For what reasons do people think Persona 3 is a better game than Persona4 golden or Persona 5...

Based, though persona 5 is absolute shit, i had my expectations completly shattered by how mediocre the game gets the longer it goes, and its long

Story is king on a jrpg, characters are a close second, gameplay can suck, but as long as it isnt painful it can be salvaged by the story and characters

Literally played P3 last week and it's still good

It is a good game. Why are you so obsessed that 3 is better?

P5 left a bad taste in my mouth, because the first and impression and the first arc of the game is absolutely stellar but as the game goes on you see it start to fall into a formula as more characters get added. Its like if the stuff that happened with P4's cast (lol fsteak, lol gay, lol nurses, etc) happened within the game. Most of the palace villains are forgettable too, Futaba being the only real good one because it was different besides maybe Shido who had the entire game leading up to him. Honorable mention to Sae, but why was Makoto not a bigger part of that storyline?

>the first and impression and the first arc of the game
oof, I meant
>the first impression you get and the first arc of the game

Probably my favorite final boss of the 3. That and the physical split was nice. Once I got physical repel available to fuse into personas in 4 and 5 the game was basically over since physical attacks were by far the biggest threat.

P3FES and P4 literally play identically, if you think one is better than the other you're basically mentally retarded

Same, tough my expectations were just too high, i mean i liked p4 and loved p2 eternal punishment and p3p, but the game got so bad so quick, the characters are shallow and sympathetic and the story convoluted and preachy, i cant help to just roll my eyes everytime someone praises babys first animu jrpg

it's a mix of contrarianism and nostalgia for their emo phase in high school.

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Gameplay doesnt matter you unbelievable casual, jrpgs are all about story and characters

Image having such low IQ that you think this is a true statement

Let me guess, you love p4 and anime

I liked the games but they're literally the same gameplay, with the exception of choosing your partys actions. Beyond that, fusing is the same, story is the same. Why act like p4 > p3 or p3 > p4 when theyre the same goddamn thing

The only reason people prefer one over the other is because they like the girls more in one game

If this were true we wouldn't have a P3P vs FES fight in every P3 thread

i love p2. p4 is just okay.

I miss weapon fusion.

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>one more changes
>knock down changes
>weapon types
>phys split
>manual control / tactics are crap in P4

There are a lot of things that change the way combat happens in P4 compared to P3. The flow is pretty different and the best fights in P4 are heavily scripted since combat in general has been streamlined to the point of simplicity.

P4
>removed Pierce and slash
>reworked the knockdown system
>removed the abillity to use different weapons
>removed fusion spells
>removed half-crits
>removed weapon fusion
>Made party members use homonculus

And a bunch of other stuff
Good job outing yourself as a retard by the way

i didnt say p3p and fes played identically

They are part of the same subseries so the gameplay is very similar, they were also released pretty much at the same time , but the story and atmosphere are completly different, also the characters are shit in p4, they are very likeable and shallow, p3 has way more unlikeable characters but they are waay better devoped and involved

desu i just followed gamefaqs guides and fused OP personas and roflstomped every boss
*dabs*

So you're saying there are more differences between P3P and P4 than between P3 and P4?

>removed half-crits
Oh hell I completely forgot about this, that shit was so cool and was one of the reasons I went pure physical in P3

P3P is fucking awful FES is better

It was usually the first persona game people in the west played. So it gets a boost in nostalgia.

Nostalgia, the story, characters and music are subjective so all that is left is gameplay that is trash compared to 4 and 5, tartarus was a mistake

When the fuck are they merging FES and P3P into one game, I don't want to play both

4 and 5 have trash gameplay

I will accept that people prefer 4's combat because of manual control but there's now fucking way people can convince me that 4's boring ass corridor dungeons are any better than tartarus

Still better than P3
P4 ones were like 12 14 floors max, tartarus got more than 250

It's not.

Persona 5 has that no?

Just by picking fusion's skills already makes it 10 times better, that along all the additions
P5 one is kinda different

We don't talk about that shit game

Some standard qol doesn't make it better than anything

Yes it does, fusing is 50% of the game, also the other additions

I mean the gameplay in 5 is better than all the previous games.

>p4 has better gameplay

see

It's not better than anything

No it doesn't. 5 has shit fusion options. Everything you do breaks the terrible game in half.

>P4 ones were like 12 14 floors max
times like 8, and P3's floors can be cleared much faster so its pretty much a wash

What are half-crits?

>removed Pierce and slash
Both were trash and useless, i bet you want more than 10 elements too
>reworked the knockdown system
The new one is more fair
>removed the abillity to use different weapons
Fair but P3 ones all did the same damage technically only good stuff was using the arrow to ambush
>removed fusion spells
Fair but it added stuff in exchange
>removed half-crits
Half crits were dumb, crits are either crit or not not half
>removed weapon fusion
Fair
>Made party members use homonculus
What is the problem in that ?
P3 is easy to break too, some fusions spells are retarded strong and also farming forever since
They can technically be cleared at the same time depending on where the doors spawn

It's called Kino.

It's 90% nostalgia. Tartarus is a slog and the forced party AI makes the game way worse than it has to be. Also, plotfags are annoying.

Being a contrarian for contrarian's sake is unhealthy.

Compared to P4 and 5 it's not at all. It's both more complex and better balanced then them. Fusion spells require you to actively have the right Personas on during combat and you will obviously not know which. In addition to higher difficulty.

Like bad games like P5 doesn't mean you have good taste

>Compared to P4 and 5 it's not at all. It's both more complex and better balanced then them
Literally just use Koromaru, he dodges 80% of the time and breaks the combat
>Fusion spells require you to actively have the right Personas on during combat and you will obviously not know which.
Having 2 personas is nothing when you can carry 12 also Liz gives you tips about which personas do a fusion skill
>In addition to higher difficulty.
Being harder don't means better also P3 was just as easy as vanilla P4, and P3P was easier than Golden

How the hell could you tout physical categories as a good thing when there are already so many magic categories that you have to cover? And then you can’t control your party members so you can’t effectively cover the other physical categories with your party members. So dumb.

>removed Pierce and slash
>Both were trash and useless, i bet you want more than 10 elements too

>removed the abillity to use different weapons
>Fair but P3 ones all did the same damage technically only good stuff was using the arrow to ambush

>removed half-crits
>Half crits were dumb, crits are either crit or not not half

tl;dr you didn't give a shit about physical attacks. Those are all in there for a reason

Physical was almost trash in P3, Magic was superior

What reason?

The element system in Persona needs an overhaul because right now it's simply better to stick with physical and gun attacks and keep spells to the eventual immune ennemy. Phys uses HP so you can spam it an then restore yourself for cheap, bu phys can critical which has the exact same effect as hitting weaknesses. In P5 there are skills that are specialized in Crits such as Morgana's Miracle Punch or Haru's One Shot Kill (which of course can be learned by Joker) which makes using anything else an objctively inferior way to play the game
I propose that every single element has an aliment attached to it. For example Agi spells can burn, Zio spells can shock etc, which is already in the game but rarely occurs. For example Garu spells can dizzy, Psi spells can confuse, and Hama/Mudo spells can cause fear. This would make the game less repetitive, more challenging (because of course those aliment also apply to spells directed at your party and enemies tend to use magic all the time)

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Out of the way, patrician opinions coming through.
Story: 3>5>4
Characters: 4>3>5
Gameplay: 5>4>3
Hopefully 6 manages to combine them all for true kino

Slash pierce and strike filled cartain niches, Pierce was high accuracy low damage, slash was medium damage and accuracy, strike was high damage low accuracy.
They also made it so that you couldn't just fuse a phys null persona and cheese the game
>the new one is more fair
It makes it so that spamming multi target spells is encouraged since it gives you turns, while they didn't in P3.
>did the same damage technically
They added a layer of depth to combat, you had stuff like long swords that dealt a lot of damage but were low accuracy and slow to hit shadows with, you had bow and arrow which were great to ambush shadows but were terrible in combat with low damage and accuracy, you had fists which were both high damage and accuracy but were hard to ambush shadows with.
It helped you tailor your combat experience to your liking
>half crits are dumb
They made it so that taking a risk by using your weapon instead of a persona skill was more rewarding, there was literally no good reason to remove them
And making teammates use hommonculus when your death is the one that triggers a game over is bad game design, your teammates can get revived but you can't so making them use homonculus is a hindrance to the player.
Half-crits are crits that only deal 25% more damage instead of 50% and don'y knock enemies down

wait do we hate this game now?

p4's story is ass compared to 3's. its characters are also ass in comparison to 3's. 5 is on par with it though

As someone who goes almost pure physical everytime I go through P3, its fine. Magic breaks the game if you abuse knockdown and in the endgame when you stack amp with the other buffs but physical has always been my way to go.

To make physical builds viable/interesting

How hard did you cry when you looked up the lyrics to Memories of You?

