of many +wisdom crystals, and Atton hitting 60+ regular non-crit sneak attack shots on everyone I cast stasis field on, which is everyone
>by the end of the first planet

I remember the game being harder somehow.

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I should load up one of original saves from years ago and see what mess of a character I built for a giggle.

based.
being first person 3D with hub areas a la fallout 1&2 would have been dope.

anyway, i just picked up kotor2 and jedi academy on sale because of this thread. i have kotor1, i'll play them all this fall/winter. that's my rpg season
i'll also need shit to pass the time until outer worlds comes to steam kek

I like 2 better but it isn't half as good as Yea Forums says it is.
>extremely slow start
>combat is mediocre at best
>locked out of content unless you force yourself to be a dick or white knight
>Nihilus is a contender for the most disappointing bossfight
>ending is rushed
>ending would be shit even if it wasn't rushed because
>Kreia is a nonsensical character

But retards will defend it because muh mature writing.

You're right, it was through a fucking wall. The point was all doors to the room were closed though.

Correct me if I'm wrong but there isn't an offensive force spell that works through walls, especially ones that are completely closed off with the help of doors.

I'll agree. It feels like Obsidian didn't have a clue how they were going to end it.
The battle of Telos was the crescendo and everything after it felt like faffing about.

Both have their ups and downs. I like Taris because you're building up for that Starkiller tournament at the end. Could definitely do without the lower level junk. Pegasus just feels like a long tutorial. If you've already played KOTOR 1, you already know all the things it's going to show you. It's probably good for people who never played KOTOR 1 and need examples of all the game mechanics.

>Kreia is a nonsensical character
Brainlet

Force storm and death field can both go through walls.
They're not suppose to, but they can in a few spots.

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>extremely slow start
Peragus is one of the coolest parts of the game.

Considering 2 is actually playable on modern PCs, I find myself replaying it a lot more.

Also the PC dialogue is dog shit in 1.
2 also has more memorable quests and side characters.

The only things I really like in 1 is the Sith Academy's triple cross or redeeming that Twi'lek, and the Sith/Jedi intrigue on Manaan - especially Jolee's buddy's trial.

I also wished 2 fleshed the regular Sith mooks out more, the non force users. The Sith mooks in 1 are part of a government, but the Sith troopers in 2 look out of place.

wow, this board really is filled with brainlet retards

Peragus is better than Telos.

Telos suffers from one of the main problems of KOTOR which is the SLOW traveling around. Fuck me, Manaan diving suit areas felt physically painful to go through. I actually laughed in KOTOR2 when they sped the fuck out of the animation for the spacesuit parts.

post cute Kreias

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yeah that always makes me laugh.

Retarded dialogue and voice direction might be canon but that doesn't mean it makes sense or is good.

You do that exactly and see what happens. If you are succesful you will learn that tyranny and ruthlessness can command great respect and power. You will learn that even if morally questionable the act of dominating others can benefit you greatly and help you achieve greater heights.

Or you will also experience disaster as the tyranny you have created will atttact attention of other stronger powers than you. Or you will see riots, the people you dominate will go against you and bring pain and demise.

So in all outcomes you have challanged your beliefs and learned about its advantages and disadvantages. The jedi and sith do not do that, this is why Kreia is disgusted with the idea that adhering to certain principles and morals means that you stop evolving as a person and civilization. The sith could learn to work in harmony like the jedi and conquer the galaxy easily instead of being at each other's throat. The jedi could learn that action can lead to great prevention of loss and help gain trust of the galaxy. But no, both sides are fanatics, they are extremists hence, Kreia hates them.

had more FUN in kotor 1 but kotor 2 is a lot better

>You do that exactly and see what happens. If you are succesful you will learn that tyranny and ruthlessness can command great respect and power. You will learn that even if morally questionable the act of dominating others can benefit you greatly and help you achieve greater heights.
>Or you will also experience disaster as the tyranny you have created will atttact attention of other stronger powers than you. Or you will see riots, the people you dominate will go against you and bring pain and demise.
>So in all outcomes you have challanged your beliefs and learned about its advantages and disadvantages.
And all it cost was the misery and suffering of countless innocent people. What a noble pursuit.

