Honestly, how did you feel about the NEED/GREED rolling?

Personal loot is babbies 1st conflict tier

Hunters taking all the fucking melee weapons was infuriating as fuck

loot doesn't "drop" from bosses anymore. instead everyone who kills it rolls at a chance to get loot, and the loot table varies depending on your class. you no longer compete for loot with teammates.

it's an anti-feature made necessary by LFD, another anti-feature

You're one entitled motherfucker aren't you? I bet you walk into the store and expect there to be a cash register open to every customer at everytime so you don't have to wait 3 minutes

it was a good idea in theory
it just didnt take into account the fact that most people are huge faggots
same reason why communism will never work

That sounds fucking horrible. I would honestly take fucking DKP over that

I like the system conceptually, but wished it was a bit more structured. I suppose having to deal with shitters rolling need on everything is part of the MMO experience, however.

personal loot is better if you're not an autistic anti-social shut-in

I always waited until everyone voted greed so someone couldn't just vote need when they didn't actually need it then I would go need to steal it

I can't tell if this is ironic or not anymore, but I hope it is.

No.

that can easily be remedied by having bosses just drop more loot depending on the raid size.

>need greed or steal rolls
>steal just reports itself as a greed roll
>if someone rolls need and wins your steal roll counteracts it
>item is removed from their bag and put into yours only after leaving the dungeon
>if they try to equip it inside the dungeon it automatically disenchants itself instead
>you steal the mats too

That's not a better loot system then individual loot.
He asked "name a better system", and I did.

what? personal loot is better if you ARE an autistic anti-social shut-in because you don't have to talk to people, form relationships to get into a guild or get on officers' good side for loot priority, or deal with the social ramifications or who wins rolls mid-dungeon.

I am salty as fuck that it got removed from raids with ML.
However personal loot is great in pugs, and it'd be better if you could trade at any item level.
>inb4 seething ninjas

for gear its fine
when you spend a month grinding a recipe and have some green nigger that doesn't even have the profession need it so he can sell it on the AC it is total cancer
fuck orcs

When did this happen? Is it really that casual now?

What if I ran Black Temple solo? Would all loot drop for me?

your reason for it being a better system than individual loot is that 40-man raids dropping 2 pieces of loot per boss is dumb. i said that can be remedied by having more loot drop.

>classic: identitarian/high trust community
>retail: multicultural/low trust community

The reason it's better is because it ignores raid composition you dumb fuck and you won't get dead loot.

you get a currency from killing raid bosses that can be turned into gear

I love it when some holy faggot paladin rolls need for his ret off spec on a best in slot weapon for my DK and wins.

Personal loot is the best because loot is ultimately meaningless and the less time I spend managing it the better.

Huh? I could've swore Beta still has Need/Greed rolling. What's it replaced with, just 1 roll without specifying?
I guess that's a bit inconvenient but it'll do.

>play warrior
>hunter takes my 2-hander
>i take his bow

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>did you feel
>they removed it
>neo-WoW

Anyhow, I think that's how it should be. Distributing loot and the social aspects that go along with it should be a part of the game. To the extent that people don't bargain, pass loot to people needing it more, group up with friends who you WOULD consider passing loot to, whatever, the solution shouldn't be to develop a band-aid solution but to attempt to make a game that encourages the more sociable playstyle. Doubly so for raids: you would obviously use master loot regardless of if you use loot council or inferior loot systems, but maximizing the benefit from loot is a noteworthy part of running a high-end guild, and personal loot would take out this aspect (I don't know if that's how it works in neo-WoW raids, just saying).

I remember when I was 10 years old and got to WC with my first char, a hunter, for the first time.
I rolled need for everything because I didn't know the difference between the two words.
Then I got kicked.
Strangely, I don't remember if the guys told me about or anything, because part of the group was from the guild I was in. Funny how one's memory can be so accurate to some specific points but utterly useless at others.
the last item that I needed was a green two handed axe

he's kinda wrong. basically boss will drop X loots depending of the size of your raid party, then the game decides who it gives the loot to (random), wich will always be something their spec can use.

