Why is there such a big difference between these to Soulsfags? Genuine question...

Accessibility is about empowering players in order for them to have the intended experience - it’s unlikely the intention is frustration at not being able to find your way in the world, so we can address that in numerous ways, usually with player empowered choices.

I am so tired of the BUT MY HARDCORE EXPERIENCE WILL NOT BE WORTH ANYTHING if Sekiro or Dark Souls games are accessible and have other modes BS. Especially from people who have never designed a game in their life.

Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

it's easier to design a game based on one difficulty than anything else
devs have deadlines to meet, they don't have time to refine actual gameplay based on difficulty, so everyone just modifies health/damage scaling and calls it quits. To me, that's shitty.

>the intended experience
That, or the next best thing?

>t. cuphead journalist

>get locked in a huge room with a bear and a shotgun
>can choose to wrestle the bear instead
Everyone would rightfully go for the gun but wrestling it would be a way better experience if you make it out unharmed somehow.

That's obviously an extreme way of putting it, but the point is there's an instinctual need to go for the easier path, and going against that need feels bad. What do you do then? Remove the easier path.

>player empowered choices
this kind of jargon hurts

in that situation choosing not to shoot the bear would make you a fucking idiot

>no gf
have a gf
>no job
work from home making good money
>living with parents at 25
28 and living alone for years
Sekiro and fromsoft games should not have a difficulty option. If you aren't good, go play something else. Not ever game needs to appeal to everyone. Use cheat engine if you're bad at video games.

I read this exact same wall of text yesterday, stop posting it

>so everyone just modifies health/damage scaling and calls it quits
But I think many people would be fine with health/damage scaling for a Sekiro easy mode.

Right, that's what I said, but what changes in a videogame context? You get to stay alive even if you die. But the instincts remain. That's why it's better not to give anyone the option to trivialise a fight.

>Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

it's a game
you might as well try it

>comparing a life and death situation to a fucking video game
Ebin

But anonymous they're experiences not games.

The point of the games is that they are a challenge that must be overcome with effort and/or strategy. If you want an easy mode, watch someone else play it or play something else. Not everything is for everyone. It’s not like we’re asking other game devs to remove difficulties and just make the game hard by default.

First you give them the simple easy mode, and then inevitably people will start whining that not properly tuning that easy mode is still discriminating against casuals. Especially the journalists, give them an inch and they'll try to take a mile. Eventually they'll be arguing that "Why shouldn't it be the opposite? Finely tune the easy mode and just stat scale the harder modes, there's more of us so we should be catered to." Best just to never give them anything and have developers follow their vision.

But it does change my experience, Going against your instincts feels bad. I can certainly do it, so can everyone or we would all be beasts, but it's better if it can be avoided.
See

Screw that, I say just sell overpriced DLC that lets them cheat. But disables achievements or marks them as cheaters in their profiles. But call it something else so it doesn't hurt their feelings.

You don't have to use it, it's for other people. Meaning it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse, so why the fuck do you care?

To DarkSoulsfags, a game's merit is measured only in how many balls it nails to the wall. If it's a super difficult game, then it's automatically a great game. If it doesn't tear you a new asshole, then it isn't worth playing because you can't tell people to git gud using a handwave argument against any and all criticisms. It's the easiest series to be a fanboy of, because you can stand on that metaphorical pedestal and shout down to people that their opinions don't matter because they didn't beat NG+++++++ while taking whiskey shots every death, with one hand tied behind the back.

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If a boss, that's supposed to be an absolute monster of an antagonist, offers you to just kill himself to spare you the trouble, wouldn't you say that kinda ruins the experience? Even if you do decide to fight him legit, it just won't feel the same. Idk, maybe that's just me.

>game is designed to be challenging from its mechanics to its accomplishments
>difficulty is reflected in the game's setting and integral to the overall experience
>"b-b-buh I want it EASIER"
the only people that complain about Souls games not catering to their skill level are the people who blindly follow anything that garners attention in the media and want to feel 'included'

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Are you posting this to show others how stupid this argument is or do you believe it? This is just ad hominem + projection. Just because one person is good at one thing doesn't mean hes bad at others. You can be a chad and be good at videogames but you can also be a loser and still be a shit in the virtual world too.

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I hate chinese food. I don't tell them to start making me burgers, I go to another restaurant. I just don't like Chinese. I won't scream on Twitter for them to change everything beyond recognition until its the blandest food that appeals to everyone on at least some level. Because then its just shitty food.
>food analogy
Yeah, fuck you. Fuck all these stupid fucking pussies wasting all their time crying because they didn't beat the game in a single sitting without dying.

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no

fuck you OP
its because the game is supposed to be hard, ie, challenging.

its not your fault your shit
oh wait

yes it is.

Thats a very bad comparison. Dark Souls' goal as a game does not fit with varying difficulty settings.

Ask yourself, what would an easier Dark Souls game look like? Higher base stats
? If reasonable, lets say everything is around 20, that already changes how the game is played substantially. For players who are more suited for the game, it becomes too easy and the experience of an oppresive world is gone. For worse players, it only gives a slight crutch, as theres still precise dodges, stamina/item management, ganks, and blighttown to deal with. If the designers somehow worked out a way to make the game "easier," by changing the AI, base stats, boss movesets, enemy placement, and even level design, the game wouldn't be Dark Souls. If a 9 year old can blast through the game then the intended experience is not there. There is no big relief from using your last estus flask on that boss and beating it. And even if there was different difficulties, then how do we design them to invoke the same feelings? I honestly don't think DS1 is hard for any standard human who is willing to sit down and learn its mechanics. But how many deadline dreading game journos just don't want or cate to invest time in it? Why should a dev cater to them? I don't know about other games, but the Souls series isn't meant for everyone. Just like a blind man shouldn't expect CSGO to make it easier for him to aim, I don't think a shitty game journo should demand the game be easier for them to play just because they don't want or have the time to "git gud." If a paraplegic man could beat the Corrupted Monk, whats your excuse exactly?

At the end of the day, some games are just not for everyone and people shouldn't expect every piece of media to pander to the lowest common denominator. inb4 newfag tells me about reddit spacing

>Why is there such a big difference between these to Dmcfags?
Ftyf

how do you feel about super mario having a play-for-me mode

What about this?

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it does make me wonder if dmc would be less or more popular if DMD was the only mode.

One single difficulty means all of the QA time went into developing it meaning you get the developer intended way to play the game from start to finish which also means the developers have more time spent on making the game rather than balancing difficulties. If there is a hard mode it should be a bonus reward for beating the game.

Okay, these strawman posts are getting a little tired.

Maybe because beating a DMC game on normal is like the tutorial for hardcore fans.

Why would I give a shit what the developer intended?

Imagine if Todd said that modding Skyrim is bad because the game is art and altering it would go against Bethesda's intentions. He would be laughed off of the internet. But because it's a Jap in charge, suddenly everything he does is sacred.

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People don't understand that even in challenging games there's usually a way to make it easier without the game developers just giving up and changing the numbers so even the average retarded journalist can beat it. The spread gun in Contra, the warps in Battletoads and the boss weaknesses in Mega Man for example. This shit has been around for ages, it just requires some level of brain activity other than just picking the baby mode and mashing the controller like a retard.

Generally, a majority of people who buy a game never complete it anyways. So, why are pretending this is more than the usual whining it really is?

Even taking this somewhat seriously: What's the point in buying a game you just want run through with no trouble? I could see the point if this was Uncharted, or just any other story heavy game, but these games are the fucking opposite that shit.

I mean, the type of person who just wants the story of these games would be better off going on youtube and watching lore videos. If you aren't going to become decent at the game, you for damn sure aren't going to hunt down the subtle clues to connect parts of the plot.

Sekiro already has those, you eavesdrop on soldiers and they straight up tell you the boss weaknesses (or in some cases they just slap them on the loading screen). People are just too retarded to use them

The Souls series is just a mess thrown together with very little thought in regards to design which the devs pass off as a selling point, because its hard or something right? In all actuality they should be making a more fluid and natural experience but they aren't good designers so they have clunky controls, terrible to nonexistent methods of teaching the player how to play the game, a scattered disjointed map, and cheap difficulty.
To answer your question op its because they made a culture around defending bad design, where everyone agrees with the crowd, without taking a step back and realizing the devs are just lazy and incapable.
The first time I played Dark Souls I was appalled, if I picked it up randomly on a steam sale and it had no reputation I'd probably play it for an hour and a half and then never touch it again since its really not a well made game. I genuinely don't understand how starved somebody would have to be for a game to think it was good.

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Pic is fucking wrong, it should be:
"I beat this game"

vs

"I beat this game on easy"
Fucking inbred degenerate.

Not the best example since Skyrim sucks on every difficulty.

Souls fans are always very aggressive about the idea of an "easy mode". And honestly, it lends credence to the idea that they draw self esteem from having beaten the games. Why else would they get so agreasive about something that doesn't affect them?

Exactly, From understands how to make a modular difficulty without resorting to changing number values.

>Generally, a majority of people who buy a game never complete it anyways. So, why are pretending this is more than the usual whining it really is?
Unlike most games, the Souls games are actually difficult and only real gamers can clear them. Western gaming ""journalists"" are not gamers and cannot get past the tutorial, and this hurts their feelings and means they cannot right reviews without getting exposed, so instead they write shitty clickbait which claims that easy mode is for disabled people and an accessibility issue or something equally retarded.

Meanwhile quadruplegics who are actual gamers are totally fine with Sekiro.

youtube.com/watch?v=tso8u4OJLuI

Open world really doesn't apply as much. Games with very tight level design (platformers, metroidvania, etc) benefit way more from it I would say.

It's because the Souls games already have a fucking easy mode built in. It's called "summoning."

Because you assume that these people -should- enjoy their experience, when they don't have the skill to earn it.
You are incorrect.
You don't reward people for doing a shit job if they're an employee, and the same is true of videogames.
Rewards are not given to you by default. They must be earned.

>Why is there such a big difference between these to Soulsfags?
considering souls doesn't have difficulty settings i fail to see how this would hold any significance to them

"i beat the game"
vs
"i beat this game on hard"
vs
"i beat this game to 100% achievements/trophies"

>it’s unlikely the intention is frustration
so what about when it is? it is intended for you to be frustrated by these games. putting in an easy mode would take away that part of the experience.

>Citing a fucking literal whos opinion from two years ago thinking it has any merit
I can tell right now at least 4 of those people in that cap are calling him a faggot. Souls games aren't hard either. They're just more difficult than the average game and even basic bitch normalfags and twitch streamers play it because its the "EPIC HARD GAME XDD"

but dark souls isn't hard

>You don't reward people for doing a shit job if they're an employee, and the same is true of videogames.
>Rewards are not given to you by default. They must be earned.
That's not for you to decide.

Games are about enjoyment, and making it so that players cannot enjoy them is an accessibility issue.

I got a handjob from this girl
vs.
I mating pressed this girl and came inside of her

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>beat
who says this? We say we -finished- a game where I'm from.

>That's not for you to decide.
No, it's for the maker of the game.
And they have decided "No victory for casuals", which I agree with, and will whole-heartedly support with my wallet.

>That's not for you to decide.
Its not for you to decide either since you don't make games :^).

They are just lazy, and that's why we have to push for reform. Stop projecting.

They're always welcome to play a game better suited to their tastes.

Soulsfags don't care about compelling gameplay, they just "super hard combat for super hardcore gamers like myself" which is why they thrive on FromSoft's bland ass games.

