Do you prefer the new open-world style for 3D Zelda...

>LoZ actually has some degree of item gating and the world itself is far more condensed. In LoZ you actually have to explore every nook and cranny in order to beat the game
you haven't actually played LoZ, have you?
and you have the balls to call me an idiot, for shame.

>BotW's and LoZ's world design are almost nothing alike.

Of course not. One is a top-down 2D gane and the other is a real-time 3D world. The game design involved in these two states is an absolute chasm in difference of what the developers expect from the player.

The point is that BotW is a very obvious attempt to return to spirit of the original game, with a focus on exploration, freedom and hidden secrets.

This is blatantly obvious to everyone except assmad shitters who don't want to accept it because they fear that if they do, they'll somehow legitimise BotW.

BotW was a great game and a step in the right direction. I hope to see another Zelda game like it but probably with less weapons breaking

>no other genre except open world can have a focus on exploration, freedom and hidden secrets

We're talking about Zelda games.

and literally all of them have had a pretty heavy focus on exploration freedom and hidden secrets

I just need proper dungeons. The dungeons was always my favourite part of Zelda games.

Ever since ALLTP the past they've become steadily more and more linear.

I want them to go to a mix of the two.
>Several large sandbox locations all surrounding a hub section
The regions were great... but there's a shit ton of wasteland with nothing in it. Not enemies, not Koroks, nothing.

Replace those 150 shitty shrines with 20 solid dungeons and BOTW would of been near perfect.

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Mix the two together.
>BOTW's open world exploration
>Traditional LOZ dungeons with actual items from each dungeon
I loved BOTW but I miss the weird gadgets and items you could get in previous titles. The runes were great, but I want items on top of the runes.

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the game has nice varied locations but goddamn they are boring, you never feel like you're finding stuff when you encounter a shrine, bokoblin camp or chest or korok seeds

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I just want a new art style that isn't cel shading or pseudo Ghibli.

I miss the hookshot. Imagine using the hookshot and paraglider together like Just Cause.

Then you wouldn't have had enough things to look for in the overworld.

Fucking this.

It'd break the fucking game as it is, but if they built it from the ground up like this it'd be fun as hell.

>linear games can't have a focus on exploration, freedom and hidden secrets
so we're back to the original argument

I don't fucking care
I enjoy solid level design, fluid, varied combat, and challenge that isn't artificial (numerical).
BotW is the antithesis to all of these concepts, so it can fuck right off, and the Amiibo-locked series' staple horse it rode in on.

OOT and MM are the only 3D Zelda games I like. I've played every game in the series.

Honestly the Divine Beasts and Hyrule Castle were still better than the 3D dungeons in most other Zelda games.

I think the next game should have more vertical design- underground areas and underwater areas.

it should have underground dungeons that are actually integrated with the world instead of taking place in some teleported rooms

>the Divine Beasts
>better than the 3D dungeons in most other Zelda games
how can someone have such a shitty opinion

open-world game design is a meme. it makes games worse, not better. what zelda needs to do is go back to the old linear structure, but experiment way more with the setting and the gameplay loop than they ever did pre-botw.
for example, a twewy/persona-inspired modern urban fantasy zelda would be pretty neat. or the zelda in space concept that they briefly considered during botw's development.
as for gameplay, maybe they could make a game where link, zelda and ganondorf are all playable and you have to switch between them to progress.
the reason why majora's mask and link's awakening are so well-liked are because they actually took risks. botw is as safe as it gets and so were all the oot-inspired zeldas except for mm.

>The point is that BotW is a very obvious attempt to return to spirit of the original game
is that why they catered to zoomers by removing all the dungeons?

do you even know what dungeons consisted of in zelda 1?

Enemies, mostly.
Ironically, Divine Beasts have none.
What was your point, again?

I think one more fuckhuge Zelda map with refinements would be enough for me, before the concept wore too thin. Afterwards I wouldn't mind a more linear game with a new shtick.

One more giant map with more advanced dungeons, more enemy variety, new traversal tools and proper postgame quests/bosses/areas would be a 10/10 for sure. My only significant gripe with BoTW would be the lack of endgame content due to the "all areas can be explored right at the start" gimmick. Also maybe gimp the food system so it heals at hot springs-speed, maybe? Once you have enough hearts literally nothing can defeat your food horde.

