Are visual novels games?

>if you hold forward enough you'll eventually see the ending

Do they contain any elements of challenge, strategy, or gameplay beyond selecting from a handful of dialogue choices?

Nobody really cares.

Are CYOA books games?

Are pop up books movies? Of course not, they are just books that use a 3d representation.
Visual novels are exactly the same.

are feet shoes

no

just hold ctrl to kill diablo bro

Sweet Mami remake fucking when?

No.
Being a "game" explicitly demands that it implements the definitive mechanism of a game with in it.
If it does not feature some degree of optimized decision making with risk/reward involved it is, by definition, not a game.

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but what if you play serious sam

this but ironically

Based game theory chad

>hold the right mouse button long enough and win

Yeah, they are considered as such by every video game distribution platform. The only people who argue this fact are people who come up with their own ultra-specific definition of video games that somehow excludes VNs

How come changing the dialogue pattern and love levels in this never sticks when you do scene select.

>Being a "game" explicitly demands that it implements the definitive mechanism of a game with in it.
But user, risk/reward isn't a necessity for a game. It's not even in the definition. Also "game" and "video game" have different definitions as well. Neither mentions risk/reward.

They're games with the shittiest gameplay ever.

>optimized decision making with risk/reward involved
Do branching story routes based on your decisions not count?

>If it does not feature some degree of optimized decision making with risk/reward involved it is, by definition, not a game.
So most modern AAA games aren't games? Who would have thought.

it depends. if they have some kind of puzzle mechanic like ace attorney or zero escape, yes. if they're just reading with the occasional "choose your own adventure" bullshit then no.

Only if there is a lose state.

>Being a "game" explicitly demands that it implements the definitive mechanism of a game with in it.
Objectively wrong.
And you were so sure of yourself, too.

Just keepin' it literal.

>But user, risk/reward isn't a necessity for a game
Yes it is, even in ones which are entirely cooperative.

>Do branching story routes based on your decisions not count?
They might, they might not. It depends on what the optimization goal of the story is (if any), and whether you get closer/further to it.
However most games with branching stories also have more gameplay elements; combat, trading, social politics, games within the game.

If it's something like "Gone Home" where all paths inevitably lead to a singular ending, with no portion of risk/reward games in between, it's not a game but just a visual method of storytelling.

And visual story telling can still be interesting to people.
But we're talking definitions here, not feelings.

>So most modern AAA games aren't games?
You're saying that not me, so it's up to you to prove/disprove that statement.

>Objectively wrong
>Provides no further arguments, examples, citations

Cool story bro.

sukebei.nyaa.si/view/2634637

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I hate nu-Yea Forums so fucking much

m00t himself said they are

any recs from this torrent?

>However most games with branching stories also have more gameplay elements
We're talking Visual Novels here man.
Most of them only have text or dialogue choices, and those choices from a list throughout the game determine what route you end up on.

>m00t
who?

I expected you to look up the definition of the word you were talking about, but I see even that simple task was too much for you. Here, have a dictionary definition or two.
>merriam-webster.com/dictionary/game
>merriam-webster.com/dictionary/video game

I know there's literally nothing you can say to actually refute this, but please feel free to reply with butthurt.

>tfw no cute wolf-gf that cooks spicy meat for you

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Yes okay, so then the question is, is there any reason any of those routes would objectively have more or less value than others.

If yes, then it is a game, albeit not a very good/complex/engaging one.
Though that could perhaps depend on the story. A point of discussion for this would be the older quality point-and-click adventure games, like King's Quest, or I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream.

If no, then it is not a game.

>merriam-webster.com/dictionary/game
>animals under pursuit or taken in hunting

Surely that's what you were pointing to.

Assert your own arguments, rather than waiting for me to take advance a turn and setup pitfalls for you to try and exploit.

One might say you're really gaming this conversation.
And now this conversation itself is constituted as more of a game than Going Home.

They're more games then all these interactive movies we've been getting the past few years.

You've basically gone and described a good majority of visual novels, good job.

That's not a VN. Or a game. It's a flash movie with a scene selector.

>the palpable butthurt of someone who was irrefutably destroyed
Delicious. Thanks for not dissappointing.

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You're welcome ?

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This. But I would consider a bad end not to be a fail state.

KILL ALL TRANNIES

>canceranon didn't live to see Liru
Stream it then, if you're so brave!

>dlc
never ever

They are but that doesn't necessarly mean they're good games since most of them have nonexistent gameplay, just like walking simulators.

have sex

yeah, me too. but mostly i wanna put my dick through that ring.

Liru a shit. Doesn't even do anal.

what do boobies feel like Yea Forums

>text based games are games and have always been games
>if we add visuals to it, they're not games anymore
i hate visual novels as much as the next guy, but this logic is retarded

like bags of salty milk and coins

What about Ace Attorney?

Some cases just have it so it's like a clear game over, but others have bad endings, usually the final case.

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pretty good, man.

Anal is literally shit. It's also the kind of sex fags have.

anal feels good, man. of all the times i've had sex, i came the quickest when fucking my girlfriend in the butt. if she either cleans well or you wear a condom, it's no problem.

>game where you're constantly making decisions to progress is the same as clicking the next button to read text that progress the story for you and you occasionally make a decision.
nice trying to simplify two different things.

Walking Simulators are more games than VNs change my mind.

does the ps3 have games?

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That doesn't make them better

that's the difference between a good game(usually taxt adventure games, but not all text based games are adventure ones) and a bad one, not between text based games and visual novels.
There's quite a lot text based games that have a lot of reading where you just click "next" with just few decisions, and lots of visual novels that have a lot of decision making with multiple paths(not limited to 2 or 3 endings depending on one choice).

dumb fat wolf

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DLC when it has been 3 years

delet

the tension is THICK between us, user

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What is Miu up to these days? More pet crabs?

season 2 fucking when

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Someone recommend me a VN that has CGs with gore or something of the sort.
I have already read MLA, Kara no Shoujo and Saya no Uta