MMO is dying

Cry me a river.

No. p2w MMOs are dying, and that's unironically a good thing

Half of players are venezuelian gold farmers.

i wish blizz had went through with titan instead of carving it up to make overwatch, i would have liked to see how the development twisted its way from a MMO to a fps

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legitimately one of the best choices

Wow it is almost as if copying WoW's terribke formula is a bad idea! Who would gave guessed!?

The most interesting thing about MMOs was the novelty of interacting with a bajillion other people in a fictional setting. This is no longer that interesting.

not true everquest is still around

WoW Classic is a thousand times better than any sort of WoW 2 that modern Blizzard could make.

Yes, it was literally so good that nothing that came after it has been able to stick. In other words, only WoW 2 can save us.

>Bless Online
Why was this shit hyped so much? There is barely anything interesting about it.

back in 2014 befre this turd was shit out it was advertised as F2Pm then they were asking for early access, later you had to pa for full game

they deserve what happend to them

Nice try, faggot

Heavy marketing. It was even shilled 24/7 on Yea Forums till a week after release

More, it was eaten up by some many retards, that it warped the genre into trend chasing.
The publishers not realizing that the only reason Blizzard games sell is that they have a critical mass of dick-sucking retards who wouldn't know a good game if it bit them on the ass.

Blizzard games have always been shit, they've just been mildly prettier than the competition.

Wasn't that generic Korean mmorpg whose only advertised feature was a tiger race and that also it launched multiple times in multiple countries and failed absolutely everywhere?
No big surprise.

Just waiting for TERA to shut down already so I can finally let go.

As much fun as it is standing in one spot treating the game like an idle game and having no one talk in chat unless it's about how to better improve your idle experience, I'll have a hard pass.

>Playing Orbus, Toontown Rewritten, and PWI

I don't see any issues here user

didn't they have a genuine public shill program on their site? "community head" or some shit, they just told you to advertise for them and maybe get some in-game bullshit i don't remember very well

Don’t worry, the genre is saved

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i kinda liked blade and soul, but it was so horribly optimized. the rest were just terrible. black desert in particular.

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>Trusting current Blizzard to make a WoW 2 that isn't utter, turbocasual, whale-milking garbage

>Game with genuinely interesting story, lore, and characters
>Bogged down due to being MMO and gameplay suffering

Still more interesting than most shit out. Kind of want to see where its at now

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Dark Age of Camelot when

wildstar was the only good MMO ever released but the suits at big companies always run anything good into the ground. ff14 is sickeningly bad, really does just go to show the power of a popular IP

>wildstar
>good
go away, cupcake

MMO was never good

>The only thing that can stop Everquest is Everquest 2
-literally everybody in the year 2000

A WoW 2 won't do shit. It'll be someone else that shakes up the formula like WoW did back in the day.

reminder that a top end wildstar raiding guild tried to show up wow raiding guilds in legion (saying wildstar was harder and wow was trivial) and ended up disbanding from how difficult it was

at this point, just quit on your own.
don't be a pussy and be forced off

The only MMO that was ever good was Maplestory.

I'm gonna get back into Blade and Soul after they update the engine. KFM was a lot of fun to play.

Glad. These games are fucking terrible. Never ever fall for the MMO meme bros. It's all a complete waste of fucking money and time that you will never get back. Don't ever let someone trick you into playing them.

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This. Only the most naive, brain addled zoomer would think WoW2 is a good idea. Go play BFA for a preview of what they think is good design.

We’re going home. No changes.

It's insane how Blizzard hasn't done that yet

It's equally insane how they think adding gorillion player races is going to fix their shit

It’s a dead genre, it doesn’t matter whether someone shakes the formula or not

This genre has been dead for years, why do people keep asking for more? I don't see the appeal.

What happened to NA Tera?

Dofus is doing just fine.

JUST STOP HAVING A LFG SYSTEM AND CROSS-SERVER INTERACTION AND I'LL PLAY YOUR FUCKING GAME REEEEEE

EVE Online is still going strong. Too bad the game itself is absolute dogshit, and the timegating keeps on getting worse.

BnS UE4 is a meme.
It's not going to happen anytime soon.

What would WoW 2 even be anyway? Nearly all threats excluding Void Lords are dealt with or in the process of being dealt with

Unless we go to space and settle on some other alien world paired with a huge ass timeskip

youtube.com/watch?v=0qj4hgJeSe4

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Is it even possible to get into EVE at this point or is still ACCOUNTING SIMULATOR IN SPACE?

>playing Korean or chink MMMos

They deserve it for making pay2win garbage

MMO is a boomer genre. Kids today give zero fucks about exploring a fantasy world with their friends, they just want to play fortnite on their phone

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>timegating
I thought that you could buy skillpoint injectors now?
I'll defend the absurd timegating anyway, because I knew plenty of people that bought high skill accounts, with expensive flashy ships and just lose them because they don't understand how to play.
t. ex-goon

due to an error, people were able to sell some shit for like 4x more than intended AND you could breakdown an item for 800 tokens each, and buy more of that item for 25 tokens each indefinitely

>What would WoW 2 even be anyway?

Nothing. It's just something a retarded Blizzard fanboy who believes more in hype than understands design would say.

Why? Why did it have to be a shitty fucking mmo instead of a glorious single-player game with amazing writing??

The Korean version wasn't that bad, it was very reminiscent of vanilla wow, and it didn't run like ass. They revamped the combat for NA, rerolled to the most fucking ancient version of the game, removed pet training, didn't optimize the client a single bit so event 1080's were getting 15fps or less outside of dungeons. It's like they treated the game like an actual early access, when people were expecting a fully functional game just maybe with less content than Korea.

It's fucking sad, because the game was actually as fair as it gets in the realm of Korean mmos that get localized wthout an abusive cash shop, and the char creator was very enjoyable, but they had to fuckup even the combat for basically no reason other than "western audience wants action combat".

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And then they made the gameplay worse for reasons no one understand

that's a funny way of spell ragnarok online

>Meanwhile Guild Wars 2 is still chugging around
Fuck this world

This.

MMOs committed suicide. They all wanted to be as "accessible" as possible and in turn ended up pushing out the thing that made them fun: The exploration and sense of adventure you got when you WEREN'T in control of every aspect of the game.

Now modern MMOs are: Level by yourself until you hit a wall, then use a finder. Level by yourself until you hit a wall, then user a finder. Hit the end-game wall and suck some dick to join some raids and bam, spend the next year on the gear treadmill until it's not fun anymore.

WHO THE FUCK WANTS TO DO THAT AND WHY DOES EVERYONE THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA?

Tree of Savior was the last shred of hope I had because it had prior RO devs on it, and even that went full-on jew with the finders, quest chains, and tons of microtransactions. Fuck this genre. Hopefully it will die and be reborn anew.

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MMOs are stuck being instant gratification shitfests.

tfw not a burger and cant play dragon quest x

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More inter-faction conflict, asspulls and introduction of new villains. LK could come back, they could (and should) retcon a lot of what happened in later expansions.

It is very much so still accounting simulator in space. You'll either be fighting bots, ganging up on someone with no risk for your group, or getting ganged up on by people with no hope of survival. There are no other notable interactions.

Skillpoint injectors are so expensive, buying them is practically impossible without either grinding ISK every waking second of every day, or spending real life money to buy ingame funds.

such a true image. the cbts were great... actually all cbts of an MMO are usually great. TERA was a great example, probably the most fun I've ever had with Yea Forums /vg/ and Yea Forums in a game ever

>Kind of want to see where its at now
No you don't. They rebooted the game by cutting a bunch of content and making it F2P at which point the player counts dropped under 100 people global. It's beyond dead now.

mmos are too shallow, and there is hardly any meaningful interaction between players.

all aspects of mmos should be player controlled. basically mmos need to look at eve online which gets the main concept right, and expand on it

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This, not only that they refuse to put players in situations where they might not be comfortable IE: Lost somewhere, at an outpost they don't know where it is, having to stick together with people they don't know, etc.
It's handholding start to finish and they wonder why no one finds the modern incarnations as interesting as RO or Everquest was back in the day. Runescape devs still don't understand why 07 is a better game than they can ever shit out.

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what are some games

>NFA VS TFT

i miss it bros

For some reason, the majority of MMO players believe that the real game starts at max level.
MMOs should start at level 1.

What guild? There were only maybe 3 guilds in wildstar that were the top. Maybe 4 if you count the entire life cycle.

also, on the flipside, I heard of hardcore wow guilds disbanding on the first boss in datascape. To be fair though, system daemons was tough as shit.

Absolutely, I think CBTs are the best time because everyone is interested in it, all the secrets are still fresh, and a bunch of the accessibility and easy-mode mechanics aren't in yet.
ToS CBT was probably the last time I remember sitting in a field with 12 other people having a casual conversation while grinding. It might be the last time, too.

>still no TLP FFXI server

and no i dont want to play some shit emulator with a whore giving BJs for gear to the admin

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Aww I was hoping to see some of the storylines I recall that were left hanging resolved along with how the overall main story continued etc

There were tons of cool plots at play

What about Eve.
Eve players are a special brand of autist, I don't see them quitting.