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the frustration is intended to enhance the enjoyment when you overcome it. the games would not be as fun if you never had to put any effort into them. also, games are "about" whatever the creators want them to be about. not whatever you demand them to be about. if you do not want to be frustrated, simply do not play a game intended to frustrate. you should not demand that a creator change their work to suit your tastes. if you don't like what they made, vote with your wallet.

I'd rather have a girl mating press me tbqh

By definition rewards are earned. Things that are handed out for free don't count as rewards by any measure.

>They are just lazy
Who, the casuals?
I agree. What's your plan to reform the playerbase of these games so that they have less of a sense of entitlement and more of a sense of justice?

>it is intended for you to be frustrated by these games.

Well, at least you admit these games weren't intended to be remotely fun.

like i said here the frustration is meant to be temporary so that you can feel like you've accomplished something when you overcome it

And by justice I assume you mean social justice.
Remember kids, egalitarianism and meritocracy are toxic notions of justice that don't belong in [current year]!

>the frustration is intended to enhance the enjoyment when you overcome it. the games would not be as fun if you never had to put any effort into them.
That's for the player to decide. Different people have different thresholds so allowing for a variation of difficulties would let players find the optimum level for them.

>you do not want to be frustrated, simply do not play a game intended to frustrate
>if you don't like what they made, vote with your wallet.

The whole movement is about calling out to people to make this issue known and to get devs to act on it.

It doesn't affect you, so why are you fighting it?
>Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

There is no need to use such big fancy words to describe the very intuitive notion of "git gud or stay rekt".

>Not ever game needs to appeal to everyone.
This. If its acceptable for books to have varying levels of reading comprehension in order to enjoy and have a full experience with them, what makes this different? If you want to experience the game but aren't able to because of varying reasons, watch a play through. Much how if you aren't able to understand a book, watch an explanation video on youtube or something.

The only reason people feel entitled to an easy mode is so they can feel like they're a part of a discussion without actually putting any effort into playing games. Basically they're posers who need to kill themselves for being fake pieces of shit.

if you play games in isolation, it won't affect you. but it affects the social aspect. if i play a game on one difficulty and you play it on another, and there is significant difference between them, we cannot have a proper discussion about the gameplay because we had such widely differing experiences.

>Games are about enjoyment, and making it so that players cannot enjoy them is an accessibility issue.

People are going to shit on you for this, but the basic point you're making is correct. It does nothing to impede anyone else's enjoyment of a game if you want a lower barrier to entry to experiencing it's content.

will next year be ok?

More like
>"I beat the game" VS "I beat the game before it forced me into a casual difficulty"

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So what you're saying is that you want games to be a gated community. That's precisely the sort of mentality that needs to be removed.

sure, if by a gate you mean that they have to walk upstairs

People who want an easy mode option:
>Hey, these games seem to have pretty cool world design and surely some elements of the combat/enemy design could be appreciate with a bit less difficulty.

People who don't want an easy mode option:
>Fuck you. These games aren't made for you and by adding the option for you to play them at a less punishing difficulty, it would ruin the experience for me somehow. Also, I'm going to insult you by saying you only like shitty and easy games and are limp-wristed nondairy milk-drinking liberal piece of shit!

Wow, that really clears it up for me: Souls games turn you into a psychotic nutjob. Thanks for the warning!

Imagine being such an actual loser you believe this unironically.

Going by your analogy: You're saying they just need to walk upstairs while completely forgetting about people in wheelchairs.

The people who don't want an easy mode option are 100% in the right. Wasting R&D time on secondary faggots is an absolute waste of time and money.

Whats wrong with some games being harder then others naturally? There are plenty of other forms of media that don't have a supposed 'easy mode' for some of their items.

Setting aside everything else, adding these options requires additional developer time. If developer time is limited by the publisher (hint: it is), then developers have to choose between improving the core experience or creating modificarions of it that will, to the people those modifications include, still be inferior to the original intent. I would rather they make a game that is great for some people and awful for others than a game that's just okay for everyone. And then other devs will make games that are great for those people but not great for me. I'm okay with that. There are puzzle games that are too simple for me that other people will consider their favorite game. If the developers spent time catering to me it would be a worse game for those people. I don't want that. In any case people only have a limited number of hours and dollars. Not everyone is going to play everyrhing. Developers should choose a demographic and make the best damn game possible for those people. That's bith good business sense and, if many developers choose many different demographics, means everyone ends up with amazing games that suit them.

if you want to discuss people who have a legitimate disability that prevents them from playing these games, that is a proper argument to be made.
but the majority of the people complaining about the difficulty of sekiro et al. are entirely capable of playing them, they just do not with to put in the effort to learn how.

i don't want a hard mode because it angers weak little incels like you who can't even beat a video game. its fucking hilarious to see you cope with the fact you suck

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I think we can sum up the general message as "Stop being such a bitch.".

Relative difficulty. Now become more skilled.

>Games are about enjoyment, and making it so that players cannot enjoy them is an accessibility issue.
I can't enjoy Fire Emblem because it's fucking boring and the art style is terrible. This is clearly an opinion most gamers share because it is one of Nintendo's lesser series. Nintendo has made this game such that we can't enjoy it. Should they cater to us somehow?
>inb4 "false equivalence"

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1. An Easy Mode takes no effort. You just double/triple base health. Nothing else has to change.
2. Calling people "secondary faggots" supports the idea that Souls games make you an asshole.

What's the point in gating off a game when many more people could enjoy it? I have no problem with Easy Automatic mode in fighting games or Bayonetta/DMC because I know the harder modes still exist.

It couldn't possibly be any worse than it is now.

There needs to be a tourist mode for mountain climbing. Differently abled people shouldn't be incapable of summiting Everest.

>You just double/triple base health. Nothing else has to change.
if a boss is trashing me and i'm too bad to even get a hit in i won't be helped by having more health

Games that have multiple difficulty difficulties are usually built around normal difficulties and harder difficulties just ramp up enemy stat numbers to stupid margins. Skyrim is a prime example of this. Designed and balanced around normal for turbo casuals, but playing the game on legendary difficult is a garbage experience.

>Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

dsp being able to faceroll his way through the souls series should disabuse anyone of the notion that they're "le super mega hard."
i wonder how many of these souls shitters have ever played king's field or shadow tower. i'm guessing very few of them have.

>Juggling braindead sandbags simulator fags
LMAO at DMCucks

The people who ACTUALLY think people behave this way are narcissistic bitter faggots

Trannies tend to talk like that

People who refuse to get better at a game and just want to cheat are secondary faggots. Games already have ways of making them easier that aren't outright breaking the fundamental mechanics of the game just so some absolute loser can feel like he beat the game.

Can anyone convince me to play picrelated on hard, I can never get to the first save point

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>You have to EARN fun from a video game you already paid for

The absolute state of soultards

You have not addressed

>people who are marginally not as good as me in video games need to kill themselves

This is why the entire world RIGHTFULLY thinks we are human garbage.

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That's literally just part of the problem and has to be fixed. Why are you acting like that's a reason to ignore the problem, when it's just another aspect to be solved?

making things easier for the sake of accommodating those too lazy to engage with them properly is a current issue with society at large, beyond just video games. i don't think it's a good mindset to support.
i am not very good at video games. i almost always lose every multiplayer game i play. i did not have an easy time with sekiro, bloodborne, or any of the souls games. but i took the time to understand them and try to improve as a player, and i eventually did complete each of them. to say that other people "need" an easy mode is to say that they are worse than me, which i have a hard time believing. i have more faith in people than that.
also, please do not egregiously use green text. it does not make your post eco friendly.

These days
>multiple difficulties = tuned for easy/normal with harder shit just being an increase in TTK or something stupid because they only care about how casuals experience the game
vs
>game that has just one difficulty and tries to tell casuals to fuck off
I'll take the latter, thanks. Even though they still don't usually turn out to be ultra hard or anything, it's nice having games that aren't made for children and mouthbreathing retards for a change.

Emotionally unstable tranny for sure

I don't care if people can't match my skills, I care that they bitch and complain that they should be given handouts because they're simply too lazy to get good.

>many more people could enjoy it?
user, the point of having a game be naturally hard an appeal to a target audience who likes hard games. It's like how there are genre's of books that are written in certain styles and manners to appeal to certain readers. Anyone can engage in it, but eventually it'll be put down because it isn't for them.

”We don’t want to include a difficulty selection because we want to bring everyone to the same level of discussion and the same level of enjoyment,” Miyazaki said. “So we want everyone … to first face that challenge and to overcome it in some way that suits them as a player.”

The creator continued: “We want everyone to feel that sense of accomplishment. We want everyone to feel elated and to join that discussion on the same level. We feel if there’s different difficulties, that’s going to segment and fragment the user base. People will have different experiences based on that [differing difficulty level]. This is something we take to heart when we design games. It’s been the same way for previous titles and it’s very much the same with Sekiro.”

No one hates you for being bad, people hate you for being insufferable douchebags

That's just inflating things out of context and going off-topic.
The crux of the matter is:
>People pay money for video games
>Some cannot enjoy the games they paid money for because the games' content isn't accessible
>Therefore content should be made accessible

That's it.

>I didn't understand some of the words in this fantasy book. I demand it be reprinted with an easier vocabulary just for me.

Game is usually designed better if it's made for only one difficulty. Eat shit.

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If you find souls games that fucking difficult, easy mode would not help you.

I hope in the future all games are creative or sandbox based with no challenges, obstacles or goals.
So worthless cocksuckers like you have nothing to hold over good decent people that just want to enjoy things

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You should probably be worrying letters to publishers to extend development time and, by extension, convincing investors to hand over unlimited money to fund said development time, then. I'm all for game devs having unlimited time and freedom. That way they could create a perfect core experience and find ways to include others too. But the world isn't perfect so until then I'd rather see a lot of great games with narrow differing audiences than more okay games that don't offend anyone.

>We don’t want to include a difficulty selection because we want to bring everyone to the same level of discussion and the same level of enjoyment,” Miyazaki said. “So we want everyone … to first face that challenge and to overcome it in some way that suits them as a player.”

It’s baffling that people overlook this, souls has longevity because it has community. Part of the reason it has a community is out of necessity to discuss how people beat certain things, you’re actually seeing this somewhat with Sekiro, where someone recommends the umbrella but it turns out to be fucking useless if you’re not using kuro’s charm.

If we all have the same experience, we’re all on the same level.

Fuck off, not every game has to or should cater to everyone. I'm sorry you were too much of a smooth brain to remember From Soft makes hard games.

I gain enjoyment from overcoming difficulty. It's how I've always been. So, the momentary frustration does lead to a more enjoyable experience for me.

Shitty bait. Apply yourself.

The content is accessible, you just have to actually learn how to play the game.

The games are designed with unique aspects in mind. And out of those unique aspects, you might find some easy, and others difficult.
For example, you might find navigation easy. While someone else gets lost easily.
You might find combat hard, while others are slicing through enemies like a hot knife through butter.
Each aspect of the game, has to be at a level where it would rewards those with the skills to complete it, while daring those who struggle to get better.

You are never unable to do anything in the game. Rather, you simply haven't come to learn the manner by which you need to handle the situation. And when you do find out how to do it, that's the rewarding experience. That's the point of the game.

If you could lower the effectiveness of the challenges, then you are never truly learning the game. You are merely going through the motions.
It's kind of the difference between fill in the blank tests, and multiple choice tests. Multiple choice tests can be easily passed, if you know how to guess well. You'll always stand about a 50% chance of answering a question properly, if not more. You don't need to actually learn what to do. Compared to fill in the blank tests, where you absolutely must have knowledge of the question, in order to fill in the proper answer.