>The sith could learn to work in harmony like the jedi and conquer the galaxy easily instead of being at each other's throat.
The kind of people who like to work in harmony also tend to be the kind of people who don't want to conquer others. The conquerer's mindset is inherently self-serving.

youtube.com/watch?v=rf_yI6tvMfg

Well thought out.

sex?!

>RONDA DEE HODONGA
What did he mean by this?

>Kreia's VA is at the perfect age for playing her in a live-action adaptation of KotOR2
>Disney will definitely fuck it up

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2 is better. Only people who think Star Wars shouldn't be good disagree.

>And all it cost was the misery and suffering of countless innocent people. What a noble pursuit.

It is not about being noble. It is about learning and evolving. For example, from your answers I can see that you lean on the more moral and noble side of things. So let's say that you lead your people with great moral principles but another nation who is expanding their territory comes down upon you with thousands of slaves at their disposal that they have amassed. When you are crushed beneath their feet will you be able to pursue your noble goals of equality and help your people live better lives? Or let's speak about it more generally, who can deny that slavery helped build the greatest civilisations of the world? All those great works of art, machines of war, immense construction projects all depended on slavery. The great Roman empire, Ottoman empire, USA, British empire greatly benefited from slavery. So much so in fact that their people still enjoy leisurely lives and superb abundance when compared to other countries. Now they can pursue whatever noble goals they have in mind.

I don't want to go off topic too much, Kreia is just saying that had the jedi the guts to act when and project power in time of need instead of hanging on to their principles as a matter of tradition they would not have been destroyed. Had the sith the ability to plan, act, manipulate and deceive others (instead of each other) they would have always been in power. They needed to learn from each other to achieve true peace and harmony. They could have been freed from the destiny that the force casts upon them.

>The kind of people who like to work in harmony also tend to be the kind of people who don't want to conquer others.

This I did not understand at all. How do you think government agencies, armies, terrorist organizations work? They work jn harmony to destroy or control others.

I can never understand how BM got just pretty much irrelevant in 2.
>but Onderon!
Yeah, and that's it. Weird.

i played both for the first time when i was 19
2 by far. 1 is so childish and retarded it was actually somewhat painful how telegraphed the "twist" was.

No, you’re just retarded.

>To be honest, I thought that felt a bit contrived. It would be okay if maybe one or two of your companions was secretly Force-sensitive or something, but having half your party be like that felt artificial.
See "Force Bonds". Also: Kreia's dialogue.

>likeable
>unlikeable
Brainlet buzzwords

kotor 1 is better and the story and locations are way better than 2
doesn't mean 2 is bad though. i actually just finished 2 yesterday but the ending is a bit shit but that's EA's fault not obsidian because it was planned to have a part 2 where you follow revan to fight dark sith lords in the galaxy.

>Force points is linked to wisdom and not charisma, so you don't even get to cast more often.
Charisma attribute bonus reduces penalty for using "opposing" powers, though.

>But retards will defend it because muh mature writing.
Stopped reading here

>I remember the game being harder somehow.
Master/Lord trivially stun-locks everything to death with Wave, for starter. And still has about 600 FP to spare.

>>locked out of content unless you force yourself to be a dick or white knight
If you believe RPGs are a one and done deal you will have to reconsider or stop wasting your time on a genre that is simply not meant for you.

about to play kotor 1, what are the best mods?

>turning companions into force users
To be honest, I thought that felt a bit contrived. It would be okay if maybe one or two of your companions was secretly Force-sensitive or something, but having half your party be like that felt artificial.

That is a huge part of the story though. Your companions don't 'happen to be' force sensitive you pull those people to you constantly. You are a breach, like a whirlpool in an ocean made up of the force. These people have no choice but to come to you even if they do not know it. Just like you do not know you are being pulled to Malachor V.

