How would you redeem it?

Every generation, a new

SLOW
D E F E N S I V E

I
C
E

Well I'd start by making an ice pokemon that's not either

- bulky&slow as fuck
- has shit stats in general

I'm sure Gamefreak will do that someday

GLACEON

Scizor
Resists Fighting

Giving it actual glass canon pokemon instead of insisting in turning slow pokemon with a gorillion weaknesses defensive roles.

By not being poison

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I want to fuck poison/fire lizard!

Keep it the same. Ice is the glass canon type. It's super effective against a bunch of types and weak against a bunch of types. Not all types need to be equal. Ice's biggest problem is basically the same fairy had in 6th gen, and steel had in 2nd gen, no good pokemon to show it off.

Make one with actual good stats for once. Game Freak seems to love making Ice types shit.

I like how that picture conveniently leaves out Gengar and Venusaur, the two best poison types.

>Gengar
>Weezing
>The Nidos
>Crobat
>Qwilfish
>Drapion
>Skuntank
>Scolipede
>Dragalge
>Toxapex
Nah son, ice is still worse

Slow
Second highest stat is physical defense
Doesn't have a noteworthy ability
Legit has to run Hidden Power to avoid being walled.

Leafeon is way better because it can at least set up a baton pass.

they have their purpose when dragon is everywhere in gen 5.
but now just use fairy LMAO, ice? more like SHIT ROFL

REMOVE FAIRY WHEN FUCKING DOGSHIT OP TYPE

why are you not posting this in /vp/?

Make remove either the steel or fighting weakness and it improves 100%.

Best offensive typing in the game but the pokemon have shit stat distributions with the worst defensive typing. Add more pokemon like weavile, cloyster, and mamoswine that can sweep

Actually no. Ice MOVES were everywhere but you'd never see an ice type pokemon other than Mamoswine or Weavile anywhere.

like other anons have said, stop making ice tanks when they're weak to pretty much every common sweeper, make more shit like weavile, they're a great counter to dragon and if gamefreak were actually competent they wouldn't have needed to include fairy type in the first place

I like fairy and I like ice. Pls no

Kyurem B

>fairy got no poke to showoff in gen 6

it literally running rampant in OU and uber.
DUDE XERNEAS+HERB LOL, MAWILE SUCKER/ PLAYROUGH LOL. EVEN GARDEVOIR SEEN PLAY BECAUSE HOW OP FAIRY IS IN GEN 6 YOU FUCKING MONGOLOID

Make Ice super effective against Water. It's why Freeze Dry is an amazing move.

Bug is a better type to be than Ice.

give me more resistance and speed damnit

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what is mamoswine, abomasnow, kyurem,weavile

shut the fuck up

is it bad that my favorite ice type is glaile and regice?

Make Ice resistant to Ground.

I completely forgot that thing was actually OU and not Ubers. The poor thing.

Fairy unironically balanced the game better. Made fire and poison types more relevant, nerfed dragon and fighting. Or did you want another gen with banded terrakion clicking cc and specs lati dropping dracos.

>mamoswine
Bad, because you have to build a team around them.
>Abomasnow
Bad, because you have to build a team around them.
>Kyruem
Uber
>Weaville
Congrats, you named the exception.

my favourite ice Pokémon is ice cream cone

Poison has exponentially gotten better since gen 6. Ice has been getting progressively worse because they don’t come out with Pokémon that take advantage of its offensive capabilities. Weavile is the only viable ice type that I can think of atm.

>make 75% of ice pokemon useless by making them slow defensive types
>when ice is one of the worst defensive types in the game
Someone at GF must fucking hate ice

abomasnow is crippled with having hail always. seriously hail sucks when you set up a team for it. You will NEVER see a team of 6 ice types in the history of forever. mamoswine is a slow tank and is ice ground. The very instant you use grass knot on it, that thing is fucked

>new pokemon is literally a vanilla ice cream cone
>evolution is literally TWO SCOOPS

which one is the new relevant fire type poke btw?
talon flame? rofl

>pokemon is bad because you have to build a team around them

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I did mention two of those. Abomasnow is there strictly because of Snow Warning because even the mega sucks a massive pair of balls.

>Kyurem
Arguably the worst legendary ever. The game treats it as Uber when the metagme it debuted on he was Underused. Even his meme fusions are dragged down by his Ice typing.

>worst legendary ever

what is phione?

More along the lines of
>lol, glacial split
>who cares about stats and competitive gameplay.
>haha, tourneyfag tears

ice-type stealth rock

>that take advantage of its offensive capabilities
who the fuck cares about this shit
Ice is garbage because all of its pokemon look like conceptual rejects, rejects for POKEMON, a series with a literal trash heap.

Yes. You have to have a mediocre team to make your pokemon good, as opposed to having a team full of great pokemon.

