Who fucked the FF franchise worse?

youtube.com/watch?v=3C5ECIsHbFM

Imagine being so autistic you get upset over this

XV. Just one forever unfinished game with boring gameplay.
The XIII trilogy range from decent to good,also the muic was better, I miss Hamauzu.

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FF13+FF14 original launch killed the franchise for a generation. It may never recover. FF15 only failed to save it, basically an impossible task.

FFXIII did far more damage to the franchise because plenty of people still had faith in Final Fantasy a decade ago. By the time FFXV came out only a handful of fanboys still had any faith left. FFXV being crap was not a monumental event. It was about as noteworthy as a new Tomb Raider game being crap.

FF I

FFVIII

He wants a physically/socially powerful wife who needs him for emotional support. It bleeds into every single thing he writes, and Lightning is the ultimate version of this fetish.

13 was irredeemable garbage. 15 was bad, but not total garbage.

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FFX is where Square's good crazy (throwing money at FF7-9, Parasite Eve, Chrono Cross, and such) started to turn into bad crazy (Spirits Within, Advent Children, FFX-2, the XIII trilogy). FFX is right on the tightrope between the 2.

FFXV because the open-world meme is worse than the corridor meme, and also because XIII had an ok sequel, better combat, and far better music

This, and it was public knowledge that the project was fucked. A lot of people were actually surprised and thought it was better than they expected. Instead of a crazy trashfire it was kind of boring and clearly not done.

FXXV is worse. When you have to resort to terribly outdated, overdone, and tired out sandbox/open world style games, you have the shit your pants.

this

FF15 was a mess, but a promising one that shows the franchise still has potential. I'd honestly buy FF16 as long as its as good as or better than 15.

The irresponsible financing didn't change, they just lost a lot of good people in positions of power and started to hand reigns over to dipshits while their executives got more and more hands on post-7. X would have been fine if it wasn't helmed in part by a numbskull who didn't even understand half of what the game was going for.

IX was the game that killed the series.

>FFXV because the open-world meme is worse than the corridor meme
Usually you're right, but XIII's corridors are so bad and the game so bereft of meaningful content that it's actually even worse.

The spinoff rebranded as a core game made on the cheap?

FF14 1.0 nearly tanked the entire company.

How was it promising? It managed to make PS1 ATB combat seem entertaining by comparison.

XV was a mess of a game that was clearly different than what the developers intended. XIII ruined the franchise for an entire generation. Both are really bad, but at least XIII-2 got Gilgamesh right, unlike XV.

Holy fuck I did not know a bunch of sexist and racists homophobic people posted here. What a bunch of incels!

t. Toriyama

subhuman

That is some huge misandry there user. You may want to think about what you just said about men and look in a mirror for once. You bigot.

You think there was ever a time in any of the ffxiii games when someone questioned Lightning's autism towards her sister?
I can imagine Fang whispering to someone about Lightning wanting to bang Serah.

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Which is management's fault.
>Doesn't make sure the game runs properly before launch.
>Hires out mocap without considering logistics of upkeep over several years.
>Doesn't make sure this game about a large community is accessible to many players.
>Doesn't make sure this shit could possibly run on the console you promised exclusivity to.
>Doesn't set up proper beta testing.
Fucking dumbasses.

T. Sexist Nazi!

tpbp

Good post. FFXIII did way more damage to the series than FFXV, although FFXV was the worst game.

Another thing I'd like to mention is how SE eventually cancelled FFXV's dlc whereas FFXIII got two more games on top of DLC.

At least in FF13 i could do a drinking game with the story and the combat was good that i could have an enjoyable time.
With FF15 having almost no story and the characters being abit too over done in their personalities (i get it u are the cook stop mentioning it) and having a barren world and dull activities with lackluster combat i dropped it

Roses? Compliments? For a fictional character?
This guy puts the WHO organization to laugh.

>Lightning's autism towards her sister?
>I can imagine Fang whispering to someone about Lightning wanting to bang Serah.
Just wow Tyrone. I did not expect such sexist language against Lightning coming from a based Black like you. We are no longer friends.

IX > VII > IV > XIV > X > V > III > XI > VI > XV > VIII > XII > XIII

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To be fair 13's two additional games were pretty much just asset flips to try and recoup losses they incurred over the engine.

Go back to reeeesetera, tranny.

I'll never understand how people can think a simple, bland game with a simple story that you can burn through relatively quickly or spend your time dicking around with is somehow worse than 20 hours of cutscenes that say nothing and holding forward to reach the next automated battle. Like fuck, at least XV lets you put the game on autopilot and do something else.

SJW > You.

The merge was a mistake, how could Enix fuck us so bad.

XIII-2 was.
LR is the corpse of Valkyrie Profile 3 rebranded for more sales and to keep Toriyama occupied.

XIII killed FF
XV revived and saved FF.

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VX was a result of 13 so 13.

Enix's only mistake was keeping Square alive past their expiration date

>muh ATB
Please go away.

FF13 has no towns, no dungeons, no exploration, no NPCs to talk to, no minigames, no vehicles to ride, no combat variety, etc. It was just a fucking coridoor and cutscenes aka a literal movie with the worst characters ever and a literal who villain. FF13 literally had cancelled DLC too, hell it was so bad that 13-2 retconned the ending of FF13 just to take place and then 13-2 ALSO had cancelled DLC which were all supposed to be part of the main story. Kitase comfiened they cut enough content out of FF13 to make a whole other game with, FF13 is literally unfinished

XV is actually a fucking game that you play that has towns, dungeons, exploration, NPCs to talk to and get sidequests from, minigames, various vehicles to ride, actual combat variety and each character plays completely unique to each other, and actually great characters and villain that you care about.

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>not 7
They've been trying to recapture that for years.

tpbp

The first XIII. XIII-2 fixed most of the issues people had, and LR went off and did its own thing. But most people wouldn’t know because of how droll XIII was that it killed any interest.

Both entries still sold super well with XV having the biggest launch of the series

10. have you guys ever read the back of the box? the only thing it advertises over and over again is the voice acting and cutscenes. there has never been any hope for recovery since.
9 was a perfect swan song.

>Enix
Is this a meme? Enix got gutted when the merger happened.

The Final Fantasy Movie, XIV's initial failure, and XV because it was a massive waste of money. XIII at least had the decency to be finished and, no, the sequels that made a point to retcon the first game's ending doesn't mean it needed them.

>Lightning wanting to bang Serah.

Wasn't this the point? At least that's the premise I went about the games.

>he likes VIII
Go back and play it to see what a rushed boring piece of shit it is now you aren't 10

How can one MC be the most bland and be the worst cunt at the same time? Nobody actually cared of FF after Toriyama's butcher

XV may be intensely mediocre, but at least my desire to keep playing it lasted longer than 20 minutes. Fuck XIII

they were both equally awful. one can only hope the next installment in the franchise doesn't follow their example.

13
15 is just a result of it

When Square and Enix merged. So around FFX and XII

the original ff13 seemed like it was written by something sinister, like a fujoshi

>tfw Noctis became an actually interesting character in the FFXIV event because competent writers got their hands on him and conveyed his personality by showing you things instead of just telling you.
>tfw Lightning was just as boring and shitty as ever when she showed up in XIV.
Some things you just can't fix.

>FFXV because the open-world meme is worse than the corridor meme

Literally the opposite. The corridor meme is worse because there's nothing to even do except fight waves of enemies, and if the combat feels like a slog like XIII's then it's not even worth the hassle.

With XV, even though the combat is equally shit, I can at least distract myself with other activities like riding Chocobos, fishing, camping with the bros or even just wondering what might be off in the distance. It's not a well-designed open world by any means but it's better than boring corridor garbage by default.

>and far better music

Now that's just fucking wrong.

well fang cant exactly talk given her boner for vanille

How's the Ardyn DLC ?

FXV might be garbage as a whole but those first 5 chapters of travelling around in a road trip with those mini-game was top-tier comfy. FFXIII made me wanna shut off the game half a chapter in and its just corridors and encounters

Final Fantasy Xiii being trash and XIV being a disaster almost fucking killed the series

XIV in particular almost sunk the fucking company. It's why they pressed all their panic buttons: KH3, FF7R, FFXV

Yeah ffxv was underwhelming but it's because of nomuras game being stolen and reappropriated and it's still a lot better and a lot more successful than XIII which made people not even want to play jrpgs anymore

I remember everyone shitting on XIII before it came out because nobody liked XII, people were more hyped about Lost Odyssey. After Sakaguchi left FF has never maintain faith in the franchise among fans. Hell I would say it goes back to X-2. It was over way before XIII came out.

Easily XIII. Fuck the zoomers who are actually defending corridors and probably haven't even played both games to realize just how much worse XIII's world is.

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Those were a time of cynicism and uncertainty, XIII was the death knell where even normal people started to go "eh, fuck FF."