>Literally just use Koromaru, he dodges 80% of the time and breaks the combat
No he doesn't and he's not even the best party member. And even then Koromaru comes at midgame unlike 5 where you break it the moment you start the game on hard.
>Having 2 personas is nothing when you can carry 12
And? The point is you won't know which are the best.
>also Liz gives you tips about which personas do a fusion skill
Yeah hints.
>Being harder don't means better
It does. Challenge is the core of video games.
>P3 was just as easy as vanilla P4
It's vastly harder. And P4 is harder than 5. How sad!
>and P3P was easier than Golden
The game where you can keep your starting Persona all the way up to the final boss? Yeah no.
The objective truth here is that p5 is worse than 3 and 4 combine.

Gun attacks need to be reworked too. You always want to use the least amount of ammo you can because the damage on them is trash and you just want the knockdown.

Because that means you have more weekness to cover and more options to use. And you can, it's called tactics

I didn't have enough tears to cry at that point, i spent it all on the ending alone.

>Slash pierce and strike filled cartain niches, Pierce was high accuracy low damage, slash was medium damage and accuracy, strike was high damage low accuracy.
They did the same damage
>you had stuff like long swords that dealt a lot of damage but were low accuracy and slow to hit shadows with, you had bow and arrow which were great to ambush shadows but were terrible in combat with low damage and accuracy, you had fists which were both high damage and accuracy but were hard to ambush shadows with.
Those stuff was just propaganda, it was just a change of like 5 numbers megamitensei.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_Persona_3_Items
>They made it so that taking a risk by using your weapon instead of a persona skill was more rewarding,
That is why crit exists

>It makes it so that spamming multi target spells is encouraged since it gives you turns, while they didn't in P3.
I thought they did, but you had to hit every enemy weak to it to get the one more. I thought the change in P4 was that you only had to hit one of the enemies to get the one more.

No, It's called good taste.

>first experience with P3 was P3P(I know)
>literally thought the MC just went to sleep in the end because lmao no character models, couldn't tell exactly what happened just with text cause I was a retarded 15 year old
>tfw finally played P3Fes much later
The tears didn't stop for like the whole day when I beat it.
Holy fuck P3 is such a good game I can't imagine someone who likes JRPGs actually disliking it

>No he doesn't and he's not even the best party member. And even then Koromaru comes at midgame unlike 5 where you break it the moment you start the game on hard.
Koro being the best don't matters when he easily abuse the system a
>And? The point is you won't know which are the best.
If you're not a brainlet you know which ones are bad
>Yeah hints.
Be smarter user
>>Being harder don't means better
>It does. Challenge is the core of video games.
Say that to tetris
>It's vastly harder. And P4 is harder than 5. How sad!
Only hard thing at all in P3 was the white table and Ryoji last phase, the rest was easy
>The game where you can keep your starting Persona all the way up to the final boss? Yeah no.
Source ?
>The objective truth here is that p5 is worse than 3 and 4 combine.
Who cares about p5 ? P4 combat is already superior to P3

in that brief moment before fading away, Yuki finally learned what it was like to have friends. The last thing he heard was them calling for his name, the last thing he saw was them rushing to him with smiles; all while being comforted by the person he had known the longest. He had a hard life, and he was able to finally rest for the first time since his parents died.
The Answer isn't canon, don't tell me otherwise.

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>The Answer isn't canon, don't tell me otherwise.
Sorry user, the world is not fair

>we

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Bro no I thought I was done crying over P3 it's been over a decade ;__;

The What?

What's your beef with it?

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>Koro being the best don't matters when he easily abuse the system a
He can't.
>If you're not a brainlet you know which ones are bad
Not at all. And if you weren't a brainlet you would know the battle system in 4 and 5 is bad while 3 is actually good
>Be smarter user
Am. Still doesn't change anything.
>Say that to tetris
A very challengeing game with high score feature that's harder than anything 4 and 5 has to offer?
Okay
>Only hard thing at all in P3 was the white table and Ryoji last phase, the rest was easy
And Rampage Drive, Crying Table, Golden Beetle, etc
>Source
Play the game you fucking retard
>Who cares about p5
You do since you mentioned it.
>P4 combat is already superior to P3
Casualized games aren't better than anything.

>Rampage Drive, Crying Table, Golden Beetle,
Git gud
>Casualized games aren't better than anything.
They are at selling and receiving critical acclaim, P3 is nothing compared to P4

I don't really like RPGs and I love P3.

... and yet its still the best of the series. Huh.

No need to git gud. They are objectively challenging on hard,
>They are at selling and receiving critical acclaim
Yet they are still shit. You can't name one thing 4 and 5 do better that isn't some worthless QoL like fusion. They are casualized as fuck.

It started the stupid Atlus trend of adding some random new female character and a bunch of fluff dungeons and pointless story content in revised edition of their games. Cue P3P, P4G, Radiant Historia Perfect Chronology, and now P5R.

>They are objectively challenging on hard,
git gud
>Yet they are still shit.
Cope

>They did the same damage
Not true
>Those stuff was just propaganda, it was just a change of like 5 numbers
Still different which gave you more options in battle
>That is why crit exists
Crits aren't half crits

Not an argument

>They did the same damage
Demonstrably false
megamitensei.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_Persona_3_Skills
>Fatal end: 230 damage, 92% accuracy, 5% crit
>gigantic fist, 315 damage, 85% accuracy, 15% crit
>cruel attack, 225 damage, 99% accuracy, 3% crit
You get all these around the same level
>it was just a change of like 5 numbers
If you played the game you'd know that attack animations on each weapon are different, not only that but you ca actually see the stats of weapons in the menu screen and bows consistently have the lowest accuracy and damage while Fists have the highest average.
>this is why crit exists
Again, no good reason to remove half-crits

>P3 Midnight, new re-release using the dancing models and P5 demons
>Combat has manual control
>but also has tactics, which buff your teammate's stats by like 20% giving you a reason to use them
>Knock down is the same as it is in P3
>Only enemies get mad and get a buff if you repeatedly knock them down without AoAs to prevent cheese
>Baton pass is in because its a legitimately good idea
>Tartarus is now several hand-made setpieces connected by randomized floors (stuff like giant halls, climbing the outside of the tower, etc)

>not only that but you ca actually see the stats of weapons in the menu screen and bows consistently have the lowest accuracy and damage while Fists have the highest average.
Just look at the link
>Again, no good reason to remove half-crits
Having 3 things to reward you for attacking with a physical is retarded as there is already the crit and not using any SP

>Baton pass is in because its a legitimately good idea
As long as they nerf it majorly. It's WAY too broken and makes fodder encounters a joke

When was fodder encounter never a joke ?

P3 on hard up until the start of midgame.

Not if you abuse fusion spells

Tactics system is so fucking ass. How can you enjoy it?
>want yukari to use mediarama
>she uses diarahan
>want aigis to use tarukaja on me
>she does it on mitsuru
In P3 your teammates are USELESS.

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What fusion spells? First you need to know what they are without looking up a guide, waste tons of SP, and most are buffs and not damage. You don't get Armageddon at the start

>P3 is harder than P4
Top memes.

In P4, as early as the second dungeon, enemy troop compositions were tricky to knock down with only two elements and there are enemies who reflect and void your attacks, and most importantly you couldn't crutch on scanning and turtling since Teddy is shit.

In P3 the biggest consistent threats are hama and mudo even into the fourth block of Tartarus, and enemies reflecting elements comes very late into the game.

You pray

>releasing P3 for the fourth time
How about they make something new or remake a game that actually needs it like SMT1 instead of milking P3 for eternity?

How the fuck are you gonna abuse fusion spells they cost like 22% of your SP

how about you make Persona 1 or 2 relevant instead

Because you can just go back to the entrance and get it back.

It's better than 4 because it has far superior characters, story, and music. I prefer it over 5 based on my personal tastes, but I'd probably say 3 and 5 are equally good.

Cadenza is low level enough and is cheap as fuck, a mediarama that buffs you on level 4 5 is great
Just one is almost enough to win a fight most of time, if you run out of sp just dodge shadows till the checkpoint floor and go back to the entrance

>enemy troop compositions were tricky to knock down with only two elements and there are enemies who reflect and void your attacks
That happens in 3. In fact you fight higher level enemies in 3 faster than 4 with many of them using medium spells at lower floors.
>and most importantly you couldn't crutch on scanning and turtling since Teddy is shit
While you can rely on scanning turtling isn't a good idea as you have no defense, just wait.

They played it before 4 and 5. Probably when they were 9 years old.

Cadenza just raises hit and heals you. It's good but going back and forth won't make any progress without wasting time.

But did Ken REALLY do anything wrong though?

