Seriously?

Everyone in Dark Souls is a time traveler.

He never made it back to Ariandel.

there's the bitch who never left her room and the one knight too

miyazki hates the sequels and wanted DaS1 to be a stand alone game. the ''lore'' in 2 and 3 is moot

>The last boss you originally fought there was later renamed to “Pontiff Sulyvahn” and moved to a different map, but Pontiff Sulyvahn was absolutely the last boss. He would be fought int he Untended Graves at the very end of the game
>Gundyr was originally called Old King Oceiros and was in where Dragon Oceiros is right now.
>The Carthus Catacombs was originally accessed after Greatwood, where the alter is now, that was actually a doorway.
>Smoldering Lake used to have path up to Irithyll starting from the large crossbow, and met up with the broken stair section where you fight the Alva invader. This is also why the Pontif Beast can appear either in the water or at the bridge, because originally there were 2 ways into Irithyll.
>The entire area in Smouldering Lake with the crossbow was actually a boss arena where you would fight a giant bat, and you could crash through the ground to avoid the boss, and then use the crossbow to wound it, a combination of Dragon God and Kalameet mechanics, then phase 2 would be the giant worm appears.
>Lothric Castle was originally all at night, and there were serpents with wings flying around instead. The Darksign Sun thing was only going to happen with the Untended Graves area, not lothric castle. The Pilgrim Butterflies weren't a thing.
>Anor Londo originally was not in the game at all. Aldritch was originally supposed to be fought in the Cathedral of the Deep. Deacon's of the Deep was originally a 2 phase and they had a cutscene and everything, Aldritch would flow out of the coffin at the half way point and eat all the Deacons, then the fight would involve circling around the coffin.

reminder that pic related is teaming up with Hackazaki on the next Fromsoft game.
>wow, I guess we truly were the Project Rune
really?

Attached: 1534263964927.png (720x401, 221K)

Damn that last one sounds really good. Why didn't they do it?

DLC should’ve ended with you fighting Ludleth as he was supposed to be. Think about it? How does a cripple like him managed to light the flames? And he said he would be reborn as a giant. Translation error or not, it would be nice if we got a chance to fight him as he envisioned himself.

>The last boss you originally fought there was later renamed to “Pontiff Sulyvahn” and moved to a different map, but Pontiff Sulyvahn was absolutely the last boss. He would be fought int he Untended Graves at the very end of the game
Honestly, this wouldn't have been that great of a change.
Fromsoft doesn't end their games by having you fight the secret mastermind behind everything in an epic final. Usually the final boss is a pitiful figure your putting out of their misery.

did you pull this out of your delicious ass or do you have some sources?

The tv series hasn't been going the same direction as the books since season 5 user.

>Two hobos fighting for a magical churro
>Kino
Fuck off

for the same reason they cut the giant snake boss from bloodborne; the gameplay was complete shit.

>did you pull this out of your delicious ass or do you have some sources?
Not him, but some of that is true as seen by some pre-release screenshots.
Some of it is out of his ass.
Some of it (probably the bat boss) is just a misinterpretation.

at least their original vision wouldn't have resulted in the hardest boss being randomly fucking smack-dab in the half-way point of the entire game. like who the fuck takes a final boss fight and just puts it in the middle? after killing the fucking guy the rest of the game becomes easy

ludleth was made a lord forcefully, did you not notice his fucking legs were cut off?

Are you fucking new? Pontiff Sulyvahn being the original final boss is a confirmed fact found by hackers. Lurk more, nigger.

None of it is really ass pull tier, all of it, at its core, is legitimate. Some of it is just extrapolation.

>>Anor Londo originally was not in the game at all.
It was, but it was in a cut desert area, for the final game they changed the sand to snow. That's why it appears in that wasteland in the intro

>he didn't explore the whole area
That bimbo invade-ganks you.

>Pontiff
>hardest boss
is that a joke?

In the base game? Absolutely.

i knew about pontiff being the final boss, but I didn't know about the bat boss, furfag.

>Nameless King

>None of it is really ass pull tier, all of it, at its core, is legitimate. Some of it is just extrapolation.
Saying that you were suppose to fight the Demon Prince in Smouldering Lake is extrapolation.
Saying that the giant sand worm is phase 2 is just an asspull and isn't really based on anything.

>but I didn't know about the bat boss, furfag.
The bat boss or crimson bat was probably just the Demon Prince fight in its early concept stage.
I prefer what we got in the dlc over this giant crossbow/giant worm stuff.

>It was, but it was in a cut desert area, for the final game they changed the sand to snow.

I still don't understand why they changed the sand to snow, it completely destroys the coherency of the game world. like the pilgrims of londor and the intro video itself have no basis within the main game. the only explanation I could come up with is that londor exists within the desert region where we fight gael, and they are traveling into lothric through the same "find entrance within ancient ruins" method the player character does in dark souls 2. this would make said area and the filianore interaction less time travel and more returning to the real world where all of the kingdoms have been gone for millenia

Is a fucking joke of a boss and is several magnitudes easier than Sulyvahn.

>comparing an optional boss in a hidden area designed for second playthroughs to a mandatory story boss who's moveset was designed to be the main story's finale

sand worm was probably meant to be a mob you encountered on whatever desert path you took to get to sand-ruined anor londo

>He is a human and he has existed since the begging of time but he has eaten all the dark souls and also he is the only being alive at the end of an infinite time and he is the most powerful human ever and he has lightning powers.
Literally the Coldsteel of From Software
What the fuck were they thinking.

This was the only kino fight in the whole series

Attached: abyss-watchers-dks3.jpg (1920x1080, 326K)

actually, most likely scenario is that pontiff was the penultimate boss, with him guarding the first flame so you can't thwart his plan, then you get past him and fight the red knight aka lord of cinder. "red knight" of course being an engrish mistranslation of the knight being searing red, aka on fire.

Attached: yes I am.jpg (1280x720, 188K)

you're high

>designed for second playthroughs
how the fuck do you not find him on your first run

Anyone have that amalgamation of every FROM final boss? It had some obnoxiously long version of Gael's line or some shit.

Wrong

Attached: Nameless Kino.jpg (1080x600, 129K)

this boss was so easy unfortunately

Pontiff has a hard moveset, but you don't even have to master it 100% to kill him.
He's just not that strong if you have enough damage to kill his clone quickly. Maybe you were underleveled when you fought him.

maybe you were overleveled when you fought him?

carthus was originally going to be some sort of ruins itself, which is why the carthus sandworm hails from there.

How can it be kino if the camera doesn't even work on this boss?

Dark 3 really created more questions than it answered.

I oneshotted him, the tutorial boss was harder.

Because you locked on? Camera is fine otherwise.

>that callback to Gwyn's theme during the 2nd phase

Attached: mako1.gif (179x275, 242K)

Same ending. It's fucked and GRRM has no idea how to make it work. Seeing the show I doubt there even is a way.

>you're high
You must be if you think Nameless King is harder than Sulyvahn. The only issue with Nameless King is the fact that his phase 1 has a terrible camera.

I liked Dark 3, but so much of the setup for the story fell so flat.
Why did they hype up Yhorm so much if he turned out to be a shitty puzzle boss with no lore at all?

it's pretty simple if you can into lore instead of watching shitty youtube videos.

all three worlds from the dark souls games are memories of long-dead civilizations, and all that's left of the actual world are ruins spread throughout an endless desert of ash. at the center of it all are the pygmies who continue to endlessly fuel the first flame, but when the illusion of filianore is broken and the pygmies killed by gael, the cycle of light and dark started by gwyn is finally put to an end.

he was originally meant to be the tutorial boss and he was hyped up because he was the first boss of the game and meant to be terrifying in that respect.

How would you even find Archdragon Peak on your first run if you're going in blind?

