When a boss is almost impossible because they don't follow the rules of the game...

when a boss is almost impossible because they don't follow the rules of the game, isn't that bad game design than genuinely challenging?

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what rules does Butterfly break?

Actually being easy when every other boss in the game is difficult.

The game has been out for like 3 months.
I'm sure at this point some autist has done a no-hit no-upgrade speedrun in 30 minutes or less

>it's a "dark souls players call a sekiro boss impossible" episode because they can't just whack the boss up front

learn to parry

This.
I was autistic and hated sekiro for a week until it clicked for me.

Stop dark soulsing and start Metal Gear Rising.

>learning to parry and dodge attacks is breaking the game's rules
I cheated through the entire game, apparently

What boss might you be taking about? At least not Butterfly

>can literally be stunlocked to death by just dodging to the side and attacking over and over

Yeah, sure it is, not sure why you posted a pic from Sekiro though

OP you haven't answered and I am genuinely curious, what rules of the game do you think she breaks?

Not OP but the optimal strat for this boss is literally spamming dodge R1 like it's Bloodborne, which is what people allude to when they call this a bad boss. It's fine but it shouldn't be the very first boss in a game that's trying to teach you to not play like souls.

Wrong. Parrying is the optimal strategy

dodging some attacks to punish for vitality damage is a very valid tactic all throughout sekiro though
it's far quicker to kill butterfly with posture damage after chipping down her vitality a bit

I'm a shitter and this was my first boss. Died like 30 or 40 times but after I beat her I was better at the game. She and Genichiro was truly hard bosses considering how early they appear in the game.

Lady Butterfly is "Sekiro 101: The Boss". If you hadn't had it beaten into you by the time you get to her, she is nothing but a parry instructor. Not only that but before you fight her you get a literal tooltip telling you how vitality affects posture. And not only that, but she puts all those early game loading screen tips about the shuriken into practical use since you can knock her out of the air for free damage every single time she goes up. In fact I found the optimal strategy to aggressively attack her until she parries, parry her counter attack, and then keep on her. It's not the game's fault you play like pussies or look up guides

>when a boss is almost impossible because they don't follow the rules of the game
Wrong pic OP

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You're a fucking idiot and should kill yourself. You didn't even grasp what is a sekiro boss and what isn't. The only bosses that could be labelled as breaking the rules are blazing bull and demon of hatred because they rely more on dodging than parrying.

>everyone says to use snap beans.
>its actually easier to kill the spirit and use them for more shuriken aerial counters.
ok

>Everyone says 2 apes are hardest
>they are actually significantly weaker/easier than guardian ape
wtf?

>everyone skips headless
>late game they are a cake walk
huh?

>everyone says to cheese Isshin
>it's actually easier to counter him and destroy his poise.

So a lot of people are bad a Sekiro i guess and spread these shit tactics and info.

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How could you find guardian ape harder than 2 apes? The only missing moves 2 apes have is the shit toss and and roll grab, which are both insanely easy to get away from.

Stop using Ichimonji because it is a crutch.

I wish you could get rid of the warning symbol. People should be bitching to have a game play mode without it.

What moves should I be using then? Ichi is the only useful one I've unlocked so far.

>Lady Butterfly is "Sekiro 101: The Boss". If you hadn't had it beaten into you by the time you get to her, she is nothing but a parry instructor.

False.
Sekiro 101 the boss is Genichiro.
He is the absolute skill check and you will not get past him until you at least grasp the mechanics.

>when a boss is almost impossible because they don't follow the rules of the game

That's why I kill him by not following the rules of the game ;)

Agreed. The purpose of Lady Butterfly is to, whether you beat her early on or not, teach you that lowering vitality is important before you try to actually break a boss' posture.

Literally anything else. Some favourites are Mortal Draw, Shadowfall, One Mind and Dragon Flash. If you're not a shitter, your own posture doesn't matter too much because a successful deflect will never posture break you regardless of your posture.

