How did she get determination?

>probably

Why people always assume their headcanons are canons when it comes to this game

Well then how does he know about you coming back after dying?

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>tfw no susie gf

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The game has a lot there between the lines. When you tell him he's killed you before he's not surprised at all, and he's fought several humans before, odds are at least a few might have said something similar after a few retries.

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FUCK SUSISEPOSTERS
MUFFET POSTERS RISE UP

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Susie is clearly superior to all other Undertale girls, in that she actually has character development.

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She was just able to. That's how badass she is. People like saying that dumb fantheory of Alphys injecting her with mild determination one time, but that's dumb.

Why shouldn't Sans also get it, then?

Asspulls to make genocide route more fun

>a fat skeleton is canonically more powerful than a hero empowered with the hope of all living beings
Bullshit.

Sans has given up. He went into the fight knowing he would inevitably lose. He put in a token effort to stop the destruction of all things and tried to cheese you into fighting him forever.

He just knows how to cheat the system, that's all

He's probably the least determined monster there is. He says as much on every route how he gave up long ago and doesn't care any more, the only reason he finally steps up at the end is because he's the only one left able to do so.

It was an anime moment. But instead you were the villain and you watched the hero have their arc and rise up as a true hero. The song is called "Battle Against A True Hero" after all

Sans isn't more powerful though, He literally cheated the whole fight. He has 1 hp lol

He's canonically the weakest enemy. And just big boned.

He is the weakest monster. He just found a way to cheese the fuck out of fights. He's weak as hell he only has 1 hp

Sans, Chara, and Flowey are characters that can see beyond the 4th wall, or are at least able to glimpse something.
Sans and Flowey use this to cheat, or alter the rules of the game, and Chara just uses it to kill things if you give him the soul.

>him

youtube.com/watch?v=xX_imE4zKD4
Thread theme

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I am Jerry

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why would you say something so controversial yet so true
based

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Fuck off Jerry!

Which animes have the hero get their "friendship is the true power" boost, only to get their shit kicked in by the villain afterwards?

It's what makes it so great.

>give a character an hour and a half of development
>has a real quick turn-around
>clearly superior
game isn't even fucking done, there's no say in making this claim

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Undyne is pretty great as well. But let's face it, Susie is a joy all around.

>The game has a lot there between the lines.
It's just you trying to fill the holes.

I don't think Undying was a "friendship" moment. It was a "I'm not going to fucking let you destroy everything, even if you have to kill me a million times over" moment. Unfortunately, Chara at that point kind of had the capability to do a million and one damage more than what she could physically muster.

I love my quacker

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She remembers them because she outlived them.

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With things that are readily placed in the game that are intended for the player to do so if they so choose to look into them.
>Chara
>implying

I love how fanart gives susie a tail even though she doesn't actually have one.

Papyrus best girl

She says that when kids fall down sometimes she feels like she already knows them before meeting them. I don't think the game mentions anything else related to resetting having an effect, except for when Sans mentions that they measured a lot of interference with the timeline, so there is some kind of lasting detectable effect even if it's not in their memories. Maybe it's just that her soul remembers, that'd be some nice jrpg style shit.

Why are the characters so enjoyable in these dumb pixel mess games?

its the complete opposite ethos to MUH GRAFIX

It's like Dark Souls. Canonically dying only happens if you rage quit and never play it again.

Why is he so weak, anyway? Shouldn't he have average power? I guess it doesn't matter since he's not really a monster anyway.

I don't understand what you mean by Chara, isn't it still the player playing Frisk?

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I interpreted that as Toriel being aware that the kids have used their save file (like a deja vu moment), similar to how Sans can recognize stuff from "the look on your face". Toriel can't use the save function herself.

A bunch of characters have vague memories on your second playthrough, including Toriel, Papyrus, and Undyne. Toriel even remembers your favorite flavor the second time around.

He never fights or trains or cares about anything going on, he just cheats out of convenience so has no reason to do so.
Perhaps trying to avoid his sins. Chara is just hitching a ride for most of it but the player, as Frisk, is the one taking all the actions.

human semen

soul

In Genocide, Undyne says that Alphys sent word to Asgore to eat the souls and prepare, but when you reach him, he hasn't done that and has no idea who you are. Why?

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An attempt to psyche you out maybe? Or Alphys being the flake she is was too afraid and ran away.

Alphys did everything else Undyne said she did, though, so it couldn't be a lie. My only idea is that maybe Flowey interfered?

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I always liked to think that Alphys experimented on her by injecting her with determination after she found out that the human was murdering everyone.

Then why doesn't she become an Amalgamate?

Well, the records in the true lab show that it took a few days before the monsters injected with determination became Amalgamates. It's not a stretch to suggest that she didn't even have the time to become an Amalgamate. I mean, she starts melting into a white puddle as she dies, like how the Amalgamates are amorphous white blobs

she got it from Galuf

I like to think that Flowey probably intercepted whatever message might have been sent, among the other things he did behind the scenes to help you along. Hence why he ran straight to Asgore to try and warn him.

