The great debate

4 has better characters and story, but 5 does everything else better

cringe.

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imagine being so mad that you didn't buy a vita
sad

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Both suck.

One has actual dungeons demons and and perfected the gameplay compared to its previous entry and the other is a bad Schooby Doo episode ft. Incelly the incelman

Take a guess.

4 is more memorable and had a better OST, 5 had better gameplay although not by much. Both games have good and bad characters.

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For me it's P5, Though P4 is a close second as far as I'm concerned.
I'm just glad that the series has 2 games I hold is such high esteem

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Persona 5 because I played it first

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P3

*in such high esteem
blah

user, can you put your mouth on this curb, it will be real quick.

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>persoshit
Lmfao

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persona 4

>better story
>(mostly) better characters
>better waifus
>slightly better soundtrack

persona 5

>cooler look/design
>waaaaaaay better fighting and dungeon crawling
>social links have bonuses

persona 3's story and characters are better than either of them, but everything else is worse (not that its a bad game at all)

Well said, me. I remember getting a "new" party member, then taking them on a Golden Hand hunt.

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Why is always the Nocturnefags the ones who shits on any megaten thread?

Nothing to debate about it, P4 sucks and P5 is better in every way.

>P4
>better story
Having no story doesn’t mean it’s good.

Tbqh I just miss when the great debate was between P3 and P4. At least P4fags could meme and had played the previous games. P5 zoomers are like retarded wind up dolls who go into pointless list making mode whenever you challenge them

>STORY
PERSONA 5 > PERSONA 2 > PERSONA 3
>COLORS
PERSONA 5 > PERSONA 1 > PERSONA 5
>CREDITS SEQUENCE
PERSONA 5 > PERSONA Q > PERSONA (1966)
>PROBABILITY TO CAUSE PROSTATE CANCER
PERSONA 5 > PERSONA 5R > PERSONA 5 DABBING ALL NIGHT

they're the soulsfags of megaten. it's their first smt game and they think it gives them "le hardcore gaymurr cred" for playing it.

jej

>persona 4
>>better story
>(mostly) better characters
>better waifus
>slightly better soundtrack

How can anyone say this with a straight face? Iwai alone shits on everyone not called Kanji on P4

>p5 has a better story than 2 and 3
?????

>4 has better characters and story

But that's wrong

>p-p5onlis!!
Go back to /pg/

Persona 6 first has to be announced then 4 years of waiting

hahaahahaahaa is this a joke?

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I vastly prefer Persona 4 Golden over P4 original and P5. Actually I even enjoyed my time is p4golden over P3.

found the babbies whose first SMT game was P5

>persona 5 dabbing all night

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If you think so, go ahead. Nothing wrong with that.

Yes, it is

Actually my first SMT game was #FE

p4's characters existed only to be glorified beta orbiters for yu the gary stu.
p4's story was a cringe scooby-doo episode.
p4's waifus can't possibly compare to sae (when she's inevitably a romance option in p5r), tae, or ann.

4G = 5 > 4 > 3FES

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its weird for me because i didn't really care for any of the new stuff in golden, and marie sucks, but i wouldn't go back to playing vanilla p4 anyway. i guess all the extra stuff just makes it superior even if none of it is particularly good

4 is the only game with a persistent tone, 3 and 5 suffer from major tonal whiplash. Either shooting yourself in the head then going on dates, to talking sociopolitical issues and trying to have a light mood. 4 never took itself seriously, it never tried to be edgy

that's even worse lmfao

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yikes, golden isn't even better than the ps2 version

P4 is the worst MegaTen game on PS2, P5 is one of the best MegaTens.

p4 had a consistent tone of cringe and reddit. it sticks out like a sore thumb in a series where literally every other game has at least some depth to it.

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For me, it's DDS

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There is no debate. I could understand P3 vs P5, but this?

4 and 5friends can argue all day but we all know that persona 3 was the best, right?

I couldn't believe how terrible P4G was after playing P5. I played P4G on hard since everyone said it was easier than vanilla P4 normal and the enemies just 1 shot the main character before I could even find their weakness. Also couldn't believe the game didn't tell you the weaknesses of personas you already owned. This shit is supposed to be fun?

Also, the "LOOK HOW BIG AND COOL FLAT SCREEN TVS ARE" is absolutely cringe.

wrong. 5 is the best in gameplay and music, 2 is the best in everything else.

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Kind of a hot take but I think P4 hit the bullseye as far as keeping the darker elements of SMT but assimilating a lighter tone. Everyone always complains that Persona 4 isn't 'dark' enough but of the three popular persona games it has by far the boldest shit happen. Teenage girls get murdered and hung from telephone poles, a 9 year old girl can get killed if you fuck up and even if you don't, she lives at home with no one other than her alcoholic father.

The tone of P4 is what really turns people off it and say it's too light I guess. But to me Persona 3 and 5 feel much safer and inoffensive. Persona 5 in particular feels like a saturday morning cartoon show, especially since there's little to no running through line connecting each chapter of the story, it's pretty much villain of the week until the last month of the game. I'll never understand the comparison to P2. I guess both games heavily feature the colour red so that means something

Don't get me wrong I enjoyed 3, just not nearly as much as golden. I didn't engage nearly as much with 3, never really felt connected to the world. 4 drew me in and held me there throughout and beyond. Now 5.. I was so fuckign excited for that game. In fact, I only bought a ps4 to play it. I wouldn't have purchased a ps4 otherwise. In fact, had I known it was coming to the switch I would have waited. Finally playing it though, I just don't like it. In fact I haven't even finished it. I stopped as soon as I got to Niijimas palace and haven't had the desire to even go back and finish it.

I liked Nocturne. I liked the 3ds games and DDS more.

P4fags think their game isn't unplayable shit for some reason.

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nice buzzwords you have there faggot, P4 had a lighter tone and was consistent with it. as I stated in 3 you go from blowing your brains out and people turning into coffins and then going on dates and shit. 5 has the same issue, your friends are all almost idiots making jokes and it tries to be some rebellious kid shit and then you have evil 1 dimensional villains raping highschoolers and killing people.

How can a game be better than itself?

P4fags are failed normalfags.