1 is better. It's a classic Star Wars story while 2 is something that doesn't really resemble Star Wars, aside from the lightsabers. It's also unfinished. But let's look at the "great" characters, shall we.
>Kreia chastises you no matter what you fucking do. She is supposed to have an ideology, but in the end besides the overly complex dialogue she is the most shallow character in the game.
>Atton - basically Han Solo. The generic wise guy that uses jokes to mask his emotions buried deep inside
>Hanharr - evil... just because.
>Bao-Dur - ASMR artist.
>Nihilus - just consume planets, bro. Quite honestly even MCU villains have more depth than him
>Sion - hate somehow keeps him alive. In the end we learn that he somehow loves the MC. Why? No idea. None of the shit he does in game make any sense.

The dialogue is deeper but way smaller in comparison to 1. You have a very expansive dialogue with each of your companions and enemies in 1. In 2, i got the feel like you only have 2 dialogue pop ups in the entire game with each companion except Kreia.

I think people here like KOTOR 2 more than 1 in order to be contrarian or simply because it's "different".

General Vaklu did nothing wrong.

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I'd agree if he didn't get played by the sith like an idiot.

Why does Avellone draw such a crowd of haters?

Movement Animation Fix for both KOTOR and TSL
Xor plot fix
Bastila's Extra Dialog on Tatooine
Garrum and Tar'eelok Restoration
Sharina Fizark Restoration
Taris_lower_city_restoration

There might be others, I just the game with added or even replaced files archived and extract it when needed.

>Jedi have all kinds of variance amongst their ranks
>Sith are all murderous sociopaths who will kill each other with no hesitation, none of them are ever level-headed and pragmatic like Dooku
Why

>I think people here like KOTOR 2 more than 1 in order to be contrarian or simply because it's "different".

Holy shit bros.. we were found out. You are right my friend we have these threads about this game that was RELEASED 15 YEARS AGO in order to be contrarian, not because we like it or it resonated with a niche playerbase oh no, sir.

>Atton - basically Han Solo. The generic wise guy that uses jokes to mask his emotions buried deep inside.

You could have just told us that you didn't play the game. It would have been easier.

>>Sion - hate somehow keeps him alive. In the end we learn that he somehow loves the MC.
Because you play as girls, faggot.

Both games are masterpieces, but with all bugfixing/content restoring/graphic enchantments/gameplay improvement mods the story of KoTOR II edges out. Without mods it's easily KoTOR I due to being much more polished and the fact that you play as the BVLL of the universe instead of a emo revan's fangirl canonically in KoTOR II.

Quite the contrary, I never play as women in a video game, I find that stupid as hell. Only one time I played a game with a female version and that was precisely KOTOR II, and it came across as very jarring and stupid.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely, I guess. Also Ajunta Pall was okay.

Who is her VA anyways? She did a stellar fuckin job

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I sure as hope you are not implying that Kreia is a Sith right?

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You're arguing against the hive mind, no good will ever come of this.

That said, I liked Kotor 2 influence system, though there is no way to see the values in-game. Character interactions were a stepdown from the first game. At least in 1 every character would give you some tidbits about a planet you're on. The interactions with companions on the planets felt unfinished. Crafting and enchanting were improved. New outfits were cool as fuck. The story is a bit better than 1.
The atrocious castrated dnd combat drags both games down and the only thing that is really terrible in both games.

Which games do you like and which opinions do you have about them so I can go into respective discussions and claim that those who agree with you are part of a hivemind?

And Darth Marr

Where does the meme about Kotor1 being true to star wars core comes from? It's TFA of old canon, it simply copies OT and TPM and is devoid of any philosophical parts. It's like the worst parts of prequels, mindless action with no meaning. Meanwhile kotor 2 is Episode V taken and expanded, it consist mostly of philosophical lessons, debates, character relations and questions about nature of the force.

Kreia doesn't chastises you all the time, it's easy to gain her approval. There is nothing shallow about her. She is bitter old woman angry that Jedi and Sith fucked her over and she is desperate to prove them both wrong, while trying to teach you to be a smart force user not dependent on the Force

Atton is nothing like Han Solo. Han Solo wasn't former Jedi Hunter tasked with torturing them and either breaking them to become dark Jedi or die and riddled with guilt over this.