>Make it strong against Water
freeze-dry was made specifically for that purpose

I think Phione itself is not a legendary only Manaphy is.

Resistance to Fairy.

Grant a Filter effect (Super Effective moves reduced by 1/4) to all Ice types in Hail.

ice/fire there you go

yeah, they have seen play in gen 5, and unironically tiered on OU. the point is where are they now? nowhere because u just have to bring fairy to check on almost everything that ice type is bad against

weird. phione just feels like filler anyway, and manaphy is so fucking rare as it is already

Why doesnt hail do that anyway? Its such a wasted weather effect

Weavile and Mamoswine
Granted it took them making some actually good physical ice moves

>stealth rock
OH NONONONONONONONO

>Several Water pokemon are already good
>they can learn Blizzard and Ice Beam for no goddamn reason
That's the real problem, I think

What we need is a Pokemon with Refrigerate and Extremespeed

I would train a munchlax and alakazam just to make them go extinct.

Bug is good now, it just lacked moves which it has now

you are right. why the fuck would I bother teaching ice beam to a slow bulky ice type with shit sp.atk, when I can do the same with a water type like milotic

make it a offensive type by being stronger than shit like fairy and water

You are right.

It’s called synergy user you sound like the kids who use only legendaries in comp.

>implying my breeding rejects won't flood the world

give it levitate gg

>Kyruem
>Uber
Reminder that ice is so shit that base 660 stat regular kyurem is not uber and never was.

>why does the Water-type learn moves that involve frozen water
Really makes me think. In any case, Ice Beam and Blizzard have gradually fallen out of favor for Water-types.

And it still took another generation so they could finally get a good physical Ice move, Icicle Crash, instead of getting stuck with Ice Punch and Avalanche.

Freeze-Dry is only one special move and is still not worth replacing it over Ice Beam or Blizzard. But is not like it matters where the only decent special Pokemon that comes to mind is Froslass, and even she gets better coverage with Shadow Ball and Thunderbolt.

I have 11 boxes of just pinsirs. Sometimes I wonder since they are so inbred if it would be a mercy to just to put them all into lava.

Frosslass is one of the better ice types, and it sucks because of its other evolution being so shitty for fucks sake

>Freeze-Dry is only one special move and is still not worth replacing it over Ice Beam or Blizzard
It actually is. Blizzard has some exceptions, though, but if the special attacker Ice-type can learn Freeze Dry you bet your ass it’s going to use it to cuck common switch-ins.

why would you want Pinsirs?

>a turtle that swims in water should be able to freeze it
based retard

Don't mind me, just being a better ice type than the others

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It’s a good thing we’re talking about Pokémon and not turtles. Moron.

Just make stealth rock a normal type move. There, suddenly 3 types of pokemon aren't invalidated.

>just turn SR into spikes
???

Hail raises special defense for Ice types.

serebii.net/attackdex-sm/freeze-dry.shtml

Look at the small amount of Pokemon who can learn the move, where only four Pokemon are notable enough to use the move: Cryogonal, Lapras, Ninetales, Vanilluxe and Articuno. Only Lapras and Ninetales are decent enough and they simply have better move options than a 70 BP move that has one single purpose.

a-user.....

But you can have team synergy with good pokemon you dumbass. Why use bad ice synergy teams?

imagine thinking this lol

Entry hazards should be allowed to do more than 25%

I imagine it would still just hit flying types/levitators
What really needs to be done is making it a flat percentage damage that doubles against anything immune to ground. No other type interaction being taken into account

I run an all big team because I like bugs.

No it doesn't, and it never has.

Yes, and every single one of those prefers to have it on hand.

I’m sorry you can’t word for shit and made your argument sound like stronger Pokémon are better than worrying about synergy. Why get assblasted in a Pokémon thread of all things.

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That's Sandstorm, which raises Sp Def for Rock, Ground and Steel types.

We just need different non-stackable sneaky pebbles to complement the rocks. Say, they make bug-type rocks and suddenly half the rocks are bug and don't hurt you

>>Mamoswine
>Bad, because you have to build a team around them.
You definitely don’t have to build a team around Mamoswine. It’s not bad at all, it’s just not OU anymore.

change it to cold type and remove its weakness to rock, fighting, and steel

Sandstorm raises Sp. Def for Rock types by 50%. Hail does not induce any stat raises or bestow any inherent bonuses to Ice types.

Sandstorm does not raise Ground or Steel Sp.Def

I was checking Serebii and I misread it, my bad.

its only purpose as a type seems to be having moves used for dragon busting but none of the pokemon that are ice type are strong

Weavile is the only truly strong Ice-type in the whole series. Very fast, very strong, has a good role as a fast physical sweeper and revenge killer and has a very good movepool and good coverage with attacks like Icicle Crash, Knock Off, Ice Shard and Low Kick, between many others.