Well designed game > Competent Corridor > Competent Open World > Shitty Open World > Shitty Corridor

Where does XII factor into the quality ladder? Was thinking about getting it, next time it went on sale.

What's the difference between a "competent" and "shitty" corridor? Corridors are corridors and nobody really likes them except Soulsfags.

FF13 was bad, but it was a concentration of bad that had been creeping in since X and had finally become detrimental, was course corrected over the next two games in the series, and managed to pull of a more or less satisfactory ending to the trilogy. FFXV is sort of this big bowl of nothing, they whipped together a highly aesthetic cinematic for FF13-Versus announcement trailer at the last minute and never really progress much beyond that, all they did really was a spend a near decade finding different ways to recreate that trailer and then dump what they had on the public when it finally became ridiculous

I still had hope after Lightning.

Its not terrible. Take a lot of what folks here say with a massive grain of salt; they're salty nostalgiafags.
Case in point: Tabata said SE was preparing to end the FF franchise before 15's release, and said 15's financial success was the only reason the FF franchise is not being cancelled/ended....yet if you went by the (wrong) opinions of some of the anons here, you'd think 15 was a mini financial ruin for the company

6

Nigga, XII is one of the best Final Fantasy games ever made.

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A competent corridor is a pretty good game that's tight and simple. Think of a middling 2D Mario game. It's better than an "okay" open world because the design is tighter.

ff15 was objectively not underwhelming. that's right. objectively.

It is really good, but it is still afflicted by the lack of confidence in their own vision that now plagues the FF series. In this case, the player character has little to do with the actual plot of the game and was included simply because they were too scared not to have an anime twink main character. Apart from that it is a great entry .

Zodiac age is amazing. If you liked Xenoblade Chronicles it's pretty much that but better.
No clue about the original since I've never played it.

XV by virtue of me being unfortunate enough to play it.

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it's not like all of 13 is corridors but it can seem that way when 95% of people quit before the corridors end

Square Enix fucked themselves.

FFXV, hyped to oblivion, years of dev hell, ended up cancelling half the dlc planned for the game, game was mediocre at best, have no willingness to ever replay it

13 series, LR in particular still imo has the best combat system of any of the FF games
the games certainly had their issues, but for me the combat more than makes up for it

12s kinda polarizing.

If you like super minmalistic story and characters then you might like it.
The world building was pretty bad and the combat was hit or miss also.

13, i tried multiple times to play but never finished. hated the story, battle system, and basically the entire cast. i can't comment on 15 cause i haven't played it yet, due to 13 making the hate the current series so fucking much.

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>9 and 4 in the top 3
>9 is basically a remake of 4 with the same exact fucking plot reveal
>8 sucks lolMAX
epic Yea Forums-approved post kid

die. i say this with like 200 hours in the game. die for real, though.

>Think of a middling 2D Mario game

Well, think of the genre Mario belongs to. Of course the design is tighter when the goal is constant platforming.

I can't think of a single corridor JRPG I've actually enjoyed, especially the ones that focus on having an adventure which is what open worlds are designed to replicate.

yup.

>irresponsible financing

I reckon Square were always irresponsible in that way, they just had the devil's own luck during the PS1 era, and they started fucking up after that.

I like that about Square though, they always throw shitloads of money at CG and damn the consequences. Look at XV with its completely ridiculous summon scenes. They've got some fucking heart, man. It;s why I think FF7R is gonna be fucking great.

>super minmalistic story and characters
What?

Except he is exactly the same in that as in the main game XV and even says and expresses the same feelings, stop making shit up you contrarian.

Better than FF13

XII is the best one

FFXIII and its sequels took over the franchise for eight years, but they were at least recognizable as JRPGs and eye rightly mocked by the larger community of gamers for the stupid things they attempted. XV somehow managed to dodge being a running gag amongst normal fags and is widely considered a success and represents the future of Final Fantasy as another generic Ubisoft open world action game with light RPG elements.

XII

>Take a lot of what folks here say with a massive grain of salt; they're salty nostalgiafags
Then he should be taking your comment with a grain of salt as well. Some people don't like playing MMO style gameplay, on top of being fueled by the shitty ATB system that's been going on since IV.

If you seriously put 200 hours into the game then you obviously like it too, nerd.

FFX arguably had the best battle system.

12 barely has a story and the characters are all super one dimensional.

It doesn't
RPGsite best FF poll with over 10k votes, XV in top 5
1: Final Fantasy VII
2: Final Fantasy IX
3: Final Fantasy VI
4: Final Fantasy X
5: Final Fantasy XV
6: Final Fantasy VIII
7: Final Fantasy XIV
8: Final Fantasy XII
9: Final Fantasy IV
10: Final Fantasy XIII
11: Final Fantasy V
12: Final Fantasy XI
13: Final Fantasy III
14: Final Fantasy II
15: Final Fantasy

rpgsite.net/feature/6530-here-s-the-final-fantasy-series-ranked-as-voted-by-thousands-of-you

Gameinformers top 300 games poll with XV in the top 5 FF games listed
270. Final Fantasy XIII (#12 ranked FF)
244. Final Fantasy III (#11 ranked FF)
235. Final Fantasy XII (#10 ranked FF)
164. Final Fantasy XIV (#9th ranked FF)
146. Final Fantasy IV (#8th ranked FF)
128. Final Fantasy XI (#7th ranked FF)
97. Final Fantasy VIII (#6th ranked FF)
51. Final Fantasy XV (#5th ranked FF)
49. Final Fantasy IX (#4th ranked FF)
33. Final Fantasy X (#3rd ranked FF)
13. Final Fantasy VI (#2nd ranked FF)
7. Final Fantasy VII (#1st ranked FF)
gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2018/03/19/readers-choice-top-300-games-of-all-time.aspx

Game informer top 5 best games in series, XV in top 5.
>Final Fantasy
>1. Final Fantasy X
>2. Final Fantasy VII
>3. Final Fantasy VI
>4. Final Fantasy VIII
>5. Final Fantasy XV

gameinformer.com/2019/04/14/game-informer-readers-favorite-games-of-popular-series

Shirrako FF poll with 21k+ votes had XV in 1st place and top 5

Famitsu best games of Heisei era, XV again in top 5 for the FFs listed
1. Chrono Trigger
2. Legend of Zelda BOTW
3. NieR: Automata
4. Final Fantasy VII
5. Okami
6. Legend of Zelda OoT
7. Final Fantasy X
8. Pokémon Red/Green/Blue/Yellow
9. Dragon Quest V
10. Xenogears
11. Vainglory
12. Suikoden II
13. Mother 2
14. Splatoon 2
15. Tactics Ogre
16. Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G
17. Kingdom Hearts
17. (tie) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
19. Final Fantasy XV
20. Final Fantasy XI
20. (tie) Pokémon Diamond/Pearl

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Its the best FF.

With the amount of time between games theres most likely a very large amount of kids whose first game is 15

>super minmalistic story and characters
>bad world building

Both of these are so diametrically opposed to what the game really has that I'm convinced you never actually played it.

FF13 had canceled main story dlc
only the non canon bonus 2nd round of alt timeline dlc was cancelled for xv and it was never planned to get those to begin with, all initial planned dlc came out and they're all better than anything ff13

nah, 7 12 and 13 are the worst by far
X actually has the best battle system and least convoluted story in the entire series

15 but Noctis is cool

XI and XII were completely different games. If anything fucked FF it's the lack of vision since the Enix merger.

its nothing like a ubi game, its literally just ff1-9 world map in bigger scale in a more condensed area of the world map

A lot of early FF games are extremely linear despite pretending not to be. And X has super streamlined design, but I'd say it's a better game than XV overall despite not personally enjoying it. The lack of freedom is a problem, yeah, but an open world that fails to do anything special with it is even worse. You need an actually bad game that's linear and focused to be worse than a not-great open world.

If you say so. Many stories that contain political intrigue fly over audience's heads though so I'll just chalk it up to that.
Also FF characters are almost universally one dimensional, at least in 12 they all have clear motivation.

And? Most peoples first FF was FF7, hell FF7 was the first mainline FF even released in Europe and Australia, FF1, 4 and 6 only got western release in NA prior to that.

>Who fucked the FF franchise worse?

Probably XV.

The XIII games actually got better over time.

XV ended as an unfinished mess (cancelled story DLC (which got revived as a novel)) with some of the worst and most casual pandering gameplay I have ever seen (Hold O to win). Plus a fired director.

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Yea Ashe was such a deep and interesting character.
Cid was an amazing fleshed out villain.
Baltheir truly grows greatly over the course of the game.
The game certainly wasn't just take Ashe to this place for 90% of the game with large segments of flat out nothing.

The sole enjoyable thing about 12 was breaking the game and fighting hunts.

