Has some of the worst enemy designs to ever grace the genre that only get more apparent the harder difficulty you climb

>being this obvious

Obvious about what?

Actually agree with most of this but:
>Very Hard and DMD are poorly balanced messes of difficulty that make the poor enemy and encounter design pop out
Very Hard is just fine. DMD is where the design flaws start to show.
>Arkham, Geryon, Gigapede, and Leviathan's Heart are all DMC2 tier bosses. Arkham being one of the worst fights in the franchise but gets a pass for some reason because of phase two
Geryon is an okay boss imo. The fact that you can knock him down by using helm breaker right before he runs into you makes fighting him a lot more fun.
>The rest of the bosses aren't bad but they aren't great or notable either, Vergil being the only good boss in the game.
Cerberus, Agni & Rudra, Nevan, and Beowulf are all great bosses.
>Vergil retroactively ends up being the easiest boss in the game on DMD due to his lack of horrible gimmicks and awful camera angles
Vergil 3 on DMD is the hardest boss in the game aside maybe from Arkham.

Well Ninja Gaiden was always the real king of the hack and slash genre...

babby first dmc, same reasons why mongs think mgs3 was the best

Absolutely disgraceful.

zoomer thread

Honestly had more trouble with Grey in on DMD than any Vergil fight. Vergil 3 only seems hard because his HP is higher than usual. He's still the same bait AI as his other difficulties and for some reason people seem to not get you have to knock Vergil out of DT on DMD.

>point out flaws
>get nothing but name calling and no arguments

Expected it, honestly. God forbid someone has a different opinion than keep parroting everything they're told to feel.

ngniggers should leave

but every enemy is so well designed in dmc1
there may be less of them but when they're all well designed it makes up for it

why are dmc1fags so insecure?

That faggot is just some poser larping as a NGfag.

DMC3 is a zoomer game retard. If your first console was Ps2 you're a zoomer

Beowulf is a shit boss

I honestly don't get the hate for the repeating bosses in 1, made them feel more personal to me. Vergil is the only boss in 3 that mirrors this philosophy and look he's everyone's favorite boss.

dmc1 is the thinking man's dmc
dmc 3 is just for le ebin combo and currrazh meme

No one's talking about 1 though

DMC 1 > DMC 3

DMC5 is objectively superior to DMC3 though, so why does everyone still continue to parrot this idea that 3 is the best?

Retard

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1. Opinions exist.
2. Nostalgia is a powerful emotion.
3. OP is a fag.

mgs3 is the only worthwhile metal gear.
Or are you a storyfag that actually thinks mgs has good writing?

MGS3 literally has the worst gameplay in the series. He's right, people who say MGS3 was the best are to have their opinions immediately discarded

stay mad dmc1cucks

mgs 1 and 2 are solid (no pun intended), get fucked.

Hell based ghost babel shit over mgs 3 and it a gameboy game

Nice argument retard.

>seething dmc3 babby cant handle facts

what facts? dmc3 being better?

It's not an argument, it's a fact.
Fucking retard

Care to expand on that you blatant nostaliafag?

>nostalia

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Wow a typo, better not actually engage in an argument.

at lacking atmosphere, horror, music, dmd that is good, better dante (bar the ending which he turns into based dmc 1 dante, not too much gimmick meme moves to just juggle some faggot ebin style, soul?

I'm not sure if this is bait or not, so if it is, then you're retarded
and if it's not, then you're retarded

Based retard.

>don't criticize my game

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Not surprised dmc1lets are illiterate. Dmc3 dante has an actual arc and character that shits all over le og Dante. Also has better costumes too, better ost and way better bosses/weapons. I’ll give you atmosphere tho

you really think this thread has any actual "critic" on it? wow
>This game sucks because I don't like it, and the things suck
>criticizing

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And DMC5 shits on DMC3 in every way except the freak occurrence where an Itsuno game actually had good characterization. DMC3fags cannot cope a better game came along so they have to cling to their shit story.

DMC3 gets points for being an innovator. I find it weird that less people give points to 1 for being an even bigger innovator (and also not having most of the issues in the OP to boot). I still think 3 is a fantastic game due to how well-designed every weapon, gun, and Style are overall, the bosses that aren't dogshit (every one you get a Devil Arm from is at least solid), having a bunch of post-game and bonus content in SE, and being one of the best examples of tying story into an action game without harming the gameplay whatsoever. While the music is mostly bland, I also find the leitmotif in the cutscenes scores to be very well-done. I also believe that Spiral is the most satisfying ranged weapon in any action game of this kind; running it in Gunslinger is incredible.

At the end of the day, I can see the argument for 1, 3, or 5 being your favorite DMC, because they're very different from one another despite being in the same series. One or two excel in areas the other(s) do(es) not, they each have features the others don't, etc. 5 is my favorite, but that's because I love having a ton of options, so Dante & Nero being loaded in their arsenals appeals to me greatly, while V is a fascinating experiment that I enjoyed learning (I don't mind him even on DMD outside of fighting some of the bosses). I'll go back to 1 for enemy/level design and most of the bosses, and back to 3 for some of its weapons and mechanics and styles that didn't show up later on.

4SE is an 8/10 game that's worth playing but only for what it has that the others don't, like Credo, Lady/Trish, Vergil with Focus, Nero's Buster animations, Dark Slayer, doing big brain shit with Lucifer, etc.

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>Actually defending DT Flux, Arkham and DMD balance

I mean it's not surprising, honestly. It's not like DMC3fags actually played the game on a difficulty higher than Normal.

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Faggot, read my post. He turns into dmc 1 dante at the end
Which is better than him being a fucking edgy retarded zoomer thru out most of the game. He is more worst than dmc 2 dante
>better ost
lmao no.
>better weapons
most of them are literally in the first bar some meme weapons like the guitar
You got costumes tho.

DMC3 innovated its own franchise, 1 innovated and created an entire genre.

>NG2 that high
>Platinumshit in the S and A tiers
I can forgive W101 being where it is since that's their actually good game this is a sad genre of those games are considered to be the upper ranks

you lost it, user
you had me doubting about it for a second, knowing that in this world retarded people actually have access to the internet, but now your bait reaches obvious levels, so as I said, you're a retard either way

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Bayonetta 1 is legitimately a game on par with DMC3 and superior in other ways. I'm sorry you guys absolutely refuse to learn the Offset system and can't handle enemies that don't stand around and wait for you to kill them.

NG2 is way more fun than Black. Bayo needs to be higher on that list too.

I've yet to hear an argument from you in why you think anything I pointed out in the OP is wrong, or anything related to balance. Guess what, there's a reason Itsuno completely abandoned the DMC3 system of DT Flux and mirrored the enemy DT system to be lifted from 1 into 4 and why 4 and 5 DMD aren't as difficult. Turns out when your enemies aren't walking abominations of game design your game isn't as hard. Or please, actually try and defend Fallen.

That's basically what I said. DMC inspired the last 18 years of action games (barring perhaps some stuff that came out in '02 that were in development by the time DMC released and some outliers like Musou games), whereas DMC3 dragged the series out of the dumpster of 2 into a new direction that changed the series and gave some new ideas to the genre at large, but obviously didn't create it.

My memory/skill in every game on there isn't ideal. I just wanted to be comprehensive so I put on as much as I could say I have an opinion on. There's a handful of games on it I haven't played but are also there for the sake of being comprehensive, but I took the time to learn about how their combat works before putting them on.

Nice to see DMC getting shit threads for a change

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I'm not even trying to shit on DMC, or even imply DMC3 is a bad game. I'm pointing out what I think are flaws the game has and I'm getting literal fanboyism in response.

NG2 really is not as tightly designed as Black and I would even argue not as fair in some places. Bayonetta on the other hand, just lol. No game that relies so heavily on QTEs should be up that high.

How does bayo rely on QTEs?

>tightly designed
>fair
All I care about is fun, and NG2 is infinitely replayable for me. Combat is way better.

Dmc series has never had good bosses desu with notable exceptions like vergil, igni and rudra. the game shines with regular enemy combat though

>gave some new ideas to the genre at large

Like what? Real time weapon switching was a natural evolution of DMC1's purposely slowed in-game weapon switching. Aside from that you do not see anything DMC3 "created" in most action games because games like NG, God Hand, and Bayonetta prioritize a players defensive skills as well as their offensive, often mixing them together. DMC3 is completely front loaded for offense, you can literally jump your way out of most damage in DMC3 so there's no need to actually prioritize learning defense. RG is there, sure, but it's not a necessity and you can easily cheese it (massively lowering the skill ceiling needed to use it well) with Roll and Jump Guarding.

WHile combat and enemy design and things like that were the main factor I weighed when making that, I also took other factors into consideration. Bayo would probably be a tier higher on its combat/weapons/enemies alone, but there's a LOT of shit that disrupts it. Not just genre shifts and QTEs, but some of the level design (the burning city is extremely frustrating to figure out at first) and the bosses outside of Jeanne/Balder ranging from mediocre to shit.

If the list was 100% combat-based, then Revengeance would probably be in B-Tier as well, for example.

Shit on DMC5 if you're so brave

>Bayonetta
>heavily relies on QTEs

You mean the optional context sensitive buttons presses that are completely up to the player to use, like God Hand? If you actually think Bayonetta relies on QTEs and I can you were never very good at the game, let alone actively tried to explore and get better at the Offset system.

You're forgetting Credo, Cerberus, King Cerberus, V's Summons, Nelo Angelo, Nevan, and Urizen 3

Shitty story, complete lack of level design and "puzzles" didn't stop you from putting dmc5 on the very top though.

TOO MUCH CUSSING AND CUTSCENCE

>bosses ranging from mediocre to shit

This is basically every action game though. A slew of serviceable bosses, a couple of shit ones, and one or two genuinely good ones.

Whether you're a fan of it or not, DMC3's systems introduced a much faster, combo-based game than 1 did (you could combo but it was often rudimentary, mostly juggling with projectiles). All of that is exacerbated by Turbo Mode. 4 took the combo wank to an extreme with Dante and not in a good way, while 5 I think perfected it, but a lot of action games since DMC3 go for that hyper style of play.

