The Great Debate

>SMW went back to losing your powerup and size when you get hit once

Super Mario Bros 3 for that reason alone

SMW, I really wish it wasn't rushed out the door as it could have blown SMB3 even more out of the water.

Patrician taste.

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I love Mario 3 for the pure platforming challenge but I love World for the vast replayability with all the secret exits. Even though I like how SMB3 NES looks and plays a bit more, I would still give it to World just for having less autoscrollers though.

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i think 3 beats world by a little for some of its weirdness.

I love both, but World will always be special to me because when I first beat it that feeling combined with that credit music stuck with me forever.

youtube.com/watch?v=4mNZAZgXYJo

No

>Game of the year for the past 12 years
How can other Mario games even compete

>Mario Maker follows the SMB3 style of losing powerups one at a time even in SMW mode

At least they eventually learned.

There is no debate. World is an empirical downgrade across the board.

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3

aside from SMB3 not letting you save, yes

SMB3 has the flute secret

I'm still mad how SMW got the Donut Plains theme backwards. At least Mario Teaches Typing got it right.

It's insane to see the difference between SMB1 and SMB3 when they're on the same console, both in terms of graphical quality and content

It's because you have the item holding mechanic. It only makes sense.

They can't.
>Four characters with their own stats/gimmick
>Build on the barebone basics of SMB1 while adding a new mechanic that allows you to attack at any given moment along with adding other ways to utilize it through puzzle solving and finding secrets
>Established many mainstay Mario enemies that would become recognizable faces to this day
>Gave both plot devices actual roles
While I have more nostalgia for SMB3, SMB2 was the better game from a gameplay perspective. SMB2USA was a proper progression from SMB1 but overall, SMB3 was also a progression in terms of powerups and level structure. But coming off SMB2USA, SMB3 was a step backwards. Same with World.

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What's even more impressive is that SMB3 still holds up, over thirty years later. Literally the only NES game that can claim that.

Yeah, SMB1 somehow wound up being the better game despite all that effort put into SMB3. It's crazy.

Both are great games but it's hard to look at SMW as anything but a straight downgrade to 3; Less stage variety, less stages in general, less powerups

3 was an insane effort. Like going from SMB1 to 3 is such a huge leap its ridiculous. SMW doesnt really up the ante as much

Here's a better debate.
Which one has better romhacks?

>Literally the only NES game that can claim that
You must have not played many NES games then. I can name loads of NES games besides Mario 3 that still hold up.

You haven't played many NES games if you think SMB3 is the only game that holds up today. Even as far as platformers theres Metal Storm and Little Samson that really stick out as unique and polished. Then you have games like Sweet Home which really havent even been replicated in a modern format, and I'd a more than competent adventure horror RPG

SMB1 is at its best when you are going as fast as possible like a lot of arcade games, while Mario 3 is built like a console game with attention to detail in mind and most people appreciate that more.

SMB3 is better. How is this even a contest?

What?

>How is this even a contest?
It's not, but Yea Forums has become infested with underaged redditors who grew up on World.

I like Mario World more.

It's just a bit more exciting.
A bit more challenging.
A bit more graphics.
A bit more colorful.
A bit more realistic.
A bit more levels.
A bit more secrets.
A bit more enemies.
A bit more friends.
A bit more sound.
A bit hotter.
A bit cooler.
A bit weirder.
A bit more revolutionary.
A bit more Mario.
A bit more of what you want.

the real answer

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Came to post this.

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I like SMW more since it has a better Mario moveset, chucking shit around is great. SMB3 is great as well, both games are different enough.

The GBA version of SMW retains Mario's size when he loses his Flower or Feather. Otherwise enjoy the higher brightness and JUST WHAT I NEEDED

God I wish Nintendo didn't treat their 2D games like second class citizens now.

based

wait how the hell do you infinite flutter kick?

World is better

>Yoshi
>the cape
>more variety
>no stupid ass repetive levels like the airship fortresses
>better art design

Over the years Ive come to like SMB3 a lot less than I used to..

SMB2 was a weird game, but it had it's charms here and there too. Did Wart ever return in the series in any way?

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What went wrong?

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Ahahahahahahano

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Didn't made it a handheld only series, they should have released 3D world instead of the Wii NSMB and Galaxy 2.

>3D World was absolute overrated shi-

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Powers: 3>world
World: world>3

3 is a better game out of the box but World gains an edge from the modding scene around it.