>all three worlds from the dark souls games are memories of long-dead civilizations, and all that's left of the actual world are ruins
This is the most retarded theory I've seen yet.
But Dark 3 just gave us tons of new shit without any lore. Who the fuck is Yorshka? Why does she think she's Gwyn's daughter? Why does Gwyn has a third daughter he never told us about? Is Yorshka the fourth daughter? If so then did Gwyn fuck a dragon?
What's the deal with Oceiros and his family? Who was his wife? Why is she important but never expanded on?
What is the deep? What is the Profaned Flame? What's the story behind the Profaned Capital? Behind Yhorm? What are the painted worlds? Are they really created, or are the painting just portals? Is Pontiff Sulyvahn a different kind of life form because he's from another world? Does his world truly exist? Do all the painted worlds take place in the same reality, or is each its own world?
Dark 3's lore wasn't nearly as bad as 2, but they just threw tons of shit at us without any explanation of what any of it was.

By not being retarded.

I don't understand how you can think NK with his ridiculous strong attacks is weaker than Sulyvahn who is only does absurd amounts of damage if you somehow manage to get hit by his combo attack. He also gets far easier once the second phase starts since his attacks become twice as readable. I struggled with more of the bosses after Sulyvahn than I did on Sulyvahn himself, fucking Aldrich took me forever whereas Pontiff was only a few tries

>AP can be seen in the distance as early as High Wall and you get a great view of it after Pontiff
>shortcut in Irithyll Dungeon has an outside area that faces the Peak, complete with dragon humanoids and knights sitting in a cross-legged position
>later on you come across Oceiros, a dragon humanoid, and find a cross-legged sitting gesture literally called "Path of the Dragon"
>put 2 and 2 together and return to the area to use the gesture

I thpught Oceiros wife was Gwynevere. She supposedly returned to Anal Rodeo after a long time and settled as Queen.

Yes seriously.

That was a theory, sure, but there's literally nothing suggesting who she might be.
Also, Gwynevere was married to a fire god in some far off land.
Who is Ocelotte? Is it Yorshka? She's the only other dragon person in the game. If so, what is her connection to Gwyndolin? Why did he take her away and hide her? Is he really her brother? Why would Gwyn fuck a dragon? Why did they just introduce a new Gwyn kid in Ringed City? And why isn't she called Gwynianor or something like the other kids?

This is the most important lore you need to know.

Attached: DARK_SOULS%3F_III_20170413170027.jpg (300x169, 9K)

Because Nameless King's attacks are all telegraphed minutes in advance. He hits hard but he's as slow as a turtle. Some of his moves are so broken that you can avoid them by just not looking at him. I'm not fucking joking, either. His charged lightning strike attack doesn't work is the player camera isn't focused on him. It just gets cancelled, and that's his strongest attack.You have to go out of your way to get hit by him unless you haven't adjusted to how the fucking game plays by that point, which would be pathetic since it's basically at the very end of the game.

I can't even tell what this image is. Post something made for larger life forms, please.

Statue of Gwyn where he's granting the Furtive Pygmy a crown of Lords.

yeah you're high

The divine blessing suggests the Queen might be her. It's the same description as DaS 1 divine blessing description.
I know she flew Anor Londo with the flame god, but maybe she returned.

Do you have a single lore snippet to back up that interpretation?
Also, the fuck are the angels? Why did they introduce all that serpent/angel shit in the last act and go literally nowhere with it? They could have bookended shit by revisiting the primordial serpents and explaining their role in the creation of the world, but no, we just get a dumb snow level and some non-sensicle undead capital that makes no real sense to the world at large.

>This is the most retarded theory I've seen yet.

it's the entire backstory of dark souls 2

Attached: 1367549-1398632966[1].jpg (2560x1440, 536K)

>The divine blessing suggests the Queen might be her
See, I'd like to believe that, but after Dark Souls 2 I can't take the lore totally seriously. Dark 3 has so much weird, unfinished shit that I can honestly believe that just being a mistake or a shortcut.

Not an argument.

This is in the ring city dlc.
Gwyn is giving the pygmy lordship over the ringed city for his humanity. It's where the curse started.

>Why does she think she's Gwyn's daughter?
her saying "Father Gwyn" is in a religious context, not familial

"The Darkmoon Knights were once led by my elder brother, the Dark Sun Gwyndolin."

The impact of a rando NPC fighting you in the final boss would’ve been greater if it was someone you already knew in the base game like Ludleth or Anri, instead of a DLC character

gwyn granted the pygmies a fake lordship in exchange for linking the fire and trapping away their humanity.

turns out that during the war against the dragons the humans were the strongest group by far, absolutely decimating the dragons in a way that gwyn couldn't even compete. gwyn found this threatening to his rule so he shackled them and used the first flame/bonfires as a means to contain them. the age of dark/hollowing is literally a result of what he did.

I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks NK is slower than Pontiff, the majority of Pontiff's swings are like twice the length of NK's moves, the sole exception being his stab, which has such a narrow hitbox you're not likely to even get hit by it

I'm starting to think your build was just awful and you respec'd sometime before fighting the later bosses

Can you actually give me some in-game text to support this? I didn't read any of this shit in the game.

Hey, remember Soulsborne games don't really have lore. It's just disconnected information that the players join. It can be anything you want since that was Miyazaki's intention (the thing about him reading english fantasy books when he was a child and only understanding parts of them, so he connected the information on his head, making the stories different).
Hell, most of the DaS 1 lore is a made up thing and we still don't know what the fuck is going on in Bloodborne.

gael's role was originally going to go to the red knight/soul of cinder, but they had to cut it due to time constraints and lore rewrites. I'm talking same backstory and everything.

could be a ward?

if you didn't read anything that's your fucking problem. you don't go into a dark souls lore thread and bitch about lore if you can't even put the effort in to read 2 minutes worth of item descriptions

No, there's definitely concrete history to Dark Souls. It's given in snippets, but you can form a comprehensive, if patchy, history of the world and its characters.
Even Bloodborne has internal consistency.
But Dark 3 seems like it just threw random shit around and hoped it would stick.

>I can't back up my claim so I'll just call him an idiot
Post an item description or dialogue snippet to support your headcanon or stop posting.

Nah, even a long time after DaS 1 launch we didn't knew some things, some of them were neves supposed to be knew, as in they didn't really thought about an explanaition for them. Go look ENB lore videos about DaS 1.
And Bloodborne is a complete mess. We don't even know why the player does what he does. Hell we don't know what is Oedon, one of the main players in the story of Bloodborne.

>I'm not going to argue with someone who thinks NK is slower than Pontiff,
But he is.

youtu.be/fo-Sc7ciEgk

youtu.be/ZD2tDnlITO8

Sulyvahn attacks faster and moves faster than Nameless King does. There's video footage to prove it. You just sound butthurt over facts.

Here you go

Attached: maxresdefault (16).jpg (1280x720, 191K)

There is no evidence that Gwyn, Nito, and the Witches were all outclassed by the Pygmies. You have absolutely no evidence of this.

>And Bloodborne is a complete mess
It really isn't. You can form a pretty tight history with some speculation. And it's all consistent with the rest of the world.
Dark 3 introduces tons of new shit that doesn't match any of the old shit and just expects us to accept it. What the fuck is the fucking Profaned Flame? Not even a single thing in the game goes into even the slightest detail on what that fucking thing is. Why is there a whole new aspect of reality we didn't know about before? The ringed city has existed forever, no? Why did we only just learn about it? Why did we only just learn that the whole world is basically a pile of fucking ash?

>b-b-butthurt!
I beat both bosses, why would I be mad? Struggling on Pontiff but not the late-game bosses just seems ridiculous when the later ones are clearly superior in terms of power and speed

OK, so we know Gwyn gave the pygmies a home.
But what about everything else you said?
>the humans were stronger against dragons than the gods with their lightning
Support this claim, you retard.

A single item description would not suffice.

A couple of retards are probably going to piss and moan about this, but just go watch the videos by Vatiividya.

Which fight is more overrated - this, or Maria?

Nice goalpost moving. Are you going to ignore the video evidence showing how Nameless King is slower than Sulyvahn?

>Vatiividya.
I'd sooner believe Yea Forums's retarded theories.