>Has some of the worst enemy designs to ever grace the genre that only get more apparent the harder difficulty you climb
this isn't an argument
>Very Hard and DMD are poorly balanced messes of difficulty that make the poor enemy and encounter design pop out
why? this isn't an argument either
>DMD is completely balanced around one mechanic that is never seen again, a mechanic that actively punishes players not willing to play the entire game around it
??? what mechanic?
>Arkham, Geryon, Gigapede, and Leviathan's Heart are all DMC2 tier bosses. Arkham being one of the worst fights in the franchise but gets a pass for some reason because of phase two
what are you talking about? everyone agrees that Arkham is a mess, so? that isn't enough to screw up a game score, and that "DMC2" tier is just an opinion, again, no argument
>The rest of the bosses aren't bad but they aren't great or notable either, Vergil being the only good boss in the game. Vergil retroactively ends up being the easiest boss in the game on DMD due to his lack of horrible gimmicks and awful camera angles
opinion opinion opinion (and a shitty lot of them)
>Music is overall mediocre aside from some stand out tracks like Vergil 1, Devils Never Cry, and Cerberus' theme
like this wasn't a matter of opinion, huh, most of us just find it better than any other DMC at least
>Everything in the game feels floaty, the only thing in the entire game with any sense of impact or feedback is Real Impact
???
>Is retroactively made inferior by later games taking what it did well (weapon variety and Style system), having none of its flaws, and expounding on them exponentially
no other game was able to "take everything that made DMC3 good", in fact, no other entries even tried
>Yet people still try and say this game is not only the best DMC game, but the best game in the entire genre
It's the best DMC game
Who cares about the genre

why are we supposed to give you arguments when you present none?

>DMC3 innovated its own franchise, 1 innovated and created an entire genre.
We wouldn't have Platinum's games or any of the cuhrayzee indie games if it weren't for 3 making everything faster and more combo-oriented.

Honestly, if you're going to go by that criteria than both TW101 and DMC5 need to dropped a level. I love TW101 to death, but some of it's shmup operations are absolutely awful, and playing as V in DMC5 legitimately kills all of my interest to replay it. On top of the awful level design at the tail end, and the utterly rushed and unsatisfying story.

they are slightly above average, not great.

These. The fuck is this revisionism bullshit. DMC3 is great game. Quit being a fuckwit.

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Almost agree entirely, but that big dude who throws cages at you is pretty good.
DMC 3 is fucking awful, 1 and 5 are the only good ones, but even those are subject to progression cancer

It's really sad to see all these zoomers shitting on a great game like DMC3 just because they played 5 once and think they're suddenly a combo God and a veteran action game designer.

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DMC3 literally just took cues from one and expanded on them because DMC3 was a game that was developed as an action game from the ground up. That would have been a natural evolution of the genre with or without DMC3. And you're completely ignoring my argument about offense and defense oriented gameplay. Ninja Gaiden, Bayonetta, and God Hand absolutely do not play like DMC3.

and you wouldnt had any of those games without based dmc1

>Credo is slightly above average

I mean, I'm not necessarily disagreeing but I'm just saying that 3 was pretty influential in its own right as well.

>Zoomers
God I'm sick of this meme
DMC is a poor franchise and 3 is terrible

This thread is too far gone.

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so you have shit taste then? ok

>this assblasted dmc3 babby

>Visit DMC threads
>UWU VERGIL
>GOBLINA
>LE BANG BANG
Literally no gameplay discussion

>just ignore all the flaws and parrot its the best because that's what I've been indoctrinated by memes into

Fucking pathetic. It's absolutely hilarious you faggots will rip apart the smallest flaw in any other action game yet give DMC3 a pass on virtually everything. I am not trying to imply DMC3 is a bad game, but the complete hypocrisy on sweeping its flaws under the rug is astounding. This is especially concerning when you're quoting someone who does not care at all about challenge or the genre at large in order to continue to fellate your childhood game.

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have sex

You haven't played any other action games have you?

Bayo 1 is below-average even with that metric, though. The Jeanne fights are good, but only the last could be considered great, and Balder is just a solid penultimate boss. Pretty much every Angel boss was bland, and Jubileus is Arkham-tier trash from a gameplay perspective (although I like the sense of scale and the post-fight stuff with her a lot).

I'm not trying to be objective here, I'm just giving my thought process, and personally my SSS tier is my 3 favorites in the genre. I enjoyed DMC5's story for what it was despite the pacing issues, I found the level design outside of the tree good enough to even out the bad within it (although more Nidhogg hatchling puzzles would've helped at least make the game feel a bit less linear), and I actually really like playing as V once I learned his gameplay loop on higher difficulties. W101 I never got truly frustrated at like I did with Bayo, and I actually quite enjoyed some of the signature Kamiya genre flips in it; I also think its underrated story and completely unique gameplay style should be given more of a spotlight.

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3 sucks with its constant menu diving and weak ass camera. Subsistence fixes the camera true but its annoying how you have to crawl instead of giving us a crouch run

>It's really sad people are trying to form their own opinions by playing the game instead of parroting what people tell them too

This is how you sound, congratulations.

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fuck me i never played dmc4 or 2

you can't beat this trio

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Barry pls
You need to let go

do you?

>Pretty much every Angel boss was bland
Every Cardinal Virtue aside from Fortitudo (the very first one you fight) is actually fucking great. I still remember fighting game again and again just because I could the first time I played that game just because I was having fun with a game.

But you didn't play the game if you're complaining about it 14 years later.
You're just parroting your shit taste and your newfag is showing.

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>thinking you have a valid opinion taking a game out of context

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>Bayo 1 below average
This is the pit of idiocy dmcfags operate on
Do I what?

>hating on the DMC3 soundtrack
Fuck off.

Lady is a worthless non-character with no relevance anymore and Dante would have had his revelation about family without her ham fisted speech. Not even Itsuno gives a fuck about her.

You do realize you're not going to make this happen, right? Ninja Gaiden fans and DMC fans overlap, you stupid fuck.

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Good songs
>The first 2 minutes of Devils Never Cry
>Cerberus Theme
>Vergil 1 and 3
Bad songs
>The rest

so, we agree that 4 and 5 lack in the character aspect?

>person that capitalizes greentext for no reason makes a retarded post
pottery

DMC3 and GOW literally killed my interest in the genre until it was revived by another series years later. I'm only now playing games that i missed because of DMC3.

How did you copy a line from the OP and get a typo

This thread was made by a DMC5 babby to cope

The HD Collection is available to anyone, the flaws that plagued the game 12 years ago are still very much there. But who am I kidding, I forgot I'm dealing with people who don't actually play the action genre, just people who play Itsuno's DMC games but happened to play DMC3 when they were kids. Why not try taking a crack at and trying to counter it since the others couldn't.

Let me re-iterate, again, because you fanboys absolutely cannot handle any form of criticism or discerning opinions. I am not saying DMC3 is a bad game, I am pointing out flaws in the game and I'm getting toddler "ur just retard" responses in return.

>Omitting Vergil 2 when it's the best track in the game
I bet you didn't even realize that in that theme, the guitars represent Dante and the classical elements represent Vergil while they fight for dominance. It's pure kino

I dont get why people like Black so much. It's so slow and stiff even more so than dmc1.

>the first game in the DMC series to introduce styles and actual combos killed my interest in the "genre"
This is your typical DMC3 hater retard

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>Guy says its bad without explaining it
>Therefore its bad
>GOD, YOU ARE ALL SUCH HYPOCRITES FOR CALLING ME OUT. YOU ALL WRITE OUT FULLY DETAILED EXPLANATIONS ON WHY AN ACTION GAME FAILED BUT YOU WON'T LET ME MAKE A POINT WITH THESE EMPTY GENERALIZED STATEMENTS.

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No, you're not pointing out any flaws, you're just spouting your shit opinion on a game you bought last week and couldn't git gud at.

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Tell me how 3 is better than 5 without hanging on the fact that 3 was the only Itsuno directed game that managed to have good characterization. You can't and you won't because you know 5 is better than 3 and your nostalgia will not let you accept it.

You have a strange definition of "most"

I did, except it's such a shallow observation it'd be like me pointing out that they added rain for dramatic effect. I get you played DMC 3 to cope with your mothers drinking problem, but the game isn't good

Why does he have to do that when he probably likes 3 and 5 just fine and you're trying to justify why you're hating on a good game?

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I can understand GoW but DMC3 is literally one of the turning points of the entire genre.

the only good things about dmc5 are present in dmc3

Present me an argument where the DT Flux system in conjunction with the enemy DT system is not a flaw. While acknowledging that Itsuno dumped both out the window in the next game and again with 5. If you want take personal bias this far I can easily say the camera in DMC1 is not an issue because you can get used to it or the lack of content in DMC4 is non issue because I liked Fortuna castle.

>DOAfag thinks he has any room to talk

>the camera in DMC1 is not an issue because you can get used to it
lol
>Present me an argument
You start

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>I get you played DMC 3 to cope with your mothers drinking problem
What the fuck? Do you have something you need to talk about user?

>The only counter to people with legitimate criticisms against 3 is saying "zoomer"
Guaranteed 3fags haven't played an actually hard game in their life, like Daioujou

The only good things in 3 are better in 5. Sorry. 5 has superior enemy designs that don't stink of amateur hour game developers and the Style and weapon system has been expanded on so heavily that it makes 3 feel like 1.

not him, but you are a fuckin retard if you think 3 isn't good

3fags played it as a kid and their nostalgia is off the charts, so they seethe whenever someone doesn't like their shovelware trash

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>literal shitposts
>legitimate criticisms

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3 is awful though.

>Present me an argument where the DT Flux system in conjunction with the enemy DT system is not a flaw
that's not how it works, you gave no arguments so far. If you're the one that needs an explanation for your opinion, then you are admitting that your opinion is a weak one
>While acknowledging that Itsuno
why are you talking so much about Itsuno? aren't we the fanboys supposed to be the ones talking about it instead of you? so far you're the only one mentioning him, so there must be a reason for that

you clearly have no idea about this franchise or context to even discuss the matter, stop crying because people aren't changing your mind full of dumb ideas, we can't remove that extra chromosome through text

>Confirmed little baby boy tries to have an argument about his shit taste

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Sure. DT Flux system is a poorly thought out mechanic in conjunction with enemy DT as it forces the player to play around DT Flux. This is not the case in any other DMC games. If you do not abide by the DT Flux system you are punished with DT'd enemies that have no thought put into them other than "just buff their HP and damage by insane amounts". You could argue the same thing was in 1, but enemies got other properties in 1 and the enemy design wasn't absolute trash. They created DMD to justify the existence of DT Flux, not actually providing a well balanced difficulty. It's difficulty for the sake of difficulty.

