Which of these two types of games do you prefer?
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>mario
>8
sonygro...
All of the left games are 9s or 10s though
God Hand is my all time favorite game, so right.
Don't even own a PS4
No mario game since 2010 deserves a 10.
Right's tend to have more impact on me as a whole, but that doesn't mean lefts aren't enjoyable.
This, Mario 64, Mario World, Mario Bros 3, Mario Galaxy 1-2 are objectively 9.5/10s regardless of the fact that i don't care for them
God hand isnt flawed.
Star Allies is more of a flawed gem than a perfect 8.
73
Give me those flawed gems
It was more of a "series as a whole" rather then the best of each game, Robobot was a 10 yeah, but that doesn't mean all the other games were, though most of them were still great, hence why they are there. It was really hard to find games that truly fit the right theme and I put the games I can think of most fitting it, I was really thinking of Dragonquest as my biggest example
I guess I appreciate experimentation over perfect execution.
this. it's a genre defining masterpiece for a genre is invented.
I don't believe that God Hand is a flawed gem, it's just a gem. An ugly gem, but a gem nonetheless.
Drakengard has nothing good about it. That's a flat out 1 out of 10 from start to finish
Flawed gems, by far. They have proved to be the most enjoyable and memorable gaming experiences for me by far. Often times, the reason they're flawed is what makes them so great--they're trying to do something new or different, and although the implementation probably isn't all there, that uniqueness is what makes them so great. I can play a "perfect 8" and pretty much always expect roughly the same experience. You never know what kind of gold you're going to get when you dig out some crusty obscure game made by a studio that went defunct immediately afterwards.
God hand has a lot of issues for most people getting into it. As much as people hate to admit it, presentation IS important for a game and God Hand looks like absolute dogshit, gameplay is all around perfect, but the game exists outside of that isn't the best.
flawed gems, if you can also post more of them i'd love it.
my favorite all time is arcanum
i'd rather firebomb every building owned by nint*ndo, is that an option?
>mario
>doesn't really strive to accomplish anything new
>invented genre and then redefined genre at least 3 times
>has multiple different takes on the genre often with impressive level design that in many places is completely ground breaking
>doesn't really strive to accomplish anything new
Where the fuck am I.
8 is a good score though.
Dragon's Dogma is another one I just thought of, should have put it on the list desu
based and dragonpilled
>mario
>solid 8
Marios are usually 10/10s. Only recently have they become so stale and formulaic they can be considered 8s
>god hand
>flawed
Also just fyi I like all the games I posted on the list except S.T.A.L.K.E.R I haven't played it yetand I'm not trying to start console war shit, it's just a thought that appeared in my head.
I like both about equally.
>since 2010
You're alright, user.
Demon's Souls definitely should be in the second column.
flawed gems, trying something new is always better than just playing things safe
A deeply flawed but unique game will always be better than an extremely polished but generic one. In fact I would agree with HK being there, but I didn't enjoy most of it.
Most of my favourite games are flawed gems, like Nier, Dragon's Dogma, Deadly Premonition, Xenogears, Kotor2, Arx Fatalis, etc.
Whats an example of a flawed gem sequel to a game that was perfect 8?
SeeKOTOR2
Jankcore thread?
Banjo Kazooie Nuts and Bolts
Shitposting thread, but I'll take the left. I can respect what the right tries to do but execution is absolutely critical, and if they can't nail it then it's pointless, only good for someone else to come along and try to do it better.
we're not gonna set the bar for "flawed gem" this low
Jamming in hours of not-Sonic in a Sonic game is not a minor flaw, it is an absolute disaster
Maybe if a cheat-engine let me skip all the mech and emerald hunting I will give it to you, but the base console release is fucking maddening
i enjoy both, but i think i'm leaning to perfect 8's because they overall leave me satisfied most of the time compared to the risk i take with flawed gems. admittedly sometimes you run into some great but it's usually personal
God Hand doesn't have any flaws aside from stale visuals
kotor had a large enough impact on star wars as a whole to not fit as a perfect 8, it basically pushed the mystical aspect of lightsaber crystals to what they are today.
>always
Horse armor was "something new" so I'm compelled to disagree. Bad ideas in the name of novelty are still bad ideas.
Drakengard is in the OP man, disaster flaws can still lead to a flawed gem.
Take Ride to Hell out of there.
There are no redeeming factors in that game. Putting it next to EDF is a fucking insult.
Don't you have some underage girls to send dick pics to?
Literally shit taste. Drakengard excels in music, edginess, and in being able to make you feel like a soulless killing machine like no other game ever has. It just isn’t a good game but it perfect pleb filter
camera is utter shit
73 is closer to 7 than 8, obviously, which would mean... it's perfect 7?
And honestly, why do people care so much about scores? We all know how the rating system ''works:
10/10 = truly a masterpiece and/or the most overrated game of all time
9/10 = truly a masterpiece and/or the most overrated game of all time
8/10 = good game, play it
7/10 = yeaaaah, it's Ok, but buy something else instead
1-6/10 = shit
I probably would've been able to enjoy Steambot Chronicles if the VA's weren't absolute shit.
>Factorio
>not enough external threats
>Dwarf Fortress
>obtuse ui
>EYE
>generic enemies with multiplayer bot AI
>Breath of the Wild
>magitech Portal test chamber dungeons and paraglide, climbing, and Cyronis are overpowered within traversal
>Hotline Miami
>door and enemy AI jank, and that hospital level
>Dominions
>play by email
>Arms
>content
>Far Cry
>the indoor corridor sections
>TF2
>cancerous cosmetics
>Marble Madness
>no trackball controller
>the vision of FFXV
>the entire execution
Golden era survival horror in general IS the flawed gem personified. Incredible atmosphere brought about in part by willfully jank mechanics and control.
t. ProJared
How retard? It's made so that it never clashes with any part of the environment and there are various mechanics to keep the character looking at what it is you need to see.