From the ones I played:

FF8 > FF10 > FF9 > FF7 > FF6 > FF12 > FF15 > All the spin offs > FF13

FF15 should have never been a main line game

10 is just as bad as 13. You are looking back with rose tinted glasses most likely.

The majority of post 9 FFs are not "MMO gameplay"; 11 and 14 are, since they're literally MMOs. 15 is not, nor is 13 (or its followups) and 12 is "singleplayer MMO" in meme. But 10 isnt. And thats only the main numbered titles, not any 'spinoffs' or non numbered titles.

>they could've extended the world of ruin into noctis trying to reunite with his mates ala FFVI without the needless padding while freeing outposts from daemons along the way
It would've made the second half a less bitter pill to swallow.

>X
>least convoluted
l o l

it is a decent time waster, but it's weak. weak story. weak gameplay. cannot praise it and also consider self to be a fan of the series. cannot be reconciled.

Calm down Toriyama.

Fuck off KH/ FF13 shill
FF13 got worse over time

XV ended its story at launch and all initial planned dlc released as intended, only the non canon alt timeline bonus 2nd round of dlc was cancelled because it wasnt canon or needed, and Tabata quit to start his own company and wasn't in charge of any of the DLC to begin with

Also fuck off with your hold O bullshit
>autist is clearly holding R1+O and still gets hit taking damage while having wait mode on and using one of the strongest base game regular weapons in the game Durandal with elemental advantage against one of the weakest grunt mob enemies in the entire game while having a full 5 member party

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XIII because its failure is partly responsible for why FFXV is so bad.

Its barry spamming the same pics over and over again

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XIII was unironically better. XIII is definitely railroady, and honestly a bit easy and boring, but at least it was a complete experience.

XV is ambitious, but definitely feels unfinished in many areas.

All I'm saying is not everybody who dislikes XII does out of pure nostalgia for the series.

PRECISELY. Thank you! So many nostalgiafags refuse to accept that fact. Its not a BAD thing, but it is a truth; most early FFs have the ILLUSION of freedom and the ILLUSION of options.
For most pre PS2 FFs, the majority of side quests dont open up until the free roam portion (usually earned at like 60-80% through the story/game)

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It is a pretty simple, by the numbers, fantasy story about trying to break a cycle.

>A lot of early FF games are extremely linear despite pretending not to be.

I think you might be conflating progression with level design. The early FF games were open world as well, only "linear" in the sense that you had a specific order you needed to visit each location in -- but the thing is, even most modern open world games are like this.

>The lack of freedom is a problem, yeah, but an open world that fails to do anything special with it is even worse.

I can agree that a bad open world can be far worse than a bad linear game, although in this case, I think XIII's linearity is so bad it's actually worse than XV's open world design. I don't think good linear games are always necessarily better than good open worlds, though. There's a time and place for everything, and a lot of it's very genre-dependent.

Retard.

So like FF4, FF9, FF10 which were originally a spinoff for NES before becoming a SNES game as FF4 after secret of Mana was no longer FF4, a spinoff called FF Gaiden with a job sysyem and Dragoon MC before becoming FF9, and not even a FF but a new IP called Seventeen before becoming FF10?

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Unironically FF7. Not because it was a bad game, but because the only game to come after it that was good was FF9, which tried to distance itself from it as much as possible.

10 improved classic ff combat pacing(mostly)
13 had some neat ideas but stupidly ruined that pacing with sloppy implementation... though 13-2 fixed the core implementation issues, it reduced the number of real party members

Neither. FF7 did by bringing in a bunch of weebshits who think Sephiroth is the height of FF story.

>10 is just as bad as 13
That's arguable but don't pretend X's linear design caused the downfall of the series when the next 2 games were completely different, or had anything to do with XIII getting 2 sequels in a single gen.

Says the KH /ff13 sperg spamming the same pics again

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XIII and its shit sequels by far.

Also this and X-2.

XIII literally cut enough content to make a whole other game according to Kitase. XIII is worse and objectively unfinished

FFXIV 1.0 fucked the franchise so hard they had to shit out 13-2 and 13-3

Nah thats fair. 12 isnt even high on my list, just been amused and confused by all the contrarian circle jerking to bash on post 8/post 9 FFs in general in this thread, especially with misleading info or disingenuous information to serve their own preferences.

I'm agreeing with you that XIII is worse than XV. Read my post again. I said that shitty games without open ended, exploratory content are inherently worse than shitty open world games. They're both shit, but one at least gives you some freedom. Meanwhile a competent open world doesn't offer quite as much as a competent game that's focused.

I mean yeah, but X and especially XIII go way too far. The abstraction of the World Map was basically a necessity as it allows the player to fill the gaps more easily in their mind without feeling whiplash (X does this several times with sudden biome jumps) or padding out the time it takes to move from one place to the other (XV's open world).

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I'll say it again. If you dumped TWO HUNDRED hours into the game, which I'm not even sure you actually did, then you enjoyed it. You can't say the gameplay was weak if you dedicated two hundred hours of your life to it. It just doesn't compute. If you're being honest with yourself, you should try to think about what about the game addicted you for that long and understand what it accomplished in its design for that to happen.

I'm not. That was my first reply on the subject.
Personally I don't think a downfall has happened at all.

Too bad the mob design was absolute garbage and it has the worst normal battle theme in the series.

Not terrible taste desu.

VII = VI > IV > IX > X > V > XII > XV > I > II > III > XIII

I wish II had a better battle system because it unironically has one of the best villains in the entire series stuck in a shit game.

FF13 took 3 games to "fix", it's obvious which game is worse at this point.

That mod post isn't even talking about Barry you lying retard, its not even about FF. That modpost is about pillars of eternity 2.

boards.fireden.net/v/thread/417135398/#417141527

> If you dumped TWO HUNDRED hours into the game, which I'm not even sure you actually did, then you enjoyed it.
I suffered through all of 15's content just to prove a point to my friends so they'd shut the fuck up about it.

He's right.

>Meanwhile a competent open world doesn't offer quite as much as a competent game that's focused.

And again, I think that's a massive oversimplification. Open world games can be focused, however rare those games might be. Some of the earlier FF titles were, and I'd easily consider them open world. The original Legend of Zelda for NES is one of the most focused open worlds of all time.

Dont know who this is but he sounds based
fuck KH and fuck nomura

Please don't let the horrid gameplay of infect the 7 remake

at least 13 tried to fix things.

Her games.

10 felt like an adventure with your party far more than any other FF, and most RPGs, thanks to its battle system of swapping people.
XV ruined what a 3D open world FF could look like and what might be obtainable. When you picture FF7 Remake, you can't help but imagine how impossible it would be done like XV

Id argue thats a tad pedantic; "need to visit" yeah, but in FF7 u cant get past a scant few areas without Buggy. You cant backtrack until a certain point.
FF9 you cant free roam until airship, with certain areas offlimits at different times.
Invisible walls and barriers exist in many forms.

Then you're just as retarded as your friends.

reminder FFXII is literally the worst FF to date

Yet you were wrong since its all kino and your friends BTFO your whiny ass

Did we really need THREE Lightning games?
>canon end is she becomes a gucci handbag model and thanks SE for creating her

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13 and 15 were both shit.
No need to argue which was worse

Cope

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That isn't how the game is meant to be played, thats just a retard playing like shit and taking damage

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No way. Zodiac age is one of the best in the series.

Yeah, duh. I'm generalizing. I agree with you that games like FF5/6 lean more towards the "open world" side in comparison. It's a discussion of player freedom and rigidity versus quality. A bad, focused game is just going to be less enjoyable than a game that's less tightly designed because of that lack of freedom, while a merely okay game that's more broad suffers from that lack of precision, and when you get into actually good games the distinction becomes blurry and far more a matter of personal taste. I'm just saying that the freedom to act sort of falls in the middle, better than a similarly bad time without that freedom, but not often as good as a more focused game of similar quality.

But XV only proved it is amazing so no it literally raised the bar for FF.

Only ff13 is shit

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As somebody that started with X in high school (I had played the older games before then on emulators, but X was the first in series I bought) then moved onto XII I can safely say I hate both games on all levels. I actually enjoy the first three games the most out of the entirety of the mainline series.

Based guy BTFOing kh fags

If you can free roam at any point, I wouldn't classify those as linear games. Maybe this conversation as a whole is pedantic since it's inevitably painted by where we subjectively draw the line between these two concepts.

Not really. Any time I brought something up they'd just deflect and make excuses

seeth

Based, fuck KH3

>I actually enjoy the first three games the most out of the entirety of the mainline series.
/vr/ please go.

FFVII is the reason the franchise is dead, if the devs could move on from nostalgiabaiting with every character from VII then the series wouldnt be so cancerous. just look at how big of a train wreck VIIHD is going to be. SE has wasted years making an episodic soulless recreation of the one game that's held them to the past. I fucking hate what square has become.

