Do people who obsess over games being art actually engage with art pre-1960? Do they read literature? Do they watch arthouse films? Do they appreciate paintings and classical music? Or do they just read genre fic and comics (if that), watch capeshit and shounen anime and listen to 4 chord pop?
>inb4 'old thing good'
That's not my point, my point is that it's embarrassing to pretend to know anything about art if you've only engaged with stuff from the last 60-70 years that's usually entertainment anyway. That's what leads to retards thinking that having a good plot makes something art.
I actually think that video games can be art, just like anime, comics and genre fiction can be art, but the key word is can. They are almost always entertainment and that's fine. Something like Silent Hill 2 or Shadow of the Colossus, I can totally see how that could be art, but that's a minority to go with NGE, Tatami Galaxy, Corto Maltese and The Book of the New Sun. I'd even say that the very best game design can provoke the aesthetic emotion, like Super Metroid and Castlevania SotN, which are also brilliant in visuals and music. But when you get someone calling The Last of Us and other B-movie games art I can only think of picrel.
Especially considering how much of the cultural consciousness is entertainment, and considering how a key trait of the art movement of the last 70 years is mixing up of high and low culture (see Pynchon and tons of other postmodern literature and film, no I'm not a retard who treats postmodernism as a boogieman, this is a legit tenet of postmodernism) I genuinely think that most people can't tell art from entertainment, and so justify something being art rather than entertainment by comparing it to something else which they think is art but is actually entertainment. It's embarrassing to talk about art if you don't even know who Milton, Cervantes, Ozu, Bresson, Schoenberg, Stravinsky, Goya or Friedrich are and most of these people probably don't.
Do people who obsess over games being art actually engage with art pre-1960? Do they read literature...
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The "is it art" debate is a massive cope by faggots who are mad that more people pay attention to and care about videogames than they do their shitty bedroom album on bandcamp
Good post and no they don't. The deepest thing most of the game community (including both players and journalists/media figures and developers) have engaged with is probably Harry Potter.
I've been trying to read a bit more nonfiction, but Lord knows I'm an incurable philistine.
What is Yea Forums reading right now?
OLD THING GOOD
SÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖÖY
Is this the same artist slowly dying?
Yes, dementia.
"Art" is a value judgment intended to dignify its subject. It has no actual meaning.
>entertainment (x6)
Much of what's considered "high art" today was intended as decoration. Similarly, so-called "art music" was once considered entertainment. Clearly, the key functional distinction of "art" is that it makes one feel high-brow.
I don't really believe in the walking simulator "art game" thing, but I read classic lit, have delved into film history and pre-60s records, and have watched most of the pre 60s Japanimation that is available outside of Japan (some via special event screenings, some online, some by importing DVDs by proxy). I also read some books on animation history and I am interested in other forms of art but haven't had the time to look into them.
I agree that people who parrot the games are art bullshit and don't even engage with other art forms or with the history are annoying and usually not very smart.
Yes for my gamins sessions I play Stockhausen in one ear and Penderecki in the other; I keep one eye constantly flitting between the works of Rothko and my signed first edition of À la recherche du temps perdu (mama's favourite!) and keep the other fixed firmly on Senran Kagura Shinovi Versus (Vita/2013).
In the evenings I meditate, undulate and weep.
YER FLAT! NO TALENT!
>But when you get someone calling The Last of Us and other B-movie games art I can only think of picrel.
Wow an OP that is not a faggot
everything is art
this post is art
This. There are "people" who think TLoU has a good story and that makes it a good game.
I enjoyed Tomb Raider 2013 well enough but would never in a million years call it art.
Art is the subjective nature of objective work. Everything is art, just because it's bad doesn't make it not art.
this
You're completely missing OP's point. It's not an issues of whether games are or are not art, it's that people who are really hung up on it have little exposure to other mediums.
Is The Teletubbies art? Is an advert art? I agree that bad art exists but I also think that good entertainment exists.
I don't really give a shit about "art" because really it means absolutely fucking nothing but I think it should only really be used for games that have exceptional gameplay, music, and storytelling, not onionscore muh feels shit like tLoU and Gone Homo.
That's basically what OP said for how to judge a good game, you even have an example in common
Sure. But games are a new medium. It isn't fair to compare it to paintings or movies because it has a different level of depth to it. People who shit on games for not being art almost always disregard the interactivity of games, and how that can affect the players emotions.
Yes, Teletubbies and ads are art. Maybe not of the highest brow nor creative intellect, but it is art nonetheless. What separates a film from an advert or the Teletubbies from an objective standpoint? Good art is not separate from good entertainment and vice versa, and I don't get the lack of correlation it's perceived as having.
Why should a piece's entertainment value not be accounted or by default detract from the arts intentions?
ironically, you seem hung up on it, which isnt surprising, since the only queers who use the post soiboi meme unironically are obviously soibois themselves. have you considered doing your parents a solid and hanging yourself?
you sound upset
Is that MechaGameZilla?
>People who shit on games for not being art almost always disregard the interactivity of games
And that's wrong, but it's not any better that people obsessed with games being art completely ignoring other medium. I think everyone would benefit from knowing a bit about music, film, painting, games, etc
Define art in a way that encompasses all that is considered to be art art, but disallows video games without using the term "video game" or synonyms thereof.
I'll wait.
The point is not that video games are art, but that the question whether something is or isn't art is trivial.
Sounds like you're obsessing over it, I just know art when I see it, I don't care what other people think it's how it affects me personally that matters
youtube.com
youtube.com
Is there some sort of prerequisite/threshold required for someone to be able to start talking about art?
>The Teletubbies art?
There is definitive objective artistry in the teletubbies. Someone had to design the costumes, the set, someone had to write a plot, however rudimentary. If something is the sum of artistic processes then is it not also art? Or is artistry lost by combining different form thereof? Wouldn't that mean that no film can be art?
>Is an advert art?
There's this guy, I think he was called Audrey Wardhole or something like that. He was a pretty big deal in advertising, but he's also a big name artist and people rarely distinguish between his ad work and his art.
unfortunately not, which is why you get shitty pseudposting like .
This.
I have my Ph.D in Art History and I have a good cringe every time someone is like "hurrhurr Video Games are art"
It isn't art until rich people say so.
As far as I know none of you plebs can afford a 50 million dollar painting that is only worth that much because collectors said so
purity at heart by kierkegaard
nothing is art
>fillings
LMAO
>being this much of a cuck for the rich
Guess who's got two thumbs and is going to die in the revolution?
All games contain digital art, but that is not art in the true sense of the word
Art tends to be intellectual.
Avengers movies aren't art unlike kubrik films
As evidenced by this board, the majority of video game consumers are far from intellectual and often downright stupid
A game must be made with an intellectual goal, and be stimulating to intellectuals to be considered art. Therefore, very few games meet this standard, and it is erroneous to consider video games in general as art