This guy puts it really well: >Unfortunately though, this mentality of Majora’s Mask being underrated has given the game maybe a little too much praise. Now a lot fringe fans make the claim that Majora’s Mask surpasses its predecessor. There was even a thread on Yea Forums’s video game board, Yea Forums, stating that collectively, the forum preferred Majora’s Mask. I thought it was hilarious until I realized they weren’t joking. Unfortunately, people’s desire to be contrarian has persisted, and they valiantly defend a game that can’t even meet what came before it. >For starters, every post, blog, video, or editorial that champions Majora’s Mask usually has a disclaimer telling viewers that they should overlook the infamous three day cycle of the game. They shouldn’t, because that’s what hurts the game more than anything. See because the narrative is about an unstoppable apocalypse, every second of the game counts toward it. If that clock hits an hour and 12 minutes, which converts 72 hours in the game world, the apocalypse happens, and the player loses. thestorageunitblog.wordpress.com/2016/09/21/majoras-mask-from-underrated-to-overrated/
(cont'd from previous) >To go fix this, the game lets players go back to the starting point to play through those same three days again. The game though gets a little petty about what happens then. If the player beats a boss or collects a new mask, they don’t have to do it again, but all other items, bombs, arrows, currency in the wallet, that all goes down the drain. Even progress on side quests and dungeons gets wiped if it’s not significant enough. >But let’s say I play by the rules and actually overlook the three day cycle. The game still has its problems. Just on presentation, the game reuses most of Ocarina’s assets, a clear sign of the stunted development time. As for the music, aside from a handful of songs, the game leaves a lot to be desired in that department. Quite a few of those songs are rehashes of the same tune with modifications. >The level design also suffers a good deal. No dungeon really shines like the Spirit Temple in Ocarina. Woodfall looks and plays like a scrapped version of the Forest Temple. Snowhead straight up feels bland. Great Bay makes the Water Temple look good. The only one that has some creative spark is Stone Tower. Adding on to that, the game lacks a true final level like Gannon’s castle. Instead the player just goes to this meadow, talks to a kid and there it is, the last enemy. >But people really like to laud this game for its narrative, because it’s dark and edgy. The worst thing about this mentality is that it treats Ocarina like it just played a safe kiddie story. Last time I played Ocarina, I distinctly remember Link having to kill his village’s god to make sure it didn’t get taken over by Gannon. And that’s just the game’s opening. Going further, the rest of the game centers on the loss of innocence that accompanies an abrupt entry into adulthood.
He's right. The idea that MM could ever be as good as OoT with its glaring flaws is like a bad joke.
Cameron Foster
>Three day cycle bad >Soundtrack bad >Snowfall is bland >OoT is secretly dark and edgy guis!!! It's amazing one man could be so fucking wrong.
>As for the music, aside from a handful of songs, the game leaves a lot to be desired in that department. Quite a few of those songs are rehashes of the same tune with modifications. I want to fucking kill this guy.
Reminder that OoT=MM>every other game in the series
Brody Nguyen
Allow me to end this retarded thread and all future instances of it in 56 words.
> Majora's Mask is a more technically impressive game based on its unique structure, but is less ground-breaking due to the fact that it builds upon the foundation of Ocarina of Time. Therefore Ocarina of Time can be thoroughly enjoyed on its own, but one must play Ocarina of Time in order to fully appreciate Majora's Mask.
Now fuck off. Mods, lock this thread.
Colton Rivera
>Adding on to that, the game lacks a true final level like Gannon’s castle. Instead the player just goes to this meadow, talks to a kid and there it is, the last enemy.
>ignoring the trial rooms to get the Fierce Deity mask does this dude eat paint
Blake Jones
Not better, but MM is on par with OoT at the very least.
I like Ocarina more but this is one of the worst writeups I've ever seen. Any comparison between two games that doesn't go any deeper than a 1:1 checklist of features, without considering context or how they gel together to form a complete experience, can go in the trash
Wyatt Cook
>skips the final segment with the mask children >complains that there is no final segment Absolutely fucking unbelievable
Three day cycle is a great game-play loop that encourages strict time management and efficient playing rewarding the player far more for smart playing than OoT. I don't know a single contemporary reviewer that tells you to overlook it though, that was more of a thing back then when people who wanted Ocarina 2 and were mad they had to think about what they were doing. Texture reuse is done well because Termina is a mirror world of Hyrule, it's supposed to look the same with slight changes Sound track is more of a personal preference, but the rhythm is far more complex and the expansion of instrumentation creates more tension and a feeling of disconnection from the world. I will admit between the two it's a toss up between the best of the best, but on a consistency basis Majora is more consistent while Ocarina's best tracks, like fire temple, easily pass some of my favorites off Majora. Overall saying the soundtrack is lacking is a lie, both are among my favorite video game soundtracks of all time. >Buh they reused themes! Every single Zelda game reuses the same exact themes from Link to the Past, even OoT. What songs that are reused are still remixes. OoT has dark themes, but that's the same in every light hearted fantasy. There needs to be darkness for their to be a good ending. OoT would be total shit if there wasn't stakes and consequences, but Majora has far darker consequences and storylines. And to touch on it, Just because OoT ALSO has dark themes doesn't suddenly discount Majora's. Both can have dark themes but it doesn't suddenly water down Majora's darker tone because OoT also gets dark.