>PERSONA 5 DABBING ALL NIGHT

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Ayo dude like Persona 5 has the best menus, graphics, gameplay and shit but yo, Persona 3 has the best, like, other things? Hope you guys enjoyed this enlightening and original post

Why is it always 4fags and 2fags that have the shittiest opinions?

I don't blame you. After the first palace you kinda get over the gameplay and QOL improvements, so the game has to fall back on its story and characters which are its weakest points. The game becomes a slog after the bank, and it gets even worse when you gotta fight god instead of ending at shido

5 is just a worse version of 4. Shame since the first arc is better than anything in 3/4

I enjoy both games for different reasons.

>Killing people
I don't think any of the villains actually kill people outside of Shido's political assassinations, they're all people abusing society to do their deeds for them and anybody dying is just a side effect of not caring

disagreed, 3 has a consistent tone from start to finish

>more popular than Final Fantasy.

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Why the fuck are you on this thread then if you didn’t beat the game? Your opinion doesn’t matter.

oh I did finish the game, i'm simply stating how awful the latter act of the game is compared to its start. The had evil igor show up really for no reason, the story would have been without it

4 is objectively superior in terms of story, setting, characters and plot. You just can’t deny this. Only thing 5 has is slightly better gameplay, but you would expect that after a generation leap and a decade.
And before you get autistic and tell me how the story and characters of p4 weren’t great, literally ANYTHING would be better than the dog shit that was in p5.

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>boring dungeons that are flat and repetitive
>boring confidant rank rewards, all the same
>combat worse in every single way
>can't tell who is available to hang out with unless you run around the entire map every day
>sidequests are infinitely worse making you run through the already bad dungeons multiple times to grind enemies in the inferior combat

Having a really hard time following this argument, my dude.

>I don't think any of the villains actually kill people outside of Shido's political assassinations, they're all people abusing society to do their deeds for them and anybody dying is just a side effect of not caring
Not him but Okumura?

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Yeah, I really thought with the vibe they were putting out 5 would be darker, but it actually ended up being more cartoonish.

>Everyone always complains that Persona 4 isn't 'dark' enough
This is batshit fucking crazy.
>But to me Persona 3 and 5 feel much safer and inoffensive.
They're absolutely safe and inoffensive.

P4 is so much darker in theme, in events, in underlying message. Everything about it is darker and graver when you actually start bothering to rub your braincells together. Honestly, I think people who are into anime/anime-style games are mostly just superficial retards who can't read subtext or actually metabolize a fucking story.
Persona 3 and 5 SEEM darker in regards to their totally surface level aesthetic compared to 4, but that's fucking it.

>combat worse in every single way
persona 5 was a joke, as such all the combat improvements are moot because each enemy and boss is killed the exact same way, as such boring dungeons are enhanced by variety in gameplay. The story is also better instead of the heap of shit P5 becomes after madarame

>P4 is so much darker in theme, in events, in underlying message

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5 had better dungeons aesthetically, but they were so fucking easy that I felt like I had to blow through them in a single day, which caused them to feel like even more of a slog than persona 4's boring hallways that I had to slowly chip away it over 3-4 visits each

>Persona 4 is darker in theme, events, in underlying message
This is the dumbest fucking post I've seen on Yea Forums in 5 years, congratulations.

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>3 and 5 suffer from major tonal whiplash.
How? P5 literally added stuff interagations and changed S.Links to confidants in order to fit the tone of the game.

FPBP

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He’s baiting newfag

everytime the game presented a dark theme, it turned it into some clownfest soon after. Futaba is the biggest example and the only exception is komoshida

>the game didn't tell you the weaknesses of personas you already owned

you don't fight demons in p4, you fight shadows. sounds like you didn't actually play the game

> "LOOK HOW BIG AND COOL FLAT SCREEN TVS ARE"

look at the little baby zoomer. the game came out in 2008 idiot.

honestly, the comparison to p2 makes a lot more sense than you're giving it credit for.
gameplay-wise, p5 brought back features like gun skills and demon negotiations that hadn't been in persona since p2.
plot-wise, yaldy's rigged game is a pretty obvious reference to philemon and nyarly's bet. yaldy disguising himself as igor is very similar to nyarly disguising himself as the time count. the way yaldy used akechi is a beat-for-beat copy of how nyarly mainpulated jun: finding a mental basketcase with daddy issues and latent potential as a persona user, giving him special powers and using him to do his bidding.
on a more meta conceptual level, the weight of public opinion and the phansite feedback hanging over the phantom thieves' heads at all times felt like a nod to p2's emphasis on the power of rumors. although the key difference there is that p2's cast was spreading the rumors while p5's cast was reacting to the public perception.

Personally I liked the theme of 4 the most. I've always got the most enjoyment out of life doing things with my friends, and the whole "Confronting yourself can fuck you up but if you have friends to help you through it you can make it" thing really vibed with me. 5's theme felt more like gamers rise up

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oops. this was meant for instead.

Only Persona I've played is 3FES, and I haven't gotten around to finishing it yet. Chihiro is best girl, though; followed closely by Aigis.

Uhh, not gonna say I beat P4 because I got bored in the 5th dungeon, but every boss I fought in P4 was the same shit as well. I'm not really sure you've even played P5 because there was way more variety in the bosses. I didn't see shit in P4 like the boss you fight on a giant roulette wheel

>you don't fight demons in p4, you fight shadows. sounds like you didn't actually play the game

What the fuck are you even talking about? I never said you fought demons?

Retards are pushing this meme a lof recently
half convinced it's astrofurfing for shitposts when SMTV doesn't sell a million even though that's typical of the franchise and woll probably still sell more than SMTIV

P4 is much better - more compelling plot and it's closer to being a sane length as opposed to the 120 hour long P5.

both of them ditch your undead ass while Lizzie is a holy crosade to bring you back

Not when DeSu exists.

Based

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>PERSONA (1966)

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Not even a debate. If you're a retard who plays games for story instead of reading books or a friendless faggot who plays games for companionship then P4 is better.

If you actually like video games then P5 is better.