If having a group finder hurts the game, then the game itself was bad.
This excuse is on par as "it is fun with friends" in regards to bad bad party games.

>mmos are dying
>post only shitty koreon mmos
>and the phone game Albion

It still blows my mind that people pay $60 for a game, and then pay $15/mo to continue playing it.
Console games and online access is basically the same thing.

>MMOs should start at level 1.

I agree in principle, but how would you balance PVP or end game raids for lvl 1's?

what are MMO

Archeage CBT was the greatest fucking thing on earth and I will never not be mad that they ruined that game

WoW before LFG & cross-server phasing was pretty enjoyable.

God I miss ToS and TERA, too.
I miss you NFA
I miss you Kotatsu

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I would love to give FFXI a looksie, but fuck actually paying for it.

Are there any decent private servers with a good population?

MMOs are over
It's all Gacha now

You don’t. You make the leveling experience, as well as low level instances, fun and interesting.

It WAS so good but instead of innovating like WoW did all these other companies just try to copy it and instead we end up with 100s of these casual babby MMOs that die in 2 months after everyone completes 100% of the content.

At least then there was semblance of server community.

It still hurts. I fell in love with the game but then when it launched, Trion jewed the fuck out of their players and the rampant botting made getting any sort of land impossible.

I quit EVE because of the constant blueballing, around the halloween war. Nullsec just wasn't fun with the mechanics in place at the time. 2010-2013 was a good time though.
Also they killed Dust 514, which was based

metagaming is what kills mmos.

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What players? The game is 85% bots, 5% regular people, and 10% multiboxing autists hunting the regular players.

It was Invective from what I remember and can see from a quick search
They apparently made a lot of videos shit talking how much harder Wildstar was than WoW, talked down the top handful of WoW guilds
And when they tried to actually do the raid, they day raided (raid every day pretty much) and got less progress than a handful of 3-4 day guilds

Took a break from it, but I really want to keep pushing through it because I love everything about this except the damn gameplay which is really a shame considering everything else about this is great.

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Age of Wushu was great, kidnapping people, casual brawls, stealing tomes, going to jail, selling drugs, playing go, breeding silk worms, doing group tai chi, fighting the entire viet alliance on wudang school, progressing your shit poison character into a god of death, running the streets as a police with tangment, having drunken blobs of violent hobbos making other people drunk in Jimming, secret crafting shit only the top end guilds knew about during their crafting meetings, it's all been shit since that for me.

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>tfw can play dqx
>tfw its not the same if I can't play with Yea Forums bros

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>If having a group finder hurts the game, then the game itself was bad.
If the game is based around interacting with other people, then putting a tool that takes away player interaction is bad.
The content of MMOs isn't the monsters you grind, it's the people you're playing with. Mechanics aimed at hermits just minimizes the time you're playing with other people.

If this were an FPS or something where the selling point wasn't it being multiplayer, you'd be right.

Maybe if other mmos tried actually doing something unique and didnt just copy WoW they would have survived. Eve isn't perfect but there really isn't anything else like it on the market and thats why its survived for all of these years.

FF is dying too. It's already dead in EU and server split only make it worse

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VRMMOs are going to be big for sure, when the technology allows it.

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Man, it's almost like everyone is tired of WoW clones with insignificant differences and want to play something long term they can have an actual impact in, but every dev/pub is too terrified of doing anything different they won't even give a sandbox similar to Pre-CU SWG a chance. I guess 16 years of innovation couldn't possibly alleviate some of the shortcomings SWG had. Better just say MMOs as a whole are dead and move on to gatcha clickers and PUBG clones.

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Restart everything with time travel/alternate dimension shenanigans and turn it up to 11

>You don’t. You make the leveling experience, as well as low level instances, fun and interesting.

We're talking about MMOs here.

imagine not being a part of this youtube.com/watch?v=Dlc5W2lYirU

This, add more impossible content and horizontal progression you cunts.

I don't think so

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>no beast races
Pass.

That was an amazing time. TERA really peaked in beta
youtube.com/watch?v=BOSCv78NJZc

WoW, is and has always been a bad game.
You only played it because of the social aspects, therefore, "it is fun with friends"

Even a multiplayer FPS needs to be a mechanically good game first. This is not the case for MMOs where taking away the social aspect leaves you with an objectively lazy game.
Might as well be playing Facebook games.

The problem with group finders is that they give you too much control over the environment of the game.
MMOs are supposed to be wildernesses that you're exploring. It's supposed to not feel safe all of the time, and you're supposed to put yourself in those situations.

Anything that takes away from that atmosphere misses the point. Dungeon finders that make the most uneasy and challenging parts of the game into finding a good group, auction houses that cut out the bartering and player stores, maps and teleports that instantly bring you to places with no travel time, all of these take away from the game.

>every dev is terrified of doing something different
This is unfortunately the state of videogames right now and why it feels so stagnant.

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Does that have the heart incident? I think I was there for that.

"look at how much money we can milk from idiot whales" is not an indication that the genre is doing well

>Only $580m dollars across all MMOs in NA.
>With MONTHLY subs.
That's like 1M people across WoW and FFXIV at best. Christ.

actually nauseating

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THis is the fourth or fifth korean MMO I've heard getting gutted on it's way to the states. Why do Korean MMO devs do this? Why do they think that carving the game into tiny pieces and selling it ever works?

Correction, Invective weren't just "beaten by a handful of 3-night guilds"
they were beaten by literally thousands of guilds on every kill

>Invective
Never heard of them. The big boys in wildstar were voodoo, world last, and 2 others I can't fucking remember. It's possible they went with a different name though.

>Archeage

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the absolute state of p2p mmos

The only way to save mmos is to fix the whole "its fun 1000 hours in" shit. People these days wont put that much time in a fucking game.

>TFW all Wildstar needed to be enjoyable was some fucking optimization to be playable
>TFW they never optimized and just kept making beefier and beefier computers crawl

>Even a multiplayer FPS needs to be a mechanically good game first. This is not the case for MMOs where taking away the social aspect leaves you with an objectively lazy game.
It sounds more like you just don't like MMOs. MMOs, at least the core turn-based ones, aren't any more lazy than JRPGs gameplay-wise.
Not to mention: playing it with your friends isn't a selling point of the game, playing it with people is the selling point. That's where the conflict comes into play: You're not supposed to feel at home with friends all of the time.

Jesus fucking Christ whales really are killing video games.

>2016
Things were already in free fall then, it’s probably much worse today

>Why do Korean MMO devs do this?
They think Americans are stupid and impatient, they're also under the impression that they love microtransactions.
Maybe they're right, but I've never seen it turn out well for an MMO.

Starter quests in that were more interesting than the majority of other MMO quests

>tfw Vanishing of Tyler Freeborn quest chain

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I played on a toaster just fine, except for one room in GA that would tank fps.

what are some good mmos

All that really matters for industry players is making a profit. Revenue continues to grow in the MMO industry with minimal expenses since whales buy everything. Gacha games on mobile show us just how much useless shit whales are willing to waste their money on, the MMO industry is doing great exploiting people like that. It isn't dying, you just aren't the target market anymore

uooutlands.com/
but it's still alive and well

>Why do they think that carving the game into tiny pieces and selling it ever works?
They keep doing this retarded thing where they "license" out the localization instead of doing it in-house.

Which essentially results in two branches of the game. One branch made by the original devs, and another branch made by parasites who thought they could turn a game over for a quick buck. Even different branches of the same company can do this and ruin a good game for years (Nexon).

Bless pc was just a scam to make some quick cash to further fund the REAL bless overhaul, bless unleashed.

Literally no one plays this game without botting

I'm pretty sure Bless failed in Korea so the devs tried to make some radical changes before bringing it to the West hoping that it would help.

Bless' western release was handled by neowiz themselves though. The western publisher they partnered with originally backed out.

>They think Americans are stupid and impatient, they're also under the impression that they love microtransactions.
Can't argue with what works.
There may be a vocal majority that don't like microtransactions. But you only need to hook a handful of whales to be successful.

I played Bless for about 1,000 hours and also have a 1080. I was getting 60+ fps everywhere except in the major cities at launch, when servers merged, and when it went F2P. Outside of that, I always had 60+ fps in Bless

It's a bad game by the way so I don't recommend it to anyone, but you're wrong

this. Kids today are so stupid and so corrupt the concept of earning your power is just too much for them to handle. This translates into RL as well. Look a at twitter, just a bunch of faggot kids crying about life being hard

grow up faggots, or be removed for being weak and pathetic.

Reading the failure of Star Wars Galaxies and seeing what Archage did to rape the market. I get the impression that devs never want players to earn unicorns. Ever. They hate the concept. The concept of a player grinding endlessly to get that rare item or that extremely valuable QOL upgrade that makes things even more fun.