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sneed

Okay then FF13 is free roam; you can freely roam back n forth among all of Pulse once you reach Chapter 11, ergo 13 is not linear either, by your own logic.

More like you'd deflect and make excuses because you don't know what the fuck you're talking about since you clearly didnt pay attention to anything that happened and didn't earnestly play the game, you only claim to have done it out of spite and I doubt you even played it at all or even have friends. You're just bullshitting trying to spread lies

For me, it's Episode Ignis.

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Lightning
>game is mediocre
>gets a buttload of direct sequels that are also mediocre because she's someone's waifu

feed

8, 9, 10 and 12 were literally nothing like 7 though, and 15 was closest to 5/6 in themes and story.

Then I think I can see what you're getting at, and I agree. I guess my only point was that a focused open world (like LoZ for example) wouldn't really benefit from more linearity, whereas a focused linear game probably wouldn't benefit from too much freedom.

I said I started in high school didn't I? Not like I have a history with the series I just found the older games better than the new.

>at least 13 tried to fix things
And it didn't. The result was some slightly less mediocre games that had their own glaring problems. All those resources could have gone to FFXV or hell, even FFXIV. FFXV's problem was that it was in development for a decade and still ended up being terribly rushed, but they got the game in a somewhat better state than 13 with DLC instead of 2 full games.

based

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zodiac only barely makes FF XII decent by adding the turbo mode. It doesn't magically fix the worst story you could possibly imagine

Yeah and I deem you an unrepentant /vr/ faithful as the first 3 games have no real value outside of being retro.
1 and 2 especially feel like a chore to play compared to anything past them.

The free roam section of 13 is more of a location than an overworld, so that comparison doesn't really hold up at all.

8-12 were fine in their own right but the past few games and spin offs feel like SE is just trying to recapture "the good old days" rather than try something new. it's just recycled plots taped together with less emphasis on characters

If it makes you feel any better, I don't like the mainline games all that much anyway. I'm more into their dead spin offs, Tactics and Crystal Chronicles.

I don't care about your storyfaggotry but turbo mode is not even the main feature in ZA.
Our priorities in evaluating a game are clearly nothing alike so I'll just leave it here.

seed

Pleb.

FFXIV 1.0

Tough question. Both games were 5/10 at the absolute best

Well my favorite FF is Bravely Default honestly so I can relate.

The 13s had their moments.

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I don't know who this guy is, but he's actually right. Somehow, KH3 has so much stuff, but it's still 60% empty. I hope the new KH3FM fixes this.

I'm in that weird state of mind where I just feel like 2013-15 did not exist

XV had a greater focus on characters than either XII or XIII tbf, but the problem was have the character development was in DLC's released months after the fucking game. I loved those characters since I only played the Royal Edition, but they should have inserted the DLC segments into the actual points in the game where you were separated.

At the end of the day I felt more emotion at the end of the game for the characters than I had in a FF game since IX. It makes me sad because the rest of the game could have been great too, but shafted by SE.

Same, except 5, 6, 7 was the peak of the numbered games and Tactics/Crystal Chronicles/Mana/SaGa are GOAT.

Based Barry. He might be a massive faggot but he's right about KH3 being worse.

15 story and lore wise seems to mainly borrow from 6, 5, 1 and 7, with the only similarity to 8 being the ring of a royal family associated with death.

Both games were shit. End of story.

>Leona Lewis singing the main theme of a FF title
still surreal

Oh you meant the fucking game god fucking damn it smdh

>literally the best game, also personal favorite of Sakaguchi, who even said IX is the closest to his vision of what the perfect FF game can be
>haaaughhhpffff IX BAAAD

Only Xtards can be this delusional.

>XIII and its shit sequels by far.
Another mouthbreather who didn't play the sequels.

And 15's open world is ended to be replaced with "linear corridors" post Chapter 9. Yeah, you can fast travel back to the open world...but its technically "over". And your exact words were, and I quote;
"If you can free roam at any point, I wouldn't classify those as linear games"

It's hands down one of the best FFs in the series, and one of the few 3D FFs to actually feel like a real adventure with some political intrigue to boot. Only nostalgiafags hate it.

youtube.com/watch?v=vv2DSmy3Tro

XV did it better

Just imagine what could have been if Square Enix's game engine autism didn't ruin the development of both FF13 and FF14 1.0, thereby also ruining FF Versus XIII by forcing it to become FF15. There's an alternative timeline where all three games are good. Instead, we ended up in the shitty timeline where all three games are trash. I want to go back in time, so I can tell SE to ditch their trash engines and just use Unreal.

The way I see it XIII was a worse game but XV was a worse-FF game. XIII could at least confidently label itself as an FF game. XV less so. I wouldn't have minded XV's ARPG style if it resulted in a complete game with a solid vision behind it. It had the foundational blocks to become a JRPG classic.

XV. Lightning was hot and the music in her game was based. XV's greatest shit was all from other games.

I would say Lightning fucked the game franchise really hard. 3 games... 3 Fucking games with her. As if the games themselves were that fun to play...They had to shoehorn an unlikable character like her into the game. Not because she is a female.. But because she isnt a good character. Noctis wasnt a good character either. Ff15 has a rather stupid story as well. You go around collecting wepons of old kings... To finaly return to take back your kingdom.. But.. At the same time you are being hunted by the empire all whille it not really even looking like you are hunted. You can walk in the cities, no problem. Sounds rather odd for someone on the run from EVERYONE basicly. Yet there he is.. Driving a car.. and always being seen with his pose. Who honestly dont look like bodyguards... not untill near the end. Where they end up looking like some teen Boyband or something.

Maybe he just really really wanted the Wyrmhero Blade.

I'm playing XIII for the first time and I'm having more fun than I had with XV. I don't like the database thing too much but they explain stuff really well there and I'm liking the characters more. The combat is more fun too but now I understand why people complained about it being too linear.

If you can fast travel back to the open world, and if the vast majority of the game is already open world, it's open world. This isn't hard to understand.

13 isn't an open world game by any reasonable metric. Only a single area feels sort of "free roam" and even that's almost completely bereft of any content at all. It's not comparable to the earliest titles that allow you to backtrack, have open overworld maps throughout at least most of the quest and give you some degree of navigational freedom.

Does he not know about the awful Final Fantasy phone games with 15 stuff? Especially the 15 city builder...

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This is the difference between average linear areas in FF13 and the most linear area in FFXV

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>all whille it not really even looking like you are hunted.
Because you weren't really been hunted because Ardyn already murdered the Empire's higher ups and assumed control, he just did stuff to fuck with you. Did you even play the game nigga?

I hate him so much

Its amazing how the lyrics of stand by me actually describe things happening in the story

The only real answer to this question.

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>n-no you didn't actually play it!
yeah, that's the kind of deflection I was talking about.
>90% of side quests were MMO-tier fetch/kill busy work
>Game completely separates story progression from roam areas (same as 13 did, mind you)
>Driving around with your speed capped at a crawl early on to pad out game length
>Mechanics such as rest bonuses actively reward you for avoiding campsites and character interaction
>Any and every fight in the game can be brute forced simply by having more potions regardless of stats, personal skill, or enemy mechanics
>Magic, despite being a consumable, takes more investment and forethought than just hitting the enemy with your biggest damage weapon
>Steyliff Grove's super-dungeon being 100 floors of a copy-pasted room
Pretty much the only redeeming quality of the game is the platforming dungeon, because it's the only unique encounter in the entire fucking game.

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No, see FF13 is a worse game and worse FF.

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No it wasnt retard

>new happy ending where no one dies or goes blind
Just about ruined whatever the XV story had going for it.

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So life-like.

That has literally nothing to do with the actual XV you retard, the KH phone game is story canon and literally keeps adding new canon story in its updates which tied directly into KH3 and set up the next KH game villain.

13 has like 60+ stones to hunt which comprise the sidequests and story of the world below, and unlocks additional info in the codex.
13 was a story narrative based JRPG, moreso than most JRPGs. It excels in that. It has a phenomenal world built, solid character development/pacing, and relatively stable/solid acting...

At least XIII had Serah and her huge breasts. XV is irredeemable Nomura garbage.

I think people had incredibly huge expectation when it came to XV, but if you played games for more than 10 years development hell is a huge as fuck redflag, things get suspicious and infighting between company most likely will lead to an unfinished freankenstein product, which will only please those who are very new to the franchise or they have some extreme type of connection and devotion towards the game and taking fanboy/girlism to another level.
At least XIII get away with the "new system lol", and the movie games disease which came with the PS3 era, so in its defense it was the safest bet to make, since there is no fucking way an actual Final Fantasy would get people hyped up, also the expectations were not as big.
In the end both games suffer from the "Final Fantasy, but not really that much of a Final Fantasy" If you know what I'm saying. They are there, but nowhere near as memorable, its probably a one playtrough-worth games, where you forget about their existence after finish.