>everyone says to cheese Isshin
>it's actually easier to counter him and destroy his poise.
Which isshin?
I think the hardest boss in the entire game is Shura ending isshin because his timings are just weird for me to get a handle on. I usually find myself sprint poking him to death.

You can sprint poke Sword Saint to death too I guess, if you hate fun.

I literally use nothing but whirlwind because the damage is so ridiculously OP

There's only 1 thing in this game that I would call bad game design and that's having to fight Genichiro before Isshin.
It's retarded. There's no need to waste time on him, especially since he's a pushover. Him being a pushover can easily tilt someone because he's just an unnecessary addition that you have to fight EVERY TIME before getting to the actual damn boss. Couple that with the cutscene that you have to skip everytime and it just gets annoying.

They should've had us fighting him once and the cutscene played once also, and on subsequent fights just let us battle Isshin straight away. Buff him a little if you have to. But Genichiro can really fuck off.

Sword Saint is much harder than Fire Isshin because of the spear phase hyperarmour. Fire Isshin does have his dodge, but that is very easily punishable by dodging his counterattack. You can interrupt his fire AOE with a combat art or firecrackers, though the fight is harder if you're doing an R1-only run.

Bosses shouldnt follow the "rules of the game", theyre unique exceptional fights that need to stand out from the normal encounters. Where have you been the past 30+ years?

>Sword Saint is much harder than Fire Isshin because of the spear phase hyperarmour.

See, everyone says this and I still don't know what it means.
Like are you literally spamming R1 and he's poising through your shit? Stop doing that.
Just whiff punish moves that make him turn his back to you, like when he misses his dragon flash or ashina cross, or mikiri his poke

idiot, she was there to fucking teach you the rules of the game

>got him to final phase my first attempt WITH the demon bell active
yeah nah you're just dogshit.

I just killed owl 2 while demon belled without any heals allowed

it's funny, when I started playing sekiro I fucking hated this game, I hated that enemies would aimbot their sword whenever I dodged, I hated that I couldn't level up when I wanted and I hated that I couldn't use different weapons

but then I got gud and now I'm here, it's fucking stunning how much you can counter bosses in this game, they are so highly interactive it feels like sekiro has learned from breath of the wild more than any other developer in recent memory

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mortal blade > one mind > high monk > ashina cross > spiral passage

the rest is useless shit for weebs

>shadowrush
>shadowrush
>shadowrush
>shadowrush
>shinobi execution

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You're thinking of Demon of hatred when it comes to not following rules, but he's still fine. Butterfly is a great boss since she teaches you how to git gud.

I find it highly doubtful that you had Shadowrush unlocked when you fought him for the first time.

Nigger, isn't this literally the boss that TEACHES you about the dodge+R1 tactic? As in, there's a thing that tells you how to do it before the battle begins?

Isn't it extremely naive to think you both fully understand and have mastered all the rules of a game in the first half hour and that they have to only be as constrained and pidgeonholed as you can imagine and handle?

kek

Headless ape is easier than his regular counterpart but when there's 2 of them, the brown one is easy to take out quickly despite having the more annoying moveset.

I deflected a bit then did jumping ichimonjis. You can also use shuriken prosthetic to knock her down. and make use of double head jumps.

>everyone says to use snap beans.
They do? I just run around and ignore the illusions until they get shot at you

Guardian ape is a bit harder (at least at headless) because of how much stuff is tossed at you for him as a boss. The two apes are relatively weaker because they don't really attack you simultaneously and Brown ape is easy to take care of. Basically by the time you're fighting both apes, it's not that different than fighting the one ape from earlier

Yeah this. Brown ape has a ridiculously small health and posture, and she's wide open for attack when the white ape stops to REEEEEEE at you

You can literally spam R1 for every other humanoid boss in the game, wait for them to deflect it, then deflect their counterattack. Being able to spam R1 is easier than not being able to spam R1. I know how to deal with him, but that doesn't make him easier than other bosses.

