Swords are good against enemies without armor

>Cutting weapons deal high damage
>Blunt weapons deal medium damage but some percentage of their hit goes through armor
What do piercing weapons do?

mechanical balance, dummy.

its silver, though. its literally spelled out for you

all damage pierces armor, armor takes flat damage off of hit

Have a % to go through all armor, but lower damage than Blunt.

Lowest damage but higher attack speeds and increased accuracy.

Diablo 2 had these

Dunno either OP.
The Mace should be even more destructive against unarmored people while it's already destructive against armored, blunt force. The majority of armored knights in history died from broken bones and blunt force trauma, followed by being pierced by the picks on warhammers or polearm spearheads, followed by blunt force from axes.
Swords were barely used in medieval warfare when armor came into the picture, if at all.

At best i can argue that mace should be easier to dodge, but damage should be uninfluenced and even elevated.

Video games and D&D still suck cock when it comes to the armor and damage systems.
We need a modern rework of the standards.

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They don't have lower base damage IRL.

why would you ever use a sword if the mace is just better?

>lower attack
Let's see you survive this through your abdomen.

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You'd survive longer than a mace bashing your skull in or a sword completely disemboweling you.

In a game with little detail, you wouldn't. Obviously a blade can precisely stab a specific area leading to a critical hit or heavy bleeding.

Maybe because it's more easily to beat an armored dude with something heavy and Kinda unwieldy as a mace.

It's harder to beat someone to death than stab them to death

>silver is more fragile than steel
As a fag who researched this shit, the silver and also copper and bronze memes were debunked in real life. Shit is different when you create real life objects from it depending on how you hammer it and what the alloys are or impurities.

Bronze swords actually manage to be so fucking sharp they can cut steel, not even shitting.
youtube.com/watch?v=Uz_CBcxzOFk
It's down to the difference in structures.
Sturdiness over the LONGER time is a topic in itself, but if you have a whole silver or bronze or copper sword, you can cut away flesh like butter.

Now try that again but with two swords clashing into each other.

neat

>combat weapons have a secondary non-combat utility function
Why don't more games do this?

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Again, swords clashing is a rarity outside of street duels between faggots and it would still be a 50-50. The main enemy of swords are armor and shields, which is why nobody was retarded enough to use them and instead everyone went polearm crazy.
However in a topic on monsters and humans, sword should be as efficient on humans as monsters even if silver.

ow my sphincter

Chance to ignore armor completely.

which end goeds in

This is how it should be
>swords do less damage against armor but swings faster
>maces do more damage in both situation but swings slower
>having high dex allows sword users to learn advanced technique like flourishes and parries
>maces have a smaller move pool
That’s how it should be balanced

>gameplay needs to be realistic instead of balanced

Maces could be lighter than swords though. The sturdiest material needed on them were the spikes if they had them or the head, the rest was light as fuck. The head could also be used out of lighter alloy since there's mass to it keeping it from breaking for long enough periods that you don't need to care.

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They tend to make the maces slower to balance it out.

Maces are heavier than swords, and bludgeoning is tactically disadvantageous in a lot of situations where a simple stab would be much more effective

No, the mass being at the head makes for a slower swing.

Everything does high damage
>Cutting weapons cause Bleeding
>Crushing weapons partially ignore armor but are around 15-20% slower to swing
>Piercing weapons have a 3x critical strike multiplier instead of a 2x multiplier.

Find me a mace that is lighter than a similar sword.

Why use shitty caveman weapons like swords and spears when you can just magic a bunch of fireballs at your enemies?

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>Maces are heavier than swords
Varying.
Also the weight of the mace works different from a sword. It's precisely because the mass is concentrated on the head that the momentum into a half-swing does its own work while your hands rest.
The sword requires constant exertion, while mace requires an application of impulse force.
You should try swinging them and then try a sword in real life, your arms last longer with a mace, not even kidding.

Maces can actually do less damage to people with shock absorbing clothing which is why strike is better resisted by certain light armor sets in Dark Souls, but not by much.

Historically, maces were pricey due to the metal content needed to make them, despite being the best weapon against armored opponents.

based mage user

Then that would mean the mace is heavier. What you’re suggesting is counter intuitive. A lighter weapon require more muscle mass to do a stronger swing. Maces don’t require as much exertion in the follow through because it is heavier.

>game has magic as something you are naturally born with
>maces are depicted as skinny bookworms still
If magic is something innate, we should see sorcerers who are naturally powerful and chose to spend time working their bodies as well.

Kiros in FF8 uses double katar

Bashing someone hurts less than cutting or stabbing their flesh.

Swords were expensive as fuck too. Mostly people fought with axes which they had anyway for chopping wood, and cudgels.

No. Mace doesn't need to be heaver to have a momentum, a momentum is gained by center of gravity being shifted away from the swinging point. Swords have a center of gravity towards the hands, ergo arm muscles are constantly active with a sword.
A mace needs only half of a weight of the sword concentrated into a ball at the end with a few spikes, and a light as fuck handle from lighter materials than steel, to fuck shit up while arms rest.
Again, try it in real life. I've tried it, it just werks.