You can then trade any loot that has a equal lower item level than the piece you have equiped

Yeah instead you can just go fucking weeks not seeing any fucking loot from raids like with personal loot. Really puts it forefront in your mind that you're wasting your time and life

What about transmog or mount drops?

>tfw rolling a 46/0/5 moonkin

Instead of random loot you get 'points'. Player can spend the points toward upgrade of their choice. With the current stupidity of 15 ilvl increase between every minor content change you could have it increase an item 1 ilvl each time. Put a cap so that every new raid boss you kill increases the max by one while you are at it.

I too love playing Skyrim with discord opened

JUST

you should never be insulated from other players in an MMO and it's a fun meta element using loot strategically instead of hurrrrr healer gets the loot because the titanforging gods smiled upon him

Still better then group loot because it least you don't have to watch pieces trickle downstream past you.

People will usually go
(item) ROLL FOR NEED OR XMOG
if they don't want the item. You can also change your loot spec so you'll get a different specs items

>huntard needs everything so everyone is needing all drops to stop his faggotry
>rage quits when the priest gets a nice new bow

hunters are made for bullying

Pretty sure Black Temple is fucked since they redid it for timewalking to scale it to current level ever 6 months. So if you went and solo'd it, it would scale down to 10m with personal loot and you would get one item every 5 bosses.
That's how legion raids are at the moment. Completely retarded that they killed this since doing those with 2 people would actually be enjoyably difficult to progress through during the expansion; and then they will give loot when they are literal faceroll with your actual face, smashing it on the keyboard.

Seed/Feed rolling

Does anyone here still play any-WOW? Is level from 1 still fun?

Yea Forums was much better back when wowfags were shunned.

I had literally no idea how the system worked, so in the limited time I played WoW I just waited a few minutes then clicked the dice on everything. Only until one group complained about it and explained the concept on "Ninjaing" I stopped, I figured if no one rolled it was a free for all.

I don't see anything wrong with FFXI's system, theres a master loot pool and if you want something you roll for it and the highest roll wins. Or if you wanted to be precious you nominate a quartermaster who holds it all.

If I remember correctly, a priest would not be able to need on a bow though. You could only need if you could use it at the time of rolling.

No sharing just personal loot. Unique equipables do not drop again for you (unless they have different stats) Higher priority is given to gear you don't have pertaining to your attribute.

Once the gear is no longer "relevant" you can filter out specifically what attribute gear you want to drop for you exclusively

Any class could learn any weapon in vanilla, it was cool desu

Unironically, Terraria's loot bags were great.

Everyone got them, they all had a good handful of items, and you could easily trade them.

once you're in the raid there isn't much incentive to do well with that system.

>that time before need/greed with only roll/pass
>after every single drop people had to go "g" or "n" in chat to know whether to roll or pass
Never again

thats not how it works for solo content.
if you go to old instances and raids you get the full loot that people would have gotten if you were in a full group relevant to the content you do. so if you ran black temple you get the loot that would have dropped for a typical black temple raid.
personal loot rules for old content only applies to timewalking and the previous expansion.
in other words personal loot only applies to bfa, legion and timewalking.
its still a bad system in my opinion since you can solo heroic legion content easily right now and get shitall for loot for example but it does allow you to farm stuff for old content since you get all the loot that would have dropped.
on the flipside peresonal loot is tradable so transmog runs for timewalking and legion content is a good way to get whatever you want.

scarce loot keeps content relevant longer. when a 40 man raid bosses drop 3 gear per kill you'll be doing the same raid like hundreds of times.

he said "share" zoomer
instanced loot is a participation award

People love to complain about ninjas but I 3 years of playing even with randoms I never got mad or saw legit ninjas.

I only NEEDED on what I needed and if a mage for example got a plate armor I'd be like "Whatever, I'll run this again later"

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>MMMMMMMMMMMIND IF I ROLL NEEEEEEEEEEEEEED?

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yes, having to compete with your own group for items was ass.

You are still competing with your own group, the game just rolls for you

based gnome

It's not really as common as people fearmonger it to be. And with the 2.5 hour trade window now even people who try to do it as a "mistake" will be forced to trade to the correct person unless they want to be kicked. The only real group I could see doing it is le epic retard zoomers.