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The general means of traversing the world lack a lot of juice. Your glider is simply a linear descent based on your stamina when it would have been far more enticing to give the player more significant control. Climbing is just a simple stamina patience game and so is swimming.
What is the point of this tedium in the name of freedom?

In turn there is no reason to look for things in the overworld.
The entire game is based around gathering strength to face a villain who has literally no presence even in the final moments of the game by doing simple puzzles that Japanese game designers made for the chosen one. It doesn't matter where you wander because every area will have almost every red thread you can pull lead to some form of shrine and if you know what you will find at the end that's a huge letdown before you even set off.
You're not exploring some ancient temple, mine, forest or city, you're looking for Easter Eggs in your abnormally large backyard.
It is so significantly unappealing. An older game may have let you fill in the gaps with your imagination but a newer game that does fill in gaps on its own should put in more effort and that means a better structure since there is inherent satisfaction to be had in being able to pit yourself against a structure and come out on top each time to the point of subverting it completely if you can think of how to do it with the challenge ramping up as you go rather than to be meandering through a sandbox of optional objectives.

The Divine Beasts were pretty crap. The Camel was alright because it had a more complex puzzle that didn't solve itself but just handing you a full 3D map and the controls for the central gimmick constantly on hand kicks the need to plan and make mental maps out the window.
Hyrule Castle scratched the surface of what a BotW dungeon should look like and was the last thing to do in the game.

>is that why they catered to zoomers by removing all the dungeons?

Tell me about your favourite dungeon from Zelda 1. Was it the one where you pushed a block to open a door? That was my fave too.

>can't climb into or inside of Divine Beasts
>can't climb towers
>can climb Hyrule Castle, therefore missing the entire level
>can (optionally) climb the overworld, missing the design elements in place and potential enemy encounters that aren't explicitly trash mobs
remind me what the purpose of this unfun gimmick autistic tree climbing simulator was?

firstly, divine beasts do have a few enemies. Secondly, the aesthetic of shrines is very close to the aesthetic of LoZ dungeons. Also, botw has more focus on the overworld where enemies are in abundance. botw has issues with lacking enemy variety, though

I'd love to see a zelda game with combat implimented by Capcom's DMC team or Platinum

Every area should have had it's own dungeon. I remember getting excited at looking down at one of the big mazes from higher ground, bjt so disappointed to only find a shrine at the end that just gives you the orb. The shrine should have been a dungeon.

>I'd love to see a Zelda game made by Itsuno
Oh, you mean a video game.
Dragon's Dogma is as close as that'll ever come. Imagine if his team had the disposable income that Fujibayashi and Aonuma have squandered for two decades?

>out of just fucking around i got to the top of an unclimbable purple thing using ravioli's and waiting for the cooldown
>jump off and glide toward a doorway at the top of the castle
>cutscene gets triggered as i land and im fighting ganon
>it's a disappointing fight and i drop the game, never play it again
i got "you can do anything'd" out of what people always say is the best part of the game and i refuse to pick it back up.

I didn't really mind the enemy variety, rather their A.I. and moveset variety.
I'd fight Bokoblins all game if they were genuinely fun to fight and were unironically blocking my path, but they're not.
Emphasis on overworld, more like emphasis on MMO-tier design. Enemies never fuck with you unless you incidentally rub up against their kneecaps, and even then you can outpace them.
When all your gameplay is optional, it comes across as an afterthought, which it absolutely is.
Shifting gears completely, it's also increasingly frustrating to me that Half Life 2 can take flak for repetitive physics puzzles, but BotW can't. That being said, Shrines are fuckin' shite, and the Elephant was the only worthwhile Beast.
Game put me to sleep. The overworld is a beautiful setpiece. A cardboard set to a stageplay acted by mutes with the gameplay of a Piranha Bytes production.

But that wouldn't have worked with a world so big.

The 120 shrines could've made the most amazing 4 dungeons

But the exploration would've been reduced a LOT.
Honestly i like the way they handled that aspect of the game

hardmode, food system, inventory and armor systems are still fucking trash tough

to make it "accessible" to everyone just so they can skip any challenge. you can easily tell this because people with taste will tell you the raining sequence in zoras domain was one of the better parts of the game and shitters will say it was one of the worst.

>But that wouldn't have worked with a world so big.
do you have any reason whatsoever as to why you think this?