>It can be anything you want since that was Miyazaki's intention
This is only partly true. What's also true is that the last two DaS games have had their stories, world lore and game progression chopped up and re-arranged less than 1.5 years from launch. A lot of shit doesn't make sense because it was sloppily hacked back together, instead of it being because it was deliberately set up to be vague (but with a vision behind it).
Players filling in the gaps themselves is a crutch that has partially hidden the effects of Fromsoft's poor project management for years now. Sometimes I wish I never watched Lance's channel; revealing the alpha and cut content of these games really takes the lustre away from the community theorycrafting

>tfw the Dark Souls series and Bloodborne have been extremely unforgettable compared to MKII, and many single players game, with the exception of Witcher 3 and Skyrim modded
It feels good that they will never reach that massive relevance like the aforementioned games. Dark Souls is a fucking blessing. Such a successful series.

Attached: 1500667062588.jpg (860x634, 232K)

>A couple of retards are probably going to piss and moan about this

Attached: thanks bro.jpg (1024x768, 82K)

>goalpost moving
the original argument was Pontiff being stronger than the other bosses, when that isn't the case
>but muh vids
he chains attacks more, but the actual speed of attacks is slower. Go frame-by-frame if you want

Miyazaki should work like Kamiya. Never make sequels.

still no proof that the pygmies vastly outclassed the gods.
They were dangerous enough, sure.

Artorias' lore is all kinds of fucked due to the DLC since we have no idea if New Londo happens before or after Oolacile

>We don't even know why the player does what he does
The player was conscripted as a Hunter for the nightly hunt as part of a blood contract. You travelled to Yharnam to get your sickness cured by their miraculous blood healing. You delve deeper into the city, you learn more and more about what is truly happening, then you stumble across Rom. You learn that she is gating the secret and you kill her. The secret was the Mensis Ritual. You stop the ritual by killing a special child (Mergo). The Ritual incidentally beckoned the Red Moon, which exacerbates the rates of lycanthropy into the extremes, and into what is known as the Scourge of Beasts. Everything I've stated here is told and inferred via notes. I don't understand how so many people are this retarded.
>Oedon
Arianna, one of the NPCs in Cathedral Ward, births a celestial. From that celestial, you can get a cord.
The description reads:
> "Every Great One loses its child, and then yearns for a surrogate, and Oedon, the formless Great One, is no different. To think, it was corrupted blood that began this eldritch liaison."
We learn from Arianna that she has corrupted blood and that she is a distant relative to Cainhurst. Corrupted blood is the very medium Oedon soughts after, a medium necessary to procreate.

Attached: __adella_the_nun_arianna_and_hunter_bloodborne_drawn_by_arizuka_catacombe__9efb739b7cf8d9e5d6c82fa56 (1000x1410, 823K)

>Why did we only just learn that the whole world is basically a pile of fucking ash?
In the future.
Well it's the future.

>I'm going to say something dumb, and people will call me dumb for it it
>it happens
>see, I told you

Attached: 1519341859586.jpg (2496x1934, 1.89M)

>games have to spend a shit ton on announcements and publicity
>Dark Souls done it all without that much money but quality on their games
It's as if they pay their artists, musicians and 3D designers enough money instead of catering to streams with sponsors and publicity

>You can form a pretty tight history with some speculation.
You mean most of it is speculation. Have you read the Paleblood Hunt. It's just a guy speculating what the lore MIGHT be.

>Dark 3 introduces tons of new shit that doesn't match any of the old shit and just expects us to accept it.
The same happened with DaS. Who the fuck is Flann and how is he the God of Flame (you know, the literal thing that sustains the world)? Why did Gnyvere flew Anor Londo and married with him? Who is the exiled son and why was he expelled from the annals (whatever the fuck that means)? What the fuck is Blightown, wich apparently is just a bunch of wooden sticks tied together over a chams and under the sewers of a city? What the fuck is up with Velka? Who painted the Painted World? Why is the Abandoned Doll in the Asylum Is Manus the Furtive Pygmy or just some old wizard Oolacile made mad because they dug too deep into the Abyss? Who is Solaire and why does he use the same sorceries Gwyn uses? What the fuck is Humanity? I could go on all day.

It's not supposed to make sense. It's just a buch of cool stuff thrown together to have fun.

The dumbest thing about Dark 3 is that the ending removes all choice. Whether you rekindle the flame or extinguish it you get an identical outcome. Rekindle the flame it's gonna die soon anyway, extinguish it an it'll just come back later on somewhere else.
The ending means nothing.

>Have you read the Paleblood Hunt
Have you?
Most of it is grounded by the lore.
His speculation is maybe one third of the story, and even this speculation has at least some basis.

>Have you read the Paleblood Hunt
No, I avoid youtuber lore shit.

>Who the fuck is Flann and how is he the God of Flame
The gods aren't literal manifestations of those things. They're a species who are worshipped by humans, they just come to be associated with certain things, but they don't literally embody them. The Lords are physical manifestation of their aspects, such as Nito literally being death, but their children, the gods, are just powerful humans, essentially.

>liking the star wars prequels of the souls series
simpleton.

>Corrupted blood is the very medium Oedon soughts after
And here's evidence for this.
From the Formless Oedon Rune:
>Human or no, the oozing blood is a medium of the highest grade, and the essence of the formless Great One, Oedon. Both Oedon, and his inadvertent worshippers, surreptitiously seek the precious blood.

Attached: 868.png (540x696, 422K)

The gods are just humans made by Gwyn's soul.
Humanity's unique aspect is that they are born from the Dark Soul, their pygmy ancestors took in shards of the Dark Soul, which is unique in that it's weaker than the others but it never diminishes, its shards can grow and then break off into shards of their own.
Gwyn spread his soul of Light amongst his knights and gods, ascending their pygmy ancestors into more powerful forms. But the weakness there is that Gwyn's soul is finite, and so breaking his soul up meant weakening himself, and his children and gods couldn't become a numerous as humans.
Same with The Witches daughters, they all share shards of the soul of Life.
And even Nito seemed to have split his soul in a way, producing his 'children' the Milfanito.

I'm not that OP, I just said that gwyn gave them lordship in return for their humanity.

I think of Oedon as being one of the older gods, perhaps even the first god discovered in Pthumeru, and maybe even the god that cursed humans with the beast plague as punishment for marrying amongst themselves.

So you'd rather believe Vaati's theories than believe Vaati's theories?

>I just said that gwyn gave them lordship in return for their humanity.
But that's not really supported at all by what you posted. The lore says Gwyn gave them a city, really meant more for containment than anything else. It never says he took their humanity (what the fuck does he need humanity for? he has his own soul) and it never says he made them Lords.

We've been having a lot of souls lore threads lately. I'm liking it. Any anons who have questions on BB's lore?

Attached: 1454601304169.jpg (1500x1500, 209K)

Evidently, it's a flame that doesn't fade unlike the chaos and first.

It also apparently makes people go nuts and transform. And something about the abyss being seen inside of it.

>Any anons who have questions on BB's lore?
BB was extremely uneventful for me, it seemed like they wanted the lore to be convoluted for the sake of being convoluted

that's why the Lord of Hollows ending is the true ending

Maybe. On that note, it's also widely accepted that Oedon is the father of Mergo, and the Great One Queen Yharnam married. Recall that Pthumerians did marry Greats back then.

Attached: ring.jpg (480x360, 23K)

I think I've got a pretty good understanding of BB lore. At least, it all makes sense within my mind.
I think my favourite part of the BB lore is the idea that the Great Ones are too fucked from their evolution to reproduce. It's pretty unique, and I think it sets up the world in a very interesting way.
I'd just wonder where the Great Ones are really from. Is "the cosmos" just space? Are they really just aliens? Or is "the cosmos" just a human interpretation of something that has existed in the world all along and simply can't be properly understood by men?

>You travelled to Yharnam to get your sickness cured by their miraculous blood healing.
Speculation. At no is it stated the player character was or is sick. We just think it because some foreigners traveled to Yharnam to cure their illness.

>You stumble across Rom.
More speculation. Literally zero proof of this.

The Red Moon yadda yadda.
We only know it lifts the vail over the world. No fucking idea what that really means. Could be anything.

>The secret was the Mensis Ritual
We have no idea what the ritual is.

I undertand what Arianna does, but now who or what Odeos is. It doesn't make any sense he's the only Old One that doesn't have a form. And how the fuck does he impregnate her if he's formless?