You have all the time in the world till you get tired, and the slinks at night are only on certain days and leveling stats at night is kinda meh as there is only the arcade most of time

He let anger get the best of him and lead Shinji to his death

But then you have to re-start your progress, it's much better to just be conservative with your SP

But then you miss out on a lot of XP, and then if you try to fight the guardian you'll die and will have to go back to the previous teleporter to fight the shadows you skipped.

The best way to tackle tartarus is to advance little by little while being conservative with your SP, using too much of it will leave you dry in the last floors before the teleporter but actively skipping fights will make you lose out on XP that you need to actually fight the tartarus bosses

You can just go back farm a little find a teleporter then go to the barricade again but on a good level

which is much more time consuming than just advancing normally

Not at all, you need setups and lots of exp gain to beat the bosses. Besides Cadenza is just a buff, that won't make all the encounters easier. It's like saying buying a tons of Go-ho, spamming them when low SP, going back to the fox then heal and go back. All you are doing is wasting time and basically grinding at that point.

Shadow Sae would have been way more balanced if they kept the split physicals. As it ended up, you can equip a persona with Null Phys, toss on a regeneration accessory and press rush with no chance of dying until her desperation. That's boring shit. Also different weapons had different affinities, hit rates, and crit rates and several bosses throughout the game were significantly harder or easier to fight depending on your weapon choice.

Ultimately the simplification of the combat system gave the game designers far fewer tools to craft interesting and challenging encounters, and it shows in the end product.

more like
>have Yukari set to support
>Is the total hp of the party near half? She'll probably use a multi heal
>Are there multiple people with low hp? If she uses a multi heal it might leave 2 people not quite fully healed
>If I heal one of them, that changes her action to a stronger single heal, which will leave everyone mostly topped up. But then I have to trust that Junpei can finish off the weakened enemy or we eat another attack.
>I can try to go for a knockdown then heal, but if I miss then my teammates aren't topped up and we're might eat an attack if Junpei doesn't get the shadow
That turn is fucking fun because you have to factor in random chance and plan everything in advance. In P4 it just goes
>same situation, attack enemy to knock it down
>on hit, Yukiko can just use her strongest heal
>on miss, Yukiko can use an item to attack the enemy
>either way yosuke stops you from dying if you take a hit because s.link powers.

Takaya would've probably killed him or both of them another time. You can't blame Ken for something that was in the hands of fate.

You don't turtle using the useless wait command, you either cast a spell equiped with a persona that's resistant or nulls said element, or use rakukaja/debuffs until Mitsuru/Fuuka tell you what element do you have to spam to win.

Early P4 forces you to approach troops more offensively as Teddy cannot analyze targets, and since voiding and reflecting mobs appear sooner you'll screwed if you're unga bungaing around.

Another thing is player advantage; getting it in P3 is too easy compared to P4, you even have the pause glitch to make it even more braindead.

>if you run out of sp just dodge shadows till the checkpoint floor and go back to the entrance
Where your teammates leave you because they're tired and suddenly you're down a few members.

okay jin fuck off??? why are you here?

the structure of each character's development isn't squashed into separate months

5 mins cutscenes are not better

>it’s fun because i’m basically rolling a dice to see if i’m gonna win

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I did look at the link
>silver sable, available at level 26: 112 damage, 92 accuracy +3 magic
>two handed sword, available at level 26, 116 damage + random effect
>beast fangs, available at level 26 102 damage 97 accuracy + random effect
>bow and arrow, available at level 26, 111 damage, 88 accuracy + random effect

Their accuracies are very different, and remember that the bow and arrow can't semi-crit, but it also doesn't cause a stumble, meaning it has some advantages and disadvantages you have to balance out.

>having 3 things to reward you for attacking with a physical is retarded
It's there to compensate for stumbles
Missing with a weapon can cause you to stumble and lose your turn, which makes it even riskier but also gives mroe reward with the chance of damage without SP and even a knockdown if you're lucky.
A bow and arrow can't make you stumble but also can't semi-crit, which balances it out.
Not to mentions that a lot of weapon effects are random, so being able to choose any weapon you want because the special effect is beneficial to you is good.
You have to take a lot of things into consideration when you choose a weapon in P3

In P4 you don't have that freedom, it was removed for no good reason, so you're stuck with "this has the highest damage and accuracy so use it.

user, Morrowind is considered by many to be the best game of all time

It is but it's tied to two very weak personas, if you get hit with either orpheus or apsaras out you're dead

Not the combat part

"People" that think that aren't actually people.
That title belongs to Resident Evil 4 anyway

>ignoring all the months of hardships and change they have to endure

Eat dick

I’ve never heard anyone say that.

>That castle segment
"No!"

Since other people are talking about gameplay, I'll discuss characters.
In P3 the character development is tied to the main story and aren't slaved to the big cock MC. This does a couple of things.

Firstly it allows for the characters to develop and for that development to bleed into the main story. When you max out a SL in P4 and P5, the development is either very minor, or is completely ignored in the main story because the game doesn't assume you max out anyone. For example, in the beginning of each game, the sidekick, Junpei, Yosuke, Ryuji, are the butt of the group's jokes and act like immature goofballs. By the end of P3, Junpei has matured due to Chidori so much so that Yukari stops calling him Stupei. By the end of P4 and P5, both Yosuke and Ryuji are basically the same group goofball jokester who gets hit a lot even if their social links are maxed. Was a scene where Ryuji gets beat up by the group after narrowly escaping death really necessary?

Secondly, the development feels more significant, in my opinion, since they usually result from actual characters interacting (see Junpei maturing due to Chidori or Fuuka getting out of her shell due to Natsuki) compared to P4 and P5 where the characters "develop" due to the blank slate MC clicking A on them 10 times after school. Like, did anyone really care when any of the P4 or P5 charterers got their Ultimate Persona? In P3 they happened at the climax of a characters arc while in the sequels they just "happen".

In my opinion, Social Links aren't an excuse for genuine character development. Relegate them to Romance/Bromance routes where you just hang out with a friend, and put the character development/Ultimate Persona back into the main story.

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Thats a bunch of RPGs, the whole point is to mitigate the risk you take (or go balls in and pray)

This isn't Yea Forums your "No!" has no power here!
Accept Leon S. Kennedy as your Lord and Savior already. Take the onelinerpill

>In P3 the character development is tied to the main story
The main story is literally only character development, the main story only advances when Ikutsuki reveals himself as a bad dude then back to chilling again for 30 days

>other rpgs do it so it’s ok

Hell yah. Party links are fucking trash.

>What are Yukari, Mitsuru, Aigis and Fuuka ones

Integrating party's SL links progress into the main story would be the objectively best solution, and therefore Atlus will never do it.

>you either cast a spell equiped with a persona that's resistant or nulls said element,
You won't know what the element is and all you are doing is pointlessly wasting SP
>rakukaja/debuffs until Mitsuru/Fuuka tell you what element
Smart thing but you are still using SP (24 per battle)
>Early P4 forces you to approach troops more offensively as Teddy cannot analyze targets
Not really. It's pretty obvious what the element is, and P4 even gives you free total turn where you can attack when you go first. Hell you can just defend, watch what spell they use, then proceed to to attack using the opposite, it's not crazy hard to figure out.
>getting it in P3 is too easy compared to P4, you even have the pause glitch to make it even more braindead.
Both are braindead. All you do is slowly walk behind the enemy.

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No it picks up at the beach event

Yes, that's the gist of what I said

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>Both are braindead. All you do is slowly walk behind the enemy.
P4's shit camera angle makes it considerably harder for me

Damn, here I am trying to give P4 some credit even though I like P3 more but, you're making it very hard.

Fuuka's Link is a secondary development she goes through. While her main development is much more focused on her desires as a person and finally paying attention to herself her S.Link is about her accepting that she can't please everyone and she shouldn't change who she is for others.

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You can easily delegate character progression to S.Links. You'd have to change the script around based on flags that are set up on how far you progressed, but ATLUS is too much of a lazy fuck to figure out how to write it out.

And people nowadays love the dicksucking too much to put in actual character progression.

The beach only expands a little, then you're back to full moon shadows and nothing till Ikutsuki

The gameplay differences are not significant enough to make the difference, so it falls to what surrounds the gameplay.
Visual-wise, P4's hippie look is liable to turn off a lot of people here. But basically a quibble.
Music-wise, many people fell in love at the first BABYBABYBABYBABY.
More relevant matters:
Thematically, 3 sticks to and explores its theme of death better than 4 does its theme of truth.
Story-wise, P3 is perhaps more interesting, though P4 paces itself better (Full Moon Operations were basically filler).
Character-wise, 3 shits on 4 from a great height. The party members feel more genuine than 4's group which formally inducts each member into the gang of buddies. Koromaru is the last good mascot character Persona had, and was done right. The SLinks do a good job of portraying a community, and have some token efforts at aiding verisimilitude of the story- Hidetoshi getting drawn into the Dark Hour comes to mind.
Another point of comparison that's minor and overlooked: GREEK >>> JAP.
3 is overall more solid, or coherent. 4 makes improvements on the formula, but the fluff is just generally worse. All this said, I do like 4, it's just noticeably worse.

