3 generations in a row all using the same storage medium

Carts are and have always been superior to discs. We're finally reaching the point where they have the same capacity as discs, since Nintendo is about to add a 64gb game cards option for devs.

The issue with carts is cost. Sure the switch could fit every game on it's own cart, but publishers are jews and always cheap out.
how many "physical" releases do you see with the download required banner?

>3
I dont remember ps2, xbox and gamecube using Blu ray.

He's referring to the PS3, PS4, and PS5.

Because you're a retard who doesn't keep up

Attached: Ultra_HD_Blu-ray_(logo).svg.png (1280x442, 27K)

PS5 won't have an optical drive. Storage mediums are obsolete.

Wrong.

Blu rays can store up to 1 tb so why the fuck not?

It has to do with read speed, not storage space.

UHD blu-ray has the same capacity as blu-ray though, 50gb dual layer. The only differences is that it adds a 100gb triple layer variant, which was already available in some higher capacity writeable version of blu-ray.

>Microsoft added it to the slim revision
>Sony didn't even bother with the fucking Pro, with 4K being its excuse to even exist

It's slow as fuck.

Because it works? Most games except insanely bloated AAA games can fit within the 50GBs of a dual layer blu-ray. Also there has not really been a proper successor besides Ultra HD Blu-rays which can hold 66-100GBs.

>Every generation before the ps3 used a radically better storage medium for every new console.
No they haven't. Early blu-rays were so slow read speed wise that many games required installations. This gen discs are essentially install media to faster internal storage. Cartridge has always been the superior medium they have just always been hampered by expensive production cost and limited storage capacity. Disc based media only became so popular because it allowed for much larger storage size at a cheaper price while having the downside of load times and a flimsier less durable media. Compare late N64 games with 64MB carts which were often expensive games over $60 versus PS1 CDs at 700MB with the option for multiple discs, PS1 games were usually only $30-40.

Main point being dollar to storage ratio has been the main deciding factor in what storage media is used. If cartridges cost the exact same amount as discs with the same storage sizes everything would still be using carts instead.

Didn't know OP is talking only about storage space. UHD BR is the successor to BR it's not considered the same format and needs new hardware

Because there's no point in wasting billions of dollars to make a new medium when Blu-Rays can fit a whole current gen and be able to fit a next gen game on them and can be manufactured for pennies on the dollar.

It also has a 66GB option.

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>No they haven't. Early blu-rays were so slow read speed wise that many games required installations
Yeah, compared to now where every console that uses blu-ray requires installations for EVERY game, and it will be the same next gen.

Rmember the HD-DVD?

>50 GIGABYTES DUAL LAYERED
>mostly used for uncompressed audio
Would've been nice to have higher quality textures instead, kojima.

>optical media

Because its good enough. We don't need to change anything. Why can't you people ever be satisfied with what you have? You guys always want to fix what isnt broken.

consoles are always trying to ketchup

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We've come full circle back to cartridges.

>Sturdier
>Better read speeds
>Comparable and higher storage capacity
>No laser or mechanical wear from usage

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You posted pretty much the only current gen game to have two discs. And we'll have 100gb blu-rays next-gen so even something like Red Dead Redemption 2 which has a 99gb install size would only require one.

The best thing is not having to install games on the Switch.

>5 generations in a row all using 3D graphics
Why?

What's worse is that he could have just used FLAC for identical sound quality in a smaller file size. Not all compression is lossy, you morons.

>gen 2: carts
>gen 3: carts
>gen 4: carts and cd addons
you're right, a complete change every single generation

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

For the same reason Music is still on CD at PCM 16 bit/44.1khz instead of using DSD 1 bit/5.6mhz or bigger on an SD Card.

Technology fucking luddites.

>when you realize Nintendo never went Bluray
True to their ideals till the end

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They're not that fucking expensive.
You fucking nu-male cunts should stop letting these kike corporations get away with everything and you need to start demanding better for your money.

ahem

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Even a hard drive is faster though.

>Falling for the SSD meme
For the same amount of money, you could buy a real harddrive that has 4TB of storage.