>Literally the only NES game that can claim that.
There are plenty that hold up really well, and just to give an example, Gradius.

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Fuck your dumb

Japanese Mario 3 shrinks you regardless of powerup.

The irony.

I replayed it recently with that hack that makes it fully colored, and honestly it doesn't hold up as well as I wished.

>Shatterhand

how so?

>the one stage that actually offers a legitimate challenge with actual platforming and not just doing lazy shit like cutting the timer in half

I think Super Mario World is the better game but I personally like Super Mario Bros. 3 more. Exactly the same opinion I have on Paper Mario TTYD to PM 64.

3D World was a fucking impeccable game. A shame it's stuck on the WiiU. The shit like the flag padding was stupid though.

I prefer Mario 3's level design, but World had a more interesting overworld and better secrets.

The multiplayer is so much fun.

PM64 is the superior game to TTYD, so your heart is right.

Well for one, even by Mario standards the game is far too easy. But that aside, it's all just very basic in its design.

World plays better and that's all that matters

my nigga

That's where you're wrong, bucko.

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Is there a hack that gives water controls of SMW to SMB3? That's honestly the only thing that it would truly benefit from.

Thank you. From my heart.
Yeah, I think TTYD is objectively the better game. Personally, I like PM 64.

What were Mario and Toad's gimmick?

I loved and played the shit out of this game as a kid.
But as another user said, it doesn't hold up too well.
It's waaaaaaaay too easy to go back to and have a good time.

Give it to a little kid as their first game though and they'll love it.

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PM64 has more consistent pacing and less tedium and a superior art style but TTYD improves on so much.

Not him, but Mario was average while Toad had the fastest movement/plucking and lowest jump height.

The tedium is what kills TTYD for me. I fucking loved PM64 and I do like the good parts of TTYD a lot, but even on my first run I was having difficulty motivating myself to move on at points. A replay of both titles makes it even more apparent how much random padding TTYD has by comparison.

Why did all of Nintendo's major titles have lots of padding in them? It was never something I noticed as kid, but going back and replaying Wind Waker, Metroid Prime, Sunshine, TTYD, and so on made me realize that all of them suffer from the that in varying degrees (Sunshine being the worst offender).

major GameCube titles*

Nintendo's GC titles were all rushed out unfinished to get titles out onto market. TTYD was made in like under a year.

gamecube games were rushed out
wind waker had cut dungeons and scenarios
even sunshine was incomplete despite the delay

3 is the better game if you have a second player to switch off with
world is the better game if you're lonely and play by yourself

But why? I meant to specify the GameCube in my original post. It seems the only Nintendo console that has this issue.

Oh don't mind me, just posting the best 2D platformer Nintendo's ever made. Aside from Warioland of course.

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Retro made that, though.

Not even the best game in its own series. It is second, but DKC2 still reigns supreme. Please don't be a contrarian and hit me with the "timeless classic....is not actually as good as you think!" posts, I'm too tired

Yeah, and they're owned by Nintendo.

They're also an autonomous studio based in Texas. Who owns them is irrelevant.

It was a weird time where Nintendo had the motivation and creativity to do great stuff but they where more interested in pushing out their next console than bringing those games to their fullest potential, personally I think Metroid Prime turned out pretty much as intended despite the short development time but they just had weird priorities in that generation.

Yeah, Prime is definitely the least offender there, but the artifact hunt at the end feels like needless padding.

Nintendo seemed to have difficulty making the jump from N64 to Gamecube (Likely thanks to the 64DD's severe issues and later failure) and the PS2 was slaughtering everybody especially with its head start so they had to push titles out as fast as possible to try to regain ground. Even games that started development a bit into the console's lifespan like TTYD suffered from this, it was announced in August 2003 but the first graphics ever put into the game are dated in October 2003, with the final build date being mid-June 2004. I can't imagine the hell the developers went through.

I recently finished SMB3 so my memory is still fresh.

SMB3:
-more challenging in most worlds
-way more creative with the world themes, something like pipe world does not exist in world, tanks and airships are all just castles now.
-overworld events are neat
-item inventory is nice to have
-more powerups
-more minigames

SMW:
-longer levels with more fleshed out gimmicks
-way more polished physics wise
-improved controls with additions like the spin jump and the ability to throw items up
-more rewarding secrets
-more branching paths on the map
-hidden exits in stages
-bonus world
-bonus bonus world
-yoshi

Its really hard to tell. If World had overworld events and better world ideas it would easily dominate.
I still think I like it more overall.

