"if u in west u can't be east :DDDDD"

>spam speech skill to 100 in under 10 levels
>end of game is achieved in a single dialogue option
shitty game, no other skill in the game let's you effortlessly win the game by being at 100

>I guess the power of 100 speech is so unbelievable that it can make a warlord forget how his army works.
pretty much exactly how 100 speech works

>dirt eating shit bandit tries to jump me, has killed for pairs of shoes his whole life
>HAND UR SHIT OVER
>[speech 100] Actually you should hand your shit over
>GOOD IDEA

There isn't a population to revolt in Legion territory, that's the point, you are either assimilated or killed.

EVERY former tribal in the Legion expresses their love for the Legion, the only people who would wish to revolt are those reduced to slaves, which in the Legion, are women or the infirm, the healthy men are soldiers that are trained to follow willingly.

Whereas the NCR has large swaths of people that hate them under their governance

That's the main basis of the argument between the Courier and Lanius, the Legion is not like the NCR, but at this moment Lanius seems to forget what he was arguing.

Guns.
Energy Weapons.
Barter.

>As you cross the river you extend your own supply lines, which are already shit tier, while shortening NCR's, which are only shit in the Mojave and quite good in California
>The Mojave is lacking all the quality tribes and easy resources your army is used to plundering and recruiting, taking the area will not replace the significant losses you've suffered and certainly wont sustain you moving into California
>Your whole army is here along the Colorado, with basically no one keeping peace in Arizona, how long do you really think it will be before someone notices you're gone and preoccupied and undermines what little infrastructure you have behind you

These are some bitch basic arguments and you still can't understand them. No oner this dialogue is a meme around here.

Who else is there?

As far as what has been established the only threats to the East are the isolationist Brotherhood, the BTFO Enclave, and possibly more tribals, none of which are an actual threat, unless the Legion abandons the territory entirely.

The biggest problem with a "peaceful" non-Legion ending is that the last time the Legate failed to take Vegas, despite being Caesar's best friend and co-founder of the Legion, he was lit on fire and thrown into the Grand Canyon. Why the F U C K would Lanius, or any other hypothetical Legate for that matter, surrender after that?

Because Caesar is dying, and his power is ended. Lanius can do whatever he wants. He's going to take Caesar's place.

well there's like 4-5 other speech checks you make to finally convince him. Not like it matters though, people like OP just want to shitpost.

>There isn't a population to revolt in Legion territory
>"Those living under the Legion's control are considered subjects, not members of the Legion proper. Lands under Caesar's protection enjoy stability and security far greater than lands outside its sphere of influence."

It's mentioned multiple times that the Legion will suffer a blood bath when Caesar dies. If Lanius wants to secure his position, he needs to control a strong and vigorous military machine. That's the argument - it's not about a third faction.

Courier’s basically arguing that what brought down Rome will bring down the Legion through the overextending of the borders and the military.

You have to remember two things. First, the Legion has to already manage and patrol a very large territory almost entirely by foot, and that territory doubles in size with NCR. Second, the Legion doesn’t really have a successor government after Caesar. Lanius is a brute instrument and Vulpes is too clever for his own good.

Whoever Lanius was fighting in the far East with the Veterans before he arrived to fight at Hoover Dam

Because Caesar is already dead or in a coma by that point in time.

Yes, as I said, those living under the Legion don't tend to mind, unless their slaves, who aren't in a position to revolt. Ever. They're women and the infirm.

It's proposed, most commonly by anti-Legion individuals. If Caesar openly dictates a successor a full-scale conflict is unlikely

Again, this applies to the NCR, not so much the Legion. The Legion conquers, aggressively assimilates, and moves on, their supply lines COME from where they have just conquered, it moves with them. The NCR is still stuck with a California based supply line as they don't solidify their positions first.

>LOL here's my worthless strawman abloo bloo XD
Woah... so this is the power of user...

I thought it was heavily implied that the Legion is the one with the stable lands due to the infrastructure and culture they bring? Not only that but its really implied that the NCR is like a rotting door that only needs to be kicked in due to being in the exact opposite position of the Legion. The Legion doesn't have problems with revolts and Raiders that's the NCR which is why they have big problems holding a massive choke point despite having a larger army and the tech advantage over the Legion.

The key part to consider is
>Lands under Caesar's protection enjoy stability and security
What happens when that is removed when the Legion is no longer capable of securing its territories?
Do you think these subjects will continue to support an institution as oppressive as the Legion when it brings no benefit to them?

that's literally the lanius speech ending though

These threads just remind me why I love New Vegas so much.
But they beg the question, is it awful writing that leaves too much up to interpretation, or fantastic writing that leaves things up to interpretation as to reinforce player choice?

That would require a massive influx of a new threat, the Legion kills any Raider, or would-be Raider in the most brutal fashion, not only does this leave people terrified to fuck around in Legion territory, it demands an almost complete removal of the a standing Legion force in their territory, which I don't see happening.

It's like the NCR abandoning California to go full-force at the Hoover Dam.