Trash.
SD Cards are superior.

Optical media need to die already, I'm sick of it.
I want games on SD Cards and I want Music encoded on DSD 1 bit/5.6 mhz on SD Cards fuck PCM and fuck Itunes and MP3 and all of that plebshit, sick of it.

Fucking luddite pieces of crap. I want Progress, I want Improvements.

I wish Blu-ray was more popular on PC.

Jews.
All other answers are for uneducated brainlets.

And it wasn't Bluray. A derivative, but not Bluray.

>everything should be more expensive to to produce but also cheaper to buy
doesn't really work that way

>2nd gen: 8KB carts
>3rd gen: 512KB carts
>4th gen: 8MB carts

Is blu-ray the end point for optical media?
Would something with more storage and faster read times be too expensive?(Are we going to see 2 and 3 disc games next gen?)

What a fucking joke.
A 128gb SD Card could easily handle this game.

It should be against the law to keep using outdated tech.

>using SSDs for storage
Only retards do this

not like you could with that limited storage

expensive is relative.
when you're printing a million copies of something, downgrading carts because it'll save you 20 cents per game is the obvious choice.

Not if you use better SD Cards.
Nintendo used cheap shit ones.

And you think that blu-ray storage sizes haven't increased too?

>And it wasn't Bluray.
Yes it was. Just because they read data backwards so they didn't have to pay royalties doesn't mean it's not the same exact technology.
That's like claiming the GC wasn't miniDVD and the Wii wasn't DVD. They were.

What sd card is as good as a 7200 rpm hd?
What sd card is good as a cheap ssd?

Mini sd cards wouldve been nice to use as the carts but stupid idiots would ruin a nice thing

MGS4 was a 50gb dual layer blu-ray game and it came out more than 10 years ago.

They're already cheap as fuck to make and they're charging you 60 dollars.
For 60 dollars they should at least give you SD Cards which are better than this piece of shit Blu-ray tech that you have to install your games for them to even load.

Like I said, enough damage controlling for these cheap luddite piece of crap companies.
We can't wait forever for new tech to become cheaper, in fact the most effective way for it to become cheaper is to be adopted en masse.

Nintendo has already cheapened the price of SD Cards a bit because of this.
Now Sony needs to do the same. MS I think is going digital-only next-gen.

There's holographic discs, which could be multi-TB, but IDK if companies are still working on them.

They'll sell you a new format when it happens to conveniently overlap with some other tech they are trying to sell you.

>I want SD cards instead of an SSD because my autism demands it

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because they lost so much money on it they need to use it

THE WRONG KID DIED

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I'm so glad I fell for SSD back in 2009. Never going back to rubberbanding HDD.

It's only because of the raw uncompressed audio.

Look at the PSN version. It's 26GB

Was fucking blown away when some random faggot sold us a bunch of these to my store.

SDUC(the latest standard) has 985mb/s read speeds. UHS-3 the previous standard had 300 to 600mb/s.
Hard Drive or SSD should be only used for downloadable games. Fuck installing games, you might as well just play on PC.

The 60 dollars isn't paying for the 80 cent garbage that the game comes on, it's paying for the game itself. The cost of physically producing a case and a disc is almost nothing, you're paying for a game that cost millions of dollars to make.

>What happened to technological progress
Ever hear of moore's law, dipshit?

Fuck you cunt.
It's zoomer cunts like you who are holding back technological revolutions.

Moore's Law has absolutely nothing to do with optical media retard.

>being an impatient child that would trade performance for being able go play the game 20 minutes earlier

I don't give a fucking shit.
For 60 bucks they should give us better. Period.

Moore's law has nothing to do with Jewish Greed.
The only reason why Optical Media is still a thing is because you fucking cunts enable the jews by buying it and not demanding better.

Plenty of great new technologies that never get adopted because "lol Optical Media is 20 cents cheaper still better continue with that".
It's sickening.

It has everything to do with technological progression and advancements, which the optical media is indeed a part of retard.