However, even with that all said, Souls games do have options to make the game easier. You can grind to level up. You can invest in better weapons. You can summon other players to your world to help you. You can allow yourself to be summoned to other people's worlds, in order to learn the level/boss without consequence.

The built-in community aspect of Dark Souls, makes it possible for people to learn the game.

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Clearly the solution is to have no-effort easy modes where all enemies die in one hit and the player is invincible.

if i bought a book that was beyond my intelligence and therefore incomprehensible, i would not demand that the writer rewrite the book in a way i could understand. that would not be fair. if despite my best efforts the book remained unusable to me, i would return it and buy a new book that i could enjoy.

You come off as an unhinged sociopath

Its because the only people who actually argue for a difficulty selection in souls are retards or journalists who just want to get a review out faster

Please address this:
>Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

The content is equally accessible to everyone. It's not their fault you didn't do any research on the kind of product you're buying, because they sure as shit don't hide the kind of game it's supposed to be.

And you come off as a loser who sucks at games.

It's for the designers of this product to decide. And they've decided that you must get good to get your reward.

This discussion always confuses me. These kinds of games that are somewhat inaccessible are clearly what Miyazaki and his team want to make. Why are they under any obligation to make their product usable for everyone? If they don't want to include easy mode, why is it such a big deal?

>Abridged books should never be published

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Fun over difficult any day

Guys, here's the real honestly truth: getting gud at a video game, any video game, is a waste of time. That's why people think you're an ass for saying there shouldn't be an easy mode.You're basically saying "you should waste more time on this video game in order to enjoy it". Stop comparing it to sports or climbing Everest, because those aren't a waste of time or effort like our digital toys.

I have to wonder why you'd want to beat a game like Sekiro on easy anyway? I've been playing Enderal and cheating the fuck out of it because Skyrim combat sucks but isn't that the whole point of Soulsshit?

>having fun without difficulty
Casual

Retards like you shitting up discussions about games that would have otherwise filtered your casual ass is making my overall experience worse.

Any hobby is just as much of a waste of time as vidya, retard.
3/10 I replied.

It's only a waste of time, if you're not having fun.
Many people are having fun getting good.

The problem with souls games isn't the mechanics or dodging or any of that.
it literally is just artificial difficulty.

Bad hitboxes and enemies that just kill you in one quick swipe with no wind up.

if you fail one roll and then get killed in 1 hit by some instant attack that is just artificial difficulty killing you over and over to pad the game out. look at the half health chalice dungeons in bloodborne and tell me getting squashed by amygdala with a second of entering the fight and then having to run all the way back to it.

You don't get to practice bosses because they kill you so quickly and they take so long to get back to them.

>god damn it I spent cash on this paddleball and it won't go right! whaddaya mean I have to learn how to play with it!?
>god damn it I paid good money for this jigsaw puzzle! whaddaya mean it won't assemble itself?!
>god damn it I bought this rubik's cube and I have to rearrange it?! but that takes TIME! FUCKING RIPOFF ARTISTS!
That's how stupid you sound, and I don't even play soulsborne shit.

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Normie.

Come back when you are a real gamer.

Difficulty is fun for quite a few people.

>An author should be required to write an abridged version of every book he makes

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i do not think the issue is whether the options exist or not. if from had included difficulty options in sekiro on release, i do not think most of the people in this thread arguing against you now would have minded.
even if they did not like it, however, i do not think they would have demanded that from remove the options. it is not fair to demand that the creators change their product for you. it was their decision to not include difficulty options.

I hope they add one, and I hope it's zero effort hold 1 button to win so these people can realize how empty it is to just win without working for it. It's FUN to get your ass kicked and improve yourself, that's why I play this shit, I like to be challenged and improve.

Fair. But it is not all to a game.

Why even post such low effort bait?

I don't think you know what 'artificial difficulty' means.

A very specific few people

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See

It's clear that the reason these ilk hate no difficulty options is not because they care about the accolades of beating these games authentically but because there still exists modern entertainment or culture which bars access at any level for any reason. To have a game deny anyone even for merit reasons is basically the colored's only water fountains for games journalists. It's offensive to their sensibilities that there are still things for some people and not for others.

imagine if frodo went and killed everything in one hit on his way to mount doom haha

climbing everest would be a monumental waste of time and effort, not to mention an unnecessary risk of your own life. there is no reason to do it.

Becaus anyone who has not played the lower depths of video games are not gamers. Amyone who treats difficulty as what matter is a fagot.

Come back after you play something more obscure.

Dude stop trying to argue vicariously through memes. Dark Souls II was the only game where this nonsense applied and everybody already hates that game.

You know what I want to see? I want to see a new game get released that's so fucking hard it makes Souls games look like babby's first vidya, a game where only a handful of people ever even manage to beat it. Not because I'm a masochist but because the waterfalls of tears from butthurt game journalists and casuals would be amazing.

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It's not not. It's practice for other physical exertions and hostile environments.

Because most games that have a "hard" difficulty never designed their games for it, and in most cases the poor game design becomes more obvious in the harder difficulties

a pretty good example is bioshock infinite, where the hard difficulty just turns enemies into bulletsponges but it also becomes obvious as to why the removal of health kits was a bad design because the game likes to throw it's equivalent of a "big daddy" in your face while the previous bioshock you had time to prepare for such an encounter, in fact it was more or less a choice if you wanted to bother with it
not to mention that with a 2 weapon limit you're extra fucked with bulletspongy enemies, the whole game falls apart on hard and it's like that for a lot of games that didn't put in the effort of making a challenging but fair difficulty

So 90% of classic pre-2000 games? Even Super Mario Bros 3 would trigger half of these fragile journos.

I can't speak for Bloodborne, because I haven't played it. However, for the other Souls games, 99% of attacks do have wind ups. And for one hit kills, that's typically because the player hasn't invested in HP. Very rarely does anything ever one shot you, if you've been throwing some points at HP as you play.

But where you lack in HP, you probably make it up in strength of dex, or something else advantageous. And that goes back to what I said about the games being designed with unique qualities. There are multiple ways to hand every situation. You might not be the best at dodging. But maybe you have decent strength, so you can carry a bigger shield. Or maybe you have more HP, so you can survive the blow. Or maybe you have more endurance, so you can equip heavier armor, thus surviving the blow. Or maybe you have more magic, so you can cast a defensive spell, or simply keep your distance.

You just have to learn how to handle the situation. That's not artificial difficulty. Because many people don't fail that dodge. It just so happens that the situation was uniquely suited to their abilities, and so they excelled, where you struggled.

This was the only post in the entire thread with a valid reason for opposing accessibilty in video games, and it can be refuted with a single image.

Most games already have these options in for testing. All they need to do is let players use them.

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>was actually using the term "gamer"
>unironically doesn't find games with no difficulty to be boring
Go back to r/whateverthefuck

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>If an author's publisher wants to print an abridged book, the author should be able to block the printing because it "goes against his intentions" of only a few people being able to understand it

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That's a fail comparison because video games have many different areas of fun.

You buy a jigsaw or a Rubiks cube for the sole purpose of solving it.

You but a paddleball for the sole purpose of hitting the ball with a paddle.

A video game on the other hand is a mixture of many elements.
There's lore and story, there's exploration, crafting, Combat, ect ect

Then you get to a hard boss and it halts everything. You fail at the combat aspect and it denies you all aspects of fun, you don't get to complete the story because of the overly difficult combat.

Imagine if you went to a taco place and they had the best tasting seasoning and the freshest ingredients, the best tacos in the world, but the chef kept putting "Mega Death Asshole destroyer" hot sauce on the taco, essentially making it impossible to eat for the vast majority of consumers. You literally just ask the guy if he could make a taco with a milder hot sauce, and people act like you're ruining the experience

why shouldn't they?

Just use a trainer

Games Accessibility isn’t just difficulty Accessibility doesn’t mean ‘nerfing’ or making games ‘too easy’ Accessibility doesn’t have to change core player experience Accessibility is about addressing unintentional barriers Accessibility is about EMPOWERING players to adapt

Your funny. Ever play Robot alchemic drive? Disaster report? In cold blood?

If not, you a fucking normie.

fuck you asshole

now imagine you had to beat BT with no warps because they wouldn't exist.

would you complain that it has no easy mode?
of course you would, because your a fucking faggot!

You're having a knee-jerk response to gaming accessibility discussions, fearing that we're trying to take away their complex or difficult games. We're not! Accessibility isn't about lowering the technical ceiling, it's about options letting more people into the building at all.

Imagine being this retarded.

>An author's publisher should be able to take his shit and make it into something completely different and contrary to his original vision just because they want to

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I'm not opposed to easy modes in games, since games are never designed with that being the intended experience and everybody knows that. Also Souls games in effect do have difficulty modes since the game gets harder on each round of NG+. There's plenty of hard games that have easy modes. I don't mind the Souls game's lack of difficulty options since it would make the online functionality even more of a mess than it currently is but in something like Sekiro where there is no online I can't really see much justification for not including the option.

Dark Souls is not a hard game at all.

It's quite easy once you've learned how things work.
There's almost no tight timings or twitch inputs which lead to instant failure and you have infinite continues from a fuckton of checkpoints

>we

I hardcapped my vitality in bloodborne and still get killed in one hit by quick swipes.
You get behind and enemy and they just flip around and slam you instantly in that game

>Then you get to a hard boss and it halts everything.
Literally git gud.
>now imagine you had to beat BT with no warps because they wouldn't exist.
What? I've beaten Battletoads several times with no warps, I did just a few days ago in fact. Its one of my favorite games.

Please prove that "most games" have them.

Some people like to brag about taking it up the ass harder than others, it's not exactly rocket science, OP.

he really didn't faceroll through them though he quit until he was streaming and able to read twitch chat to guide him

>hurrr I play these obscure games. That makes me not a casual who can't ever git gud
kek. Nice "argument"

I only play hard games. That makes me a normie.

Makes sense to me.

>food analogy

Jesus fucking Christ here we go.
That's a terrible analogy because you are making the assumption that an easy mode is just like "milder sauce" when the core argument against easy mode is that it's a completely different experience. To put it in your analogy's terms: you're not going to a taqueria and asking for milder sauce on a taco, you're going to a taqueria and demanding they make you a burger when you are completely free to just go to a burger shop and not eat at the taqueria in the first place.

Yes but to the extreme. I wasn't exaggerating when I meant that I wanted to see it be so hard that only a small handful of people ever beat it. I want to fucking bathe in that ocean of tears.

et's just have a scream about this bc I saw another shit take about difficulty settings in games.

ADDING EASIER MODES IS AS MUCH AN ACCESSIBILITY OPTION AS ANY OTHER!!

Having them doesn't mean that YOU have to USE THEM.

Nobody is forcing you to
there is generally, genuinely NO FUCKING REASON not to open your game up to as many people as possible???

Look, some people just don't have good reaction time, some people can't rapidly tap buttons, some people can't focus well on several things at once. Hell. Some people just want to enjoy the aesthetics and story without having to sink hundreds of hours and that is O K A Y!!!

Souls games only have 1 difficulty

Souls games use difficulty to make up for it's lack of content

>things I never said
Keep going. What other retarded non-arguments do you have?

>Casuals got so butthurt that easy mode now comes with a "pick this if you want to enjoy the story!" disclaimer in most modern games.
>Implying lowering the difficulty doesn't undermine the conflict.

Souls games being balanced around 1 difficulty works because they are RPGs, and many of the solutions to problems or challenges can be answered by using your different options, to the point that it makes them easy. Sekiro doesn't have any of that, so balancing is meaningless in that game. Mobs just hit hard for the sake of hitting hard.