If Persona 5 was as good as the Kamoshida arc consistently, it'd be the best Persona game. As of now it's one of the worst which doesn't matter cause all the Persona games are great. lick my nuts if you think of any of them are """"objectively""""" bad why do I even come to these threads

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Persona 4 is the weakest game in the series so anything is better than it.
The plot goes nowhere after Rise and doesn’t pick up until after Heaven
Hirata is an okay singer but is fucking nothing when Lyn, Yumi, and even LJ is around.
I hate how the IT got off so easy in this game, they even get away with murdering a dude.

>P4 had a lighter tone
so? a "lighter tone" is not what anyone expects from a megaten game. if i wanted a "lighter tone," i'd play a different jrpg.
>as I stated in 3 you go from blowing your brains out and people turning into coffins and then going on dates and shit. 5 has the same issue, your friends are all almost idiots making jokes and it tries to be some rebellious kid shit and then you have evil 1 dimensional villains raping highschoolers and killing people.
it's called balance. 3 and 5 can get very dark at times, but it's balanced out with moments of levity so it doesn't get too depressing.
with p4, atlus lost sight of the whole concept of balance and went all-in with the moments of levity too much. as a result, its story feels totally lightweight and inconsequential compared to the rest of the persona series and the megaten franchise as a whole.

>I hate how the IT got off so easy in this game, they even get away with murdering a dude.
You're not talking about Namatame, are you?

Persona 4 is about the darkness inside every human's psyche. Persona 5 is about how good guys are a bunch of pure as the driven snow irreproachable wunderkinds whose only personal failings are a consequence of entirely external pressures put on them by SOCIETY MAN.

With the exception of Mishima, not a single confidant in P5 has a character flaw. Even Futaba's crippling schizophrenia and social anxiety is basically cured with a single revelation of INJUSTICE. Even when it seems like a character could be dynamic and interesting and multifaceted, nope, their theoretical failings are always justified as a consequence of them being so perfect and pure and brave and put upon by some comical evildoer impelled by SOCIETY.

There's absolutely nothing dark about it, unless you conceive tonal darkness as nothing more than external threat against the heroes. Even then, P4's external threat is more focused, and more personal.

Yes.

But in the "canon ending," Namatame is never killed at all, and your team never throws him into the TV, because you end up realizing after that, who the actual criminal is. I hope you didn't throw the guy in.

>I didn't see shit in P4 like the boss you fight on a giant roulette wheel
do you think I'm talking about design? I'm talking about the actual fights. Each fight was the same buff and debuff, sometimes there was a gimmick but it didn't change the way you battled the enemies or bosses like it did in P3/4. The only exception is madarame

>>ruins dungeon crawling
How is the dungeon crawling any different than vanilla? I'm legitimately curious because I've only played Golden.

>that doesn't count!!!
Oh, so you're just bending the rules to make your argument work

>1 boss fight in a 100 hour game negates all criticism about the enemy design
I wish I was as easily amused as you

>Persona 4 is about the darkness inside every human's psyche.
no it isn't. p4 was all about atlus creating a "lightning" for them to shill for the next few years while they struggled to adjust to hd game development.
>Persona 5 is about how good guys are a bunch of pure as the driven snow irreproachable wunderkinds whose only personal failings are a consequence of entirely external pressures put on them by SOCIETY MAN.
how can you possibly say that with a straight face after praising p4? yu is by far the biggest gary stu in the entire megaten franchise and the rest of the p4 cast are his personal beta orbiters.
meanwhile, p5's cast is a bunch of losers and outcasts brought together by an evil god's rigged game.

>
Persona 4 is about finding the truth, it’s literally the main battle theme.

>darkness inside every human's psyche
That’s the main theme of the entire series user.
In P5 you’re literally going into a persons distorted viewpoint of the world.

P3 is better than both and it's not even close.

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easy

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Lets you easily travel back to start

How do you miss the entire point this hard?
You literally get an item called the “Orb of Sight” not the “Orb of Darkness and Human Psyche”
The main characters face the truth about themselves and their intentions.

Oh, that was specifically a Golden change? Seems like a decent enough quality of life change. Anything else changed between the two?

>how can you possibly say that with a straight face after praising p4? yu is by far the biggest gary stu in the entire megaten franchise and the rest of the p4 cast are his personal beta orbiters.
The principle element of the game is that people develop their persona power by facing and accepting the truth of the dark emotions inside them. In P5, they develop their power by "standing up to injustice". The characters have no dark emotions inside them. They are all intrinsically perfect. Chie is embittered by her lack of femininity and relegation to tomboy status, and secretly relishes Yukiko's reliance on her. Ann is a model who gets creeped on by Kamoshida until you beat him and then she's fine. Kanji is a homo/bisexual who's history of childhood ostracization led him to posture as a delinquent and thug, while pathologizing and perverting his secret sexual desires. Futaba is a hacker genius who is gaslighted by a shadowy organization into believing that her mother hated her, leading to her complete social isolation and suffering from self-loathing hallucinations, until it's she learns that it was a lie at which point she is simply cured and no longer mentally ill.

I had initially been really excited at the thought that Joker was a juvie case. I thought it would be interesting to have a character with actual edge to him instead of just another dull honor student, but no. Turns out that not only was he justified in doing what got him arrested, he actually basically didn't do anything and was simply framed by an evil bad guy. Yu on the other hand lacks a clearly distinguishable dark side, because Adachi is his thematic counterpart, the shadow of the player.

>meanwhile, p5's cast is a bunch of losers and outcasts
The only one who even close to fits that description is Ryuji. The rest of them are either world class talents, or otherwise intrinsically important.

>brought together by an evil god's rigged game.
That's every megaten game, P4 included.

>Kanji is a homo/bisexual
Yeah I’m not gonna read the rest of that.

>In P5 you’re literally going into a persons distorted viewpoint of the world.
It's about the distorted viewpoint of almost randomly chose bad people whose spirit you break against their will and then they are rendered simply dysfunctional. Compared to P4 where the distortions you see are mostly of your allied cast of characters, who continue to develop over the course of the game.

Eventually it turns out that they were revolting against the constraints placed on them by society which is the puppet of the demiurge blah blah blah gnosticism it's an SMT game. All that is still EXTERNAL. There is no internal, personal darkness in P5.