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SMW. duh

its a galoomba, duh.

the thousand year backtrack is a bit on the terribly overrated side of things like all things Nintendo did on the Gamecube.

wart was in links awakening

This, the PS2 was killing and killed everyone.

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why are gamecube babbs specifically so obnoxious compared to anybody else?

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SPW gets really shitty once you get to world 3 inside the cave plus theres so much trial and error and everything in the game is designed around a certain play style or gimic. SMB 3 is more flexible and levels are designed to make sense. in SBM feels like levels were designed to be a little too long for no reason and its challenges can usally only completed in one way.

the fuck

HOO! HOO! JUST WHAT I NEEDED

This.

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It was the first time a Nintendo console was basically just held up by Nintendo. If your parents weren't financially well off you'd get a gamecube because it was the cheapest option. The games were mostly passable but incredibly mediocre to much of what Nintendo did before and unfortunately put them into a terribly long rut of mediocrity. These people have some seriously stunted growth and cling to their childhood games worse than anyone else out there.

They're both so...flat.

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n64 was already the nintendo only console.
gamecube felt like it had more third party even.
like actual unique games from capcom and square enix holy shit

N64 fanboyism is justified by having 2 of the most important console games ever, gamecube doesn't so it just comes off as biter.

Including the gaming industry. People who started on Ps2 grew up to be the most insufferable faggots out of everybody

And it's appropriate that they are like that because Sonic couldn't work in a Mario level either, stop pushing this meme.

n64 was the rare-nintendo console. There was at least the impression of variety there.

im not blinded by nostalgia. Snes version of mario was a huge downgrade. I will admit the first and second worlds of the game were good but after that it gets so generic and boring..Boss battles are meh, haunted houses are meh as well. Nothing really impressed me. Meanwhile look at Sonic and Knucles thats what mario on snes should have been.

good tradeoff if you consider that sonic barely has any fucking levels.

>Boss battles are meh
imagine saying that while defending smb3 lmao

Why is there a super leaf in the fourth brick for SMB3 1-1? It's a mushroom, isn't it?

I didn't get a game cube because it was the cheapest option, I remember super monkey ball at mcdonalds and wanted it also getting majoras mask for GC was a boost too. I could only afford ocarina of time majoras mask was always sold out and expensive on the N64 and parents got me DK64 that year.

Quality, not quantity. Doesn't want to waste your time with boring, tedious forest levels for 60 of the 80 levels.

but bro... boom boom...

i sure do love nintendo's obsession with him and the smb3 iteration of the koopa kids fights later on too. what low effort garbage.

yeah it just gives you a handful of easy levels where you never have to bother with the higher parts.

Anyone can beat it, but it says a lot more about your skill if that's your experience with it.

soul
soulless

GAME OF THE YEAR
EVERY YEAR

Boss Battles in SMB3 you usally know what to do right off the bat. SMW stupid ass trial and error untill you figure it out can only beat bosses one way, the journey to the bosses is shit as well while in SM3 the journey to the bosses was well designed with a varierty of challenges and enemies that challenge your jumping skills, timing etc SMW challenges your trial and error and holding the run button while staying as close to the edge as possible of the screen.

its the games fault for never pushing me to improve.
and lets not talk about how fucked the ring system is.

imagine being too fucking retarded to understand mario world bosses

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Dude, it's a Mario boss. They're more of a formality than an actual fight.

SMB2, turnip tossing was fun

You settled on mediocrity, the game gave you choices.
>and lets not talk about how fucked the ring system is.
another thing you're not good at?

>this nigga seriously needs trial and error to understand more than "you jump on them 3 times lmao"

I'm great at literally never dying no matter how hard I fuck up because the game was designed by a retard.

not retarded just saying the journey to SMW bosses is shit and once you do it its just trial and error until you figure it out which is not good design....SMW trades good game play and design for graphics. SM3 exceeds in good game play and minimalist design that makes it a superior game.

what the fuck are you talking about you fucking schizo

im saying SMW was a shitty platformer with good graphics. DKC was far superior gameplay wise on the snes in boss battles level design, soundtrack etc DKC also does not suffer from that trial and error bullshit in SMW

take your pills man

It's simply designed to accommodate them, the sensation of speed and swift platforming and navigation is the best reward, but you struggle to make it up a ramp without having to turn back and spin dash, or hope for a spring to give you that little nudge. You can do it my baby boy.