I want them to try it again, but to do it better.
BotW was already amazing, but to not try it again would be a ridiculous waste of potential because BotW had so much room for growth.

it's still by far the best AI and moveset variety enemies have had of any zelda game

Test of strength for the 50th time. Fuck the shrines.

The Ganon fight is kinda random. First time I did it all he used was his easily avoidable sword swipes, then died like a bitch. I did it a little later on and he was fucking stabbing at me with the little blue weapons, climbing the wall, spamming magnet poles, launching fireballs/lasers/tornadoes/ice blocks/spears, repeatedly stomped the ground, it was impressive how much he moved.

I think a health/speed buff and attacks that always do AT LEAST a significant percentage of damage would have made it much better. Plus maybe give him health regen even in normal mode.

Keep what they learned in BotW. Do a better job at production values and immersion. More traditional/ up kept modern Hyrule. Something as seen in childhood era OoT. No cheap, post apocalyptic cop out like BotW. Actual dungeons, better boss fights too and do a better job at making a more engaging script.

know what the funniest fucking part is? I shit you not, I completely missed that section where you follow Sidon and get the lore dump tablets.
I found a zora who told me to go find Sidon over yonder, but I just climbed up and over and then accidentally found the Domain.
Remember when games had designers? You could autogenerate this kind of "experience".

I don't care about zelda games, I care about vidya games.
Ocarina of Time didn't revolutionize Legend of Zelda games, it revolutionized video games. Let me know when they come back down to earth and remember what those are.

I mean, that's the game working as intended. Would you prefer it if the story just stalled when you hit the domain and you had to dick around the path until you found Sidon?

botw revolutionized videogames as well
gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-06-05-how-will-the-legend-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-change-the-open-world-paradigm

The most fun I had in this game was exploring Hyrule Castle. The master sword seemed like it would never break and if it did there were weapons always nearby like crazy.

I just went around dodging, sneak attacking and fighting everything. It was fucking great to not have to worry about weapons. The game should have always been like that.

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Does the Switch version of BOTW run a lot better than the Wii U version?

>Yea Forums cries for years that Zelda is stale and following a formula
>New Zelda is much different from previous games
>"GO BACK TO THE OLD FORMULA!"

I'm glad that you incels don't matter anymore.

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literally any dungeon from zelda 1 is better than copypaste shrine #5000, and they weren't even good.

yeah but oot actually revolutionized it and botw just "revolutionized" it by making an ubisoft game on nintendo and journalists finally having a game easy enough that they could beat it.

have you even read that article?

Holy fuck. Everyday. EVERY FUCKING DAY we have this SAME thread complaining about BOTW. The game is fun but flawed in that the world is super empty at times. Stop talking about this shit and move on

>Yea Forums cries for years that zelda's formula is getting stale
>nintendo switches to a different, but equally stale, formula
>"OMG MASTERPIECE!!! 97, COPE, SEETHE, SNOY, REPEAT!!!"

"A lot" would be pushing it but yeah, the framerate is better 95% of the time and I believe it runs at a higher resolution.

>Game's get designed worse and get stale because of it
>Try to fix it by throwing everything out, even central parts of the series' appeal

You don't fix things by going completely with the face value of fan feedback nor do you do it by doing a complete 180° turn, you apply your own discretion and put talented people to work and not Pajeets who can churn out topology and dozens of puzzle rooms constructed from a tileset.

>botw comes out
>everyone praises it by saying they went back to the old formula of the original games
huh

also
>Yea Forums is one person

if its that same faggy one botw drones always post with the witcher dev quoted in it then yes.

gmod came out in '04
these hacks they're interviewing and their short list of non-accomplishments are citing the freedom of BotW in its quote unquote emergent gameplay, while praising the freedom of the world's design to not pen the player in, even when it does exactly that when it needs, or rather wants to (Towers, Divine Beasts, Yiga Hideout).
They took long existing design work, added the context of Zelda's shallow lore and bottom-of-the-barrel combat, and this is revolutionizing?
It's worth noting that whomever penned this article is unfamiliar with video games, as they reference Just Cause as an FPS and LoZ as an RPG.
Check your sources, or cite some evidence of revolution, not some clickbait's theoreticals.