Make happen what?

>Criticisms of the enemy design, level design and combat design are shitposts
I see

3 is pretty much the most essential backbone to the series that gave the franchise its own identity and everything that is liked by dmc. you zoomers need to learn some respect

Having just played it for the first time the past couple of weeks, I loved it. I never found it "stiff", I found that it was the game telling me I need to commit to my actions. The fighting game part of my brain read that all of my actions had recovery frames and that I needed to plan around those when fighting. I also found the combat pretty fluid if you're using your mobility options (mostly based on the walls around you and your enemy step which vary per encounter, which I like) and certain weapons (I find the Flail & Lunar the most like that but most of them have some aspect of that). I also really like the enemy design; they're always a threat but they're never unfair.

I just played through all 5 games for the first time over the past couple months and 3 is my favorite.

>Visit Senran Kagura thread
>LMAO girl with toddies f2f
>Visit DOA thread
>I LOVE MARIE!!!!!!
>Visit any fighting game thread
>"Why arent you playing this game with this big tiddie bimbo?"
Rating games based on threads on Yea Forums is a really shitty idea,considering all Yea Forums does is bicker and share porn

>he doesn't agree with me
>shitposts

>DESIGN SUCKS
>criticism

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>DMCfags literally cannot stop talking on dumb memes
Clockwork
I've never seen a case of trying to fit in so hard

Don't get what you'r even implying, even in regular DMC threads most people agree the enemy design in 3 is ass. How is that not a criticism?

>Anything bad about the game isn't criticism

Way to out yourself as being completely unreasonable and not worth arguing with.

What even is the point of this thread? Is this OP trying to justify jumping on the series at 5? You play the series in release order excluding 2. Like, what is the actual point of this fucking thread? It sounds like OP played 5, then was angry when 3 didn't have style switching Dante or something, not that he probably utilized SS Dante appropriately judging from his empty "criticisms".

>DT Flux system is a poorly thought out mechanic in conjunction with enemy DT as it forces the player to play around DT Flux
It really doesn't.
>just buff their HP and damage by insane amounts"
You mean like every other DMC game after?
>enemies got other properties in 1
Just like DMC3, take the lust enemies for example.
>muh enemy design
shit opinion discarded
>They created DMD to justify the existence of DT Flux
DMD was already a difficulty since DMC1 you stupid retard.
Holy shit dude, your "arguments" are so weak and they literally show how much of a fucking newfag you are. Don't even (You) me with your shit posts every again you mouthbreathing retard.

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Anything negative about babbys first action game is a shitpost

care to tell us WHY design sucks?
so far no arguments on the table to even dismiss

>DMC3 gave the franchise its own identity

Oh boy DMC3fag revisionist history at it again. DMC3 reimagined the franchise, DMC1 was the only actual DMC game for four years. DMC became a flagship franchise overnight with 1 and the opening JP sales of DMC1 were only ever matched by MGR some 12 years later. DMC had its identity with 1, for better or worse 3 changed it.

Cuz I hate them >:(

OP showing his true colors now.

>Has some of the worst enemy designs to ever grace the genre that only get more apparent the harder difficulty you climb
Debatable, but sure.
>Very Hard and DMD are poorly balanced messes of difficulty that make the poor enemy and encounter design pop out
Yup.
>DMD is completely balanced around one mechanic that is never seen again, a mechanic that actively punishes players not willing to play the entire game around it
Yup.
>Arkham, Geryon, Gigapede, and Leviathan's Heart are all DMC2 tier bosses. Arkham being one of the worst fights in the franchise but gets a pass for some reason because of phase two
Yeah, especially Gigapede. Vergil is a good, albeit ridiculously overrated, boss. The jester guy is alright too.
>Music is overall mediocre aside from some stand out tracks like Vergil 1, Devils Never Cry, and Cerberus' theme
3 started the screamo shit, so no, the music isn't good.
>Everything in the game feels floaty, the only thing in the entire game with any sense of impact or feedback is Real Impact
I'd actually say that the game feels stiff and rigid. I get it's 15 years old at this point, but DMC1 feels more fluid than 3 does.
>Is retroactively made inferior by later games taking what it did well (weapon variety and Style system), having none of its flaws, and expounding on them exponentially
This is what sequels usually do, user.
>Yet people still try and say this game is not only the best DMC game, but the best game in the entire genre
Nobody said this initially. 1 was always recognized as the best. 3 was a shocking return to form after the abomination that was DMC2. I remember seeing a trailer for Star Wars Episode 3 in theaters before some movie, and one of the guys in the theater said "Episode 3: The Apology" afterward. That's basically what DMC3 was.

>Screamo
Confirmed DMCfags are literal children

I'm 29

very hard is the perfect balance of difficulty/fun you shitter

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user's right, even if 3 was so different, it established what was DMC about. Style, combos, cool characters, and shit. DMC1 wanted to be more dramatic, and 2 didn't think the gameplay was that important in comparison.
DMC 4 had a Dante that was a mix between 3 and 1 for a reason

>All these people getting mad about DMC3 by only looking at the flaws,instead of carefully weighing the Pros and Cons of the game

I've never played any DMC but I'm a huge Bayofag. Which one should I start with?

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1, then skip to 3, then skip to 5, and shelve the series.

You can make it even more fluid if you cancel your attacks with shurikens. You can cancel flying swallow into an on land charge, for example.

Can't I like 1, 3, AND 5?

>muh styles
>muh cawmbos

Styles remain to this date an absolute shit mechanic that limited you with the illusion of choice and later "evolved" into a convoluted system by design in lieu of a practical control scheme. At the time i didn't have much of an issue with the sytles even though i already felt it's limitations, that's because i didn't know of an alternative. Style changing though is just embarrassing.

As for the other """""""point"""""". What more needs to be said? Classic 3fag, muh cawbos came at the expense (for no reason) of combat and enemy design, something that ended up making DMC the odd one out for the genre it arguably created.

DMC3 killed my interest in the genre because it bored me and after playing GOW i thought beating up potato sacks was all the genre had to offer, i actually did enjoy GOW more though. Also because nu-Dante was trying too hard at times.

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thanks

1 then 5, the rest are shovelware

5 and 1 are the only ones worth playing nowadays desu

>It really doesn't
Wow what a concise and well thought out argument. Tell me, when you see a room full of Engimas, what are you going to try to do? Any non retard will tell you to kill as many of them at once lest you deal with an entire room full of DT'd Enigmas. Now what would be the best way to accomplish this? Now apply this concept to the entire game
>You mean like every other DMC game after
Sure, DMC4 and 5 don't have terrible enemies though. That's the important part here you are ignoring.
>Just like DMC3, take the lust enemies for example
Lusts get the uppercut on Hard and they use it a lot on Very Hard, it is not a consequence of the DTing or the DMD difficulty.
>shit opinion discarded
Wow, great argument. It's almost like you're giving your shit opinion with no substance and you accused someone else of doing the same thing.
>DMD was alread ya difficulty since DMC1 you stupid retard
No shit you brain-dead moron, I clearly addressed it the very same post. I'm saying they BALANCED DMD mode around DT Flux and that is a fundamental design flaw.

I get called names and yelled at by fanboys yet this is the what I'm up against when it comes to actually arguing flaws.

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This except throw out your platinumshit

it literally is not, it turned fuck all but for the it's own series.

Dante, the most important character in the franchise got his core personality solidified in dmc3 and that carried on in 4 and 5. if you think otherwise, you are just plain wrong.

Always go release order, don't skip 2 see how bad it is for yourself.

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Kill yourself you worthless avatarfag. You poor, destitute waste of space. Stop fucking speaking you braindead down syndrome NG2 apologist

All those things can be applied to 1 though. You're telling me 3 wasn't overly dramatic near the end? You people retroactively try and say DMC1 wasn't about combos when it was. How the hell can you say DMC1 was not about Style when it had the Style meter? How? Your retroactive biases have completely changed DMC1 in your eyes. DMC1 WAS Stylish Action when it released.

you gave no arguments so far, stop crying because people isn't destroying you with a text wall you won't even pay attention to

DMC1 is mediocre.
DMC4 is great. It's mostly "hated" by memeing faggots who parrot shitty e-celeb opinions without ever stopping to think for themselves.

>Kyoani poster is based
What the fuck

Unironically kill yourself my dude

cmon op admit your thread is bait.

>I think Kamiya-san makes good games. However, I think they, the systems, gameplay elements in his game tend to be rather shallow and he makes up with that through stylish presentation. I think if you were to compare them directly, the combat and other gameplay elements in Ninja Gaiden II are much deeper than projects that he works on.
>In my games its all based on a back and forth with the enemies, its very interactive. You feel like you're pushed to the brink but you manage to survive, the enemies are as out to get you as you are to get them. Whereas other types of action games, one of which being Devil May Cry, enemies exist there as objects on which you unleash your attacks.

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They want to be special so they pretend 1 wasn't about showing off.

>other guy tells why you're wrong and explains it, and forms his own opinions about it, doesn't insult
>resorts to ad homs
this is why you shitters are never taken seriously.

I've never heard e-celebs talk shit about 4, e-celebs don't even play this series.

Replying to your own post like that is pretty cringe desu

Well no sense arguing with you since you've already decided everyone who hates DMC4 is a boogeyman right user? I played DMC4 for the first time a few months ago with no preconceptions about it and within the first few missions my impression went from it being pretty cool to it being a downright shitshow. I couldn't even finish the game.

>implying I would have any form of kyoanus pictures

>I've got no arguments, better post a bait image.

Every single time. It's like clockwork at this point. Remember kids, we learned today you cannot say anything about DMC3 other than it is perfect in every single way imaginable and it has no short comings at all. Don't think so? Well you're just a retarded troll.

I'm honestly surprised none of you idiots whipped out the Tameem card yet.