>SMB 3, World, Mario 64, Galaxy 1 and 2, Odyssey
>8
>Doesn't strive to accomplish anything new or innovative
>Never really achieves a mindblowing expirience
Ok I'm triggered
That factorio flaw is wrong.
Odyssey's a perfect 8 for sure. Good sense of exploration and control but not the most challenging game, or even Mario game for that matter. Also didn't do a whole lot novel as it was largely a return to 64/Sunshine style gameplay. It's fine, it's nice while it's on, but my mind wasn't blown while playing it.
>Kirby
>8
The grand majority of Kirby games are designed for toddlers. They might be polished but they barely reach a 6/10.
For World, Galaxy 1 & 2, and Odyssey, that is accurate.
For SMB 3 and 64 he's out of his mind.
My mind says "Perfect 8s" but my heart says "Flawed Gems"
Bloodlines and Saints Row 2 are my favorite games so the heart seems to win out.
Based and objectivepilled
The "perfect 8" was more like, bottom line the game is going to be an 8. It can do better sometimes, but it is always going to be at least an 8, I could have worded the shitty chart better I guess :p
I like both ends but flawed gems are far, FAR more memorable than perfect 8s are, unless it's a miracle game like SM64 or Planet Robobot. The unfortunate part of flawed gems is trying to introduce the less forgiving friends of yours to said games only to find that they can't forgive all of the flaws themselves.
Not an expert on SW lore, but I don't feel like that detail is that relevant overall. Thematically and tonally Kotor1 is basically a (good) rehash of previous movies, the plot is very straight-forward and plays it completely safe and any interesting additions it has regarding the force are only briefly mentioned. It's only until 2 where more meaningful topics are developed in a more complex story.
3D Mario games are not challenging, If you even find someone hard or close to challenging it's peobably because you played them as a kid or when you were younger and had not the same experience with videogames.
Also I thin transforming as the enemy was pretty novel, at least for Mario, sure it had been done before like with Banjo were you can transform, but doing so as fast and convenient as in Odyssey is a big step up. And even as a return to form, It did some great QoL changes, yeah people complain there is a lot of filler moons in the game, but its undrrstable to have so many since the level doesn't restart each time you get one, I bet Mario 64 would do the same if the game didn't throw you out of the level each time you grab a star (hell, even then Mario 64 still has a ton of stars that are repeated but for different levels, not to mention all those 100 coins and red coins stars, don't even get me started on sunshine)
Drakengard is more of a smashed gem rather than a flawed gem.
camera speed
Offhand I'd say Sunshine and Galaxy 2 put up more of a fight than Odyssey does outside of the Darker Side, and even then that's not the toughest "true final level" Mario games have seen in recent memory. And yeah, Odyssey is in a lot of ways the SM64 formula adopting some of Banjo-Kazooie's ideas.
you can lock straight on to enemies though
God Hand is fucking great and one of the best action games of all time but if you actually think it has no flaws I doubt you've actually played it and are prob just pretending for "Yea Forums cred".
This isn't a flawed gem, it's just flawed in pretty much every way.
That's the nature of a flawed gem. It won't be universally liked and a lot of people will be turned off by it. Yet it will still have a following.
a perfect 8 is just a notch above that 7 that means servicable and mediocre. probably a good time playing, but unlike Drakengard and God Hand, you'll never think about it again.
Darker Side is fucking easy.
I'd honestly like to see a toddler beat the True Arena. Not to say that most of the Kirby games aren't piss easy to complete the main story, but some of the challenge shit can be pretty fucking hard.
Mirror's Edge
Pandora's Tower
Fragile Dreams
Gravity Rush
Soul Sacrifice
Freedom Wars
Folklore
No More Heroes
Vampyr
VA-11 HALL-A
Tenchu in general
Deception IV
Show us your yaoi dick Jared.
But XC2 does everything worse than other games except anime girls. Flawed gems have aspects that are exceptionally good, or unique. Godhand has unparalleled brawler gameplay. Stalker has incredible, immersive environments and tense skill based gameplay. Etc.
XC2 is a mediocre at best, stockstandard jrpg that gets your dick hard.
Flawed gems every time
Right, I literally can't enjoy the shit on the left.
Bullet witch, breakdown and 99 nights are 3 of my favorite games.
Abyss Odyssey is my favorite Flawed Gem
Bullet witch is a janky masterpiece.
if you say it must be unique in some way I guess it doesnt qualify, but there is enough enjoyable content buried under a boring first act and cringy cutscenes for it to count for me
never played any of these. EDF is pretty acclaimed and Breakdown's supposed to be good. Ride to Hell tho?
I'm not saying you shouldn't enjoy it, if you can find fun in a generic jrpg then more power to you. There are certainly bad games I enjoy as well. But I think if you are being objective you will agree that a "flawed gem," or even better than "mediocre", it is not.
I think most of us got it. Like Mario, right - good bordering on great but ultimately pretty safe? One of those
The ultimate flawed gem
>that 7 that means servicable and mediocre
I hate modern scoring scale interpretations. I would consider a flat 5/10 mediocre, games like Nights of Azure or Senran Kagura Shinovi Versus that are mechanically competent but nothing special by any relevant means.
Drakengard is beyond "flawed", the gameplay is absolute trash and the writing is not strong enough to make up for it.
is there a bigger yikes than review blurbs on the front over?