Seems like someone is getting angry. Your arguments are like viniger and cheese. Bland, awefull and makes people sick.

Real gamerd game for the sport, not for fake points. But we already established, you are not a real gamer. You are a normie.

Like why is it so important that a game be made easier for you instead of you actually attempting to improve?

I'm saying that tacos have many different ingredients, cheese, beef, tomato, sour cream what have you. Those ingredients alone are fucking awesome and no other restaurant has ingredients that fresh or high quality, but then they have a shitty hot sauce that makes the whole thing inedible for 90% of people.
You could give customers the option to have a milder sauce and the taco would still be better on it's other strengths.

I find that a little hard to believe. Maybe you just suck at the game, and fail to read tells that are obvious to everyone else. I can say, because I don't have experience with the game. But I'm not sure I can take your word on it either.

Regardless, just because there are a few cheap attacks, that means the games needs a difficulty mode? Is that the solution?

>laughing at you
>angry
Don't you ever get tired of living with your blatant handicap? I take back what I said earlier. Stay here for future laughs. Don't go back to tumblr/reddit/wherever.

Here's a thought: the designer is trying to evoke an emotion from the player. Not just with the level design or the set dressing, not just with the animations and dialogue, but with your actual gameplay. The cruel memory-based difficulty curve is part of the crushingly hopeless atmosphere, integral to the experience.

There's no easy mode in Dark Souls for the same reason there's no full color version of Schindler's List: it would fail to convey the creative intentions of the creators.

the game already starts on easy. Hard is enabling the Bell Demon, and going into NG+ with one of the difficulty enhancing items enabled.

He doesn't, but you do. People who screech and cry to be included in something by having the bar lowered for them are unbelievably self centered. You're a genuine sociopath if you think it's okay to ruin a game people enjoy so you can play too. You're like a little kid sibling who gets mad seeing teenagers doing teenager things because you know you're not old enough to enjoy it yet.

Then you don't actually like the taco, and you can go buy another taco from someone else that suits your tastes better.

I don't know what game this is, so I can't really speak about gamplay; it looks like a platformer though.

So, you guys want basically God Mode in everything but name?

Like why is it so important that a game be difficult for other people instead of you just picking hard mode?

Why don't you just accept that you suck at videogames?

The only valid complaint is "but developer resources". Implementing a god mode would not require much time/resources. It's that simple.

In the end it's just people whining about their gated community.

See

>Max vitality
>Enemy damage from 1 hit exceeds my total health
>You just suck at the game

You're retarded

Because "hard mode" in most shit these days isn't anything other than easy mode with inflated values that make the game tedious rather than challenging. If devs ever took the time to properly design and balance difficulties individually, we wouldn't be having this thread.

Because not every game's difficulty can be so easily modulated by changing numbers without breaking the games mechanics.

Jesus fucking christ, did r/games's shutdown bring in an influx of casuals who want to breeze through everything?

>ruin a game

just pick hard mode and enjoy getting killed 900 times you stupid faggot. adding difficulty options doesn't actually mean YOU PERSONALLY have to play on easy mode. you're fucking retarded dude

That already exists in the form of the vast majority of games on the market. Individual games like Sekiro base their identity around difficulty, you wouldn't want to threaten a developer's identity would you?

If you're just going to play easy mode to skip the game and look around and watch cutscenes why bother buying the game at all? Watch it on twitch.

Serious question, how is Sekiro not retard proof? Is it not accessible by basic principle of a controller being easy and intuitive to understand? All controls are explained, and invalids can play with it all the same as we do. If they can't wield a controller for some reason then there are already companies that build controller devices to answer these very problems. The only thing left is the difficulty simulation itself. If you don't like the designed scenarios, install a trainer. Since this obviously isn't an ego thing or anything, that shouldn't bother you. Problem solved.

Zatch Bell! Mamodo Fury
Checkmate faggot.

he's right, you're the retarded one. you're also a selfish crybaby. games with satisfying difficulty tend to be designed with difficulty in mind. simply adding a hard mode doesn't cut it. skyrim on hard is nothing like dark souls or sekiro, because those games are designed from the ground up to provide challenge. you're truly an asshole for wanting to deprive people of the very few challenging games they get just so you don't have to feel like the inferior cuckold you really are.

You can't read?
That place has superior ingredients and higher quality produce. They just ruin it with hot sauce.
fucking moron pay attention.

No. It's been like this for years and years now and has only been getting worse. I honestly wish infinitychan was faster so that I could just stay there and let reddit have this shithole board that's already infested beyond redemption.

>Dark Souls
>Hard mode plays exactly how the game plays normally right now
>Easy mode cuts enemy damage in half

wow so difficult. totally ruined

It's a question of dev resources and artistic motivation.

If Quentin Tarantino made PG-13 rated cuts of his movies they'd be more accessible, but the experience would be ruined. It's spending money to help people miss the point.

It requires fast reaction times, being built around parries. There are disabilities which limit a person's reaction times.

>difficulty
Talking about accessibility here. Making the game easier would have it remain the same RELATIVE difficulty while being accessible to someone with disabilities, allowing them to have the same experience as someone without disabilities.

Oh well, go play a different game then ;^)

Its not excluding anyone, there is realistically nothing stopping a player from enoying the game short of actual disabilities, which the people clamoring for baby mode dont have.

You could grind in the game to upgrade your stats and armor to have the same effect. That would require effort on your part though and by that point you might have actually grown a pair and gotten good at the game.

I know, your analogy is just shit because you're retarded. If you prefer, then the taco is made in a way that explicitly depends on the hot sauce being added. Without that specific sauce, the entire taco is diminished and you can get one that you like better at another shop.

You know, those options used to be common in games. They were locked behind cheat codes. Or, you have to unlock them by completing difficult tasks. I kind of see your point. More options can be fun. I remember when my brother learned how to enable god mode in quake. It was a blast becoming an unstoppable killing machine.

But what I don't like, is framing it as "accessibility." Because it implies some kind of moral duty that the dev must take. Like offering ramps for wheelchair access. You people aren't handicapped. You're just bad at video games. Stop calling it accessibility options. You have the same access to the game as everyone else.

I feel like this is just another form of social welfare, only it's video games. Lowering the standards, so those who don't want to get good can play.
And then what will inevitably happen, is that the easy mode audience will become larger than the normal mode audience. And the devs will shift their focus from the good players to the shit player.

Do you know what's a better accessibility option? Playing an easier game. If you suck at Celeste, then go back to Super Mario and play that for a while. Then when you have the hang of that, return to Celeste.

Honestly, I have stopped caring. If a game has a difficulty, I just play on normal. If it doesn't, it doesn't bother me. I get the same result no matter what.

Those people can play a different game, maybe something turn based.

people who play on hard are tryhards

Those 0.02% of the playerbase disabled people should play something else or just watch the game instead of reeeeeeing about the game not catering specially to them. There are a million other games that are perfectly fine for them. Twitch and YouTube exist. Not everything needs to be made for everyone.

Youre projecting too bud

That isn't how game design works, you casual little shit. Satisfyingly difficult games have to be designed from the ground up in order to feel that way. You're literally getting mad at people for enjoying games you're too casual to play and wishing you could water down their experience. If you're that desperate you can just watch a playthrough on youtube.

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A lot of people consider the difficulty to be a defining/signature feature of From games. In that sense it's not like asking for a taco with a different sauce, it's like asking for a pizza without dough. Yes the games have other traits that make them good but that's the same as how you can eat the cheese or toppings on a pizza by themselves and they still taste good but if they're not all together it's not "pizza".

>You people aren't handicapped. You're just bad at video games. Stop calling it accessibility options. You have the same access to the game as everyone else.
Define "you people". You're just making assumptions about who's delivering a message in order to dismiss a valid argument which affects a large amount of people.

why do people think this? Literally no game gives me a rush like souls games, that's why I play them. I'm fucking horrible at games in general but I still try because having a challenge is fun

hard mode fags have retard complexes, if hard mode didnt change life or attack values(like attack sppeed) more would play it, normal mode is basically shooting a guy in the head he dies as opposed to shoot a guy 50 times in the head and he dies.

there is such a thing as enemies dying to quick to execute good strategies but this isnt what were talking about were talking about predictable preset computer opponents that wont learn and adapt and once you do you win. every time congrats you outlearned a retarded computer the rest of us wont bother but your trophies in the mail

I can't verify if you're telling the truth.
I've known people to make claims such as this, and then I look into them, and see they're full of shit. Or deluded themselves into believing a falsehood.

"Hard mode" is often gay and badly designed, and is there to tokenly appease people who want games that aren't shit. If you just want to play Skyrim so bad go fucking play Skyrim. The irony of this discussion is that you obviously don't want to play Dark Souls, because if you did you wouldn't be asking for Dark Souls to not be Dark Souls. You want access to Dark Souls so that you can you're part of something that you're not, like a parasite.

>The only valid complaint is "but developer resources". Implementing a god mode would not require much time/resources. It's that simple.
Why does it need to be there? I'm asking seriously. I'm not a huge fan of the Souls games, I beat the first; and Sekiro; looks beatable.

>In the end it's just people whining about their gated community.
It's no more petty than arguing for a mode that isn't there, in a game created by a dev that's known for making difficult games.

From the outside, it's like watching a bunch of people who didn't inteand to buy the game anyways scream that they should be catered to.

The simple fact is that in some cases accessibility options are not worth the time and money, especially if the altered version would prevent the player from properly experiencing the game - you'd literally have a better time watching someone else play on twitch.

I don't honestly fucking get what people are arguing about. Options in Souls game's difficulty? Or games in general?

'Cause if it's the latter then it's simple as having higher difficulties reward the most skillful players and locking elements behind them.

>tryhard
Yea Forums is an 18+ website.

now imagine its fucking 1990, your 10 and you and a friend can't beat turbo tunnel for several months because you just can't GITGUD because that word didn't fucking exist yet.

you may beat it now, but back in the day, child, people didn't just beat BT several times. they barely beat the game at all, no one fucking did.

if you could get past Tunnel, you pretty much beat the game in 99.9% of kids eyes.

lol you're retarded.
You changed the entire scenario and defied logic just to suit your argument.

let me make this easier so your caveman brain can understand.

McDonalds Cheeseburger = SHIT (Bethesda Game)

Five guys cheeseburger = GOOD (Fromsoft Game)

Now we've determined that one is better than the other. but what if Five guys started putting dog shit into their burgers and a handful of people said it made the burger superior because they like eating shit.
And you asked for a burger without shit in it and they said you're diminishing the experience.

A five guys burger without shit in it would still be superior to a McDonalds burger. but it's ruined by virtue of a giant fucking piece of poop on it.

Let's be honest, none of these journalists and cucks with their skill level would be able to beat an "Easy" Dark Souls game. Let's say they deal double damage and receive half damage from all attacks. They still get killed by twice the number of basic attacks they are too shit to dodge. Alright, too difficult still? They receive about an eighth of the damage and deal eight times as much damage per swing. Massive boost, clearly, but they'll still get massacred by anything faster than Taurus/Asylum Demon, and anything that peppers you with ranged attacks that you aren't smart enough to evade.

You will still get killed by fall damage because you're too shit at the game to maneuver on ledges properly.
You will still get killed by petrify because you are too shit at the game to know to immediately get out of the way of the smoke clouds.
You will still get obliterated by any invader because you are too shit at the game to know how to properly maneuver through combat (Unless "Cuck Mode" implies zero invasions)
You will still get stunlocked by enemies that you are too retarded to get out of the way of
You will still get baited and locked by the Mindflayers
You will still get sniped by the Anor Londo archers
You will still get melted in Black Gulch
You will still get eaten alive by the Winter Lanterns
You will still get fucked raw by the Jailers
You will still get annihilated by any fucking Black Phantom, Invading Hunter, Shinobi, etc.