>The main characters face the truth about themselves and their intentions.
Yeah. The darkness in their psyche. In what way are those not exactly the same thing?

>Persona 4 is about finding the truth, it’s literally the main battle theme.
See what I mean by "superficiality"?

Great. You're really good at arguing your point. The way you just say "you're stupid" and then don't back it up with anything. I know this is Yea Forums but I would have figured a Persona thread might have attracted people who want to talk about Persona.

>The principle element of the game is that people develop their persona power by facing and accepting the truth of the dark emotions inside them.
that's all well and good, except for the fact that their "problems" are pathetic compared to other persona games' characters.
boo hoo, yukiko doesn't want to run her family's inn. boo hoo, kanji likes girly things. boo hoo, chie is jealous of yukiko. at the end of the day, the p4 cast's personal issues are a bunch of schlock ripped straight out of a wb teen drama from the '90s. remember the old madtv skit, "pretty white kids with problems"? that's persona 4 in a nutshell.
the shadow maya arc from p2is alone was more memorable, better-written and more consequential than any of the p4 cast's shadows by a country mile. so was the shadow futaba arc from p5, and i don't even like futaba as a character very much.
>I had initially been really excited at the thought that Joker was a juvie case. I thought it would be interesting to have a character with actual edge to him instead of just another dull honor student, but no. Turns out that not only was he justified in doing what got him arrested, he actually basically didn't do anything and was simply framed by an evil bad guy.
that's the thing, though: in japanese culture, it doesn't matter that he got framed. nobody cares, and they still view joker as a delinquent regardless. that's the whole point of sae's character arc culminating with her palace: it shows that the justice system is corrupt, winning is the only thing that matters to everyone involved, and the general public is too deferential to authority to care - and joker is a victim of the system. the deck is stacked against him from the moment he arrives in tokyo.
in contrast, the entire town of inaba is lined up ready to kiss yu's ass the moment he steps off the train.

>extends game for two extra months for no reason at all while adding nothing

fuck off. it's awesome that the game did this. That's just extra time for seeing more social links.

>There is no internal, personal darkness in P5.
The internal darkness is about what their doing is right.
Is it fine that they’re just brainwashing people they don’t like into confessing their crimes.

>almost randomly chose bad people whose spirit you break against their will and then they are rendered simply dysfunctional.
It’s not randomly chosen.
They had to go over Kamoshida because he was going to expell you and turn Ann into his personal onahole
You were requested to go after Madarame in order to save Yusuke.
You made a deal with Makoto to go after Kaneshiro.

This is how any P3 defender sounds like

>P5 best music.

You literal retard. 3 had the best music.

Hardly a debate. Anybody who claims P4 is better than P5, or any other Persona/SMT game except for the first archaic few is unironically a zoomer retard that should be shot in order to save the gene pool. Not to say that P4 is a bad game, just not better than almost everything else in its series

>that's all well and good, except for the fact that their "problems" are pathetic compared to other persona games' characters.
Their problems are problems which are intrinsic to their personalities. It's not the gravity of the problems, it's the essentiality of the problems.

>so was the shadow futaba arc from p5, and i don't even like futaba as a character very much.
It had the potential to be interesting, except that with a single revelation of truth, every single one of her problems, her mental health problems that have destroyed her life for years, melt away and she is redeemed and perfected. Futaba's problems are ultimately not essential to her character.

>that's the thing, though: in japanese culture, it doesn't matter that he got framed. nobody cares, and they still view joker as a delinquent regardless.
The point is that it DOES matter to the game, because the game doesn't allow ANY of its main cast to have intrinsic problems. It's not only that Joker didn't do anything, it's that he was punished for engaging in selfless irreproachable heroism.

Every confidant save Mishima is made this way. The fortune teller lady is scamming people, oh that's interesting, oh it turns out that she's being forced to scam people by some cult, and she fell into the cult's influence because she was forced out of her village for being so fucking perfect and wonderful and selfless. In order to sell the theme of "society is stacked against you". the characters are not allowed to be multifaceted, flawed human beings. Problems are all external. External problems are solved by changing hearts.

Except it wasn't necessary. You can advance the theme of an oppressive society beating down decent people without having to make those people flawless saints. But that would be just too fucking nuanced I guess.

The fact that P4's characters are hobbled by petty problems is what makes them interesting. It makes them seem more like real human beings.

P4 has better comfyness what with the town setting and more events wear you just chill out with your friends, but P5 is the generally better game

Are you guys getting Persona Q2?

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Yes, and I hope FeMC acts like a little sister towards Door-kun

>Their problems are problems which are intrinsic to their personalities. It's not the gravity of the problems, it's the essentiality of the problems.
so? this is a meaningless distinction, because at the end of the day, their problems are still never big enough to justify how much importance and time that the plot devotes to them. there simply isn't enough substance to make me care all that much about kanji's insecurity or yukiko not wanting to run the family business.
>It had the potential to be interesting, except that with a single revelation of truth, every single one of her problems, her mental health problems that have destroyed her life for years, melt away and she is redeemed and perfected.
you obviously didn't do her social link, or sojiro's for that matter.
>The fact that P4's characters are hobbled by petty problems is what makes them interesting. It makes them seem more like real human beings.
not really, because they never truly evolve as characters after facing these petty issues. they never stop being the one-dimensional beta orbiters of p4's perfect gary stu mc.
you can whine all you want about the p5 cast's problems being more external than internal, but at least there was actual tension and weight behind those problems. with p4, it felt like they gave the cast the bare minimum amount of issues to qualify as a persona game and nothing more than that.

I'm not the guy your arguing but doesn't Futaba's problems just disappear because she had faced her shadow/a change of heart? Seems like it would make sense for her to just become redeemed and perfected since that's what always happened to 4's characters after they face their shadow.

Fuck off.