This is why fantasy setting are better when magic is a rarity. Only magic beats magic because magic is broken.

Katars are also shit weapons. Anything that revolves around the punching motion is a shit weapon.

Arentcha retarded.
It's on the same level as katanas cutting through steel - which is bogus and isn't related to "material comparison" what so ever.
Cutting through a thin sheet of non-hardened steel is not an achievement. Good luck trying to cut hardened steel with a bronze sword - no matter how well-hammered, sharpened, and annealed.

try putting a pot on your head and smack it with a spoon a couple of time
report back your experience

Of course, but swords also got cucked by knights especially when armor got really good, which is why thrusting swords started becoming more common because when you can't penetrate the armor, you had to openings to your opponent.\

Even still, Maces, good metal ones, had a fuck ton more metal than swords.

>Ragnarok Online's Assassin class' main weapon
>hurr no game

Which is why the post after that exists, you need to grow some patience before shitting your pants user.

Maces are heavier than swords, user. Prove me fucking wrong. Their entire schtick comes from them being heavy enough to penetrate armor.

i remember darksouls 2 had it so enemies were just 99% massively resistant to non-crushing so maces were just alwayus better

Ragnarok

>be happy
>reminded of RO
>depressed instantly
why are you doing this

youtube.com/watch?v=BqijsweJzFQ

Maple Story

>Polearm/spear/mace autists
Romans would BTFO any medieval army

>Maces are heavier than swords, user. Prove me fucking wrong. Their entire schtick comes from them being heavy enough to penetrate armor.
They don't need to be heaver than swords to penetrate armor. That's the entire point user. Even a simple working hammer in your average home today can blast the medieval helmets to bits. It's about concentrating power into a small point, not about using giant weights.

Romans were BTFO by Cavalry. There's no amount of shields or spears which would save your ass from a medieval armored horse cavalry with fucking polearms.

What's heavier, a kilogram of mace or a kilogram of sword?

That's right it's a kilogram of mace.

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step it up fampay
youtu.be/RlXCexeWLG8
youtu.be/SSMjsDoeNwM

I'd imagine someone blocking a mace you swung would probably hurt more than getting a sword blocked.
You gotta throw your weight and it could fuck up your shoulder

DaS II logic was that Regular(which should just be called "cleave" damage because it applies to thick swords and axes) didn't make sense so they removed it leaving only slash, strike and thrust.
They then proceeded to apply the classic souls resistance logic that slash is only good against light armor, in a game where loads of enemies were fucking armored knights.
Likewise, Strike was classically strong against armor and so everything was weak to strike. The only enemies that resisted the fuck out of strike is Covetous Demons and I believe the fat hippos.

you motherfucker

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Hammers aren’t maces.

Mace weight is balanced towards the head, so it strikes with more force, but lacks an edge to really cut through flesh.

>???

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I think the idea is that maces are heavier and unarmoured enemies are generally quicker.

it's just easier hitting a quick enemy with a lighter sword than a heavy, slow mace.

although if you manage to get a good hit in with a mace it'd do some serious internal damage.

>know limmy's show
>seen that skit
>saw the punchline coming from a mile away
>still laughing like a retard
god dammit

go play OriginsRO, pre-renewal

>tfw halberdiers are fucking awesome
>only games that give some focus to halberdiers besides "another weapon to attack quite far" are japanese games or korean games
>they all add giant halberdiers with giant overdesigned axes and spears

I don't mind if a loli use a giant scythe because japan, but it really bother my autism if the setting also gives a giant focus to multiple kind of swords and they all look normal as fuck.

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Maces heads weighed between 50 grams to about 2.5 kg.
Arming swords, your one armed ordinary size, weighed about 1kg.
They pretty much were user. Sorry to break your weight masturbation, but people did also put thought into how much their arms were tire in battles that could take up to 2 fucking days.

>no setting were mages are naturally buff because magic requires discipline that can be achieved by working out

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I'm a wagecuck with 2 hours of free time every day.

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The point is that maces ignore some percent of armor, so they still do more damage to unarmed, but you just enjoy less of their special advantage. Nothing bullshit about it.

Aren't those persian?

Very small hitbox which lets you exploit gaps in the armor.

Nothing. The point of a mace is to either make you unconscious or turn your bones into dust, and whether helmet or no helmet it will fuck your shit up about equally in a battle. If you go unconscious in a medieval battle, just say your farewells to your family in your dreams before they are cut off from you being either trampled by the other soldiers to death or suffocating in dirt and mud to death.

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>gun bullets aren't effective to monsters but swords and arrows are
explain this

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if I was already filthy rich, and had like 12 hours of free time per day, I'd probably play RO again

Magic power protects bodies of the monsters. Only other magic power can pierce it.
You can only apply magic power to the objects directly.