All of this can be avoided if you just sit aside for some time, practice your swigs, practice your dodges, practice your blocks, practice your parrying and deflecting, practice your item usage, practice your timing, watch enemy movements, and learn spacing. But since you faggots just refuse to get better at the game, all of this is impossible, and while you beg, cry, bitch, moan, and complain for an Easy Mode, the actual fans of these games learn how to play.

TL;DR

GIT GUD

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That sounds like more of a problem from being disabled than anything to do with Sekiro.

The funny thing is that disabled people with a passion for games are able to play Dark Souls and Sekiro easily. The "b-but disabled people" argument is made solely by casual shitters and journalists trying to use people with disabilities as a shield to protect their own egos, and that's genuinely disgusting behavior.

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>you'd literally have a better time watching someone else play on twitch.
Which results in less sales which hurts devs!

That's why they should implement accessibility options!

>not worth the time and money
See

>Define "you people".
Everyone who isn't handicapped. Me, you, that user over there. It doesn't matter who they are, or what they believe. The fact of the matter is, unless you're missing fingers or chromosomes, you have the same access to games as everyone else.

>Imagine if you went to a taco place and they had the best tasting seasoning and the freshest ingredients, the best tacos in the world, but the chef kept putting "Mega Death Asshole destroyer" hot sauce on the taco, essentially making it impossible to eat for the vast majority of consumers.
If the proprietor is open about his recipe, and most of his customers enjoy it, you don't have the right to demand that he serve his food a certain way. Especially when there are millions of competing restaurants with equally fresh ingredients that will cater to your weaker palate.
Also,
>food analogy
Fucking brainlet.

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>You have the same access to the game as everyone else.

Really nigga

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Yes, and this is about making disabled people able to play games like Sekiro.

>fuck the intentions of the devs and the art of video games, put in easy modo for cash
Hot take, Becky

or you can make a game the way it was intended.
and easy mode can be the afterthought.

DMC5 uses its last level to introduce a brand new mechanic you use in NG+, it's not really supposed to be a one and done deal. The idea is to work your way up to DMD.

>A five guys burger without shit in it would still be superior to a McDonalds burger.
shut up, shiteater

Disabled people can play Sekiro just fine with custom controllers you prick

[Chalice Dungeons]

it's no falsehood mate

The statement was toward people who aren't handicapped.
Regardless, even someone like him can learn to play the games. He would just need to learn how to play with his mouth and stumps. Maybe a footpad, if he still has mobile lower extremities.

I understand exactly what you're trying to say, but your analogy is just as fucking retarded as you are, which isn't surprising because you're trying to use a food analogy.

Or you could just cheat or watch somebody else play if you really want a shitty, diminished version. Why do you think a game dev should waste time and resources on an afterthought solely for bad people like you?

There's a substantial difference between accessibility as in options like completely rebindable controls and color blindness settings and "accessibility" like instant win buttons for shitter journos.

> You want access to Dark Souls so that you can you're part of something that you're not

you treat it like it's some kind of club exclusive to people like you. it's a cult to make you feel better about yourself and it's sad.

No it isn't. This is about whiny cunts like you, who are perfectly normal and not disabled, whining and throwing temper tantrums because you can't get gud, using disabled people as a tool for your argument like literal cuntstains. Stop pretending. It's not fooling anyone here.

Look, just take Reservoir Dogs and make a PG version. You want it to be accessible, don't you?

I don't see why anyone would object, least of all the director of the movie.

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Are threads like these ironic? Im starting to not be able to tell anymore

Disabled people can already beat Sekiro. Stop using based disabled bros as a shield for your own inability to git gud, you horrible horrible person.

oh yeah, I forgot he mentioned that. Correct me if I'm wrong. But isn't that a mode where you fight creatures you've already fought before?

It took me years to beat turbo tunnel as a kid, my brother and I kept coming back because it was fun to attempt something so difficult. I remember when we finally managed to beat it. It wouldn't be until I was a teenager that I actually beat the game fully for the first time.

>I don't understand what you're trying to say
>I'll say I understand what you're trying to say and then call you retarded

quality argument

Then it's really fucking pathetic that you feel like you aren't part of the club and you're demanding access to it.

why do incels hate challenging games so much?

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And you're illiterate, too. Got any more first-grade analogies for me, kiddo?

>Two versions instead of one
>More content
>More appeal
>More money to the director for more ticket sales

in actuality your retarded argument would be great

Why is it essential that Sekiro be disabled proof? How many disabled people are actually gathering around this issue? Do disabled people actually care? Are you disabled? Why is it that the only people who visibly complain are games journos and the usual "social welfare" ilk? Can you produce for me a single disabled person crying about their lack of access to Sekiro?

Furthermore, disabled game's enthusiasts get by just fine with all kinds of games. BrolyLegs bodies LowTierGod just fine and disables beat Souls game and action games with missing limbs. Ironically if we were to ask what an actual disabled games enthusiast thinks, they'd probably say that you're an excusing making faggot who needs to get gud. A more likely explanation is that these are just the usual weak willed people using disabled people as the excuse to peddle their usual low effort morality.

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>I beat the game
>I respawned at bonfires dozens and perhaps hundreds of times
>bosses killed me twelve times before I learned their pattern
>I rage quit and relaunched the game countless times
>I watched walkthrough video tutorials to see how to kill bosses
>I died so many times that I thought "you died" was my wallpaper
>I spammed summons to gang up on bosses
>but I did it, you guys
>I beat the game

No, you got your ass thoroughly handed to you on your way to finishing the game.

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If you buy a purposely hard game famed for it's difficultly, then yeah you fucking do you goddamn brainlet.

Dang guess Sekiro is kicking peoples asses. Most games have difficulty options. I heard the new Yoshi game came out, that may be more their speed.

It's already bad enough that the can't beat pussy. Now they can't even beat vidya.

The good news is they can beat life in multiple ways.

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It depends on the disability. If it's a physical handicap, sure, but there ARE disabilities that affect reaction time.

>I watched walkthrough video tutorials to see how to kill bosses
>I spammed summons to gang up on bosses

Everything but these 2 are acceptable.

Because developer time wasted on balancing and implementing an easy mode (especially in a game with drop-in/out multiplayer) is worthless when players who are unable to complete a game that they can literally have other players play for them can just watch a youtube playthrough instead.

Maybe I prefer to play games that don't have easy mode options in them. :^)

...

If that's how you feel about it then why do you want in? So you can exert control over something you don't like or respect? The argument for letting people like you in become's even worse.

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cuz your a neet

Then they should consider watching a youtube playthrough. Just like someone who would want to play a game like Tennis or Hockey but lacks motor control can instead watch those games played to enjoy them.

>I like challenge in games
>"You're an incel!"

>I don't like challenging games
>"You're an incel!"
I hate Yea Forums with a fucking passion. So why can't I stop browing it?

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Yes but they are all artificially buffed opposed to their first encountered versions.

look up the undead giant

>all this projection

but they are intended to be difficult it's in there design, retard.

There are also people unfortunately enough to be deaf and blind. Guess we can't have art or music anymore, or else those people might feel like they missed out.

This. There's nothing wrong with failing, and trying again.

You're thinking of sekiro, not souls. Souls has summons (coop), different weapons that are easier, option to grind levels to make it easier, etc etc etc way more organic in its difficulty "slider" than most games. Sekiro is just like a game made for people who are too good at / bored of souls

Is Sekiro actually hard or is this one of those "lol its darksouls!" bandwagons.

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guys I tried reading Hamlet, but it's too hard
is there an easy-mode for it?

The game lets you do it fag it's just part of the design hurr durr

It's a bandwagon. The game is middling in difficulty at best

They actually do make retard-speak versions of Shakespeare plays but they're marketed at young students, not adults.

>*disabled* people are *not able* to do certain things
whoa... it's almost like... that's what disabled means...?

I want to enjoy the game, not interact with you fucking retards.

imagine, you and this guy meet, and youre all polite and successfully avoid saying something weird about his body, disability, and pretty confident you fit in with 'those cool guys that are cool about his disability and not overly weird and preachy.'

and then, suddenly, you two are alone. and out of earshot. you approach him. tower over him. a malovent smile spreads across your face as you bulge your eyes down at him, hoping they convey the mad lust that has now overtaken you. A strange expression crosses his own face.

Your arm slowly reaches for his legs, or his 'lower nubs.' He does a panic wiggle. No matter. It's over. But like a cat, you want to extend it a little bit longer, that moment that can't be put to words, but has just passed. Hmm, is it not the prey's fault for making such a moment pass by too quick? Oh but certainly, you agree to yourself, as you now hoist him up in one swift motion. You make sure to display your own strength, your own ability. "Look, man. One of my arms can support what's left of your body. Cool huh?" He says something, but total ecstasy blocks sound from registering between your ears and your brain. "Uh huh yeah." you grunt out. and then start giving him a little shake. "Hahaha. fun huh?" Your wild eyes glance at his face, which is contorted in rage and humiliation, or perhaps that's the blood rushing to his head from the gravity. Tsk. Bad prey. Doesn't know when to give up. You now notice a massive erection. How embarassing, you hope your new bro doesn't notice it and call you a fag, despite all the other obscenities he's screaming out right now.

You now secure your other arm on his other lower nub, and move to the center of the room. He sways a little from your grip. You begin to spin slowly. Then faster. Then faster. The centrifugal force picks him up until he is almost horizontal. "HAHAHA YES BRO! YES!! YOURE IN THAT SPACE STATION MACHINE THING!!!! YES BRO!!" you scream, your own drool whipping across your face.

>difficult
Many people suggest a false dichotomy between "difficulty" versus "accessibility"
Please educate yourself to the bare minimum level before participating.

It's harder than any Souls game but not quite as hard as God Hand. You can beat Dark Souls without ever getting good, but Sekiro is a little bit more demanding.

Side effect of the industry pandering to retards for 2 decades and now they're problem solving skills and reflexes have retarded (lol). Maybe that's why they keep talking about disabled people so much, they're trans-retarded.

It's way harder than Dark Souls.

Can one really claim to have beaten DMC3 if it was only beaten on easy or even normal?

OK what's stopping you retard? I don't remember the "post on Yea Forums" segment of Dark Souls.

iktf
We can't find a better alternative.

you know the second one is correct

>bad takes
>This isn't inclusive enough
>if you crave a challenge then good for you champ
>gating
I'm starting to realize why women's opinions were largely disregarded for most of human history

What do you do with games like chess or say real life you stupid faggot

>incel
isn't that insult reserved for hating women and minorities?
why are you guys throwing it around for everything now

Of course, we're not talking about difficulty! It's just that reflex intensive gameplay is handicapable exclusionary so we're going to include the "halve the reflex requirement" accessibility option to make the game less oppressive to handicapable-kin.

ugh

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You can make whatever excuses you want, I', still going to call you a bitch if you need summons to beat the game

SO LONG GAY BOWSER

OK, just just watched this fight. youtube.com/watch?v=f0VKJpbKw6E
I see he has a couple of swift slices to his back. But he totally winds up. It's one of those moves where you simply need to note that when you're at his back, he could pull off the slice at any second. So you need to wait for him to telegraph a move with a safe window to counter. Rather than spamming attack, and hoping RNG doesn't get you killed. This isn't anything big. Maybe you get struck by it once, and then you learn to bait out his attacks when you're at his back.