Hanharr is a beast and play on the wookies, not one of the main characters. His role of being with broken mind that twisted his perception of wookie culture because of trauma he got during slaver raids is perfectly fine for side character that is meant to be a lesson for protagonist.

Bao Dur is loyal soldier riddled with guilt over creation and use of Nuke and acting in war like the very thing he despises and swore to defend people from - Mandalorians.

Sion is failed student of Kreia, obsessed with gaining her attention and seeking her appreciation while being envious that she directs her interest towards you and not him. He is furious that he can't satisfy her and complete his training in her eyes. He says that he can't stop thinking about femExile because she reminds him of Kreia he is obsessed with and good feelings will literally kill him. You need to convince him that his life is pointless while being so dependent on force that he can't enjoy it or be free. So you try to help him find peace.

The gameplay and story is more interesting. K2 even improves K1 characters.

Both have their charms, but the unfinished ending in 2 (even with the mod) disappointed me. Used a mod to play as a femtwi'lek in 2, was cool if you ignored the frequent references to the Exile being human. Should I do a male exile playthrough? The comics are great

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Man I forgot about the femExile/Sion dynamic. I don’t play female often enough in this game

>She is bitter old woman angry that Jedi and Sith fucked her over and she is desperate to prove them both wrong, while trying to teach you to be a smart force user not dependent on the Force
You kinda missed the point. The organisations are secondary at best for her, she hates the Force itself. At least as long as we discard the hastily stitched together ending.

She clearly wanted to prove that she was right and they are wrong, which is why she gets so angry when you simply kill them. She hates the Force but can't kill it. At best she could teach you how to not be a slave to it.

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Post underrated kino
youtube.com/watch?v=x_Onexl9ji0&t=0m40s

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I'm butthurt because we will never get anything like either of them again.

>The comics are great
t. Alek, your waifu isn't even in 3d.

fuck off Canderous, I need to see them tiddies

Yes, but wrong about what, specifically. Jedi believe the Force is about making the world a better place through self-sacrifice and all other stuff. Sith believe it is a road to power that rewards the strong while using the weak as fuel for that reward. She believes they are all retarded for using it at all. I don't think she was very rational there, in the DS version. She just wanted revenge and a "told you so" moment.

I can't understand why Mass Effect and Kotor are the only space crpgs. There is shitton of fantasy ones, a nice bunch of post apo and cyberpunk, but next to nothing in space. Even new Obsidian crpg seems like Fallout postapo, and it all being in space feels like only existing to not be straight !notFallout.

There is that The Ur-Quan Masters but it's hardly a normal crpg.

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>Where does the meme about Kotor1 being true to star wars core comes from?
Because KotOR 1 is designed in a very similar way of the OT. A story of good vs evil, Jedi rising up to battle the Sith.

It ends it an award ceremony purposely shot very similar to ANH as a homage. Not like TFA though which is a mindless retread of the story exactly, KotOR 1 simply carries the same themes.

>mostly of philosophical lessons,
And you just hit why KotOR 1 is more Star Wars like then KotOR2. Star Wars has NEVER been about philosophy. It has always been a story of good vs evil. Im not even trying to say that KotOR2 is bad, but KotOR 1 is a game that feels like it belongs in the Star Wars setting. Remove SW from the title and a person would easily say "man this could be a SW game." Do the same with KotOR2 and you would not get that response.

>story is more interesting.
Thats opinion based. I would much rather have a story about a soldier stepping up to try and save the weak from a seemingly impossible threat (even if cliche) then to travel during a time of peace around the galaxy to ask a few people some questions that I dont even care about the answers too in the first place.

In fact, of the characters you mentioned, the only one I didnt utterly hate (for one reason or another)was BaoDur. Im not saying KotOR1 companions were amazing. To make it clear im not the guy you replied too, though I agree with him.

>travel during a time of peace around the galaxy
You learn it's in no way, shape or for the time of peace on fucking Peragus.

>to ask a few people some questions that I dont even care about the answers too in the first place.
So it's not interesting why a particular Jedi is so unique to survive being cut off from the thing that flows through every living thing in the known Universe and binds them together?