They don't want players to believe that the nigh-obtainable can be earned with hard work and the fun to be had on the way. They always claim to fear the poopsockers but they sell out to the whales nearly every time. And what isn't sold is parceled out in carefully timed daily bullshit or roulettes to encourage players to play at a regular interval instead of having fun and progressing at the time of their (Or god forbid their 5 man static's) choosing.

I just checked wayback (because their old wowprogress page is gone) and this is who they claim to be
>Our foundation is from Wildstar World First & US 2nd guilds Enigma & Subterfuge.
They did incredibly bad, it was a funny trainwreck
This was back in Q1/Q2 2018 btw

I disagree. What MMO's need are the following:

>A sense of jolly cooperation
>A reason beyond "oh I need to grind it's like a fucking job" to come back.
>A community.
>Content that isn't rendered outright obsolete with each update.
>Not gimping players from the start in order to sell "quality of life" shit from the cash-shop.
>Not having cash-shop cosmetics outright outshine what can be obtained through pure gameplay.
>Alternatively, cash shop could maybe accelerate some aspects of the process of getting cosmetics through gameplay if the player is so inclined.
>Also alternatively, appearances/outfits are all available from the start, and "gear" are just under-armor/stat increments.

For this I propose the following model:

>Group oriented gameplay.
>Largely PvP
>Construction and crafting akin to rust, fortnite, and more accurately what we probably should have fucking gotten with Everquest NEXT.
>This comes with building fortresses/ levels/ zones that other players may explore.
> Populate said zones with user friendly programmable enemies, bosses, ect.
> Effectively a PvP oriented Mario Maker MMO.
> Only with more nuance and options.

What was the heart incident?

>I'm going to fall for the Bless meme a second time

It is interesting if some care is taken into making the other players playing seem mysterious and interactable.

One of the great things about Vanilla WoW was the inability to inspect enemies. So I see a red name off in the distance, and unless we're startin' shit, we nod and go on our way because there's no real way to tell if dealing with them was worth it.
I haven't played since BC but I don't even think modern PVP works like that anymore. You can think less of the players around you than the NPCs you talk to simply because none of the players give you quests.

too much PvE focus on almost all new MMOs, designed for the new generation of people who don't care about sandbox games, open economy stuff etc. It's all just shit now and not enough people want to play PvP games

>single-handedly saves and kills MMOs for good

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>Dungeon maker MMO
No developer would ever get it right. Worse still it would be raped into another Clash of Clans clone if anyone ever tried

It wouldn’t work simply because players nowadays have a completely different mentality. People are a lot more fickle and seeking fast rewards nowadays.

It was a different time

It's almost like MMORPGs are not popular anymore, and WoW was just a fluke because it was based on an insanely popular PC game and had tons of celebrity advertisements for it.

BDO closed the SA out of incompetence towards hackers, though, not out of lack of popularity or little player count.
And good riddance too, thank fuck that shit's gone.

To be fair, they got rid of Shadow Arena in BDO because it was TOO successful and was unbalancing the game.

How old are you guys? I'm 32 and was able to experience MMOs in their prime. I played them all and have countless tales, memories, friends, and achievements across the gamut of the genre.

It's kind of odd to me that if you're early 20s ish then you kinda just missed out. And it's not something you can ever experience again because it's truly dead and cannot return because it's not the games' fault, it's just how the internet and how people are now.

This genre is dead and literally cannot return.

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this

A big reason why MMOs are dying is because people want instant gratification. Nobody wants to spend days/weeks farming for a single piece of gear anymore, they just want to run a 30 minute dungeon and get showered in loot, hence why nuWoW turned into that.

Why wasnt FFXIV 1.0 held up by brand?

What sounds better, rice or fried rice?

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It sucks that people as dumb as you get to communicate like everyone else.

>actual meaningful gameplay in VR
>modern north american internet connections handling the load required to process complex movement and interaction of hundreds of people at once with ther cucked comcast data caps
>people wanting to wear VR equipment for 8 hours straight

VR mmos are the memest of memes. ACTUALLY never ever, if you think about it for more than 10 seconds you'll realize it's a terrible combination

>This genre is dead and literally cannot return.

It's not dead, it's just returning to being a niche thing that only turbo-nerds do, like EverQuest and Ultima were back in the day.

If they just made WoW classic with an anime skin I'd fucking drop out of life.

>haha u dum xd

Nice counterargument, retard

I’m 29 and they pretty much marked my life. Hell, for ages I had this intense fantasy about the first MMO I played, and I always sought the same feeling again. It was an overwhelming feeling.

>Enigma
That's one of the names that was on the tip of my tongue. I remember one of their raiders got banned for botting. He automated his rotation or something. They had good players though. They were the only other guild besides world last to clear datascape when it was still a 40 man and before it was fine tuned. Plus, a lot of people used their build guides. Sounds like that dozen that went on to wow got carried hard.

I believe it's Xbone exclusive so I hope you're safe from that.

>bethesda
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!

youtube.com/watch?v=n7mjaD9xVeI

NFA / TFT shenanigans was peak Yea Forums community

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Unleashed does look like what bless rebuild project should've been. It's completely different, going so far as to rename npcs and change the lore.

DFO still unkillable

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Why would I argue with a dumbass, retard?

>TFT was making a heart in Velka field to celebrate the end of CBT3
>Aphotic (old private server RO guild lead by a guy who got cucked and sold his account) and Sunless (Furry guild that deteriorated due to internal drama) find out about the heart and immediately run over to Velka
>Gather in another channel, swap channels to land on top of the heart, and then declare war on TFT
>Lag results in them not all loading in at the same time that they declared war .

>Slow trickle of shitters results in people immediately realizing what was going on and breaking up the heart to fight them.
>They immediately retreat once it became clear that their ranks didn't work the way they thought it was.
>Back up onto a hill thinking they could throw spells down onto the advancing TFT members
>Don't realize that sitting on a hill puts them in a different vertical plane, resulting in a bunch of their heaviest-hitting Sorc and Mystic spells missing because they're fucking shitters.
>Promptly get wittled down until they back off
>Then swim into the middle of Lake Velka (Can't PVP while swimming)
>Stay there, stranded, until CBT3 ended.
>There's videos of some of them floating on Lake Velka's surface while people did the Lancer hook trick to walk onto the bottom of the lake, taking a selfie with their panty shots in the background.

Sad my computer was a toaster and couldn't record video, but I know it exists somewhere.

Albion was pitched as a free to play game retard

>TTGLxSlamJam remix
>Tribes speak being used in chat

Yep it was 2012

Honestly we just need someone autistic enough to bring back text based adventure MUDS. Those can be cheaply maintained, a proper home brewed client would be a mint and the need for player creativity would encourage a healthier community. Encourage RP, Downtime and non-combat skill growth and minigames to encourage players to learn.

Censorship sucks.

Imagine the people who still play MMO's

WoW poisoned the entire MMO market.
All the chimps tried to ape WoW instead of do their own things and surprise surprise no one left WoW for any of the WoW-clones.
Publishers have now begun sinking all the money into Early Access survival crafting and/or Battle Royale games as the new cashgrabs after being burnt by funding WoWclones that flopped.
And finally because communities are full of absolute, utter, totally whiny bitches these days. I shudder to think of trying to play an MMO these days, when online communities WANT to fill out report cards to mommy to punish bad players. Oh, did I say bad? I meant problematic. Being bad at the game isn't an issue but saying "holy shit what the fuck are you doing you tard stop aggroing everything" or "DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT ORDER TO PRESS YOUR BUTTONS IN, HEALSLUT? BECAUSE CLEARLY YOU DO NOT" would be.

Sounds familiar. I might have been there but its a blur now

Are MMOs a good way to make friends? What is a good one?

Picture so my question gets noticed.

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I know, being happy and shit. The sick fucks.

There are two types of games: games that people complain about, and games that nobody play.

That’s why no one pans your obscure weeb shit faggot

That's because the era of the MMO has passed. No one has the time anymore.

>this nostalgia feels
FUCK
Cabbage, Arurun, Tonnura, Enna

Apothecary misses you.

ffxiv was so held up by the brand that they scraped the game entirely and rebuilt it. besides it's not like the game wasn't played up until the shutdown before ARR.

>Old School Runescape has literally the highest active user counts in its history
>FFXIV steady and growing, new expansion coming out soon
>Wow Classic about to drop
>Guild Wars 2 somehow still healthy despite massive layoffs

Damn... This genre sure is dead...

rip tribes

yes, but the MMO needs to be one with a small playerbase otherwise you'll just meet trannies and memelord faggots
all my online friends are friends from MMOs on servers that had less than 2,000 active players

>What is a good one?
Classic WoW this summer, you'll be sure to meet people.

Im still mad they went with overwatch instead of making a sequel to wow

Im glad that overwatch is irrelevant nowadays

Cute Cthulhu.

>wake up to the hamtaro theme playing on TV
>I set it to turn on automatically so I could wake up early
>breathe in the fresh morning air and try to contain my inner excitement
>it's time to play all day long again

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I miss Erika
That's kind of the same way for me.
It's just dust.

Dust in the wind

being able to(and expected to) look up everything about a game is really the thing that is killing MMOs.

