What should Pokemon games ideally strive for?

2D > 3D
a good 2D game will look good for years
even a good 3D will look dated in a few generations

You can fix their Evs in literally 5 min after you beat the game you shithead.

I do agree for the most part, but there are still older stylized 3d games that are standing up better than a lot of the mediocre 2d games of old
people who think pokemon should have realistic 3d graphics are retarded though no doubt.

>m-m-muh based lazy 2D

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Bottom pic is what I've always wanted since the first gen.

It's a matter of art direction.
Every 2D game built for the CGA color space, for example, looks like abject trash.
3D games that use a more stylized art direction rather than chasing realism still loo fantastic to this day.

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why shouldn't it be open world? the games are about the journey, exploration and adventure.
you want a series of corridors separated by cutscenes

Pokemon games should an action rpg prove me wrong.

>after you beat the game
The Elite Four + the Champion are the final showdown, wtf is the point of only being able to change the EVs after??

Both look like shit

Pokemon will never live up to its potential, accept that fact and move on

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They didnt claim that. They just want graphics to actually show off the world, and scope.
Looking around, to see cities you visited, or forests in the distance, etc.
for general emersion reasons.

Personaly the reason I feel it shoudl go open world, is because the stories are garbage, and are making the game too "by the numbers".
The best part of pokemon is picking a custom team, with custom builds.
Then the wonder of what the world offers, with unique things to find and see hidden through out.
but when the world is a long hallway, it no longer feels like youre looking for that secret, hidden in a dungeon. it feels like a hallway, to another hallway, to another hallway, with the prize at the very end.

its not even mario level design, where u go left to right, but have constant interesting things to see.
you get the same stuff, or reskins of the same stuff, and hardly ever anything new to interact with anymore.
theres a such thing as "too open", but theres a such thing as too linear.
atm pokemon is too linear, and old school pokemon was an ok middle ground, but had room to be more open, w/o cost to quality. (in design, i know gameboys couldnt handle it back then.)

Just use berries bro

Just give me another BW/2

>hurr what are storage limitations

The main game is easy as hell you bitch boy. You can steamroll through the game only using a farfetch'd. Evs are basically worthless through the main game. You would realistically only use Evs for online battleing. Plus, gens 6 & 7 make it easy as fuck to Ev train your dudes really early on.

>hurr tile-based games can't look good ever

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You dont need minmaxed stats to beat the Elite Four. You dont even need a real team. Most kids just brute force it with an overleveled starter.

Something that doesn't exist considering the average PC game with uncompressed videos in multi-languages is between 30 to 50gbs and a 64gb SD card is just 10 bucks.

So yeah, that isn't the issue.

To be honest I want the game to look like this.

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I think a good open world pokemon game is what literally everyone wants.

I, and most likely the poster you replied to as well, have given up any hope of game freak ever being competent enough to deliver something like that.

Top image actually looks pretty good and I can immediately see it actually being playable. Is that an actual game/demake in the making or is it just a thrown-together image?

Is Gamefreak the laziest dev in the entire industry?

Like Pokémon Orange, Coral, Red++, or Polished Crystal.

>Most profitable video game series ever
>Shitters actually defend their laziness
lmaoing, i guess if you really wanna keep eating the same shit for over two decades this is the game for you, fucking barebones rpg.

Yesss

funny how a series about evolutions refuses to evolve
and the fans are okay with it

Nintenbabys

Why did they never try to sell Pokemon to the gamers who were kids during red / blue? A more grown-up look at the pokemon world would be really interesting.

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Give me something bigger than GTA V map in 3d and I may consider buying another Pokémon ever again. Last one I bought was Gold on GBC

Finding people with low standards and poor sense of taste, and exploiting these people for massive amounts of money.
They need to cater directly to the gullible retard audience.

sauce?

>pokemon, a simple RPG with a simple premise, catch them all
>rather than going for a more simplistic style to match this, people want full world ginormous regions and loadsa graphix and tons of animations
>animations that would make battles take forever to get through
Pokemon leaving the 2D plane was a mistake.

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Pokemon turned to shit when it turned 3D. Pixel is best.

youtube.com/watch?v=eO4Lyc4NoFQ

How good is Pokémon XD Gale of Darkness?