The art direction in both games was fantastic, it still looks good this many years later.

youtube.com/watch?v=8VvS5MLnG0Y&t=5m13s
That they deemed her and her philosophy as a failure and thought her stupid. She wanted them to admit that she wasn't stupid and they were stupid instead.

The Force isn't gonna make the world a better place when the jedi just sit on their asses, preaching garbage that turns people into murderous lunatics. The Sith, in turn, surrender all sense to chase after power - so they just end up slaughtering each other like retards.

It boggles my mind how people can prefer the first games companions. Everyone is completely one dimensional and dull. T3-M4 has a complete void of personality which was shocking to realize when replaying both because it’s so full of character in the second game.

Yeah, seems like we're saying pretty much the same thing with some disappearingly slim nuance in-between.

And I never said that I believe the Council picking their noses while Mandalorians rip-n-teared was the right thing to do. Wasn't the wrong thing either, though, as it turned out.

>You learn it's in no way, shape or for the time of peace on fucking Peragus.
There is not a galactic war going on. Compared to KotOR1, KotOR2 is very much a time of peace.

> particular Jedi is so unique to survive being cut off
Not even remotely because they already told you the answer by the end of Telos. You cut yourself off from the force to survive the backlash of Malacor making the character just like every other non-force user. So why do I need to bring the Jedi Council members together for an answer I already know the answer to. Even if I didnt know, why should my character care? If it didnt bother her to know the answer years ago then why would she suddenly just now want to know the answer?

Its not that the companions of the first game are well written, as much as I hate the companions of the 2nd game.

I legitemy hated Atton and Kreia.
Mira and the wookiee I had no interactions with (because Im an idiot and always did Nar Shaddaa last so I never gave them a chance.)
BarDor and the Disiple are kind of weak.
Handmadien and Visas were good.
The Droids and Canderous are repeats and dont count.

Meanwhile in the first game, the only character I disliked was T3. Even Carth I liked (though I agree he was whinny as fuck, I liked his backstory)

While it boggles my mind that you could dislike Atton and Kreia, I take offense to one thing
>The Droids and Canderous are repeats and dont count.
Absolutely untrue. They are so much better in 2 that they might as well be new characters. T3-M4 has the most improvement, going from a silent droid to a mastermind keeping your party together in the shadows. Canderous was obnoxious in the first game and was much more interesting as a powerful leader of his people. HK-47 is the less improved since he was one of the best in 1, though I do think I found him funnier in 2.

Also G0-T0 is original, and very underrated since no one takes him due to his abysmal combat ability.

>Not even remotely because they already told you the answer by the end of Telos. You cut yourself off from the force to survive the backlash of Malacor making the character just like every other non-force user.
But not why you are still alive. It shouldn't be possible.
Also if you cut yourself off why you are regaining your connection?

>So why do I need to bring the Jedi Council members together for an answer I already know the answer to.
Because the reason they cast you out is absolutely not explained, even in the recording. Yet they are obviously distressed or afraid.

>Even if I didnt know, why should my character care? If it didnt bother her to know the answer years ago then why would she suddenly just now want to know the answer?
Because she thought it was simply punishment for disobeying the orders. Now she knows there is something very, very wrong with her.

>Because KotOR 1 is designed in a very similar way of the OT. A story of good vs evil, Jedi rising up to battle the Sith.
People are overblowing simplicity of stories like Lotr and OT. Just because you can have good characters and evil characters it doesn't mean that everything has to be so utterly generic and bland. Neither Star Wars nor Lotr are so painfully simple either. Exile goes through similar arc like Luke, in both cases teachers were good while student were right and Exile has still to stop pure Evil while he is clearly good. It's just all more interesting instead of being generic.

>And you just hit why KotOR 1 is more Star Wars like then KotOR2. Star Wars has NEVER been about philosophy
But it was. Luke's training under Yoda, Cave on Dagobah, all those lessons from Ben, throne room duel and tempting, those are the best parts of OT that make it so amazing. And similarly talking about Echoes, Mandalorian Wars and Jedi Civil War lore, Force itself, Wound in the Force, Jedi and Sith worldview, it's all what's so damn fascinating about Kotor 2. I have nothing like this in Kotor 1 which is why I was so disappointed in it when I finally playing after hearing how good it is.