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Lot of these arguments don't make sense anyway, if you're going to count the numbers of powerups or level design you can't really make an argument out of that.

The conclusion is that they're both great games and it's like trying to compare doom to half-life or something

but half-life isn't a great game.

vanilla smb3 > vanilla smw
romhack smw > everything else

I can have speed and platforming in a mario game without retarded babymode shit like in sonic.

Game is made for idiots.

yea im wrong look at all the bullshit trial and error im SMW, stuff like enemies exploding into 3 and charging into you when they never did that before or a football charging the wall right when you hit a check point to kill you so much bullshit like that in SMW. The mini games are all RNG bullshit as well, no challenge or thought like SM3. The game is fucking mediocre.

That's ok honey, now eat your tendies

not if you're already big i guess.

>speed
>mario
pick one.

?? mario is super fast in 2D.

Compared to a cripple maybe, Mario's a very slow game.

>t. hasn't played Sonic

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its legitimately faster than sonic lmao.

DKC is just very horizontal while SMW is more vertical than usual for a Mario game which I don't like too much but at least the controls are perfect.

But...it's World 1-1. The first power up in 1-1. SOMETHING DOESN'T ADD UP

World was fucking hard and everybody I know has somehow forgotten this fact.
And then we play it and it all comes flooding back.
Fuck 3 though, some of those levels are just goddamn lazy and the ending is unbelievably poor, even for a Mario game.

you could miss it, get a regular shroom and then go back to this.
its odd placement for sure.

>lmao
typical retarded facebooker. Can't even wrap their head around the pinball physics of Sonic. Stick to your baby games kid.

You can turn back and go back for it wtf man

but I dont play a game where the protagonist is an unkillable god just after picking up one coin.

see
World has both better level design and is much longer.

World has the star world secret. There is literally no argument to this as it not only puts you further in the game, but you actually have to work for it and if you complete it you get 8 more challenging and enjoyable levels. Way fucking better than "me walk to area offscreen. me get flute. me get to world 8 immediately"

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Xbox its hard to say died then, cuz it WAS their first foray into the market at all. Sega though got trounced out completely

No, instead you play babies first platformer with no depth.
info.sonicretro.org/SPG:Solid_Tiles#The_Three_Speed_Variables

thats some nice gibberish you just linked there. doesnt change that sonic games are piss easy and all supposed depth is wasted on them because they are fundamentally made in a retarded way.

Mario 3
>more diverse stages
>more diverse worlds
>more diverse enemies
>more diverse power ups
>better challenge
>better music

Mario World
>MUH CAPE
>MUH YOSHI

>still no argument
typical low IQ mario fan.

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How did Yuji Naka figured this out

arguments have been made but you are too retarded to realize them. probably have to put it into a loop that plays itself for you to understand.

oof

>better music
Hold the fuck up.
youtube.com/watch?v=H7bvnjQMgq4

given how they act sonic fans deserve the trash they're getting from team sonic

This post is a bit gay and you're a bit gay.

Sega's always been better than Nintendo, they've always had game design geniuses, it's how they literally reinvented the platformer while Nintendo rehashed and rehashed, and they continue to do today. They burned thrice as bright, but half as long.

Still waiting for a real argument here.

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Man the SNES sounds like ass.
youtube.com/watch?v=RPYzgCI6Q1I

How did this thread turn into Sonic vs Mario?

I can't pick. Between these two and Mario 2 I don't think they've ever done a better 2D Mario. NSMB games are pretty good but nowhere near those three.

>Sonic fans desperately trying to stay relevant
Come back when you get a Mania 2.

sonic autists are freaking out because of that shitty movie trailer

What's more exciting? Comparing two jump & bop platformers or jump & bop platformer vs exploration-physics platfoming?

How did Sonic make the transition into 3D better than Mario?

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Some YouTuber has a document explaining the shortcomings of SMW were born from a short Dev cycle and unfamiliar hardware. If we'd been blessed with another SNES Mario that was not Yoshi, just look at the insane movement of Super Metroid. Look at the shit ROM hacks have squeezed out of the physics of SMW.