>why shouldn't it be open world?
because open worlds are just a reddit-tier meme. the industry uses them as an excuse to sell you less content for the same price while tricking normalfags with the illusion of freedom. this approach to game design has ruined so many series and hasn't improved a single one. pokemon wouldn't be any different.

Pokemon battle revolution a wii game.

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ME LIKE LIKE POKEMON BUT ME WANT POKEMON NOT TO BE LIKE POKEMON
ME WANNA POKEMON TO BE GENERIC OPEN WORLD THAT IS NOTHING LIKE POKEMON
BECAUSE ME LIKE LIKE POKEMON

My bad on this reply thanks

>this could have been the standard for pokemon

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simple solution: let people turn off the animations in the options menu if they don't want to see them.

Pokemon battle revolution for wii

you're explain why it shouldn't be a BAD open world game.
also you're implying linear shit like it's now is good.

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>you're explain why it shouldn't be a BAD open world game.
there has yet to be a good one.
>also you're implying linear shit like it's now is good.
linearity isn't bad, the problem is that pokemon got rid of the hidden side content and has started only using linearity to move the player from one unskippable cutscene to the next.

why would people want a generic world

Anything that is not the battling itself is extraneous and irrelevant.

>Pokemon, a simple RPG with a simple yet addicting gameplay formula that doesn't need much change
>the only thing the series can really improve is graphics and scope
>graphics have gotten worse
>also the gameplay has somehow gotten worse despite them already having the formula for good gameplay

>there has yet to be a good one.
yikes

>people want a collectathon with large areas to collect things in
literally what is wrong with this

It's pretty good.
In colosseum and XD the pokemon selection is pretty limited and it forces you to use mons you usually never would use which is pretty neat.
Also no encounters only trainer battles so it's hard to overlevel your self.
You can grind at some facilities, but you really need to go out of your way to do that.

Are you kidding? Kanto pandering has been a thing for years.

Honestly this, that and new pokemon generations run like absolute shit in 3D
>Mario Kart 7 can run smoothly and look good
>GenVI and VII look like shit and chug like a mother fucker just by a simple rain effect in battle
It's like Gamefreak can't program a 3D game or something

There's no reason it shouldn't at least look like battle revolution, keeping turn based battles and random encounters and what not

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imagine being a kid and watching the anime, its vast world with pokémon wandering around
then you play the game. you love it but the vast world and the adventure are all in your head. then you dream of what technology will be like in the future and how you'll be able to play games that look like the anime, with dynamic battles and exploration

then, 20 years later...

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Because pokemon games still need to have good pacing and length. 8 gyms and an E4 works perfectly, it's not too long, it's not too short. Get too many routes and areas between them and the game just turns into a bore.

I'll start a new game next Friday night then. Isn't Colosseum simply Stadium 3?

This, why won't they simply listen to us? Pokémon Go had potential for players to fight each other old-school style but no we got some automatic abortion that you have to swipe

I would love the top picture instead. Sick of 3D shit everywhere.

generic open world

He's talking about mature games for mature people, such as himself. This ain't your old pokemon, it's dark and brutal.

Not being made any more? The franchise was for kids 20 fucking years ago, try to keep a little dignity

The sheer fucking amount of Pokemon pretty much negates any hope of a fully realized 3D open world game. The amount of work, and skeletons, and animations, and effects etc that would have to go into making a thousand creatures move, behave, fly, fight, interact etc in a 3D game is simply not feasible, effort or finance wise.

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>just stop producing one of the largest grossing franchises because I don't like it anymore.

People who cared about graphics stopped playing Pokemon after they turned 12. Only autists still play this trash. It's literally the same game we all played years ago with what? Colors and fake 3d?

If the games were still simplistic pixel graphic games, there would still be room for that same imagination
But now we're somewhere in-between two different extremes and it's uncomfortable to say the least. Gamefreak needs to step it up

This looks like dog shit holy fuck. You shitters want this??

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I mean, they are so lazy they've reused the same 3D models since fucking XY. Thats the real appeal of the 3D switch, they can just reuse shit with zero work. Fucking stadium has better animations.