>P4's shit camera angle makes it considerably harder for me
Both have very shit camera angels though. Even if you have the trouble with the camera you just need to walk and no one will notice you. Still this system in 3 and 4 is better than 5 as at least it isn't press X to awesome

Not at all, you are learning about the dark hour and gaining parry members and going on events

>The gameplay differences are not significant enough to make the difference

Are you retarded?

Additionally, the characters in P3 felt way more autonomous of the MC than in P4 and P5. Hell between P4 and P5 you can probably count on one hand the number of times that characters from the group (not the MC) act or interact outside of the group and its activities. In P3, there are several scenes between characters of the group where the MC isn't even present.

>Another point of comparison that's minor and overlooked: GREEK >>> JAP.
based and westpill

You only learn at the beach, the it chills till Ikutski, there is no event till there and new party members are just 'there' till their arc

Contrarianism, the same reason people on here shill P1 and P2 so hard.

All of them still have development in the main story with the SLs being more secondary. You could probably toss Akihiko, Ken, and Shinji into that list since they get the same sort of secondary development in the female protagonist routes.

Attached: __female_protagonist_mochizuki_ryouji_and_pharos_persona_3_portable_and_etc_drawn_by_miyasumi_jam_se (620x800, 281K)

P1 and P2 are shilled by SMTfriends.

And they are right about 1, that game is pure old-school kino.

>SLs being more secondary.
Yukari, Mitsuru and Aigis ones are critical, Mitsuru literally gets fucked if you don't do it, Aigis is still less human and Yukari is still a bitch at her only parent alive

Isn't that when Ken / Shinji joins?

>Aigis
Her link is irrelevant thanks to The Answer.

You remind me of the scene in P4 where I think Yosuke asks the ChadMC if he wants to study with the rest of the group. If you refuse he says something like "oh, I guess we won't meet up then". If you can't be there, they won't meet up.

Only Aigis i guess, Shinji joins some time later

Persona 3 meant something

It makes sense, Mc is the glue of the group

As a P3fag, P4 meant something too.

Not true at all. You literally are gaining and learning about the dark hour more, That's all events

>You literally are gaining and learning about the dark hour more, That's all events
You aren't, tell me 1 event after beach and before Ikutsuki that you learn something ?

subjectivity

>clear block in one day
>go to school
>do a social link
>do literally fucking nothing every night because there’s no more social links and my stats are full
>sleep
>repeat for one month

That but the whole game

The lore of the dark hour, the lore of Tartarus, the lore of apathy syndrome, the lore of the monthly shadows attacking the city. You have party members and each full moon boss and shit like the Summer Festival

This is retarded everyone people mention it. The character development in 4 and 5 isn't in the S. Links, it's in the story surrounding the respective character's dungeon and then the S. Link is just used to reflect in that development and tell you more about the character. S. Links aren't treated as an excuse so they don't have to develop the characters, and even putting aside the fact that they're developed in the story, you can see that even in P3 seeing as the girls have S. Links and so do the guys in P3P, it doesn't change that they're developed in the story and the same goes for P4 and 5.

There are issues with the way characters develop in 4 and 5 with how formulaic it can be, but it's not an issue with their S. Links and them having S. Links doesn't mean they have to remain static for the rest of the game even if that's how they're usually handled. Even that is a problem with everyone but Junpei and, to a lesser degree, Aigis in P3 where the parts if a characters arc where they develop only covers a few scenes, Akihiko's development pretty much entirely happens at the funeral for example, even though it's prompted by Shinjiro's death that's where he reflects on it and grows, and he doesn't change much in his attitude or behaviour at all, he's just more resolved now.

What P3 does do better than 4 and 5 in terms of development is that relationships between characters and their development is handled well, but the development of individuals is handled as well, or even worse, than 4 and 5's development with the exception of Junpei who is handled better than anyone in any of these games, and also with P3's development feeling less formulaic and more natural. None of this has anything to do with S. Links though.

Never played through P3 as Non-canon girl. Worth it? How's her characterization like? From what I've seen she isn't emo so that might be fun to experience

Persona started at 3. Also looks great on CRT. The green and blue glow so well.

Tactics vs dictating party member moves is not dramatic enough to truly tip the scales in favour of 4. Besides, P3P gives you the direct control option anyway. I missed weapon types and fusion skills in 4, but honestly didn't use them enough to consider them a huge loss. People saying Tartarus is FAR worse than Midnight Channel are forgetting how monotonous Midnight Channel is. It's not AS bad as Tartarus, but it's still the same beast.

>The lore of the dark hour, the lore of Tartarus, the lore of apathy syndrome,
There is no such event after the beach, you only gain more lore on Ikutsuki's betrayal
> the lore of the monthly shadows attacking the city.
You literally just go and kill the shadow
> You have party members and each full moon boss and shit like the Summer Festival
Again nothing, party members do nothing till their arcs, full moon is just go and kill and there is literally only the summer the festival as a event

P5 has a decent amount of that as well as some characters discussing their time without you, though less time is dedicated to it than in P3. 4 is pretty bad for it though, I think the only scene in the game not from Yu's perspective is when he's in the interrogation room and Yosuke and Teddie are shown at Junes.

You won't even closing the SL's at night and your stats will never be full. Unlike P5 where you finish everything before the last month so you do nothing but sleep

If you read the goddamn thread, then you'd know about all the changes from 3/FES to 4/P3P/Golden you dumb ape. I'm not spoonfeeding your ass.

Her S. Links and OST, with the exception of Wiping All Out, are much better, in my opinion.

>Tactics vs dictating party member moves is not dramatic enough to truly tip the scales in favour of 4.

Its the primary complaint from people who play P3 and don't like it.

>You won't even closing the SL's at night and your stats will never be full.
You literally only have 3 stats and intelligence always levels automatically if you study before sleep, night slinks are also quick as fuck cause there is just 2 of them you can even fuck up and come back

Better story writing characters and atmosphere better music too

I read the thread, Mongoloid,my point is that the changes are, as I said, not enough to be what decides the better game.

>There is no such event after the beach, you only gain more lore on Ikutsuki's betrayal
Wrong
>You literally just go and kill the shadow
Which is a event and you do things. This isn't like 4 and 5 where they spout pointless repetitive and nothing actually happens
>Again nothing, party members do nothing till their arcs, full moon is just go and kill and there is literally only the summer the festival as a event
No you gain party members, have full moon operations, summer events, and school shit

>stats will never be full
nigger i am in summer and they are done and i have a persona with like 80~ on everything

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Because bimbo aigis is a qt

>You literally only have 3 stats
Which are harder to max then other games
>intelligence always levels automatically if you study before sleep
And?
, night slinks are also quick as fuck cause there is just 2 of them you can even fuck up and come back
You can savescam everything. Not an argument

>Wrong
Say the event then
>Which is a event and you do things.
Killing a big shadow is not story neither a event, it its just a boss fight
> summer events, and school shit
There are no summer events neither school shit

Did P3P offer the right medium between 3 and 4?

>Which are harder to max then other games
They aren't
>You can savescam everything. Not an argument
The game can savescam for you

She's a lot more upbeat and happy in her responses and attitude. It's honestly great and I'd recommend it to anyone who's already played P3. If you don't want to slog through Tartarus again, just download some cheats and BS your way through it.

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p3 has SOUL

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I honestly cannot think of a single scene in P5 that a) does not have the MC present b) does not focus on the MC, and c) is not directly related to the phantom theive's activities.

>Literally removes demons models for meh shadows
>No negotiation
It removed the soul

How many of you beat Margaret?

How many of you have beaten Margaret in P3P?

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p3 is boring as fuck, tartarus is the worst offender. the love hotel was probably the most fun part of the whole game because it’s a designed place with puzzles.

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Yes for Margaret but no for P3P Margaret as it requires playing P3P

>majority of p5 is a flashback
>surprised the first person story is revolving around its teller
Wow

>wanting to negotiate with the repressed darkness of humanity
SEES already knew it was a lost cause.

>does not involve the mc
It’s almost like everything is being told by the protagonist.

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A lot of them are like that, the scene where Makoto apologizes to Ann after Makoto's dungeon and the scenes with Makoto and Saw are some exceptions to it, though the latter often have n association to the PTs they're often not the focus. There's also the one leading up to Makoto's dungeon where Goro calls her worthless or something, the one where Goro is giving an interview on TV and he has an internal monologue during it and I feel like there's one with Yusuke, but I may be misremembering. There are some anyway, much less than P3, but noticeably more than P4.