I on other hand can hardly like any Kotor 1 companions. They felt so artificial and like they don't have a reason to follow you after you are done with their mission. In Kotor 2 all companions have a goal that binds them to you for entire game. Visas is tied to Nihilus and important to his defeat, Mandalore has to unite clans for Revan and protect you, Mical is a spy, Atton is blackmailed and is secretly seeking absolution, Bao Dur feels like he needs to finally do something right in the world etc. Meanwhile Mission goes because her wookie goes and has nothing better to do, wookie will follow you simply because of his debt, Hk-47 doesn't have a goal, T3-M4 could disappear after Taris etc. They all feel like they follow you because it's simply a game that needs companions.

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>And similarly talking about Echoes, Mandalorian Wars and Jedi Civil War lore, Force itself, Wound in the Force, Jedi and Sith worldview, it's all what's so damn fascinating about Kotor 2.
Korriban.

1 has the better DS companions, 2 has the better LS companions

I'm about to end this debate forever
If you want a regular, OT like adventure, 1.
If you want a philosophical and a thought-provoking Star Wars, 2.
Even though they're both SW, the games are entirely different in tone and theme. You can barely compare them. It would be like comparing Breaking Bad to Seinfeld.

jedi academy

Isn't Mission kinda bad no matter what? Also I can't imagine the furball being happy with DS.
Jolee outright fights you to death if you fall. And HK-47 is not only also in TSL, but even a bit better.

Aside from some Old Sith lore you had in tombs it was made so you could be disguised as dark Harry Potter in dark Hogwart. I do not remember anything as interesting from here like Kotor 2, only jokes. It was entertaining to fuck over sith though, especially if you already discovered that you are Revan and unlocked additional dialogue options because of this.

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>Kreia is a nonsensical character
You've failed to understand why people like it so it's no surprise you think this way.

Hanharr’s twisted view on life debts was great, what did 1 have for DS companions that 2 didn’t?

youtube.com/watch?v=aVgI2pe4HkY

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I meant that you forgot TSL's Korriban that explored several themes, like desperate fools clinging to their delusions of glory and piling layers upon layers of ruins in vain hope of building the next Galaxy-spanning empire. Or how futile attempts to grab dat ultimate powah inevitably lead to utter and complete failure for everyone involved and a lot of those not involved. Or how even those who seemingly managed to achieve the goal are living in a barren, deteriorating prison (because they rely on it's diseased energy for very survival) and call it a kingdom. Something like that.
But Korriban in 1 was pretty good, just the lessons were of narrower scope or, more rarely, not as obvious.

>Not even remotely because they already told you the answer by the end of Telos.

I believe you are referring to the scene where the Ithorian priest is talking about you to his assistant after you've helped him deal with Czerka, before you depart for the shuttle.

Your character isn't present for that conversation.

It's funny that Kreia, who dismissed Chodo's wisdom, comes to the same grand revelation only much, much later.

What's the appeal? She shows up, tries to shank you, Avellone forces you accept his waifu and she goes to not-die against big succ. She just seems like the galaxy's biggest jobber of an assassin. And if any of you are fanboying her solely because of lips or tits, then hit up paheal or sadpanda and jerk it already

Meant for

With and without mods 2 is better.

>Visas said she loved me at the end of the game
bruh, the first thing she says is "My life for yours". She's in love with you from the start

>Absolutely untrue.
They are more advance versions of the originals but are still the same character in the end, just more mature. When someone says "I prefer KotOR1 characters" they are (at least I am assuming) factoring those characters out because they are repeat characters.

And I always forget about G0-T0. I found him somewhat interesting.