That's reasonable, thanks.
Didn't think of that, thanks.

because tobyfox is based

They became hollows. Pay attention to the lore, retard

So what is Deltarune's connection to Undertale? Obviously Sans knows what's going on.

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alternate universe, toby confirmed that much
the tweets also imply Gaster is doing something behind the scenes

I remember some people theorising that Sans is a darkner a while ago due to him bleeding after his fight. Judging by how his workshop in UT references 'don't forget', I'd say he came to the UT universe from the DR universe. "I gave up trying to go back a long time ago." and "You must really want to go home. Hey, I know the feeling, buddy."; both of those lines seem to hint at something like that too.
On a semi-related note, I can't shake the feeling that Papyrus is gonna be a different character from his Undertale incarnation. Maybe like the creepy nerd he was originally imagined as.

I don't understand how Sans can bleed when Papyrus can't, since we see Papyrus turn to dust.

It's really unlikely that she'd just have some lying around, that she would be willing to reveal her past to explain she would have it, or even that Undyne would just let her inject her with stuff, before they're actually going out at least. Also the determination only manifests during the fight after you attack her to begin with.
The melting is caused by them not being able to handle or control Determination, they wouldn't have been injected with as much as Undyne was creating at that time. Plus she was fighting and lost so she'd break down faster, it's only her sheer willpower keeping her together but she has that to spare. And of course, Amalgamates are multiple monsters melting together into one mass.

It's ketchup.

That is definitely another possibility, considering the shithead that he is.

maybe he didn't? it could be ketchup from what we know.
Also how do you explain Grillby's being scratched out and replaced with Sans? It would imply sans came from UT to DR

Asgore either shut himself away from communications at the time and Alphys couldn't reach him, or she had the evacuation take priority and when it came time to reach Asgore, she got terrified of the human finding her and stayed put, trying unsuccessfully to call him instead.

There were 6 kids before the player, some of them must have mentioned Asgore killing them multiple times.

you were the only one who kept going after the first game over

You find tons of empty bottles of it at his guard station. He straight up drinks the stuff.

If it's ketchup, then Sans must be a monster and a Darkner or whatever, so why die off-screen?

>so why die off-screen?
because he walked off

Guys, I think I'm in love with Undyne. Don't tell Alphys.

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>Toriel says she frequently remembered just knowing things about the other humans who fell.
How does this prove the other humans could save?

Because she 'just knows' things about you in a second playthrough, along with the other major characters.

Who knows? Maybe he's not even dead.

DragonBall Super Tournament Arc

The power over the timeline is linked to whoever has the most determination. That's why Flowey was able to reset before humans showed up. Some people are able to notice and remember things from previous timelines without actually remembering it, mainly being Toriel and Asgore, the two who interacted with the humans directly knowing what they were.

Well that's because you can save. I don't see how that means the other humans could.

I understand that, but I still don't understand how that proves anyone except Flowey and the player character could save.

You gain EXP when he dies, so he definitely dies. We don't know if Darkners and humans give EXP, though.

Human souls can naturally generate and store determination. Also they say things referring to all the humans that passed through, not just you.

I just want Deltarune to come out so I have a new soundtrack to listen to

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>Also they say things referring to all the humans that passed through, not just you.
But again, that just means humans passed through there. They don't make any mention of something that would hint that the other humans could save.

The sans fight is actually pretty clever, every attack sans does only hurts 1HP but he spams so many of them it seems like he does more damage
the truth is that he's cheesing the absolute fuck out of you in hopes that you'll just give up
the entire point of determination is that you don't have it when you give up.

to add on that, the reason why humans are infinitely stronger than monsters is because 99% of monsters don't have a glimpse of determination, and even though Undyne managed to catch a glimpse of it to keep going even after you stomp her, it was still not enough
Monsters don't have determination because they care enough to keep going like humans do, they are LITERALLY jokes and puns that don't really matter, like actual video game monsters and enemies like the minions in a FPS game or random encounter enemies in JRPGs.

But Flowey had a lot of determination and he still couldn't get past Asgore without a human soul as crutch.

That's a fair point, but it's not like EXP and LV are concrete power levels so much as reflections of your emotional capacity, so maybe it counted.

because he still was just a monster. He still didn't have ENOUGH determination to keep going.

its implied that he already killed asgore a billion times before and got bored of it. he only stopped being able to save/load after frisk arrives at mt ebott because human DT overrides artificial DT.

she also still refuses to die and melts if you kill her in neutral, so she always has determination

monsters aren't TRUE GAMERS. They give up too easily and are like videogame journalists, acting like tumblrtards and taking life too easy. The few real gamer monsters were Undyne and Flowey which discovered the true power of VIDEO GAMES. Frisk was just a GAMER that happened to be there to P0WN all those N00BS

>Maybe like the creepy nerd he was originally imagined as.
holy fuck if delta rune papyrus is the dedan papyrus that never made it in I'd shit my pants
that would be such a toby fox thing to do, wouldn't it

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>its implied that he already killed asgore a billion times before and got bored of it.
Wrong, Asgore safeguards the human souls. If he could kill Asgore, he would've gotten the souls and gotten through the veil and wrecked shit and all that. He literally tells you he couldn't get through Asgore.