So is the Chalice version really that much worse?

its for people who are bad at games

I think you know why I'm here

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"WOOOO!"

You let go, and your friend flies from your grip. Not accustomed to spinning like that, you lose your balance, and stumble to the ground as well. You struggle to get up, laughing all the while. "crazy, huh bro" you gasp out to your good friend. He seemed to have landed with a loud bang, and it looks like he flew straight into the spice cabinet and slumped down onto the ground.

You get up to inspect the damage. Tsk, this won't do. You look towards your friend on the ground, now conscious, and squirming in a grotesque, frantic way. You bend down and lift him up by the arms this time. A rush of passion swirls around your brain again. Without letting your friend know, you build up kinetic energy, and swing him against the dented spice cabinet. It's just like hitting something with a sack of potatoes. Not that you've ever done that before. Wham, Wham, Wham, Wham. You're careful to not let his precious head get hurt.

Exhausted, you let him go. The drool is all over your face, and your sweating healthily. Your panting speaks to your own satisfaction, but your friend is now totally terrified. Oh damn, here it comes. You hate this feeling. It always comes with that annoying question of whether or not you did something awful.

You take a good long look at him. And decide no. No more self doubt. You unbuckle your pants, undo his diaper, and rape his asshole.

it's called game+

That's not true. Any physically demanding hobby will actually improve your life as opposed to video games.

The "letting woman into male spaces won't change the hobby" argument was a lie. Women infantilize wherever they go.

Because people enjoy challenge, and a product designed without concern for an "Easy mode" for journalists and people with terrible hand eye coordination frees up that time, love and resource for far more relevant and important design features and game elements.
Consider Dark Souls; you can grind your way along if you really want, how's that not "Easy mode"? Just over-level everything and stat-bloat yourself until you can stomp every boss. It's very doable.

The fact that you want every game to invest serious time, resources and effort into pandering to people who do not even fit that game's design is astounding.

>We're making a super cool hardcore rpg adventure, it'll be very challenging, buy today!
WHAT THE FUCK WHY ISNT THERE AN EASY MODE WHY IS THIS GAME HARD

Some games aren't for you, user.
Some games aren't meant to be easy.
Ever.
Under any circumstance.

While i'm at it
SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED

I'm no soulsfag, tried it didn't really enjoy it, but this entire idea that everything needs to be for everyone is idiotic and needs to go away. It's perfectly acceptable for a game to be too hard for people, it's just not for them. This idea that every game, movie, show, book, community, etc. needs to be 100% accessible to everyone is whack.
I'm not sure when it started, but following other social media it feels like there's been a push to remove the "niche" from everything. It seems like every new game/piece of media comes out, it's the hot new trend that everyone needs to talk about, then it's forgotten in the next few weeks when the new shiny object gets dangled in front of the masses. What happened to the longevity/nicheness that used to exist? It seems like things used to come out, find their audience and stick around for a while. Now it's just a sprint from one object of consumption to the next.

A bird in the hand is more impressive than 2 birds in a bush.
But in this case, there is only 1 bird

kino

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That's the easiest version of that fight.

Now imagine he has chains on his back and he spins around for an instant one hit kill, And the hitbox is all around him
And you also have you HP cut in half and all of his attacks are 1 hit kills and he leaps at you the second you enter the boss arena
and he has a shit load more health

To be a faggot for attention?

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In what way? You can get the health benefits elsewhere while still having vidya as your only/main hobby.

See

You can't show me a single person with a reaction time disability complaining that they wish Sekiro has an easy mode. Just admit to the fact that this isn't about "disabilities," you and all these other babies are just upset that this game that is relevant in current pop culture is too hard for you to participate in, and you're feeling left out.

>I'm no soulsfag

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I love souls for the lore, customization, world design and combat. The difficulty is just an added bonus

It's pretty clear that like this guy, the argument's being hijacked by "gamers" who are trying to push things being made harder for the purpose of gatekeeping. Accessibility and difficulty get conflated, especially by bad faith actors.

There are higher levels to this argument too.

"I beat this game on hard with no cheap tactics"

"I beat this game on hard with no cheap tactics in 4 hours 37 minutes"

Every game doesn't need a casual setting.
Literally watch a lets play, friend, or streamer if you don't want to interact with a game's mechanics.

i really hope you're trolling or false flagging. the tranny talk you're spewing is disturbing.

>watch a lets play,
>consider watching a youtube playthrough
>watch a youtube playthrough instead.
Why are you trying to kill video games you fucking retard?

Maybe

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You're literally a chorus of freaking dogwhistles for bad-faith "we don't need accessibility options" arguments. STOP.
Difficulty is a portion of accessibility, what's wrong with having a simple accessibility option? If you want to get your ass kicked, you got the harder difficulty options.

If the "accessibility" options just entail aspects that limit the player input demand, like reaction time, then you're directly affecting the difficulty you mealy mouthed maggot. Nobody is fooled by euphemistic newspeak. On the contrary, people are getting really tired of it.

So I get why Souls fans become defensive when this is brought up since its one of the main reasons many fell in love with the series, BUT if someone wants to play these games and simply cannot make progress because of the difficulty WHO AND WHY does it hurt to add accessibility options?

I'm in the middle of watching the Chalice version this times.
youtube.com/watch?v=hu1QxHnfxmY
And I see the ball attack. It wrecks this guy's summon in a single spin. So clearly, it's a oneshot, but with an asterisk. *If you get hit by everything.
I saw this guy mistime a dodge, and one of the balls hit him near the end. So you can survive a partial strike.

I've also witnessed this guy easily dodge away from the attack multiple times. It seems like the iframes are very generous. The attack is telegraphed. But also, it's kind of predictable in it's timing. You can feel it coming, after you've encountered it a couple times. The boss doesn't allow you room for combos. So that attack probably fucks up R1 spammers. Performing a single blow, and then anticipating the spin, is really all you need to avoid it.

Also, if the half health version is AFTER this version, then that means you've had two encounters with this boss already. That's well enough practice. So I don't know why you're whining about artificial difficulty.

>incapable of the slightest measure of critical thinking
>calling others retarded
W E W
L A D

Repeat after me:
Games Accessibility isn’t just difficulty
Accessibility doesn’t mean ‘nerfing’ or making games ‘too easy’
Accessibility doesn’t have to change core player experience

Accessibility is about addressing unintentional barriers

Accessibility is about EMPOWERING players to adapt

Stop justifying the gating of content

If "saving" video games means having retards dictate every aspect of their design then I'm not sure they're worth "saving." That said, your ilk is not needed as Sekiro is already doing fine.

this website isnt for you
this board isnt for you
this game isnt for you
not everything in the world is inclusive
please drink bleach

ADDING EASIER MODES IS AS MUCH AN ACCESSIBILITY OPTION AS ANY OTHER!! Having them doesn't mean that YOU have to USE THEM. Nobody is forcing you to

you neglect to acknowledge that accessiblity options were always there. they are called 3rd party trainers. You can download them and play sekiro with infinite posture and health. Just like every other shitter who refuses to learn the game.

And do it, nobody cares. It's just that you're taking to the soapbox because that's what your types DO. If you truly cared about accessibility you'd just download the trainer and go live your life.

The fact that people like this are allowed to exist and act this entitled while expecting everyone to cater to them and their delusions is worrying. The entire world would unironically be better off if you and everyone who acts like you were euthanized.

Not on console

i know. but the answer to that is simply not buying it on console.

no, it isn't, you mouthbreathing fucking mongoloid. read the thread. take a nice long swig of bleach

this is either a tranny or a pretty solid tranny impersonator. either way thanks for the laugh, hope you're not an actual disgusting freak though.

if someone wants to play these games and simply cannot make progress because of the difficulty WHO AND WHY does it hurt to add accessibility options? You're literally a chorus of freaking dogwhistles for bad-faith "we don't need accessibility options" arguments. STOP. Difficulty is a portion of accessibility, what's wrong with having a simple accessibility option? If you want to get your ass kicked, you got the harder difficulty options. the argument's being hijacked by "gamers" who are trying to push things being made harder for the purpose of gatekeeping. Accessibility and difficulty get conflated, especially by bad faith actors. Accessibility is about empowering players in order for them to have the intended experience - it’s unlikely the intention is frustration at not being able to find your way in the world, so we can address that in numerous ways, usually with player empowered choices.

I am so tired of the BUT MY HARDCORE EXPERIENCE WILL NOT BE WORTH ANYTHING if Sekiro or Dark Souls games are accessible and have other modes BS. Especially from people who have never designed a game in their life.

Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

Does your console have a USB port? They're on console. There was a perfectly working Dark Souls trainer for the 360. I'm sure there's been one for every iteration since on both console systems.

anyone else enjoy this?

>Accessibility is about EMPOWERING players to adapt

Oh boy, there's that word again. What do you need empowerment for? Is this fucking AA? You people sound like a cult. Furthermore, why would I want to stop gating? We've seen what happens when cultural gating stops and it turns everything into trash. I'd like to keep people like you out. I do my part to keep gating alive every day.

GIT GUD.

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this actually can't be an ironic ruse, this person is actually this fucking retarded

or maybe it's pasta from twitter and you guys are dumb

The intention is forcing players to play on the same level as everyone else so they can feel an ACTUAL sense of accomplishment when they make progress in the game.

git gud

learn to code

etc etc

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The difficulty barriers aren't unintentional.

Talking about accessibility here. Making the game easier would have it remain the same RELATIVE difficulty while being accessible to someone with disabilities, allowing them to have the same experience as someone without disabilities.

Kanye West was called an incel too. It's the same as cuck but for the verified twitter crowd.

Why does everything have to be accessible to everyone? How are you gonna let blind people play Sekiro? What about people with PTSD that get triggered by violence? It's just pointless trying to make a game accessible to literally everyone, and a waste of resources

there are enough actual trannies raiding this board at any given time that it's actually hard to tell anymore.

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people dont understand that dying and getting rused in fromsoft games is literally the entire game

after you learn every enemys patterns, do you think the game is any fun? No, your only option is to either do challenge runs or speed runs. dying to bosses is literally the meat of the game for most people. That is why asking for an ez mode for sekiro is really absurd.

Like what are you going to do? cakewalk the game for it's "STORY"? please.

Go play the game for yourself idiot. You're not seeing the hitboxes from this guys fight.

Now go look up the amygdala fight and Headless bloodletting beast fight with all the curses

People with disabilities have to work harder to do things that people without them can do, this isn't new and game developers aren't obligated to put energy into catering towards these minorities of players.

Get gud applies to everyone. It doesn't discriminate.

now that is accessibility

Pretty much every game ever made has had cheats for it anyway. Play with fucking immortality enabled or something if you can't handle a game's intended mechanics.

Why do you even care what a reviewer who just wants to push through the game as quickly as possible and get on to the other 20 games he has to review that month thinks?

Some games are made to be hard. Part of the enjoyment comes from passing the test created by the difficulty level of the game.
Ta-daa.

Not every game has to be this way
But if the game is designed to be challenging and that is what the developers were going for, then it shouldn't be something anyone can just breeze breeze through
I guarantee that if Dark Souls had an easy mode option and people picked it, Dark Souls would not have become popular, casuals would think it was a boring and just forget about it as soon as possible
People like to be challenged, people like triumphing over these challenges, people like watching others struggle and overcome these challenges, it is in human nature to want to come out on top when it comes to something difficult
"I beat this game" is like saying you have a participation trophy
"I beat this game on hard" says that you challenged yourself, struggled, improved, and came out a winner
Hard games are hard, if you don't like that then play something else

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>Pretty much every game ever made has had cheats for it anyway
Did you stop playing games in the late 90s?