>Just Cause as an FPS
jesus christ

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I want From to make a Zelda game

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DELETE THESE!

sure you have

BotW is a great place to start, but some of the de-emphasized elements could be reintroduced.
>fewer shrines - they're fun but don't get to develop any ideas beyond introduction
>bigger dungeons, more if possible, stronger themeing
>dungeons have a "proper" order, but may be accessed out of sequence
>reintroduce a small amount of item gating - at least in the overworld, bonus points for being brave enough to put it in dungeons too
>reduce stagger on weapons - i managed to play nearly the whole game without learning how to actually do combat by sprinting up to everything and bashing it
>more enemy types

Taking inspiration from LoZ was a great move. I like the results so far and hope this direction continues to be improved upon.

Couldn't give a rat's ass about RDR2, I tried to play it and could only get to Chapter 3. I think the controls and movement is what killed it primarily.
in regards to BotW, I never found "climbing that mountain" to be fun. The core mechanic of climbing is not particularly fun or clever, you don't need to really prepare or do much of anything. It's effectively the same as walking vertically, except you might need to run in circles on an outcropping to regenerate stamina.
And what's worse: There's nothing on top of the mountain. So what do you do up there? Make a little sketch in your jour- I mean take a snapshot with your Sheikah Slate XR?
The style is there for BotW, and RDR2 has some substance. It's a shame neither could pull off the other as well, despite their notable development teams and bottomless coffers.
Oh, and it's a damn shame neither game could have some decent fucking combat. What the Hell does a guy have to do to get some well designed combat mechanics with intuitive control schemes nowadays? I swear to God game developers are fucked in the head.

from the comments of that article
>not to forget a lack of a linear storytelling that is not plotting a sequential narrative race course through a world open in all directions and thereby not ruining it.

why does every compliment i ever read about botw sound like people are praising the game for doing nothing.
>they didn't put a story in the game so you can't break the story. nintendo is truly brilliant, genius game design
no, it's because telling a story would have taken effort given the open world nature of the game so they just didn't even try. it's all so tiring.

I just realized the compliments are for doing things that are essentially the opposite of Ocarina of Time.
I wonder if these nobodies liked OoT?

>What the Hell does a guy have to do to get some well designed combat mechanics with intuitive control schemes nowadays?
wait for japan to make it unfortunately.

Pretty sure Nintendo is from Japan.
Been waitin' 21 years on that account.

>or do you want Nintendo to go back to the older design for the next game?

You sweet summer zoomer, this zelda did go back to an older design. BotW is the closest any 3D zelda has ever come to emulating the feel and gameplay of the original. Windwaker/OoT style are the newer things.

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BotW does have a story, just a weak one although it's better than most zelda games' storylines, but at the same time they're not entirely wrong with the fact that a stronger narrative could contradict the open gameplay style.

right, it would have been a feat if they had made the game with a strong narrative and pulled it off well given the difficulties they would have to overcome. instead they just didn't try. i don't get why that's impressive.

They’re literally doing both.

I don't remember degradable weapons, shrines, and the ability to do the final area at any point in Zelda 1

comparatively I do remember a straight-forward dungeon progression with optional orders, 9 total main dungeons, and three tiers of sword progression (one being optional) in both OOT and Zelda 1

>Importantly, though, the survival mechanics are handled with a light touch. When the player enters hazardous areas, for example, it isn't long before they find protective gear that shields them from the worst of it. Overly harsh survival mechanics can frustrate players, enslaving them to punitive death-countdown meters and forcing them into a desperate scrabble for food, or water, or oxygen, or what have you. They make the game about survival, and using them like that means you're making a survival game. Breath of the Wild's approach, making use of these mechanics periodically for flavour and in order to vary the constraints on the player, is much more generalisable. It adds texture to the game's world without constantly rubbing the player's face in it.

it just sounds so stupid
>the game has these survival mechanics but they basically don't matter because it's not long before you're given an item that completely negates the mechanics in place.
>and that's a good thing because it would suck if the game was "constantly rubbing it in your face" that there's actually some kind of challenge to overcome for more than 5 minutes at a time.
basically the devs couldn't find a way to make their survival mechanics fun so they just give you an item that makes them not matter. why is this praiseworthy i don't understand.

Yeah they complained it broke the game that’s why they took it out
Personally I wish it was a final boss reward

>it would have been a feat if they had made the game with a strong narrative and pulled it off well given the difficulties they would have to overcome
I don't think it would've been possible, the game is too open for any structured narrative to really work.