What the fuck is Paleblood.
Why do the Old Ones want to have childs at all and surrogate childs.
Why do you ascend by "killing" and Old One in a pocked dimension. Even though we don't know if Old Ones really die or are killable. I mean how the fuck does a normal human kill an Eldritch god.
How are Nightmares created.
How come the Moonlight Sword has a galaxy inside it and talks with Ludwig.
Why does the Scourge of Best exist at all.
Why did some of Mergo's followers became giant spiders.
What the fuck is Mergo's Wet Nurse.
Again, I could go on all day.

who is good hunter? Does he know what is he doing with the cords?

Why not expand on that, then?
If the Profaned Flame is just what happens when Chaos fucks the Dark out of wedlock then show us what it is and what it does.

I dunno if Oedon is the father of Mergo, but with his association with Arianna's family line he could be.
What confuses me about Mergo is the timeline. So she/he/it was born once down in Pthumeru, was stillborn, and then is being born again up in Yharnam centuries later? How does that work? And how is Yharnam pregnant when you fight her? Is there time fuckery down there?

>cursed humans with the beast plague as punishment for marrying amongst themselves
wat. I always thought latent beasthood was a side effect of blood ministration becoming widespread, and use of the Old Blood in particular. Am I retarded?

>and the Great One Queen Yharnam
Give the Ring of Betrothal to the Queen of Cainhurst

There's a fucking statue of him giving the pygmy a crown for his soul... do you have low IQ or something? Why would gwyn burn his own soul if he could use the pygmies?

>Most of it is grounded by the lore. But the guy speculates a lot and sometimes, he's just trying to join the dots. Sometimes just pulls shit out of his ass. I mean the guys tells you in the first pages that he's just trying to tie it all together, and that it's just his interpretation.

Then why is Flann the God of Flame?
Reply is because fuck you. The question doesn't really have an answer because it's just made to look cool.

>Why would gwyn burn his own soul
SUNLIGHT FOR LIFE

>wat. I
I forget the exact lores that formed this idea for me, but the Betrothal Ring says marriage was a sacred thing meant for Pthumerian royalty to marry and breed with Great Ones.
I think the Bastard of Loran suggests something about children born to humans resulting in the Great Ones cursing Loran.
I honestly can't remember, but I'm sure there are a few chalice items that suggest this idea because it's pretty firm in my mind.

Pure

>I mean how the fuck does a normal human kill an Eldritch god.
By hitting him with big stick long enough. It's Japanese thing.

Attached: Heather_smile.png (1394x865, 705K)

>Then why is Flann the God of Flame?
Velka is the goddess of sin, but she isn't literally the embodiment of sin.
I figure they're jobs. In the same way old French aristocracy gave themselves bullshit "jobs" because they were bored of doing nothing all day, I suppose Gwyn may have assigned jobs to his gods, perhaps even part of a plan to control humans by organising them into religions.
Flann is probably just the boss of the flame religion, or whatever.

>just be kaathe's pawn bro

>I mean how the fuck does a normal human kill an Eldritch god.
>normal
You're not normal. The Hunter starts off killing lesser Great Ones, like Rom and Ebrietas. By the time you're fighting Moon Presence you're basically a god yourself.

>I mean how the fuck does a normal human kill an Eldritch god.
by bumping your boat into its head

Don't you know that eating umbilical cords transforms you into the creature type that it came from?

still mad those slippery serpent fuckers get away with it without facing any retribution

>I figure
>I suppose
>Perhaps
>Probably
See? You are literally specualting.

And how come Flann and Velka are not the embodiment of their respective theme but Nito is literally Death, as in he touches living things and they die.
What does that mean anyways? Is he God of the Death of Gods, of the Death of Humans, of the Death of the Flames, of the Death of Pygmys? How could he be God of Death when literally eternal dragons exist? How does it even work?

You did beat him right Yea Forums?

Attached: Sekiro_Isshin_the_Sword_Saint_cover.0.jpg (1200x800, 103K)

>And how come Flann and Velka are not the embodiment of their respective theme but Nito is literally Death, as in he touches living things and they die.
Gods =/= Lords

Kaathe's fucking dead dude

>And how come Flann and Velka are not the embodiment of their respective theme but Nito is literally Death,
Nito is not the same kind of life form.
Nito is a Lord. He has an original soul from the first flame, his soul is that of Death.
Velka is a God, she is a pygmy given a part of Gwyn's soul. She does not embody any aspect of the first flame.

Two different levels in the hierarchy.

There isn't much on the Profaned Capital and their specific flame.

Best understanding I have is it's just "cursed." It essentially killed everyone in the Capital, those that didn't were turned into those Hand monster things you find in it's local poison swamp garden. Also Irithyll utilizes it in there weapons, which extends to Aldrich's motivations.

>Ebrietas
>Lesser Great One.
How do you know there is a hyerarchy of Old Ones?
How do you know you are basically a god at the end of the game?
>How do you know the Hunter is not normal?
The reply is you don't. You are making shit up as you go.

>Speculation. At no is it stated the player character was or is sick. We just think it because some foreigners traveled to Yharnam to cure their illness.
Promo material was shoving this very premise everywhere. Even the starting classes state this as their background.
>More speculation. Literally zero proof of this.
You literally do.
>We have no idea what the ritual is.
Did you even pay attention Micolash?
>"Ahh, Kos, or some say Kosm… Do you hear our prayers? As you once did for the vacuous Rom, grant us eyes, grant us eyes. Plant eyes on our brains, to cleanse our beastly idiocy."
Did you read the cord that drops from the wetnurse?
>"Every Great One loses its child, and then yearns for a surrogate. This Cord granted Mensis audience with Mergo, but resulted in the stillbirth of their brains."
Do you understand that Great Ones are attracted to special children?
What the ritual entailed was that Mensis was using Mergo as bait, to beckon Kos and thereby ascend.

Cont.

Attached: r-K Selection Theory.jpg (3264x1743, 1.2M)

>Velka is a God, she is a pygmy given a part of Gwyn's soul.
Proof?

The Ringed City is fucking great.
Ashes of Ariandel is trash.

Attached: 1558385811682.jpg (536x536, 89K)

>What is Insight.

>How do you know there is a hyerarchy of Old Ones?
Because Ebrietas and Rom are Great Ones who evolved from humans.
And while there's not a 'hierarchy' of sorts, there's obviously power levels. Moon Presence has reality warping powers, while Mother Brain just makes you frenzy, and Rom is basically braindead and can just form a veil over Yharnam.

>you don't know the hunter is not normal
You literally inject your body with the blood of gods and their magical umbilical cords to fight the final boss.
You're far from a normal fucking person you retard.

You tell me. Since we don't really fucking know what is exactly is.

Gwyn distributed his soul amongst his knights, in a similar way to the Pygmy spreading his soul amongst what became humans.
All life started as pygmies, Gwyn was a pygmy, The Witch, Nito, all the lords were the same in the beginning before fire. If you don't want to call them pygmies that's fine, but they were all the same lifeless, deathless, meek pygmy creature.
All life forms come from them, all of Gwyn's people are created by parts of his soul.

>See? You are literally specualting.
You realize this is literally what Miyazaki intends with these games, right? That he makes the lore purposefully vague and full of holes and expects the player to fill in the blanks themselves?

The psychic vestiges of the wisdom of the Great Ones.

In this thread we list things that made Sekiro Shadow Die Twice the best FromSoftware game, I'll start

>Takes place in Feudal Japan and has a mythological spin on it which is LIGHT-YEARS ahead of le dark medieval fantasy or victorian era crap.

>A great straightforward story/plot that is not purposefully mysterious.

>Easily a 40-60 hour experience and beats out Dark Souls 3 and Bloodborne in length but doesn't overstay its welcome like Dark Souls 1/2.

>An interesting cast of characters with personality, motivations, information/exposition and aren't just purely loved because of their nostalgia like Solaire or Eileen.

>For once a simple tutorial that isn't noneexistant but isn't necessarily forced down the player's throat.

>The soundtrack is traditional Japanese music and not the same old boring le ebin orchestral trash we've been getting Demon Souls.

>Stealth mechanics are now an optimal way to bypass enemy encounters and to get death blows on larger/stronger enemies and even bosses.

>Grappling mechanic that essentially makes Sekiro extremely mobile while also playing into exploration and bossfights.