I dunno man.
Not him, but I hate the open world meme as much as the next guy, but I really feel like if there is a franchise that can make it work it's pokemon.
Usually in those shitty open world meme games, you can explore, but the world completely empty.
Like you can climb that mountain, but there is absolutely nothing there.
While in the theorotical open world pokemon game if you climb said mountain you can find a cool Onix that only spawns in that mountain area.
Exploring would reward you with finding cool new mons instead of some shitty crafting item to craft some atomic dildo or whatever in the other open world games.
I am actually kind of fine with the main game of pokemon, I never thought the older games were super open to begin with outside of some minor sequance breaking.
The only thing that really gets me miffed is that there are no good postgame stuff like the battle frontier.
But what I am trying to say is that I wouldn't mind seeing pokemon try a shot at the open world meme.
If there is a franchise that can make the open world meme work I think it would be pokemon.

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Not the exact art style
But the cinematic camera and better animations do a lot more for me than the same shit we had on the 3ds

>its too much work animating the 200~ pokemon in a pokedex
Bitch that's 80% of the pokemon game, this mainstream ass game doesn't deserve the indie copout answer of "we're too poor to make a good game"

Now go look at the polycount of the pokemon themselves

It hurts when the biggest excuse for Pokemon has always been the mainline is on the weaker half of Nintendo consoles, only for you to see how far other people push Nintendo platforms, especially the Switch, and then look at GF.

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I don't think you understand just how much work and money goes into making a good open world game, Rockstar the golden standard for open world spend hundreds of millions of dollars and take a good portion of a decade to make just one, and theirs only have one sized human skeleton to worry about and animate. A thousand Pokemon would be insane, just making them work fine in the overworld would be an undertaking, let alone all the moves that would need their own animations and effects, with no ability to just motion capture them. I'm not excusing Game Freak in any way but the concept stopped being feasible around gen 2.

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>I just want it to look prettier
There, I shorten that for you :)

It's no issue at all for Monolith Soft, Game Freak is just lazy.

>1000 pokemon at once
Why? Every pokemon game has a pokedex of 200~ give or take.
>buhhh it has to be detailed as a rockstar game
They're pokemon, not photorealistic humans

look at how bad banjo-tooie and yooka-laylee were, then imagine making those worlds even bigger, emptier and more boring.

XD gale of Darkness is a direct sequal to the plotline of colosseu.
In pokemon colosseum is about two collabing to create shadow pokemon.
Shadow pokemon are pokemon conditioned to be like fucked up rabid fight dogs.
The region is a lawless barren shithole that is so awful that there are no wild pokemon, it's just a fucking wasteland outside of a few human settlements.
So what the collab entails there is one team called team snagem which has a machine that mods pokeballs to steals pokemon from other trainers and Cipher a team that does the shadow pokemon conditioning.
In colosseum you play as an ex-high ranking member of team snagem and you're really good at stealing mons.
After finding out what happens to the mons you stole you show remorse and betrays his organization.
You steals the pokeball modder and with that steal back shadow pokemon from trainers who bought them to undo the damage that has been done to them.
It's pretty cool you start out with a lvl 26 umbreon and espeon and all battles are doubke battkes.
So you get some wacky shit like enemies using skillswap slaking or silverwind, sword dance baton pass scizor.

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go back to 2D. The game looked perfect on the GBC and GBA

t. game freak apologist
you're right, this looks sooooo much better.

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Give me actual dungeons so move and item management is a thing. Gove gym leaders and late game trainer competitively viable teams with actual synergy. Let me do the gyms in any order with level scaling based on badge count. Give me a hard mode. Make double battles the standard format for single player

There, I fixed it without making it something completely different

Oh, they sure can't

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X, monolith's most open world title, is horse shit.
And their games actually get the full time to develop, y'know, getting one every 3-4 years.
As opposed to Pokemon's development staff being split into two groups in order to churn out annual releases.

>Rockstar the golden standard for open world spend hundreds of millions of dollars and take a good portion of a decade to make just one
and it's still just a boring, shitty movie full of tedious busywork. open-world game design will always be a meme.

I'd prefer this.

If you're talking about EV optimization, you sure as fuck are not also at the same time talking about only beating the "story mode" of any of the games. The main storyline is easy as tits and by no stretch of the imagination does it demand ANY degree of EV optimization. You only give a fuck about EVs if you're playing competitively with other people.

