Do you expect bossfights in every game you play?

do you ever stop talking like this or is it just hardwired at this point?

That boss was bullshit but fuck if I said I didn't enjoy beating it

Tell us how you really feel user

depends on the genre

This would have been good bait 5 years ago. Now it's just so expected.

what if instead of fighting and killing the player witnessed another person in need and had to help them in order to progress? this could be something as simple as picking up and returning an item that another character dropped or talking to a character about an emotional issue they are experiencing.

Certain genres like strategy games and stealth games have mechanics that can't rally support boss fights.

Fire Emblem is an example of this. Bosses don't pose any threat whatsoever, because they remain glued to the gate/throne they're guarding, so you can just have all your characters surround them and take potshots at them.

The boss fights in the MGS games have some of the worst gameplay I've experienced. The MGS controls are completely unsuited to action, yet the boss fights force you into playing it like an action game.

Depends on the genre and how they're designed. In shovelware jrpgs like Neptunia and such, most bosses are pretty much a stat check. In action games like DMC or GoW, the options a player has to handle the boss are huge because of their toolkit.

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Such as yume nikki?

Depends on of they are well implemented
Dark Souls wouldn't be nearly as good without its bosses, but if it's basically a normal enemy turned into a damage sponge, don't bother

The real drama is that this would become true to some people one day.

bait? I'm trying to raise the level of conversation and see games become more than just macho death simulators for under sexed adolescent boys. games have potential to tell real stories and convey deeper messages than just "kill the monster."

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Is quake as fun as the original doom games i've been tempted to try it and it looks like the layout/controls are pretty much the same as wolfenstein/doom

Depends on the genre, they're the best parts of games like DMC or God hand but are shit in things like stealth games.

that's a dumb question because it depends on the game.
they aren't obligatory but they are good obstacles to test your skills. that is, if the game in question requires any skill to actually play.

Any game with combat is going to have bosses to show that off, but I don't think mandatory bosses need to exist (especially in games that try to be open world). Bosses probably do more to confine level or world design and limit modding ability than they do to improve game experience.

Whether bosses are good or not depends on the gameplay.
They generally take the role of a test for your skills, most often testing what the previous levels/areas have been teaching you.

Bosses suck in a lot of FPS because they're generally about learning to deal with different mooks in different environments. That turns the boss fights into wave fights, which are usually disappointing as a climactic battle, or into 1v1's with shitty forced gimmicks to prevent you from just using cover to win instantly.

Like take the Flagship from FTL as an example. It tests you on how well you built your ship and how well you can deal with a bunch of different situations. It feels good to kick its ass.

But then look at Deus Ex: HR. The boss fights there have very little to do with the main gameplay and are completely fucking awful because of that.

>boss fights are too video gamey and reinforce patriarchical skill-based gaming tropes
>boss fights are too video gamey
>video gamey
>reinforce patriarchical skill-based gaming tropes
That's what video games are you faggot moron zoomer. Neck yourself!

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Metroid Prime has tons of fantastic bosses despite being a FPS.

There's no excuse other than developer laziness to come up with a boss or at least something equivalent to a boss (a check of how well you've learned the mechanics that acts as the climax).

>replying seriously to sarcasm

I highly recommend it. It's an absolute classic game just like Doom.

a good game with no boss fights is better than a good game with shit boss fights

good game with good bosses > bad game with good bosses > good game with no bosses > good game with bad bosses > bad game with no bosses > bad game with bad bosses

Well the thing is bosses sometimes feel out of place in some games. In RE 2 most of the skills required don't involve shooting something till it dies, but managing supplies and risk. You're made to feel like an ordinary, helpless person but then they dump a giant nigga on you and you're supposed to become an avenger

Enemies tend to be a lot more bullet spongey than Doom and there's less of them, but that doesn't mean it's bad.

I'd like your opinions: What makes a good bossfight? What makes a bad bossfight?