>Deflection and posture mechanic heavily rewarding the player with damage and take downs but also relies on timing, patience and most importantly skill.

>Prosthetic shinobi arm is the secondary weapon with several different type of tools that can be upgraded and fills that lack of weapon void.

>3 Ninjutsu techniques that are basically special abilities for aggressive, passive and defensive playstyles.

>Skills/Combat Arts that add an entirely new layer of sword fighting to combat.

>A progression system that doesn't encourage overleveling.

>HitBoxes are finally perfected unlike the previous games where literal shockwaves would kill you.

>Bosses are the best in Soulsborne and have unique designs, fighting styles and arenas.

>No awful tacked on multiplayer that completely ruins the balance, sekiro requires actual skill.

Attached: 1557987203121.jpg (1278x1087, 411K)

>Ebrietas evolved from a human
>Moon Presence has reality warping powers
>Mother Brain just makes you frenzy
Zero proof of this.

Where is it stated that injecting yourself with the blood of gods and eating umbilical cords makes you a literal god? Because you know, everyone that tried that method in Bloodborne before that failed miserably.

>Because Ebrietas and Rom are Great Ones who evolved from humans.
What?

well, you gain it from Madman Knowledge or if you see something freaky. So, it's basically madness level, what explains how your character knows how to use all that random shit like cords.

Cont.

>What the fuck is Paleblood.
The Moon Presence.
Read the Lecture Hall note.
>Why do the Old Ones want to have childs at all and surrogate childs?
Why is this hard to understand? Every living creature is inherently geared to procreate.
>Why do you ascend by "killing" and Old One in a pocked dimension. Even though we don't know if Old Ones really die or are killable. I mean how the fuck does a normal human kill an Eldritch god?
You ascend by gaining insight and eyes on the inside. Read the item description for the cord. Also, Great Ones don't truly die, their consciousness still persists in a Nightmare.
>How are Nightmares created?
They just exist. But, they are accessed through the consciousness. They are real physical planes of existence. You take objects from these planes and bring them down to Yharnam. They also exist above the Waking World, as inferred by the motto of the Choir "the Sky and the Cosmos are one". Not to mention, this is a premise explored by Lovecraft's works, like Polaris.
>How come the Moonlight Sword has a galaxy inside it and talks with Ludwig?
It's imbued by the arcane. Lots of weapons are. Wheel is another example. Ludwig was once a prospector until he found the Holy Moonlight Sword and established his legend in the church. This can be inferred from the fact that the Tomb Prospector Set is unlocked after attaining the Radiant Sword Hunter Badge, which is associated with Ludwig. The Moonlight itself must have been a Pthumerian relic, and we know just how close the Pthumerians were to the Great Ones. Of course they'll have knowledge of the arcane, and them developing a cosmic imbued sword wouldn't be out of the question.

Attached: raquel-cornejo-ludwig-el-maldito (1).jpg (1169x6049, 1.34M)

Literally what I'm trying to say.
There isn't supposed to be a lore of this games. It can literally be whatever you want, because there are so many holes you have to fill them up using your own thoughts.

you mean, there is proof what Rom was human?

Well, they're certainly key steps in the process, as you don't exactly win against the Moon Presence if you DON'T eat the cords. You just get a chair and hope someone eventually kills you.

Ariandel > Ringed City in terms of quality. Fuck off. AoA was just too short.

>Where is it stated that injecting yourself with the blood of gods and eating umbilical cords makes you a literal god?
So... you didn't get the full ending? You can only fight Moon Presence if you use the three umbilical cords. And by doing so and killing the Moon Presence you become a Great One. A different process, but similar result to Rom, and most likely Ebrietas, because she has white blood.

Ebrietas has white blood, unlike the real Great Ones like Amygdala who have red blood.

>final boss is literally Guts
how did they get away with it?

Based and Redpilled.

Attached: 1558317876096.png (631x710, 1003K)

>>Takes place in Feudal Japan

Attached: 1532271426304.png (900x600, 786K)

>Every living creature is inherently geared to procreate.
Are they living? Also, they can't procreate.

I'm tempted to buy sekiro just to see how hard it really is.

>For once a simple tutorial that isn't noneexistant but isn't necessarily forced down the player's throat.
This is a god damn lie. The game throws tutorials at you from start to finish.

>Ebrietas has white blood, unlike the real Great Ones like Amygdala who have red blood.

So, doll was human?

>Are they living? Also, they can't procreate.
Exactly, they can't procreate but they really fucking want to. So they use humans.
The only one we know of that had a child on its own is Kos, and it died in the process.

Attached: 1428650379335.jpg (604x266, 110K)

like 300 times

No one said he hit harder than all the other bosses, you fucking illiterate monkey.
>he chains attacks more but his actual attack speed is slower
I posted video footage proving you wrong. Cope more.

Cont.

>Why does the Scourge of Best exist at all?
I just explained why it happens. It's just a natural precedent in BB. Do you question why the flame fades in DaS?
>Why did some of Mergo's followers became giant spiders?
Mergo's followers? Mergo had none. It's more likely they were followers of Amygdala, considering Patches.
>What the fuck is Mergo's Wet Nurse?
Does it really matter? Mergo is a child, what else should there be to defend him from potential dangers?

>Are they living? Also, they can't procreate.
Don't act dumb. They can't but they are inherently geared to reproduce.

Attached: The School of Mensis.jpg (1700x2058, 524K)

I dunno if there's any concrete ideas about the white blood, but it seems to suggest an association with experiments. Rom I think has red blood, but Rom ascended with insight, where Ebrietas is likely the result of blood experimentation. The Celestial Emissary, which is technically a Great One (albeit a shitty one), was created by human blood experimentation and has white blood.

Nah, GRRM purposefully fucked up the ending to the TV series so he can double-dip by getting people to buy his books to read the 'real' ending.

>Hand it over. That thing. Your Dark Souls III: The Ringed City DLC, now bundled with the main game and the Ashes of Ariendel DLC, for the Dark Souls III: The Fire Fades Edition

not really harder once you get the hang of it, but the last boss and others are just amazing fights

Is "Paleblood" the moon, the Moon Presence, or the white blood?
Is Flora really the Moon Presence? It's nameless after all. Or is Flora just the name the Doll gives to the moon? Does Flora refer to the Messengers? I figured the Messengers are the power of the Moon Presence to guide the hunters, which Ludwig saw as a light.

The dreg heap is further in the future then Gael

>Ebrietas has white blood
No she doesn't, she bleeds serum when you hit her and she spits red blood at you. The only two things in the entire game with white blood are the doll and Willem

>Don't act dumb. They can't but they are inherently geared to reproduce.
Where does it ever say the great ones can't procreate? It says every great one loses its child and yearns for a surrogate, not that they can't reproduce

Nah. AoA was boring snow shit while RC had really cool pygmy/human cities and bosses.
Also AoA was way too fucking edgy and Bloodborne like with those bird people.

>More speculation. Literally zero proof of this.
It's even blatantly inferred by how you enter the boss fight, insightlet. You use your gut instinct and jump into the lake, with nothing but a peculiar glowing spot in the lake and Wilhelm pointing you to it.

Attached: 1555041429617.jpg (1920x1080, 329K)

>It says every great one loses its child and yearns for a surrogate
THERE'S YOUR ANSWER
also read pic related

>>Moon Presence has reality warping powers
It seems the highest power in Bloodborne is the power over 'dreams'. Amygdala has shown to be able to traverse dreams through its lesser incarnations, but Moon Presence has the power to create dreams. It created the Hunter's Dream.
It seems also Mergo and Orphan of Kos have this same power, Orphan creating the Hunter's Nightmare, and Mergo either creating or embodying the Nightmare of Mensis. You will not that these three bosses, alone, give you the NIGHTMARE SLAIN message upon their defeat.
NIGHTMARE SLAIN means you have killed the dream, essentially. You're slain the being that created this particular reality.

At least all the boring snow shit could be explored. The Dreg heap was too fucking short and had nothing in it but an empty swamp, then the Ringed City was just a god damned hallway that led to another fucking swamp. Demon Prince and Midir were underwhelming and Gael, while a fun fight, was too fucking easy just like the other two bosses. Ariandel also didn't just throw more random fucking lore points that went absolutely nowhere and has a better soundtrack.