>The internal darkness is about what their doing is right.
>Is it fine that they’re just brainwashing people they don’t like into confessing their crimes.
This is what makes it so saturday morning kid's show. Forcing people who are doing evil to admit what they're doing so as to save innocent people who are being harmed is not really a moral grey area. The conceit is almost like death note for 5 year olds. The moral aspect, the way the public responds, the way the police respond, it's almost as if they ARE killing people. Instead they're just, forcing them to fess up their crimes, and that's objectionable why? The game would be far more coherent narrative and thematic-wise, if you actually were killing people when you steal their hearts. Fucking P4, the "baby lighthearted game for little girls", gives you an option to kill a guy at one point. Too raw for the "darker" game though?

>It’s not randomly chosen.
It's arbitrarily chosen, with little deliberation or justification, and none of the people you go after have any real sense of personal connection to the party after Kamoshida, and usually the time constraint is self-inflicted. The shadow thieves just feel like they're meandering about at random and stumbling into the plot, which just so happens to align with their actions, because yaldablabap was pulling the strings. Isn't it great how you can make a game about the demiurge and it allows you to write the entire plot as one big deus ex machina?

>No dub
Fuck no.

P5 has the most newfags so it's understandable why they constantly rate the game much higher than their predecessors because of stuff like menus, graphics and gameplay.

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yeah I'll just read with the dub voices in my head

Fighting Mementos does not in any way accomplish any of the following:
- Help Sojiro realize he's clinging on to the past and that he needs to be a proper father figure for Futaba in the present and future because he's the best she has
- Help Iwai realize his son doesn't give a fuck about being adopted by an ex-yakuza and that he doesn't need to have a martyr complex over it
- Help Chihaya realize she shouldn't just hang with the wrong crowd because they were the first ones to offer her a fake smile and that she can stand on her own
- Help Tae realize her true calling is actually helping people on a more personal family doctor basis instead of shoving herself in a lab isolated for her entire life
- Help Kawakami realize that she needs to hold on to why she became a teacher in the first place and not letting anyone or anything get in the way of that, regardless of any perceived embarrassments
- Help Ohya realize that she can't keep being a pushover who quietly seethes in some dingy drag bar drinking herself to death
- Help Hifumi realize that her passion should be her passion on her terms and not be hijacked by someone else for their selfish wants
- Help Shinya realize that winning isn't everything and he should actually be friends with people instead of an arrogant snot-nosed brat just because he's good at vidya

Every single one of the Mementos bosses by themselves are just symptoms. The real problems are internal with the confidants' various character flaws, and the development happens through Joker talking to them and helping them realize it. If all Joker did was punch Mementos bosses in the face, it wouldn't do anything because the confidants' character flaws would just lead them into situations with more problems.

For someone whining about nuance it's hilarious that literally the entire game is flying right over your head, and it's not even that complicated to follow.

don't worry user, I read the beginning of your post and got the joke

I don’t think you played P5 user

Both are terrible.

>Bought cousin and her boyfriend P5
>She doesn't like vidya but she likes anime and VN and that's 50% of Persona and bf likes games and waifu's
>Cousin loves it
>Literally does nothing but play it all day
>Lost her job
>Literally ruined her life and made her a NEET
So is P4 any good? Never touched any of the games myself and I wanna keep the addiction rolling.

oh she will love 4

Either she'll hate it because it's not 5 or it'll ruin her life more than 5 because it's even more of a wish fulfillment simulator.

Introduce her to P3 when her depression kicks in and she'll off herself, then you can dab

>it'll ruin her life more than 5 because it's even more of a wish fulfillment simulator
its true
fuck

>you obviously didn't do her social link, or sojiro's for that matter.
I did them both. You help her get over mild lingering agoraphobia and bond with the family. Considering she just spent the last several years of her young, still developing life locked in her room terrified of being seen, the change that comes over her does not seem appropriate. No P4 character is ever as crippled as she was to make such a fast recovery. Still, she was probably the single best example of a character with actual personal depth in the entire game, and I wouldn't have so much of a problem with her characterization if it didn't fit into a pattern.

>you can whine all you want about the p5 cast's problems being more external than internal, but at least there was actual tension and weight behind those problems
The tension is resolved so easily and routinely that it has no weight. You go into mementos and kill the shadow and then the problem is resolved, sometimes off camera. It facilitates no sense of character growth, because it just involves you making the source of their problem back down and give the character everything they wanted as if they had no problem to begin with.

>there simply isn't enough substance to make me care all that much about kanji's insecurity or yukiko not wanting to run the family business.
I don't think that the P4 characters are extremely deep and complex characters, but they were complex enough to make me invested in their involvement in the plot. Once I realized that every P5 character is a perfect moral exemplar, I couldn't give a shit about any of them anymore.

They're both good games and it's okay to favor one over the other, but anyone that tells you P5 sucks or is garbage is a contrarian.

P2 Innocent Sin is still my favorite. P5 is second, then 3 then 4. i can't remember anything from 4 and i don't really care to reply it. i've replayed 2 and 3 a few times and just love it every time

>contrarian
>nostalgia
These buzzwords should have been filtered before soya

Sorry but none of these developments you listed are particularly interesting to me. They all seem like "my priorities were wrong, now I've changed them". I don't think that qualifies as a "character flaw" so much.

My main gripe is more with the core party than the side confidants anyway. A lot of the P4 side social links are pretty dull too.

She doesn't. She says he feels familiar and they're said to have the same heart and the whole plotline is dropped. PQ2 is essentially "the PT meets the casts of 3/4", all potential beyond that is left at the door.

Yes absolutely, although
>no dub FeMC
one day, bros.... one day....

It was just Laura Bailey.

How many of you have actually played P3? Every single Persona fan I know that has beaten Persona 3 knows it's the best. And it's really simple why. Character development outside of social links. That's it. Junpei and Akihiko put P4 and P5 characters to fucking shame.

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I didn't enjoy it. I didn't like the characters, I thought the story sucked, I thought the combat was okay but also too easy, and I hated the palace puzzles. Even the soundtrack I didn't like as much as either 3 or 4.

It was an okay RPG experience that I don't regret going through, but I don't think I will ever play it again.

Just Junpei really
Akihiko just has his one moment then goes back to the way he always is

>You help her get over mild lingering agoraphobia and bond with the family.
so then you admit that her problems didn't actually disappear right after she accepted her shadow, and she still had to work on her issues after that.