>Morrowind
>Deus Ex
>New Vegas
>Alpha Protocol
>Bloodlines
>Witcher
>Max Payne
>Dark Souls
>Planescape Torment
>Mountain Blade
>Freelancer
>Aquanox
>Deadly Premonition
>Kotor 2
Flawed masterpiece every day. Literally soul vs soulless.
"Perfect"
I had fun with Earthworm Jim 3D and that sure as hell ain't a masterpiece. Just enjoy whatever games you can. It doesn't matter if it's perfect or better than something else. What matters is if you're having fun.
Okami isn't flawed in any way, it's a perfect 8
Ninety Nine Nights was fun
Yeah this is a perfect example of the flawed gem. So many things like the gacha mechanics, battle system, and the waifus are pleb filters. True fans can enjoy the game without any trouble despite the glaring flaws.
Okami is one of my favorite games of all time and its certainly flawed. I can't figure out how you would honestly think it fits perfect 8 over flawed gem.
>Tfw my first and second play throughs of STALKER SoC had 0 bugs
Call of Pripyat didn't have any either. Both were just solid, atmospheric video games. Also on master difficulty all of the issues with bullet spongy enemies go away and combat becomes extremely tight and fast paced.
i can't even say it's completely because of reviewers and PR being too cozy. even 20 years ago everyone started to focus on the games that got over 7/10 or 75/100, so that's just where the median shifted.
Flawed gems are supposed to have good aspects too, not just glaring flaws. And no, "anime girls that make my dick hard" doesn't count as an "incredibly good or unique quality".
yeah on a related note, even though im a liberal in favor of social justice, kikes niggers and faggots should be fucking reported to outer space. it only makes sense
>Dwarf Fortress
>obtuse ui
Most good roguelikes are that way, though.
>EDF
My nigga
nier gestalt/replicant fits more then dod1 imo
and stalker isn't buggy at all unless you're unpatched or full gopnik modding
Flawed gem, no doubt. The new Dragon Quest games are boring to tears, total corporate mass produced shit.
Stalker is generally still pretty buggy even when patched, because Xray works in mysterious ways.
My favourite game of all time and most people hate it for being too cryptic with it's advanced gameplay mechanics and story and expecting you to figure shit out instead of just holding your hand and making you follow a golden line
They butchered the sequels too
Hi.
Where do Battleborn and Overwatch fall on the scale?
I'd say Overwatch is an extremely polished turd and Battleborn is a rough precious metal.
Hollow knight has janky elements and strives to be innovative.
But.
>May be hard, bugged, or otherwise straight up unfun
FUCK YES GIMME THAT.
If the Fun is buried beneath a layer that requires effort to work around, then it's gonna ward off the normalfags, casuals, scrubs, and "It's the game's fault I suck at the game" types. Those types are pure fucking cancer.
And they're scared away, to at least some degree.
That's really fucking amazing and I want that.
>Many hurdles for the player to overcome to reach "the good stuff"
Aw fuck yes that's what I'm talking about. I'll buy 10 of those hurdles man that stuff is solid platinum.
>Only enjoyable by people who can ignore the flaws
Ah, this isn't me. I enjoy the flaws; the flaws are what prevent the plebs from getting adjacent to (or involved in) game discussion. I don't ignore the flaws, I cherish and respect the flaws. This side isn't for me then, guess I'll go with the 8s.
What form of sekrit klub autism is this
Newer games are trying to recapture the magic, but they're too easy
youtube.com
youtube.com
I only play PC games released between 1989 and 2005 so basically best of both worlds.
10/10 = Low standards, paid reviews, bias, AND it's massmarket trash
9/10 = Low standards or paid reviews. Possibly both. Has a very tiny chance of being a legitimately amazing game that merits 9/10 but these are rare.
8/10 = has a chance of being a great game, but might also be low standards + paid reviews while also being complete dogshit.
8/10 is the ideal spot to look for good games.
7/10 = Genuine score for a game that's pretty good, or an utter fucking turd that still got paid reviews anyway.
6/10 = Mediocre game with a genuine review or a total fuckin dumpster fire
5/10 = Game is bad
Once you realise that there are actually two different systems overlapping - one for paid reviews biased AAAshit and indie collusions where the game is nowhere near as good as advertised, typically getting 9/10-10/10, and another scale for genuine games, typically 6/10-8/10, then it makes it a lot easier to find actually good games.
dragons dogma
It's not sekrit club. More like a club with a bouncer that doesn't let you in if you think "I just play games for fun man" is a valid excuse for sub-optimal play.
Can't deny autism though. But autism is a superpower. It lets you have a refined sense of taste, to focus on what's good, to realise what's bad, and to reject the REEEing of the masses.
Todd liked that
I like either, but thinking through my favorite games of all time, not what I think is best, My top 3 excluding Majora's Mask) are all flawed gems.
- Sonic Adventure 2 is jank as hell with iffy camera and movement, being more in line almost with Gen 5 platformers like SM64, with large amounts of the game just sort oif being meh with the mech and treasure stages, but that soundtrack is fucking godly, the speed stages are 10/10, and the chao garden is fanastic.
- Halo 2 is similarly pretyt jank, with tons of glitches, exploits, and cut content, and with many of the missions being somewhat repetitive slogs (though never as bad as in CE), but it's also got a ton of fantastic missions, againa stellar soundtrack, and the core gameplay is just fun as hell.
- Asura's Wrath is, to be honest, barely a videogame, being mostly QTE's and cutscenes and what gameplay it does having being utterly lackluster, but the cutscenes/QTE's are phenomenal, the art design, story, coregraphy, music, is all great. As an interactive anime, it's a stupid insane,over the top trip.