>using the slower, older format is progress
what the fuck are you saying

SD Cards have way way better performance.
What the fuck are you on about you dumb piece of shit?

We're still suck with terrible load times because of fucking Hard Drives and Blu-ray's can't even play games off the disc anymore, fucking useless.

No, it's specifically about silicon transistor sizes.

The fastest hard drives are like 150MB/s. Even the shittiest micro sd cards are faster than that now.

That 60 dollars has nothing to do with the physical medium the game comes on. You are not paying 60 dollars for a disc, you're paying 60 dollars for the game on the disc.

SD Cards should be used for the games.
SSD should be used as the internal storage.

Blu-ray and Hard Drives need to fuck off.

There's nothing wrong with what we already have though. It does what its needed to do. Is that not enough for you?

It had nothing on blu-ray tech wise. The thing was a product of a petty patent and codec spat between MFGs and nearly killed both formats. In the audio world at the time, SACD, HDCD, and BluCD actually did all kill each other (though, one can argue buying physical music would have died on its own anyway).

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>That 60 dollars has nothing to do with the physical medium the game comes on.
Then it shouldn't matter if the game comes on an SD card either then.
Thanks for playing, idiot.

Show me an sd card that's as fast an ssd.

I wasn't comparing the two. I was comparing it to a hard drive, which is what consoles come with, and will likely still have even in the next gen.

>There's nothing wrong with what we already have though.
There clearly is when you need to install a bigger hard-drive on your console just to play a game and you need to keep removing games to install other games. You might as well just play on PC at that point.

It does not do what it's needed to do.
What it needs to do is have the ability to play the games without installing them to the internal drive and it needs to have a lot of capacity and speed for that, things which the Blu-ray format lacks because it's outdated shit.

Yes it does, because you're going from paying 0 dollars for nothing to paying 0 dollars for something. You're already not paying for the disc, you're asking for something that costs money but you don't want to pay for it either.

buying physical music still hasn't died, especially in Japan where I imagine much of this idiotic fighting took place.

...

Why use an sd card for games when it's slower?

>though, one can argue buying physical music would have died on its own anyway
I will argue that the music industry is dying.
Streaming is a meme and most people just download music illegally.

The only thing that could revive it is if they dump the CD format to the trash and start putting Music encoded on DSD 1 bit/5.6mhz(or higher) on an SD Card.
That is if fucking luddites ever would let this happen.

Only people who buy music nowadays are audiophiles and enthusiasts.

>3 generations in a row all using the same storage medium
>Still not backward compatible

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No it fucking doesn't.
Because by using SD cards you eliminate the consumers need to swap internal storage.

It's a better value for costumers. Period.

Why would normalfags care about that though?

Wouldn't they prefer to just put more memory onto the consoles since I'm sure they can skim more off the top for digital downloads.

>Blu-Rays and DVDs feel more worth it to me because they're bigger even though cartridges are better

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Technology has nothing to do with why the music industry is dying. It's dying because modern music is all degenerate jewish propaganda and continues to get worse every decade.

It's much faster than hard-drives and you do not need to install the games to play them fool.
If they're big enough you could potentially also patch them directly in the card when bug fixes are needed.

The SSD drive could be as small as 128gb relegated to downloadable games.

>I will argue that the music industry is dying.
I would say that it is paring down. Music doesn't have nearly as much cultural force as it used to have, and without that, pushing music and things related is that much harder.
>Streaming is a meme and most people just download music illegally.
Streaming is here to stay and the perfect solution for satisficers. It lets the average normie say that they're legal while giving them goodnuff quality and good availability.

>Only people who buy music nowadays are audiophiles and enthusiasts.
Agreed

>slower is better because im lazy
No thanks, ill stick with my faster speeds.

2 blu rays probably cost less to manufacture than an SD Card.

Because now that net neutrality is dead, ISP's will come asking for their piece of that pie too.

that doesn't have much to do with why certain consoles aren't backwards compatible

>If they're big enough you could potentially also patch them directly in the card
That's be horrible for user version control and I hope this never happens. I don't mind downloading a few hundred MB to 10 GB if that means there's a once-in-a-blue-moon game release that's better unpatched (Resie 2, Estival Versus)

Thanks for reminding me how shitty everything is

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>hard-drives
I'm talking about ssd. Why not switch to that because it's the fastest?