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>Couldn't finish the game
Neither did the devs

REFUTE IT DMKEKS

>you gave no arguments so far

Literal head in the sand. Just stop wasting your own time. Maybe go play DMC3 on DMD so you can see this all for yourself.

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We only learned that you're still a shitposter with no arguments.
There's literally no reason to try to "argue" with a literal underage like you.

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This entire thread is useless because the best action game is Onechanbara Z2 Chaos

ITT: DMC3fags refuse to actually present counter points and instead resort to name calling instantly.

All i see is him using arguments and pothers calling him retarded and asking for arguments.

"where's your arguments!?" is the oldest and most common fallacy you will find in this board.

refute it

Play Ninja Gaiden before you shittpost.
Its natural discourse to try to pit DMC fans against Ninja Gaiden fans even though the fanbases overlap. There's not a lot of hostility there. Your typical character action fan likes God Hand, Kingdom Hearts 2, DMC, Ninja Gaiden, and the like. Sure, they have their preferences, but thinking they HATE any of them or think they're faulty or overrated to any degree is so fucking stupid.

ITT: DMC3haters refuse to actually present counter points and instead resort to name calling instantly and ignoring previous actual arguments.

>I played DMC4 for the first time a few months ago with no preconceptions about it
>no preconceptions
>on Yea Forums
I honestly and genuinely doing it, user.
I won't be arguing with you because I'm tired of repeating the same stuff over and over again. "Criticism" DMC4 gets is about 75% underserved and falls apart quickly in a proper discussion.
Assuming you have something adequate to say, I'm sorry I can't answer you.

Weird you guys shit on dmc4. That's the only game I see webms of posted to show the series' stylish combos it's known for.

It has the best story of all the games easily, and until DMC5 we only had DMC4, which has waaaaay more problems than DMC3 does. DMC3 WAS the best in the series, but overall I think DMC5 beats it out except in story, which felt really weak.

REREREREREREFUTE IT

Consider an exit bag avatarfag

Let me put it this way
when they tried to do DMC2, they thought people loved the story of 1 because of its narrative aspect, and the style was just a fun gimmick related to gameplay. Well, turns out, that "fun gimmick" was pretty much what made the game special, and they realized that after fans took a shit on 2 for being "too serious". They put style as a priority now, just to see if they could regain some fans, and it worked. Not only worked, but fans never cared about the narrative, but the characters because of their STYLE. I wasn't talking about the style meter, you dingus. I'm talking about overall style. Gameplay, story, graphics, whatever. All points into style after 2 flopped, and 3 was a hit because of that.

You have no intention of actually debating anything so why are you even replying. None of what I said is an "argument" but your "shit opinion discarded" was a good enough counter point in your eyes. We're all adults here user we can have civil discussions if you can learn to stop being a fanboy.

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>Yet people still try and say this game is not only the best DMC game, but the best game in the entire genre
We did. Not anymore after 5.

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>Whereas other types of action games, one of which being Devil May Cry, enemies exist there as objects on which you unleash your attacks.
Yeah, that's why it's a character action game: it focuses on what a character can do, not on enemies.

>monsters is bad
>music is boring
>mechanics are shit
I'm willing to bet you're the same fag if you are telling me those are arguments

>You have no intention of actually debating anything so why are you even replying
Because I thought it would be funny to give a literal child a taste of his own medicine

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>meme text
>samefag

Are you the fucking fallacy curator?

OP blown the fuck out. No wonder he didn't reply.

DMC4 has the most stylish combo potential, even now, so for true autists it's their favorite, but there are few of these people. As a full game it's pretty lacking. It was notably unfinished, the second half is mostly the first half of the game in reverse, but you play as Dante.

>it literally is not, it turned fuck all but for the it's own series.
>Platinum literally played DMC4 for reference for Bayo 1
>DMC4 never would've been the way it was if it weren't for DMC3
Sure, okay, user.

The genre wasn't called "character action game" (stupid name btw) until some years ago.

>DMD is completely balanced around one mechanic that is never seen again, a mechanic that actively punishes players not willing to play the entire game around it
Literally WHAT mechanic

Holy BTFO Batman!

DMKEKS BTFO

No user,you must hate 3 because Yea Forums says so. And while you're at it,you should start liking DMC2 now.
>Styles were a convuluted system
Each of the styles worked in their own ways while not making it feel like you were necessarily forced to use an exact one. Sure you can say it was limiting but it worked well for how someone likes to play the game. Also how exactly is style changing embarrassing?
>Combos came at the expense of combat and enemt design
Nigga what? The game had solid combat throughout the whole game and doesn't have shitty gimmick levels like Bayonetta and the game only had 2 enemies that felt like you couldnt use your typical combos on. You say a lot of shit to try and sound smart but yet you sound and look like a retard. Not only that but you try to pass off GOW as a more in depth game than DMC, only showing the bait even more

So then NG and DMC aren't even in the same genre.

>VIDEOGAME AGENCY GOOD
>PLAYER EXPRESSION BAD
Whosoever agrees with this argues against themself, and is, therefore, cucked.

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>Platinum literally played DMC4 for reference for Bayo 1
And yet the game is nothing like DMC4 when it comes to enemy design and approach to combat and is instead like a normal action game If anything what they took from it was the ebin over the top style.

>DMC4 never would've been the way it was if it weren't for DMC3
No fucking shit sherlock, i literally said that.

I just played through every game in the series except 5 in their release order and I agree. I know this is an unpopular opinion, but I genuinely think DMC4 is way better than 3 and 1. The story and characters were shit, but other complaints like backtracking through the game didn't bug me because I loved the combat so much. It's a straight improvement over DMC3's gameplay and its only downsides gameplay wise are enemies like the Chimera.

Epic samefag

Try playing any other game in the genre that's not GOW you actionlet. DMC is not the rule, it's the exception.

>enemy design
>mattering in a game about dodging and combos
t. can't dodge offset

>DMCfags so scared of competition and discussion they now want a genre of their own

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That's your cop out? Loving every laugh.

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Seethe harder, you got absolutely BTFO dude.
Not even him btw,

Name three besides Ninja Gaiden, Bayonetta and GoW.

Just because you don't like how the games are, doesn't mean they're bad, my man. If it's not for you, it's not for you.

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DMC3fags have yet to present ANY argument on how they think DMC3 is better than DMC5, none at all.

>mfw DMC3fags literally cling to "muh story" as the sole reason why DMC3 is better than DMC5 even though DMC5 is a direct upgrade in every other way imaginable but call DMC1fags parrots and nostalgiafags if they try and list multiple reasons why they prefer DMC1 over DMC3

The level of hypocrisy in you people is absolutely astounding. No wonder this fanbase is utter garbage.

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Dodge offset is Kamiya's answer to this.

Are you actually being unironic about enemy design not mattering in a game about dodging and combos or are you just next level shitposting?

>he thinks DMCfags actually play other action games, let alone git gud at them

It's much easier for them to just call it shit.

Style changing ins only there to artificially inflate execution as a poor replacement for actual challenge. That and keeping the archaic control scheme around. It's ass-backwards game design but brainlets love it because they don't know any better.

>Nigga what? The game had solid combat throughout the whole game and doesn't have shitty gimmick levels like Bayonetta and the game only had 2 enemies that felt like you couldnt use your typical combos on. You say a lot of shit to try and sound smart but yet you sound and look like a retard. Not only that but you try to pass off GOW as a more in depth game than DMC, only showing the bait even more

I should have read this part before i bothered replying, No, the game does not have "solid combat", to have solid combat you need to have good enemy design and mechanics. If you avoid the higher difficulty the mechanics part are alright but the enemies remain shit. COMBAT literally implies more than one faction. Keep fuming though.

now that the dust has settled, it's time to rate the fanbase in the franchise (from worst to tolerable):
1)Vujos and Tamemefags (DmC: Devil May Cry)
2)nostalgiafags (DMC 3, 3SE)
3)Kamiyafags (DMC 1) and combo autists (DMC 4, 4SE)
4)nuDMC (DMC 5)

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this thread is about a retard claiming DMC3 is overrated and not even the best of the franchise, giving no arguments
why are we the ones who need to give out arguments?

At least I've seen Kamiyafags actually acknowledge flaws in his games. Not like DMC3 nostalgiafags where the game is literally flawless and any dissenting opinion is chuck in the "shitpost" bin. I'd even put them in the #1 stop because at least DmCfags are at least non-existent.

>giving no arguments

Give me an argument about a flaw you think DMC4 has and we'll see what you people actually consider an "argument".

It doesn't, because in the end there's no spontaneity to it, simply learning. It doesn't matter how well you design an enemy, because they will always have a finite amount of actions. Focusing on giving your player more and better tools is the superior way, and that's why DMC is the superior series.

Otherwise you're just trying to reinvent the wheel, hammering your head against a problem that already has a solution. In that case watch a TAS and be done with it.

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No, but just because you like the games doesn't mean they are good either.

Don't know what that has to do with my post though

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-Dante being a recycled, heavily nerfed version of his DMC3 self with a smaller, terribly balanced moveset littered with overly situational, redundant or useless attacks.
-Removal or nerfing of cancels from DMC3 while adding more clunky uncancellable shit (see: Gilgamesh).
-Styles getting nerfed. RG and GS are trash, DS is half trash, SM being head over heels the best in most situations (while still being worse than DMC3's). No QS or DG. TS was the only one that survived relatively unscathed and still lost crap.
-Dante's guns getting nerfed, hard, for no reason.
-Lucifer being overly situational garbage with the worst SM moveset in the series, bar none.
-Botching a morphin weapon (where Bayonetta succeeded *twice* while half assing it).
-NoCrazyCombos4u.
-Removal of all but one of Dante's high DPS JCable attack (which got nerfed) while making JCing harder.
-Every mob and its grandmother having unreasonably short hitstun, super armor, shields or all the above, without being DTed, in a combo oriented game.
-Bosses being huge, JCable, constantly open large hurtboxes who have 'lay down and pound on me' states so the Buster wasn't worthless.
-Enemy DT meaning nothing anymore.
-Despite fewer enemy types and bosses, still have s*** cases like basilisks, faults and Angus Wall.
-Blitz.
-Fewer enemies per encounter outside LDK mode (which is a joke).
-An absurd obsession with meters and just inputs being required to deal great damage.
-Lack of non-Super costumes in vanilla.
-Can't go through Dante's levels as Nero and vice versa.
-Dat ranking system.
-Dose deep puzzles (in a f***ing Action game).
-No DTE.
-Taunts are crap.
-Baby's first style gauge.
-Can't start a new game on higher difficulties.
-Bloody Palace has a timer.