Well, the developers don't want to do it.

>We don’t want to include a difficulty selection because we want to bring everyone to the same level of discussion and the same level of enjoyment,” Miyazaki said. “So we want everyone … to first face that challenge and to overcome it in some way that suits them as a player.”

Should they have to sacrifice part of their vision to appeal to a specific subset of players? It's not like the games aren't huge hits as-is. Why can't they make what they want to, user, as long as it sells and doesn't hurt anyone?

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"Empowerment" is such a nebulous term, that can mean anything, depending on the perspective and biases of the individual.
Not only is empowerment ill defined within the scope of video games. It's also not agreed upon that empowerment is important for the experience of the game.

It's a vague term that sounds good when stated as a principle. But it's application meets conflictions.

I'm not going to look up more fights, if you're just going to tell me I'm wrong, because I haven't played the game.

Why does it need to be a requirement? Just don't buy the game or use a trainer. I don't want them spending time and resources on something they don't even want in the game and only are doing to appease everyone else.

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Difficulty is why Souls is as big as it is now. From would be retarded to dumb it down.

Just watch a walkthrough for easy mode

What if everyone game you ever loved forced you to play a mini game to get to the title screen and play the game.
But the minigame was a randomized Abstract Algebra logic puzzle and you couldn't play the game unless you solved it.

I guess everyone should just go to college or play something else cause the game wasn't meant for them.

Why are you people and journalists bitching so much? I’m no fan of souls games, but if my grandpa can platinum them all, then anyone can. Fuck off.

this is retarded on so many levels. please go sober up before posting again, you absolute moron.

I hope they go bankrupt due to lack of sales once the fad dies and normal people quit buying shitty souls games

i feel empowered when i win or beat a hard game
easy mode is for retards - literally

If the game’s not fun, why bother? If the player wants the game to be difficult, so be it. If the game is too hard for you, git gud.

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I see someone failed calculus

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If you can't pass the test, you need to study. If you can't play the instrument, you need to practice. If you can't play the sport, you need to train.

If you can't beat the game, that's okay just play on easy

You're retarded for thinking what you said and what the other guy said are comparable. On the other hand, I'd be up for it if it meant keeping out ultra-casual faggots who whine about fucking EVERYTHING.

It's called practice. Try it sometime.

>being this much of a spiteful baby because you couldn't git gud
Literally every other game coming out is made to appeal to lowest common denominator retards like you, and you're throwing a bitch fit because there's one or two games coming out a year that don't cater to you? How much of a little bitch can you possibly be?

That's just inflating things out of context and going off-topic.
The crux of the matter is:
>People pay money for video games
>Some cannot enjoy the games they paid money for because the games' content isn't accessible
>Therefore content should be made accessible

That's it.

Games are about enjoyment, and making it so that players cannot enjoy them is an accessibility issue. Accessibility is about empowering players in order for them to have the intended experience - it’s unlikely the intention is frustration at not being able to find your way in the world, so we can address that in numerous ways, usually with player empowered choices.

I am so tired of the BUT MY HARDCORE EXPERIENCE WILL NOT BE WORTH ANYTHING if Sekiro or Dark Souls games are accessible and have other modes BS. Especially from people who have never designed a game in their life.

Maybe you don't understand why having better options so as not to exclude people from the experience of the game is necessary, but to counter that...if it can be done without changing your own experience for the worse(and in most cases, it can) , why the fuck do you care?

Maybe do some research before dropping $60 on something you might not enjoy

Fromsoft got too big. Now the *true* casuals want in. Some would argue that the games were already played by casuals. But no. It's popularity was middling. However, three things have happened.

1. Dark Soul's reputation is MASSIVE. Everyone is curious about it. However, casuals have been too afraid to give it a try.
2. Sekiro is advertising like crazy. I see the ads on youtube all the time. They're really throwing some marketing dollars at this one. So again, people are curious.
3. It's a new IP. Now that Souls is over, and this is something brand new. More people are deciding to give it a chance.

All this put together, means that the *true* casual audience now wants in. But they still can't handle it, due to the difficulty barrier. So now, accessibility has become a matter. It's the one thing holding them back from this experience. They feel like they should be able to play every AAA game. As they've always have.

>I'm bad and this game I bought is hard = this game isn't accessible
>the customer isn't responsible for determining whether something may or may not be for them before purchasing it
You're retarded.

Wait, if I loved the game, that means I've played it a lot already, which means I should be used to these puzzles. So why would I be complaining if I can do them?

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games are about competition loser

I think they should have an easy hard mode, because it makes me feel bad that everyone else can beat a game on hard except me.

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Unassailable.

>Games are about enjoyment
Actually, Miyazaki states himself, that what he seeks when developing his games, is a sense of reward. And he uses difficulty as a means to give the player that rewarding sensation, when they overcome.

That's literally his intent when making his games. Stating otherwise, is wishful thinking.

you fell for it
games arent about solving math puzzles unless that's what the game is actually about, at which point only people actually interested in solving math problems would play it
not only that people genuinely interested in the game would actually take the time to solve the problems or mod them out since the actual game isnt about solving math problems

I think Kirby's Epic Yarn is more your speed

Are you aware that not all skills can be learned? That all people are not equal?

Conservatives: Just work harder to do anything
Liberals: Anybody can learn to do anything

Some people are not mentally capable of doing certain tasks. practice and education cannot make everyone capable.

I still dont get why they dont do difficulty like Thief 1 and 2
>the harder you play you unlock the complete real mission, not just scraps

Or something like Radiant from Darkest Dungeon, mostly design arround speeding up things

you replied to the wrong post you mongrel

>Conservatives: Just work harder to do anything
>Liberals: Anybody can learn to do anything
That's the same thing. 4/10 otherwise

probably because games like Dark souls and bloodborne are fucking 10 times cooler than dog shit like uncharted or whatever gay shooting game that's being released every 6 months.

but for some reason all the best writers and all the best world designers only make good games if they are impossible to play.

What other game has the same story and setting as dark souls but isn't difficult?

What other victorian gothic alien lovecraft game was released in 2015 that wasn't difficult?

There's no good games that are also easy, it's all dog shit.

>be full time wagie
>tired as fuck, just want to play video games for 2 hours before I fall asleep on a Saturday night
>ugh wtf this game is too hard, I spent 2 whole hours and I'm not even at the second boss!
>only play a couple more hours on Sunday before 5 pm when you make dinner, shower, and get ready for bed
>wtf I should have beaten the whole game by now! it's already work time again...
just find a new hobby you fucking losers

Yes I know, not everyone is physically/mentally capable to do whatever they want. But for most people, practice is how you succeed

Posting source. Because I feel like a lot of you never heard this before. And it needs to be known.
ign.com/articles/2011/11/08/the-mind-behind-dark-souls

>"But the main concept behind the death system is trial and error. The difficulty is high, but always achievable. Everyone can achieve without all that much technique – all you need to do is learn, from your deaths, how to overcome the difficulties. Overcoming challenges by learning something in a game is a very rewarding feeling, and that's what I wanted to prioritise in Dark Souls and Demon's Souls. And because of the online, you can even learn something from somebody else's death. I'd say that was the main concept behind the online, too."

I hope you get passionate about something one day and face immeasurable impassable failure and you rethink some of your opinions.

>dude im so passionate about this thing ive never done and dont even like!
fuck off poser

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Because the game as it is is the intended experience, and part of the artistic vision of the game is to persevere when things get frustrating. Grow up.

Enjoy the experience of getting better at a game over time through practice, like your fathers did when they bought a pogo stick or a hacky-sack or whatever dumb toy that required practice to fully enjoy. Realize that your mentality has been warped by skinner boxes and instant gratification, and slow it down a bit. You'll come to appreciate the game much more in the long run. You don't need to finish a new game in the first week it releases, and yes you will still eventually get through it even if you're only playing 2 hours a day because you have a "life".

We spent all of 2003-2009 trying to overcome the casual market and prove that difficult games had an audience, and finally dark souls came around and was a huge success in spite of its difficulty and gave those titles a place again.

Quit your bullshit or every game is going to turn into waypointers, tooltips, and linear hallways again. I don't care if you're being ironic, you're shilling for something or spreading propaganda, you're underage and naive, or if you're legitimately just a big spoiled baby who needs his hand held for every little thing in life. Grow up and stop treading on the integrity of art at the expense of everyone.

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lol it doesn't work like that.

You'll get about halfway through and realize you hit a plateau and then you'll desperately want to move forward and you'll see other people pass you by and you'll wonder why you can't progress. You'll get a taste of success before the bitterness of life hits you

this is some high tier projection. i dont know what your actual problem is but you wont fix it seething on a kyrgyzstani skrimshaw forum

>why isn't there an easy mode for this game I paid money for?????? I saw people doing cool tricks, I wanna do cool tricks too!!!!!

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>You'll get about halfway through and realize you hit a plateau and then you'll desperately want to move forward and you'll see other people pass you by and you'll wonder why you can't progress.
What stops me from asking those people what they're doing to progress in life and just mimicking what they do? Us humans are damn good at mimicry.

>no one: can't believe I paid money for this game that I didn't even get to see all the levels on

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>im bad at the thing and other people are better at it than i am so it should be changed to cater to my ineptitude
this is the mindset of communists and weaklings. if this isn't bait, re assess your life and mental attitude. you're going to be a loser forever.

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>a small entry to this medium I'm supposedly passionate about is too much for me to handle, so the entire medium is ruined!
wat
Also
>Souls games being so hard that someone who's actually passionate about games (therefore capable of playing them because they couldn't fucking be passionate about playing them otherwise) couldn't beat them
kek. You're trolling, right?

You don't see instrument players whining about how there are songs too difficult for them to play and begging for people to stop writing such difficult songs. They learn to play other songs.
You don't see hiking/climbing/whatever enthusiasts whining about how difficult and dangerous Everest is and demanding a fucking escalator be installed. They climb a different mountain or stick to hills.
Why should video games be any different? If you aren't trolling, just go and stay go.

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I'm a failed artist my dude.
I've come to terms with it and spread the good word.
The simple truth: life is unfair.

however video games don't have to be unfair.
I wish more people wouldn't reward developers for making shitty game decisions. I pirated all 3 souls games and played in offline mode. slapped on god mode if I got stuck, the games really aren't hard if you know how to use a computer I guess

>im a failed artist
>i beat dark souls with god mode on
>games arent hard if you know how to cheat
you're a failure. not at being an artist, or at video games, just a failure.

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Your definition of what's fair is warped. Souls games are the epitome of challenging but fair. If you suck nuts it's your fault, as I'm sure can be said about most of your real life failures.

then buy a copy then watch a youtube playthrough

Souls games do difficulty right imho.
Only one difficulty and you can unlock things that make the game harder if you wish.

>Challenging but fair

Whoops you slipped on this stupid ledge that was placed awkwardly for no other reason than to randomly kill you =^)

hol up bro
souls games are known to have fucked up glitches like enemy weapons going through walls or that snake monsters jumping attack literally snaking around a pillar
still knowing about those glitches allows a player to avoid them

yikes

this generation is fucked

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Counter-argument: playing KH2FM below crit ruins your expierence

what is: a hack/mod?

>enemy weapons going through walls
>glitch
embarrassing

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To touch on this, it's important to recognize those aspects are good specifically because of the difficulty. Hard games give players incentive to look somewhere other than the main path, in search of literally anything that can help them. Therefore, the devs put a lot of work into that optional content (like environmental storytelling, item text lore, NPC interactions, different weapons, etc.) so the player will continue to have fun. Easy games don't have that, so instead all effort goes into making the main game into a rollercoaster. The player will still experience all the game has to offer, but they'll also be far less invested in it because there was never an incentive to be invested in the first place.