And this is a good thing how? Repeating spent content over and over is fucking boring.

Are you dumb? It was 25 silver or something, there was a weapon trainer in every city

i played an undead warlock using a dagger and needed all daggers

An unbiased master looter who abides by the rolls

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Hunters eating up gear from real classes
Paladins needing on cloth

>items cant be rare, its skinnerboxing! I should get what I want when I want it or else its a BAD GAME for making me work for it!

I bet you dont like better players getting better rewards in games either. Because its skinnerboxing.

Ah, perhaps you are simply mistaken. Each class could learn extra weapon skills, but not all of them. Warrior could learn almost everything, barring wands, I believe.

retard

Nigger what? There’s no fucking difference between 2 pieces of loot dropping per boss and constantly killing bosses to never have personal loot drop for you due to RNG

Oh you're probably right then, I haven't played since BC, so my bad. Carry on user

Based chuck poster

>personal loot is better because at least you don't get to be happy for other people
This is your brain on nu-wow

Do you also get unicorns to police your guild?

go play a single player rpg then

This is just meme currencies like emblems of triumph or whatever that were introduced in BC and Wrath. which are a good idea tbqh

>Are you sad they removed it?
I'm sad they removed a lot of things. It's why I don't play anymore

why are people complaining about content drought in all last expansions yet this wasnt an issue in vanilla?

need greed is definitely the most fun loot mode

Leprechauns?

Believe it or not, there are actual decent people in WoW.

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back when i played wow in a guild(im a rogue)
do raid weekly
been in guild for over a month already and been there for every raid
new recruit rogue joins up less then a week
do raid finally a dagger upgrade i need drops
NEED IT
faggot raid leader gives it to the new recruit saying its a bigger upgrade for him
new recruit never logs in again after that

did the same thing when i was a hunter and a hunter crossbow dropped
faggot gave it to a fucking newb rogue!

fuck WoW and the retarded players.

>Newfag attempts to greentext

>doesnt roll weed

Because vanilla had attunements for everything that took fucking forever and you couldn't skip to the current content you had to get your tiers in order unless you got carried. Completing Naxx was like an impossible dream for most players not in a hardcore raiding guild. The game also forced pvpers to constantly pvp or face deranking

loot council

that wasnt for greentexting retard

seems like you are a mega retard if you need a green text just to read simple bullet points

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vanilla attunements are completely trivial, you're confused with tbc

because games were shit back then

>Doesn’t even put bullet points and is now performing damage control
Just lurk moar

Allow me to introduce LCaaS, or Loot Council as a Service. By adding rules that prioritize factors such as attendance, performance, current gear or the amount of loot already obtained, you can show a list of everyone elligible for a certain item, or show what items a specific player is elligible for. Because the rules can be agreed on beforehand, there is no potential for corruption from the loot council or unease from the players.
Here we can see the Choker of Enlightement has been allowed for mages, warlocks, boomkin druids and shadow priests. Of all the players in the highest attendance bracket, Harrison, Liz and Thuy have the less loot, so they are allowed to /roll on it. Unparalled fairness.

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Well, there's various reasons. For starters, vanilla simply had a whole lot more content patches and generally more content. Vanilla and TBC also lacked outrageously lengthy stay in one tier.

Secondly, content other than raids was more relevant. TBC increased the time it takes to reach level cap (even after reduced XP requirements in 2.3) but other expansions have decreased it so for pre-Wrath expansions even the leveling was a "real" part of the game. 5-mans also were more legitimate content than the kind of thing you start by pressing a button and breeze through with randoms since the content is tuned to be unfailable even by these random groups.

Thirdly, no planned obsolescence of raids. In Wrath and beyond only the latest tier is relevant content - for example, in 3.3 you can get a full set of ilvl232 and 245 gear from doing 5-mans (ignoring 264 BoEs, 251 Quel'dalar weapon, 264 emblem of frost items you could get a bit slower) while ICC10 is tuned for TOC10 gear (ie. ilvl 232) with 0% buff and then there's the additional catchup mechanic from +30% everything buff on top of that! You could be overgearing it the day you ding! In other words, in vanilla and TBC direct (like simply making bosses easier or taking out attunements) and indirect nerfs (like new accessible gear options from small raids, buffed low-level items, class buffs etc) slowly make previously inaccessible content accessible for more people so a low-end player actually has the whole T1->T2->T3 progression left to do with its detours. In Wrath and beyond even the lowest scrub only needs to concern himself with one tier, AND artificial faceroll difficulty setting also allows you to complete it day 1. In other words, when it comes to running out of raids to clear, everyone is at the same spot with the world first raider, it's just that they've picked a different difficulty setting.