The mountains can be climbed but nothing's on top. The trees can be chopped but nothing to do with the wood. Stop pretending this game is interesting or fun.

I'd be fine with the comically large map approach if they could fill it with better things this time around. Oh and fuck durability and limiting inventory space. And fix combat and menu healing. Jesus

botw is about you getting stronger to face ganon, it would make little sense if the entire game had link struggling with basic survivability when the premise it about you regaining your strength

They’re all shit

The only way it could contradict the open-ended gameplay is if you locked content out.
So just don't do that, or have an obvious Point of No Return.
It's worth noting that narrative concepts can have a positive influence on gameplay elements, and in fact should.
For instance, the Blood Moon, which should have been a constant world state that would be lifted from the region up the BLIGHT being defeated. The Divine Beast could have been meant to be a counter to Ganon's Blood Moon, instead of some retarded Sentai laser mecha.
While the Blood Moon is active, monsters are rampant, act savagely, and are comparatively stronger. When the Blood Moon is lifted, they calm down but are still hostile, but their A.I. is altered so that they act smarter and improve their weaponry, so the difficulty remains while being altered.
Hey, I improved BotW's narrative AND gameplay by using the outlines of concepts it already has.
>spoiler
Fuck outta here. BotW's story is terrible, from its concept to its execution. The closest it came to being decent was with Zelda's arc, which they promptly threw out in the last memory anyway. What the fuck am I supposed to glean from that, I wonder?

wood is one of the most useful resources in the game, since it's used to make fires which can provide an updraft for your glider; provide a campfire; cook food; and burn things.

>Menu healing
That resulted from the Switch to the Switch.
The game was built entirely around a real time touchscreen menu and they cut all of it out for parity which is why everything is the way it is.
BotW was "Oh look we have a tablet and an actual game out, buy our console" the game.

They probably could have managed by varying up what happens when you do important things in different orders. Would have been easier if they cut the dreadful voice acting too.

Mentioned it in another thread but it got derailed into gay Link porn
I hope they stick with the open world style and hoping a future game where they use a modern setting would be like the final season of Samurai Jack where Link is foreign to the modern setting and has fallen into that world and adapts to the weapons and armour, maybe set during the period in which the Sheikah utilised guardians and the ancient weapons from BOTW and Link arrives in that world wearing the ordinary green clothes and is forced to wear new armour and endgame armour could be an upgraded version of his green tunic that utilises the technology of the world he's in.
I just want a futuristic kingdom that looks like Haven City in Jak II and outside the city is regular Hyrule with fields and rural villages with streetlamps as the height of their technological prowess and a motorcycle for Link because Master Cycle grew on me

>BotW's and LoZ's world design are almost nothing alike
For some reason people feel like drawing that connection gives BotW more legitimacy or something; the reality is LoZ has a lot more in common with ALttP (and, yes, even OoT) than it does BotW. Acknowledging this doesn't mean BotW "isn't a real Zelda" or whatever, though.

Or you can just get the spirit updraft. Wood is not useful.

>The game was built entirely around a real time touchscreen menu and they cut all of it out for parity which is why everything is the way it is.
I'd never considered that kek, it's disappointing to think we could have had a better system that would be a lot more tense

>Real dungeons
oh boy, I SOOO miss shitty block pushing rooms and "hit the eye" to unlock the door dungeons.

>They probably could have managed by varying up what happens when you do important things in different orders
How would that work, legitimately?

open

>updraft for your glider
why would i need this?
>provide a campfire
for what purpose?
>cook food
i think i beat the entire game without needing to actually cook anything. there was plenty of health from raw materials i picked up.
>and burn things
for what purpose?

he said so in his own post
>exploration would've been reduced a LOT
the implication is that if you have a few traditional dungeons they'd have to be further apart, leading to less frequent points of interest thoughout the world.

>new zelda good
>old zelda bad
it's like a reverse zelda cycle. maybe when the next one comes out everyone will call botw a shit game finally.

gamers always want more of the same but luckily Nintendo knows better and will ensure that fresh new experiences will keep the series alive instead of stagnant.