>But not why you are still alive. It shouldn't be possible.
Its not the first time people lose their connection to the Force in Legends and it wouldnt be the last time. So this wasnt a big deal to me because its not that big of a deal. new and old canon its a thing. Hell its not even the first time in KotOR its happened

>regaining your connection
A decent question but again, the game answers that before you even come up with the plan to track them down. You being around other Force users restarts your powers (in a way)

>Now she knows there is something very, very wrong with her.
Ok Im trying to recall my feelings when I was playing a game and Im sorry Im drawing a blank so I wont be able to carry on this discussion.

I simply remember it (last played 2-3 years ago?) that I personally did not find there was anything wrong with my character. Any questions I had were already answered by Kreia or the recording, so I had absolutely 0 drive to track down the Jedi Masters. There was simply no reason for me to do it beyond that is the point of the game. Compared to KotOR 1 where I found the cliche, good vs evil story, a strong enough drive for me to continue.

It was like that in my first playthrough also over a decade ago.

Take your bias against her and put it in some securely sealed, inaccessible place, then play the game again and actually listen to what she says. Even what fucking Kreia says. Even what "Atton" says, as weird as it may sound. It would just take a comparable amount of time to explain what her character is about, I'm afraid.

Confirmed for never talking to Hanharr. I bet you never learned the lesson of strength either.

Actual serious lore question: Do you think Handmaiden shaved her pubic hair?

Two by far. I'm replaying both back to back and currently am about 2/3rds of the way through kotor 2.
It's not even a contest. Kotor 1 is boring as fuck and was an absolute slog to get through. If I'm gonna play babby's first RPG then I at least want it to have interesting things happening.

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naturally

She seems like a trim kinda girl

kotor 2 is pst for millennials

rule34.xxx/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=645760

2 might be better written and the few character that didn't get shafted are more interesting, but all in all 1 is just more entertaining.

Kotor 1 was a complete game with a wonderful story. Also the philosophical questions that rised from the twist of the MC being a former Sith Lord were great.
K2 had the potential to be a much deeper game but it was so rushed that even with the restored content it feels like an empty game, it's a shame.

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If you paid attention to the circumstances that brought her to you, you would understand why she tried to kill you. If you paid attention to her when you bested her in the fight for your life, she sees your strength and loves it so much she wants to fight by your side. That is awesome.

2 is the superior story.
1 is alot of fun though.

I actually think 1 has the more "fun" characters.
Kreia isn't "fun", she's a plot device to deconstruct the star wars setting. She's a fantastic character, but she isn't "fun".
Everyone else in 2, other than HK is kinda "meh" imo, just less interesting overall imo (although I really did enjoy breaking Hanharr).
As others have said, 1 is a star wars story, 2 is much heavier content, and the levels and pacing play to that end. Everything in 2 is there to service the story, and in 1 everything is there to be your playground.
They're both solid games, but as I said above, I prefer 2 because stories are timeless, but while gameplay can get stale.

KOTOR 1 = Bloomer
KOTOR 2 = Doomer

TOR = Nigger

I can see where you're coming from, but I personally thought Atton is a blast. If only for his early antics with femExile. And Bao-Dur is unintentionally hilarious.

Sometimes I forget people like you exist, thank you for reminding me this.

Give me a break. Kotor 2 came out only 5 years after planescape.

"Atton" has some depth but very quickly peters out and it's "Soulless query: Wanna play pazaak?"

Truth

I actually liked large portions of TOR
All the expansions are dogshit though

Oh yeah I forgot about that one... Hard to remember it sometimes.

I agree, at least the expansions gave us a cutie sith waifu

Lana a shit

Should I play SWTOR or replay KotOR 2?

Do KOTOR 2 and try to be as much of a dick to everyone that you possible can.

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I already did that. Actually I have never played on the light side and if I'm going back to kotor, I would probably play dark side again.

A rare case when brainless and the mentally challenged flag their opinions as such for our convenience.

Just bought both. Anyone got a list of essential mods?

for kotor 2 get widescreen fix and restored content

>for kotor 2 get widescreen fix
W-Wait, isn't that fixed by default now?