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>Games not made for you
"Maybe if I argue and whine on a Tibetan feces collecting forum then everyone will understand"

What about all those books and movies and shows that make references that go over your head? You want there to be subtitles to explain them for you, or do you want them to drop it so its more 'accessible'?

So then point me to literally any other gothic victorian love craft game that isn't bloodborne

The difficulty doesn't make these games

This entire post is arguing against it self so hard it hurts.

>Isn't just difficulty
Then selecting a difficulty in a game shouldn't matter.

>EMPOWERING
Wait. . . . so you don't think that overcoming a CHALLENGE set by the devs made to be DIFFICULT is empowering or rewarding? You use the word 'gating' like you know what it means, but clearly you have no idea what your saying.

darkest dungeon
>The difficulty doesn't make these games
it's definitely part of it

>We're not!

Hello journalist! Do you enjoy posting from your cuck shed?

>what are built-in difficulty options such as kindling bonfires, summoning help, overleveling, farming, using overpowered gear and vice versa
Make think

>in a sea of easy games, there aren't any games like Bloodborne
>therefore the difficulty doesn't make the game

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>making it so that players cannot enjoy them
You mean a segment of players, cause obviously others do. Sounds like the game isn't for you pal.

>There are people who haven't beaten Serious Sam on Serious

>There's no good games that are also easy, it's all dog shit.
>Best world designers only make good games if they are impossible to play

Sounds like if you really cared or wanted to bother or anything, you'd just dedicate the time and effort like the rest of those who have played it before you and stop whining. Honestly Souls games have already been getting easier over time, if you want to really complain, play Demons soul's.

Hey pal, IWBTG is 4 pages back

What did Easy mode do to that game?

I'm saying that Good games are being inhibited by difficulty.

Bloodborne could be good if it had the same story but a different easier combat system.

this
it's a totally different creature on serious, you're always at most 3 hits away from death

Because you like being mad at retards, probably makes you feel like less of a failure

Shamelessly screencapping my own post in the other thread because fuck you. The souls games fall apart when you take away difficulty, it's what everything else is built on.

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>Inhibited by difficulty
You aren't a god, you aren't a savior, you aren't anything special then some random asshole who got thrust into something far greater than you and just so happened to get through. The difficulty adds to the narrative.

>The difficulty is part of the experience
>It's the designers vision
>It's the way the game is meant to be played.
Therefore, a mode for less skilled players that actually gives them the experience of overcoming a challenge instead of bashing their head against a wall and quitting from frustration is more in line with the intended experience. The experience that you, as a relatively skilled player, get out of the game.

Plenty of other, actually valid arguments to use against difficulty modes but this isn't one.

Never played a Souls game but I loved Dark Arisen, and commonly like sword fighting/medieval like games.

Should I give this shit a try? Difficulty is not an issue, I know by experience that 90% of Yea Forums is shit at vidya, so all this "to hard' threads don't phaze me

>I beat this game
Why do you need to bring this up other than trying to jerk your nonexistant microdick? How lacking in confidence must you be to tie your achievements to something like this.

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why do video games have the same importance as civil rights now

If you liked DA you'll feel find in dark souls. After a bit it'll transfer over like nothing.

Learn attack patterns and react to them, that's all there is to it.

Unless you literally have a physical illness that hampers your inputs, you can beat Sekiro.

Because literally who cares? If they make an easy mode, epic. If they don't, they don't have to. It's literally up to the people making the game, not people crying online.

>Should I play this cultural phenomenon?
Maybe, user, maybe. If only to see what if it lives up to the hype. Next you'll ask if you should try Tetris or Mario.

>less skilled players
>overcoming a challenge
Pick one and only one. Discussion dies when everyone experiences something different. The only thing that games that have done when adding difficulties, and intended for you to play on hard to get the real experience, was make it so there was a different ending or locking the rest of the game. Honestly I'm ok with the latter, since it means that if you really want to finish the game, or talk about it, you have to play it as it was meant to.

>Discussion dies when everyone experiences something different.
Therefore, the experience needs to be tailored to players of various skill levels to ensure that they have the same experience. If one person experiences a healthy challenge that they learn and overcome and the other quits in frustration, then they did not experience the same thing. Bear in mind I'm not talking about people who could get good but refuse to engage with the game, I'm talking about people who are legitimately bad.

Git gud lmao

>DEVS NEED TO CATER TO ME
No they don't. It is up to them how they make their game, not you. It is their choice to either add other difficulties or not. To quote those faggot """journalists""" who's articles people throw around in these threads: don't like it, don't buy it.

>adding an easy mode somehow ruins the impact of you beating it on a harder mode and the dev making money
Just incel thinking.

>People who are legitimately bad
So. . . all the people who have been playing the souls games for a while, and are veterans and know what they are getting into, versus the people jumping onto the fad so they can say they beat it. Lets divide the latter into two portions: Those who have looked into the difficulty of the games in question and understand that it uses death to teach the player and it is expected to die several times over the course of the game. That the game teaches you through this process and that is the experience and ultimately the reward when overcoming an area you hadn't prior. The other portion is those who know not where they tread or do not understand the point of the games difficulty and view death as an ultimate negative and that if they die too many times after not adapting that its the games fault for being too hard, ultimately failing and missing the point of the difficulty period.

For all groups there is the same constant: dying, learning, trying new strategies, repeating. The main 'barrier' if you want to call it that, is the players own perseverance. You'll still feel that sense of reward and accomplishment after beating a boss no matter if you are a veteran or not, but the point is to not give up just cause things are difficult. It leads to exploration, to different strategies, and slowly mastering the core mechanics of the game which leave you to look back at your growth. This is something that everyone can talk about on the same level if there isn't a difficulty slider or whatever. If there is one, then it feels disingenuous and when seeking help or strategies, or even to commiserate, there isn't any baseline.

>Therefore, a mode for less skilled players that actually gives them the experience of overcoming a challenge instead of bashing their head against a wall and quitting from frustration is more in line with the intended experience.
But if they know and acknowledge that this mode's challenge is reduced compared to the standard mode of play, then they logically cannot have the exact same experience as me, a relatively skilled player who completed the game in the traditional manner.

>oversimplifying everything to fit your narrative
Just retard thinking.

You cannot simultaneously say that people need to have the same experience and then say they should not. Of course, your statement
>Discussion dies when everyone experiences something different.
was always retarded in the first place when the series has always had
>this boss was easy and this boss was hard
>No, THIS boss was easy and THIS boss was hard
arguments.

>For all groups there is the same constant: dying, learning, trying new strategies, repeating.
And an easier mode changes this how? If a player can't beat a boss and only becomes capable of beating a boss through learning or employing a new strategy, how is that a different experience when the boss starts with 500HP or 1000HP? Indeed, if a player has, say, poor reflexes then they need to rely all the more on coming up with strategies. If all of their strategies are useless due to them having worse reaction times than the average person, then they are not getting the same satisfaction as you.

That's why catering the experience to the individual is an "ideal". It is difficult, sometimes impossible, but that falls under
>Plenty of other, actually valid arguments to use against difficulty modes
and doesn't change the fact that ideals should be implemented if feasible.

That's a bit simpleminded to think that adding an easy mode would increase sales, that's never even been a highly advertise feature. For the first one, it doesn't impact me so I don't care either way, so I don't care what the game makers decided to do about difficulty or accessibility.

Nice strawman

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>how is that a different experience when the boss starts with 500HP or 1000HP?

Well user, that wouldn't necessarily be the only difference. In an easy mode there could be a variety of changes, you take less damage, you deal more, enemies are weaker, etc etc.

Assuming that would be the only difference, an easier mode is specifically made for you not to get stuck or be challenged as hard. Hence the name Easy. Its there to experience a narrative where there is one to be driven through, but in a game where the point is the struggle, it doesn't really work as well. If the only change is the HP of a boss, would that really satisfy those who want an easy mode?

>an easier mode is specifically made for you not to get stuck or be challenged as hard.
No, again, I'm not talking about people who could but refuse to get good. I'm talking about people who would find easy mode to be as challenging as you find hard mode challenging. Imagine, say, your dad or a younger sibling. They aren't going to get the same experience of overcoming a challenge that you do if they were forced to play on the same difficulty as you.

>If the only change is the HP of a boss, would that really satisfy those who want an easy mode?
And user, the HP thing was an example holy shit. The point was an easier mode can still be a struggle to the people who require an easier mode. For this struggle to match the struggle you had, it is not required for the exact gameplay and numbers to be identical and in fact the opposite is true.

user. . . If they are going to persist with the game, then they are going to get better. Only if they quit within the first few deaths would they not. Incremental progress is still progress. They wouldn't be getting the same experience anyway because if they aren't interested in getting good then the game overall wouldn't be for them. They wouldn't have fun. It'd be like giving someone DMCV and they only want to use the gun. They'd most likely not have fun with it compared to using everything else. For these games, a lot of the fun is the challenge. When you take that away you just get fashion souls or in sekiro's place. . . . not a whole lot

have sex

Get fucked

>That's why catering the experience to the individual is an "ideal". It is difficult, sometimes impossible, [but] doesn't change the fact that ideals should be implemented if feasible.
I have two questions
1. Why are you carrying on about (what you admit are) game design pipe dreams in a topic like this? What's the point of that?
2. Since when is "catering the experience to the individual" an ideal? I thought we as humans took pride in our different tastes in entertainment and skill sets in leisure activities?

I don't understand why so many people want to play videogames without actually playing them, just to "enjoy the story". Nigger, just go watch a movie then, the story there would be 500 times better and you won't have any problems with bosses.

Soulsfags are mentally ill. Even though they keep going on about DS difficulty the fact is that the game isnt even hard, its fucking mediocre.

Play AC or something you fucking casuals. Its blatantly easy to know who is a normie or a casual gamer by hearing "wow, Dark souls is difficult"

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Personal enjoyment

Also, the notion that souls takes skillcis absurd. I mean fuck off, youre literally rolling, parrying or abusing broken mechanics all the time. Fuck off, that isnt skill, youre pressing two or three buttons.

Soulsfags are mentally ill casuals who think theyre hotshit because mainstream media (which suck at playing vidya) trump DS as a harder game than it is

The truly sad/irritating thing is that, by comparison to most everything else in the genre that gets released anymore, DS games actually are difficult.

>DS games are difficult compared to other releases
Lol no, AAA maybe but there are a lot of harder albeit smaller games

Name 5 harder games.

leveling in rpgs is a dynamic difficulty slider. souls games always had an easy mode ie grinding to overlevel.

Starsector
Cuphead
Dorfforttress
AC games
Halo games on legendary
Divinity original sins
Xcom
Poe
Tyranny
PoE 1/2
Old splintercells

Off the top of my head

That's literally the opposite of what is true. Playing on Normal is fundamentally the developer intended way to play KH2, since it's what determines all the core elements of KH game design.
-Attacks that move Sora for you and change based on where enemies are you you don't need spacing to hit anything
-Summons, Limits, and Drive forms exist to be fight ending nuking tools (like attractions in 3) that refill all your health and in the case of limits make Sora completely invincible
-the game sends mickey mouse stop players from dying and having to reset progress in 90% of the game's bossfights

all dark souls could be beaten without breaking a sweat by summoning and magic.

yet people still complained.

an easy mode isn't going to change anything

because its fun! ahaha!hahaha