Joker's a shit storyteller then

>Say the event then
Literally more lore on Ikutsuki's betrayal
>Killing a big shadow is not story neither a event, it its just a boss fight
It's objectively a event
>There are no summer events neither school shit
No you have stuff like the summer festival and movies

it doesn't matter that it makes sense, it's still boring and makes for a less believable cast

HE’S LITERALLY DRUGGED DURING THE INTERROGATION

Yes he is drugged and groggy from frequent beatings

>They aren't
Yes they are.
>The game can savescam for you
No it can't

I don't even really like P3, and I don't think having "soul" makes something good even if it can be endearing, but that they made a uniquely structured game and were willing to implement novel mechanics like Tactics to further the depth of characters makes it feel like a passion project in many ways. I also think a lot of those mechanics like Tactics are horribly executed and completely fail on every level, but I think the attempt at them instead of just playing to safe makes it fair to say it's a soulful game.

negotiations are overrated as fuck, holy shit

>I need to see people going out with each other or they don't go
Are you dumb ?
>Yes they are.
>Charm and courage 80 in P3
>Understanding 140+ P4 and Courage 140+
Fuck you

That's not my problem.

>You are now thinking of Joker completely botching a bedtime story

>clear dungeon in one day in P5
>go to school
>do a social link, finish it in 5 days due to the game being casualized
>do literally fucking nothing every night because all the social links at night are auto and all the activates are pointless
>sleep
>repeat until next pointless cutscene
>lategame finished everything, just sleep until the game is over
>never play it again as it as no replay value

it's super obvious you didn't play the game, you shitter

>Charm and courage 80 in P3
How many things raise it unlike 4? You are given very small amounts
>Understanding 140+ P4 and Courage 140+
Literally walking gives you stats boosts in 4

Reminder to use the P3P HD mod if you decide to play the game on PPSSPP.

forums.ppsspp.org/showthread.php?tid=23509

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>people are one person

This looks like garbage

All of those are short as fuck and pointless. All the characters in 5 never leave you alone. Kill yourself P5babby

>How many things raise it unlike 4? You are given very small amounts
Just farm it at night, night slot is practically always free

>All of those are short as fuck and pointless.
Just like P3 ones then

You are raising them to date Yukari

Nope. They give life to the characters and shown you aren't the center of the world

>boss fights aren’t events
????

why would you play the persona games that don't feature the man

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>shown you aren't the center of the world
But you are in P3 too, the group literally breaks apart in the answer without you, also the girls slinks

They are events

My man Igor is in all of them except q

>the group literally breaks apart in the answer without you
Makes sense, you made great friends with them
>also the girls slinks
Being asshole reverses them, makes sense

Wait you don't happen to be a spy do you?

They exist regardless of your opinion if them, the story wouldn't function without the Sae ones, Goro's entire background and his feelings on it would go unexplained without his and the others just make the character's individuality more apparent,and are no more or less pointless than the ones in P3 which accomplish the same thing.

I will let you know that I not going to continue this conversation though, because the fact that you unironically use the term "P5babby" tells you already have a firm opinion on this that you won't change and there's no point in either of us describing games we have both presumably played to each other when you won't listen to anyone who has anything positive to say about P5and I won't listen to anyone who has a tribalistic alignment to a specific game and malice for anyone who speaks positively about another game, so I'm not going to drag this out.

>you made great friends with them
Tell me 5 times the Mc went out with any of the boys

>the story wouldn't function without the Sae ones
Yeah it actually would since P5's garbage story is shit from the start

Seething

>not playing on merciless
>HURR ITS CASUALIZED!

At a bad story no

>do
would

w-wahhh where’s my edge...

>doll
>man

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merciless is braindead easy as fuck. You literally one shot everything

Merciless actually makes the game easier though. You can blow through entire health bars due to weakness spam, to the point where the game has no strategy. I hope P5R fixes the difficulty, but I doubt it.

Fuck off racist

tartarus
spings
summer
movies
the scenes at the playground

For me, it's the music.

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More like where's my good writing. How do you make a worse story then P4

>tartarus
?
>spings
Not alone
>summer
Again not alone with them
>movies
>the scenes at the playground
I give you these 2
They already made P3 though

Not NG+.

>junpeis horrible “””””romance””””” with chidori
>the extremely obvious ikutski twist
>never explains how killing ryoji will get rid of their memories
>yukari is an unlikable bitch the entire time
>fuuka and koromaru are jokes and wastes of space

You are literally traveling with them through tartarus
>Not alone
You don't out with the girls, you hang out with the guys

Yeah 3 has better writing then 4 and 5 while 5 has worse writing than 3 and 4. Point?

Fuuka is not a joke nor a waste of space!

Attached: Fuuka's Smile.webm (524x576, 2.81M)

>junpeis horrible “””””romance””””” with chidori
People talk shit about Mc romance with the girls but Junpei one was funny as fuck

>he never did man's night out/harem anime at Tartarus

You get a special dialogue of you talk to your teammates if you have all guys or all girls.

>junpeis horrible “””””romance””””” with chidori
bait

The MCs romance is just filler for waifufags.

>You are literally traveling with them through tartarus
Tartarus is not hanging out, it its stressful as fuck
>You don't out with the girls,
You do in every single slink rank, also events
>Yeah 3 has better writing then 4
Haha no

Just because a story decided to use a particular narrative device does not excuse its shortcomings. The simple truth is that the side characters in P4 and P5 lack the autonomous feel that the characters in P3 had. The method of story telling that P5 used does not excuse that.

>anime scooby doo
>better than 3

(lol

>Evangelion shitty fanfic
>Better than 4
Lul

If I'm going to be completely fair in the ranking of the newer generation Persona games, I'd say
>Story
3 > 5 > 4
>Gameplay
5 > 4 > 3
>Dungeons
5 > 4 > 3
>Characters
3 > 5 > 4

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the dungeons in 5 are trash

Fuck you, P3 story was filler 80% of the time, also having Koromaru

I recall eating with Akihiko.
The obligatory weapons shop visit with the magician, Junpei.
The original operation Babe Hunt.
Walking Koro-chan with Ken.
I think there was a scene where we learn Shinjiro is dying. Though maybe that was between Ken, Akihiko and Shinjiro.
Don't forget choosing to listen to Ikutski's jokes.

I think the real question is recalling if we even spent one day with Mitsuru outside of Tartarus business.

>3 has the best characters
what the fuck?

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Even a shitty Evangelion is still miles above anything 4 or 5 brought to the table.

I agree, Reservoir Dogs 2 was better than anime scooby doo and evangellion fan fic.

>muh randomly generated hallways

>I recall eating with Akihiko.
Not alone
>The obligatory weapons shop visit with the magician, Junpei.
I think you were not alone in that one
>The original operation Babe Hunt.
Not alone
>Walking Koro-chan with Ken.
I give you this one

>splits gameplay and level design but puts 3 at the lowest

Now this is some decent bait. I'm using this to trigger FEtards

That's a reasonable opinion, though I don't agree entirely, I see where you're coming from.

Nah, P3 is that bad

The real redpill is accepting that the dungeons in P5 were actually bad, and piss easy to boot in their puzzle usage. Not only that but your party constantly jabbers about any little puzzle to the point where they might as well hold your hand. Even still though, it's the first time the series has actually had proper dungeons for once.

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>I think there was a scene where we learn Shinjiro is dying. Though maybe that was between Ken, Akihiko and Shinjiro.
That was just Akihiko and Shinjiro on Port Island
>I think the real question is recalling if we even spent one day with Mitsuru
Social Link

>artarus is not hanging out, it its stressful as fuck
You gain friends through hardships so yes
>You do in every single slink rank, also events
Yeah. Slinks. okay
>Haha no
haha yes

Even our best is still bad, how the fuck did Atlus stayed alive all this time ?

Still miles better than Tartarus and the TV world.

Define filler please? To be fair, I will admit that the story in P3 took longer to build up, but towards the Climax ~ End, it had some story story. The beginning is a slog though until around Fuuka's recruitment.

The real redpill is that Persona is for people who do not play video games. Ergo, all persona threads warrant a 3 day ban for off topic.

5 doesn't have good gameplay and dungeons

What in God's name is wrong with Koromaru?

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Their games make up for lackluster dungeons elsewhere. Etrian Odyssey is their only series people play for the dungeons.

cope, p4fag. it's the truth and you know it

Everything that is not Tartarus, Dark Hour related
He is literally nothing, remove him and the story just needs a single touch

Not alone doesn't mean you aren't hanging out with them. Just stop P5babby this is embarrassing

>That Characters ranking
Actually quite fair. I really dislike how your party members for the most part, instantly cling onto Yu's dick. In P4, you're literally just a chad who everyone is attracted to with relative easy. In P3 and P5, your party takes some time to grow closer to you. You're first meeting with them isn't exactly "buddy, buddy".

Fucking faggot, I bet you think Teddie and Morgana are actual characters too

Nah, you can't spin in any way how Akihiko was more sad for Mc death than Shinji who was his bro for longer, also Junpei becoming his friend 20 mins after offending him

>Even a shitty Evangelion
Nah there are many shitty Evangelions and everyone agrees they are truly terrible.