The "doesn';t strive to do anything new" line is fucking stupid but I agree that Sm64 and most mario games are straight 8's. SM64 i'd actually say is more like a 7/10. It very much set the standard but in retrospect it IS just sort of standard.
The majority of the Mech and treasure stages are fine: not particularly great but still servicable. Then a decent amount (Wild Canyon, Pumpkin Hill, Meteor Herd, Dry Lagoon, Weapon's Bed, Cosmic Wall) are actually good to great, and only a few (Aquatic Mine, Mad Space, Eterneal Engine, arguably Security Hall) are actually bad.
>gacha, a shitty mechanic designed to suck money through the cell phones off mindless nips riding trains by imitating gambling is now a pleb filter
Why is it that anyone who uses the phrase "pleb filter" is a completely fucking retard defending the inclusion of poor choices in his preferred media?
SoC in it's modern form is perfectly fine the way it is desu
the only thing I'd maybe consider janky or needs to be changed is the artifact system and GET OUT OF HERE STALKER (and i wouldn't change the latter). Something like New Vegas should replace it.
I think Hollow Knight is alright, on the other hand I think pic related is absolute wondrous, where do I rank on the contrarian autist spectrum?
Flawed gems anytime.
I can deal with jank or sloppy execution (within reason) for interesting and/or innovative mechanics and atmosphere. If I were to make a meme top 20 list I guess almost everything would fit the category.
Perfect 8s have never enthralled me. In term of novelty they are usually the inferior reash of a real 10/10 and there is little reason to play them, just like there's no reason to play the gorillonz of chess variants. And even considering these games in isolation, they rely way too much on polish rather than soul. Yes tetris is a 'perfect' game, I'd like to see people pretend it makes it to their top ten.
is this the best modern example of a flawed gem?
>all this incredibly good taste ITT
I'll drop Alice: Madness Returns into the mix
Dark Souls is a perfect 8.
Bloodborne is 10.
Demon Souls is a Flawed Gem.
>Dark souls
>Perfect 8
None of the dark souls games are free enough from jank to be considered a perfect 8.
I like how OP inserted HK, STALKER, and GH for guaranteed replies because he knew he was a faggot and needed something clickbaity.
Which side am I on?
Camera is literally perfect and every single action game needs to take notes from it. The terrain warps and disappears to suit the camera, the camera should not freak out because of terrain.
Newer games are soulless trash relying on human characters dumping exposition instead of just letting you explore an alien world and putting in artificial barriers like not letting you reach higher evolution levels despite it being necessary to progress in the game
The first digimon world can be beaten in a couple of hours if you know what you're doing, the newest one you need to grind that long just to get basic skills
My favorite games are stalker and EYE, so...
It's not flawed enough for normies to hate it no, it's a weird inbetween, an anomaly.
>God Hand has many good qualities and many bad qualities
I always hear this copout so what are some of the bad qualities of God Hand? I'd argue that it's actually near perfect in its execution.
Imagine being such a retarded double digit IQ gorilla nigger you not only think quality can be measured objectively, but you’re also cuckolded enough to hold this fictional objective standard above your own opinion of the game. Guess what nignog, the word you’re looking for is normative, not objective
If you play a bunch of "perfect 8s" in a row you'll eventually get tired of them. Plus, if they're the only thing being released, they cease being 8s and gradually degrade in score.
You could play a shitton of flawed gems in a row and realistically never get tired of playing them because there's always something unique waiting for you.
What new and interesting things was Alice madness returns trying to do?
Fuck you, his thread is nice. No need to ruin it with ironic shitposting, I find his definitions valid.
This post is a great sum up of my thoughts on the matter.
Where would the Ace Attorney series figure? In my mind, most of the games would be on the left except for the first one when it was released in the west.
both mario and kirby had innovative games in their franchises wtf are you talking about?
I mean, really depends on what the game has to offer and if it's of my interest. You can have a game that is a flawless experience but still be so void of character or interesting gameplay that it sucks. There's no way to categorize things this simply put.
I was thinking it should be lower, actually.
calling those titles flawed is considered clickbaity? are there fans of God Hand that would claim it's not an acquired taste? or that Drakengard is just a solid experience all the way through?
In what way is Stalker flawed?
It's a perfect game. CoP anyway.
vtmb is shit after Downtown.
>splatterhouse
nice
shame we'll never get a sequel though
If the game you're defending from being 'flawed' isn't universally acclaimed, consider why your idea of perfection (or near-perfection) wasn't as well received as you think it should've been.
Hollywood isn't all that bad until the sewers
One of the best examples at least, it's just that it's so mainstream that it's hard to put it in the same category as other lesser known gems.
If anything DS3 is the perfect 8 of the series. Dark 1 and Demon's are flawed as fuck but are still the best ones by far.
What's flawed about God Hand?
and no being hard isn't a flaw, it's a design choice.
not him but what are god hands flaws?
literally can't think of any, not a single one...
You think that only because of Velvet.
If you say so, I think she's a cunt
The enviroments are complete shit for one.
>Yea Forums is finally realizing that Hollow Knight isn't a flawless masterpiece
thank god
Definitely perfect 8
I mean the levels have low poly buildings but the layouts are fine.
Jet set radio
>ctrl+f pathologic
>0 results
huh
This entire series is a perfect example of flawed gem, except Saga 2 which is just a massive turd.
> bad feels when no Haven 2
The monster Hunter starting from the PS2 up until generations is pretty much the definition of a flawed gems you learn to appreciate when you get good and exploit the best of the limitations you are given.
Monster Hunter World is a good game
Feels bad bro. Even Pathologic 2 is barely drumming up discussion.