The feeling I get mid-late game when I'm literally just rushing like a madman on a mission through the parts I was trying to sneak through before is so fucking liberating

>Fight several mini bosses near cliffs
>repeatedly try and fail to knock them down
>it's clear they've been literally programmed to not falls off cliffs even when pushed or attacked
>fight Armored Warrior who must literally be pushed off cliff

Stupid. Which is a shame because it would've been fun to figure out on my own. I assumed knocking down the walls on the bridge was just an attempt to handicap the player, since sprinting off the edge is easy, and it's encouraged to put distance between you and him

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she's really, really, really, REALLY easy. I'm not being a cunt, she's just misleading. look up some fuzzy bearbarian tutorials, he exposes how manageable most bosses are.

What was his fucking problem?

Came here to post this, wtf OP.

autistic rage since his son is ded

I beat him entirely by accident on my second try while I was just experimenting against him.

When she jumps up into the air?
Shurikens. She falls down and doesn't complete that bullshit wrestling move.

Honestly this boss was stupid.
>eavesdrop guards saying they fitted an armor on a big guy
>game tells you about a spear prosthetic that can strip armor off foes
>stumble upon this guy
>he clearly doesn't die so you go get the spear
>it actually doesn't do shit at all and you have to make him fall despite it not being a thing anywhere else in the game
I don't even recall which enemies can lose their armor because that shit's so useless.

So did he die when he fell off the bridge, or is he still alive and immortal at the bottom of a chasm somewhere?

Just get better lol.

Not that guy but not only was Shadowrush one of the first things I unlocked because "muh stinger", I also got lost on the way to Genichiro several times and basically did everything else in the damn game until progress was halted by Genichiro not being beaten yet

Any tips on Demon of Hatred? I got the fire umbrella but I'm having trouble managing my resources, by the end of the second phase I'm totally out of heals.

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Literally the easiest boss in the game
She's Pursuer-tier cheese
Just shoot a shuriken at her when she goes into the air
Pathetic

I beat her on the second try, I only does the first time because I relied on snapseeds when I ran out on the second try it was arguably easier

The fffffFUCKING PHANTOM CORRUPTED MONK CAN EAT A FUCKING DICK

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The fuck are you on about, deflecting and keeping pressure wrecks her posture. Only boss you need to focus on dodge and r1 is demon of hatred

This this this. I did too and I even made a thread about being incredibly disappointed in it. Then after the middle Genichiro fight everything just works. lol at the retards who were agreeing with me. This game is awesome, easily my second favorite From game.

Wrong. The purpose of Lady Butterfly is to teach you how to use shurikens.

It's just a really shitty boss.
LITERALLY just
>sprint around the arena waiting for him to whiff
>run up and hit him a few times
>repeat

I killed him legit once. I will cheese his ass off the cliff every single time from now on.

learn his moves and keep trying, take some breaks or else you'll get into a rut though

I tired that and got my shit kicked in tough I never played BB so maybe that knowledge was missing. I found it way easier to parry and use shuriken on her in the end.

>tfw if you kill the white ape first then the black ape just loses the will to live, sits down and disappears as you slaughter her spouse

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learn his patterns and try to keep yourself under his ass for most of the fight
the main issue with DoH is that you have to keep moving and avoid his fire attacks
you can easily parry his stomps and the malcontent whistle stuns him for few seconds
when he does his bomb run away and jump before he hits the ground
you can grapple to him to avoid getting hit

Just circle around him (I can't remember which side, it's think it's his lead leg). He'll miss pretty much all of his attacks.

nigga i just used a trainer after the 38th try

>tough I never played BB
count yourself lucky because like every From game between DaS1 and Sekiro, it's mediocre

I had it tough I missed most of the other arts you could pick up before fighting him so I had almost the whole tree unlocked by the time I was on the top castle floor.

Genichiro is there to remind you about deflecting a succession of quick attacks. The two most recent bosses you've fought before Isshin are either slow as fuck (monk) or a gimmick that doesn't involve deflect at all (dragon). If you fought demon beforehand, reminding you about deflecting is even more important

If they're close enough one bean beats them all. Or you can just around in a big circle around the area and they never catch you.