DMC5*

Sekiro just came out, and the game feels like it's trying to answer the same question as ninja gaiden and bayo: building the game around the back and forth between the player and enemies, putting an emphasis on enemy aggression.

You can, but make sure you always say 3 is the best lest you get called names by nostalgiafags as this thread has clearly shown.

>doesn't mean they are good
According to your metric, not mine.

Absolutely fucking delusional post. You have this backwards. There's no need for improvisation in your webm which carries over to the main game since half the enemies are training dummies.

>Dante's guns being "nerfed" even though Pandora is his best Gun in the series
>all the while DMC3's guns were not all that powerful outside of Spiral Cancelling
>this is an "argument" but this is not

This is just sad.

Sekiro is a good answer and I think it does its job well, but it feels really weird to think of it as an purebred action game when it's branching off a decade old series of RPGs. Not that DMC1 did have a similar history though.

>>Has some of the worst enemy designs to ever grace the genre

That's massive hyperbole, but you're right that DMC3's enemy design is not great. 4 and 5 are unironically better in that regard.

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how is any of this an argument and the op isnt?

>Onimusha
>Metal Gear Rising
>God Hand
>Zone of the Enders
>Genji (only played a bit)
>Shinobi (did not play to completion)
>Nioh
>Vanquish
>Sekiro

Defense plays a major role in any action game worthy of note aside from DMC and GOW. I'm sure i could list more given the time

>Style changing ins only there to artificially inflate execution as a poor replacement for actual challenge. That and keeping the archaic control scheme around. It's ass-backwards game design but brainlets love it because they don't know any better.
Changing your Style is literally a press of your dpad. If pressing a single dirction on your dpad is really to hard for you then I dont know what to say user. Also how exactly is the control scheme archaic when it controls like literally every other game at that time( excluding dodging of course).

>If you avoid the higher difficulty the mechanics part are alright but the enemies remain shit
Literally name 5 enemies throughout the game you constantly face that are shit. Most of you probably are going to mention come and go as fast you can say "DMC3 sucks". And nice assumption thinking I'm fuming because I called you out on your shit. I'm definitely not gonna say this game is perfect but to say this game is a weak entry to the character action games is just plain fucking wrong.

>There's no need for improvisation in your webm
That's correct: the creativity came before the execution.

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...what?

Samefagging dmc4brony

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It's not a hyperbole at all, name action games with worse enemy design.

Style meter in DMC1 meant jack shit and dissapeared fast. Just gave you some extra orbs and encouraged some variety so shitters wouldn't spam stinger. """Comboing""" in DMC1 is primarily for building Devil Trigger with the taunt here and there, then unleashing absolute fucking oblivion on your enemies with the flaming dick of sparda.

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According to your parameters, the games are bad. According to mine, they aren't. You want something out of the game which I don't want.

I'm not even the same guy but
that was just the gameplay aspect
regarding narrative:
-non memorable characters, Nero is the only one worth mentioning, the girl and her father pope or whatever were weak as fuck, and I'm sure this isn't opinion, they're just bland
-no questioning, intriguing motifs, or plot points that require some kind of an elaborate explanation on anything
-no character arcs, at all
-old characters' versions are just less interesting than before, and this is purposefuly done, in order to make Nero the center of attention
-Nero is just a typical main character, unoriginal, and they even tried to make it more like Dante in 5
-you can guess what's going on with his arm from the beginning, and it's not like you're invested in him or anything to even care. The character just comes with that arm
-adds nothing to the already established narrative
-the aesthetics and the whole setting is just too bright and uninspired, and has nothing to do with that gothic/industrial mix the franchise always had

The creativity of pointlessly juggling sandbags? DMC peaked at 1 and became slightly different with 3, finally getting ruined with 4 and 5 that instead of having actually difficult and technical combat like ninja gaiden, opted out to double down on the laziest possible design philosophy you can have which is durr do everything u wangg!!11

Fuck off with this garbage and stop trying to poison the genre.

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that post is describing specific gameplay mechanics that are inferior, not just claiming "mechanics are shit", like OPs

Style meter in Itsuno's games means jack shit either. In case you idiots never paid attention to any of those lauded "combo videos", most of the impressive shit is not actually good for the Style meter. It's visually and technically impressive, yet your Style rank is sitting at an A.

None of those are arguments if my point about DT Flux and its affects on DMD was not one. Pick your definition of "argument" and stick with it.

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I still don't see how any of this has to do with pretending DMC is another genre just so the fanbase can swirl a turd, plant a tiny flag on it and declare themselves kings of the hill.

Also there's things that are objective in game design.

Style meter means jack shit in every single fucking DMC game

Style meter means everything when the enemy doesn't plan on dying within the first 5 minutes of the fight.

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>Sekiro
OH NO NO NO NO

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>literally say DMC3 has inferior enemies to 1/4/5
>NO NOT AN ARGUMENT
>DMC4 nerfed guns
>This is an argument

You people are legitimately insane.

So you might as well just queue your inputs into a TAS then.

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What are you even saying here? The Style Meter is why DMC3/4/5 revolve on massive HP bloat for difficulty. Unironically DMC1's Style Meter would work better with all the fancy jump cancelling combo videos you see on the internet.

You sound like a B rank chump

>inferior enemies
what makes them inferior?
the guns nerfed are a real thing, they do less damage, that is a fact, not an opinion

Yes, it's not unlike a chess composition.

>it's actually retarded

Oh no! Poor thing :(

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DMC3 is the only game in the series where I think it shows how flawed it is on harder difficulties.

Does anyone actually think this is a fun demon to fight? This isn't even the worst one either.

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t. only played DMC3 and couldn't finish on Very Hard because game was "broken"

What is this obsession with what everyone else is doing. muh combo vids, muh combo vids tho, fuck off.

They are inferior because they rely on being overly annoying for their "challenge". Take Fallen for example. Kamiya had the good sense of making an enemy that can phase through walls to avoid damage have low HP, DMC3 gives the same kind of enemy massive HP buffs and the ability to attack you through walls. This is not good enemy design and you have to be out of your mind to imply it is.

>pretending DMC is another genre
Genres are not set in stone, friend.

All I'm saying is that DMC is good at what it attempts to do. You might not like what it's aiming for, but that doesn't make the games bad. Not all games need to be designed in the same way.

Show me an encounter in 1 or 5 that's as bad as A Hell Vanguard and 6 Soul Suckers in one room on DMD.

I've played them all but I knew there would be a contrarian faggot who actually thinks pic related was a good enemy.

>stop trying to poison the genre
But I thought DMC was the exception?

Is it possible that I am ACTUALLY, legitimately, the ONLY ONE who actually prefers DMC5 trish?

5's my favorite game but once you go into the tree the enviroments look samey and the asset reuse is as bad as a Compile Heart game.

Nah, bad taste is rampant these days.

He's right, these enemies are complete trash.

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Then every single game ever made is a master piece because it was "trying to do something"

Like i said earlier: that's a cowardly position to take to avoid any sort of scrutiny or discussion.

Even in this case, no, you're not the only one. There are communities of people who are into GILFs.

Would you agree that the story is shit and feels incomplete? Also that the atmosphere is the weakest?

No, there's other people out there who want to fuck transsexuals.

>Let's have an enemy that blocks you from the front unless you break its shield, also it can go through the environment so you have to wait to attack it.

>muh combo vids, muh combo vids tho, fuck off.

Yeah, tell that to the DMC community that's been going on for the last 10 years.

>Then every single game ever made is a master piece because it was "trying to do something"
No, since it doesn't exist in a vacuum.

>massive HP buffs
what? they die in 10-15 hits at most in DMD, and besides, DMD is supposed to be tough, how is them being "annoying" a problem? if you know how to exploit their openings they die pretty fast
I see what the problem is now, you think these games should be beaten on the hardest difficulty with ease
It's no surprise DMC games are getting easier and easier

there's literally nothing wrong with him other than having a tiny JC window which is the same with most DMC bosses pre 4. I cannot possibly imagine how a player wouldn't beat him in one go every run after the first, his moves have the longest telegraphs in the entire game. Gunslinger and Sword master get boned by his AOE if you pay actually zero attention but half of those styles is understanding that you have to be more careful with spacing/enemy actions because your access to mobility and invulnerability is much more limited

Based

Little bitch scrub is whining about enemies being able to DT.

but DMC does? Do you even read the shit you write? I can't believe I'm actually talking to some nigga arguing that Devil May Cry are not action games.

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Combotrannies ruined the series.

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The spiders I don't mind that much, and the gas demons are a cinch with Spiral (just look away and Ricochet). Fallen can go fuck themselves, won't argue with that.

Did i say he was hard? It's a pretty fucking short post, not much room to misinterpret it.

>but DMC does?
Nope.

and I predate you faggots. Fuck combo vids, fuck lady, fuck nero, vergil's ok, credo too, fuck kyrie, fuck 3 Dante, 4 Dante, 5 Dante all of them. #NotMyDante goodnight

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You forgot Duhallans and Enigmas.

Look, I'm not claiming the Fallen or Souleaters are like the best enemies you can find, but they aren't that bad... Souleaters die pretty easily and the Fallen telegraph everything they do, I don't see how they're a problem

Watching other action games get dismissed because they have fewer variations of aerial combos is annoying as fuck. I'm tired of seeing that be the sole criteria by which an entire genre is judged.

No shit I'm saying that's who cares about combo videos, the thing that made Itsuno's DMC's popular on the internet.

oh ok, so you just counter what ever post you reply to regardless of what came before it. I see now, this one is actually new to me.

>other action games get dismissed
And who's doing that?

>Combotrannies

lol i like that

This.

Spiders are one of the few good enemies in 3

>DMCucks arguing which of their turds is the least shitty

Combo juggling autism is not the end be all for Action games. DMC devs should finally learn to go past juggling simulators in 2019 but they didn't because Itsuno can only pander to combotrannies.

youtu.be/JOkne5NfPwQ
How embarrassing when a Disney game from decade ago has better boss design than DMC.