The best part is that many zelda games even have an underlying theme of not dwelling on the past and moving on to new things but the message clearly isn't getting through

you faggots are hopeless

given that SS was a giant pile of shit that flopped, yeah, old Zelda was fucking stale and awful.

no one said you have to get rid of the shrines though? no one implied it had to be one or the other except that retard himself.

>why would i need this?
fly up further/faster. Extremely useful for climbing cliffs quickly
>for what purpose?
to wait until morning or evening, useful for quests and riddles that need you to be around at particular times of day (most notably anything involving shadows)
>i think i beat the entire game without needing to actually cook anything. there was plenty of health from raw materials i picked up.
cooking isn't just for health, it's for elixirs as well. Personally, I use a lot of movement speed elixirs as they make climbing significantly faster something most people seem to forget
>for what purpose?
burning things deals damage, or can instantly cook an animal if it died whilst burning.

I hope you were just baiting, as otherwise I can only assume you played the game like a complete drooling retard

true, I think with the long dev and high budget botw already had though they probably had to cut any traditional dungeons. Plus, from a gameplay point of view, any dungeons more in the LttP/OoT format wouldn't really have worked with botw's systems.

I had this idea for a old style game with a simply massive Hyrule Field central area. Artistically crafting contained areas is just too good. I hate this paint by numbers open world shit, at least when it is used alone.
Also I want a game set in Termina again. I had an idea for a Masks based game with a companion sword character called the Face Sword. It has a blank face on its guard that you could equip the various Masks in the onto, transforming it. Double the effects of every mask in the game this way. Arrow mask, Bomb mask; everything would be a mask. I'd take botw's dodge-flurry mechanic and rework it so that instead of a bland sword flurry, you get free re-equip opportunities during the slow down. The skill-reliant options would be endless.

>luckily nintendo will make their first open world meme game 20 years late when it's already a stale formula
so fresh. botw is literally nintendo's "see that mountian you can climb it" game but released 6 years after that was already a meme.

at least you really can climb that mountain this time

*in the game onto

i guess i just didn't need a laundry list of crutch items for a kid's game. whoops.

Damn
Post more Link pls

>Plus, from a gameplay point of view, any dungeons more in the LttP/OoT format wouldn't really have worked with botw's systems
in what way?

Yeah but you can bline for piggie and finish it in about 2 hours

none of the things I mentioned are "crutch items" in any way

true, too bad there's still no reason to

you have to know the game pretty well to actually do that, it's not as straightforward as literally running there.

I think BotW was wonderful, mechanics and atmosphere-wise it really draws you in. If they try and do this style of game again though, a variety in the appearance of the Shrines would make a world of a difference, make the entrances and the décor change depending on the part of the world they are found in. The game also lacks any serious caves or buildings to explore. If the next installment can provide a larger variety in indoor environments then I'd say they've got the game perfect.

I would also like to see the return of some of the older items, like the Hookshot or the Boomerang. I've been playing a lot of DMCV lately and the ability to pull enemies close to you would be fun, as would the ability to do a larger variety of sword attacks. If DMCV can have multiple styles of sword swings mapped to just the Y button surely Nintendo could implement moves like the High Roller or the Split. Also the weapons need to break less often.

TL;DR great environment and controls, needs more variety in moves and indoor maps.

Yeah you can't run there but you can climb or glide there pretty easily

well for a start most obstacles you could just climb over, and the old zelda dungeon format was heavily reliant on a key item for that particular dungeon - which wouldn't fit with botw's design approach of having items split into categories that you find via exploring the overworld. They'd have to gate, for example, the boomerang into a dungeon instead of it being a fairly common disposable overworld weapon it is now. We could get into a whole debate over whether that's what they should or shouldn't have done, but by that point botw would be a completely different game as another OoT clone.

What gives you the impression that the dungeon design wouldn't be improved upon?

i'm imaging the autistic way you played the game.
>see a cliff
>build a fire
>pick some food up
>immediately build a fire
>run into some mobs
>build a fire just in case you want to spend 3 minutes trying to kite a mob into or something instead of just killing it like a normal person
>pick some consumables up
>build a fire so you can create woodchopping elixirs that grant you +5% woodchopping speed
so you can continue on your quest to deforest all of hyrule

there sometimes is like a rare weapon or armor piece but it's definitely something to improve in botw 2.

The same way it works in any other "rpg".

