Was he "bad" from the start or Micah was the turning point?

Was he "bad" from the start or Micah was the turning point?

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You start the game with Arthur describing how Dutch went batshit on a woman for no reason during their botched heist, so yeah he was unraveling from the start.

He's the definition of 10 charisma 0 int

wasn't there a sequence in the guama act where he strangles an old woman because apparently he knew spanish and she was gonna betray him and arthur. lol. i think dutch just hates women.

Wasn't he crazy before Micah? I remember he was already saying some crazy shit at the first camp.

I had captions on, which was useful for seeing that French (?) guy in Saint Denis talk shit to Dutch right to his face. But I don't recall the old woman saying anything suspicious, by that point Dutch was just paranoid as fuck.

He tells Arthur he knew Spanish and she said something that implied she'd betray them and not even a minute later changes it to "I-It was because of her body language". I imagined that was what annoyed Arthur more then anything rather then Dutch killing her for pulling a knife.

It was all part of the plan. Have a little goddamn faith.

She wasnt going to betray either of them, she was some random idiot he paid the gold to escort but then he just murdered her and didnt even pick up the gold.

It wasnt covering costs and eliminating risk, it was bloodthirst. Dutch later on just went philosophical bullshitter to jsutify being a raider for fun. He wanted to kill, plunder and pillage, endlessly gaining wealth for the sake of it, not be tactical and end up on Tahiti or anything.

Nobody was above expendable for him. He shot his lover, betrayed everyone for a cocksucker rat who charmed him and ended up in RD1 as nothing but a psychopath who waltzes into a city to kill someone for pure fun, he doesnt even excuse it.

He was unbalanced, with Arthur and Hosiah acting as his moral compass
With Hosiah's death and Arthur becoming weak and detached, Dutch hinged on Micah who reaffirmed all of his shitty behavior. Also, he got thumped on the head pretty fucking badly

I recall him gathering up everyone in the first camp and making a speech, which was essentially the speech from the intro worded somewhat different and with him going off on a tangent about monkeys at the end. He does the same shit in chapter 6 and in the chapter 2 camp theres a note off to the side on a crate of him preparing one of those speeches.

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A GODDAMN

She wasn't going to betray them, she was just asking for the gold. Dutch just told Arthur that to appease him.

Hey that old lady was an absolute cunt. Got a gold fucking bar for payment and still asked for more.
She had it coming.

I feel like he had a loose grip on some instability until he took that blow to the head in the street car, he seemed to swan dive off the deep end at that point

Am I the only one who was disappointed with Micah bring the rat? It seemed far too obvious to be him, to the point they were it felt like they were trying to make him the obvious red herring and have it turn out to be John or some shit.

I had the same feeling but later on I thought about it and realised maybe I'm just way too used to media trying to subvert my expectations.

Based on his story about hating his parents and leaving them, he has always had a pathological aversion to authority and escaped after things coming to a head.

he was an idiot who thought he was smart, but actually was as naive and low iq as you'd expect out of any amerimutt

Whatever you say Dutch.

Micah spoke ill of dark people, he couldn't not be the bad guy.

True, but it just felt so obvious with how unlikeable they tried to make him, I was expecting him to be a cunt and he'd either bail or he would be genuinely loyal despite how unpleasant he was.

she stood at good grounds of betraying them since he had no more gold, dutch shut an open door. though he could've just knocked her out or something.

>"Arthur, listen to me..."
>"Shoure,"

This.

Also, we won't know about how Dutch really was until RDR3, where the wild wild west was now only the wild west.

Yeah he was sliding before blackwater I imagine, blackwater just kinda pushed shit over the edge.

>decide to replay the game
>walking past conversation between Hosea, Lenny and Tilly I never heard before
>Tilly talking about how when she dies she'd like her grave to have flowers and shit on it
>Hosea just simply wants to be buried with either friends or family, Lenny agrees with him
>Hosea notices Arthur and asks him what he'd want
>Arthur tries to be dismissive, saying "Nah, I don't care about that kind of nonsense."
>"Oh come on."
>"...Face me to the west. So I can, watch the setting sun, and remember all the fine times we had out that way."
>Charles happened to be walking past as he said it
That felt like way too much of a coincidence.

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Just one more job.

He had plenty of chances to actually make an honest living without mangoes in Tahiti. But he kept burning the bridges along the way.

>Arthor, listen to me
FTFY

I didn't ask for a fucking feels trip

>replay it
>Catch Dutch very clearly hitting on Mary Beth hard
>Camp scene where he calls over Mary Beth and Molly to talk about that faggot Millers book
>Molly obviously trying to get his attention, standing in front of Mary Beth until she moves to the other side of Dutch
>Molly tries to act really interested in the book because he keeps looking over at Mary Beth whenever he's talking to the two of them
>Scene later of her sperging out at him over him while he pretends not to know what the fuck she's talking about
>Later on see Micah ask to dance with Mary Beth only to get BTFO by her
Fucking kek.

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A little, but remember that he only became a rat after Guarma. Everything before that was him alone fucking up and supposedly not actively trying to sabatoge the group.

Dutch is such a fucking asshole.

I felt super sad sad for Molly this entire game.

I ended up forgetting about her like 70% of the game, even though I would always make the rounds and speak to everyone in the camp

youtu.be/g-VoPrtF7hA
youtu.be/y6ity2Lmr-k

The amount of conversations in camp that you can easily miss are insane. That youtube channel is great with putting them up though.

>That moment in camp when Micah talks shit to Charles and Charles bodies him
Made me appreciate Charles

were you retarded before or after rdr 2?

nah that old bitch was a jew
she got paid a fucking gold bar and wanted more
she deserved to die

Micah was such a fucking idiot, who in the right mind would talk shit to the two-hundred pound African-Injun man

He wasn't crazy before, just in denial

Theres another where he tells Javier to fuck off back to Mexico and gets fucking decked. Best part of Charles shitting on him is how desperately he tries to still act tough.
>W-WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING AT COWPOKE

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just one more bump Arthur

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micah was based

Y?

because

It was interesting how destroyed Charles was in the epilogue. Especially since he was one of the newer members.

He was already bad from the start. You learn this by reading some of the books and notes he keeps around. And because he murdered a pregnant woman out of mania back in blackwater. The bump on the head after the failed Saint Denis robbery was what made everything come out of him