Lets not forget the load of leftover data from generations ago.

>wtf is the point of only being able to change the EVs after??
The thing the game is designed around?

Usually the open world games ends to be checklists and generally Skinner's Box-ish time sinks
Everything has to be sprinkled everywhere as little rewards and no unique rewards can be given from side or secret places as most players would miss them.
That is why so many open world games feel quite silly for me.

>tfw the best Pokemon game is a mod for Minecraft

keeping the same style an adding to it is ideal
otherwise genre bleed
all games look and play the same already

Pokefags dont care about immersive environments, they just want more autistic stats to grind

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Call me a hyper weeb but all I want is a Pokemon game made by Monolith Soft that's just Xenoblade Chronicles 2 but with Pokemon instead of "Blades". Ideally with the same environmental artists and level designers so they world won't look like a generic RPG with modern buildings here and there. Alternatively call AlphaDream to do a Pokemon game with action commands in the vein of the Mario & Luigi series. Just do anything but the same shit again but in 3D this time, please.

Suprise surprise, Game Freak constantly declares that they start working on new generations at least a year before the current game is released, so they get from 2 to 3 whole years to develop a game. Not only that, but their main team is more than the double than Monolith Soft's, yet they can only do the bare minimum and provide nothing but an upscaled 3DS game so shiteaters like you can swallow their turds every single year. They also have been using the same Pokemon models since XY, they only have to work on the new Pokemon models for the new generation, hell they don't even bother in updating their animations, Pokemon like Skarmory keep gliding even after years of not having sky battles.

Stop defending this pathetic excuse of a development team, idiots like you are the reason why the 3DS generation was a complete disgrace.

nu-pokemon is bad enough without gacha shit elements added to it.

this

gameplay>graphics amirite?

>they only have to work on the new Pokemon models for the new generation
they don't work on the models at all. creatures inc. does it for them.

Open world isn't necessary to represent any of those, and doesn't serve the core gameplay mechanics (something most of the audience specifically wants to keep, since its ongoing standard is literally the biggest draw of the franchise) in any meaningful way.

Pretty much no game ever has come close to the amount of work needed for a good, fully-realized open world Pokemon game, Monolith Soft can make Xenoblade Chronicles, but can they put 20 Xenoblade games worth of effort into one game. It doesn't even have to be Game Freak, pretty much no sane publisher/investor/whoever would greenlight it, and no sane dev would attempt it.

You're making the mistake of assuming the "photorealistic detail" is where the effort would be concentrated, when that's actually a fairly simple and streamlined part of asset creation nowadays, hell they could use the 3D models they have right now and there'd still be a shitton of work left to do. The Pokemon need an overworld AI, moving animations, resting animations, eating animations, collision, interaction with the world, interaction with other Pokemon, then the combat itself with all its moves and attacks, conditions, reactions to different areas, and then the same amount of work if not more into Pokemon you actually caught, riding them, having them move outside of their Pokeballs, interacting with them for friendship, contests, fainting, sadness, hunger, evolutions, cries, HMs, carrying them, there's just an unbelievable amount of details cover, which were simple to do in 2D when most of everything was just told to you through a text box. Sure you could cut out all of this, have the Pokemon only appear in grass and not in the world, have them only remain in Pokeballs when you catch them, so the majority of the work is concentrated on the combat, but at that point why even bother making a 3D open world game.

How the fuck is this defending?
I'm saying Monolith gets to make largely great games because they get the time and effort put in.
Gamefreak churns out shit on staggered, basically-yearly cycles to get out their entries.

shut the fuck up justin

pokemon is for toddlers, grow up

Imagine how much comfyan there would be if there was actually a triple a pokemon game, that wasn't bound by the rules established in all the old games, base the world more off the anime in scope and wonder

I may get lambasted for this but I honestly think if there's one franchise that could do the Open World meme well, it's pokemon. I always thought it would be the perfect expression of pokemon if it were open world an/or an MMO outright. It's based on dudes catching, training and dueling with their own host of creatures, circumventing dungeons, beating appointed leaders to earn the right to compete in a tournament to become the best in the league.

That's pretty much perfect for the MMO formula.