Sony made blu-ray btw

You clearly don't understand how this works or what the installations are for.

Normalfags don't buy music.
They download MP3's or use youtubetomp3converter

It's a big part actually.
Piracy is very easy because of the CD/Streaming/PCM format.

Imagine if the music industry collectively decided to say "Fuck Streaming and CD, we're going DSD on SD Cards exclusively"...just imagine that.
Everybody would be forced to buy new receivers and crap just to listen to new music...either that or attending concerts wherever they can.
It would also be difficult to rip DSD compared to PCM since equipment for that is still very expensive.
But the music industry doesn't have the balls to pull that crap.

I agree that the music industry is crap because they keep pushing shitty as new music as well as that the internet making everything accessible has destroyed the music scene but technology plays a big part.

>holographic discs
vaporware

Wait, what were they before?

Yes it absolutely does.

Consoles with backward compatibility have in the past shared media, that's the biggest barrier. The Switch isn't BC with Wii U games because it would both need a disc drive and the hardware necessary to run the games, while something like the Xbone only needs the 360's hardware to run games without needing emulation, they both use optical discs. Its reasonable to expect backward compatibility when the consoles use the same media and its not too expensive to put the old hardware in the new console. For example PS2 backward compatibility on the PS3 only cost Sony about $27 per unit, I don't think it would have been too much more expensive than this to do PS3 BC on PS4 or 360 BC on Xbone without emulation.

SD cards are faster.

Because developing a game whose assets are over 200GB would be insane. Not even World of Warcraft, after a fuckton of expansions, is that big. Not even Raibow Six Siege with the ultra textures is that big and the textures alone are over 30GB.

There's no reason to go beyond multi layered Bluray at the moment and I doubt we'll have that need in the next 10 years.

See, this is the exact mentality I hate.
If we adopt SD cards now they will go down on price very fast.
We cannot keep using this outdated tech.

It all depends on how they implement it.
They could give you the option to patch it on the card or just have the patch be on the internal storage instead.
They could also give you the option of unpatching it.

Whenever I ask you to show me an sd card as fast as an ssd card you always dodge the question. Why is that?

Music is losing popularity because most popular musicians (the ones that get forced on us) are absolute shit.

Because you can't sell games on SSD you retard lmao.
SD cards are smaller and far more portable.

SD Card for games and SSD for storage is the optimal combo.

>For example PS2 backward compatibility on the PS3 only cost Sony about $27 per unit
>only

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray#BDXL

Blue ray XL exists

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well i'm not talking about patches. i'm taking when a game comes with a 40gb installation straight out the box day one cause its not on the disc

I said SD cards are faster than hard drives/Blu-rays not SSD's.
You can't sell games on SSD's, what the fuck are you on about?

>I will argue that the music industry is dying.
It's been dead for years, it just doesn't know it yet.
Then again I'm a hermit when it comes to pop culture, I couldn't name any "top" acts from the past few years.

>lol how do you get a game onto an ssd fucking idiot
shit you got me there, how are we going to get the game onto an ssd? literally impossible. nevermind, lets all use sd cards instead.

>things which the Blu-ray format lacks because it's outdated shit.
I wouldn't say Blu-ray is outdated, it's just that because of how reading from a disc works, it will always be sub-optimal for games from here on out. With a linear movie, Blu-ray is just fine because the data is always going to be in a set sequence but with games, the data that is needed is going to be in different places so read times have a much more significant impact. No matter what we do, disc based media will always have this limitation. Solid state storage formats don't have this issue and will always be better for gaming, which is why games should just move back towards carts.

>You can't sell games on SSD's, what the fuck are you on about?
I really hope they find a way to transfer files from an external storage medium to an ssd, but i guess that technology doesn't exist yet. oh well! jeez user, you're so smart. how did you get so smart?