You know Nintendo fucked up when AC:O has a better open world than this

BotW
>focus is wandering across a world in any area off the bat
>can do the 4 main dungeons in any order
>not story driven, can ignore most NPCs entirely
>original concept for the game was actually done in the Zelda 1 style

Zelda 1
>focus is wandering across a world in any area off the bat
>can do the dungeons in many different orders
>not story driven, can ignore most NPCs entirely

OoT
>extremely linear path with areas only available after specific story driven points are passed
>can only do the dungeons in order
>100% story driven

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why would I make a separate fire if I already made one?
If I'm making a fire to climb something faster, chances are I'll quickly drop some spare food materials onto it to cook some stuff for a few seconds before heading off.

Also, how is any of this unusual to you? I think anyone that plays this game makes fires pretty frequently, since fire is inherently designed as a multi-purpose tool in the game that you're encouraged to use as early as the tutorial region.

>well for a start most obstacles you could just climb over
agreed, the way they implimented climbing made most of the game shit. thats why in shrines and divine beasts they were too lazy to implement it in any way and just dont let you do it.
>key items and gating
yeah actual game design would have been necessary and getting an item like the boomerang could have meant something unlike it just being another disposable trash item out in the overworld.

you can cry oot clone all you want but an oot clone in an open world setting would have undeniably been a better game than botw.

>AC:O has a better open world
kek, good one

Either you do the bare minimum and change a few lines of dialogue here and there and have every major achievement be a story event, have every major achievement be a milestone in how the story progresses with fixed events occurring if you complete enough milestones or you do enough tweaking that your progress in one area feels like it has notable consequences in another area, making your future progression easier, more difficult or just different.
This could have worked by placing various features throughout the world that respond to appropriate events.

As an example of that last one maybe you bring water back to a desert valley as part of one major story event but the valley had a structure you could have visited before that is now below water. Even if it's not necessarily a super structured narrative it sort of beats doing little nearly inconsequential puzzle elevators everywhere until you get bored and want to end the game. The Divine Beasts are almost that but I'd argue that they're not quite there, they're barely at the bare minimum since as far as I'm aware the dialogue won't change if you do them out of sequence and you still get a lot of the same handholding during the Divine Beast subjugation.

Climbing everything short of a ceiling was kind of dumb anyway. BotW could have still managed its disposable weapons by just having several weapons with systemic attributes like metal or wood. Since the entire weapon system was garbage anyway it wouldn't hurt to use that to supplement fixed tools and key items that have more individual depth to them.

How does BotW have a better open world?

nah fuck you, I'm sick of the LttP/OoT formula and it's clear the devs are as well after the trite that SS turned out to be. There's little left to do with that style, and despite some clear faults I much prefer they continue with the ideas BotW had than return to OoT yet again. At the end of the day, if you prefer the old formula then they can keep that style for the 2D games - which makes far more sense as the 2D games were always better at it, whilst the 3D games just kept stagnating by relying on it.

>fire is inherently designed as a multi-purpose tool in the game that you're encouraged to use as early as the tutorial region.
but then the normal person realizes they don't need that much cooked food and the time it takes to make a fire, drop a bunch of items and "wait around a few seconds" to climb something faster when you could just start climbing it when you get to it.

I want a game set in Termina again. I had an idea for a Masks based game with a companion sword character called the Face Sword. It has a blank face on its guard that you could equip the various masks in game the onto, transforming it. Double the effects of every mask in the game this way. Arrow mask, Bomb mask; everything would be a mask. I'd take botw's dodge-flurry mechanic and rework it so that instead of a bland sword flurry, you get free re-equip opportunities during the slow down. The skill-reliant options would be endless.
Also I had this idea for a old style game with a simply massive Hyrule Field central area. Artistically crafting contained areas is just too good. I hate this paint by numbers open world shit, at least when it is used alone

Attached: 1484836308970.png (344x344, 66K)

see

completely wrong, it is SIGNIFICANTLY faster to use move speed elixirs and updrafts from fire to climb. I wouldn't use them were it not for the night-and-day difference of climb speed.

i still don't understand what you think botw did better than every other ubisoft game released 10 years before it. now instead of getting a "stale formula" zelda game once every 6 years we get "fresh formula" open world game #4234 but with a zelda skin every 6 years.