You're making the mistake of expecting bing bing wahoo levels of engagement and instant gratification from a vastly different genre, sure the story missions could be more open ended, but the actual open worlds are best in the industry.

I don't think anyone's arguing against changing that, but in the show there are more than 8 gyms in a region, you just need 8 badges to go to the pokemon league. I think people who want a more open pokemon game want there to be more gyms that you can go to in any order and the world will scale in difficulty after each gym you complete. functionally it's almost no different to how the games are now, but it still opens the game up for those people

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Pokemon games are already devoid enough of substance most of the time where I wouldn't want a detailed 3D map to have to navigate around, because then that just means I'm going to spend more time doing menial crap.

Yea Forums once again showing that they know even less about pokemon than /vp/

gen 3 was open world and you all hate it

>gen 3 was open world
Good lord.

I want my sprites back.

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no, i'm expecting an actual game, not "watching paint dry: the cinematic experience." it doesn't have to be bing bing wahoo, but at least give us something better than a walking simulator with shit controls.

What the fuck? How can they be that incompetent? How do they not have the ability to hire someone who is competent?

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>at least give us something better than a walking simulator with shit controls.
Like what? It's a realistic wild west simulator, which means there's going to be a lot of downtime by default. GTA games have plenty of stuff to do because of the different setting.

Keep the world 2D, Use Pokemon Stadium for 3D fights.

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how about an actual game, not a hyper-realistic "downtime" simulator? why couldn't they just give us a true red dead revolver 2 instead of movie "games"?

what anime

>Meanwhile, on the other side of the spectrum
youtube.com/watch?v=WO9WwR5Ng3I

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valvrave

Vulvarape the penetrator, featuring ERU-ERUFU.
It was a meme show from 2013.

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Its from 2005

Because they want to make it, which is actually a very respectable decision in this day and age where everyone is trying to make games which they think will sell, Rockstar just has the added benefit of their vision being highly profitable. I personally don't like the RDR gameplay, but the world was enjoyable to behold, now imagine if every nook and cranny had a new Pokemon waiting to be discovered and caught, which would actually be engaging and not a downtime simulator.

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soulless
vs
soul

You'd still catch them normally, it's just there wouldn't be a separate screen for battles, battling and the world would be integrated as one so when you see a pokemon in the wild all you need to do is go there and order your pokemon to beat em up and shove them into pokeballs.

Death. Let it die....

Monster Hunter Stories, a game for the 3DS, is basically what the Pokemon series should've been

Seriously, if a 3DS game can do the semi-open world thing then why can't gamefreak do the same on the switch?

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thanks

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Bottom picture isn't realistic.

Sword/Shield is very clearly just a 3DS port. Knowing GF it'll probably still run sub 30fps during fights somehow.

>Because they want to make it
You know they made it to have another GTA online money maker right?

While I agree, it's a shame that MHS is really bogged down by its mediocre combat. The game straight up lies to you about it, too. That said, both Monster Hunter Stories and Yo-kai Watch (Any of them really) are way better than anything Game Freak has made from the 3DS era and onward.

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How are people still so invested in Pokemon? It's one of the worst RPG series out there.

The single player is basically untainted by the Online component, no sacrifices were made and the rest is just an upgraded RDR1, which they made before they knew how big Online would be.

It's a target video for a Wii game.

>even a good 3D will look dated in a few generations
Wind Waker still holds up, despite being almost 17 years old.

If I could haphazard a guess it's because most people who play Pokemon literally only play Pokemon, and maybe a few other games here and there. They'll buy consoles just to be able to play Pokemon, and they don't really play anything else. They're perfectly content just buying one or two games a year.

Then why have the world at all? Why not just have the game be a battle simulator with a random generator for different Pokémon and a menu for essential services? Or better yet, automate the stuff you do in towns so you don't have to wander around an open space? Nothing in it but battle after battle. No plot either, just at some point you fight an extra strong trainer then win.

it's pretty sad that rockstar is so soulless now that they WANT to churn out generic open-world meme games for nu-males. revolver was a fun arcade-style game that didn't take itself too seriously, and they've totally missed the point of why people liked it back then in order to turn the series into a pretentious walking sim.
as for how pokemon's collectathon aspect would work with the concept - i think people really underestimate how tedious that quickly becomes in an open world. for example, anyone who claims they didn't get burnt out on collecting korok seeds in botw is lying their ass off. the open-world formula would honestly reduce all the pokemon to just being items on a to-do list to check off.