Toby, we need you to work on deltarune.

I cheated for Sans fight. Multiple bullet hell patterns in a row without break and bones attacking you in the menu is too hard for me.

I cheated by bringing multiple pies and that's it.

>Toriel says she frequently remembered just knowing things about the other humans who fell.
You might be being intentionally dense then.
>If you save/load, people know things about you from previous timelines they don't know how they know.
>Torial/Asgore mention knowing things about other humans without understanding how they knew.
Is it an out-and-out concrete explanation they can save? No, but we're talking about a game that does half it's worldbuilding by saying things indirectly. If you don't acknowledge that, you're retarded or disengenuous as fuck.

Okay, I get what you mean now, emphasis on the "just" knows.
Do you remember any quote about that?

>makes the healer a cute boy
>makes the bruiser a butch girl
What does Toby Fox meme by this?

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Toriel says that whenever humans fall, she feels like she already knows them. Like she's "meeting an old friend for the first time.".

This, I can't get enough of Don't Forget and I keep finding myself humming it to myself.

LE FUCKING PASTA DE MERDE!!!

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>sans is ""killed""
>he's covered in ""blood"", even when monsters don't bleed
>then he says he's going to Grillby's and """dies"""
>next time he appears in another timeline with the whole Grillby's place renamed after himself
He faked the blood with ketchup and you know it

They gave up you retard like how the fuck is this a question.

Fuck outta here.

Alphys injected it in her vaginally

He does die, just off screen. You get the xp. The blood was totally ketchup, unfortunately. It's a really holy shit moment just pondering why Sans would be bleeding...until you realize it's ketchup.

Will she be straight in Deltarune?

I find that doubtful, the only time Flowey says he can't get past someone is Sans.

Heavy implied they experimented on determination. The fact that when she dies she goes into a goo JUST LIKE THE EXPERIMENTS and is able to change forms means she was injected with it.

Military will be popular candidates for testing beside dying people like the experiments. The experiments failed most likely because they were to weak and why they needed to group together to stay alive. A healthy subject would give better results.

Man I hadn't thought about Deltarune/Undertale in months, but this thread brought back a lot of familiar feelings. The intrigue, the emotions. Where the fuck is Deltarune Toby you fucking HACK

It's a prequel

its literally determination
when they're not determined they just fucking die

6 more years.

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No, we need to go deeper.
>Sans, almost dead from his fight realises the world is doomed
>drags himself to Snowdin and manages to get the broken machine to work
>it malfunctions, transporting him and the vacant Grillby's to Deltarune in the past
>Sans then abandons Grillby's to move into his old underground lab to research ways to stop determination
>meanwhile past Sans discovers Grillby's and thinks it'd be a cool place to remodel and moves in

>two sanses telling awful puns to each other at the same time

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AU and a prequel, cause why not

Tails get trolled

Human (has determination) and a monster (no determination) made a babby. Think about it, seven humans lived down there at least long enough to outgrow their shoes, one of whom owned a gun. Since there is no specific timeline, chances are at least one of them hit puberty and boned a monster before dying. On top of that undyne has a very human body and proportions, and unusual strength

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I want to make this spider happy forever.

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the other six humans fell down the mt ebott hole because they were suicidal = no determination to go on = easy kills

>humanxmonster
not a good idea

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isn't chara the one who's dragging kids to the mountain?
and then somehow giving control of them to some stranger to play like a video game?

I think this is most likely too. "Legend says that those who climb Mt. Ebott never return." They knew what they were doing.

Fuck no where did you even get that from.

it just feels like this can only make sense from a meta-perspective
by this point chara already assumed direct control of frisk and the whole game, so it just makes sense to make that the only one they can't completely control is someone outside the game

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You oneshot him anyway.

Why did Yea Forums pretend to hate Undertale for so long?

An effect of overexposure. It's died down to a tolerable level.

I kinda get where you're coming from, but I think the real answer to the initial question is that the other humans can't save because they don't have Chara.
Chara is the "the demon that comes when people call its name." Their name was only called when the player entered the name on the new save file, so they didn't exist on the meta level until the game started.

Alphys tried to contact Asgore via image posts, emoji, and other Web 2.0 things.
His phone is not compatible and could not display it.
She could've called him directly or sent a simple text message but she's too much of a sperg to even think about communicating like a normal human being.

Gaster nothing, that's %hilariousname%'s writing style.
Unless someone is going to come up with truly the edgiest and batshit of fan theories about how Gaster and %hilariousname% are the same person.

I blame those newfags from Gaia online. They always make a discussion worse.