Yeah, fuck them, they should play (AAA first person shooter sequel #6) and (indie pixelshit game) instead.

>click yew tree
>tab out
riveting gameplay, bravo Jagex

I envy them unironically.

I don't mean the game mechanics only, I mean the game content too.
Like, more MMORPGs, half of the content depends on socialization, and socialization is very fickle, not a good replacement for content.

>A reason beyond "oh I need to grind it's like a fucking job" to come back.
A perfectly good plan, if your objective is retaining only the top percent of most obsessed players whiled riving away everyone else. Not to say that game that must be played as another job only makes it less enjoyable and sets on the burn in faster,

I haven't mentioned a single game, faggot

MMOs are a relic of a bygone era. Their time has come and gone.

It's still too far from release

How Albion now? I'd wanted to try it out but can't be assed to pay.

You know what I miss?
MMOs that tried to experiment.

>Probably sunk a hundred hours guarding crater
A modern Shattered Galaxy would be amazing, but the MMO craze is over.

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It's killing multiplayer games in general, but affects MMORPGs more. Everything now is all about le meta builds and there is barely any exploration involved.

Socialization is fucking raped in MMOs. I don't know why people say discord is anything knew, it's been going downhill for decades, People just won't fucking talk, they won't have fun discussing trite bullshit in the guild chat, it's all just sanitized and tiresome repeat drama.

Wow 2 on a brand new upgraded engine would literally save MMO gaming.

let me get a source my man.

Sometimes I miss wildstar.

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garbage

>that chat font
That alone is a relic of old school RPGs.

A shame Nexon is such a shit company and ruined every game they had. I miss Nexus/Dark Ages

sadly it wont happen

yeah, I wonder how many people actually consider this when they bring up WoW classic. there won't be anything for people to learn, there won't be discussion on how to accomplish something, it won't give you that sense of exploration that you had years ago you already know where to go, the entire game is going to be solved and that really hurts mmos.

There is nothing to talk about, literally everything about the games can be consulted on the internet. You don't have anything you can discover with other people.

>10 million was invested in to bless online, after it already failed.

it was fun for a whole 2 weeks
housing remained fun until the end

To be fair, 800x600 was its native resolution, Shattered Galaxy is an old, old game.
All the more reason I'd love a modern version of it.

>tfw you lock down the enemy faction in their capital and they can't escape for almost a fucking hour

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"Look It Up Yourself" by Fuk Yu.

>I miss Nexus/Dark Ages
Ironically Discord made doing shit on Dark Ages a little bit more viable, but it's still a very dead game.

I think the largest detriment to MMOs is that everyone thinks you need to have a million plus players to be successful. WoW drove that with its subcount all the way though WotLK. It also doesn't help that any form of micro transaction will eventually kill a MMO. They are kinda like compound interest where you make more an more money from them due to whales to the point where you sacrifice the core game to satisfy a smaller number of players. The only way we can enter a golden age of MMOs again is where they are developed without outside funding and having to answer to investors. Even then it will require the creators to resist the temptation for a quick cash grab on launch profits + micro.

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remember to claim your land on the 29th

I bought the collector's edition with half a year's worth of playtime. I never bothered to remake my character after the beta ended ;_;

Socialization only happens between people that are already friends, or have something connecting them other than the game itself.

Newsflash, nearly every player above casual wants to push their own performance higher, even if doing offmeta stuff. Competitiveness further strengthens the need to perform better by watching what others do, extracting all the data in the game and generally attempt to achieve the coveted solved game status.

Oh and I just got the the Galo Sengen. Yeah that completes the trinity of Yea Forums 2012

such a good game but feels like NA doesn't like 2d games/nexon forever fucked it up from there mishandling of it

This
MMORPGs aren't dying, they're just leaving the mainstream, and returning to being small niche communities. WoW hitting 12 million subscribers just pushed everyone's expectations way too high.

Before WoW, 500k active players was considered wildly successful.

>I think the largest detriment to MMOs is that everyone thinks you need to have a million plus players to be successful.
It's kind of true though, those games are designed to function with high populations, and every crap MMO no one even knew had thousands of players back in the day.

thanks man i found it.
nhentai.net/g/224338/

Mabinogi> maplestory fight me.

I THINK ALBION ONLINE SUCKS!

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No, because maple is objectively shit.

>Socialization only happens between people that are already friends, or have something connecting them other than the game itself.

Not him but this is incorrect, this is a misconception based on the current era of Hermit MMOs.

Socialization used to be a requirement because you were required at one point to interact with the people around you to form groups, grind for items, tackle harder areas/quests, or just show you around a place or teach you something.

Part of that was made obsolete by wikis, but the rest of it became obsolete only because MMOs started to pander to hermits, who became the majority of playerbases. To the point where they wouldn't even respond if you talked to them.

Way back in the day it wasn't uncommon to sit for hours talking with complete random strangers while you were grinding or were mining/crafting/etc.

Old school Runescape was an excellent example of 'Develop your social skills or get fucked'. Want to sell coal/goal/rune certs? You better be able to pitch them at the market.

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I like FF14, but it isn't a good MMORPG. I view it as a single player game you group up with "bots" to do dungeons/raids with. I like the world, story, art, music (it's amazing),etc. Best FF game since ps2 for me.

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I'm not sure if you're trying to explain how things work nowadays or if you have no idea of how things rolled back in the day.

what are some recent MMO's that have a thriving but niche community and are fun to play?

more like it was too influential and the brainless retard mongoloids who run all of the major publishers in the industry are literally incapable of doing anything but mindlessly chasing trends even when it's obviously not working

>Old school Runescape was an excellent example of 'Develop your social skills or get fucked'.
It didn't even feel that way though, it just happened naturally. People just interacted more to the point you didn't really have to struggle to interact or anything. I've heard a lot of Asian game servers are still like this in some games.

Not him but a bunch of private servers are like this. I would only go with private servers because they're the ones who tend to update things, sometimes for the worst.

none

>It didn't even feel that way though, it just happened naturally. People just interacted more to the point you didn't really have to struggle to interact or anything.
Yeah, that's literally the point of old school MMO design and why current MMOs fail. The game itself naturally encouraged you to socialize. If you didn't, you were never going to get anywhere and you would quit unless you were one of those super hardcore autistic solo guys, like BST mains in FFXI.

This is a dangerously accurate image. I fucking hate the internet in a lot of ways, that innocent time was damn near perfect.

i agree it's not a good mmorpg, the vertical progression/treadmill is fucking boring. something about it just feels so plastic to me though. even just the way characters run and move. i can't enjoy the world the same way i did vana'diel. really wanted to though.

of course they're dying, they're all pay to win garbage

I remember when dragon armor was released for RO and what's-her-name (the autist miner who made the first full set of it) was buying rune certs for like 500% markup because she owned like 20% of the gold on the server.
Anyone else remember that?

Fuck guys

those days aren't coming back.

I still play TERA on occasion.
Can't say I'll be sad to see it go.

this
once FFXIV gets Trusts in ShB it will be one of the best single player Final Fantasy games

The problem with the MMO genre is that it functions with 3 classes the end-game player. the non-endgame player, and the newbie.

In the start the end-game is small as fucks, but eventually it becomes the biggest part, and the other 2 classes suffer. The problem with this is that the other 2 classes are the life line of the game.They collect the resources, needed for end game fags. These two classes get fucked, in prices and might just stop playing. It also not helpful that devs will cater to high-end, and neglect the other tiers.

how to combat this? automate the other two classes to end-games are fine and everyone is worse. Make the huge stockpile of non-end game shit useful to end game boosting prosperity to the other to classes to give them finical insentive to stay.

None these solve the problem that the dev must make content for the two other classes even if the end-game bitches, because if they do not, the content of the other 2 classes becomes outdated and people get turned off. the other 2 classes are important.

I think the whole point isn't design, the playerbase and their expectations just changed, as well as the other changes mentioned in the thread. Even if you revived those games nowadays it wouldn't be the same thing.

What happened to TERA just now?

>bring back text based adventure MUDS
>bring back
Aren't there several still alive and kicking? I've only heard of a few but I don't think I've seen one die.

The Grand Exchange was the best thing to ever happen to RUnescape

which ones do you play on? i'm not into wow, but i've tried some FFXI private servers. they were mostly too fragmented and low population to get anything done. some of them claim to want to capture the old era but you can't capture it if you're still having to solo your way to max level because not enough players.

>Playing PSO2
>Dead tired
>About to go to bed
>Whole lobby turns red
>Realize that you have to drink a cup of coffee now because you'll be up for another hour

Who else understands this predicament?

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>Way back in the day it wasn't uncommon to sit for hours talking with complete random strangers while you were grinding or were mining/crafting/etc.
I think that was really due to the average age of the playerbase for MMOs back then. Kids and teenagers were more willing to talk to strangers about random stuff, most adults don't do that. Another thing is I think a lot adults have a limited amount of time to play the game, so they become more goal oriented when they're playing, sitting around talking to another player for awhile is usually a hindrance to achieving said goal.