Oh god I'm on this guy. Is there anything to do but run around him and pressing R1? I get hit by every single attack that actually can hit me because it's so boring that I'm zoned out by the time the attack comes out.
I love this game but holy shit is every single boss that you have to kill from vitality a slog.

>is the one boss that isn't killed by deathblowing, but instead staggers back in an exaggerated motion every time.
>can't figure out how to beat him
o lawd.

not as sad as gyoubu's horse

You want to stop the monks from immortality shit.
He still thinks his son is getting treatment and not just fucking dead from an attempt at a divine child of rejuvenation. If you get past the bridge, he thinks his son will die. I cried a bit when he fell.

gyoubu didn't fuck his horse probably

Fugg man. I also felt bad when I found one of the old hags in Ashina castle cowering in the corner while I was fighting another dude, until that point I had just slaughtered them without realising they don't fight back.

Don't listen to this guy , we have a lot of autistic versionfags on this site due to constant bait and troll posts, Bloodborne and all the other Souls games are awesome.

You mean the guards who are in a totally different location, explicitly talking about POORLY fitting armor, like the one on the three different fat guys right next to them? How retarded do you have to travel two hours away from two chucklefuck in Ashina and somehow think they're talking about the clearly extremely well armed and armored guardian of a Sengoku Temple?

no they don't fight back but call more samurai
they are guilty by association thats why they must die

>Sister asks what the old ladies do since the first thing I do when I run into a room is kill them.
>"I don't know and I don't want to find out.'
>mfw they do nothing

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vinny beat her in like 5 tries

Or the sisters at Fountainhead Palace

>Be an old nurse who has dedicated her life to healing and easing the pains of the brave men who give their life to the freedom of your homeland in the face of an overwhelming tyranny
>Murdered without a second thought by a rogue Shinobi infiltrating the castle

Ashina...had a hard life

It's really not unreasonable to think that a game might expect you to remember something for further down the road.

MY NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAME

he's not immortal, he was seeking immortality for his son who is likely dead

461585960
What made you feel like you were welcome to reply to me, tastelet?

It is when the thing they're clearly actually talking about is a massively different thing that's five steps away from them.

>he's not immortal, he was seeking immortality for his son who is likely dead

he keeps getting back up

>There are "people" who turned the English dub on and didn't immediately turn it off after hearing the first lines of dialogue.

Because your blade doesn't pierce his armor on the deathblow.

>implying your sword can pierce his armor

Because your sword can't pierce his armor. Go back and read the dialogue in that fight, he spends the entire time bragging about his armor.

the boss is designed to force you to learn to parry, brainlet

he's in big fucking armour and chainmail your shit tier japanese katana can't pierce, he even tells you that

Cheese him by having fall of the cliff. You'll feel bad but beating the last boss legitimately will solve that, since he kills you way faster than the demon and actually requires perfecting the game mechanics to beat

its actually designed to teach you when to dodge ie almost never except for gimmick shit like her fight

Phantom Corrupted Monk just takes time. Just hit and then run away for a while.

>mfw I have to fight this nigger 3 goddamn times

This is bullshit

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Less hp more boosts for sekiro and i memorized movements at that point.

patched eons ago

>can be stunlocked to death
>can be lured into suicide
you shouldn't allowed to do this but I'm glad you can, at least for the demon since that jump is almost more difficult than fighting the boss

any boss/enemy that does the lightning attack is a free win since lightning reversal shits on them so hard

he's piss easy and the fucking tutorial boss

The first two phases are exactly the same and can be easily learned, and then his third is laughably easy if you just use lighting reversal.

lol just spam firecrackers and ashes idiot

Wrong. I did it two days ago on the latest patch. Get him stuck on the edge, use one of the towers to climb to the gate's roof and stand on the corner directly above it. Demon will throw itself down the cliff and die

aged mist raven obliterates this joker

nobody cares faggot cheater lmfao!

