What is with the hate

>devil may cry/bayonetta/ninja gaiden black/god hand level design is hallway into arena into hallway into arena etc.
>nobody minds because the focus of the game is obviously on combat and not being in an arena is just downtime
>nudoom level design is hallway into arena into hallway into arena etc where arenas are where the real combat happens
>suddenly everyone minds because ??? or 'its a doom game' instead if judging the game on its own merits
explain this

>series known for X continues doing X
>all is fine

>series known for Y does X in new installment
>players that enjoy Y are upset

No, if it didn’t have the Doom logo, you faggots would love it even more for the sake of being the contrarian redditors that you all are.

btfo'd

>>series known for Y does X in new installment
>>players that enjoy Y are upset
so we're not talking about the quality of the game here, then

yeah contrarians only speak in metaphors and confucianism's

those games have a small but extremely vocal (obnoxious) playerbase,your comparison is stupid

>liking this game is contrarian
In what fucking universe?

Glory kills are gay

Because doomguy's punch and kicks are stronger than most of his guns

>press X to movie and get your health back
why couldn't they just have a doom game

a sane one

frankly no they are a great solution to stay in combat and not have to runaway and find hp
all doom gaymes have button prompts it;s literally 2 seconds

yeah I really want a melee weapon I can reliably use in eternal

The "deluded boomer" one.

yeah deluded boomers that think that the past was literally perfect

because people wanted a new Doom, not Painkiller.

Deluded boomers that think the general consensus is that D44m was a bad game, thus making liking it "contrarianism".

It’s nothing like Painkiller.

This is insult to painkiller.

It's a great shooter game.
But a bad Doom game.

its nothing like it wtf
whats your beef with doom 2016

>i do not like this game even though it's popular
>WAAA WAAA REDDIT CONTRARIAN
truly a big brain post

>DUM DUM
there is a difference between calling someone out on it's lack of education regarding a subject (here game design of an FPS) and calling that person dumb

>assuming shallow is a bad thing
it usually is and the case of this game it is

When i play a doom game i assume it's gonna have design elements of a doom game
and when people think doom they think about doom 1 & 2, final and all that jazz
and doom 4 is closer to painkiller than doom and people are rightfully pissed about it
if Bayo 3 has an open world and golf mini game instead of the common formula of 1 & 2 people are gonna be equally pissed at it

nah painkiller is pretty bad

The only thing that really is crap is how slow it is in the beginning and the music is really really bad. Don't care that it's "metal" it really isn't, it sounds like shitty dubstep. The game is fun though and no, it doesn't lock you into arenas all the time. At times the levels can be qiuet sprawling.

It's is a contraction. Its is the possessive form.

my first game was Doom, which I played sitting in my dad's lap
I really liked nuDoom
the arguments don't really matter anyway, Marathon was better

it's full of shit design that is competently realized

It's fun to play DMC/Bayo/NGB/GH. It's not fun to play nuDoom. It's not rocket science, nigger.

i try my best but writing isn't my forte

I don't like glory kills and it's too slow.
Also,

>It's fun to play DMC/Bayo/NGB/GH. It's not fun to play nuDoom. It's not rocket science, nigger.
So the arenas aren't at fault?

Its not a bad fps at all compared to what we have in the market. At least moved from the corridor design, but still far away from the old map design where you had to explore everything. Problem is that people back then complained they got easily lost

The locked arenas help magnify how shitty nuDoom's gameplay is.

Doom>dook>nuDoom>Dusk>shadow warrior>Rott with mouse aiming>blood>Serious Sam>quake>Serious sam 3>Brootal Doom>Rott 2013

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But why does nobody complain about arenas in DMC but suddenly they're bad in nuDoom?

Because combat in DMC is not a chore.

Painkiller has better weapons and levels both.

Modern FPS is shit
Where were you when retro FPS were making a comeback???
>Amid Evil
>DUSK
>Ion Maiden
>Wraith
>Devil Daggers

>Because combat in DMC is not a chore.
Nigga, how does good combat suddenly make arenas good? You're skipping a few steps of logic here by failing to explain why combat in nuDoom is supposed to be bad.

Those are beat'em ups. You beat people up. They do the beating up thing well, which makes them good games. In d44m you run and gun. The gunning is ok. The running is not. It is a mediocre game. Shooters live and die by their environments, it's the only way you can make "click on enemy" interesting for dozens of hours.

Quake should be way higher, you bitch
Quake is unironically better than Doom

Already beat Dusk, absolute kino of fps. Could have been better, but still very solid. Waiting for the rest to come out, as much as I am looking forward to them, I still am not going to buy early access games. Only on release.

The environments in nuDoom are definitely varied in terms of how platforms are arranged, so I don't see what you're getting at here.