"Every great one loses its child" means they can have children but inevitably lose them, not that they're incapable of having children

see , keep up
>I posted video footage proving you wrong
compare the frames

Also, the Moon Presence is the only Great One that can move people between dreams. Hunter's chosen the The Moon can traverse realities, but when the moon abandons them they no longer 'dream', and can't move between worlds any longer.
Mensis achieved this by sacrificing a whole town and channeling that power through one person. But the Moon Presence has this power naturally.
It seems Amygdala may also have the power to move people between dreams, as Patches can appear in the forbidden woods and the Nightmare Frontier.

in a way he did.
his blood will make the paint for the new world

>not that they're incapable of having children
I think it means they're always stillborn or miscarried.

>compare the frames
I did, Nameless King attacks more slowly.
>See x
This changes nothing because I already responded to is. Nameless King hits harder, but attacks slower and telegraphs his attacks a lot longer than Sulyvahn does. I never denied Nameless King physically hitting harder than Sulyvahn, you fucking idiot.

i liked gael, he shouldn't be the boss that caps off the series though.

>Even the starting classes state this as their background.
They don't. Go read the descriptions, it's as generic as it gets.

You don't even know if we stumble upon it or some institution or entity is guiding us to get to Rom

>"Ahh, Kos, or some say Kosm… Do you hear our prayers? As you once did for the vacuous Rom, grant us eyes, grant us eyes. Plant eyes on our brains, to cleanse our beastly idiocy.
So no idea what the Mensis Ritual is. Ok.

>Do you understand that Great Ones are attracted to special children?
>Every living creature is inherently geared to procreate.
Why, they are literally eternal gods with crazy powers. Why even want children if you don't really die. Why do or did they lose their original ones.

The cords only state that they give humans a link to the Old Ones. It's never stated that it might make you a literal Old One after "killing" one.

>Mensis was using Mergo as bait, to beckon Kos and thereby ascend.
Zero proof of all this.

>Paleblood is the Moon Presence
Proof?

>They just exist.
>They also exist above the Waking World
Any proof on this?

>Wheel is another example.
The wheel does not speak to the player nor has a galaxy inside it. Being imbued with the arcane (again another thing that is not clearly stated what exactly is) can apparently mean a number of thigs.

Stop telling me lore stuff that is evident for someone that has read item descriptions, like the fact that Ludwig foumd the Sword in the Ptumerian ruins. You are trying to fill up holes in the story that are not meant to be filled. It's supposed to be your own headcannon, not what actually happened in the game. And that is the whole point.

Mergo, the Orphan, and Oedon/Arianna's child show that isn't the case

>two randoms just fighting over nothing
Miyazaki really fucking hated Dark Souls and its fans in the end, DS3 is literally an entire screed against it hidden beneath subtext.

Well it means shit since the painter girl planned on making the painting for him and wants him to see it.

Or if you take humans and expand that. A baby horse is born able to walk, but a baby human has to be born essentially early, because the human head is too big to fit through the female pelvis when fully formed. So babies are born without any ability to do anything, because it's essential for our intelligence.

Now scale that up another billion years of evolution, and you'd have babies that basically have to be born as single celled zygotes, metaphorically. Great One children would be so weak that they'd essentially have a near 100% death rate.

Mergo died when she was first born.

>Is "Paleblood" the moon, the Moon Presence,
MP is the Red Moon (he descends upon you with a red moon behind him, throughout his fight the moon is red too) and Paleblood (lecture hall note).
>Is Flora really the Moon Presence?
Yes.
Or is Flora just the name the Doll gives to the moon?
Yes.
> I figured the Messengers are the power of the Moon Presence to guide the hunters, which Ludwig saw as a light.
Ludwig's guidance was a rune, a speech of a Great One inscribed into his mind. That's how runes in BB work.

Attached: Moon Presence.gif (540x228, 2.99M)

you're a little late, OP.

>Midir were underwhelming
Midir was a good boss, don't know what you're on about.

>Mergo died when she was first born.
You hear her crying all throughout the game after you kill Rom

Also, Mergo was born to a human mother, which gave her greater survival chances.
Arianna's child is alive at birth. That's why the Great Ones breed with humans, because it's the only way to have healthy children who will live to mature. Something about humans lets the child be born normally.

Alright, stupid lore speculation time, Gwyn had 6 kids, 3 naturally created and 3 artificially created. The naturals were nameless king, Gwynevere and Fillianore, not sure who the mom was but it don't matter. After the big fuck you war Gwyn had with the dragons he, like most dickheads in DS, got obsessed with dragons and wanted to become dragons or some shit, so he gets Seath and is like "Hey bro, I'll let you do whatever fucked up shit you want if you help me make some dragon babies" and so they do. The first child created from this union is Gwyndolin, carrying pale features, like Seath, and having a bundle of snakes for legs, snakes in DS lore being regarded as "imperfect dragons", so no dragon people there, moving on. Then they make Yorshka, who looks like a crossbreed, fanciful scales and that shit, but Yorshka is small, and weak, not nearly the mighty being Gwyn was trying to create, so he tries again and we get Priscilla, who's a much greater success. But then shit go's down, flame starts to fade and Gwyn makes hollows himself out to keep the first flame going.

what helps, in my mind, lend credence to this theory is the painting guardians, who we find out are actually called princess guardians, all over the ringed city protecting Fillianore. Now why would a bunch of the Princess' royal guard be dicking around outside some big dumb painting full of monsters and abominations unless they were really doing their job, protecting a princess. Also there's the vague connection of Gwyndolin being all connected to moon magic shit and you getting the Moonlight Greatsword from Seath, but that connection is loose at best.

This theory also helps explain why Nameless King bailed on poppa Gwyn, after the war he found out what Gwyn was doing, and that the war with dragons was just a bunch of bullshit so Gwyn could be in charge and dips, assumably telling Gwynevere before he bails, which is what made her leave too.

Midir is one of the most overrated fights in the entire fucking series. The only issue with him is that he's too big and the camera starts to freak out when he moves his pinky. If you just unlock for the entire fight he turns into an absolute joke of a boss in both style and substance. The only interesting part about him is the fact that he has a laser beam, which is pathetically easy to dodge.

really makes you think how different the game would be if they had the time or care to make things fit better.
of all of the games, 3 probably has the most finished cut content in the data, so it makes you wonder

>Ludwig's guidance was a rune
No, he saw the Moon Presence as a light which guided him.

I mean when Mergo was born hundreds of years ago in ancient Pthumeru, she was stillborn. Then she was 'reborn' in the Nightmare.

>That's why the Great Ones breed with humans, because it's the only way to have healthy children who will live to mature
Nothing implies Kos fucked a human, and the Orphan would have grown up normally if Gehrman and Maria hadn't killed it

Where’s this project rune meme coming from

Mergo and Arianna's child abides by the rule, dumbass.
>"Every Great One loses its child, and then yearns for a surrogate"
Queen Yharnam was a surrogate for Mergo (she literally stands before Mergo's Lunarium) and the Arianna was a surrogate for the celestial.

>Nothing implies Kos fucked a human
But Kos had to die to give birth. Which isn't great for the birth/death rates of a species.
If Kos had knocked up some fishwife everything would be fine.

>It's just natura precedent. Do you question why the flame fades in DaS?
The flame fades because that is what fire does. Why the fuck do they become wolves? It would make sense for humans to become monkeys, not wolves.

I meant the Nightmare Apostles. By the way, there is no explanation why there is a froom full of giant spiders and on of them is larger than the rest.

>Mergo's followers? Mergo had noneIt's more likely they were followers of Amygdala, considering Patches.
Proof?
Also why is Patches a spider?

>Does it really matter?
Of course it fucking does. Why I am even arguing with you when you answer with shit like this.
>Dude is just a powerful thing.
Yeah, whatever, right?

Isshin the sword saint is MILES ahead of Slave knight gael and Ludwig the accursed, change my mind.

Attached: lydia-peschke-isshin-ashina-fin.jpg (1150x900, 282K)

>Mergo's followers?
The school of Mensis sought to contact Kos by entering the Nightmare, but they instead found Mergo and starting following and protecting it.