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I miss the novelty of it and the ML system, but I don't miss ninjas

Most gear is crafted. You find schematics or knowledge on how to create gear in dungeons, dungeons also drop crafting materials. Crafted gear stats are dependent on the crafter's skill and the wearer's level/stats. Crafters can teach other crafters their recipe's, but it's expensive for both parts share knowledge.

what do you mean they removed it?

I miss it

AHHEM

LOOT

COUNCIL

me and my friends get all the loot

you get the scraps

nice whitetext, newfag

all summary's dont need to have the bullet point icon retard
if you cant tell something is a summary i feel bad for you
the fact you need it greentext'd is incredibly sad
i pity you

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>Playing Druid
>Sick Agility polearm drops
>GM's Death Knight girlfriend wanted it too
>She wins the roll
>Before he can give her it people go mad saying its not a DK weapon because its Agility
I was genuinely fucking shocked I got that weapon over her

>taking along hunters
>ever

Hunter.
Weapon.

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>he can't read whitetext

lol

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463450406
You don’t even deserve one for pity. Fag

Well, that's a misrepresentation of the facts, too. You can make it look overbearing with a picture like this, but as a general rule, you complete attunements in course of regular play with very little extra being required. Like, you "obviously" do level 70 instances once before going into Kara, and it doesn't require anything more than that. Ditto for doing the quests since most people would need to do the prequests for BT/TK attunement chains for item rewards or simply getting the gold required for flying.

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meanwhile
>MC
>run(or just skip everything in) BRD
>10 minutes
>BWL
>run UBRS
>30 minutes
>naxx
>pay up, bitch

463450579
unlike you i dont need to have a linked backlink to know who replys to me, but nice try goober

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Loot ninjaing was worse way back when gear was a lot more valuable and a fucking knife from Deadmines was coveted.

How obsessed can you be?

you casually throw in BT with TK/Kara like BT and Mount Hyjal aren't some of the worst quest chains to ever exist

when you been here long enough you know who is replying to you

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>Not having exalted argent rep from farming crafting mats
Nobody who ran naxx ever had to worry about paying up unless something stupid happened

>sharing

Master looter with 9/24/39 other people that understand loot is a tool and not a purpose.

The only real bad part is hyjal completion because everyone hates Hyjal.

You think you do, and you probably do actually. its just a circlejerk at this point.

>GM's wife/GF gets priority
WEW

the point is it's easy as piss no matter what, you don't have to autistically plat the game and run every single dungeon on every single character you make, or run a dozen of them again because you forgot to pick up a quest somewhere along the line
worst comes to worst you just cough up some dough and go to town

yep at least we were amused for a little bit in our life

back to the dredge of reality, have a nice day

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the better analogy would be that only 20 customers a day get to buy groceries, chosen at random, at the checkout counter after you filled your cart with food.

Master loot with a loot council assuming the council consists of a rotating set of members and thinks of the raid group as a whole instead of trying to feed all loot to a single idiot.

why the fuck wouldn't you get your entire party to need on rare boe drops or mount drops??? why did idiots always greed them then complain?

So steal only exists to be an asshole and is strictly better than need?

skinnerboxing is random reward distribution fuckhead. it doesn't matter how good you are or how often you push the button. your mind is hooked because of the "just one more" mentality that ensnares gamblers and rats alike. except this is aimed at children and manchildren.

yeah. it was fun ninja stuff and see people rage.

you should just buy it from him then. what are you? poor?

Hyjal attunement is looting item from Kael and Vashj. Now, that is obviously a pretty tough attunement because Kael and Vashj are both more difficult than anything in Hyjal, but it's not exactly high-effort (at least after the vial change).