In the 90's, I would have said World
but it's aged in the last few years while 3 has not.

>modern 3D Mario is fantastic
>modern 3D Sonic is trash
>modern 2D Mario is just there
>modern 2D Sonic is kino
Both series have lots to offer if you know what to look for, I honestly don't get the whole "X is better" angle when both have tons of history.

>modern 2D Mario is just there
king of plebs

>realistic
you on drugs?

didn't forsake its roots like Mario. Nintendo had to copy Argonaut's design and slap together a new game only to be embarrassed by a game like Crash Bandicoot. Miyamoto was furious he wasted all that time, money, R&D on a 20FPS platformer when the solution was so obvious. Sonic's ass.

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Please tell me more of those great 2D mario games released this decade

all stras is pure vomit i would rathher drink rolling rocks thanplayn that that turd

smb 3 is the best 2d mario game

The only genius thing about Sega is how they've made a character so shitty, it attracted all the autistic kids that think that having mazes is level design.

>How did Sonic make the transition into 3D better than Mario?
The most delusional post of all time? Sonic Adventure is ass.

I'll get back to you on that as soon as Nintendo makes a good one. It's been over 20 years and I can't think of a single worthwhile 2D mario since the 6 golden coins.

2D Mario was never been better thanks to NSMBU.

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> autistic kids
aren't you guys still writing fanfic about this green cube between the foot fetishism and "racist mario?"

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Heh it looks like Yoshi is farting. Heh. I wonder how it smells.

Pleb choice: World
Patrician choice: 3

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STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP FUCKING DONT FORGET CHRIS CHAN HES A FUCKING SONIC FAN STOP IT STOP IT NOW NOW NOW

why? if I remember correctly both have the same 2player system.

3 because raccoon is less broken than the Cape.

>classicfags are willing to give the benefit of the doubt to Adventure games
>adventurefags genuinely believe anyone that dislikes something from those games just "doesn't get it", they also hate anything boost and 2D
I guess I finally realize the root of autism in the fanbase.

what about the clipping through the floor bits that you run into nonstop

>He fell for the '3D Sonic is bad' meme

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but at the same time 3 gives out so many fucking P-Wings. you can skip quite a few levels with those.

Hey man, he just wanted to fit in

Pretty sure that one is explained in the lore.

Will Mario ever be this good in 3D? Odyssey was so disappointing compared to Mario 64.

>A bit more challenging.

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>P Wings
>Cloud item
>some levels are pretty much skipable since they are in a branching path and they pretty much tell you to choose the level you enjoy more and move on
>flute
SMB3 needing a save system my ass.

I just want an Adventure game where the whole thing is Speed Stages only

git gud

What do you really think mario world is more challenging? Honestly that is wrong, i admit to prefer World too because of most things you have said but it's obviously less difficult because of some power up like the cloak and Yoshis, especially the blue one. i had those 2 games during my childhood, they were both really awesome games.

SMW2 is a great game but the loss of a real world map makes me not totally like it. That's also a reason why i can't appreciate Mario maker, people can't create their own worlds, only editing levels and honestly when you see what some romhacks with lunar magic you can only think that mario maker is a lazzy and shitty trash.

They're both great games and it comes down to personal preference, but it's also a bit unfair for World. SMB3 took the NES hardware and really pushed what it could do. World was a launch title for the SNES and didn't really scratch the surface of what could be accomplished with SNES hardware. I think the only real place World has a distinct advantage over 3 is the ability to save progress.

3

World has generic plains
Tanuki > Capeshit

Git gud.

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yawn

I wish the game penalized you for using the flute. Maybe the Advance version does I forget but...

>The Advance version

both are amazing I cant choose

Actually you can do that level by beating directly those monsters, i don't get the point of that shitty webm. Mario maker is trash tier game, you can find more challenge and more well made level in any romhacks.

is this what autism looks like?
its not even mario maker

Unironically SOULLESS

>its not even mario maker
Then why send that shit?

youtube.com/watch?v=FPzuYWbnln4

>aren't you guys still writing fanfic about this green cube
sh-shut up

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i played through all of SMW this week and it really feels like a game that desperately needed a sequel with better levels. the game is incredibly short too and you can tell it was rushed to come out with the snes launch. some of the levels are so bad.

Dumb zoomer
I bet your favourite Metroid ever and forever is Super Metroid