I tend to enjoy flawed gems a lot more
Not really sure how to describe why, just something about them is always alluring and I have no problem putting up with flaws
Hell, I was ready to play through System Shock Classic Edition until someone gave me a download link to the Enhanced Edition
sounds like you only enjoy games because other people dont enjoy them. you just want to feel unique. youre no better than tumblrfags, and its not healthy. get help user.
Flawed.
Fallout 3. Unironically. I like NV, but it'll never match the world and feeling from Fo3's atmosphere.
I enjoyed the flawed gems more because II generally play Perfect 8s as my main stuff.
The lower amounts of Flawed Gems means I tend to remember them more, but if Flawed Gems were more common then I probably wouldn't have this opinion.
>dragon quest
>considered good
What.
depends heavily on the gameand my experience with it
both
I'll always prefer games with higher highs even if they come with some lower lows. Favouring games of a more even but otherwise lower quality is something dumb people do, see Bayonetta 1 vs Bayonetta 2. I don't think I'd go so far as to call the first game a flawed gem by the OP's description, but it does have some issues; cutting the QTEs and gimmickier levels isn't worth dumbing down the entire combat system in the sequel.
I'd love to be able to flex some street cred, but I've always been a perfect 8 type of guy.
>Tf2
>Cancerious cosmetics
It wasnt always that way
You're a 10 to me user
hollow knight sucks dick, salt and sanctuary is at least 4 times as good don't @ me
The fuck is Hollow Knight doing there?
I seem to spend more time with flawed gems and remember them more, so those I suppose.
Right now I'm playing Kenshi, which has many, many problems, but there are moments where it's fucking great.
where do yakuza games fit?
perfect 7s
>Kirby games
>anything but shit
based
cringe
Here's one for the right side. It's an amazing game. Very moving. If only you look beyond the flaws.
Sonic Unleashed is pretty much the definition of flawed gem
That 8 description and those games aren't accurate given those games all do something new with each iteration.
you're sad
I get the chart but you should at least put games on each side that are actually in the same genre for a better comparison. Like you put HK, Kirby, and Mario there but didn't put a single 2d/3d platformer on the right. Or you put mostly RPGs on the right but only put Dragon Quest on the left instead of say Witcher 3.
Chart has potential. Flubbed it on the execution. Apply yourself OP.
Eurojank == Japjank > shit > everything else
If you like Mario games, then Perfect 8s
If you like Sonic games, then flawed gems
I'm talking about the sidescrollers, which I feel are the core mechanics of these franchises.
Sonic's momentum and speed is not immediately apparent to the user, and people can get through the game without knowing how it actually works. But when you do know how it works, it's practically magical what you can do with it, and the game transforms before your eyes. I found myself sorely missing Sonic's mechanics when going to Mario, Megaman and Metroid.
Marios is more basic, but also very solid. Most stages are carefully designed to take account of what the player can and will do, making for a far more directed and polished journey. You can't beat Mario without knowing how it works. At the same time, this level of direction and tightness can become bland. It's difficult to put in to words, but there's a point where the gameplay, despite being well designed, become rudementary, as if lacking depth.
no, this was the best blurb on a videogame ever
>It's difficult to put in to words, but there's a point where the gameplay, despite being well designed, become rudementary, as if lacking depth.
Its called being a casual.
>spy fiction
Damn. I forgot about that. Had a pretty cool costume system.
It's actually just shit. Granted, I never bothered with the fifth episode, but up to that point it was largely just flawed, and its saving graces weren't nearly enough to make it worth my time.
I hear you can make the cute main character a lesbian. Sounds worth it to me
It's not.
now THIS is true autism
name a single bad quality of god hand
sad!
Yea Forums really loves making up new buzzwords uh
that one platforming section
it will never get a remaster or sequel
i absolutely love it when i game is slightly janky and feels like a video game
its hard to describe
god hand did literally NOTHING new or innovative within the space besides scaling difficulty which has existed in arcades for almost three decades prior. It's combat was a total fucking joke dominated by two or three combos of moves, it's levels were all a horrendous mishmash of styles and design, it's bosses were about it's only saving grace.
It had the game design professionalism of a fucking flash game. 0/10 piece of trash.
and yes, it's fucking camera blew asshole.
based retard
Give me flawed gems or give me death
I’m at the very end of the final dungeon in Saga 2 and don’t understand the hate at all.
The story isn’t quite as good as 1, but even then it gives good development for Albedo. Everything else from battle system, to music, to graphics is much better. The new designs were jarring at first but I prefer them now, and even the story presentation feels better imo.
Horrible audio quality? Voices sound like they were recorded with $5 mic.
That trademark PS2 motion blur and AA that doesn't scale well no matter the resolution.
30 fps lock.
No new game plus.
MGSV and Rain World. I think Furi is a solid 7-8 game but seeing all the complains about difficulty (both too easy and too hard) and controls (soulskids can't figure out that dodge is on release, not on press) I could put this to the flawed gem pile.
no stage select
i cant think any other tho
What's a flawed gem that's also gained mainstream popularity?
I like a mix of flawed gems and perfect 8's.
Right are jank games. They've got some seriously broken qualities either technically or design-wise but offer truly unique and memorable experiences, promoting enjoying something for what the experience is intuitively as opposed to rigid, shallow metrics.
I'd choose the flawed gems any day.
Monolith Soft has a knack for this stuff.
Origins in particular has a great battle system and some fantastic story beats despite how jank it can be. Anyone whose played it through knows exactly what I mean.
Great ideas that make a shitty game
>Union system
Intruiging
>Battle rank
How the fuck did they expect to design a system that actively punishes you for grinding, yet not explain it anywhere. Fucking Square.
you were being easy on most of them but i still like you
My top 5 is Gothic 2, Stalker Shadow of Chernobyl, Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines, Dragon's Dogma and Thief II.