And BT attunement is the same shit. A dozen or so part quest chain (ie. no longer than Kara attunement of Cipher of Damnation) and then a few parts in T5 raids. The tough part is doing the T5 raids because they're more difficult than T6, or getting every idiot to start the quest chains because there's always someone who's not on the same page, but the logistics of completing them once you've started doesn't require much more than doing the content you were going to do anyway.

terminal gold hording

this.

as a hunter main, i was forced to make my own groups or ask friends.

What else is there? Its a solved game, where you can't win really. You have these groups were people spout shit and change their opinions daily. There is simply no way you would drag me into a raid where the loot is reserved, and I might get breadcrumbs. Competition rises with minmaxing, and I highly doubt the you get excited for another person getting thunderfury days will be back. I wouldn't be even surprised if Gearscore or some form of it came back.

that's a lot of words to say i'm right about vanilla attunements being trivial compared to tbc

Change need to "main set" and greed to "off set"

they removed need/greed? What expansion exactly? What system do they have now? Played since vanilla up to cata (quit before the first content patch) so it was need/greed for start till finish for me.

>Put time and effort into collecting shit to do the raid
>Show up and do you job
>Expect to get something in returned
>WOW SO ENTITLED CIS MALE PRIVILEGE

Lol stfu nigger.

>played healer/tank/dps combo with my two brothers
>never took a hunter along during all of Vanilla WoW because we had heard of how they'd steal loot that wasn't there's and their pets would constantly pull

Felt good man. Saying "LF2M DPS *insert dungeon here*" and having literally dozens of responses to selectively choose from was amazing.

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Well, I guess they are, but in both cases they're a non-consideration that doesn't influence things like content drought.

What's the problem with hunters?

I'm pretty sure we'll get all the cancer modern WoW has, like sellruns, some kind of itemlvl elitism addon, streamershit and a shitty, egoistic community.
I'll give it a try since I have two months of gametime still lying around and want to give it a chance, but I'm afraid it just wont be like it used to ever again.
I sure do hope I'm wrong and can have a ton of fun with the game again though.

Ultimately, no.
Need/Greed works well in a world where no ones a cunt. But even if only 5% of your experiences with need/greed are negative, that 5% can feel so awful that it alters your general opinion of others. It's also very abusable by people in the position of power.

Personal loot has solves almost all of those issues, the only one being that Blizzard is way to strict with Personal loot trading atm because they are worried about harassment.
As a raid leader, Personal loot made my job have significantly less drama.
Fuck going back to using anything like DKP and having to split 3 pieces of gear between 40 people.

Personalized loot.

There's only personal loot now. You either get loot or you don't, and you can get a limited amount of roll coins you can use for an extra chance of gold/points/loot

interesting. But man... gotta be pretty disappointing downing a boss and seeing no loot even if it's not intended for you.

hopefully the streamer cancer dies down, unfortunately the beta was all streamers so it's hard to avoid

Nothing nowadays, but back in earlier expansions they would need on everything because they could use cloth, leather, mail and nearly every weapon. This meant they would constantly take gear every other class actually needed to upgrade.

It's part of the game. Rare recipes are rare for a reason. Maybe you shouldve just farmed the gold to buy it from the AH for a month instead of PUG'ing with randoms who would backstab you over it.

Not sorting personal loot trough a loot council is simply not optimal and leaves it all to rng who gets what. Having to trade loot and play around the trade restrictions is simply more bothersome work forced down by blizzard.

>roll need on gear that they get less less from than their teammates
>pet's constantly pull monsters
>always forget to turn off taunt on their pet
>deal shit damage

Don't get me wrong, a good hunter can be great and none of the above apply, but most fucking suck.

>skinnerboxing is random reward distribution
No?

Because of how Hunter's worked, pretty much every item could be used by Hunters in some way.
They benefited from every stat, could use most weapons and had the largest verity of damage types.

Nothing more frustrating than seeing there's jack shit in the corpse, then rolling a coin and getting a miniscule amount of ap or gold that's worth shit. Then someone loots an item they don't even want because not only it has bad stats for him, but can't trade it because it was a ilvl upgrade for a spec he doesn't even play.