I feel like their insistence on "gotta catch 'em all" is contrary to the idea that pokemon are real living creatures that you develop a bond with. I mean hell, the big things they've added to the games to try and make pokemon unique, ivs and natures, just serve to make most wild pokemon useless for anyone but the (based) casual players
they either need to accept that it's an autistic numbers grinding sim or they need to go in the direction of something like digimon world or monster rancher to try and make you develop a connection to a few pokemon

>good world design
>great combat
Fuming incel.

Because Poketards literally don't think about the stupid shit they say on a constant basis. Their fandom is literally just a combination of Sonic and MLP.

gotta catch em all was dropped as a slogan ages ago, and was a western only thing while it existed.

>They're perfectly content just buying one or two games a year
I havent bought a pokemon game for many years now but I still only buy about that many games a year for the last decade because of the never ending onslaught of nothing but garbage

Yeah, the core mechanics of combat seems like an afterthought and more of a yokai watch rip off. It's fine for what it is though, I love playing it while watching TV or browsing the internet.

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You would guess wrong. I guarantee I buy and play more games than you each year, and look forward to (and enjoy) mainline Pokemon games when they come.

A Pokemon game like the bottom concept would require focus and attention usually reserved for protagonists, on all 807 Pokemon. Even WoW, a 15 year old game that has had continuous work done on it due to being insanely profitable, didn't bother to suitably accommodate every option for every playable race and gender (18 in total), and instead took the lazy way out most of the time.

Uh-huh. Whatever you say. I doubt you could even compete with me in the number of games I can play in one month compared to you.

how are most pokemon not already just items on a check list? and turning pokemon into an open world game doesn't mean adding ubisoft towers and a few collections of generic items to collect all 26 of. it'd just be allowing you to go through the game mostly as it is now from any direction. the big difference would be no hand holding save the world from the bad guys story. also rockstar may have missed why people liked revolver, but it's kind of a worthless point since redemption and 2 have sold way fucking more than revolver and have been praised to high heaven. clearly people like what they've done with it
they still want you to fill out the pokedex though. it doesn't need to explicitly be the slogan for it to still be their vision

That town looks really barren and empty, is that supposed to be impressive?

Every day I wake up is a day where I ask "how come a company this incompetent managed to have in their hands the highest grossing media franchise in the entire planet?"

>What should Pokemon games ideally strive for?
mature

I really want a more fleshed out Pokemon RNG with breeding/synthesis/genes. Like it doesn't have to be a mainline Pokemon game but something similar to DQM and MHST would be great.

As far as story is concerned, while MHST is nothing new it certainly blows anything Pokemon has done out of the water. There were some really touching moments and whenever the MC pulled out the "Ride On!", I knew shit was gonna go down.

Let me skip the tutorial for fucks sake, that's all ask.

>Pokemon is about the graphics and the world
>Pokemon is not about the pokemon and the game mechanics

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Cope.

I actually like the idea of IVs and natures, some are naturally weaker with no way to overcome it, adds a layer of depth

I doubt you play as many games in a year as I do in a month.

I want neither look

>zeldafags

Nah, I like the look Sword and Shield has. I simply want the world to be bigger and the games to run better. The jury is out on SnS's overall quality until we see more and the games release.

Simple just don't use every generation of pokemon
maybe use the black and white method and only have new ones

Sounds fun

>Blur and glare out the ass
>Worse 3D models than the ones game freak made
Absolute trash, what the fuck did I expect from udnerage shitters.

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>Durr why does a target video for a 2001 hardware not look that great.

Must be great being so dumb you can't comprehend being wrong.

I really like the idea as well, but in reality it's like an rpg having tons of different build options but everyone goes for the single meta build because it does the most damage
I think a harvest moon pokemon spinoff game would be fantastic. you'd have a ranch with your miltanks and mareeps and a loyal herdier and you'd work on breeding better farm pokemon. natures would determine how they act on your ranch and whatnot