No you aren't allowed to say anything bad about 5. It's perfect

So? He's miles above Teddie for the simple fact that he isn't an annoying prick.

>social link
Yukari and Fuuka have their episodes that level up Fool; the one at the beach and the bully Fuuka arc. Mitsuru gets a cutscene where her dad talks and then she's irrelevant afterwards. She's the reverse Beauty Thief.

There's a difference between combat and dungeon design, but okay. I don't hate how the Tactics System operates since it can be quite strategic, but overall it's still a slog on new playthroughs of the game.

Teddie and Morgana were at least plot relevant
Teddie had a reason to be there, Koromaru is just there cause needs a mascot and even in that Aigis still stole his spot

No they are the same level of shit P5babby

Many if not most of the side scenes were actually very relevant to the story. They just weren't related to the SEES activity at the time. Eg. Yukari's snooping around behind Mitsuru's back with Fuuka wasn't related directly to the SEES activities but ends up becoming relevant when she questions the motive of SEES. Akihiko and Shinjiro's meetings are not directly related to SEES but end up becoming relevant later when Ken joins. Junpei's interactions with Chidori are not SEES related but end up becoming SEES related too once he gets kidnapped. Ultimately this ties back to the autonomous feeling that the characters in P3 exhibit. They show the lives of the characters outside their role in the group without feeling pointless or filler like.

Yeah actually. 3 is better. Cope

>junpei is a jealous asshole to you for almost the whole game. he tries to apologize then he goes back on his bullshit again.
>yukari is a complete bitch the whole game except for the beach scene
>mitsuru is just ok, she gets no characterization not from her SL
>akihiko’s entire character trait is “get stronger”. at least FES added him wanting a girlfriend.
>fuuka is a joke
>koro is a joke
>shinji is the cool gentle giant, too bad he dies
>ken is a little shit but he at least mellows out to be a boring kid
>aigis is ok but she’s only human-like in the last month of the game

Most people play Persona games for SL's and the story to be fair. The gameplay and dungeons are an after thought. I hope P6 gives you proper puzzles that challenge you in dungeons, but I won't get my hopes up.

>Everything that is not Tartarus, Dark Hour related
So everything is filler in 4 and 5. Olay retard

All of that was filler user, remove them and Mc still's defeats Nyx and nothing changes

>more sad
More like the same level of sadness. They hanged out and fought together

Doesn't Izanami say the power of Persona made people be attracted to Yu? It kind of gives their relationships a superficial feeling when there's some supernatural force behind it rather than a genuine bond, but it's an in-universe explanation at least.

Fuuka is not a joke!

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Still less filler than P3 somehow

And remove the entire plot of 5 and it's literally nothing. That's how bad it is

>5 doesn't have good gameplay and dungeons
If you dislike the dungeons and gameplay of P5, that's completely fine, but let's not get carried away. P5 improved the gameplay from 4 tenfold in many areas, as well as Persona having actual dungeons for once in 5. While both the gameplay and dungeons are heavily flawed, they still beat the prior titles easily.

MC was only able to defeat Nyx because the entire group bonded after a months, and for some a whole year, before that point, and those bonds expanded and grew with those events.

>And remove the entire plot of 5 and it's literally nothing.
Well makes sense, no plot = no plot

Actually it isn't. You literally doing nothing in 5. And when you do something it's a "gameplay" section that plays itself.

I play them I've the gameplay, but the story and characters are part of that. Persona has a unique flow to it's gameplay I really like and it keeps me engaged for the most part, so long as all the pieces of that flow are working, which they aren't always.

still ended up being a better character than both of them lmfao

>Everything that is not Tartarus, Dark Hour related
By your logic, everything that doesn't focus on the TV World or Murder Investigation is filler in P4. Learn what filler is before you speak, user.

No, he won the universe cause of his bonds with the others not his team (only the girls of his team had bonds with him), the boys were just disposable
But yeah it its, if they don't advance the plot they are filler, most of P4 events are filler too but it still got more plot moments than P3

delusional

5 having dungeons is a good argument. But Mementos is the worst iteration of Tartarus ever conceived since the Bath House and Secret Base in 4.

This really made me laugh.

>P5 improved the gameplay from 4 tenfold in many areas,
No it didn't. It's casualized as fuck compared to 4. Adding potinless fluff doesn't make it better
>well as Persona having actual dungeons for once in 5
And they weren't good.

I bet you like tactics.

It makes sense since the game is literally filler. Nothing happens until the Igor reveal

I like it more because it's easy to rush through and has dialogue among the crew, though that dialogue could have been better implemented. It's still not a great dungeon, but I never found it grating unlike Tartarus.

Fuuka's character arc could have used some more focus, but it's about finding confidence in herself and growing stronger, being more useful to the team. Sadly the game doesn't highlight this as much.

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Stakes in Persona 3: Guys the world is actually going to end with Apathy Syndrome, we need to kill the 12 shadows and oh shit now the world is going to end because we just summoned the harbinger of Doom
Stakes in Persona 4: Guys we need to get to the bottom of the TV world because these murders are starting to become more rampant and we have to prevent mass chaos
Stakes in Persona 5: Guys we need to give soul back to society

Mementos was unironically better than Tartarus just by being shorter, also sometimes skipping levels with Futaba

>if they don't advance the plot they are filler
Yeah I hate how 90% of 5 is filler

I guess that explanation works as a reason why people are attracted to him, but the way it was executed doesn't feel too well. I'm not particularly keen of the Izanami plotline much at all, honestly.

>he won the universe cause of his bonds with the others not his team
No he won becasue of his bonds with everyone he met.

Each dungeon in P5 had a point, Tartarus was literally filler till they discover that Ryoji is going to use the final floor

Funny becasue it's true

So you're saying the Phantom Thieves were a group of oppressed gamers that rose up?

I think these games could benefit more by focusing on the gameplay aspect better. They focus primarily on the story for the most part.

Yea you are

No, it was just the slinks
youtube.com/watch?v=xGtDoPQFCSY

>5 having dungeons is a good argument.
Too bad they were shit

Should I pleasure to Elizabeth tonight yes or no

Tactics is better than 4 and 5

The puzzles in Kaneshiro’s palace were alright. It was basic algebra but still. Plus it has the best theme.
youtu.be/pbwljew1UbE

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>ESL struggling this hard to cope
HOLY SHIT AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA MAKOTO FUCKING GAAAAAAAAAAANG ASSEMBLE

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>Each dungeon in P5 had a point,
No they didn't. Take them all out and nothing changes. All that matters is Shido

P4 and 5 got tactics too, they are only missing 4 options that were shitty

>not having all my turns be literal dice rolls means it’s casualized and shit!

His team mates literally call out to you. Are you retarded?

They weren't gamers though, and the only reason they "rose up" was because the antagonists were intentionally stirring up the public into a frenzy.

>Be P5
>Have proper dungeons for once
>Due to the nature of the story, they disappear once you complete them
>Afterwards you're stuck slogging through yet another randomly generated dungeon, Mementos
Why are Atlus so incapable of making proper dungeons? Jesus Christ. They might as well abandon them at this point.

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Nah, Shido only got exposed after the other dungeons, you could say Mementos was filler till after Shido but they said that something was down there

They were also dumbed down and like the shitty games they are casualized the battle system

this is really weird bait

Yeah, I don't think many are, few people seem to like P4 for its plot. Though, honestly, I like how P4 handles it's plot the most despite thinking the plot itself is the worst if P3-5. It always feels very secondary, which a lot of people dislike, but that makes it so a lot of scenes just focus on hijinks with the characters which I feel like are handled a lot better than the plot. In that respect, I feel like the game is just playing to it's strengths, which I prefer to how P3 had a strong focus on the plot, but with me not enjoying the plot until he very end of the game, despite it having a better plot than P4, I feel like I had a worse time with 3's because my attention was drawn to it more.

I imagine a lot of people will disagree with that, which is fair considering I'm essentially praising the game for being poorly written, but I can't help but feel I enjoyed P4 more for that still.

>Have proper dungeons for once
What's with this meme? Do P5babbies how no idea what good level design is they call these proper dungeons?

You can basically run behind shadows for free advantage in 3 or simply cheese them with a bow.

In 4 you're forced to walk slowly and there's no menu glitch, which makes the midnight channel actually more tedious than tartarus funny enough.

>They were also dumbed down
Removing 4 shit options is fixing it, also both are better than P3

You got btfo hours ago. Cope

this never happens in mainline which is one of the reasons i prefer it so much more

>slogging through mementos
>each block is like 20 floors tops and they’re filled with requests

No, everything is pointless is the game. Only Shido, Mementos, and the final boss matters and even then it's not important

Nah each one had a important purpose

Unironically, if the PT's were to have directly attacked Shido, the only other relevant antagonist in the game is Yaldabaoth.
>Everyone I dislike is a P5babby
Take your medicine, please. You don't have to project your dislikes on every post you see relatively giving P5 any form of leverage. Like it or not, P5 had ACTUAL dungeons. They weren't randomly generated hallways full of dead ends and had actual puzzles behind them. I can fully admit that these puzzles were shit, and the dungeons in general were mouthbreather easy, but they were still actual fucking dungeons.