I'll take no bosses if there are loads of different types of enemies

This. I love bosses but sometimes they just don't fit in the gameplay.

RE is a mixture of inventory management, juking monsters, and solving stupid ass puzzles

The bosses in Remake 2 are almost all good because they reinforce all of the above.

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But look at all the other mechanics Metroid Prime has other than just shoot dudes with gun.

The giant plant boss at the beginning of MP1 is more advanced and interesting than the vast majority of FPS bosses.

not scripted
no adds
no hit this specific spot
no billions hp for no reason other than waste time

Not every game but most games, yes. Boss fights (or even difficult and memorable encounters that serve the same role) are integral to video games and I usually feel really hollow and empty when a game doesn't give me satisfying encounters like bosses to get past.

i think the most common bad bossfights are bulletsponges fights. Also, the ones where you have to run around them like an idiot. You often get both

>Metroid Prime has tons of fantastic bosses despite being a FPS.
Are you kidding me? Metroid Prime has some of the worst boss fights I've ever experienced in an FPS.

Bosses are boring HP sponges that barely even move and are basically stationary and boil down to 'scan for weak spot and wait for boss to open their sphincter to reveal their weak spot. Aftr a few shots, enemy closes their sphincter and periodically opens it again, allowing you to get a few more shots. Rinse and repeat about a billion times'.

Secondly, Metroid Prime has lock-on, negating the need to aim. So there's not even any challenge associated with aiming while moving. You just lock-on and button mash.

Metroid Prime's combat in generally is pretty bad. Absurdly small FOV, literal tank controls, arbitrary camera restrictions (e.g. can't look up or down while moving), no such thing as managing ammo, etc.

Okay thanks i'll probably just get it after I get my laptop fixed lol

Bosses are vital to resident evil games, they're the things you need to be saving your bullets and healing items for. Sometimes they go too far with it like in Code Veronica but it's important to have the big monsters that exhaust your supplies in order to keep tension going

>sarcasm

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>no adds
What's wrong with adds? Having to juggle between priorizing the boss himself and his minions is a great mechanic.

>Good
Tests your skills in an interesting way. Typically with a new powerup or weapon. Or introduces gimmicks or patterns exclusive to the boss itself that require you figuring out what the best way to beat him is.
>Bad
Giant bullet sponge bosses that just require you to hit or shoot them a lot. When a boss requires a specific gimmick like a new powerup, it can sometimes revolve around using it in a bad way. Like just hitting them with the new power, then hitting them with normal attacks. That's a shitty way to make it useful.

>What makes a good bossfight?
The boss tests your abilities beyond blindly rushing them
Story-wise, they're built up as someone you really want to battle and can deliver a good fight

Generation zyklon arent the sjws you dumb nigger

No. Yume Nikki defied all conventions of video game design 15 years ago and it was pure kino.

It can be fine with some bosses. I just find that there are games where every boss ends up being minion rushes with the 'boss' itself being a slightly tougher goon.

>playing Tales of Destiny 1
>like 10 hours in
>"boss fights" are just groups of regular enemies that aren't any harder than regular encounters
>lose interest and stop playing

what the hell happened

Metroid Prime is more of an adventure game in the first person than an FPS.
Problem solving and observation skills are regularly used in that game, so the boss fights can reasonably be a test of those skills, as a kind of deadly puzzle.
Some shooters will instead opt for a kind of boss level, a whole level that contains more difficult setups that are meant to overwhelm the player. I think that's a reasonable replacement.

The aha moment when you understand what you have to do, whether it's exploit a weakness or learn how to avoid a certain attack, and then the balance associated with completing that task. You want a boss to be difficult, but doable once you understand it. If it's too hard even after you understand what you're doing it's because the boss has some actual bullshit, and if it's too easy you may gloss over it or avoid the "aha moment" entirely. It's a tight rope that requires a lot of resources and a good understanding of what mechanics you're pushing in a game, hence why so many game developers don't get it right.