>Technomancer
>Of Orcs and Men
>The Surge
>Incredible Adventures of Van Helsing
>everything Piranha Bytes has ever developed
>What's a flawed gem that's also gained mainstream popularity?
Impossible.
Flawed gems by definition can't become mainstream.
Flawed Gems, they end up being way more fun and having a lot more potential for independent development.
League of Legends.
>Visually bad
>30 fps
>Environments are terrible (literally just square rooms a lot of the time)
>Upgrades/unlocks that are actively detrimental (and some that can't be undone)
These are in no way dealbreakers, especially when considering how good the combat is and how fun the characters are, but to say it's not flawed is blatantly wrong and just reinforces my earlier theory that you haven't actually played it.
Sounds like it'd be a 7 or 8 rather than a flawed gem.
>DQ
>above a 5 ever
>no La Mulana posted yet
Yea Forums proves again and again how casual they are
Terrible game on paper, but it's still fun as fuck.
never forgetti
MGS4
MMX8
graphics are awful and alot of the enemies are reskins of older ones
This chart is all over the place. Some of these are phenomenal and some of them are unplayable garbage.
Agreed. VtMB blew my mind last year when I finally played it. Easily became a game in my top 10. Right side can be a fun time spender though for sure.
When will you guys learn that video game reviews are scored based on mass appeal versus how well the game delivers on what it promises?
If a game gets dozens of perfect scores, it's because so many people enjoyed the experience. Some games go out of their way to make the player suffer even if it's in service of the game's message.
Maybe try thinking up what you enjoy in your favorite games and see who else enjoys what you do. Then you can lean on them for game recs without really being burned out on anything.
Perfect 8s. Very rarely does something come along and do something new - AND manage to do it well. Let's establish some decent games first instead of trying to do something special and unique every time.
>FE fates
the trashcan
left tend to be more enjoyable to play but often right are more memorable
> hollow knight
> any score above 3/10
>Hollow Knight
>No apparent flaws
Lol. The first few hours are a chore
>Drakengard
>Flawed Gem
Why would anyone play fucking Drakengard except for the story.
>Soulless vs Soul
>meme game
Reminder that NG and Bayo are better in every way
OHHH YEAAA
fpbp
OP clearly assblasted making this thread
Of course they can, it's something that depends of the game itself and not of the popularity or the reception
God I'm still so miffed that we're never gonna get a sequel that resolved the cliffhanger at the end. You're right the game was buggy as hell but holy hell was it top tier jank fun.
The game mechanics didn’t even get off the ground until like chapter 5 or 6, many of even the special gachas were semi-worthless on most characters, Mythra totally outperforms Pyra and most of the equippable items are either interchangable or semi useless, fewer enemy sense types and most interesting upgrade is behind multiple minigames of contested enjoyability (although I did like Tora tora)
Once it really gets going it’s fun and it has some decent ideas but otherwise it was a real step down from X which had plenty of problems of its own
Why are so many sonic fans prone to passive aggressively responding to anyone that says Sonic Adventure isn't good?
Not at lot of flaws, but definitely a gem
>todder getting mad over video games
God hand doesn't have any flaws
I considered this less tedious than Banjo Kazooie to be honest, sure you have to change Kongs to collect bananas but when you get them you get to keep them. In Banjo Kazooie if you die, and don't have enough notes, you'll have to recollect every single not you already collected, plus DK64 has warp pads.
most of those games are trash
only god hand, dragon quest and drakengard are any good
and they're all flawed
flawed especially because 90% of western AAA games feel like perfect 5s and are incredibly boring.
>drakengard
>flawed gem
It's a steaming pile with one crazy diamond sticking out the top. A lazy Dynasty Warrior's knockoff that just by chance happened to have batshit endings.
Flawed gems are literally all shit
Nobody actually likes games like vampire the masquerade or balders gate besides sjw basedboys
Literal npcs
t. NPC
>VTMB
>Baldur's Gate
>only liked by SJWs
You fucking what mate. Not everything you dislike is soi
I'll have to go with right since STALKER is quite frankly the only game that did "OPEN WORLD FPS" right.
Lackluster melee combat and RNG weapon grind bullshit aside, this game is 19/10. It tries to do literally everything and nearly succeeds while being on a 240p piece of shit.
So yeah, I'd take a flawed gem over an enjoyable, but predictable experience any day
I've been replaying a 2004 base builder strategy game called Evil Genius lately. Last time I played it was during high school. Basically you build a supervillain lair inside a volcano and defend it from the secret agents that want to put a stop to your evil plans. Its surprisingly comfy and really fun, but you do need to install a few patches and mod some things to fix some big flaws and make the whole experience better. I don't mind doing it every time I reinstall the game because the I love the building aspect. You should all give it a try it's a really good game
>Hollow knight strives to be innovative.
How? I love the game, but the only thing it went for that felt new given my experience with the genre was just being bigger than everything else, which isn't really innovation.
You're a god damn liar if you say that hk isn't difficult
>Hollow Knight
There are much better metroidvanias I don't get how Yea Forums started sucking this game's dick so much since it came out.
Now this is a good thread. I like flawed gems a lot more because they are more memorable while polished games tend to be more average and forgettable.
So many unique games fall under this category. The first Nier, Shadow of the Colossus, Ico, The Last Guardian, Gravity Rush, Dragons Dogma. You could see even Demon Souls and the first Dark Souls.
Wish more western companies tried experimenting with game mechanics and had more out of the box ideas
Because they are pathetic autists?
hollow knight is more like a 6 or 7 desu
I strongly am in the "flawed gems"
While some classic games like zeldas and marios are very polished and without majors flaws, they lack uniqueness.