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The problem with ice is there's no reason to use an ice type when water types can do everything they can, and have a solid defensive typing.

I liked using the ice dinosaur because it has Refrigerate. Nature Power in I think 6th gen would turn into Tri Attack, so Tri Attack turned into an ice move but still had a chance of causing burn/para

mamoswine is stronger than weavile in gen 5, check up many OU poke with STAB EQ

Just make it so you have to stack it like spikes to get the full effect.

Bug is still pretty bad. Yes there are some good bug Pokemon like Yanmega, and I guess the Ultra Beasts did introduce a couple of powerful Bug types. But Bug is still just pretty shit, the only thing it's really useful against is Psychic, but for that you can just use Dark.

I definitely think Ice is a better type than Bug. Ice is 4x effective against Dragon/Flying types, which can be insanely useful.

This
Also make Cold super effective against Fire and Water but keep Fire's super effectiveness against Cold

I like Glaceon but you can only get it absolutely late as fuck and it's also garbage to use anyway
But it's sooooooo pretty

Aurorus too, luckily XY is easy enough that it didn't matter but it still got OHKOd by so many attacks

>Yes there are some good bug Pokemon like Yanmega

And Scizor. And Heracross. And Volcarona. Or how about Golisopod, Ribombee and Araquanid? There's also Galvantula, Escavalier and Scolipede. And that without counting Mega Pokemon like Pinsir and Beedrill. Bug has way more and better useful Pokemon with better estabilished roles than Ice, which has absolutely no reason to have so many slow and/or bulky types when the type should be all about offensive.

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just use focus sash + counter fampaymarinarinlon

yanmega is only good if you have it with speed boost. Tinted lens sucks ass for an ability

Being Bug actually comes with benefits. Ice has none. Almost no Pokémon who is Ice type, wants to be Ice type, you just want to slap Ice type moves on Water types.

>But it's sooooooo pretty

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-remove Rock weakness, make it neutral
-make Normal, Fighting, and Water not very effective against it
-change NVE against Water to neutral

>Tinted lens sucks ass for an ability
Tinted Lens baisically makes Bug unresisted, and since Bug is the most resisted type normally it works wonders.

>I definitely think Ice is a better type than Bug. Ice is 4x effective against Dragon/Flying types, which can be insanely useful.

Competively, this isn't correct. While there's a number of Big types that see use, Ice doesn't.

Even for that specific scenario of Dragon/Flying, Dragon or Rock will usually do the trick, being 3x with Stab from the important users who can then use their Stab elsewhere, as opposed to 4x and no Stab (and therefore less useful in general)

This. Also works wonders for whatever secondary STAB the Bug has and even its coverage moves, plus it means opponents can't simply switch into a Bug-type opponent and expect to take little damage from resistance.

Make them slower and more defensive.

make ice good against bug. Most bugs cant fucking move at temps lower than 40 degree F.

Ice has enough SEs and Bug has enough weaknesses already.

I think you've had quite enough speed recently Regice.

Ice doesn't need more strengths and Bug doesn't need more weaknesses.
Ice needs less weaknesses and Bug needs more strengths.

It's more that Ice moves are better than Bug moves (unless you count U-Turn, and you use that more for MOMENTUM) while Bug Pokemon themselves are better than Ice Pokemon. This is because while Ice is a great attacking type, as a defending type it has horrendous synchronization with other types.

Only thing wrong with ice is that it has no resists. If it resisted water, grass, and poison immune, it would be perfect

cpokemon.com/seccion/herramientas/tipos/en/
YOU KNOW WHAT TO DO

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No I don't. Please explain.

is ice still one of the best offensive types? i'm not specifically talking about ice-types because a lot do suck, but i'm talking about ice moves on pokemon in general. when i played competitively in 4th gen -- used to be ranked top 10 -- ice beam was a must. i don't know how it has been since gen v

Yes. Ice moves are great. Ice Pokemon are shit.

you mean refund...

Not sure anymore, it has been a while since I played competitive but Ice moves were always very useful because of their nice coverage and their ability to deal huge damage to common threats like Garchomp or Dragonite. BoltBeam at least is still popular nowadays because of perfect coverage.

do people use steel types for resistances? i haven't played in while either and if i do, it's only single player, but i do like hearing about the competitive scene here and there

Give ice-types a defense boost in hail
Make ice resist fairy, grass, and water
Remove rock weakness

Steel is actually used as an offensive type now, thanks to fairies

Steels have great defensive capabilities (even after being nerfed by removing their Ghost and Dark resistances) but I believe they're usually better as bulky attackers than tanks, such as Magnezone or Metagross.