>make shit games and shitty clones of established games
>WOWWWW, WHY IS THE GENRE DYING

Developers are fucked.

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That's why I proposed a "dungeon maker" MMO in the first place. You have VERY little idea what you will get. It brings back a sense of mystery, it's complete youtube/streamer bait to pull normies in because "le wacky game lets me be both player and DM," content is ideally plentiful and massively reduces the gear treadmill. If there were any treadmill it would be a cosmetics one. The overall objective though is to make a game that is fun.

>Age of Wushu is a far more fulfilling experience than WoW due to player forced interactions
>But the PvP-centricness will keep it niche chinkshit at best
I fucking hate PvP but Wushu was the jam. Second best MMO I ever played. FFXI for 9 years takes the top spot.

not him, but I still play aardwolf but I'd be insane to recommend it to anyone

When the fuck are we getting EVE Online 2? Improve the broken-ass system and server architecture and give us a new world to play with, with as much and more player interaction. I'd play day 1.

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I'm speaking of the now. What happened back then is irrelevant to the part that the game itself was weak, and every time someone whines about "hermits" or LFG is because they played MMOs that were a mere notch above a chatroom.

just your average mmo exploit that results in easy/free resources

it's getting rolled back 24 hours, that's it

nawh you didn't need to talk to anyone except during trading.
wiki was still a thing, but it was vague like addy rocks in falador.
People still somehow talked, my guess was cause you all grinding and got nothing else you can do meanwhile.

how difficult would it be to make an mmo with bloodborne style combat, decent quests, good economy with trading, leveling options to ease grinding, and good story?

If you didn't start as a Templar, you're a cuck.

Doesn't help that all of those MMOs are actually complete shit from start to finish.

What you just described is Vindictus, but people abandoned that eventually, too.

think about how much the souls games lag even with a minimal amount of players on the server

now think about how likely it is that there are people competent enough to get an entire MMO running with that combat, without lag

yes but mmo's over the last 10 years or so have been trying to git rid of the social aspect of them in favor of letting you do most of the stuff yourself

>I proposed a "dungeon maker" MMO
but, how are you rewarded?
Based on clearing the dungeon? People will make brain-dead easy dungeons
Based on difficulty? People will make bots that purposely fail the dungeon.
Making players in charge of content is difficult to balance rewards.

I would love that. There used to be a custom map in Warcraft 3 which was just "D&D Adventure" where one team played DM and the other team played players.
That was my favorite. Sad nothing has come along to replace it.

>bloodborne style combat
latency
>good economy with trading
bots

i miss you mox

Nah, you're just a jaded fuck. It's going to be badass. VR chat already supports a bunch of people in the same space. Shit's gonna be like .hack I can't wait. Hopefully you'll be dead from ass cancer by then.

You literally sound 12.

>The problem with the MMO genre is that it functions with 3 classes the end-game player. the non-endgame player, and the newbie.
Yes, absolutely. But for me the problem is it seems people seemed to be more content to be non-endgame and newbie back in the day. Nowadays it seems everyone is rushing to endgame player as fast as they can, so you end up with nobody in the other two. I still think it's a matter of mentality that you can't remedy with game design.

And again, people don't even have to experience being newbie or non-endgame because datamining and databases will make sure you don't have to do any of that by yourself, you just have to rush through the content hoping to get that endgame reinforcement that usually isn't even there.

Even if you release the best game ever today, people already have the means to make everything trivial, to have the best builds to do what they want, know the best places to level up and the quests that will give them the best rewards and whatnot. There is no exploration involved. Hell, some autist will already disclose all that information on the first week of release.

The only way I see for MMORPGs to be successful in 2019 is to use social progress systems rather than reward repetitive actions, because you can't make perfect guides on how to deal with people predictably. Unfortunately such a system would have problems of its own and likely wouldn't work with super massive populations.

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>Guess I'll subscribe to FFXIV again
>Run the same roulettes every day
>Insanely easy, pretty much automatic content
>Get tomes
>Get better gear
>Don't feel better about myself
>Tries every single content except for savage, it's all trivial crap
>All NPCs treat me like some sort of walking god, feel like I, as a player haven't earned any of that praise

Meanwhile

>Plays Sekiro
>My character upgrades stats, but they are mostly marginal
>All skill comes from me, as a player
>NPCs compliment me accordingly, feel like those are earned.
>Start the game on a completely new save file, steamroll through everything because real life upgrades are forever.

what do you guys think about pantheon? it sounds cool but it also sounds like the kind of thing most people who play mmo's today would hate

hard, alot of money

You would need to create a balance of skills vs normal combat where the skill pressing does not feel op as fuck where people just do that, but at the same time people still think it is worth using.
The problem is hosting a beautiful game with lots of fags, and reducing lag.
You would have to make it instance based dungeon to reduce lag, probably, that still doesn't killed latency.

the
problem with vindictus was it was a hub, of emptiness even on release you felt lonely as fuck. p2p and party kick +p2w killed it.

You know what I also miss?
lolidwarves

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Archeage is starting to get better as a game, but it's population is still dropping.

Main armor lines are built more around gold and grind than Labor and the p2w mounts can now be obtained with manastorm crystals which are obtainable from golden chests (which you get from raid bosses)

New region just got it's story quests.

We had that in City of Heroes/Villains and it worked somewhat. People still made optimized missions/dungeons that allowed them to farm exp and items optimally.

Are private servers worth playing these days? Archrage sounds cool, I never played Archage but I played nearly every other major MMO on the market..even Champions Online at one point. Wow, Aion, Tera, Dungeon Fighter Online, Maplestory, Trickster, Runescape, FFXI, FFXIV. I can keep going, it was the genre I always loved most. But anyway, I wish we got some good MMOs again.

Remember when lord british was gonna save mmos and then came out with shroud of avatar? :^)

>Me and my friends all played Elin and rolled around as a squad
>We actually encountered fucking Ulboarax while levelling
>Immediately attacked us for being disgusting animes
>Dunked on him then sat on his face
Good times

I even remember people joked about characters that never left the mission architect building, because they just spent all day farming these missions, which usually consisted of a single room that constantly got flooded with certain enemies that you could kill with area attacks.

Who remembers Tabula Rasa?
The only reason I keep bringing it up every MMO thread is because it had the most genius system for mobs ever, where they would gather into groups and go out on the hunt instead of waiting for players to come to them.

That minor touch improved an otherwise mediocre game and I'm still waiting for another game to rip it off.

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Man Age of Wushu was a ton of fun for me because we were all completely clueless. It was a lot fun to just talk about the game while we were learning it. I'm honestly not sure if I liked the game itself, or just learning about it. It's really rare to get that kind of game release state in the West, usually people know everything about it before the closed beta begins. I can't remember why barely anyone knew a damn thing about Wushu.

>all these complaints
I'm surprised no company has decided to go wide and promise MMO players everything under the sun for those sweet whale bucks.

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I'm never coming back, no matter what. Trino deserves to get fucked and die.

There are a lot of nice promises and such, but like most people looking for an MMO to play, I've been burned before and so my expectations could not be lower.

its a generational change
these new faggots dont understand or play some genres
at least not in countries we're looking at

even with guides if the content is challenging, to get to end game you will be stuck in non-endgame for awhile. But devs will still neglect that section, and you will be bored as fuck, because it is outdated, or not enough. basically devs create the cool shit in end-game, and not in the middle. and really neglect the newbie level, by showing them the cool endgame, but giving them outdated un-cool start, so they are not retained.

They have though. The latest bundle of MMO releases were just that. A lot of them fell for the Darkfall widows and hardcore PvPer meme players though.

Was it literally this? youtube.com/watch?v=rrsWbyJzZDU

It's weird how mmo's will have that one feature that manages to make them stand out. If one game could combine those, they'd make a masterpiece if they got them to mesh together right.

A lot of people talk about how wow killed mmos in a bad way when really it was sort of like a bunch of dads telling their sons to be exactly like the coolest kid in school. Wow looked and played better than any MMO on the market, it innovated some things and casualized others. Wow did its own thing and thats fine it was actually great, blizz made the game they wanted to make. But it was the game that killed MMOs. Once wow came out they industry stopped making MMOs they just made wow clones. Every MMO that came after it was just wow with X, games that had came before wow were turned into wow clones. Its actually pretty sad

Nah, same zone though, in the nearby rape dungeon from that one Asanagi doujin.

you people suck

What's stopping you from savage bud

literally what Bless Online did

>Dofus is a cool game
>Ankama is absolute shit at marketting
it's a complicated feel

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guardians of ember is there for you

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Housing was honestly a big part of what kept the game alive as long as it was. A shame there's nothing else like it.
I miss mox too.

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Still mad how they shit the bed so hard on that.

was bless supported by the people like star citizen? cause it seems more like it was supported by corporate, and they just could not let it die since they spent 10 mill on that shit.

Point and click Runescapes evolved form is boring as watching paint dry and no one wants to do it on 2019 with games like Sekiro on the market? No man... You've GOT TO BE KIDDING.