Dont get.me wrong, after 23 of gaming, i fell i already experienced all "polish" in games.
I rather play an unique and flawed game.
"Flawes gems" side*
Someone respond, I'm genuinely curious. Fighting the final boss(es) at the moment and its a decent game imo.
Based
The games have god tier soundtracks too
youtube.com
Why should I choose which type?
There are perfect 8s that I like and enjoy more than jankshit and there are flawed gems that I find far superior to perfect 8s. And sometimes both of them are my GOTYs.
This is the dumbest bait I've ever seen. SM64 revolutionized 3D gaming, it's been copied by every 3D game since
Play E.Y.E., filthy jians
Honorable mentions to:
>Cryostasis
>E.Y.E.
>The Void
All of them except for Hollow Knight (haven't played it), scoring games is sucking some journos dick for free.
You'e going to play them and enjoy them or not, as simple as that. Going full analyst on vidya is what's killing the western game development.
OP's picture doesn't mention mario 64
this is it really, you need the flawed gems to advance the genre and keep it interesting, but its nice to have at least one perfect 8 per established genre to see what the reasonable peak of that genre can be
fucksake its sad that i have played all but 3 of the these games on this list of mainly shit games, and have owned all but 7 of them.
If it's talking about SMO then it makes even less sense
i mean, it is fairly flawless, thats just not enough to net you a 10. perfect 8 is a good term for it, since it does what it does near perfectly, it just doesn't do anything particularly new.
>dont like platformers at all and every time one comes out its described as the near perfect game
I just get bored of them, collectathons do nothing for me. I grew up with platformers out the ass, the only one I actually liked was Crash games because I liked the characters. Its sad because I feel like Im seemingly missing out on definitive examples of the medium.
none of the mario games are collectathons, though.
by theme youre technically collecting stars, but thats just a narrative device to send you to all the cool and unique levels. mario games are the closest thing to old arcade experience you can still get today.
These days I prefer the serotonin high of a perfect 8 over the sporadic dopamine bursts of a flawed gem.
If you find God Hand to be flawed because of the camera and the controls, you are legit low IQ
You ever play any of the New Super Mario Bros games or 3D Land/Word, that's a fucking 8 at best.
It's talking about the New Super Mario games and 3D Land/Word
Both is good
flawed gems
all four of those games on the left are boring as fuck
Swinging for greatness and missing is way better than aiming for safe and comfortable.
they all seem like good games, why do you have to pick?
shh, nukiddies on Yea Forums are too young to realize Mario came before the rest and just see it exists, not that it was first. It's just like how people shit on Seinfeld for being cliche, when those cliches only exist because so many other shows copied Seinfeld after it's success.
its much easier to digest when you have less time - you know you can sit down and have a couple hours of solid, enjoyable gameplay rather than having no idea whether your only free time of the day will be fun or just incredibly frustrating.
Mario 64 is the epitome of flawed gem. Most games from the N64 top PS2 era are. No mater if they're AAA shit.
nu-mario doesn't even deserve an 8 (except for 3d world, which is actually good).
I like it = Flawed Gem
I don't like it = Perfect 8
This is already trash and the concept hasn't even existed for 2 threads.
not every game fits into either of these categories.
there's a happy medium between not explaining anything and holding the player's hand, and dw1 completely missed the mark.
dw1 was a totally unique experience unlike any other game, so they really needed to explain how it worked, but they didn't.
So you never played mario maker or odyssey. I can't remember when galaxy 2 came out but that also destroys your little argument.
Exactly. Perfect 8s will never totally wow you like a perfect 10, but they'll never frustrate or dissuade you from playing like flawed gems will.
You just made this garbage image to say that HK is an 8. It's a 9 at least, kill yourself you worthless nigger and never post again
its not really a flawed gem I think, its just an okay - good game.
It would've been well liked if it wasnt featuring banjo
perfect 8s are the worst. I'd rather play a shitty game
sa2 is not a flawed gem, it's a flawed masterpiece
get it right
maybe people who don't like sa2 should stop cheating on their wives
kirby as a franchise is not a perfect 8. too many weak ass games and his best games easily exceed an 8 rating.
Tails/Eggman segments are shit, they're not flawed like the Knuckles/Rogue segments, they're outright shit.
This is just a bad game
Which are 10/10 platformer games. The games on the right are the overrated drivel that Yea Forums circlejerks endlessly
git gud
Assuming it really "connects" I'd always go for a flawed gem. Those are the ones that usually stay in my memory for years.
>Been hearing how great Morrowind is for decades.
>Finally try it.
>mfw I put the camera in third person and jump
nsmb is the epitome of souless trash
They aren't hard to beat, just boring and slow. Doesn't add variety, just adds an unnecessary break of rhythm.
>souless
Learn to spell, ESL
Definitely right. I always say that for a game to be great it has to do one thing really well. An extremely flawed game that does one thing really well like Fallout 4 and exploration is more entertaining to me than something like ocarina of time which is adequate in everything it does. But that just makes it boring for me. I know i'm gonna get shit for that last example. Same thing with something like Sekiro. It's missing a lot of the rpg elements, different weapons, builds, multiplayer, and replayabilty that I loved from the previous souls games. But the combat is so fucking good it makes up for it.