>xv has combat variety
I almost took your post seriously user.

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>There are people in a fucking JRPG thread, in a FF thread claiming the games are bad because of convoluted stories.
>In a genre where a 16year old mutes regularly topple technologically advanced intercontinental empires secretly run by satan, travel through time to charge up rocks to turn into a sword and then kill god with the power of anime.
You fuckers would have hated the 90s.

Based Serahfag

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Goddamm step aside Tifa.

Retard detected

Those quotes sounds pretentious and empty. I hate the aesthetic, marketting and mindset the series has had since the merger. FFXII was the last pure FF, even though I couldn't stand it.

Why not post the actual map of that area? Surely an image exists of it on Google

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this webm can't be real lmao

XIII because it was the beginning of a decade of shit games. XV was the climax, the ultimate turd that came and hopefully has served as the final lesson to SE to ditch everything they'd been doing since XIII and make a glorious return to the golden age of FF games starting with 7R I hope

He was living the dream

You mean 7 right, that one spinned the series into weird futuristic but not shit

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recorded it myself, it's about as real as it gets.

KH3 > FFXV

Report back 20 hours later

>xv is a B
mate what the fuck is wrong with you

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I wish they can make more Chibi spinoffs

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Holy fucking based

Wrong and cringe.

Based. KH3 has its problems but I had more fun with it compared to FFXV.

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>XI that low and XV that high
You almost had it right but you had to be a newfag.

VI or VII.
Take your pick.

Keep coping, barry

>I-It gets worse in 20h

It's fun if you ignore all of the DLC episodes
MMOs are cancer

hey there barry

Why does square hate ffVI so much?

No, 20 hours is actually when it gets good.
But after 20 hours of corridors you'll have a different opinion. I started out loving FF13

Step aside Tifa? More like get in the spotlight Tifa. We're getting her trailer tomorrow.

You never played it, I get it newfag.

Oh fuck oh fuck. My og waifu. Nomura better not ruin her.

yeah i never played XV DLC because by the time it came out I was done and bored with the game

>Too linear in FF13
>Open world is pointless in FFXV
Why can't we get a good middle?

I've yet to play LR, but I've played XIII and XIII-2 as well somewhat recently and had a pretty good time. The linearity in XIII didn't really bother me a lot and the characters manage to grow on you. I wish the different mechanics got unlocked a bit faster. The game does take its time there. Doesn't make a lot of difference whether you're gated into specific areas because of high level mobs kicking your asses or whether it's a corridor. Both result in the same linear experience most of the time, though I guess you do miss out on the illusion of freedom in the latter.

Tetsuya Nomura

Its true, they would've probably reee'd at Legend of Legaia.

I spent 5 hours setting up the launcher for FFXI and then loaded into a totally empty town with useless NPCs and TERRIBLE fucking combat

Because they have no confidence in FF as a franchise anymore and are too scared to commit to any single vision.

Based fellow IV Chad

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I'm about 35h in on chapter 11 doing some side quests. I don't have any complain about the game besides the linear part and it didn't bothered me too much.

Hey retard. Not that guy but please understand that MMORPGs are trash no matter what, it's not even that uncommon of an opinion, time to accept it.

13-2 and 3 are not on PS4.

lol

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yo i wanna suck those titties

Cucked and blueballed.

I fucking love Lightning Returns and it's in my top 5 FFs, it's too bad no one played it

Hey thanks for proving my point faggots.

they both did

Squareenix isnt the same company that made Crono Cross, FF6 FF7 etc

I feel like no matter what they do to Tifa, it's going to spark a huge controversy.

I don't think there's anything necessarily wrong with trying out completely different designs for familiar enemies, but yeah FF13 sucks

You don't have one. All you have is the inability to accept that others may not share your passion for the worst genre in video games, aka autism.

The story didn't give you cancer?

Based
Cringe

absolutely FF15

mind you, 13 is underrated: the first game gets a lot of shit for being linear (it is) but so is FFX. 13-2 and LR are both much better games, and the art/sound in both are very good.

Play 13-2 now and you'll enjoy it if you skipped it before.

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FF13 is worse because it has actual sequels.
At least XV's shitshow ended with a single game

Actually...i could accept that as a suitable port/remake project. Id take some chibi remakes.

Yeah on Yea Forums, the board currently up in arms over the existence of the sun in another upcoming game.
No sane person cares about Tifa's tits that much.

Lmao at waifu retards trying to justify FFXIII

You literally just posted some old outdated slightly reworded copy pasta to avoid archive detection like a retard because you clearly never played it

All sidequests are the exact same shit you did in FF1-12. Hunts are exactly the same as in 12, get frogs quest just like in 9, get item for item reward no different than get kupo nut for item reward in 9, get minerals to upgrade weapon no different than get adamantite to get new sword in ff1, melusine quest, zu quest, deadeye quest, chardanook exactky the same thing as any optional boss quest in any other ff, fuck off you lying cunt
It is nothing like 13 and every mainline FF is linear as fuck that separates open wide areas from the actual story progression areas in linear spaces
Its not capped to pad anything its and you can literally upgrade the driving speed by getting new parts, not to mention how fast chocobos are and the fact that you have fast travel anyway
You clearly never played it, camp sites net you buffs which are necessary for harder hunts and fights and dungeons, EXP only raises level which doesnt boost stats nearly as much as food buffs do, your stats and buffs which affect stats determine everything, not your level, level is a literal non factor for the player, it only holds relevance for enemies who are at certain levels
You can brute force any RPG by spamming potions and revives, this is not a valid argument
So Magic actually requires thought to use and this is a bad thing?
A post game dungeon that is clearly just a series of challenge floors? Are you even fucking trying?

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oh come on, there's the classic Hold One Button To Win mode and then there's Nuke Your Friends With Magic Pots mode

I mean that was true until FF15's financial access, as I mentioned before re: Tabata.

its not canon

FF has been garbage since 12

No, the story is ok.

No, that would be Lightning Returns.

XV is bad partly because of XIII's after effects which STILL linger even a decade later.

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>No sane person cares about Tifa's tits so much
Not yet...

There is over 15 unique weapon types and each 4 bro has entirely unique combat sysyem mechanics and actions, are you retarded?

13 was bad but it was a bad FF game. 15 was bad and it didn't feel like a FF game at all. So I'd say 15 was worse. Also 13's combat wasn't terrible.

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Then you have abysmal taste in story and writing.
Half that script is l'cie and fal'cie

XII is my least favourite game ever.
It’s the instalment that turned me away from the series.

>a game from the genre i hate can't be good
>you're not being open minded about others btw!
The irony. I think you're the one with autism here.

>XII
>anything but lowest tier

I don't know why you fags insist upon trying to label it as anything but bullshit.

This. FFX is a good game but this is where FF went off the rail and never recover ever since.

The gameplay is great and that first half is one of the best FF games.

No FUCKING way

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Wrong, see Ff13 felt nothing like a FF while XV was inherently FF at its core and throughout

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Here i'll do it for you.

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That is the actual map of the whole chapter 13 area

I hope you are baiting because if not you have some serious mental problems.

Thats not the whole map, thats only 1 floor because the map only shows the current floor you are on, this shows the whole entire ch13 map for every floor

So, when do you think Barry will get banned again?

Double based

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I'm not the same user, but I plodded through the game and put in about 150 hours into it.

It was fucking lame, user; BEYOND fucking lame. FFXII is the game that killed my interest in Final Fantasy.

What's with the sudden revisionism?
The entirety of FFXIII is fucking garbage

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15 was that bad

Nope lmao

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>aerial spellcasting
BULLSHIT

13. 15 actually had the makings of a potentially good game that had to be thrown together fairly quickly, and had likeable characters despite its very rushed story.

Zelda syndrome.
People trying to retroactively defend XIII

15 was so bad it makes 13 looks good to many autists.

You're forgetting the fact that it was you who replied with accusations of newfaggotry over the other dude stating that he didn't like XI.
My post is also a proclamation of dislike towards the genre, neither of us criticized your favorite MMO for what it is because neither of us care enough to play it.
Do you understand now?

Post that on Critical difficulty

I always thought it was fine

>stand still and do nothing
>don't get punished for a full minute
>could have just used one of your 99 revival items anyway
lmao, imagine defending that kind of shit game design for an action game.

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samefag

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And I said he proved my point, unless you consider playing a game for 10 minutes enough to rate a game.

Why are the FFV Goblins naked.

fuck off badonkadonk

Even if i disagree with his direction of where the game is going, Yoshida fucking gets how to actually make a good story/characters/world and translate that into the mmo space.

This is what happens when a delusional waifufag directs Final Fantasy.