Austin Rivera
Majora’s Mask has always been overrated by contrarians. They ended up being the same nerds who grew up to be videogame writers and successfully force fed the narrative that MM is this under appreciated thing that got slept on because of the PS2 launch. As usual it’s people thinking too much about their games that allows them to forget the dumb shit the game has you do to progress: like the fetch quests, some boring storylines, and iffy design decisions like having you do ramp jumps as a Goron ball to get anywhere in a dungeon.
MM isn’t bad, but holy shit is the game mired in problems that get glossed over just because of its story. It’s also a more linear game than Skyward Sword but that game gets piled on for it while MM gets excused. Zelda fags are annoying.
Jackson Reyes
You haven't given a single shred of an argument. As is to be expected from MM morons.
I will give credit to MM for having some good music, because I want to be objective. Stone Tower Temple music is a good song. But much of the other music in the game is forgettable or just not very good. Termina Field's arrangement of the main Zelda theme isn't very good. Southern Swamp music is kind of annoying. There are a few examples.
Why would you want to kill someone for being right? That's a significant level of autism you've got there.
One of the things that makes that mechanic annoying is that it uses your magic, and if you want to avoid using your magic, you have to deliberately go a bit slower than full speed.
Nah I don't agree. I've only fully played OoT, MM and WW, and I would rank them as OoT > WW > MM. MM really suffers from its terrible saving system, its ridiculous punishment of taking away all your ammo every time you save so you have to grind again to restock, and its short development time is pretty apparent. It certainly has some really cool ideas in it, especially considering the short development time, but the limitations are just far too annoying.
Kayden Baker
>needing to pick a favourite between two great games Fine. >forcing other people to pick a favourite even though they enjoyed both games about the same Fuck you. Retarded manlet.
Anthony Sanchez
People that say MM is better are just neo-Yea Forums contrarians.
The FD mask isn't part of the main quest so I think it might be you who is the one that eats paint.
You haven't made a counterargument. You haven't engaged with any of his reasoning or any of the contentions that he makes, and you haven't given explicit reasons why his contentions are wrong. On Graham's Hierarchy of Disagreement, you're probably somewhere between "responding to tone" and "contradiction". You're seem to be levelling a vague criticism against him that his argument is only a "checklist of features" but you haven't actually engaged with any of his assertions or explained how he has failed to "consider context".
Let's take the save system as an example. I don't see what context you need to understand that a save system that erases a lot of your current progress and takes away all of your ammo is a bad save system. Even with the addition of owl statues, which force you to quit the game if you want to use them, it is still a phenomenally poor save system.
His criticisms of the dungeons and the music are similarly accurate. MM's dungeons are pretty crap compared to OoT's. They certainly don't have the same clear-cut themes of OoT's. Each one is sort of a mishmash of ideas. The Forest Temple is set in a forest, okay got it. The Fire Temple is all about fire. The Water Temple is all about water, makes sense. The Woodfall Temple is... set in a swamp, okay, I guess that makes sense, but it's not a very thrilling temple. Doesn't have the same variation as the Forest Temple with the outdoor areas, the checkerboard thing, the Poe fights, the elevator, the twisty doorway. Snowhead Temple... okay so it's sort of an icey temple, but also with rocks. Right. And it's got this blue wizard thing that has nothing to do with either ice or rocks. Okay. This game clearly didn't have a lot of development time and it shows.
>has half as many dungeons >lacks the depth of having two completely different periods of time and completely different ages >has a terrible godawful saving system that has obviously never been used in any other main zelda game because to reuse such a shitty "feature" would be insanity Yeah, totally on a par mate. That's why OoT is the best rated game of all time on Metacritic and MM is 53rd.
Wyatt Phillips
/thread
How can anyone enjoy MM when it has the most moronic saving system of pretty much any game ever?
I think someone should make a romhack where saving through the Song of Time doesn't lose you your items (it doesn't lose your key items so why the fuck should it lose your ammo?), and also where saving works exactly the same as in Ocarina. Just these two changes would instantly make the game a hell of a lot better, and only then could it ever be considered in the same breath as Ocarina (but of course, owing to its lack of content and clearly rushed implementation, it would still lose comprehensively, obviously).
Anthony Parker
>I think if the game is as brain dead easy and has no complexity it's a better game!
Because the saving system doesn't actually get in the way. It's a retarded nitpick that only makes any difference if the game crashes.
John Scott
Is MM overrated at the end of the day? Yes. Is OoT still GOAT? Yes. Are both better than WW? YES.