nope, i just did it the other day. get him stuck on the tree

>he wasted his time fighting the demon

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>have almost all of the achievements just playing the game normally
>kinda want to finish it off for completionist sake
>would have to grind 40+ skill points
I think that one's just gonna sit there

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These threads are starting to follow the exact same trends as every Dark Souls game, where over time, shitters will progressively claim they knew every exploit, every pattern, knew what every item effected what, and therefore beat every single boss in under three tries, all on their first play through, with no tips or hints.

nigga she so fucking easy
you'll figure it out and later in the game you'll definitely be like "damn I wish everything was as easy as butterfly was"

just finish the game bunch of times
each NG+ cycle gives almost double the xp

No

git gud. I haven’t even played this game but your whining is obvious.

>Hit her 3 times, Deflect, repeat until 2nd phase.
>2nd phase go below the base of the buddha statue and attack her as soon as she appears. You just interrupted her ghost goblin summons. hit her 3 times, deflect, repeat until dead.
Sure user, impossible.

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parry her combo, it never changes and it does huge posture damage
if you're too shitter to do that, just dodge/jump on the second slash of her combo and she'll miss completely miss the rest and be open for free hits
throw shurikens when she's in the air or on that wire (she'll block them if she's already facing you)
when you get to the second phase, you can just run around in circles until the illusions disappear, then do the same thing you did for the first phase

>be dumb fucking fag and make a post about how "dissapointed in Sekiro" you are
>Actually git gud and play the game correctly

Literally game journalist tier. I hope you atleast cringe at the memories.

>it never changes
It does. She has a 3 hit and a 4 hit. Still not hard.

Every now and then there's an enemy near a shrine that's worth a fucktonne more exp than usual, I'm almost certain it's for grinding exp, which is dumb as hell but after getting all the other achievements after 2 1/2 runs, it only took about half an hour of grinding to finish off.
The two I know about are the monk-ninja cunt in the river just behind the Mibu Village idol, and the monk-ninja guy right after the Upper Tower - Antechamber idol once Ashina's aflame.

Name a more overrated game this year than Sekiro.

Whatever you prefer.

my anus

Butterfly is the skill check boss to make sure you learned how to parry properly, it's pretty obvious that parrying her is the easiest and most efficient way to beat her.

I'm pretty sure every boss follows the rules of the game in Sekiro fine, Lightning Spear is still garbage in a game without Faith and Miracles, and the bosses can be death blowed as much as we want to get our frustration out.

I can't
youtu.be/1sP6S3Gve2w

KH3

demon of hatred is the only boss whos actual bullshit and its just because he has so much health that fighting him is a fucking chore

Red umbrella, Divine Confetti, and health shaving attack boost. Approach him by his right side.

that game is getting shit on

>tfw I died to him a dozen times, went back to him after beating sword saint and killed him on the first try
weird how one memory makes that much of a difference

How can the game of the year be overrated?

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just finished ng+6 no charm bell demon
AMA

>be bad
>cry and bitch in Yea Forums

Same, but I only used the shuriken prosthetic, no sword.

>tfw pretty much never replay games but I really want to continue playing Sekiro
Maybe I should.

How do you beat Owl (Father)? I'm on NG+, guy's pushing my shit in

and deathblows/finishers?

Whats your biggest issue with him?
A lot of his attacks are slow enough to parry easily, his 2hit into firecrackers is best dodged into his left and getting some vitality damage in

Phase 2 run around like mad to avoid his dumb owl teleportation bullshit that makes him unhittable in the middle of his own combos

what do i even do when fire isshin does his initial fire attack when he goes into the second phase? that shit goes everywhere.

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Kh3 was great

Just, how aggressive he is. He's super fucking fast. When I fought him ontop of Ashina, I would usually wait to hit him when he did his kick, used the bomb thing that makes you unable to heal, and when he jumps over you.

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Your only option at that point is to go faster yourself

Firecrackers are useful, can let you get some free hits in if you need a breather.

I fucking hate the MGR parry system, is it different in Sekiro?

Yes
dedicated L1/LB to block/parry

Umbrella is your friend if everything else fails

Its been done under 24 minutes a week after release.