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>All sidequests are the exact same shit you did in FF1-12.
that doesn't make them good
>Its not capped to pad anything...fast travel
learn to read
> camp sites net you buffs which are necessary for harder hunts and fights and dungeons
>You can brute force any RPG by spamming potions and revives
completely contradictory statements
>Magic
my fault for fucking the wording. They take more thought and investment for *less reward*
than unga bunga me swing sword
>challenge floors
the only challenge is not fucking falling asleep as you fight the same group of tonberries/mindflayers/griffons in the same room for the 80th time

Holy fucking cringe

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I don't understand how FF14 has good characters, I simply do not understand where you get that from

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Spirits Within having nothing Final Fantasy about it causing Square to lose so much money they merged with Enix and haven't produced a worthwhile title since.

>gameplay is great
>1st half is one of the best FF games

LOL come on, now. The game doesn't even get remotely interesting until you reach Archadia, and even that doesn't last for very long. And how in the FUCK did you enjoy the gameplay? Not only is it slow and boring as fuck, but all of the good rewards and drops are locked behind such unbelievably time-consuming RNG that the odds of stumbling upon any decent gear during a blind playthrough are fucking astronomical.

The only thing about the game that's impressive is that they managed to make it run on a PS2. Everything else about it is nothing short of a chore.

>samefag

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The gameplay is bad in xv but at the very least it has good characters. The post game dungeon was also genuinely good

xiii is garbo

X is linear as fuck, but the systems within it are 20 times more interesting than anything 13 has to offer. Plus, X actually has a good story, good characters, and amazing world building.

KH fags defend FF13 because its the only FF they played because watanabe co-wrote it and co-wrote some KH games

they're also still triggered that KH3 was trash while XV was kino so they shill FF13

>the games certainly had their issues, but for me the combat more than makes up for it

Only being able to switch between 5 classes while the Computer picks abilities is not a good combat system

t. kh sperg

Your point is that someone is a "newfag" because they put FFXI too low on a fucking tier list. You insist on this retardation despite getting an answer as to why it was placed there.
If not autism then why? Why insist? Reality check faggot, FF is not an MMO series primarily and you should expect people to place the MMOs low on their lists if they're not into the genre.

13 (initial) got a lot of flack but 13-2/LR are legit much better games

I wish more rpg games used the LR system for combat, it's a nice combination of turn based with skill/timing based actions.

pretty much this, my month was ruined when i saw that movie

As a character? Lightning.
Who's game fucked it more? 15. At least lightnings games were fun to a degree combat wise and had some challenging fights and shit. 13-2 was a pretty good game. 15 on the other hand is a nice world, but the combat is the most utterly dogshit thing in existence. KH was already bad enough to begin with, but hold square to win managed to make it worse somehow.

Please explain your priorities in evaluating a game so I can have a good raff.

FFXII was boring as fuck and only impressive on a technical level. Prove me wrong.

Have you....PLAYED 14? Through all of ARR? 2.X? HW? SB? Post SB?

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A good majority of the Scions get indivudal arcs dedicated to them at points in the story, villains actually have proper build up and motives, side characters that participate in the main story are also pretty well developed, the player character is given an entire job quest line dedicated to the effects their actions have on them with incredible writing.

I'd say XIV has good characters.

its part of the parrycounter he does on behemoth and iron giants

Yes. But FF13 needed THREE FUCKING GAMES, an anime, and other shit to tell it's shit.

I partially blame both on that stupid ass "Nova Crystal FF13" series shit they were trying to do with Versus 13/15, Agito/Type-0, and 13 (before the sequels) for that shit.

>switch between 5 classes
>or spam the one ability worth using like most other FFs

>15 unique weapon types
That make almost no difference when elemental affinities and over all equipment bonuses are all that matters. Also guns are absolute shit because you can't even shoot and move at the same time and they fire too slow
>Each 4 bro has entirely unique combat systems
Ignis swings at enemies, Gladio swings at enemies, and Prompto shoots stuff. Unless you're controlling them directly all it takes is one flying enemy and they're reduced to live bait

I haven't actually played LR, but everything i've seen of LR's combat system made me really want to play it cause it looked fun as hell.

Why has the merger caused the company so much creative stagnation?

XIII's world is far more interesting and imaginative. The majority of XV looks like an Arizona trailer park.

you clearly haven't touched XIV ever

>any ff above b
curve grading was a mistake

Not to mention that the controllable party members had to be patched in instead of being in the game from the start.

what gaem

The only bad characters out of the main cast in XIV are Lyse and Y'shtola.

I mean....whats not "FF" about it?
It has 'Cid' (legacy franchise name), its about a dying world and a ragtag group fighting to protect it.
Sure its more science fantasy than fantasy, but it still IMO fits the idea of the FF franchise about always going for new worlds/stories that play off of certain ideas/mythologies/names.

Spirits Within was underrated, I think, and probably wouldve done better had it come out a few years later or even something similar instead was done in modern times.

Why? Kh3 needs difficulty settings added post launch to be made harder? pathetic

Are you illiterate? Did you ignore that noctis is at level 120 with max default defence plus when recovered by a member your defence is buffed by multiple times? While that boss destroys noct in 6 hits to 0 hp regular before he gets recovered and defense is multipled by recovery buff from gladio, if I fought that boss without that buff unlocked and at the regular level 40 youd regularly be at by then then he'd die in 1-2 hits

Hell even fighting aranea at level 120 with max level default defence takes 3 hits to hit 0hp and lose the fight
You're fucking retarded and BTFO, KH3 lets you do nothing and win, eat shit.

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The gameplay. In a JRPG specifically it's all about coming up with plans to approach fights that are typically too hard/tricky to do on the level that I am.
FF12 offers both many such challenges and ways of tackling them. ZA allows the player to experiment to their heart's content with the license boards and that's the feature I value the most about it.
Also it feels like an actual adventure spanning multiple nations, full of things to explore and discover, also something I look for in a JRPG.

I'm in HW and it's just fucking horrible, it's like a typical anime plot except even worse because of these EMBARRASSING cutscenes without voice acting or anything

>taking the newfag claim this seriously
autism
The reality is that its genre is irrelevant to its score. By your idiotic argument, WoW should be ranked the lowest of all Blizzard/WarCraft games, and yet the "reality" is that it's the complete opposite.

so obvious

it's arguably the best part of the game, you actually need to time blocks and so on and swap between different styles: fun system once you get used to it.

>13-2 ALSO had cancelled DLC which were all supposed to be part of the main story. Kitase comfiened they cut enough content out of FF13 to make a whole other game with, FF13 is literally unfinished
Yet somehow XV is better even though it released unfinished, separately sold you parts of the game that were literally cut out with no explanation (Gladio just needs to "go do something" out of the blue guys don't worry!), then cancelled three other expansions? Come on now

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My favorite part about XV. Everything 1-2 shots you and you just spam potions to win

Funny user. Fans of KH love XV and hate XIII

That being said, XIII is a complete game, XV isn't. So of course XIII is a far better game.

Congratulations, you are officially autistic

The Oath in Felghana
And in the webm I posted it's time attack mode which means equipment is maxed out (normally impossible at any point of the game without obscene grinding) and on top of that there is no way to restore your HP in that game. Compare that to FFXV where you have virtually unlimited HP due to being able to stack 99 of every healing item (and being able to be revived by your AI teammates indefinitely if they're alive). Dying in 1-2 hits doesn't matter when the boss has to kill you literally 100 times for you to actually die. But then again, FFXV is made for senile old people, not people who actually enjoy videogames.

How are the PC ports for 13 and the sequels?
I bought the original 13 on Xbox 360 years ago but didn't have the patience to finish it and want to give it another go since I loved XV so much

One is development hell spawn the other is just a bad game

Get help

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No I just have better taste in stories/art than you

>cutscenes without voice acting or anything
You mean just like every FF game that's worth a shit in the characters department?

15
13 is bad storywise but it was fun to play
15 bad overall plus it was suppose to be long awaited nomura ff

Fine now.

Horrible.
XIII is the only one that works somewhat well.
I recommend playing on console, especially Xbox One since it has 4K patches

I heard the ports were ass but had the absolute ass parts ironed out somewhat. However you liked XV so that means you have no standards at all, so you'd be fine with the PC versions even if they were as bad as they were at launch

passable to garbage depending on your expectations, but at the time SquEnix couldn't into PC's

>13
>fun to play

How dare, Yshtola n Lyse are both solid. Lyse undergoes a shite ton of growth and for those who experienced (or at least read up on/watched what they could) 1.0, her tells and foreshadowings are PHENOMENAL. Her growth is fantastic.

Typical anime plot? I dont know a ton of 'typical anime plots' with shite tons of political and religious intrigue/heresy/betrayal. HW is like "What if kinda like GoT but FF." Which honestly I enjoy. How far into HW are you even?