I really need to finish Sekiro.

>I did
then post it

maybe you've seen it already, but oceiros was originally supposed to be carrying ocelotte with him the whole time.
halfway through though, oceiros would freak the fuck out and would start attacking wildly, smashing the baby around with each attack.
they probably thought that was too much and just made the baby invisible, but the model is in the game, and oceiros can be fought that way.

I literally can't, it's the objective truth and anoyone who says otherwise is just coping.

>But Kos had to die to give birth.
Nothing says she had to die to give birth, she just happened to

Oh boy.
>Why the fuck do they become wolves? It would make sense for humans to become monkeys, not wolves.
Beasthood is a violent reaction against alien influence. Beasts are anathema to kin, anathema to the influence of the alien old blood. It's a clear call back to themes of degradation found in cosmic horror. Kinhood mirrors this with themes of the frailty of human identity, considering the fact hat kin were once human beings - proven in horrible clarity by the corpse of the dead Celestial Emissary in Iosefka's Clinic that still has an unchanged human hand. The blood was never meant to be used, it's simply incompatible with mortal life, human, Pthumerian or otherwise.
>Proof?
You first. Show me proof that they are Mergo's followers.

Attached: transformed celestial.jpg (863x484, 53K)

>that moment when you beat genichiro and he comes out of the self-inflicted cut on his neck
He doesn't even want to fight you, he would rather be dead. he is literally only fighting you because he is forced to.

>who is good hunter?
I explained here >Does he know what is he doing with the cords?
He doesn't quite know. All he knows is that it leads to eyes on the inside, whatever that entails. But, the more he ventures, the more he knows just how valuable eyes are, and Micolash hammers this point to the Good Hunter.

Attached: 1549731160377.png (910x798, 762K)

>then post it
I already posted the videos. You can record the footage yourself and throw it through any video editor like webmforretards to see each frame by frame when the attacks start and end. Sulyvahn is Faster. I'm not going to specifically do your homework for you and make a video for you to compare them, especially since you seemed to try to tell me to do it while not doing it yourself yet being sure that you were right.

If you want specific timings, start at 1:00 to 1:12 for Sulyvahn and for Nameless King start at 4:35 to 4:50. Make video clips of both esenes and compare the frame data between each one to see how many frames there are between the start and end of each bosses attacks. Sulyvahn is objectively faster, Nameless King is physically stronger.

Gael yes, Ludwig no.

Attached: ludwig__the_holy_blade_by_gorkechaos_d9mar81-fullview.jpg (1024x1307, 104K)

Then why not degradate to something humans were in the past? Instead they transform into a completely different thing.

>You first. Show me proof that they are Mergo's followers.
I have none. Same way you have none that Mergo didn't have followers, or that Amygdala had followers.

Attached: SotFS_Nashandra.jpg (1280x622, 628K)

>No, he saw the Moon Presence as a light which guided him.
It's a Rune. All runes work that way: they are utterings of Greats seared into the mind of humans. But, considering it is the Moon we're talking about, then I wouldn't be surprised if rune came from the MP.

Attached: Nameless Moon Presence.jpg (1024x761, 137K)

It would break the basic lore of the game if Kos could give birth. Unless there were something suggesting she was unique, but there isn't.
Great Ones being unable to give birth is like the advent of the First Flame, it's the fundamental backbone of the game's lore.

gottem
inb4 DaS2 doesn't count!!!

When Ludwig closed his eyes, he saw darkness, or perhaps nothingness,
and that is where he discovered the tiny beings of light.
Ludwig was certain that these playful dancing sprites offered "guidance"

The Holy Moonlight Sword is synonymous with Ludwig, the Holy Blade, but few have ever set eyes on the great blade, and whatever guidance it has to offer, it seems to be of a very private, elusive sort."

The guidance was part of the Moon Presence's guidance to all hunters, but only Ludwig saw it that way. Runes are items any hunter can find and use, and they need a tool to use them.

She does give birth though, she just dies beforehand. The Orphan seemingly would have grown up perfectly normally if Gehrman and Maria hadn't killed it

>technically, not the last boss, but uses his body to bring back boss

Attached: maxresdefault.jpg (1280x720, 98K)

>She does give birth though, she just dies beforehand.
Yes, she died before she could give birth. Nothing killed her, she washed up on shore dead.
She died in childbirth, or perhaps willingly gave her life so her child could live. She couldn't have been alive alongside the child.

Beasthood is marked by the loss of eyes lot of people recognize us by smell, Chapel Dweller, Gascoigne's daughter, Annalise, Fake Iosefka, they smell us like an animal, a canine beast. The loss and gaining of many eyes/features is also visual language for inhumanity. Eyes, and faces, are very important to human beings for reading body language, changing something about the face, either take something away or add something, and we instinctively find it unsettling in some way.
>Same way you have none that Mergo didn't have followers
Exactly what is the point of this discussion here? They don't contribute anything significant to the lore. I stated maybe they were followers of the "Lord" Amygdala, as Patches the Spider is some sort of worshipper of Amy.

Attached: Patches_A_Thing_Most_Secret.jpg (1920x1080, 295K)

Right, but the Orphan would have lived on just fine if not for Gehrman/Byrgenwerth showing up and killing it. People in this thread have been saying the great ones are physiologically incapable of reproducing when that clearly isn't the case, the Orphan is proof of that

>the Orphan is proof of that
The Oprhan is just proof that if a great one sacrifices their own life then their child might live.
But that's not beneficial to the species at all. And Kos may even be unique in this respect.
Also
>the orphan would have grown up normal
What does that even mean? He's a Great One, he's probably normal as he is, living inside his mums rotten fish womb is par for the course for Great Ones.

Isshin is good but overrated.

I wonder if Patches will be in Dark Souls 4.

Attached: 1433309205112.png (509x1059, 350K)

No it isn't. That's fucking retarded fan fiction, especially since Gael leaves messages at the dreg heap, prior to his comsuming the dark soul, which lead to the Ringed City.

>The Oprhan is just proof that if a great one sacrifices their own life then their child might live.
>But that's not beneficial to the species at all. And Kos may even be unique in this respect.
So if a woman dies in childbirth but the child survives, then she didn't have a child? I don't get this logic, also it's never stated that Kos sacrificed herself or that she "had to die" for the Orphan to be born, we know next to nothing about her at all. All we know is that she died, not how or why she died
>What does that even mean? He's a Great One, he's probably normal as he is, living inside his mums rotten fish womb is par for the course for Great Ones.
The game states that every great one loses its child and people have interpreted that to mean all children of great ones are stillborn, when the Orphan is proof that that isn't the case. That's all I'm saying

>Exactly what is the point of this discussion here?
The point is most of the lore of the Soulsborne games is just not there, and people fill it with their ideas and thoughts. It's just information that makes fun games, but it doesn't make any sense unless you add something of your own invention.

>I'm not going to specifically do your homework for you
then don't claim otherwise, especially when your examples are all over the place. Not to mention that NK still has attacks that beat out Sulyvahns, like 4:53 for NK is faster than 1:16 for Pontiff, I think your main issue is that he incorporates movement into his attacks, which while making him move faster than Nameless, the actual hit doesn't happen until after he stops side-stepping around everywhere

Would a theoretical DS4 be based upon the Dark Age and the fall of gods?

Not that user but humans DID happen to be able to beat the gods and dragons fairly easily

Orphan is literally the only example we've seen of a Great One giving birth naturally. And she had to die to achieve this, and she was unique in that she was a benevolent Great One with many followers, so we don't know if this had anything to do with it.
Also, we don't actually see her giving birth, so how can we even say she didn't use one of the fishing hamlet villagers to achieve the childbirth? The hamlet is fully aware of the existence of the child, so there's a chance they had something to do with the childbirth.

In any case, great ones being unable to breed still stands as fact and is the basis for the whole story, because the only time it has happened was an extremely unusual case with unknown variables.

The coming of the coming of the Deep Sea.
Either that or a giant retcon of DaS 3 and they end the whole thing with the serpents.
I rather they do Bloodborne 2 or a different thing.