>pet on aggressive
>constantly multishot CCd enemies
>"everything is hunter loot"
>feign death at the drop of a hat
>forget to bring extra ammo

>someone have [food]? Forgot to buy some and my pet's getting pissed

>run a guild during BC
>accept gold in exchange for taking undergeared players to get some easy raid loot
>except I fucking hate rogues
>every time we advertise we get 20 applications from rogues, many of whom join the guild just to try and get loot
>all of them are annoying underage spergs
>eventually get sick of it, start taking rogues since the core party is so overgeared
>roll need on every agility weapon or leather gear that pops up
>disenchant it immediately after in plain sigh
>watch every rogue leave a full clear with no new gear, forced to wait another week to try again
>self-aggrandizing rogue who "is a big time roleplayer" sends angry tells because he notices what I'm doing
>report him for harassment
>he gets a week suspension
>ERP with his roleplay girlfriend while he's gone

Rogues are faggots.

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if it's a static group and not a pug then DKP

>Rogues are faggots.

As someone who used to play a Warlock in cloth armor, I agree with this notion.

>ERP with his roleplay girlfriend while he's gone
And I was beginning to respect you, too

>ERP with a guy as revenge
lol

Does personal loot drop offspec gear?

If so i would have loved to play with that system. With Need/Greed, though it was easy to gear up as healer, would never be possible to be awarded dps gear by raid

>simply more bothersome work forced down by blizzard.

It really isn't. Other than being in a top 1% guild, pretty much every guild has loot people don't need and can trade be a simple /roll with priority going to core raiders over casuals/alts.
Who gives a fuck if it isn't optimal, loot is so easily replaced/redundant one patch later that it really don't matter. The time you save not having to distribute loot is significantly better.
If individuals are obsessed enough about min/maxing to get a tiny dps increase, they have other options to do that. This is coming from a guild that consistently sits in the top 10 on the server.

hey at least this time the guy will be on hormones since its 2019

You can select the spec gear will drop for. So yes, you can build a healer set while playing a tank.

>(at least) one piece of loot drops per player per dungeon/raid guaranteed
>no duplicates
>no trading
there, i fixed the fucking loot system. you can still have shit like daily and weekly lockouts but i can finally actually get fucking rewards for doing content that's supposed to be rewarding

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>shower me with purples
No.

>you can still have lockouts
>shower

Expansions were front loaded with more content. Not really a fairy picture.

Why don't they just make a system where you individually earn peaces of gear you want based on the raid itself, instead of a gambling system?
>Finally we beat the last boss of the raid I farmed 8+ hours to prepare for and spent my entire night fighting NPCs
>finally the rare piece of gear I wanted dropped!
>oh no I lost the need roll
>guess I gotta repeat the entire process multiple times
how do people tolerate this hamster wheel system?

>guaranteed AT LEAST one drop every raid
>not a shower

If I absolutely had to keep personal loot I would give the bonus loot tokens a 100% chance to get an item, give the player only one per week and keep everything else the same.
It can probably still be frustrating to not get the item you want, but it at least gives you some control over what you get.

>no food analogy
>hmmm
>store analogy

This

I remember when I was new to the game I thought Greed would be stronger than Need. Good times.

4 pieces of loot per month
there is no fucking reason in a monthly subscription based game that i should be able to go 3 weeks without seeing a single fucking +5 ilvl upgrade. If I'm able to clear the content I should be able to reap the rewards contained within. ESPECIALLY with old content

I'm starting to think this place just dislikes analogies in general.

I'm pretty sure two continents and ~20 dungeons is more than what expansions had at launch, and in terms of raid content it's comparable

MUH CAREER
MUH FAMILY
MUH FREE TIME
MUH I PAY FOR THIS GAME
MUH I DESERVE TO EXPERIENCE ALL CONTENT

No one forces you to play this game. Gear distribution shouldnt be a participation trophy. Faggot,.

No-lifing loser GM who plays every class well, attends every raid, and doesn't interact with guildies except for lootmaster duties. Loot is distributed by considering best-in-slot itemization, attendance, and performance in the party. You cannot refute this, don't even try.