Jack Perry
Wind Waker unironically has the best soundtrack out of any Zelda game
Michael Williams
Fuck no, OoT
Carson Brown
*still has the most catchy and memorable tracks in the series.
Nicholas Morales
OoT is basic as fuck, save for some of the dungeon themes
Austin Howard
neither of them are any fun to play
Noah Adams
Well I played both at release and vastly prefered Majora. So this entire argument is wrong and MM is confirmed better.
Camden Brooks
haven't played a single Zelda game and never will.
Hudson Ramirez
Majora's Mask is the only Zelda game I like even a little bit because the mechanics are interesting and the aesthetics are spooky and bizarre. Any argument criticizing MM invariably is predicated on the assumption that you like the Zelda formula to begin with, which I don't.
Parker Morris
There’s nothing as good or creative as Gerudo Valley, Underneath the Village or the Forest Temple in WW.
What MM has in sidequests and world building is worth far more than what OoT has and the masks were always interesting/fun to use. The dungeons were also far less linear and the entire game had really unique/interesting designs for its locations. They're practically even on soundtrack and combat, but everything else boosts MM over OoT for me.
Noah Morris
>This game clearly didn't have a lot of development time and it shows. >lack of content and clearly rushed implementation The game's short development cycle and unchangeable release date is the only reason it ended up being interesting.
Noah Ortiz
>Every game should have every control inverted (so left is right and right is left), and it should change controls RANDOMLY every five minutes. You thought RT was shoot? Well now it's B ya dumb fuck. What's to complain about? Don't you want a challenging game?
>If a game forces you to leave your console on and hope that nobody touches it or else - SORRY, you lost all your progress! - then that's a GOOD thing! >If a game pointlessly takes away all of your items upon saving, forcing you into a repetitive and time-consuming grind every time you start the game up, that's a GOOD thing! >Bad game design forcing the user to engage in repetitive mundane housekeeping tasks for a few minutes EVERY TIME THEY START THE GAME is a GOOD thing! My time isn't valuable at all because I'm a complete loser!
>I'm an MM moron and, just like every other MM moron, I will simply refuse to acknowledge objective facts! Because, see, that's the only way that the idiotic idea of MM being better than OoT could ever be correct: if you ignore objective reality. Yes, ignore the significantly higher review scores for OoT across the most authoritative review score aggregators out there. Yes, ignore the higher sales. Ignore every facet of objective reality: because it is only when you ignore reality that you could ever pretend that an objectively worse game is somehow "better" than on objectively superior one.
>Who cares if my car doesn't have brakes? That just makes it interesting!
>it's illegal to have opinions that aren't the same as mine
Isaiah Wilson
Completely disagree. OOT is certainly still worthy of a best of all time rating for being nearly a perfectly put together game, but among Zelda titles it has problems that Majora's Mask addresses.
Firstly you vastly overstate the quality of Ocarina's temples. The child dungeons are filler and are incredibly boring. The adult dungeons are by large okay, but they only amount to 5. Several like the forest temple and shadow temple are piss easy and take 10 minutes to do. LTTP for example demolishes OOT's dungeons in terms of difficulty, design and puzzles.
Meanwhile OOT has an empty overworld with any sense of depth absent. LTTP wrecks OOT in this regard as well. The overworld has plenty of secrets, depth and a density of content. Hyrule field in OOT is a flat fucking plane with nothing happening.
Why did I bring up LTTP when I'm going off talk about MM? Because MM tried to solve some issues that OOT had. The four dungeons in MM seem to be controversial; some love them and some dislike them. I'm in the camp where, when I was young I liked OOT's dungeons more "because they were easier". Going back to MM, all three feel like lategame OOT dungeons with about the same level of attention a the Spirit temple, or more. Stone Tower temple is the best 3D dungeon hands down in Zelda.
MM also addresses OOT's issue with an empty overworld and having barely any interesting secret items or upgrades. The NPCs and side quests bring about a level of density and interactivity that OOT was sorely lacking .
Logan Anderson
The 3DS remake solved the save system (it seriously needed to as a handheld) but they fucked with a bunch of the game's mechanics for no discernible reason mostly to negative effect.
Ayden Anderson
>OOT isn't dark remember, no sages
Jason Johnson
you're like the silly man from the I am silly comic but real
Landon Hill
@461905914 >outing yourself as a Wojak posting retard >not actually responding to any arguments >instead exaggerating the fuck out of any aspect someone disagreed with you on This shitty bait doesn't even deserve a (You).
I enjoyed both games desu. Hard to say which one is better. I think being able to fuck around with transformations puts MM ahead. I also didn't ever feel the weight of that timer after getting the time slowing song, but I also didn't bother with too many sidequests.
Juan Rogers
>game not letting you save scum like the filthy casual you are is equal to the controls being fucked up
Who knew MM making you sit and play a full game loop was a casual filter? I didn't.