Nope, its because only shit eaters actually finished that game, unlike smart people that will drop it asap

p3's character development is so overblown, it's not even funny. it's a massive regression from p2, but p3 babbies like to ignore that the series existed before their game and only compare it to 4 and 5.

P3 has the widest variance in quality in both SLinks and character development. Many of the characters didn't even GET any development until their extra scenes in FES and the Drama CDs, which like 5% of the western fanbase has even heard. Also, for every Akinari there's a Nozomi. I'll agree with 4 but 5 has a few characters that have good growth.

Persona 3 is the first Persona game user. Did no one tell you that 1 and 2 don't exist anymore?

this sale ends in a couple of days, which version should I get?

or should I just wait for P5R?

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Where did you got that? P5 is the first one
The full game includes some dlc that will put it on easy mode alongside costumes
Up to you , really

The ultimate edition is essentially pointless, just get regular my dude.

Persona 4 had a fairly simple and straightforward story. It wasn't always exciting since there's a lot of "Save _ from the TV world.", but it feels like it flows decently.

Persona 5 tried a riskier story and had a lot of memorable moments, but it had a lot of weird or poorly handled things.

Shido had a great boss fight, but he was kind of a poor villain by the end because his evil plan literally only happened due to Akechi having a dumb evil plan himself. But then they try to play him up as some Mastermind behind everything when he's just coasting off of the fact he nutted out Akechi once.

I just said that I think she recovers too quickly from too significant a handicap, and also that despite my problems with her she's not as bad as other characters.

I think she was a MASSIVE missed opportunity to make a far more interesting character then she turned out to be. She has lingering issues, but she never relapses, or even hints at the idea that she might relapse, or hints that even though she's able to function better, inside she still feels depressed. Nothing like that. She's totally happy-go-lucky, but a little afraid of crowds.

My main problem with P5 is a problem of missed opportunity. The game suggests a lot of great ideas and then doesn't stick the landing on anything. Futaba could have been great, the Joker juvie stuff could have been great, the part where Morgana leaves the party and joins up with Haru could have been amazing, but it gets resolved so quickly that it feels like it shouldn't have even happened. It's a great basic outline that needed to be totally rewritten.

you will probably never touch the dlc content except maybe once or twice to check it out might as well get the regular

Whats in the ultimate edition?

Persona 4
>Better main story/premise
>Inaba is really comfy
>Main cast has better chemistry with each other
>More events for the main cast to just hang out and be friends
>Nanako

Persona 5
>Better music
>Better art direction and general sense of aesthetics
>Better gameplay
>Has unique dungeon designs
>Better S Links

Both games main cast have good and not-so-good characters. I also like Morgana more than Teddie, but they're both kinda eh, so it's not by much.

>Better main story
How? Having no story doesn’t mean it’s good.

Gay

>Persona 4
>Better main story/premise
jej

>I'd didn't own a PS Vita
thanks for the blog

>A Mary Sue as a good point.

Persona 3 had better characters, better music, better story, better main antagonist and 5 shamelessly tried the same thing but was less effective as a result.

I'm more into mysteries than the Robin Hood/vigilante thing P5 has.

>neater music
>when tartarus forces you to listen to the same shitty song with a different filter every couple of floors
Lmao. P3 babies are so easy to spot.

Also, Strega was shit and Nyx is a non character.

Can we just agree that Hashino is a hack?

p5 borrowed far more from p2 and even mainline smt than it ever did from p3.
p3 babbies truly have an overinflated opinion of their game.

in case the guy from this shitty makoto shitposting thread is here. thread archived before I caught the question.
the pacing is bad and the action scenes especially the ones involving the personas is embarrassing. ren being aggressively boring is the worst offender. all of the stuff in reality is passable to good though. I like that akechi is more involved and haru has a little more presence in the early plot. I'd say it's not worth watching overall though. only one that's worth watching is the vanilla p4 anime and mostly because anime yu is a fun character.

Attached: [Erai-raws] Persona 5 the Animation - 03 [720p][Multiple Subtitle].mkv_snapshot_15.35_[2018.04.21_14 (1280x720, 108K)

How do i begin playing persona? can I just pick up any of them and be happy? People seem to like them and I want to have fun too

Yes

dope. Because i looked up the series one time and after seeing that it's a spin off of another series I was like: Weeb shit is always connected and I don't have time to learn that much to enjoy a game.

I am happy that i can just pick it up. Thank you, friend.

yes

Play p2/3 first. They have terribly boring gameplay so is hard going back to them.

Start with Persona 3: FES

Why is it that the characters and their dialogue is always the center of the debates for Persona when we all know the characters are pretty much just a new coat of paint since Persona 3? The same writer who worked on Persona 3 is the same writer who worked on Persona 4. The merits that substantiate whether this Persona is better than the other is the soundtrack, how the story is presented, how well the themes are established through the game and the finale, the gameplay and the gameplay loop. Not if Yosuke comes off as more annoying than Junpei or if this game was dark or not.

Persona 5 shit the bed after like the second dungeon. The finale was the worst of all three games too.

Are you fucking retarded? The only reason Persona is more popular than SMT is because of the characters.
Only dumbasses pretend Persona so more than a highschool simulators with likeable characters and okay gameplay.

the final boss theme was so fucking bad gooddamn

t. console warrior who's mad it hasn't been ported to their platform of choice
those of us who actually played the game know that the real best parts are futaba and sae's palaces.

Nanako acts exactly like my niece. You sayin’ my niece is a Mary Sue?

What.. debate? P4 is one of the absolute worst games I've ever had the displeasure of playing.
The fact that you can use nothing but Izanagi the entire game and have him get 99 in every stat + learn whatever spells you want.

Start with 3 and then play 4.
Starting with 5 will only disappoint the fuck out of you when you go back for 3/4 because P5 sets the bar extremely high.
1/2 are optional and 2,4,5 have no influence on them because they're more SMT-like./

>P5 sets the bar extremely high.
This is a joke right?

Nope. P5 is easily the best one. Actual dungeons, actual demons, actual negotiations, guns, great difficulty especially on hard mode

No? Persona series was a mediocre before P5 came out.
It didn't even have decent dungeons for fucks sake.

You must be fucking dead if you think anything sounds worse than the Genesis.