FF7 has better non-voice acted, in-engine cutscenes than FF14.

If I know anything, it's that Final Fantasy 12 was the last possible chance for Final Fantasy to stay good because it was made by people who actually cared still, got fucked over in development, and everyone didn't understand how great it was and everything went downhill from there
Square didn't kill Final Fantasy, the fans did
And Square

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>"What if kinda like GoT but FF."
YIKES!!!!!

Here's your (you)

So then complain about EVERY FF you hypocritical fuck

Are you illiterate? You can increase movement speed and also it takes you the same amount of time to drive from hammerhead to Chocobo Post than it does going from Kalm to Chocobo Ranch

Nothing was contradictory you illiterate fuck, you just cant fucking read or know how RPGs work

They have HUGE FUCKING REWARD, holy shit did you even use them? They deal a fuckton more damage than any regular weapon you have on you

It's literally a fucking 100 floor challenge have you even played a fucking summon night swordcraft game before? its exactly the same thing

play 13-2 or LR

Fair enough, user. Indeed these would have been interest things that I too would have probably enjoyed if the game wasn't slower than molasses. I really don't think I've ever played a game with such a horrifyingly misguided sense of pacing.

Then again, I only played through the vanilla version on PS2 which was definitely nothing more than a punishing, masochistic experience. The fact that they added a way to speed the game up in the updated versions of it means that the devs fully recognized how badly paced the game is.

It doesn't, only FF14 trannies pretend it does because noone actually played it yo find out if they're lying or not so they don't go against them saying it so it gets regurgitated

Lyse undergoes a lot of nonsensical and half-assed development. She also might as well be a different character; there is nothing left of her "Yda" personality after the reveal ever, even in post-SB quests. She is also objectively so retarded that she should have been thrown in jail due to being aware of how tempering works and allowing tempered beastmen into her conference.

yes it was especially in compare to one button degeneracy in 15

>but 13-2/LR are legit much better games

Not that much better IMO. The combat system is still pretty ass in 13-2.

Cor fight is harder than anything in any ff13 game

Lyse is a bad character in SB, before SB she was interesting and fun to be around.

I'm taking your autism seriously m8, because it is a serious case.
You keep pushing this back and forth over someone's tier list in case you haven't noticed, the most personal and opinionated thing ever conceived. It is the fact that this is what triggered you that I take issue with.
Should I have just never responded to you to tell you that you were acting like a fag? Probably, but I just couldn't resist, that's just how much of an autist you come across as, in my opinion.

FF11 shits all over 14

I mean to be fair, 14's voice acting parts are great for character dev.

Sure kiddo. Sure. Which one of Sephiroth's "remnants" do YOU want to be for Halloween?

Also while im at it "without voice acting";
My dude....Not every MMO is ESO/SWTOR; they have to choose what to voice or not. Text is fine. It did the job just fine for 15-20 years until voice acting, it does just fine now.

FFXV doesn't even feel like Final Fantasy, it's like one of those half assed offshoots. It feels more like a spiritual sequel to The Last Story than anything else.

You mean Yda was. Lyse is a different character entirely.

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FFXV was kinda bad, but XIII had three games worth of bad.

I can never quite tell whether people are complaining about the actual FFXIII or the trilogy as a whole. The first one did get some getting used to, but I ended up liking it, after my dictionary was full enough to comprehend all the world specific lingo thrown at me and the game finally gave me all gameplay mechanics. XIII-2 I had a great time with, especially since I was now familiar with most of the mechanics. The timecop shenanigans were a cool storytelling approach, kinda a FF version of Maniac Mansion 2 and the story was poignant and I gave fucks about the characters, which was pretty surprising, as Serah was such a non character in FFXIII. Noel was great too. The timeline with the respawning L'Cie was garbage though. Looking forward to playing LR.

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This
Plus FFXV ended up being bad because of FFXIII

I appreciate your concern and I'm glad you responded since you made good arguments.

I've played through the MQ story, it's pretty good from what i've seen. way better than WOW at any rate.

>Then complain about EVERY FF
I would but the discussion was about 15 and I haven't played most of them because I hate JRPG's
>Are you illiterate?
I said they pad out the beginning of the game you brain dead retard, you know before you can increase the speed cap or fast travel?
>Nothing was contradictory
Saying that "you need buffs for these fights but can win without them" sounds pretty fucking contradictory to me
>They have HUGE FUCKING REWARD
Sure spells are rewarding, let me just spend 15 minutes collecting the materials, mixing and matching ingredients to get the optimal result, and the have that time I spent equal out to maybe 20% more effect than starting the fight earlier and hitting the enemy instead.
>have you even played a fucking summon night swordcraft game before
No and the name alone gave me terminal autism. Plus, as I stated earlier, just because a different game does it doesn't make it any better.

The pacing is fine. Travel speed would be an issue with how sparse the teleport crystals are but ZA has fixed that.
I don't think it's fair to damn the game because of issues that it had in the past but I can see how someone could be left with a bad taste in their mouth after playing it back when it came out on the ps2.
Then again that release was long ago at this point and the game is available on all platforms so I advise you to give it another chance.

The franchise is fine. Y'all niggas just turning into jaded boomers.

XV is not even final fantasy

XIII is bad, modern example of style over substance

If i had to chose then definitely XV is the worse one, i can't even get to chapter 2 because my absolute disgust toward the game

More like overly negative cunts cause they want it to be the same but also to change how they want but not to change TOO much.

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XIII probably did more damage to the brand but XV is the worse game. That shit wasn't even finished and was a total mess that was so different it doesn't even really feel like a FF game.

Yoshida is the only hope we have left and he's stuck working on Final Fantasy 14 which is the best MMO out there right now and a great Final Fantasy game, but I'd like a single player experience too

They make all the difference because mechanically they all function uniquely with different actions, attacks, warpstrikes, directionals, combos, manuals finishers etc, gun directional lets you dodge roll while shooting and changing direction, stop making shit up

Ignis has elemental daggers which eirher targets individial target, a string of multiple lined up targets or an aoe, plus dragoon jumps, buffs, a counter parry boost and damage multiplier that goes up to 10x regularly and up to 200x in his episode and has a focus guage on triangle which boosts damage dealt when full but can be used to heal by pressing triangle which depletes the meter, all three spell daggers have a completely different combo and use

Gladio has sword and shield combat with precise blocks on shields which uses stamina like souls, has sidesteps and parries identical to input as souls, a basic greatsword combo where from afar a directional lets you throw the sword or when near he punchs between attack hits, has a rage meter that builds up from successful parries and blocks and a special meter for triangle heavy attacks that grow to stronger different attacks the higher the meter is from a ground slam to a multi hit double slash to a triple spin slash to dual wielding two greatswords and wailing on enemies

prompto has TPS reticle shooting controls with a machine gun and bazooka, a first person scope view sniper rifle, action shooting handgun and aoe grenades, plus enemy debuffs with starshell and dual pistol barrage with trigger happy, plus stealth kills and melee with a baton axe which also has a special finisher move on triangle with crackshot

Picking words from a menu is nothing compared to actually unique combat systems per character, noctis already can do more than entire FF parties alone

>best MMO
>10s GCD
>best
YIKES

no it isn't

I mean 14 can do that for the most part. For Shadowbringers, they're adding a mechanic thats sorta like the NPC helpers of SWTOR or the Heroes of GW1 n such, effectively that you can "recruit" NPCs of the world to help you fight. Its to offset the higher difficulties of the zone to encourage partying (if i remember right) while ensuring that you can do the content even if alone.
Outside of raids, you can always do the content yourself for 14 (and for dungeons, DF is rarely an issue for finding peeps......usually.)

thats a hard one desu

FF14 is an online Sims game. It's kept alive by glamslutters and roleplayers. It was good in ARR and HW.

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FF14's GCD is only 2.5 seconds. Not 10. Try again dumbass.

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I'm glad this real life paedophile piece of scum is gone

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Still too much, even reducing it if played as monk, it still fucking sucks.

XV released more finished than 13 ever could be and will be you retarded sperg, none of the dlc were cut out of the main game, gladio leaving and coming back with a scar is no different than rydia leaving and coming back an adult

and all initial planned DLC came out, only the non canon bonus 2nd round of dlc was cancelled you stupid cunt

That was 6, you goddamn retard.

T. wow manlet

nice potions

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VI was still into the FANTASY PART, the whole castle knights and shit.

VII introduced a weird concept that doesn't fit ff

Yeah thats why Aether/Primal VASTLY outweigh Balmung/Mateus in pop size. Thats why 1/3 to 1/2 of Crystal left to go to Aether/Primal...because its all about the roleplayers.

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Nope, KH fags love ff13 and all KH games are unfinished trash as is FF13, XV is objectively more finished and content filled than any of them.