2 is by far the superior product. By virtue of characters alone, it is better. Mission vao, wookiee something, canderous, carth are all shit versions of their counterparts in 2

>carth is whiny and squeaky clean and has no real conflict. I am supposed to belief he is a fiersome hero of the republic but then he opens his mouth
>Atton is infinitely more nuanced than carth and has an internal struggle that brings his past I to play in a way I never expected from a quirky sidekick

>canderous is a generic tough guy action hero with crew cut who dont care about nothing but the job
>when he becomes Mandalore, he is a man fighting for the integrity of his people as well as following the age old tradition of being a hired gun and his spat with Kreia is really spot on writing

>Mission and her Wookiee, they are the squeaky clean Velma and Scooby of the gang, they are so straight laced that turning to the darkside instantly makes them hate you, whereas all characters in 2 learn to follow you and learn and grow as you do.
>mira and Hanharr are miles better with more compelling devil may care Mira and a believable savage killer in Hanharr, to the point I actually believed he was a Wookiee exile.

>jolee Bindo is pretty based but Juhani or whatever is a literal who
>Handmaiden is annoying but a good foil to you as she is the ideal student and you are exiled whilst Visas Marr is an introspective character with something to actually offer, if only a sob story. Miles better than Juhani

>the droids are based in both games
>but in 2 you get GoTo also. He has an interesting happy merchant arc with his finger in all your metaphorical pies

>Bastila is the only mentor in 1 and has no authority or command of the narrative or anything really to offer but textbook jedi shit
>Kreia is the single most based bitch in the galaxy and one of the best characters from a dialogue standpoint in vidya

Darth Nihilus seems like the only star wars character who is actually scary, other sith just seem like they try too hard to be edgy.

From the workshop page:
>This mod aims to fix all the stretching that occurs in widescreen (16:9) resolutions. Aspyr has already fixed the main HUD, but there are a lot of other elements in the game that are in need of correction, such as the pause menu, galaxy map, loading screens, etc.

Oh, gotcha. I thought some elements looked stretched, but most of the game looks fine.

I like both but I have to say the dialogue in 1 is cringy as fuck, the combats better in 1 though because in 2 you are basically a living God/spamming attacks that spam lock the enemy.

Also Carth is such an emo whiny cunt when Im replaying I cannot STAND him.

If you haven't played swtor you could give it a try. It's not great, but some of the class quests, especially sith warrior and imperial agent, are quite entertaining.

He is misunderstood as are most geniuses and big brain Chads. Every project he is on instantly gets some literary level dialogue and solid narrative structure. That guy must be a voracious reader or something cos I like to write fiction and I dont think could come close to the quality of some of his games.

The game brings out the worst of both sides, making the Sith a failure and the remnant Jedi also a failure to their own cause. I think they are unironically edgy because of this reason. They no longer apply their dark/light powers to a real purpose or goal, they are too absorbed in their ways.

To be honest. If you don't get reputation high enough with Atton he will just sit around in the cockpit refusing to talk for 90% of the game.

2 has a better story, debatably the best story in any star wars thing ever, but needs 1 for context, and ultimately has way less game to offer
1 is better but 2 is smarter, for whatever that's worth, but they work really well when looked together

Of the Triumvirate only the third, last member is truly to be feared.

>Star Wars has NEVER been about philosophy. It has always been a story of good vs evil.
Wut? That is literally philosophy. It has always been about ethics. From Ben's sacrifice and the clear allusions to Bush I do and buddhism in Ep 4 to the last battle with Vader and Luke where he is finally goaded into giving into his dark side and must resist, no action scene is just an action scene.

Luke constantly thinks he knows better and gets btfod on cloud city because a jolly old sword fight is not enough. There are countless times luke learned this, and if you didn't whilst following his journey you are a brainlet.

Essential for Kotor 2 are
steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=485537937
steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=485537937

Not essential but good to have
steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486006450

nice I think, though probably for second playthrough after you already finished it once
Kotor 1
deadlystream.com/files/file/335-pc-response-moderation/
deadlystream.com/files/file/558-kotor-1-restoration/

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I hate copying links from workshop, meant to post steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=639641660 instead of this same mod twice

What does everyone think of this analysis? Kreia always perplexed me so I watched this guy the other day.

youtube.com/watch?v=-Z0S0Z8lUTg