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>Why
CUUHRAAAAAYZEEE

literally DMCfags and literally within their own series?

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>It's no surprise DMC games are getting easier and easier
DMC games get easier and easier because Itsuno keeps adding moves and layers of mechanics to player characters while doing nothing on the enemy side to rebalance that.
DMC's brainlessness, juggling and low difficulty comes almost exclusively from that, you have too many tools, even when Itsuno tried to "rebalance" it in DMC4 by nerfing Dante's raww damage output into the ground (Gunslinger especially) nothing really changed, it only made killing things more tedious in Dante's case since he does barely any damage compared to the rest of the cast unless you're up to pulverizing your wrists to make up for that.
Simply put, it's like having a baby fighting against a lion, except that in DMC you're the lion, as much as I don't like NG, especially on higher difficulties, Oatmeal had the right idea for that enemies in there, at least in theory since at higher difficulties the games kind of bottleneck you into abusing I-frames for the win.

I say the most "balanced" action game I played is Malicious but barely anyone played it and it's a very different kind of action game from DMC, NG and the rest, despite being made by Albion who codeveloped Bayo games, and it shows since it does share a lot with Bayo despite being radically different.

You're just taking one post way too seriously.

DMC has its merits and I judge it according to them and what it presents itself as. If the game presented itself as something but then failed at it, then I would dislike it, but it doesn't and it didn't. It set out to be a stylish action game and it succeeded. Other games approach action games with a different mindset and that's perfectly fine.

Based

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I thought DMCfags didn't even know there were other action games.

Pick one narrative, because it can't be both.

He made Dragon's Dogma so he's not conically retarded

>They die in 10-15
Sure, sounds like a small amount. But you deal with Fallen in pairs. Sin Scissors came in groups of 2-4 but they all died very easily.
>DMD is supposed to be tough
This is where DMC3 falls on its face in the attempt of "these games were supposed to be hard, right?" If they made Vergil 3 kill you in 2 hits on DMD would you defend that? Game is supposed to be hard, right?
>I see what the problem is now, you think these games should be beaten on the hardest difficulty with ease
How are you going to say that when 1, 4, and 5 have easier DMD modes? You know what the difference is? Those games don't have shit enemies.

>Resident Evil 6
?

>OG Nier above anything
?

It actually is both, DMCfags are more than 1 guy.

if i did have a narrative that post would literally LITERALLY support it.

DMC1 on DMD is easier than DMC3 on DMD you idiot. DMC1 doesn't front load its "challenge' by having annoying enemies with massive HP bloat with a enemy DT system that is pants on head retarded. DMC3 was the highest spike in difficulty in the series for entirely all the wrong reasons.

Based 2FMchad.

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>People really like a game's battle system
>See the game has an unlockable video showing someone on the dev team having fun with it
>Make their own vids and share them
>Years later retards on Yea Forums ree because they're not doing videos for the game they like
No one's stopping you from talking about Ninja Gaiden's combat but you and your insecurity.

I like how this DMCuck is scared to directly address anyone and can only throw cheapshots behind a greentext like some little bitch.

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It's okay user, you can show me your combo mad, I bet it's really cool.
You don't have to pretend you're tough, we're all friends here.

>Okami
>action

What the hell are you on?

>See the game has an unlockable video showing someone on the dev team having fun with it
I'm new to this series, which game is this in and where can I see it?

I was gonna tell you to git gud, then I remembered those angel fuckers who constantly fly out of bounds or into the fucking terrain, killing your time ranking.

BUT KAMIYA THO

>No one's stopping you from talking about Ninja Gaiden's combat

There's plenty of people stopping me from talking about NG's combat, strawman-kun

Devil May Cry 3, I forget what the it was called but it was basically the first style video.

It's one of the videos you get from beating the game.

>The rest of the bosses aren't bad but they aren't great or notable either, Vergil being the only good boss in the game. Vergil retroactively ends up being the easiest boss in the game on DMD due to his lack of horrible gimmicks and awful camera angles
i disagree, all of the bosses not mentioned in the shit list are fantastic, and vergil 3 is actually insane, due to him not sitting still and being on your 24/47
>Everything in the game feels floaty, the only thing in the entire game with any sense of impact or feedback is Real Impact
DMC3 dante has the best feeling attacks in the series alongside Exceeded nero attacks.
>Is retroactively made inferior by later games taking what it did well (weapon variety and Style system), having none of its flaws, and expounding on them exponentially
you cant really fault the game for that, there were severe memory limitations that got in the way of itsunos team implementing style switching, just a few years prior to that they were barely able to code dante having guns and a sword equipped at the time.
>Yet people still try and say this game is not only the best DMC game, but the best game in the entire genre
i can only speak for myself here, 3 was my entry point into the series and at the time there was nothing really like it, it had the funnest action game hero to date with cool weapons and one of the best bosses in video games.
5>1=3>4>reboot>2

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>has the most intricate, varied, and open-ended gameplay in the series
>is the worst
is this what being gay means?

DMC4 has half their enemies built around Nero's grappling arm. They are very different from 3's enemies, and their HP looks the same, on average. The difficulty decrease comes from monsters being less "annoying", and consequentially, having a very limited set of movements. They all can be defeated using the same two or three techniques with Nero. They knew some casuals would jump into the game, so it had to be a softer experience in general.
DMC3 had its weak points, and some enemies being more annoying than challenging, yes, but all of that made the DMD mode something that you would be proud of having finished. DMC4 was just not as memorable. And it definitely wasn't more fun.

I'm talking after 3, you fucking retard
and stop with this "massive HP" thing, monsters die pretty easily once you learn how to play the fucking game and which weapons to use for each level

They're just words they can't hurt you, go ahead tell me about how fucking cool Ninja Gaiden is.
I like how in 2 the werewolfs can pick up corpses and throw them at you. :)

youtube.com/watch?v=bfDeJi1mRbA

Here is an example of why I think DMC3's enemies are bad.

Take these faggots, these faggots are hard but they are hard because they challenge your reactions and ability to read their tells. Compare them to Enigmas, who literally just scoot backwards infinitely and fire arrows that do 90% of your life bar while gaining absurd knockdown defense once DT'd. These faggots are actually fun to fight against, Enigmas are not.

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>Thread is full of like 4 or 5 different groups of elitists defending their favorite game/series because they value the thing that it does best
>If I say I like most of them then I'll either be called a centrist faggot or part of one group of elitists "coping" by trying to make nice with the [game they like]chads
I was hoping we could have our good gameplay-based action game thread for the month early, but I guess I'll keep waiting.

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it has none of those things. All the mechanics introduced were objectively a failure and disservice to the gameplay. The game is dumbed down in many aspects compared to 2.

and you can't dodge those arrows?

>They're just words they can't hurt you

I tend to say literally a lot but that's literally not true, even outside of this metaphor.

BASED

Personally, I like Onimusha series as action games more than the DMC series. What's that make me?

That's the problem when you're talking about games that are considered hard, every insecure faggot comes out of the woodworks to show you how big his dick is.

What does it matter if you can or not? Their difficulty comes from their sheer annoyance factor With that token why is DMC even considered a hard series, can't you just dodge everything? There's a reason itsuno never put a dedicated ranged enemy like Enigmas ever again.

Perhaps you should see a therapist, this attitude can't be healthy for you.

I guess you like a more focused and grounded combat system than even DMC1. I haven't played Onimusha but what I've heard about its combat systems seems interesting. DMC1 had the atmosphere of a horror game at times, but Onimusha seems like the midpoint between action and survival horror in terms of actual gameplay.

This entire thread is about DMC3fags being unable to accept their game has flaws.

Onimusha is dead, forgotten, and irrelevant. DMC is thriving and 5 sold better than any preceding game in the franchise.

I loved Onimusha back in the day. I hope Capcom keeps remastering them and releases them as an HD Collection eventually.

t. DMCfriend

Yeah, they're one of the groups. It's DMC3 vs DMC1 vs DMC5 vs Ninja Gaiden vs Bayonetta vs Kingdom Hearts vs maybe another series, as if they don't all have pros and cons and liking more than one or two of them is impossible.

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>why is DMC even considered a hard series
It isn't.

so enemies shooting at you are considered annoying now? wow

The only action game feud that matters anyways is God Hand vs. casuals

Yeah, a room full of Enigmas shooting arrows at you from off screen sure isn't annoying. Especially on DMD where they get massive knockback resistance. Itsuno knew they were shit, why can't you see it.

Based.

Ignore the faggots telling you to skip 3. 2 and DmC are the only games in the series you should skip.

We'll get a remaster one day damn it.

I'm a fanboy and I'm accepting DMC3 has its flaws. In fact it isn't even one of the best games ever made. However, with its flaws it's still the best of the franchise, and OP is asking about that

The thing is that it's easy relative to other games of its kind, but since it's an entry point to them for many and it's a notch harder than the average game overall (plus they all have a decent amount of systems to learn) people think they're hard. That's how I was when I got into the series; I was bad at them because I'm bad at games, but I've played harder action games since and subsequently found DMC games easier going back.

The Mighty Morphin Power Rangers movie had better writing and dialogue than DMC1

I'm playing trough the series now and i agree, so it must make you a man of taste.

youtube.com/watch?v=F3589zFsgBo

Gonna start playing the 3rd one maybe this week, then take a break before 4.

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DmC is objectively better than DMC1

They can't begin firing from offscreen, they can only finish an attack they started when they were on screen.

You know some times i want to get into KH2 and even think about buying the ps4 games to but every single time i watch a video or something and i see fucking mickey mouse on the robe like its a sonic game or donald duck and shit i inmediately hit a wall and i just cant fucking do it

Oh no, not again.

Dawn of Dreams is kinda shat on aint it?
I actually liked it a lot

faggot
3fags should kill themselves
man what a retarded fanbase

Like the great philosopher Chirstofuuuh once said:

>I gotta live in the world

and as such i am not removed from it's influence on me no matter how hard i want that to be true. Spitting bumper sticker motivational slogan bullshit is not gonna change basic human nature.

Itagaki is a hack

Stop shittalking my power rangers dumb zoomer normalfag.

youtu.be/DmOzHNgSw6Q

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3 is pretty nuts, the chained issens let you utterly demolish groups and Jean Reno's the shit with his fighting style.