LISTEN HERE, YA SHITTERS

IF YOU SMASH ICE WITH A ROCK, THE ICE SHATTERS, THEREFORE, IT LOSES

make sneaky pebbles typeless

If they're going to keep making Ice types slow and defensive, give it at least two resistances

Poison is an amazing type, it has some awesome pokemon, that function even though game freak always gives poison types a BST penalty compared to other types. It's true this means a lot of Poison types with great designs end up shit (like Dragalge), but guys like Gengar manage to stay meta in every gen (at least until game freak specifically nerfed Gengar like the assholes they are).

Ice splits rocks apart.

Poison would be great if it just had one or two more super-effective matchups. Water is a big one, since polluted water is deadly to most life. Could also have it be SE against Fighting, since poisons debilitate the body.

>tinted lens flygon never
it wouldn't even be that strong now that fairy faggotry exists.

water dilutes most poisons though. I do think fighting being weak to Poison would've made good sense though. Poison has good resistances though so it's more of a defensive type. It's only weak to Psychic and Ground. Poison types problem over the years is more about how weak the average Poison type pokemon is, Like you pretty much never see a 540 BST poison type let alone a 600 BST one.

not instantly

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After Kyurem-Black, who has the strongest unboosted Ice move in OU ?

Take a rock and go beat on the side of a glacier, tell us how much you manage to break off.

>TWO SCOOPS
Gone but not forgotten, rip piano man

stop using ice type for defensive pokemons, it suck at tanking

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Blocks your sneaky stones

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>not weak to rock, seriously why is it weak to rock
>resists ground, grass, water, dragon, fairy, and electric
>super effective on rock
>steel no longer resists it
There, I fixed it

I hope they remove Pressure from Weavile sometime. It has to be one of the most useless abilities in the game, especially for a fast, frail sweeper that is either one shotting things or getting one shot.
If they removed Levitate from Gengar I can only hope they give it something fucking useful.

retard

they won't. they didn't even give gengar the dream world ability they owed him after they removed levitate. Game Freak doesnt' want to fix bad pokemon, unless they're in the show regularly anyway.

>It has to be one of the most useless abilities in the game,
clearly you've never played gen 4 ubers before. pp stalling with pressure lugia was a legit tactic at one point

I like bugs.

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Yeah, because plants and water split rocks apart instantly too.
Oh, fucking wait a moment, they goddamn don't.

Literally no you

ice pokemon ain't as big as a glacier

Just did it and managed to break a huge section off. Guess Gamefreak was right.

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ice literally obliterates rocks on a yearly basis, I've never once seen a rock break ice but I see ice tearing the fuck out of rocks, sidewalks, roads, bricks, fucking houses even every time the temperature outside drops below 32 degrees. Ice should fucking annihilate rock types.

Alright Yea Forums. What would be the best possible teams for these Anons?

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I just realized Delibird is pronounced like “delivered”. I always called it Deli-bird! So I look it up online and apparently his tail is hollow and it made me want to throw up. I used to like this Pokémon and now I hate it

This was pretty fun to do again. Made one of these a while ago, but I guess I deleted it

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>its not poison
Buff my man toxicroak

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This is about a year old but here we go

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patrician taste coming through

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>galvantula
>gliscor
>slowbro
>m-mawile
My guy

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Why does Gamefreak hate Ice so much?

>competitive Pokemon

That crap ruins Pokemon. Autists taking a children's game way too seriously when it should have been about fun. I'll answer your question anyways though. You can't possibly ever balance these stupid ass games if you keep adding so many damn monsters to the series. Gen 2 was the last great gen. Everything after should have just been about refining the mechanics rather than more gimmicks on top of gimmicks and new monsters.

Why do they bother so much trying to make unique interesting designs when you will just want to evolve the damn things anyways? It is a waste of time. They might as well just make the pre-evolutions smaller versions of the final evolution for most monsters.

Ice literally isn't eve fun to use in game. They're all slow and weak to everything.

Show your tits, Misty

Because there is too many monsters and they keep piling shit on top of shit you idiot. Gamefreak is a garbage company that doesn't know how to balance a game to save their lives.

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The only way Ice will be good is to knock Water down a peg. Water is easily the most overpowered typing as of this moment. Ice needs to be super effective against Water. Retcon Freeze-Dry entirely.

There's nothing to redeem, it's already perfect.

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It's not a problem of individuals, it's a problem of the type itself, which can at least be fixed by just changing the type itself for the better

based and dunspilled

It's almost as if you can see which Generation is my favorite or something.

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>Four Pokemon justify the myopic use of Freeze-Dry and not buffing Ice

I'm so glad retards like you don't work for Game Freak. Go fuck off back to /vp/ with your contrarian opinions.

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>implying

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That wasn’t my point at all. Are you retarded?