Flawed gems unironically due to the "soul" element. Just compare DeS to every other sequel. Sure, by every metric the others were an improvement, but they get completely blown the fuck out when it comes to actually being their own games rather than "spiritual sequels". The game is consistently good, unique, and enjoyable, and it had the budget of most indie shit that doesn't even make it out of early access these days. Flawed gems are just passion projects that have a solid vision behind them, free from executive meddling, because it's not a cash cow (yet). Succeeding too much unironically turns games bad, because publishers will want to make it into a golden goose, and start meddling with the creative process thinking they know better (usually by insisting x and y features from the biggest titles be included for a wider audience).
it's only flaw was not having a sequel
>being hard is a flaw
>steep learning curve is a flaw
>not being new or innovative isn't a flaw
>not being challenging isn't a flaw
fuck off
Fuck off
The sonic levels are shit too
SA2 is in every way worse than 1
AA development is best for video games. AAA is too big, and corporate, indie is too amateurish and mismanaged. Sure, AAA and indie probably produce more 10/10s, but AA development produces a lot more consistently good, and unique titles. It also helps that AA aren't "too big" or too small to do certain genres or titles unlike AAA and indies, which will only play it safe and do genres that will guarantee sales.
Separating games in those two cathegories is gross simplifications, other factors separate them into different subcathegories. This is bullshit and OP is a faggot, as usual.
OP's pic is 2d nu-Mario, which definitely is an 8. Odyssey is a 10 though.
The gameplay really does get pretty fun 30 hours in, and a great OST. Yes, it does have a really generic story, bad graphix, a slow start, a poor tutorial, a shitty gacha system for some reason, but it is actually pretty fun once you get far enough in.
And no, it isn't generic, at least in terms of gameplay. I can't think of any other RPG with such an involved combo system.
see
specifically the "New" series didn't really do anything innovative.
Git gut, you can beat them really quickly, just curb your ADHD and learn to use the analog stick gently.
...
Games on the right usually feel neat but are just a bitch to play. I'd rather read about Drakengard than ever pick it up and STALKER feels like a waste of potential overall due its engine limitations. I think both are a good experience.
>SA2 is in every way worse than 1
wut? git gud, sa1 is trash
get A ranked on all of them. running through the levels as fast as possible is playing them wrong
I can skip and clip through shit like in other segments, I still find them shitty.
>N64
I'd argue the dichotomy doesn't really apply to video game until the 2000's
The descriptions of course are fucked but this is actually accurate, also I'd argue the Wii U belongs on the right
I just want STALKER with some modern graphics god dammit
Neo Geo must be perfection.
the wii u is nintendo at its most saccharine and soulless. It's literally a worthless console with no games worth anyones time. It is as perfect 8 as it can get. the most soulless kirby, mario, smash, mario kart, zelda games of all time all on one failed console.
>Hollow Knight
>no immediate hurdles
All the plebs constantly complain about getting lost and then call the game shit because they don't know how to explore without handholding.
that's weird, it's about as sterile as an exploration game can be.
I found turning left and right kinda clunky.
nice buzzword
The final boss is lame.
30 FPS.
Some moves are just flat-out better than others.
Whip whores.
Those couple bits of platforming.
There's really no better word for the adobe flash graphics, double jumping in a platformer, and boss patterns regurgitated from the NES than sterile.
I fuck with Vita and Dreamcast but give me the left otherwise.
Name a better platformer
Hard mode: on the same platform
64 is in the running for worst nintendo console.
Cope.
You have to be joking. They already have two consoles very famous for flopping, one being monumentally bad
I rate games my own way so a flaw to me might not be a flaw to anyone else. That said, I can play game with a lot of flaws as long as there is something great enough in there as well that I can focus on. Some games I'll play again and again for years and some I can recognize as temporary things that are only good because of a multiplayer component for example.
Most of the complaints I've seen about the aren't about getting lost, but about the game wasting a lot of your time early on with empty corridors, boring initial area and hours of lackluster gameplay because it takes forever to get your proper basic movement options.
Name a better "Flawed Masterpiece" than The Wonderful 101. Go ahead, I dare you.
That doesn't make it not a flaw.
Killer Instinct
There's nothing extremely flawed about the Reboot. KI 2013 is a fantastic fighting game with more creativity than any other game in the genre this decade, held back entirely by being XBone/W10 exclusive for the majority of its life.
I'm talking about the Arcade original.
Flawed gems are what all games should strive for. Perfect 8's provide a solid smooth experience but it leaves very minimal impact, just a dopamine rush that you could get literally anywhere else. You can say flawed gems are soul and perfect 8's are soulless.
Perfect 8's are what people buy, flawed gems are what people remember.
>Prefer Flawed Gems
>Favorite Mario is 3D World
>Favorite Kirby is Star Allies
Checks out.
>bunch of video games in the picture
>one(1) nintendo game
>first post is toddler getting triggered
Just make a containment board already
Thea:The Awakening
King's Bounty:The Legend and sequels.
The Witcher 1
Master of Magic (Best Civ game, but bugs out the ass and muddy brown sprites.)
Atelier series up until Sophie.
Star Citizen
Most Divinity games.
Pathfinder:Kingmaker
Ninja Gaiden 2 is the ultimate flawed masterpiece
>one of if not the best combat systems in an action game
>frame rate problems
>master ninja difficulty wasn't properly balanced/tested
>some shitty bosses that drag down the experience
>lacking enemy variety in the end of them game
Pikmin 1 is a Flawed Gem, Pikmin 2 is a Perfect 8.
Replace it with the Xbox360 Bionic Commando
Cause you're wrong? Not that hard to understand
Personally I rate games on a 0 average system based on how much better or worse the game is compared to Shadow of Mordor.
Drakengard is an objectively boring and repetetive game. The only saving grace is the story.
>galaxy 2
>deserving any of its 10s
either underage or NPC
The left. Major flaws can sour the whole experience.
Megaman X6
Stalker had no major flaws.
Don't lump all sonic fans in with adventurekiddies.
agreed