Yes....people were tired of getting their feelings hurt by random assholes or "corrupt" GMs not giving them free shit during their trial week so they forced personal loot on all content at all levels beyond solo. All this has really done is fuck over organized guilds that handled master loot like adults.

Ion thinks this is a great idea and despite months of backlash will not budge on it because he's apparently "looking out for the little guy" and waits to avoid those ridiculous edge cases where top end guilds optimize to get world firsts faster...the "one percent" shit that nobody cares about.

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>no fucking reason
if blizzard gave everybody sweet loot every raid, they would lose interest too fast. You gotta keep them coming back for more like a casino.

Instanced/Personal Loot is best.

Random chance merely pads out gameplay by forcing repetition. Why would anyone want this?

It's not a participation award. It's an award for time and and completion put forth. Beating a thing fifty times isn't any harder than doing it once.

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>gotta keep them coming back for more like a casino
yeah look how well that fucking idea turned out

totally pointless system tbqh. every PUG i was ever in would just greed most things, and if something BOP dropped that people actually wanted, everyone would just pass and then we'd sort out who wanted it before /rolling.

they removed it? what is it now?

Im sorry to disappoint you, but this is the first time i wrote that. What user said just doesnt relate to this topic here in any way

Is the answer extremely well?
The treadmill isn't why people quit after legion.
If people didn't like the treadmill they'd have quick halfway through BC

>everybody passes
>take all the loot for yourself
>disenchant it in front of everyone
>/dance

>random chance is bad so we should use random chance instead
yikes

Everyone gets their own personal chance at loot. If the game deems it's not an immediate upgrade you're allowed to trade it but that's rarely the case.

>I'm I fitting in guise xd

you know what we had in bc?
tokens
you know what we had in wotlk?
tokens and conquest points
you know what we had in cata?
justice valor and conquest points
you know what we had in mop?
item upgrades valor points and bonus rolls
you know what we had in wod?
apexis vendors and item upgrades
you know what we had at the start of legion?
nothing but bonus rolls which were nerfed
you know what we had in bfa?
nothing but bonus rolls which were further nerfed

>Vanilla
>Major patch
>Literally only added weather and a full balance changes.

Vanilla literally only had 5 actual major patches
>1.3 Dire Maul
>1.6 Black wing Lair
>1.7 ZG
>1.9 AQ
>1.11 Naxx
Even these patches added less content than most major patches did since Wrath.

>successfully clear content
>receive nothing for four weeks

Is that all this game is to you? A glorified lootbox?

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lets be completely honest here:
Competition spirit will be 2 times bigger at worst than it was in vanilla. You can fool yourself otherwise with this "just have fun bro" attitude believe me the moment people see that epic and they can have that this blood fires up. Its cool and dandy until you reach the point where it comes to that point where you want to reap the fields what you put your work on it too. Its just human nature, and people changed over time, especially since most of us are adults now and more or less understand that competitiveness is a very big factor to success, especially when there is nothing new. Private servers proved this theory too: if you are a warrior there is already at least 3 other warriors waiting to replace you, and be better than you. History repeats itself and you'll see the 1% Tigole shit with an even worse packaging. You can bet your ass on that.

>play spec with a stat that's actually worthless on it (mastery)
>ring with a fuckload of mastery drops
>can't give it to a guildie who actually needs it because it's 5 ilvls higher than my current ring
th-thanks, blizz

There are many reasons. But at the end of the day, I think the simplest fact is that Vanilla is a full game while the expansions are expansions pretending to be full games.

>only patches with raids count!!
Classic retailcuck.

1. Make it impossible to "need" things that your character can't equip. All non-equitable things are for "greed" anyways, they are trade goods.
2. Make it impossible to "need" things that can be traded. If it can be traded, you can buy it from who won it. Its a "greed" thing.
3. For "need" items (that is, equitable items that you can equip), have it display what the different people are currently using in that slot when you hover. That way you can see if someone is doing a "need" roll despite already having a similar quality item, while another person would get this as a huge upgrade. Just information, not binding.
4. Make it so until all people are done rolling, you can cancel your roll. You don't get to reroll, but maybe you decided you don't want to participate in the rolling contest for this item, after being asked by someone and agreeing with them.