MMOs have always been trash. You have to have a mental disorder and completely suck at video games to enjoy them.

It was gonna shit the bed eventually.
You can't relaunch your game multiple times and not think that something very wrong with the game itself.

What's the fucking point of making MMOs?
>hey we have some decent idea for setting/story/combat
>but let's make this game an MMO for no fucking reason so that our development costs would bloat plus maintenance costs on top of that
>btw we aren't going to create any meaningful ways of players interaction besides barebones coop and arena
>but game's existence will hugely depend on its playerbase anyway
>oh no the initial hype died out!
>oh no we players are leaving!
>oh no we don't have money to make massive content updates every month!
Literally every single MMO in last 15 years.
WoW only succeeded because of Blizzard's reputation and Warcraft's relevance back then. But the game itself is (and was) dogshit. It lived long enough for people who can tolerate such garbage to get invested into it and never leave it for another grindy crap.
Korean shit barely survives for some time because gooks have absolutely no self-respect as consumers whatsoever. And anime tiddies to trick white people into trying this shit hoping for some gameplay.
Even if someone makes legit real MMO with actual players' interaction like EVE Online it would die within months because genre's reputation is such a shitstain at this point that people with any resemblance of taste won't even try playing anything with "MMO" label attached to it.

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I'm intrigued.
Is it still alive?

get in a guild you loner

is it near impossible to get enough MMO fans to put in $150+ million funding for their dream MMO?
i think the biggest so far was Ashes of Creation and that was just $3 million.

>guardians of ember
lol the second you spend a single attribute point, if you want to respec out of it the game requests $7.00usd worth of premium currency, and obviously you can only buy it in $5.00 increments.

thats what Albion Online is except a fantasy approach instead of sterile empty space

Ashes of creation will save us all.

Not him but they did think something was wrong with the game. That was the whole point behind rebuild project. They actually improved the game from the original kr build. Then NA launch rolled around and they threw all that shit out the window. People got hopeful from playing the JP build. NA was completely different.

None today, but they were fun back in the day. MMORPGs need a constant flux of people who leave and new people who show up to function properly. Nowadays you just get a bajillion people on the first week or two and a dead game in the rest.

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2bad it runs like shit

>is it near impossible to get enough MMO fans to put in $150+ million funding for their dream MMO?
There is Star Citizen, but it promised way more than what it can deliver. Other than that it's virtually impossible. And these games are expensive as fuck today because people expect cutting-edge tech and MMORPGs need to have a shitload of different and vast content.

ashes of creation is a pyramid scheme

based brainlet

Honestly the only issue with mmos is locking progression behind stupid raids and cash shop upgrades.

All they need to do is have like 100 different things you can grind in different spots of the world that are worth a shit, and have some be slightly harder than other and require a group, and BAM you have people playing the game and farming and having fun. But instead everything is a solofest, then join some LFG tool, and wait for the next week till the fucking raid resets or go to the cash shop up buy some stupid upgrade crystal so your weapon doesn't break when you try to upgrade it.

I cant wait to PL to max and gank low level shitters then rape their Virtual corpse

Ehh, I'm enjoying them for what they are, a comfy grind.

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you couldn't whale in Bless though so what are you talking about?
the game had zero p2w

cause mmo games negelect everything,but engame. making end-game people's only goal, and they get burnt out trying to get it cause non-end game is not fun.

Atleast shit like runescape had mini-games to let out some of that burnt.

VR should literally just be projecting a realized matrix into your mind while you are in REM sleep. That way when everyone goes to bed we'll all just be playing MMOs and shit instead.

Mark my words VR will save mmos. Maybe not tomorrow or next year but it is coming and it will change everything

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ActivisonBlizzard is not Blizzard. They have never made a good game.

Doesn't change the fact that those games are dull as fuck and most are probably just Asian whales who can't give up on the games after spending what amounts to a new car on them.

explain

Last time I tried playing a UO private server, it took about half an hour to get a single player to speak with be when I was trying to have something addressed because everyone just uses discord for everything.

Why should I expect that to be any different?

I find it weird the only gimmick MMOs haven't tried is the ability to have sex in them.

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What MMOs need is seasons. Reset everything every so often with a new gimmick added.

Most crowdfunded MMORPG projects are.

Change the second W for an S. World of Starcraft

There is no face to MMO, you have no one you can say that they know how to make a good MMO. Without a face no one would even fund star citizen.

>Too bad nostalgiafaggots

no it was blizzcuck, they were making wow 2 but scrapped it to make that shitty waifu shooter

DFO wins again, baby.

Most players don't want to experience non-endgame content, they just want to rush to endgame.

what game

You can still do it user, even more so if you join an mmo late. There's no reason to rush to get the best gear and no reason to rush to the end game. It's not going anywhere. So might as well have fun and explore.

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>ywn play a fully realized dust 514 that allows people to participate in 0.0 politics while having actual fun gameplay

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That and space sim genre was pretty much dead before Chris announced Star Citizen.
There are too many MMOs out there to bring everyone together for one new MMO and the audience is too skeptical to fool.

>Largely PvP
>Construction and crafting akin to rust, fortnite, and more accurately what we probably should have fucking gotten with Everquest NEXT.
>This comes with building fortresses/ levels/ zones that other players may explore.
> Effectively a PvP oriented Mario Maker MMO.

Cringe

>shitty korean MMOs dying
As they should. Hudson was amazed when he came back to Bioware how many people still play TOR. GW2 may not recover from chasing after stupid mount cash but WoW and ESO will persist. The market *wants* an MMO, but most suck because Koreans suck at Tencent sucks and NCSoft sucks and most publishers are full of poodles who can't take risks

I downloaded Albion Online yesterday and it was actually pretty fun desu (first sandbox mmo I ever played too). I cannot stress how important it is to find a good guild though. Also wouldn't try playing it this week because of how ass the server lag is.

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Most MMOs have nothing but low quality filler content that is just designed to waste your time. The is no fun trying to get to the endgame while taking your time.

Not as difficult as developers would lead you to believe.
It's more of an issue of time and money rather than any kind of technical limitations. We got MMOs with action combat, quests, plot, economy and all that exist in many other games.

The only thing stopping a MMO from having all this is the state of the industry. You can take lots of time and spend lots of money making the best MMO ever, and you'll probably make money off of it. Or you can spend a tiny fraction of the money and still make a good profit.

The sad fact is, MMOs, even the shitty ones make a profit. If it's still hugely profitable why do more than is necessary? Especially when this will probably decrease profit margins.

There is no more vile and shitty genre than mmos

I think a big problem that he would run into is if he wants to do anything that requires players he either won't be able to do it because everyone deems it worthless content so they don't even bother with it, or he'll be expected to know everything about the content because it's old and there are tons of guides that he could look at

>a minority of people with a lot of wealth are ruining everything

just your average day on planet earth

I don't get why people cling to these ideas. It's been tried several times already and failed all the same.

>meme is dying
>weeb trash has poor management
>unnecessary and failed game mode being removed
>who?
>actually literally who

End-game is always a goal you should have, the problem is dev push on you by sacrificing all other things. They don't give a fuck about non-end game shit, when ever a developer modernizes anything it is always old end-game shit, never the middle or the start.
They literally want you to suffer, and have no fun and chase the fucking carrot.
If there is some p2w, expect non-end game to be horrible.

>base game and PVE revolves around grinding and doing exactly the same shit over and over and over with a different coat of paint per every 5-10 levels or so
>usually P2W
>roleplaying community is either non-existent or nothing but ERPing fags
>PVP revolves around abusing whatever handful of the best "builds" or classes there are
>never any end game shit that isn't just more of the same but with a glossy coat of paint
>usually little character customization in most MMOs, guaranteed to look like dozens of other players
>lockboxes and kikechests
>time consuming as fuck for little reward
>monthly subscriptions will ultimately have you paying hundreds of dollars for a game that will ultimately die and lock you out of ALL the shit you accrued and spent money for
>very little significant updates outside of the companies that can actually afford to staff an active team
>most of them have shit graphics
>most of them are now empty as fuck for all the above reasons, further compounding every issue
>most of them are uninspired trash in boring settings

i wonder why they're dying

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>Nearly all threats excluding Void Lords are dealt with or in the process of being dealt with
What the fuck? I always joked you'd eventually take on motherfucking Sargeras but I didn't think they'd actually be retarded enough to do it.

what would wow 2 even do that current wow cant do? am i a brainlet? i dont get why people ask for this

DFO still has a fun gameplay system under all the RNG gear, endgame bullshit. Makes me wish there was a version that gets rid of the huge aoe on skills for a balanced experience so it's more inline with actual offline beat em up.

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What classes are you playing DFO Chads?

woah

>implying that WoW 2 isn't actually Classic
>implying that Blizz isn't going to Reboot the whole franchise with time shenanigans
Look at him, look at him and laugh.

ArcheAge, they have a new owner. Though I'm hearing mixed reviews about them. Trion went bankrupt. Was bought up by Gamigo.