QUAKE 5 WHEN? ITS BEEN OVER 10 YEARS

Dusk was awesome, hope Prodeus turns to be good too

Anything to be a contrarian fago.

That shooters and beat'em ups are different genres making it a very poor comparison.

Same here. Of them all I'm looking forward to Wrath the most because of that forward momentum from the wristblade. You can have a lot of fun with that and the levels seem to be made with it in mind too.

I came into it with very low expectations and was very pleasantly surprised, I still replay some levels from time to time.
I can understand being disappointed if you were expecting something playing like Doom 1 or 2 but it's not like anybody makes games like those anymore. It plays more like Serious Sam or Quake 3, but that's not a bad thing IMO. At least it's not a tacticool cinematic shootan.
I'm looking forward to the sequel.
>there is a difference between calling someone out on it's lack of education regarding a subject (here game design of an FPS) and calling that person dumb
Imagine taking videogames so seriously. I don't need a PhD in videogame design to know that I enjoyed playing this game. The gameplay is fast paced, the weapons feel good, the level design is... okay (I would've preferred something less horde-based but it's still decent).
>When i play a doom game i assume it's gonna have design elements of a doom game
Then you're an idiot and you have absurd expectations. Doom 2 was released in 1994, at a time when we played FPSs only with a keyboard. Doom 3's gameplay is even less of a "Doom". It was clear that they needed to reinvent the formula to make a modern AAA game out of it.
What did you want exactly? A modern FPS where you can't look up and the whole gameplay revolves around finding color-coded keys while you strafe in circles to avoid the enemy's projectiles?
Again, I do think they overdid it with the enemy wave-based gameplay but overall it managed to bring the feeling of "one guy fighting the legions of hell" to the 21st century pretty well IMO.

Never ever Bethesda decided to hold it as a garbage OW style shooter arena

>there are people that don’t enjoy ripping and tearing demons to heavy metal
idk OP, some people just don’t like fun I guess

Because you clearly wouldn't want to be locked in mandatory combat if the gameplay (and level design) was trash, do you play videogames?

Quake is Boomer shit
With the failure of Quake Champions, I doubt we'll get a Quake V
It's probably going to be a reboot like Nu-Doom
The question is, are we getting Stronger SciFi or are we getting the pseudo-lovecraft, gothic, medieval shit

Strogg*
Fuck autocorrect

>That shooters and beat'em ups are different genres making it a very poor comparison.
How is that relevant? In fact it might even be more relevant than you think considering the nuDoom devs went on record saying they took some inspiration from brawlers for enemy behavior and the Glory Kill system, like MGR's Zandatsus (which magically nobody complains about either).

The balance between exploration and combat in levels surely transcends genres, don't you think? Else how do you end up with games as different as DMC and Dark Souls? Hell, from what I gather here is that if the focus of your game is combat, then arena-focused level design isn't such a bad fit.

>mandatory combat
You are then telling me that combat in olDoom... isn't mandatory?

>The balance between exploration and combat
(good) level design is not separate from combat in a shooter

>(good) level design is not separate from combat in a shooter
Says who?

Anyone with half a brain. What map you're playing matters more than which game.

What's wrong with a shooter which is just arenas back-to-back where you get immediately teleported to the next when you're done killing everything? It's not like level design in every platformer needs to be open-ended either.

quake sucks. 90% of the enjoyment comes from multiplayer which is dead. I'm rating things on their campaign.

strawpoll.me/17912088

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I can't even tell what you're talking about anymore.
Your irrelevant and hypothetical shooter would be fine if it has good level design, and what the fuck do platformers have to do with anything?

D44m is a mediocre game because it has dogshit level design. It plays the same no matter where you are. Locking you inside the little boxes is just adding insult to injury.

>D44m is a mediocre game because it has dogshit level design
yes but why

I guess they didn't have anyone competent at it. You'll just have to ask id.

The design being based around arenas with a few seemingly endlessly respawning enemies instead of sprawling levels with a very rigidly set amount of non respawning enemies is what kills it for me. Especially now that I know the AI is literally taking the piss and waiting their turn to attack the player as dictated by a overseeing ai director because challenge is frustrating and instant gratification is king and we have to let console players feel like they're good at fps games. Here's another canned animation of you punching the bad man, good job!

>lazy level design (arenas, map markers, empty hallways, etc...)
>glory kills break combat flow
>skill trees
>online is shit
>no mods
I enjoyed the game, it's a solid foundation for a rebooted series but it still needs some more work for it to truly be great. I hope the sequel is better.

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Yes, but what makes the levels so bad then?