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While P5 did add a lot of new stuff to the gameplay. It didn't add enough new challenges to use the stuff on. You can create the most intricate combat system in the world, but if you have no interesting challenges to challenge the player with using that system, then it all falls flat. If P5 had provided more interesting and varied challenges in the gameplay department, then I would have agreed with you.

It's truth. Cope P5babby

No you are force to walk slowly in both situations.

I actually really like the bonding presented in P4 compared to the rest of the games. Out of the 3 titles, your group easily spends a lot more time together and there's plenty of interaction.

No they didn't. Take them out and nothing changes

I agree somewhat, but a game that intertwines a JRPG and a VN is bound to have a strong focus on its writing. The only thing I really want to see be changed is the balance of the games, if SP management were a lot tougher to handle and the bosses were a lot harder, seeing as you're guaranteed to go into them with full SP, that would be ideal to me. There's some other changes like IV:A's QoL in fusion, no handholding for simple puzzles and so on that would be nice, but the balance is my only big grievance with the gameplay at at this point.

Here's the thing. If the plot revolved around something minor, like everyone struggling through minor conflicts while trying to get their grades high to pass the year, then it'd be fine if that was secondary. But P4 focuses on a fucking serial murder case in a small town. That's not the sort of shit you just casually brush aside. And the one time it gets personal for the IT, the arc just ties up nicely with absolutely zero consequence.

I've never seen a game handle its plot with so little disregard.

Mainline dungeons are pretty damn great for the most part. I hope SMT V can continue this trend.

the main dungeons in p5 suck. They're why I won't play P5R and rather prefer replaying P3 and P4 over 5.

>P5 had ACTUAL dungeons
And they were, just as bad as 3 and 4. Having different visuals doesn't make them good.

Nah

Yeah. If the PT's were to have directly attacked Shido, the only other relevant antagonist in the game is Yaldabaoth.

>would rather do fucking tartarus again

They die if they directly attack Shido, Akechi is there and stronger than just 4 of them

>>each block is like 20 floors tops and they’re filled with requests
What were they.. thinking? At least Mementos bosses were great Macca farms for all the trouble they put you through navigating the place.

No they wouldn't. Akechi is a jobber while Joker is OP

>shorter
Only if you have post-game knowledge or use the internet to know which floors some bosses are in. Come on user you can say the same about Tartarus. And for its day Tartarus has surprisingly short load times and quick progression mechanics. The game expects you to GTFO out of a floor by flushing you out with the reaper who appears quite often in 3, as opposed to 4 and 5 which takes a long while because the floors are so massive in the newer games' dungeons. Also its got teleports.

The best parts of Tartarus comes late game where you try to reach the final floor but you have like 100 floors to go and you find yourself clearing all that distance in just a few hours. Neat huh, gives the feel that you beat insurmountable odds not unlike how the game's characters start believing by then that they can reach the top, and in gameplay terms the Tartarus music gets upbeat in the highest floors.

Not level 20 Joker

I guess I can agree with this. So many of the Personas you can fuse, absolutely bust through the game. This guy right here and Physical Attacks in general demolish so much of the game. It's not even funny how easy it is to tear through battles on Merciless since you can virtually one shot most demons with weakness abuse.

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Level 20 Joker breaks the whole game with all his OP shit he gets

Only on NG+

youtube.com/watch?v=57JAxSTqnDw

You're right, which is why I said I can understand people disagreeing, but at the same time, I just feel that I enjoyed the game more for that, if I'm being honest with myself. It's not how any story should be handled in my opinion and if I were being objective, I would definitely say it handles it's plot the worst of 3-5, but if I'm just talking about how I felt about it, I think the truth is I enjoyed it most in that regard.

I can actually agree with everything you just said. Very enlightened comment compared to most of the shitflinging you see in here. Takemi's SL made it so easy to bust through dungeons, and bosses in general. The bosses could actually be quite difficult though, in some areas.

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No it's dumbing it down and casualized. And both are worse than 3 since 5 is one of the worse games ever made

No on base.

What strong broken stuff you can have by level 20 ?

>They're why I won't play P5R
Aren't the dungeons confirmed to be edited in P5R? My major gripe with dungeons in P5 in general boils down to
>Puzzles are piss easy and revolve around basic things like "hit this Switch", "remember this", "grab this item"
>The Stealth mechanic is absolutely broken to the point where clinging on any object will allow enemies to pass you, completely unnoticed
All they really have to do is make enemies more aggressive in their searching and fix the stealth, and I'd probably be less anal about how bad the dungeons were.

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P3 has an actual story that is somewhat serious unlike P4 and 5 where nobody dies and everyone is saved my friendship bullshit.

>The bosses could actually be quite difficult though, in some areas.
No they were brain dead and easy as fuck. P5 had no difficulty. The game is one of poorly desinged and broken games ever made.

>P3 has an actual story that is somewhat serious
>Everyone chills for 30 days and only go to Tartarus if they want
Yukari can fucking skip it to study

Nope, in 3 you can run in and stab them with your sword even after their spotting animation plays, as long as your player model was behind the shadow you get advantage.

Literally all they had to do is knock Akechi around a couple of times and preach to him. That's all it took for him to reevaluate his situation. So again, the only antagonists that matter in P5 are really Shido, and again Yaldabaoth. Everyone else serves as filler to acquire new party members.

>Literally all they had to do is knock Akechi around a couple of times and preach to him.
Akechi would just Loki their asses

I played the game on Hard Mode my first time around and I didn't grind much at all so things were challenging. That's probably why I found them hard, anywho.

the friendship shit is only overabundant in 4.

Shiki-Ouji. Swift strike. Only a few examples

Good job not understanding him.

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>Only if you have post-game knowledge or use the internet to know which floors some bosses are in.
I don't feel like that's true, I rushed through Mementos and completed Mishima's Confidant and I went in totally blind, it's pretty easy to do even without prior knowledge.

>gives the feel that you beat insurmountable odds not
I actually hadn't considered that in the past and it's a good point in Tartarus' favour. Personally, I associated that feeling of blasting through enemies with a feeling of wanting the game to be over with seeing as I was tired of it, but I can see it taking the connotation you mention if I were more engaged, which I appreciate even if it wasn't my experience. The music didn't really work out for me though, gradually changing the song throughout the game is nice in concept, but I was so sick if that song even with the changes long before the end of the game, so while I thought it was a nice idea I didn't think it worked for a game of that length.

nu-Yea Forums is actually real, what the fuck?

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This is perhaps the most retarded venn diagram I have ever seen. The points of overlap between the circles make no sense. Please remake this as a web.

>that time someone in P5 tries to commit suicide
>oh but wait it can't be any of the main party members showing how serious the situation is, it's gotta be a pointless side character no one gives a shit about. Can't have precious waifus hurt
P5babbies will defend this.

I remember the time we bullied P3fags and chilled on P4 treads

Yeah they have their own lives. Unlike 5 where they hover around your cock

>good storytelling is only measurable in deaths
I bet you suck George rr cock

They turn around fast so no. You still need to walk slow behind them

You didn't like how the music became better and less shadowy as you climbed up?

You see! This is why the music in Mementos is the same what 5 notes for its entirety.
dun dun dun... dun dun... dun dun dun... dun dun...

this entire thread if four different fatlus arguing that their husbando is more diligent and hard-working

Saving the world is more important than fucking studying

>P4 and 5 where nobody dies
what is Miss Yamano, and Saki Konishi in 4 and Haru's dad, Principal Kobayakawa, the SIU director, and Akechi in 5?

You don't need to grind. The game literally plays itself and you can beat all dungeons in one day with time to spare.

And Joker would oneshot him since he's a jobber and he's a super special snowflake

>Akechi is a member of the PT's in PQ2
>He's getting a redemption arc in P5R
AKECHI SEASOOOOOOOOOOOOON

They know you have wall blocks. It's not necessary right now

Yeah people actually defending P5.

forgot Mr Morooka in 4 aswell

>Tartarus was bad
Terrible opinion, every single block is peak aesthetics.

But P5 is and always was the most liked persona by Yea Forums ever since it's release

I like the concept, but the song is still fundamentally the same and you spend so much time in Tartarus that I got a headache just listening to it by the end, even with it being altered. The music in Mementos was just forgettable to me, it probably would have bothered me if Mementos was like Tartarus, but I spent substantially less time in Mementos than I did in Tartarus so the music could never get to the point that Tartarus' did where I couldn't stand it anymore. I do maintain that the changing music in Tartarus was a nice idea though, just not one that worked out for me.