> i can't even get to chapter 2 because my absolute disgust toward the game
Same

BASED

>HW is like "What if kinda like GoT but FF."
No wonder it's terrible

I don't give a fuck about your specific Ys modes, I'm talking about the actual main game you dumb fucking sperg.

We already know you use 2 IPs

This is true, the MMO people are a reinforced circle of confirmation bias so strong it can't be broken. The problem with replacing a job with a video game

Are you stupid? You are aware that less than 10% of Western players clear savage raids? I posted that interview excerpt where Yoshida himselfs says roleplayers are the focus and only a fraction of players cares about combat. SHB combat changes are dumbing things down so hard that it's obvious they don't care about combat anymore. All the signs are there, yet you people furiously refuse to admit you're not the fucking focus group anymore, grind that 4 raids for months and shut up.

You mean the actual main game where realisticall you'll be geared and leveled and have an inventory full of healing items, versus the main game of Ys where you'll be more vulnerable? Sure let's talk about how FFXV is even easier than your cherrypicked webms make it out to be.

Pretty sure Monk also has one of if not THE longest 'optimal skill rotation' in the game; a truly optimal monk rotation can take anywhere from 75-120+ seconds to finish a single full true rotation on.

>it does just fine now
No when everything being said is pointless filler bullshit. You can skip 90% of cutscenes and lose absolutely nothing

Fuck off kh turd you literally press 1 button to play ff13 to input autobattle

spotted the child

If 13 had the combat of X and a slightly better story I would have actually enjoyed it.

>Tabata
>Paedophile

Now this I gotta hear.

>source: my ass
Are you really this delusional that you can’t possibly comprehend that multiple people think FFXV is shit?

XV feels the truest to FF that FF has ever been since FF9.

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Okay then. Summarize the approximate storylines of ARR, 2.X, and what you have experienced so far in HW. Its still fresh, so you should be able to do that if you "skipped everything" as you said.

You miss typed XIV

XIII. XV was definitely bad but it seemed more like a drain on Square Enix rather than damaging to the FF brand since that damage was largely done already. They developed that game for far too long, released it in an unfinished state and had to release a huge amount of DLC to plug the holes. Should have just canned the whole thing years ago. Cancelling the rest of their DLC was a smart choice.

XIII on the other hand was the only playable FF related thing SE produced for an entire generation. The longest lasting generation of consoles ever and all we got were these shitty games. Tons of people associate the FF brand with that garbage and only that.

While I think XV was the worse game, XIII marked the beginning of a massive downswing for FF. XIII and XIV 1.0 back to back dealt a devastating blow to the franchise and they spent so much time and money trying to recover from this (XIII's asset flip sequels trying to wring as much money as possible out of the money pit that was crystal tools and XIV A Realm Reborn) that XV suffered as well.

If it weren't for the successful turnaround of XIV, SE would have squandered two entire generations worth of FF. The PS5 is on the horizon and the last good game in this franchise would have been from the PS2 era or earlier. It really is a testament to how much good will they built up over the years for them to just stumble through these past two generations and not completely crash and burn though they came close.

SE seems entirely incapable of developing FF in the HD era and I have huge reservations about whatever XVI ends up being. It's no wonder they hit the VII remake button and they're managing to fuck up what should have been the easiest money in the world with that too.

only if you played for 2 chapters
13 is the most challenging ff games

So you're full of shit since you never played it and are just being a contrarian cunt.

It doesn't pad out anything you can literally get chocobos by ch3 and ch1 and 2 are only like an hour long each where most of ch2 is inside dungeons and most of ch1 is running around questing on the overworld, you spend less than 10 fucking minutes in the car in either chapter

Reminder

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not the guy you're replying to, but why would you do that if you didn't like the game?

>forgetting about the mechs the fact that there was like TWO fucking castles, one of which was a mechanical sand-submarine, the other was a fucking european castle in the FF6 equivalent of Japan for no explained reason, forgetting about the fucking lab, forgetting about damn near everything else
It was schizo-tech, but definitely different enough from 1-5.

13 fags are shit

just because its not the newest ff game anymore doesn't mean we have to hold it to any respect.

imma be honest here. I liked ff13's battle system. technically I only liked it's paradigm system. but that's possibly that's my introduction to new FF games past ff8. i didnt play any ff after 8.

XV it doesn't even feel like Final Fantasy if not for main characters it could easily pass as WRPG.

>ARR
Dark evil mages are evil and causing a bunch of low level problems. Turns out they're actually helping the empire (LE GASP) and you have a big battle versus the big empire bad and the big mage bad to save the world.
Nothing else that happens along the way has any bearing on the story.
2.x I skipped, go fuck yourself that was tedious as fuck. I quit after Moogle King
HW has your party invited to a big castle and curry favor with the various factions within the castle. there's implications of dragons coming back and wanting to merge with humanity. nothing presented so far is anything new, unique, creative, or well executed.

just saw the cloud titan thing and that airship escape is CRINGEWORTHY in how it's just models moving in-engine

I like XIII-3 battles best, the best FF battle system imo

I don't know which game trashed the franchise the worst.
I do know which game is peak FF, though.

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>give it another chance

I literally beat it about 10 days ago, so I have absolutely no intention of touching it again for some time. I tried my best to 100% the game and even went so far as to get the Wyrmblade Hero sword, so trust me when I say I've had my fair share of it for at least a decade.

In the future I may give one of the updated versions a chance but for now I've had just about all the FFXII that I can stand.

But you can't win without the buffs retard, spending 3 hours doing chip damage is not winning the fight as intended in under 5 minutes you fucking autist, you aren't winning anything other than the biggest autist award for being as retarded as possible

You literally get elemancy at every fucking campspot and you collect items to build to that as part of game progression, this is not a valid complaint itd be like complaining you have to do gold saucer shit to get rare materia in FF7

Stop making it so obvious you never played the game let alone any FF or JRPG

XV was by far the biggest departure from anything else Final Fantasy by name. The game was basically Advent Children The Game

XV is the most true FF to be a FF since FF9

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God no.

The mechanical castle could be compared with the steampunkish tech from FFV

The magitek was MAGICAL technology

Fuck off Nomura fag

This thread convinced me to get Lightning Returns. I hope I can see Lightnings feet in that game

Yeah wrong FFT my boy that one is trash, it was a major downgrade from the psx one

The tp the bp

13 had a great battle system when the Crystarium was more evolved later in the game. Pretty much that and the Archylte Steppe were the only redeeming points.

FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII
FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII
FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII
FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII
FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII
FF XIII FF XIII FF XIII

Did you just ignore how Level 120 ara fight has you lose as soon as you hit 0hp as in there is no danger state to help you and that she has 1hko attacks? you retard?

Battle system is the only aspect of the game that Lightning Return got right, but for me it really was worth it just for the battle system alone

The proof is you're still replying

>Tons of people associate the FF brand with that garbage and only that.

That's more of a problem with consoles not being backwards compatible for the most part. Good thing most of them are on pc now (some ports better than others), so you can just point interested players to whatever version you think is best. Or they can check out all of them. Everything's available and they don't have to take the crusty word of oldfags for it, how everything's so much better in previous "generations".

Not really sure, desu. I found myself asking that very same question a lot during the game.

I guess it's because I had already invested so much time and energy into it that not finishing it up in its entirety would feel like an even greater waste than it already was. I'd already made up my mind to finish the game once and for all, so I figured I ought to try to 100% it while I was at it. At least then my disgust for the game could be entirely justified and not just the half-assed ramblings of someone who fundamentally misunderstands it.

artificial difficulty

No I didn't, ff14 feels like a generic theme park spinoff and not an actual FF game or earnest FF world

Wow great. That's a required fight for the story and not some irrelevant meme fight that offers nothing other than a useless achievement? Maybe FFXV isn't as casual as I thought it was.

>an online dressup game is the best ff game
yeah okay

13 is just autobattle to win

That the mod is talking about pillars of eternity 2 you lying fuck?

boards.fireden.net/v/thread/417135398/#417141527

Stop samefagging badonkadonk

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Not the best game but the first in ages to actually capture what ff should feel like

You played all the way through the original ps2 version while ZA was out? Why?

Fucking retard, that one is about POEfag/Kiddinity-kun.

>still talking out of his ass
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

that's fair

>story
>world
>characters
>feel like they could be from some shitty nip tv show
>BUT LOOK AT THOSE MONSTERS BRO
retard

XV is the most true to the source of FF that FF has ever been since FF9, even Sakaguchi thinks so which is why he so highly praised XV and Tabata

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Yeah. If she's changed too much people will riot, if she's not changed enough the media will riot. Gonna be a shitstorm no matter what.

The only FF game that i loathe is XV, so yep XV for me

What is this about? I've always thought he's a full blown sociopath, but I've no idea about this and I need to know, please.

Yes it is, objectively