>Especially now that I know the AI is literally taking the piss and waiting their turn to attack the player as dictated by a overseeing ai director because challenge is frustrating and instant gratification is king and we have to let console players feel like they're good at fps games
The reason why there's an AI director is because otherwise you get an unreactable clusterfuck on top of enemies being able to lead their shots like this
youtu.be/2KQNpQD8Ayo?t=41m10s
Now imagine that on Nightmare Imp fireballs can gank you for 45HP damage each on top of enemies constantly being outside your field of vision, and things would fall apart rather quicklly

They have no effect on the gameplay. It doesn't matter where you are. The level design is basically fucking absent, you might as well be walking through the void.

doom 2016 is an excellent game, anyone who thinks it sucks is trolling or just has very poor taste. or they're a girl

>They have no effect on the gameplay. It doesn't matter where you are. The level design is basically fucking absent, you might as well be walking through the void.
You'll have to be more specific because that doesn't tell me anything about the level design itself.

>glory kills break combat flow

They literally last less than a goddamn second

it's been a while i played painkiller but i don't remember anything not worthy in the design aside from a ""puzzle"" boss
as for the weapon i only remember the spike launcher and it's not that great because fear does it better so i'm biased

>retro FPS
>Devil Daggers
it's "serious sam is th return classic FPS" all over again
but aside from that only dusk came out and it's good, a 7 or a 8 out of 10

the combat in nuDoom is bad because it's slow, is interrupted by a glory kill if you use them and that weapon don't feel that good and because you only fight 10 ennemies at the same time at most

A PhD is only one form of education, playing and analysing games is also a way of educating yourself
>I don't need a PhD in videogame design to know that I enjoyed playing this game
you do not but you're talking about enjoyment not about quality
>fast paced
what are you ? a snail ?
>absurd expectations
expecting a doom game to have many ennemies, impactful weapon and mazy maps is absurd ?
>Doom 3
never talked about it and yes its even less of a Doom game even if the horror element is one of the core elements of doom it shouldn't be a focal point
>It was clear that they needed to reinvent the formula to make a modern AAA game out of it
and it was a bad idea, i'd even say a bad ID
>legions
more like a couple of squads
It's not a doom game, it's a random shooter with a paint of doom on it

>heavy metal
but it's not heavy metal user

>They literally last less than a goddamn second
It's not that much of a big deal, but they take long enough to break the combat flow a bit. Sometimes you just loose track on where enemies are around you while you're stuck in the animation and this can be a real pain in the ass on harder dificulties especially since arenas have no cover at all and you're always exposed.

>the combat in nuDoom is bad because it's slow, is interrupted by a glory kill if you use them
This looks slow to you?
youtu.be/72S2aAxtZOs?t=53s

After this doom fiasco you're asking for quake?
Get their shit straight first

The arena level design

>doom fiasco
What fiasco?

All of thse contrarian posts are sponsored by EPIC and ActivisionBlizzard

and its not boogieman bullshit, its well known that both has a beef with id and Zenimax related media

if you like nudoom give shadow warrior reboot a try, it was pretty underrated

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I stopped listening to this place when fucking Doom 3 apologists came out of the woodwork and seriously try to argue their slow as fuck pseudo cover shooter is better than 4.

>t. Zenimax shill

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That’s video games in general wtf you mean

Stop shitposting nigger and go fix World of Dyincraft

>have to defeat enemies to progress in a video game

gone home is that way zoomer

>strawpoll.me/17912088

as usual most of the hate is by a small minority of seething butthurt shitters

Its just a good shooter. Not worthy of real hate.
Its kinda sad we lost the more dark style of 90s fps like Quake, or the personality of the build engine.

Modern engines look like plastic, demons are not scary at all.
Contrast an old cyberdemon art to these ones.
Only the lighting is much better, still better then gear era where everything looked greasy.

My fps drug still comes from Thief maps, and the marvelous shit like Ashes 2063 and HL echoes.

strawpoll.me/17912380 Better poll without the trolling bullshit.

>you either like nuDoom or you hate ALL OLD VIDEO GAMES
jesus christ, are you a political pollster, talk about leading

if you like nudoom that's fine but it's shit, SW was great

>you either like nuDoom or you hate ALL OLD VIDEO GAMES
Are you okay user? Do you need help?

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explain how SW reboot is good but nudoom isn't, they have the same monster arena style gameplay and are fun as fuck

>if you like X video game then you dislike Y video game

because it actually is a very boring, dull game made for zoomers
there isn't any game like it released these days that aren't obscure indie games, and no one else wants to download the originals because they don't want to get exposed as fruads

doom = all about infighting, massive monster armies, high skill challenge and good, sprawling dungeon maps with many secrets

nudoom has none of this

the end faggot OP

zoom zoom.

i like it desu