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I think a token system is the most sensible loot system for end game content, but I'd be lying if I said there wasn't an irrational part of me that absolutely loves the gambling and social aspect of a few random drops being divided among a much larger group of people.

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That's either a DKP system (which can get really fucking stupid at times) or master loot with a good raid leader (which brings the massive risk of having a shit raid leader giving out loot retardedly)

We had a rotating council of 5 people + the two officers who decided who got loot. Each month we'd literally have the guild nominate people to be on it (they could nominate the same people if they wanted). Except in extreme edge cases (that involved the dumbass getting removed immediately) this always worked out for us.

fuck that sounds lame. so is it possible that you won't even see any loot after a boss fight in a raid, if you have bad luck and no one wants to trade their drops? and do with the trades do you see what other people got and can bargain between players or what?

There is literally no counter argument to a secondary token system on top of a regular loot system. Why is okay for someone to have content on lock and clear it for months but never get the gear they want because of rng?

>So it's possible not to see loot?
Yes
>Do you see what other people got?
Yeah you do but a lot of the time people are assy about it or will just lie so they can sell/DE the item.

completing dungeons gives you currency that you can spend on loot.

People are inherently evil, so the system will never work.
>inb4 people try to disagree

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ITS NOT A LOOTBOX YOU RETARDED FAGGOT

Youre reading a book. The hero is in peril, the villain is on the cusp of victory. You turn the page, is that a fucking lootbox? No! It's called SUSPENSE. It's called STAKE. It's called INVESTMENT.

Without STAKE, INVESTMENT, SUSPENSE, there is no story. WoW is great because it gives you stories to tell. That quest where you spend 5 hours to grind 4 bear asses? That's a STORY. Low drop rates and unpredictable loot gives you A STORY TO TELL IT WAS DESIGNED THIS WAY ON PURPOSE ITS NOT A LOOT BOX YOU RETARDED FAGGOT IF YOU ARE GUARANTEED GEAR DROPS THEN EVERYONE WINS, THE GEAR IS LESS VAULUABLE.

YOU FEEL LESS ACCOMPLISHED. EVERYONE WHO SEES TIER 3 IN STORMWIND IS LESS IMPRESSED. IT TAKES THE MYSTERY AND STATUS OUT OF THE GAME

TRY TO USE YOUR RETARDED ROOM TEMPERATURE IQ BRAIN TO THINK... FUCKING. THINK. IF YOU GET TIER 3. AND THE NEXT GUY GETS TIER 3. AND EVERY FUCKING RAID LOGGER GETS TIER 3. THEN WHAT MAKES TIER 3 SPECIAL? IT DOESNT MAKE IT SPECIAL. YOU JUST TURNED VANILLA INTO BFA

YOU JUST KILLED VANILLA. GOOD JOB. IT WAS DESIGNED THIS WAY ON PURPOSE.

AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH WHY ARE YOU ALL SO FUCKING STUPID

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It was fine.

>wow is great because it gives you stories to tell
>i didnt get loot once for 5 weeks haha u guys like my story

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and then one week you got 5 items, who cares

People like you are the reason wow got welfare legendaries

Gear/oot drama gave a lot of stories.

>one time my friend got a piece of loot and i didnt
>i asked if i could have it and he said no and i got angry and gquit
>haha u guys like my story

SHUT UP BLIZZ SHILL KIKE

Go play BFA if you don't like it. Seeing someone in tier 3 was fucking insane back when. Now every raidlogger gets legendaries.

Seriously go play BFA. Im not insulting you. Thats obv the game you will enjoy.

it's funny cause you how no idea how stupid your post is

bfa is a fucking dumpster fire too because loot is just as stupid in different ways
>oh that guy got his bis azerite piece in his first week box, he must be so cool
vs
>oh that guy got lucky on a t3 roll on his first run, he must be so cool
there's no fucking difference. you didn't earn either
>b-but naxx was har-
No you fucking idiot you had 39 people to wipe your ass. if you got loot in vanilla you were sucking the raid leaders dick and if you get loot now you got lucky. You personally don't do a fucking thing to get your loot either way. Remember mage tower? those skins were EARNED because you had to DO something other than ROLL