It's okay I'm playing on the oldest version.
But also yeah, that's the sculptor bro and I need to give him closure.

I made that thread hopeful that I'd find a solution to all my problems with the game and be cringing at it right now. So it was actually a massive success.

She's easy, I haven't lost to her once.

I think I'm getting his pattern down a bit. When the red kanji symbol happens besides the Mikiri, I jump above him, hit him twice, wait for his double Ichimoji or whatever, and then get a few more hits in

I kind of want an end game refight. All the other old people are fucking terrifying; she was too until I beat her. Never learned what her deal is.

Honestly I'm loving this game because I'm a huge shitter and it takes me back to when I played ninja gaiden on the NES and just banged my head against the wall. Currently stuck on the Drunkard, I realized that there is a helpful NPC after 2 full hours of attempts. I'm having a blast because I can actually see what I'm doing wrong and I fail to improve because my brain shits itself when specific inputs are required like jumping for sweeping attacks, I may be slightly retarded

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Okay or not, all of a sudden the guy is doing a sweep attack following the red kanji thing, I'm about to fucking murder someone, I am seriously pissed off.

I'm really glad the default for people playing this was Japanese. I was worried too many would think palying Japanese was the weeb option

I was stuck there too. Just kill everyone, run away, sneak attack juzuo, then get the guy to help. You're a ninja who's outnumbered and overpowered, the proper way to play the game is to be as dangerously cheesy as possible.

As much as I want muh honorabru duel, I figured out this tactic after a while, will try it tomorrow with fresh mind and reflexes

picture very fucking unrelated right?

>Give everyone dragonrot letting the fish qts kick attack me over and over again
I have no regrets.

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>platinum the game and stop playing
>weeks later get the itch to continue when other games (except bloodborne) just aren't doing it for me.
The animations and sound makes such a difference in a game being fun, it's crazy

Isn't Hirata optional, despite being available early? I understand you might've not know this the first time, but why some of you faggots kept getting stuck there when you could've go make progress in Outskirts? The ogre is tough, sure, but there's no way you got stuck in that as well.
I admit I made my priority to kill Lady Buterfly first, just because I hated that bitch. And, sure, I died a lot too, but I never EVER thought the battle was impossible or unfair, just challenging. The possibilities were there, I was learning the ins and outs of the mechanics, until it clicked.
>BOO HOO I couldn't kill her in my fifth attempt so it's bad design
Fuck off

>people complain about video games getting easier as years go by
>legit challenging games come out
>people realize they were never good at vidya to begin with, so they have to backpedal a bit
>start using "unbalance" and "bad design" as buzzwords to cope with the cruel fact that they suck
How does it feel to prove the industry right?

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Honestly the earliest parts of the game are the hardest. You can't really expect anyone besides people who have been playing the genre for years to understand what they're doing until they beat Genichiro. Gyoubu has too much super armor to teach you anything. The chained ogre too. The general samurai, shinobi hunter and drunkard have too many adds for somebody to ram their head at them until they get some genuine time to practice against an opponent that forces them to learn. The first general comes before you even get tutorials on perilous attacks. By the time you even get to Lady Butterfly you've been trained by the game to be careful and defensive because every single boss and some adds up to this point have had hyper armor attacks that punish you for keeping pressure up and being aggressive.

>beaten the game four times
>mfw Chained Ogre is still one of the hardest bosses for me
That one throw that comes out near instantaneously is an instant kill, it's so stressful that I end up playing the poke game.

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i found out you can just smack him out of the animation. fuck his final phase though. dumb flame trail shit.

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LONE SHADOW NIGGAS

>use gachiins spiritfall to backstabbu his first healthbar away
>use yashariku spiritfall straight after
>flame vent -> living force and keep whacking him
>he universally grabs me once
>Loyal wolf, take my blood and live again
>get back up and finish him off
faggot ogre

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what rules?

>literally the first boss in the game
>"doesn't follow the rules of the game"
what the fuck are you talking about?