>People in this thread have been saying the great ones are physiologically incapable of reproducing when that clearly isn't the case, the Orphan is proof of that
It's a natural law in BB that Greats do not reproduce on their own and yearn for human surrogates or adopt a children of their own.
>Oedon seeks surrogates (Arianna, Queen Yharnam)
>MP seeks children (Gehrman, Good Hunter in the Honoring Wishes ending)
Either Orphan is an exception, or he really did die in his mother's womb and not at the hands of the Byrgenwerth slaughter party.

Attached: Bloodborne_.The.Old.Hunters.full.2541117.png (1200x1313, 855K)

>then don't claim otherwise,
The funny part about this is you specifically acted like you compared the frame data between the two bosses then specifically told me a fact that one is faster than the other despite later saying you didn't do this and needed someone else to do it for you only so that you can spaz out when you aren't spoonfed. Do your own homework you stupid bitch.

Attached: 1542498065235.png (1920x522, 404K)

She's adopted moron

>Orphan is literally the only example we've seen of a Great One giving birth naturally.
That may be but it's still proof that it can happen and "every great one loses its child" isn't a hard and fast rule
>she was unique in that she was a benevolent Great One with many followers
Nothing unique about that, I forget what item says it but "the great ones are sympathetic in spirit and often answer when called upon," Most of the awful shit that happens in the game is due to humanity's inability to understand or communicate with the great ones and not understanding or caring about the effect that contact with the great ones has on their minds and bodies, not necessarily the great ones themselves; They might be benevolent or they might be malevolent, it's literally impossible to know, but it seems like most of them at least don't mean humans ill
>the only time it has happened was an extremely unusual case with unknown variables.
Every one of the great ones we come into contact with in the game is an unusual and unique case with unknown variables. Oedon impregnates Arianna, the Moon Presence keeps Gehrman and potentially the player hostage as a surrogate child, etc, there aren't really any hard and fast rules to any of it. All the great ones are different and so are the ways they try to reproduce

Messages. I don't remember if there were dev messages there but I do remember being guided by messages.

Even one exception is enough reason to assume it's not natural law considering there are only four or five legitimate great ones in the game

I'm still disappointed with Gael and that dlc as a whole. It was so short and Gael didn't even feel like a grand "end of dlc" boss. When I beat him, I felt certain that I must've only been halfway through with the dlc, that there was more, so I combed the desert looking for the next area there was none

>You don't even know if we stumble upon it or some institution or entity is guiding us to get to Rom
See >So no idea what the Mensis Ritual is. Ok.
Did you not read?
What the ritual entailed was that Mensis was using Mergo as bait, to beckon Kos and thereby ascend.

>Why, they are literally eternal gods with crazy powers. Why even want children if you don't really die. Why do or did they lose their original ones.
Holy shit, it's like I'm talking to a child. The precedent this game sets is that Great Ones cannot reproduce on their own due to their position on the evolutionary scale (see pic related ). This is the backbone of the lore and basis of everything.

>Zero proof of all this.

>Micolash prays for Kos to hear him
>Ritual needed a child
>Great Ones are attracted to children
Does this now follow?

>>Paleblood is the Moon Presence
>Proof?
Pic related.

>>They just exist.
>>They also exist above the Waking World
>Any proof on this?
I just explained it. I'll provide even more context.
>Badge of a member of the Choir, elites of the Healing Church.The eye signifies the very cosmos. The Choir stumbled upon an epiphany, very suddenly and quite by accident. Here we stand, feet planted in the earth, but might the cosmos be very near us, only just above our heads?
Cosmos refers to the Nightmares and Dreams, the planes of existence that lie above Waking World.

Attached: Nameless Moon Presence_.jpg (1600x900, 209K)

Yeah, man.
Let me join this little bits of information with my own headcannon and call it fact.

>Cosmos refers to the Nightmares and Dreams, the planes of existence that lie above Waking World.
This is also supported by the fishing hamlet in the hunter's nightmare being literally physically above nightmare Yharnam, if you look down into the water when you walk through the clock you can see Yharnam beneath you and that you're physically in the sky

Post more blopodborne kino art

Attached: b3dd00c9e86aab03850463756be390a7.jpg (1000x2401, 442K)

Yeah, way to casually dismiss everything I've stated backed by ingame evidence.
Good you mentioned, Nightmares are stacked. Here's how it goes from highest to lowest.
>Nightmare of Mensis
>Nightmare Frontier (you can visibly see the building higher from where you are in the Frontier)
>Fishing Hamlet (you can see ship masts from the Frontier, near Amygdala's arena)
>The Hunter's Nightmare (you see the buildings of through the waters when you step into the Hamlet the 1st time and a snail woman falls from the sky from where you pick the Pizza Cutter)

Attached: Nightmare_Yharnam_Underwater.jpg (1920x1080, 121K)

Attached: DohFgV1XkAEe_Lw.jpg (1280x719, 163K)

Ludwig is my favorite From boss aesthetically, the most physically repulsive thing in the game but his sword is so beautiful

Attached: aae3f51b37b3c4c923df1ac4b70671e2.png (1567x2160, 2.68M)

Attached: DogxfLRWkAEOpf3.jpg (1280x775, 251K)

where's this then

Attached: Pwktp0F.jpg (1920x1080, 296K)

I have no idea.
Somewhere higher than all of them, I suppose? And as for the pillars, I like to think they play with the concept of Yggdrasil, like Ash Lake's Arch trees, support stands for all the Nightmares and Dreams that exist in the Cosmos.

Attached: DogffhOWsAIiUBh.jpg (1280x1139, 212K)

>He thinks two hobos fighting isn't always the most kino thing ever

I have way too many kinoborne fanart.

Attached: orphan-of-kos.jpg (1080x1350, 289K)

nice headcanon

>can't find the preorder voocaroo

excuse me but fuck you user

Attached: Dark-Souls-3-Ashes-of-Ariandel-How-to-kill-Sister-Friede.jpg (1670x912, 106K)

>sword saint
>brings a fucking spear and a gun to a sword fight while also controls the lightning
beated today, took me like 3 fucking hours to get used to the way he moves

Titular occurences are mock-worthy and it is trendy to attack and debase them. I am superior for mocking titular references in my preferred media.
>t. pseud faggot

Attached: come, sekiro!.gif (372x200, 1.32M)

seething

favorite boss in the game

Attached: DjhP-t2UYAAthOA_png_large.png (1280x1280, 639K)

The thing that pushes Isshin ahead of any other boss, is simply because the guy is just so damn charismatic. Even though he's a massive killing-machine he just seems like a fun guy to be around.

suits well.

Project Rune is a "leak" that came out of Yea Forums
My guess is it's bullshit, but the GRRM leak looks like it's real

Post your favorite boss in the entire soulsborne series.

Attached: yande.re 525212 bloodborne gun lady_maria_of_the_astral_clocktower sword wlop.jpg (4521x2259, 3.54M)

Abyss Watchers
they're kind of easy but fuck the fight is so cool

>OH HOW MY BLOOD BOILS

Attached: 1554953243737.jpg (1282x1080, 894K)

I can never choose between Gehrman, Orphan, or Ludwig

Attached: 1476890573837.jpg (1200x634, 105K)

its at the bottom. that's why you awaken above ground

It'd make sense, considering how in the marketing for 3 they called the Das3 armor the "Red Knight".
I get why they wouldn't use Soul of Cinder but it'd be a lot less conspicuous if they called it the "Ashen One".

There's a few tremendous bosses, and a whole slew of mediocre ones.
Among my few favorites
>Lady Maria
>Smough & Ornstein
>False King Allant
>Flamelurker
>Pontiff Sulyvahn
>Mirror Knight
>Kalameet
>Ivory King
>Fume Knight
>Lady Elfriede
>Gael
>Artorias the Abysswalker

Literal trash:
>Pinwheel
>Crystal Sage
>Fool's Idol
>Witches of Hemwick
>Saints of the Deep
>Fat faggot dragon in the windmill in ds2
>Gaping dragon
>Ancient dragon
>most of ds2, in fact

It worked, mad bitch?

>quality on their games
all of the souls games are janky as fuck

Attached: bof4-So this is it huh...I have finally become Breath Of Fire IV..png (480x104, 11K)

Not an argument, retard.