NV is better than the bethesda games by far
4 was a fun looter shooter but that's about it
76 was a cash grab and is now rolling out a fucking BR mode

>What happens when that is removed when the Legion is no longer capable of securing its territories?
It can't be removed unless an outside force moves in. The territory is secure because anyone capable of putting up a fight is dead, the old and women are slaves and the male children are out west fighting for the Legion. NOT because they have a large military occupation like the NCR does in its territory.

Give me on reason to side with House

he's the emprah from 40k

If you care about progress over people, House is the choice for you.

He plans and knows how to bring about a new age of technology

He's the only option with a fleshed-out plan, and has the backing to prove he knows his shit; had Fed-Ex not fucked up he'd have saved Vegas and already put these ideas in motion.

The other factions are just... doing things, with the view of "once we own all lands, then shit gets real"

>The territory is secure because anyone capable of putting up a fight is dead
Imagine actually thinking this.
No, they did not conquer everything East of the Colorado, and even then, that insinuates that new threats will be incapable of forming, which is ridiculous.

>That would require a massive influx of a new threat
No, not really.
All it would take is for a few territories to be destabilized for doubt to set in.

First, you’re assuming everyone is okay with the Legion, when we never actually see Arizona and only ever meet diehard fanatics of Caesar’s most favored legions.

Second, you’re confusing supply lines with manpower. Sure, the Legion can conquer tribes as they go to swell their ranks, but they’re still dependent on static resources to maintain their army. Part of the reason they’re even in the Mojave is for Lake Mead. That means that their supply lines stay just as static as NCR, only getting stretched thinner and longer the further the Legion marches away from Arizona.

Killing him loses karma

Arizona is a vacuum, the only thing keeping the peace and the borders secured is the presence of the Legion. The Legion operates more like a roaming band of raiders than it does a proper, defensive army, so the vast majority of their soldiers are at Hoover Dam in preparation to conquest NCR. Caesar could take almost as many men as he wanted with him, which he'd need because NCR's army is no pushover when properly managed, while he himself states that Kimball could only take as many soldiers as his Senate would let him.

If any of the tribes, raiders or other societies outside Arizona look in and see the Legion is both missing and busy dying, it will be a free for all.

It'd take a whole hell of of a lot of doubt for people to get rid of the barrier between them being raped to death or eaten.

80% of the NCR population doubts the NCR, yet they don't revolt.

I'd argue most are. Raul is the only companion to have personal experience with the Legion, and he says he doesn't have a problem with them; that's not just a random coincidence, and yes, a large part of why the Legion wants the Vegas territory is the massive resource boost; so does the NCR. This doesn't change the fundamental difference between their two approaches.

>Part of the reason they’re even in the Mojave is for Lake Mead.
Caesar is there entirely for his historical re-enactment of crossing the Rubicon and invading NCR. The Legion is the one faction with no real interest in the Dam or the lakes. It's a roaming army of tribals who lived in a desert all their lives, they're not going to have issues getting enough to drink.

He's the only one not treating you like dirt

This isn't entirely true.

Caesar WANTS Vegas, he wants it to be Rome, to give the Legion something else to idolize and fight for besides just the dictator, Vegas is the start of the Legion becoming an actual civilization rather than a nomadic army.

>It'd take a whole hell of of a lot of doubt for people to get rid of the barrier between them being raped to death or eaten.
No, it would turn from "we should trust the legion" to "we should only rely on ourselves for defense".
All it takes is a few settlements in supposedly "safe" territory being raided/destroyed for that to set in.
>80% of the NCR population doubts the NCR yet they don't revolt.
120% of statistics are made up.

>80% of the NCR population doubts the NCR, yet they don't revolt.
The NCR is also the only thing keeping them from being flattened by the Legion and made into slaves.

still have to aim and barter doesn't skip a fight to beat the game

Exactly. Just as the Legion is the only thing keeping the Raiders away.

Even if the population becomes resentful of the Legion, they aren't revolting just because the troop presence is smaller.

>still have to aim
>VATS
>target head
>skill

>barter doesn't skip a fight to beat the game
One of options is Barter based you fucking moron.
Thanks for confirming you've never finished the game.

>No, they did not conquer everything East of the Colorado, and even then, that insinuates that new threats will be incapable of forming, which is ridiculous.
They conquered everything they wanted they probably stopped when they ran out of tribes. We know how the Legion deals with every tribe they find, it has been the same since they started. If you are going to question how they hold down the East you have to question how they hold any territory and it is stated that they have so much manpower for their size because they don't occupy land. That's why they can go toe to toe with the NCR's far larger and more standardized army.
> which he'd need because NCR's army is no pushover when properly managed
It's stated that its not and this is another major problem with the NCR
>If any of the tribes, raiders or other societies outside Arizona look in and see the Legion is both missing and busy dying, it will be a free for all.
That's assuming there is anything big enough to cause a ruckus. Why would the Legion stop at some arbitrary point instead of just taking on every tribe and raider gang so they wouldn't have to come back? If they were going to revolt why didn't they do it when the army had to walk from Arizona to Vegas and then when they had to sit in the camp for the attack to take place?