>P5 is easily the best one
Yeah this is a joke

>Persona series was a mediocre before P5 came out.
>P3 and P4 were the most well received RPGs of the generation when they cane out
Sure P5Babby Sure

not an argument

I'll get it and probably dislike it.

Waifufags need to fuck off.

characters
4 > 3 > 5
music
3 > 5 > 4
everything else
5 > 4 >3

It's the perfect blend of modern persona with a slight pinch of real SMT.

What are you talking about? P3 barely managed to break p1 numbers and that was after it's re-release.
P4 did better, but that was because it improved upon P3 with the dungeons, OST variety, and stopped ignoring the male party members.

Characters
3 > 5 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4
Music
3 > 5 > 4
Stuff that actually matters
5 >>>>>>>>>> 3 > 4

So what?
Persona 5 beat out nier at the game awards and was the most memorable game on the PS4 according to some nip devs.

>sales figures
>when nobody even fucking remembers P1 not even Atlus
P3 was the reason the franchise had a second chance of life.

>kamoshida
>1 dimensional
Kindly fuck off.

>game awards
Kek

p3 didn't even sniff p1 numbers.

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>not even Atlus

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How the fuck could anyone think P4 is good in any way?

Sup /pg/

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Yes, I'm sure lots of people loved P3 way more than P5 despite not buying the freaking game. And that's like saying P3 would never exist if p1 wasn't a success.
P3 babbies are so fucking retarded.

Where's the P1 merch and cameos?

P5 only shits the bed in the 5th and 7th palaces

Where are P3 dancing moonlight sales?

>Yes, I'm sure lots of people loved P3 way more than P5 despite not buying the freaking game
Are you pretending to be retarded? You do realize that P5 would not have been a thing if P3 wasn't a success right?

P5 is a a shallow imitation of P4

More like shits the bed after the 1st
Higher than P5 Stars sales

youtu.be/jLXpv4TTttU
youtu.be/QppZu_EUSlY

But it isn’t. It sold less.

>tfw got a persona banner when opening this thread
I would say 4 is better. While 5 has a lot of flashy style and was a blast the first time through, it simply doesn't have the staying power of 4. Playing through 4 again, the characters are way more likable than in 5. There are some parts that actually make me chuckle, where if the same thing happened in 5 with the characters replaced with their equivalents, it would probably make me cringe. The world building and atmosphere of 4 is simply unmatched, I played 4 for the first time on my vita just 2 years ago, and even then I had a deep sense of nostalgia playing it. The game perfectly captures something, though I'm not what exactly, that makes you feel as if you've lived in the world itself.
youtube.com/watch?v=flFluz2K2FU

You being a lonelyfag who doesn't have friends doesn't make the P4 cast good.

>Fucking nothing
Okay then.

Wrong. Also Q2 sold less than Q1 and the P5 anime sold less than both the P4 anime and P3 anime. I thought P5 was more popular.

>d-doesn’t count!!

Yeah, because P3 only got made because p2 was a huge success, right?
And P3 only exists because p1 was made first(and it actually sold copies)

>7 year gap between P2 and P3.
>nobody even remembers P1 or P2

Get dabbed on retard and get a fucking argument and come back.

No one remembers because zoomers like you weren't born yet.

There's no debate P4 is pure shit.

Or because they weren't popular

Persona3> Persona 4 > Persona 5

>10 year gap between P3 and P5
>people care so little about P3 that its spinoff flops
P3 babbies aren't the brightest.

neither was persona 3. being popular among niche weeb circles isn't the same thing as being popular in general.

>neither was persona 3
There's no need to lie user

Persona 4 is better.

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>frogetting that the p5 spinoffs flopped just as hard

I bored so I’ll take the bait.
P5D sold 18k while P3D sold 6k which is fucking pathetic.
>Q2 sold less than Q1
Because of the 3DS being dead even that Mario game flopped.
>P5 anime sold less than both the P4 anime and P3 anime.
The blu-rays aren’t out yet, P5A has way more merchandise than both of those combined.
>I thought P5 was more popular
It is you’re just a fucking retard.

>p3 gets made
>it does okay, nothing g amazing
>Atlus reuses shit as usual and makes P4 for some quick buck
>it becomes Atlus best selling game
And now revisionist are claiming that it was P3 that made personal a huge lol

>The blu-rays aren’t out yet,
....they've been out for 8 months now

good thing i'm not. persona 3 sold like shit and had no mainstream popularity.

So can admit that P4 is the reason Persona got huge? Its spinoffs sell like hotcakes.

I hope they do the same with P6. I feel like the time they spent making all the new assets for P5 were the reason why the game felt somewhat unfinished and rushed.

>P5D sold 18k while P3D sold 6k which is fucking pathetic.
Wrong
>Because of the 3DS being dead even that Mario game flopped.
Wrong again dumbass
>The blu-rays aren’t out yet,
BDs have been coming out since June of last year dumbass
>P4A v1 - 40k
>P3M 1# - 23k
>P5A v1 - 7k
Pathetic
>P5A has way more merchandise than both of those combined
Wrong again dumbass

5 had the same story beat for beat

Attached: 5 copied 4.jpg (960x720, 204K)

>P4A - 40k
>P3M - 23k
I bet the movies were twice as expensive too.

No they looked like shit for the most part. Probably did well at the box office though.

Why hasn't it been ported to the ps4? Both the vita and pstv are dead. It's literally free money for Atlus.

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Wrong. P5 made the series huge

Probally becuase you suck at the game

>using lonelyfag as an insult in a fucking persona thread

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Oh shit you got him

The P3 movies looked great actually, the higher budget shows.

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>no argument
Here’s one last (You) from me.

Read the chain of replies before you post. Circular arguments are the laziest shit.

That webm looks like shit user

You look like shit.
Your whole family look like shit.

>The P3 movies looked great actually
No they looked awful. Had lots of QUALITY and stills throughout.

Not the person you were talking to. That being said, there are substantial factors that played into how p3d/p5d and PQ2 did. After hyping up their existence, Atlus reveals that fan favorite characters would not be
A-1 took over after the first movie and there was a definitely dip in quality but they were serviceable, though they very obviously saved their budget for parts in the last movie.