>Implying the aesthetic design makes up for how poorly it plays
I liked it too, but the dungeon was objectively piss poor.

Also better than p5 dungeons since at least it's over quicker.

>every single block is peak aesthetics.
On the first floor of each you already see it, the other's 240 are just meh

By P5babbies which are filled with the worst of ironic weebs.

More like the most liked in general.

I always see people bashing these games to oblivion and invalidating opinions by calling someone a "babby" of a respective game, but what are some actual things you would improve about the game? If you were in charge of remaking Persona 3 right now, what are 10 actual things you would do to renovate the experience for the better without overly altering the game?

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You do realize the Judgement Arcana is LITERALLY THE ENTIRE TEAM, JUST LIKE THE FUCKING FOOL ARCANA. Play the damn game you lazy piece of shit.

Ur 2 slow

That is true

Nope

P5babbies are the majority since its the only one they played

Watch the cutscene again there is no judgment one there

Haru's dad was the only character death in P5. the other two fucks are barely even ascended mooks that just show up to die.

Yes

It’s not a venn diagram.

It's not by real fans

Nope

Will we ever get another Persona Opening that's as based as Unbreakable Tie, ever again?
>youtube.com/watch?v=P2YViRcaf5A

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they are still deaths though,
also forgot about the railway accident happening at the start of the game

Too bad they were pointless garbage, just like everything else in the game

How did we go from this to the dumpster fire garbage that was 5?

>58 IP's
>This much autism over which game is shittier than the other
You guys have serious issues.

>You guys have serious issues.
we do

Blame the retards who obsessively bump

normalfags and a change of writers

Why do you think we are here ?

The principal's death was meaningful but it was wasted. He was the only guy who could have gotten Makoto to beg for her college recommendation.

Why has there been so much animosity between the P3 and P5 groups respectively as of late? I've heard some guy named Ryan has been anally defending P5 while simultaneously trashing P3, but damn.

All of them were wasted and worthless. Maybe if wasn't a piece of shit with a hack writer it could have been good

Cause the community is a massive dumpster fire that can't just enjoy the games.

> I've heard some guy named Ryan has been anally defending P5 while simultaneously trashing P3, but damn.
It's the reverse i think, or maybe Ryan is not even real

P5fags mad people are bullying them since they are retarded enough to buy the same shitty game over again so they attack P1-4

Why do you niggers think people dying more frequently will lead to a better story? That's not how things work.

It's not dying more but the tone and atmosphere is complete shit and not MegaTen

I like Persona, but I honestly hate the fandom. This is why I usually just stick to the mainline series.

But Persona 5 is literally just a homage to the Persona 2 duology.

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>homage
You mean a poorly written stillborn child of it that takes from 4 and 2 with gameplay as bad as it.

It's not about dying frequently; it's about having it matter. Shinji's and Makoto's have a very clear impact on the group and they change for the better as they overcome it.
What did Nanako's death mean? Absolutely jack shit. No one grew from the experience. Hell, no one should've been so strongly affected as they were as they barely even knew her, and yet they act like their immediate family just died. Then she's suddenly brought back to life because a clown-colored bear called out her name, and everything is settled all nicely. No reinforced resolutions, no growth. It just wraps up like it was an individual arc with no lasting connotations.

I think this Ryan character is real, though he may not be named Ryan, because there's a guy posting in these threads who constantly calls others P5babbies, claims P5 doesn't have certain things but then when it's mentioned that it does he just says it doesn't count because P5 is shit and just shows a lot of malice for P5 and it's fans in general. It seems to be one poster and I assume this is the supposed Ryan. That said, the guy complaining about this guy is just as huge an autist, so much so that I wouldn't be surprised if they're the same person shitposting on both sides, but I think I may be looking into it a bit much. The threads are a mess regardless, and even if one or two guys are behind a lot of it, many people are to blame.

Some anons were making threads a while back after picking up some SMT classics like DDS and Nocturne and they dropped them because they say its too depressing and bleak to play.

Atlus needs to get them into the mood slowly before mind breaking them into edge lords with games like P3 that do that well, as opposed to P4. Also they should have tried Raidou if they think DDS is too bleak.

Nanako survived though, also they learned to not toss innocent dudes in the TV

Yeah i agree, it's exactly that

That doesn't sound true. I have a hard time believing people dropped those games because of how bleak they are, there are other reasons I could believe, but I don't think large groups would drop the games for that.

>raidou
shouldnt have started this game around the same time i started playing god hand, made me REALLY realize how fucking awful the combat is.
Ive been told its better in 2 but I just dont know if I have it in me to make it that far.

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They are fucking retard because how is Nocturne depressing or bleak? The world ends but you have no attachment to it.

Believe me it was odd seeing PS2 games in nu-Yea Forums's catalog.

holy shit awesome! does this work on vita too?

It's honestly not that much better. It's better, but not a great improvement. I love Raidou, but anyone will tell you the combat is far and away its weakest point, and you don't need God Hand for comparison to see that.

So does Megami Tensei I and II still happen in the Persona timeline?

I find it incredibly ironic that Persona 3, the only game in the series to not feature shadows of the main characters, handled the character development the best out of all the other titles.

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I think the Raidous and maybe Desu happen

It's not odd to see that at all, plenty of PS2 games get discussion on Yea Forums, you're in a thread right now that discusses P3, a PS2 game, I just don't believe people dropped it for that.

The only Persona character better than Junpei is Maki

Awakenings + Dungeon is better than just some cutscenes

Junpei is handled exceptionally well, but otherwise I disagree.

You have any idea how long 1 is? Im in love with the setting and characters and really fucking want to meet anime rasputin but I dont know how much more time I can dedicate to it.

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Junpei is shit, he goes through all that shit then close to the end blames Mc for Ryoji, then 20 mins later becomes his bro again, and let's not forget that he gets the most screentime

No they aren't, they were pure shit.

Just off the top of my head,
Scrap The Answer.
Don't restrict having Door-kun/chan dying on the love interest's lap to New Game+.
Scrap useless social links for the male protagonist like Moon and modify the FeMC Akihiko, Ken, Shinji, Koromaru, and Junpei routes to replace them.
Bring over the general gameplay improvements from P3P and P4.
Female Protagonist Route.
Modify the different levels of Tartarus to make them more different. Not major changes, just enough to make them more distinct. Tough considering the amount of levels, but I think its possible.
Optional minigames around the city.
Cycle the music in the dungeons more so that you don't get sick of BABYBABYBABYBABYBABYBABYBABYBABY
Let me pet Koromaru.
PC Port
Be able to call people out for dates/hanging out.

Junpei like all the P3 characters is better than anyone from 3 and 4. Cope

Characters like yukari evolve from one flavor of shit to another, but its still character progression in its own way.

I’m just wondering because if If... is where the split occurs as an alternate version of SMT 1 then anything that happens before SMT should still be canon in Persona.

4 and 5*

Not a argument

Yes it is. Saying it's shit is not a argument

I like the atmosphere more

If your Vita is hacked maybe?

Wait i guess that is true

None of the characters in 4 or 5 develop

I think it's 30 hours or so, but I don't remember my hours. I will stay this though, if you haven't seen Rasputin yet you're not very far at all. If you really want to stick with it, I'd recommend trying to get a hold of Estoma and not letting go of it, that way you can at least reduce the encounter rate. You'll have to look up yourself the earliest opportunity where you can fuse one though, because I don't know it myself.

>, he goes through all that shit then close to the end blames Mc for Ryoji, then 20 mins later becomes his bro again,
This one is
Did you play the games at all ?

>Don't restrict having Door-kun/chan dying on the love interest's lap to New Game+.
how does that even work if you have multiple lovers, is it just random?

I agree it has character progression,I just don't think it's particularly well handled, for the most part. It's never egregiously handled or anything like that either though.

You pick youtube.com/watch?v=Jf4F614THnk

None of that is true. Being a little mad at something and making up later doesnt change shit. And sadly did play 5 and has one of the worst casts in fiction. All one note and nobody develops. Kill yourself P5babby, you are a blight on the series.

>Being a little mad
>A little
Your parents literally died in the day and he just goes 'all your fault bro'

What the fuck are you even talking about. Show the scene

>you are a blight on the series.
you being an annoying negative piece of shit is more of a blight than anything

Nice try P5babby. There's a reason we want you gone from the series

The last Junpei's fight against Mc before he becomes your bro for life at the rooftop

>we

>we

Attached: shit that never happened.jpg (488x351, 23K)

And show a video of it

All of these games are my all time favorites and I fucking despise people like you.

Play the game faggot

Yes we. Nu-Persona/MegaTen fans like you arent worthy of notice

Did, so why dont you show it

>we

>we

Nice thread personababs.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=0VLNOXkc7nk

Yes we.

Threads when to shit when P5 came out. Killed the fanbase and the series.