4 is super different though, pure action RPG.

Kingdom Hearts 2 Final Mix is literally the answer to everyone's problems with DMC and other action games. You bitch about lack of enemy interplay? 2 solves it with peak humanoid boss design in Data Org/Lingering Chad. Combos with little purpose beyond looking flashy (DMC)? 2 has real combo optimization like fighting games where you find a balance between damage, Revenge Value efficiency, resource consumption, enemy specific mechanics, and more. Difficulty? Lv. 1 Crit is far and away more difficult than any difficulty mode in DMC and better designed on top of it. If you think 2 doesn't gel with you then you just haven't played it properly and don't understand the complexity behind revenge values, magic, summons, and abilities. That's why it's considered one of the greatest action game ever made by veterans like SBK91.

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Based khchad dabbing on dmctrannies

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imagine having dmc living in your head rent free.

I liked that 4 gave you 5 whole characters to play with.

I have yet to play it save for the first couple of areas to see if the disc works so i wouldn't know why or if it is justified. I'm taking a break so i don't go into the game burned out on the series just for the sake of finishing it. I have been 100%ing the games and for Onimusha 2 that meant a lot of playthroughs for the scenario stuff. Dawn of Dreams looks fine from what i saw.

QTEs require use of magic which is a limited resource, plus they leave you wide open to enemy attacks, so they are pretty much exactly like neros buster grabs

*dabs on everyone in this thread*

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replace spiders with Dullahan and add Enigma and Bloodgoyles
god imagine fighting ALL of these fuckers in a single room, all DTd, on DMD difficulty

>having trouble with DMC3 on Very Hard
retarded shitter detected, opinion discarded

I fucking wish DMC4/5 had difficulties like VH. Son of Sparda is a fucking joke

As somebody that loves Ninja Gaiden, yes he is. NG2 isn't on par (still very good but you can feel him slip), and NG3 being bad threw people off and kept this mystique about Itagaki. Then Devil's Third happened and I think most people realized he's a hack, no matter how good NG Black is. Also Dead or Alive was never a good fighting game.

I don't like KH because it's literal garbage. Laughed my whole way through KH3. The cringe was real.

>and the bosses outside of Jeanne/Balder ranging from mediocre to shit.
DMC3 is objectively even more guilty of this if you're seriously going to pull that card on boss encounters.

We need another game like this. Not V (although I like V more than most people), but a character who can actually fight that has summons he can bring in while he's fighting like assists in MvC.

While we're at it, we need another game like Otogi (very air-based with destructable environments), and another game like Urban Reign (tradtional beat-em-up with fighting game-level combat and combo mechanics).

fuck no, Bayo 1's bosses are all QTE shit on a different level of dogshit than DMC3.

I agree. It's just one of many little issues that hurt Bayonetta's really stellar and interesting core combat design. The reason I like W101 and TF Devastation so much is that they build off of Bayo 1's template very well while going into their own unique directions, which is something Bayo 2 failed to do, only improving in things like the story and visual design while regressing mechanically.

>NG2 isn't on par
t. NPC

NGB has too many trash mob fights and is refined around UT spam almost to the point of sterility. 2 in general is far more vicious, OT's let normal attacks compete with UTs and its weapons still shit on everything else in the genre.

Games are for gameplay, DMCtranny.

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V was a mistake

I miss when action games were popular.

not op but DMD3 is awful because of the obscene amount of health enemies get in DT, the only way to really get around it is by using DTE (the ability op said DMD was balanced round) which isnt fun at all, compare it to 1 where enemies had less health than in lowere difficulties but due to their aggressive nature 1 mistake could cost you your life

I don't like DMC, KH is still cringe trash though.

NG2 on Master Ninja is UT: the game

4 and 5 are easier by virtue of not having pants on head retarded enemy designs. Bayonetta 1 is by all accounts a harder game than DMC3 yet nothing in it feels as annoying as Enigmas, Fallen, or Arache.

Fuck you

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How's TF Devastation like?

so is the kmcuck falseflagging?

DMC3 on DMD is harder than Bayo 1 on Infinite Climax. DMC3 DMD is definitely not particularly well balanced. the chessboard > anything in Bayo 1. Bayo 1 isn't very hard once you learn how to dodge offset consistently.

Either way though if you have trouble with DMC3 on VH you are inarguably a shitter, I beat that mode on fresh new games for fun

I finished DMD a few times, and never, NEVER used DTE. And I don't see, at all, how is the game "built around" that technique. Why are you saying that the only way to get around it is like that? have you tried hitting and doing combos on the monsters for fun instead of mashing up your standard attack just to complain they have too much hp?

I liked the manual chain issens in 2, very satisfying to pull off, but i still prefer the block issen. They really nerfed the frames for the block one in 2, to the point that i stopped using it until i played critical mode and found out that it's still very useful against certain enemies.

When i tested 3 i was a bit skeptical about the analog control scheme introduced, i kept getting the kick action if i dodged into the foreground and tried to attack an enemy. I had no problem playing with the D-pad on the other games so I'm wondering if it's something you can get used to or if the D-pad is still objectively better.

>-Bosses being huge, JCable, constantly open large hurtboxes who have 'lay down and pound on me' states so the Buster wasn't worthless.
I agree with most of this but 4's bosses were pretty fucking fun for exactly that reason.

>-Lack of non-Super costumes in vanilla.
The lack of costumes period sucked.

The Wonderful 101 is better than them all.

amazing sroundtrack, forgetable everything else

youtube.com/watch?v=mS1S8wo6c9w

I love how people pretending dodge offset is some hot shit in Bayonetta when in fact the only thing it should be used for is skipping pointless combos (great combat system, right boys?) and attacking with solely Wicked Weaves.

Oh forgot:

>-Taunts are crap.
Dante's were crap but Nero's were fucking great.

I like Nero a lot but I do have to admit, they fucked up the execution of the character in 4. In fact, 4's story overall was fucking terrible.

FUCK ALL YOU WASTES OF SPACE. I WAS THE BEST ACTION GAME!

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Issen is broken as shit in 4 once it's been upgraded, you can clear whole rooms in the dark realm in seconds.

>Dante being a recycled, heavily nerfed version of his DMC3 self with a smaller, terribly balanced moveset littered with overly situational, redundant or useless attacks.
This is factually wrong on too many fucking levels.
You are describing DMC3 Dante, you autistic moron.

>daily reminder that after making DMC 3, Itsuno wanted to pursue and direct Dragon's Dogma (his ultimate dream game)
>daily reminder that Itsuno wanted to pass the development of DMC 4 to another director, but Capcom pushed him in a different path
>daily reminder that Capcom once again fucked Itsuno's dreams when they decided to westernize DMC, ultimately lead to delaying his dream game
Itsuno should've left Capcom after making Dragon's Dogma

>Also Dead or Alive was never a good fighting game

>NGB has too many trash mob fights
>When comparing to Trash Mob Spam: The Game

Opinions discarded, holy fuck.

Prove him wrong.

This. Dodge offset wouldn't be necessary at all if it weren't for the complete style-over-substance shit that are wicked weaves.

>You are describing DMC3 Dante, you autistic moron.
That's some prime bait, friendo.

>Styles remain to this date an absolute shit mechanic that limited you with the illusion of choice and later "evolved" into a convoluted system by design in lieu of a practical control scheme.
lets say we drop the style system, then what? you would have to either
A) cut down dantes movelist severely to be able to fit it on a controller
B) use fighting game motions like UMvC3 and alienate normalfags who arent used to arcade controls
which would you prefer??
>i actually did enjoy GOW more though
>Also because nu-Dante was trying too hard at times
oh, nevermind youre just retarded.

It has Bayo's mechanics (Offset, direction parries, Witch Time equivalent, Vehicle Attacks at the end of Strings instead of Wicked Weaves), but with a control scheme closer to Revengeance, TPS mechanics that actually blend in pretty well (they're good combo extenders and when you fire them in vehicle mode you can get a Vanquish-like feeling), and then Loot RPG elements (all 5 characters have different stat spreads and unique cooldown specials/Ultimates, you pick up weapons of different rarities and upgrade them to create loadouts, there's TECH which give various passives). There's also a mechanic called Overdrive that builds up as you hit enemies, which cuts the startup frames on your moves and lets you do Vehicle Attacks out of more moves. Also the story feels like a long episode of G1 and the OST is top-tier.

Joke's on you user, I actually completely agree.

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I saw it replaced the magic attack and you can do it at will now but can't the same be said about the very thing it replaced in the previous games?

Hey anons, I'm planning on replaying DMC3.
Should I go with USA Dante's Awakening or the Special Edition?

Not him but while I wouldn't say better than all, it's much better than people give it credit for and I'd put it up there as one of the best games in the entire genre for sure and one of the best action games period.

Special Edition. Bonus Content and Vergil make it the better one. The only thing is that SE's Normal was the original's Easy. If you want, find a way to unlock Hard early if you'd rather play the original's Normal.

Based, just finished DMC3 earlier this week. Absolute trash. Only Lady was memorable in it. Story was as trash as DMC has ever been, but her story was a bit interesting. Gameplaywise literally the whole game is backtracking and fetching fucking items with nothing inbetween to break that shit up, it's just a neverending formula from start to finish. Very few of the bosses were actually enjoyable and they were mostly uninspired in design. A fucking giante centipede? really? LOL

>Vergil 2
>Rain
OH NO NO NO BRUH LOOK AT THIS DUDE
You just got exposed for not actually playing the game lmao.

SE. There's no reason not to play the original over SE.

>tfw still need to go back and beat DMD as Vergil and Bloody Palace as both

I should get on that real soon, especially because I have no way of playing 5 at this moment.

Are you fucking stupid? Virtually every other action game can handle movement options and multiple attack buttons without fucking mapping them all to one face button and then telling you to switch the function of that button by pressing the dpad first. Is DMC the only game you've played?

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>chessboard

You can defeat the Chessboard with Quicksilver, it's not even hard. And I completely disagree, I found Bayonetta 1 much harder but more satisfying. By the time I finally beat Vergil 3 on DMD I never wanted to look at DMC3 again. Vergil was finally a good challenge on DMD but the rest of the game was fucking dogshit.