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P4G>P5>P4

youtube.com/watch?v=Eb9xi-69b28
>the awaken power inside of you

>That being said, there are substantial factors that played into how p3d/p5d and PQ2 did.
Maybe P5 characters don't have the draw P4 characters did

Fucking auto post. Was going to delete that entire last line. Don't really care enough to keep talking about it.

Nah, they flopped because Atlus was being retarded and extra jewey.

>The characters that are aeen as delinquent and impure aren't as popular as the characters with (hardly) any flaws and are extremely attracted to and care about (you) and can't stop and won't stop praising (you).
Wow, really? Almost like the only people that like the p4 cast are lonelyfags who have a false understanding of how friends behave towards each other.

I probably would have bought them if the PS4 version of P4D came with all the DLC.

Maybe. P4 characters are really popular. Some people are still salty about their popularity 10 years later.

P2

SEETHING.

So you agree with him? You need to tldr, my dude.

That's not having a draw. That's having an understanding that your core market is a bunch of lonely otaku and creating characters that cater towards their wants.

But they’re not. The only one that tops character polls besides Yu is Yosuke and that’s only because he’s fujobait.

Having vocal fanbase is different to being actually popular. P3 usually tops the charts but that didn't stop P3D from selling like shit.

I agree in the sense that yeah, the p4 cast is liked by more people because the P4. Cast was engineered to appeal to the otaku market. They're not liked because they're better characters. They're liked more because the p4 cast is explicitly about making (you) feel like a successful and happy person.

only Yu, Chie, Naoto and Yosuke are popular desu

Which only flopped because Atlus went full Jew with the DLC.

I love both, plus 2 and 3, and don't really see the need to measure them against each other since I had such an amazing time with each of them.

I've had hundreds of hours of enjoyment with this series, it's so great and I hope they continue making more.

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>the P4. Cast was engineered to appeal to the otaku market.
Yeah man nothing screams otaku market like the normal straight man, a sexually confused gorilla and and literal fucking incel.

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At the end of the day all it matters is that people like them and want to see them in more games. That's what writing a character is all about.

Wrong

That's your opinion. I think 6k is waaaaay too low even for muh overpriced dlc rant.

>the P4. Cast was engineered to appeal to the otaku market. They're not liked because they're better characters. They're liked more because the p4 cast is explicitly about making (you) feel like a successful and happy person.
By thus logic the P5 cast should be vastly more popular since everything about them screams checklist marketing but they're not. Meanwhile the P4 cast are just dorks.

That’s not an opinion it’s a fact. Go read up on 2ch before you go full retard.

>what is otaku daydream
come on, son. NEETs and hikki spend their days wishing they could be normies.

>Ignoring the traditional submissive Japanese beauty.
>Ignoring the literal Idol character.
>Ignoring the tomboy
>Ignoring the reverse trap.
Bruh, the main character is literally named Yu. Persona 4 is about as self-insertive as you can fucking get. And if there's an unfortunate truth to the current market in japan, it's that self-insertion sells like fucking hotcakes.

There were full on threads and rants from 2ch and twt users losing their mind over the DLC atlus was putting out. And a considerable amount of butthurt of leaving Shinjiro/Groo as DLC.

>2ch posts are facts
>when Japs spend like dumbfuck s in gacha shit
Jesus christ. This is beyond retarded.
I'll head to bed now.

lol

>Ignoring the traditional submissive Japanese beauty.
>Ignoring the literal Idol character.
Funny thing is that they're the least popular among the cast.
>Ignoring the tomboy
>Ignoring the reverse trap.
Tomboys and reverse traps aren't popular amongst otaku

Go be stupid somewhere else

The only checklist character in P5 is Futaba.
>Literal autist artist.
>Dumbass delinquent
>Impure high school hottie.
>Rebellious School council president
>A smart mouth cat who constantly chastises you and calls you retarded.
No, that's what writing a marketable product is about.

>is literally named Yu
Yeah his name means calm in English. What does that have to do with anything.

>posts facts
>n-no youre retarded!!
I hope you die in your sleep you fucking loser

>Tomboy aren't popular amongst Otaku.
Is this a joke

>facts
Yes, user. And BoW is the worst game ever. I read countless threads about it on 4channel.

Gachafags and franchisefags are not the same users you idiot. Not all elevens are hardwired to spend spend spend on everything a company puts out; and even with gacha not every person is a whale, and companies know this which is why they market to the small percentage that are. Not to mention, these are full spin offs. Not mobile gacha. And in the case of 3, it was a cast that hasn't been around since 2012, the movies notwithstanding. Leaving one out intentionally just to bank on DLC bucks didn't sit right even with the more hardcore Atlus fans, and many people were vocal about wanting to keep from buying it to express that displeasure.

>marketable product
All that matters when it comes to video game design.

>Look at me, I'm being obtuse on purpose.
Go be a retard somewhere else...

No He's right Tomboys are never popular amongst them.
Nice try faggot but Yusuke is literally the fujo bait character, Ann is the foreign bombshell, Makoto us the studebt council presudent, and Morgana us even more of a shitty mascot character than fucking Teddie

I'm not going to argue that making a product that sells is a bad thing, because obviously selling us good.
But I'm not going to let people claim that characters that sell are examples of well written characters or a well written cast.

>But I'm not going to let people claim that characters that sell are examples of well written characters or a well written cast.
Of course they are. You can push something as hard as you want its not going to hold well if the character is shit. Pic related. Marie had all the trimmings of a popular character and it backfired. Ann is another example but that's mainly due to how underutilized she was in the game.

Attached: P4AU_Marie.png (1115x1983, 830K)

But it's not like Persona is know for its good characters. I think Junpei is the only decently written character in the series and even then it's stretching it. His development and interactions with Chidori feel more than forced.
Memorable marketable characters is Persona bread and butter.

rise has a smooth brain

I like P4 way more, but can't really think of any good reason why. Maybe I'm just being blinded by nostalgia and am too old to enjoy the new games.

>All the persona fags in this thread
Psh, Nothin' personal, kid.

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Who cares post feet

>how dare people talk about the subject of the thread