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There's no innate fun in playing with random people anymore. I have my MMO PVP share from Dark Souls invasions, and other Co-op games to play with friends.

FFXIV has a demo period though. To progress further, you need to pay. So by definition, it's p2w.

All the original devs are gone. The 80 IQ diversity hires there now aren't capable of making such a game

>archeage
never had as much fun as I did in that mmo, nothing ever comes close

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When you said "seasons" I thought you meant actual seasons where the world changes with the weather and world events.
I'd like that, too.

That sort of design is doomed to failure nowadays because eventually mostly everyone will be at the endgame demanding more content and barely anyone new will come to experience other content. Most games nowadays bulk largely on the first week of release and barely get players after that. Unless you have a flux of new characters like you had in say, 2004, there is just no point to developing non-endgame content all that much. Yeah, it sucks to have power creep and old shit getting boring/dated, but it wouldn't change things all that much to change that nowadays.

>Diablo 2
>hack-n-slash RPG are stuck forever in a state of heavily RNG-based single player MMOs without any innovations in terms of mechanics
>Warcraft 3
>RTS got replaced with ASSFAGGOTS
>WoW
>MMORPGs got replaced with theme park skinner box abominations
>Overwatch
>ASSFAGGOTS abilities and degenerate deviantart character design are now mandatory for multiplayer shooters

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the fuck are you talking about

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winning is an arbitrary concept in an mmo

I bought into prior to it's release and then was sent on a deployment I wasn't supposed to initially go on. So I missed out on the first 6 months of the game and was just a few days away from it's release.

At least now I'm enjoying it as more of just an adventure. I'll never get to do the pirating shit that I wanted.

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>roleplaying community is either non-existent or nothing but ERPing fags
MMOs still have great RP potential, but that is not a financially viable model, at least not for big companies.

Nasomi.

>MMORPGs got replaced with theme park skinner box abominations
You can thank EQ for that bud

>SAO
kill yourself my man, can't believe you schmucks haven't grown out of that by now

>Trion went bankrupt
Better late than never.

I'm surprised Yea Forums doesn't know it, it happened like last August.

the last mmo I enjoyed was FF14 1.0

yes you heard me, fuck you it was unique and cool, a hassle and annoying, but it was also cool

Moreso WoW

Same
CBTs and first month of release was pure modern MMO kino until economy and other aspects like land being fucked by cheaters and bots

Devs adding thunderstruck trees as a gachabox in cash shop was the start of its rapid downfall though, and the castle update fiasco sealed its fate

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>DaS
>coop

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For serious, if what brought you into MMOs was the socialization, try traditional gaming, especially if you were also into roleplaying.

>Devs adding thunderstruck trees as a gachabox in cash shop was the start of its rapid downfall though,
I literally got my first thunderstruck three days before that and hadn't sold it yet, that shit pissed me off so fucking much.

>playing games
fucking nerd

i don't mean that to say i expect to go into an MMO and experience a thriving roleplay community, it's just that when there is roleplaying in most MMOs, it's pretty much just for the end goal of jerking off with another man online pretending to be a girl

Wasnt the BDO one more about that game mode having some xp or silver exploit that broke things. Last i heard BDO is still making a good chunk of money here.

no tricks, no traps
PAY TO WIN

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is there any hope for mmos? I literally don't see anything good on the horizon
I'm scared bros

Freeform RP for you, then.

I did actually, found a group and tried FFD20.

My first session had the DM screaming at me because my character mained Red Mage and I wanted Blue Mage to be my character's second job.

I had quite a few saved up, when the update hit and they put that shit in, i just quit.

No. The reason they ditched the abttle royal was because it didn't make the money they want. Not because it lacked players, but because it was actually balanced and lacked rng bullshit

It was a complete trash fire but i respected it far more than the WoW reskin we got now.

And what if you like to roleplay but don't like to have to pour over books on books of autistic guides and manuals and rules to play something like DnD or Shadowrun or whatever? If I could get a group of people together who would be interested in a custom, free-form roleplay with homebrewed rules and regulations just at the snap of my fingers I would, but that will never happen - I've been on /tg/ a couple times and they're all mostly brain damaged weebs that don't even actually roleplay or write.

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Good? MMO's have pretty shitty gameplay, it's the grinding loot skinner box shit that kept people playing them for so long and that has now been moved to tons of other types of games so MMO's have no place in modern gaming.

Are the Koreans even making anything new on the MMO front? I'm not sure if I just stopped following MMO news or if there just isn't any nowadays. The most recent Korean MMO that I can name is Lost Ark, and I know that one has already been going for a little while now.

2.0 was fine, I have no idea why they abandoned all the good things they had going for it to get this weak wow clone instead

It attracted so many players it lowered the bar forever and no mmo could reach the critical mass to exist.

Not OSRS the only good mmorpg that matters

Damn, sorry about that.

In my experience, nearly any other board than /tg/ and Yea Forums-/vg/ gets roleplaying.

I just want MMO's to allow more cooperative play, it's a fucking massive world with thousands of players, and you bar everyone from playing with each other because of some stupid story quest barrier or level barrier.

I really like Star Citizen because in theory it's going to let people just play together immediately. More stuff like that please Jesus fuck.

Yeah, it's usually how it goes. Good RP support would need more than just throwing players into a game and expecting shit to happen naturally. I don't think people get much motivation to RP in these games as there are barely any mechanics involving it. It's usually better to just look for online play-by-post shit when it comes to that.

I keep hearing about Lost Ark in discussions related to Path of Exile and honestly it looks very generic.

>wanting to be a purple mage
Fag.

Most KR devs are now making "mobile mmos". Which, as expected, combines the worst of mmo whale milking and gatcha whale milking

MMOs dont really need to exist anymore. I like destiny 2s model. You play with your group of friends and can see other players roaming about in the open world. All the story missions are just you. I also really like the raids. I wish more games had raids.

pimpin' ain't easy

>start mmo
>create character
>put effort into making something lore friendly
>load in
>see this

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>I just want MMO's to allow more cooperative play, it's a fucking massive world with thousands of players, and you bar everyone from playing with each other because of some stupid story quest barrier or level barrier.
This times a thousand
Quests killed MMOs, there's no reason for anyone to play together because even people who are the same level could be on two different stages of a quest, thus wasting both of their time.

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Maybe once things settle a bit and we get more niche titles

>tfw Digimon Masters Online had huge potential but asian jews killed it
Fucking hell, man.

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The fucking horror

Not him but in theory a Red/Blue (or Purple I guess) Mage would be retard powerful considering the former's a champ early game and the latter only gets good later on when jobs appear in FF. They basically cover each other's weaknesses and only enhance each other's strengths, so that's probably why the DM refused to allow it. user is just That Guy for not following.

Do you even understand the concept of a sandbox game?

Says every MMO shill before the game comes out and then dissappears

Koreans only care about mobile shit

City of Heroes was great for things like this.

Sandbox games are inherently bad

FFXI announced some big news for its 20th anniversary, when that disappoints me I'll probably finally be able to let go of the genre entirely.

Yep. Chances are it'll be the offline remaster they've teased before.

That's where the trinity comes in :^)

>capeshit popularity is at an all time high
>no good capeshit mmo
PLEASE

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I'm surprised SE isn't riding Blizzard's dick like they usually do and making a classic server of their own.

Ship of Heroes or City of Titans, if they fail we will never see a good Capeshit mmo again.

I wish there was an option to disable other players in hubs and display pubs in missions with default look of their frame and default hooded inbredling like when it was first shown in The Second Dream. Warframe players have the worst fashion sense in the universe.

Pic related.

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Still makes no sense for people to play together when even two members of the same group have to play catch-up if even one of the other members isn't on the same stage of the quest.
What an awkward system for a multiplayer game that just became popular everywhere at once.

The way I see it, resuscitating the genre is simply going to require a dev/publisher with the willingness and financial ability to accept that they're not getting WoW numbers. Bring back things that forced player interaction. Bring back varied builds with the understanding that you're going to make a character that will be a clownshoe in some content because of monster resistances/abilities and a god in other instances. That means a whole world of sidegrade content, for starters. A dev and publisher that accept that they'll be alienating the lowest common denominator, and that the most utterly casual players will whine about the game not being accessible enough while never throwing them a bone. You either commit and find a few extra brain cells to raise your IQ over room temperature, or you get nothing from the game.

There are other things they could do too, to smooth along the usual nags. Say, make the game f2p with the usual cash shop of cosmetics, but a player also has the option of paying a monthly sub; during which all cash shop crap(or components to craft it) is droppable by various content. Have the game ban all IP ranges from China, South America, etc, and stamp out any identified VPN. Don't bother with those markets. Accommodating them always brings quality down from both the influx of those people shitting up a game with RMT and botting, or devs having to make compromises in aspects of a game to make it kosher in the eyes of the Bugman High Command.

we need another deep sandbox like SWG. the direction mmos were heading before WOW ruined everything.

youtube.com/watch?v=n6Q96KIRG8E

imagine it bros

zones in modern graphics all the size of orig barrens

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I can't speak for XI but Yoshi-P's been pretty adamant about not even trying to truly compete with WoW and so far being the only dude at Square left that hasn't been completely and publicly humiliated by the higher ups in some form, he's getting his wish.