Zelda 1 and BotW both lack guidance, but their overall priorities are completely different. Zelda 1 is primarily about dungeons. The overworld matters a lot, yes, but the game is about dungeons. They are the levels of the game. They're what the player will probably spend most of their time doing (especially on replays) and they're what the game is about. Most of the items you get in the game serve to allow access to dungeons (though they have uses in the dungeons too).

BotW is all about the overworld. Shrines punctuate exploration to give it more meaning than it otherwise would have and to give variety to the game, but the game overall is about exploring and getting around Hyrule. Even the Divine Beasts leave far less of a footprint on BotW than the dungeons do in Zelda 1.

>Since the entire weapon system was garbage
I know I may be in the minority on this, but I don't agree with this. The way I see it, botw just treats melee weapons in the same way other games treat your ammo, and I feel it made sense considering the structure of the game. Honestly, my only gripe with it is the fact you don't have an option to repair or reinforce your preferred wepaons in any way.

ok, you win at speed climbing. i can't even complain because unfortunately climbing is 90 percent of the game with gliding being the other 10. i guess i was playing it wrong.

see

>arguing like a redditor
try having your own opinions instead of echoing some faggy journalist you mindlet. not even echoing, just literally copy pasting someone elses opinions.

>climbing is 90 percent of the game
for you, maybe.
Brainlet

if the only thing you value in Zelda is the overworld then I could understand this perspective but the series has always been about more than just walking around in Hyrule

I want itsuno/kamiya combat with Dark souls map/level/world design

guess it should have been 60 percent wood cutting 10 percent climbing and 30 gliding. i've truly seen the error of my ways. i concede

>echoing some faggy journalist
the article is about the opinions of actual game developers, most notably TW3 and Asscreed devs. Therefore, it's completely relevant to the discussion.

you're so salty holy shit.
You barely even need to chop trees

im sorry lumberjack-kun i already conceded i don't know what else you want from me.

may as well admit you barely played the game, if at all

okay, why don't you cite something from the article. what do you expect from someone you retard? to just go read the article and then argue it in it's entirety in a single post? end yourself please.

I hate shrines, I hate divine beasts, I hated the lack of enemy variety and copy pasted bokoblins.

Other than that, good game.

i wish. something like 140 hours of my life i'll never get back.

I expect basic reading comprehension skills, I shouldn't need to cite anything when the article is posted right fucking there already as a source. If you have a problem with any points raised in the article, quote them and we can discuss from there.

you spent 140 hours on a game you hated?
lying or not, you're even more of a brainlet than I imagined

>you played for x hours! that's too little to have an opinion
>you played for x hours! that's too much to have a negative opinion
everytime

okay let's play by your stupid fucking rules of discussion then.

google.com/search?hl=en&q=reasons why breath of the wild is bad

anything less than 10 but more than 5 is sensible, you're just autistic.

probably. i played a climbing sim for 140 hours.

The open world style is amazing, BotW executed it badly though. Sure you're free like in no other open world game, but the world is empty if you don't count the shitty filler (shrines, koroks, shitt fetch quests). It's one step forward and two steps backwards. A perfect game would have the open world style of BotW with the open world content and writing of The Witcher 3.

how pathetic, can't even pick 1 quote from that article that you don't agree with and resort to hyperbole retardation instead

if you have a problem with any points raised on the internet, quote them and we can discuss them from there :^)

keep telling yourselfthat nignog

childish and petty, almost like you have no argument

but i did have an argument, see the one without an argument is the faggot who thinks linking to opinion articles from game journalists is somehow an argument or a sane way to have a discussion.

>opinion articles from game journalists
here you go again with the game journo boogeyman when it's from the opinions of actual veteran game developers/competitors. Also nice irony when your previous post you're quoting has even less substance to it, all you did was spew buzzwords with no reasoning behind any of it.

>it's not opinions from game journalists it's opinions from game devs
who gives a fuck you faggot. just try developing a thought of your own for once in your life.

>who gives a fuck you faggot
well you compared botw to ubisoft, and one of the developers in that article is a lead dev behind the asscreed games saying how botw subverts other open world games (including the ubisoft ones) so it's entirely relevant. Interesting how upset this makes you.

>plays the game
>it's not exactly what he wanted
>waaaah
holy shit this is hilarious

>uses babyspeak
>thinks his opinion matters
back to twitter

exactly this
some people want something to hold their hand the whole time