>maces head
We’re talking a whole mace here.

>MUH MAGIC

>implying a stab wound is more instantly fatal then getting your entire gut/chest slash open

you'd literally have to stab them in the fucking brain, also stab wounds that are plugged by the stabbing implement also bleed less, so if you jammed your spear into a dude and he shanks his more agile sword through your fucking neck vertebrae, he might live to tell the tale, but probably not..

The handle's are made from light but flexible material more often than not, including all kinds of wood, which still puts them under overall in many cases. 600g of handle can be a pretty fucking big handle user up to 30 inches and more depending on material.

Optionally
>muh aura
or
>muh spirit

If monsters are ok, magic and derivatives should be ok too.

Ffxiv has these.

>two piece of almost identical rod shaped object
>except one has a solid mass on the end and one doesn’t
>somehow the one with the solid mass weighs less
Nope, sorry, physics don’t work that way, user. Also, you’ve never tried denting a piece of solid metal with a regular hammer. It doesn’t work. It takes a sledgehammer to do the job.

IFchan uses katars in every game shes in so :)

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200 grams of solid ball on 600 grams of handle are under an arming sword and more destructive on armor than the sword could ever hope to be.
I understand your woes user, but facts are facts. People in those times put more thought into swinging endurance than you did, and they didn't underestimate how destructive even 50 grams of mace head can be which is the lowest recorded limit for mace heads with effective use in actual history.
No amount of physics theorizing can bullshit through what actually was utilized by people who actually went into war frequently unlike yourself.

Swords are absurdly overrated in modern culture - historically they were of pretty little use due to combination of being expensive and shit performance against armored enemy. It was mainly decorative phallic weapon only good for chopping down peasants, while axes/maces/picks remained choice for actual work.

Why are you’d roaming like you went to war, bruh? No shit the mace is more powerful. We’re talking speed, nigga. No way was a mace lighter and easier to swing than a sword.

>No way was a mace lighter
It was, as proven through many example pieces dug out and even described in various documentation.
>and easier to swing than a sword
It was by venue of use of momentum force as opposed to constant force exertion due to a balanced weight.

>muh axes and maces
>no spears
Shut the fuck up. You are fetishist as well as swordfags.

>You can't cut through armor but you can crush armor.
>Cutting is more efficient when dealing with unarmored people because cutting hurts more than blunt force.

That's just real life,

based, history has proven that this is the order of melee effectiveness time and time again.

>Game has large weapons
>Ultimately worse than smaller weapons because they lose out on DPS
How do we fix this?

You cannot.
HP mechanics are retarded by design.

>Like the silver sword in the witcher series, why can't that pull double duty with regular humans?
Because monsters don't have steel plating and chipping your softer, yet more valuable tool with repeated blows is rather stupid.

>Lowest damage but higher attack speeds

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but I'm tired of my big fucking axe being worse than sticc thin swords

From everything i've learned over the years in going into real history as opposed to video game, cartoon, and fantasy jerking, whichever world i would end up in and whichever pre-contemporary era the last fucking thing i would want to wield as a weapon is a fucking sword. The last fucking thing.

Play TW Warhammer. They're the only weapon in the game that's both armor-piercing and can shut down charges from both heavy infantry and cavalry/monstrous creatures.

The same reason you don't see warriors and soldiers as cream of the crop intellectuals considering you need good cunning and intelligence in battle, being able to read and appropriately process several factors in your head at once.

But we're not gonna get any of those because it neither conforms to stereotypes and its straight up not fun or interesting.

>kilogramme

>*spawns in a cramped Italian tavern*

knives.

Axe my friend with a pick on the other side, and a buckler or a piece of wood of whatever kind to substitute.

>gets poked by a tacticool poking device*
>can't defend himself because he's bleeding and because it tickles
>pees his pants from giggling too hard
>girls start laughing at him and call his opponents cute
>dies

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>what is JoJo?

People had a few knives and were pretty good throwers in that era mate, just for note.

If you don't stop ruining my shitposts, I'm finna boutta grab my arming sword

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what about spears? they were much better for stabbing from a distance and multiple men could force a long, sturdy spear through even steel armor

>he doesn't always pick the big massive smasher weapon

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Polearms were basically almost all spear tipped with either an axe/pick or combo thereof underneath. Long spears went out of fashion because they can't adapt properly to quick changes in battle and spear-formations became irrelevant as all armies became masters at destroying them and rendering them useless.
As such most pole-arms were either near the height of the wielder or up to their chest/neck to maximize usage and reach together.

THE GOOD DAYS ARE COMING BACK BOYS

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Do you not play video games?

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It is bullshit, i agree. Only balance to be done is to make the unarmored enemies a lot more agile and fast and slow down the heavy armored ones, so that the mace is a weapon to be used against armored enemies much easier than it is to be used against those without armor. But damage should never be reduced on anything or anyone, especially the unarmored ones