Vegas only matters as Rome if he can conquer NCR, which is where the real change begins. Vegas is a midpoint between California and Arizona, the site of what he hopes to be his greatest triumph and one of the best preserved cities in the country besides.

But without the people of California to be citizens in his new Ameri-Roman Empire, Vegas is a fairly worthless acquisition.

Attached: 1459048766239.jpg (1280x1440, 400K)

>It's stated that its not
It's very clearly stated that the problem with NCR in the game is because they're mismanaged by an idiot General who wants to have him moment of glory to one-up the Rangers instead of properly utilizing what he's got.

Even Joshua Graham admits that without a bunch of NCR soldiers and an important supply line being blown up at the Divide, the loss at the first battle for the Dam could have been much worse for the Legion.

>If Caesar openly dictates a successor a full-scale conflict is unlikely

Good thing he dies unexpectedly.

Yes the army is mismanaged and has way to much ground to cover. The NCR is well known to be slow to response to threats and just having a shitty bureaucratic system in general. If the man who guards against the greatest threat to the NCR is an idiot only put there because Kimball likes him, imagine what the rest of high command and the officer corps looks like.

The way of the future.

>the rest of high command and the officer corps
Colonel Hsu and Colonel Moore are both presented as competent soldiers and officers, with Hsu being hamstringed by ridiculous orders and Moore too busy with the Dam and too much of a warhawk to disagree with Oliver and Kimball. The problem is at the top, with even Chief Hanlon cowed by Oliver's idiocy.

>written by Chris Avellone

It's all becoming clear now

You live your whole life in peace, rich and with whatever you want.

>whatever you want
what if I want the opposite of that

You choose the Legion

house always wins

Then why did they kick me out of all the casinos on the Strip

The real interesting thing about this encounter is that he's built up to be a mindless, savage monster but when you actually encounter him in person you realize he's at least willing to hear you out

but user, nuVegas is zoomer-darling after streamers told them to love it

You need an IQ of at least 120, sorry user

I fucking hated that shit. I invested heavily in luck knowing that there would be casinos and then they all throw me out after I've made a few thousand bottlecaps. Complete bullshit. I wouldn't have even invested in luck if I knew that would be the case.

Luck gives you better base stats and higher crit.
Its literally the best handy stat.

Luck's a pretty great stat in NV tho

>more crits
>basically free money
>some speech checks
What else do you want from it, goddamn

I meant I wouldn't have invested as heavily in it as I did hoping for immense amounts of money from the casinos. I had 9 luck and I would have probably had it no higher than 5-6 if I knew this was how the casinos worked.

So that House can run all the political shit in Vegas while you go off on fun adventures in your spare time

Success at gambling is directly tied to your Luck. 49000 caps just for showing up in Vegas is fucking absurd money. 2500 more if you hit up Vicky and Vance, potentially several thousand more over the cap in all the casinos if you go out of your way to get jackpots on slots.

Stop whinging and accept how good you've got it

39k, whoops

>Caesar does not take "no" for an answer.
95% of the time caesar is in a coma or dead by this point.

I mean looking back I should have expected there to be a limit to how much you can get from the casinos. I went in naively expecting the game would just let me milk insane amounts of money from them.

There's also the casino at the Sierra Madre, that's 10,000 chips for the vending machines. That's a lot of stims, ammo, and repair kits for basically free

Caesar is the only one in the Legion with both the intelligence AND charisma to lead. Like that one user said, Vulpes doesn't have the charisma and Lanius doesn't have the intelligence, and maintaining an entity like the Legion over the long-term requires both at once.

If you cash in your ten thousand chips for ten thousand Pre-War Money you've got a payout worth (up to) one hundred thousand caps. You also get the complimentary voucher worth a thousand chips every three days in the bunker, so you don't even miss out on free stuff.

>Vulpes is too clever for his own good
explain
t. never did a legion run

kek
based

He's a frumentarius, which is basically the Legion's equivalent of the CIA. He can carry out underhanded shit like Nipton and blowing up President Kimball's aircraft at Hoover Dam, but he isn't trained to lead combat troops in an actual battle. Plus, with the Legion's mindset of "physical strength good, intelligence bad", he's probably seen as some kind of coward by everyone outside of Caesar's inner circle who know just how important his work is.

>he isn't trained to lead combat troops in an actual battle
He was a Decanus who broke ranks to lead his squad through enemy lines and capture the enemy leader without further fighting. Caesar made him a frumentarii because his Centurion wanted him crucified for breaking with the usual Legion meatgrinder "tactics"

>man clearly and consistently makes more money from the House, then the House does from him
user irl casinos WILL kick and ban people who legally find some means of increasing their winning odds to 50.001%, otherwise they'd literally just be giving him money in the long run
not sure what you expected

Its been almost 10 years and we're still discussing this damn game.

To my point, the Legion's overemphasis on brute strength and frontal assaults as a point of personal honor would not endear someone like Vulpes to the rank and file.

>Caesar feeds you a bunch of bullshit
>talk to other Legionnaires about him
>"oh yeah Lanius has been one of us since he was 12"

...

Pay what I want or die