TW101 would honestly be an my favorite action game of all time had there not been the underwater shmup sections. I usually don't mind the Kamiya-isms but that was just shit.

what do you know, a contrarian on Yea Forums. fuck off retard

*AHEM*

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>It has Bayo's mechanics (Offset, direction parries, Witch Time equivalent, Vehicle Attacks at the end of Strings instead of Wicked Weaves), but with a control scheme closer to Revengeance
I don't really like the sound of that but I think I'll give it a chance.

Yeah they kind of tried that with Bayonetta 2 and look what happened. Offset system isn't just tied to Dodge, you can Accessory/Taunt/Panther as well.

>A) cut down dantes movelist severely to be able to fit it on a controller

Wrong, in keep seeing this posted and it makes me facepalm eveyr time. DMC has a retarded legacy control scheme that they insist on keeping. You can do every single action in DMC's style system in Ninja Gaiden without having to toggle anything, it's all there, accessible at all times and properly mapped to the controller.

>B) use fighting game motions like UMvC3 and alienate normalfags who arent used to arcade controls
which would you prefer??

Also wrong, see above.

>oh, nevermind you're just retarded
WOOOOOOOOO WOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOHOOOOOO WOOOOHOOO YEAH WOOOOOO

embarrasing post

I'm actually glad people are no longer sucking DMC3's dick as much after DMC5 came out aside from staunch autists, I still love it but the game is riddled with a lot of design flaws that shouldn't get a free pass.

How not? unlike DMC, GoW actually had an interesting mythology. Wtf is DMC's mythology? oh some great sparda guy worshipped as jesus who saved humanity once and is never heard from again for all the games, now follow Dante in his never ending quest to thwart his seething brother again, and again, and again and again and again. So interesting. Even the fucking creatures themselves are boring. Like come the fuck on, introduce some new concepts already. Atleast DmC tried with the limbo shit, DMC never does anything new. Same bullshit brother rivalry shit for the past 5 games. It's old, it's boring, and we're over it.

It really doesn't feel like them once you learn it. It has its own flow entirely. The controls are simply because the director of the game was Saito, who directed Revengeance, so he prefers Light/Heavy over Punch/Kick. I think the bigger hurdle is the RPG elements and weapon drops, since if you start fresh on Commander your damage output will seem low for the first 20-30% of the game until you get better drops and start upgrading.

Also the biggest draws of the game are the bosses (they're all fantastic and distinct), and the Challenge mode that drops you into some really fun combat encounters, including several which combine bosses together.

It's good but not top tier. The continue system breaks whatever difficulty W101 may have had. It makes every fight a foregone conclusion, since as long as you're dealing some damage between deaths you'll eventually win. Compared to other games in the genre, enemies are typically slow while you get all sorts of broken crap like Bomb, Unite Big, Hero Time, Hero Sense, etc. This while Hammer, Immorta, Chewgi, Goggles and Drill morphs are pretty pointless (outside Big).

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stay mad autists the dmc series still the best.

At the time when compared to 4 I can see why people lauded it as one the greatest action games ever. It's the 4 dick sucking I can't stand here more then DMC3 dick sucking.

play the SE.
play Vergil.
unlock all of his moves/buy all Blue and Purple Orbs/Darkslayer Level 3
play Bloody Palace
enjoy game

Yeah, and ?
I play DMC and Ninja Gaiden for different reasons brcause they are different games.

I honestly don't get the praise for Shinobi. It has clunky controls, very basic mechanics and it looks like PS1 game to boot. The gameplay loop is so weird too, just going around one shotting enemies. If i find it being sold for cheap i might give it a try on PS2 since the PS3 version is fucked.

Shmups and action games don't overlap you mouthbreather. You don't have to play some other genre to be valid in another
>"Oh you play Street Fighter? Why don't you play a real game of skill like Modern Warfare"
Retard

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>All this fucking arguing over decade old banter between a talking cookie and Krillin from Dragon Ball.

I like using Hammer, Drill, and Immorta anyway honestly. Deleting the turtle enemy with Hammer is a fun time if you learn their openings. I think the enemies might be slower to compensate for the camera, as you need to locate yourself in order to avoid things accurately. They might have overcompensated, but I think I get the idea.

that's lowkey admitting God of War is a movie game

DMC4 Dante factually has way less redundancy within his move set compared to DMC3 Dante with a single fucking weapon missing a Stinger variant.
Not to mention, DMC4's weapons are actually balanced to work together, as you get height-adjusting aerial attacks:
-Rebellion to stay still
-Lucifer to go up
-Gilgamesh to go down
purpose-oriented performance
-Rebellion for AoE and CC
-Gilgamesh for direct damage
-Lucifer for delayed damage bursts and guard bypassing
but without being forced into a specific playstyle as the weapons still have a degree of versatility to them
-Overdrive and Dance Macabre allows Rebellion to deal heavy damage
-Kick 13 and Sock allow Gilgamesh to throw a flurry of quick hits or to AoE
-Lucifer provides utility through Ecstasy launches, timed aerial setups, and spikes for immediate bursts.

DT moves are also a new addition and they are pretty fucking powerful.

The only aspect of Dante's styles that was "nerfed" was RG which is completely understandable as in DMC3 you had to give up a source of damage (even Trickster eventually allowed you to increase your damage output through Air Trick) to use it. Every other style is as good or better. People complain about not having a triple dash but ignore the unlimited dashes in DT.
GS is actually useful for a change. SM is stronger than it ever was.

>he thinks Itagaki vs. Kamiya is even relevant

This shit has always been Itsuno vs. Kamiya.

Whats the point of this thread?

>Shmups and action games don't overlap
Uh, about that...

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It's deserved, DMC3 didn't know what it wanted to be. The fuck did they even have puzzles in the game for if none of it had any depth at all? And the senseless backtracking to try to cover up the fact that all of DMC3's missions were short af some of which lasting 4 minutes kek

I don't care if it's cheap, DT is very satisfying to use.

>HURF DURF OTHAR AKSHION GAM!!111
show me 1 (ONE) action game character that has more individual moves than dante

If only KH3 hadn't shit the bed instead of actually feeling like a proper follow up to KH2FM mechanically.

I mean, seriously speaking, it's not a bad idea, but the implementation and the actual usage of it within the system are kinda mediocre.

Dmc3=Dmc5>Dmc1>Dmc4>Dmc2
have sex incels

>KH2
Is final mix really that much better than vanilla?
I played on release and sure I liked the game but was not impressed by the action gameplay at all.

Dickwaving, like most of Yea Forums. Honestly this is still better than consolewars since the gameplay is the focus, even if there's still a lot of bullshit flying.

Hammer is certainly viable, but it's purpose as a meh damage slow weapon with little utility evades me. Whip and Claws are in the why-not-use-Hand-category. Drill is strictly for combo points, which in many cases is done better by juggling or Bomb exploits. Which in turn hurts depth, as depth is to some extent how many meaningful options you have available to you. If the movesets were a little bigger, a little more diverse, or there were more multi-move Morphs available, that would help a lot.

NG2 Ryu, and his moveset is far better balanced than any of Dante's. That was easy.

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You need to break up the combat with other stuff in action games

DMC5 > DmC > DMC3 >>>>>>>>

There's nothing wrong with short missions, that's why DMC1 is so appealing. You can finish DMC1 on Normal/Hard in an afternoon.

>Lore and worldbuilding =/= being a movie game
Even Sonic games are better than DMC regarding to this.

He isn't wrong though. DMC3 for all its highs has more than plenty of lows in boss encounters that are made even more glaring on further replays, neither game triumphs in that category alone.

DMC 3 is a truly finished and non rushed game unlike 2,4 and 5.
The story is the best in the series, the music is best in the series, the gameplay is extremely polished (because they did one style at the time), more mechanics with weapon switching like Artemis and E&I, Agni and Rudra, Nevan, most diverse arenas and levels, best looking and many different Devil Trigger designs, secret 2 player co-op with doppelganger style, most costumes.
DMC 4 and 5 have better gameplay, but that's it.
As a full package DMC 3 is still the best game in the series.

Yes, play it on Critcal and see it shine.

>NG2 Ryu, and his moveset is far better balanced than any of Dante's. That was easy.
i didnt as for your worthless opinion on ninja gaiden you nigger, read my post again

>show me 1 (ONE) action game character that has more individual moves than dante

Are we talking overall or available without going into a menu? Actually it doesn't even matter because Ryu in NG2/S2 beats him in both criteria. If it's the latter then eveyr single character in Razor's Edge and all but one character in Sigma 2.

I wish there were videos showcasing the movesets in NG like there are for DMC, they would be pretty long.

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The reason vanilla KH2 got the meme reputation of being a button masher is because Sora's HP and the enemies' low damage allowed you to get away with not learning the mechanics. It had the deep combat already but it was obfuscated by it being impossible to die. Final Mix fixes this by halving Sora's health, and adding Level 1/Zero Exp, which is the best way to play the game. There's also over a dozen new superbosses, one of whom can easily be considered the best boss of the genre.

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Your first point meant nothing
>story is the best in the series
Sure, I agree
>music is the best
Nope, 1 still has the best OST in the series, 5's is better than 3's
>gameplay is extremely polished
Literally useless buzzwords, DMC5 expands everything 3's gameplay did and builds upon it
>DMC4 and 5 have better gameplay, but that's it
Incorrect, you basically provided nothing of substance to argue this other than vague praises
>As a full package DMC3 is still the best game in the series
DMC5 offers barely less content in its vanilla package and the only real complaint you can give it in that department is the lack of costumes.

None of this makes DMC3 a better game, sorry my dude.

>worst gameplay
>worst ost
>backtracking
>item fetching
>only lady's/arkham story is decent
>the story is shit all the same
>some of the worst bosses in the entire series
>trash devil trigger designs
>factually less mechanics since future games would go on to introduce more

>can't read
>project it onto others

lol

lmao keep dreaming KHfag
Nomura has already left KH, he's now focused on FFVII remake

Ryu has almost as many Flying Swallow variants alone as Dante has aerial melee attacks total, 15+ basic moves per weapon in NG2, wall attacks, counters, GT, projectiles, Ninpo, and the ton unique useful strings every weapon has. DMC has tiny movelists limited even further by the style system, and ton of them are useless.

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