>Warframe
>make a character lore friendly
the potato creator is so fucking limited you can't really make anything original, I'm surprised that ronald was even possible

Waiting for someone to hit the market with a competent VRMMORPG is suffering.

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They will fail, MMORPGs just can't succeed at this point

VR gimmick is already dead.

They are absolutely going to fail.

There is just no point, it's not financially viable. You have to make a massive game with tech comparable to AAA non-MMO.

GOOD.

Maybe developers will wake up to the fact that a good MMO needs to be immersive and not a shitshow of LFG daily raid achievement gobbling cash shop cosmetic P2W garbage.

Yes because the Internet has advanced far enough that nothing MMOs provide is necessary. Online community? Facebook, reddit. Online arena/pvp? MOBAs, Battle royale. Online worlds? ARK, Minecraft, H1Z1, GTA or whatever the fuck you want to play, almost any game has some online aspect to it now. MMOs worked by owning all these aspects of online gaming at once, and now it's impossible to do so with so much competition. It's never coming back.

me 5th from the top left

>tfw no localised Dragons Dogma Online in the west.
I just want an MMO where the combat is fun

Everyone knows that, but MMOs are an almost guaranteed financial disaster and no one wants to touch it with a ten feet pole. Even addressing the issues chances are high the game will fail and crash hard

Me on the right, behind the kissers

If at least half to three-quarters of your MMO isn't interacting with players on any meaningful basis beyond doing a group finder and running dungeons into your fingers lock up and your eyes burn out while not saying a word to each other the entire time then it's going to be a shit game because anyone who wanted to do that would just play fucking world of warcraft

But honestly it's not the Devs fault, if all your money is coming from vastly affluent benefactors who are funding this thing they want what makes a guaranteed return and it's going to end up a WoW-like no matter what these people say otherwise

>understanding that you're going to make a character that will be a clownshoe in some content because of monster resistances/abilities and a god in other instances
Still baffled as to why FFXIV is so resistant to this concept. Especially because your one character can and is encouraged to level up every job. If X class is bad for one boss, switch to Y class. You don't need to homogenize the classes so fucking much.

Got any more of the videos?

FFXI did it, until they abolished low level content.

>cucked comcast data caps
Must suck to live in Shitville

They can still fulfill a role from an massively multiplayer storytelling framework, but obviously that will not attract the numbers these do, which already isn't enough to sustain all but a few, so I think the future of MMOs are going to be much smaller in scope. Overworld MMOs just might end up being too expensive, maybe it'll be all PSO lobby to stage shit.

this
I played a bunch of DDO and it's really fun, but not being able to understand 90% of the story or any dialogue got real tiresome, plus the translation breaking every patch got so tiresome.

because then you got a shit meta versus everything being able to clear.

Because MOBAniggers invaded the genre with their sterilized idea of """balance"""

webm related

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Or just go RDM and shit all over everything. Goddamn I hope SHB nerfs RDM into the ground to MCH tier.

By far the most interesting MMO I have ever played, i adore funcoms methods of level design and the paths players take to complete things. Very rarely in today's market do you actually get a game that doesn't just handhold the fuck out of the player.

Its really too fucking bad the combat is by far one of the WORST ive ever experienced, Runs like hot garbage, and is buggy as fuck.

I think it looks interesting. It's sort of a mix between PoE/Diablo and RO, near as I can figure. Maybe add a dash of PSO for good measure.

Digimon RPG Online was better, simply because it wasn't bloated as hell.
>tfw you will never play on the OG korean server ever again.

I would honestly take a shit meta with unique skills and capabilities that gets balance changes to shake it up every so often over homogenized playstyles between your tanks, healers, and DPS. But I also really enjoy fighting games, and that's pretty much how they roll.

The meta should involve you switching classes to optimize each situation.

MMO is dead, i really want one but everyone's so caught up in INNOVATION and NEW TECHNIQUES and FUN ACTION PACKED GAME PLAY.
I just want something to throw hours away with.

If my last digit is a even number, this right here is MMO of the year and outperforms Classic WoW.

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F2P MMOs are what gave birth to shitty loot boxes economy

>have successful mmo
>make some changes
>players start leaving
>make more changes
Why do they do it? Why not undo the changes?

then the endgame becomes only accessible to NEETs with 500+ hours of playtime and you lose a large playerbase.

So basically, MMOs died because we got older, but at the same time zoomers don't care about MMOs, this genre is truly fucked.

I hope they do it, and I hope they let us download our character data to import into it.

Because if they don't their publishers will fire them, your company is ran by accountants and salesmen

>>PvP

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XIV is not an old school MMO. You can get a job from 1 to 70 in a week.

People also understood back then that hitting 75 cap was a long term goal that was meant to be a months long process for most on their first time, so your ass is experiencing every tier of content for quite some time. I don't know if modern MMO players would respond well to a very slow burn level cap. I played Tera a few years back and the leveling process felt like the game was just rushing me through it like it was a bother, like just instantly make me at level cap then.

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I loved Dungeons and Dragons online pre Epic Destinies and levels 21+.
They powercrept the game like hell.

We jumped ship when gaijins were getting banned for being gaijins, also another game where you don't talk to people since they can't speak english.

I'm glad because the entire genre is shit.

>undo changes
>people who liked changes leave

>I like destiny 2s model
fuck off

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I got burnt out of the MMO part of XIV, but I'm gonna get ShB for the RPG part of it

>I loved Dungeons and Dragons online pre Epic Destinies and levels 21+.
You mean pre level 13ish, why did they feel the need to appeal to the hardcore fanbase in such a light hearted game?
I fucking loved it up to 10, desert was alright, and gianthold was alright. After that it went downhill so fast, mobs taking thousands of damage to kill to "make it harder"

Yes imad

blessed be your days, brother

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this art looks like trash so I'm not surprised board leaders axed it

unironically what is reddit about that? does reddit love the game?

>relevante
These people are millionaires

>mobs taking thousands of damage to kill to "make it harder"
So much this.+-

TAKE ME BACK

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>The only thing that can save the MMO genre at this point is WoW 2
all blizzard neads to do is go back and follow their own design philosophy. make hard content, make the player have to do things in order to do other things or gain access to things. its cool if only 10% of the playerbase gets access to certain types of content. it will make other players look up to those and aspire to be like them.
dont hand the player everything. go back to having to socialize to actually form groups to do certain content and make it so they actually have to get to the content they have to do.
incentivise world pvp instead of just doing this weird war mode.
stop homonegyzing gear, trading gear is fine but dont make every piece of gear the same with a different coat of paint. have set/legendary modifers drop as part of normal gear and bring back werid/situational gear like a fucking cloak that lets you stealth as any clas or a fucking hat with a built in fear, daggers with innate bleed effects, hammers that reduce armor, staves that summon minions or some shit. sure its balance nightmare but it sure was a lot more fun back in the days when a warrior suddenly sheeped you while you were trying to do quests in stv.

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a week of playtime is 168 days. multiply that by multiple jobs.

You want to fix MMOs? Apply this speech to them.
youtube.com/watch?v=LmbyWGCwX90

Dont forget how the game was basically designed to have everyone using wounding of puncturing weapons and then they nerfed it.

never played RS, what makes an older version better?

Slowly working your way up, partying with friends, making new friends along the way, actually earning that level was so enjoyable and rewarding. There was always something to look forward to in a few levels, be it a job-defining spell or ability, a great piece of gear, or even a new camp. It never felt like a pointless grind to max level.

Sadly, most people who played back then are adults now and don't have time to play several hours every day. This age of instant gratification and cash shops keep that kind of gameplay and progress from becoming relevant again.

The number of people who liked the changes is finite. The number of people who have yet to play the game as it was before the changes is infinite. It makes more sense to put the game back to the way it was during a period of growth than to make more changes to appease those who stuck with the game during a period of decay. Just look at any F2P MMO that ends up having its development driven by whales.

>The only thing that can save the MMO genre at this point is WoW 2
This is the dev team now

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take me with you

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>its cool if only 10% of the playerbase gets access to certain types of content. it will make other players look up to those and aspire to be like them.
If people actually felt this way, you'd be on to something. The problem is that most don't. People are just gimme gimme and want things without putting in any sort of effort. They just want to be fed an experience.

Did anyone play Vindictus? The combat is still the best out of any MMO, even though it's not really an MMO.

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Have you checked out the emulated swg servers?

Same thing with old wow and modern wow.

On vanilla the leveling process was the experience, I remember I didn't even care too much about what lvl I was when I was leveling, it was just everything was so cool.

On nu-wow it's like they're pushing you hard through content at fast speed.

I'm okay with this, the MMO "genre" needs the reset button pressed on it.
But with that said, if/when it dies, will it come back?

design philosophy for old runescape was a point and click adventure game, but an mmo. modern runescape is a wow clone with janky controls