Honestly I think if you advertise technology(such as DSD Music on SD Cards) to normalfags properly they will buy it.
Vinyl has gotten really popular among the hipster section of normalfags in recent years after all.

Advertisement is such a lost art these days and there's not enough risk-taking from companies in today's climate.

Music being shit nowadays though as is a big hurdle to pass through.

are you confusing a SSD with a USB Stick?

Yes let's just have a game store filled with SSD Drives lmao.
What a fucking retard you are.

Fucking idiot. This is the problem with the current consoles. Having to install(and remove) shit constantly.
SD Cards eliminate this shit(not to mention their capacity/speed is only getting better and better every year), why can't you get this through your thick skull?

>If we adopt SD cards now they will go down on price very fast.
That's not how it works.
Companies won't switch to making less profit per sell just for the chance of it going down in price in the future.

What do SSD's have to do with consoles at all? Sony and Microsoft aren't going to put SSD's even into their next gen consoles.

Already outdated.

It's outdated even for movies.
4k blu-rays are usually upscaled or bit-starved.
The blu-ray meme is over.

>Already outdated.
What's newer and useable?

I agree with this user and this should be the way forward. It could also help bring back physical copies for PC since sd cards are still relevant.

like 3

>PS3 has a read speed of 9MB/s
>PS4 has a read speed of 36MB/s
>The highest spec Blu-Ray drives out right now, the best the PS5 could have, has a read speed of 72MB/s

For movies? Internet streaming.

For games. I don't understand what you mean by outdated. Is there a newer storage format?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_HD_Blu-ray

>72MB/s
Actually it's 72Mb/s. Big difference.

>Sony and Microsoft aren't going to put SSD's even into their next gen consoles
It's way more likely than people putting shit on expensive sd cards.

Meanwhile, SD cards are 300MB/s.

Nope.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-ray#Drive_speeds

>This is the problem with the current consoles. Having to install(and remove) shit constantly.
So now we're back to "im a lazy impatient child who will trade quality for convienece".

>assuming we all live in a place with unlimited WiFi

Yeah I'll stick to my blue ray. Plus I like the feeling of owning something.

turns out Optical media is just obsolete nowadays, No one uses CD's anymore, and Blu-ray players are bargain bin items. Unless you plan on going for a meme like 3D movies which died back in 2015, the future is purely in digital storage. Microsoft wanted this push back in 2013 but people cried out with good reason that no-one should be subjected to forced internet downloads. Retail space hated it as well, so here we are, living in a time where a disk prompts you to a 5-10GB day 1 download with none of the benefits of stored media. next gen is going to be cardboard cutouts with a download code, or something very similar. Maybe using the disk like PC's used to back in the late 90's early 2ks, where its just used to check if you still own the game and didnt sell it

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>50 GB (dual-layer,[1] 82 Mbit/s)
>66 GB (dual-layer,[1] 108 Mbit/s)
>100 GB (triple-layer,[1] 128 Mbit/s)

Capacity wise this looks almost identical do BLXL

>For games
Also internet streaming.

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That's exactly how it works retard.

Everything?

Also outdated.

This will never be a thing. The US in particular has shit internet and many people around the world are forced to using wireless. The input lag will always be there as will the shit image quality.

SD Cards would be million times better for movies.
>brb faster seeking times
>brb bigger capacity so real 4k movies instead of 2k upscales
>brb much higher bitrate for video and audio

Then why do you think people will go for it?

That's what consoles are you retarded zoomer fuck.
They're meant to be convenient.

PC gaming for high-end shit.

People who live in cities have good internet. Only rural and suburban retards won't be able to use it.

>People who live in cities have good internet
NYC is a prime example of this being false

>No one uses CD's anymore
They don't. That's why you see them for 2-3$ nowadays.
People are buying Vinyl records more these days.

Optical Media is obsolete and the only reason it hasn't been phased out is because of greedy jews.
SD/Flash cards are far superior.

I wish PC got physical releases, fuck paying for digital distribution

I like the idea of being able to buy HiFi physical, but the average normie I deal with doesn't seem to care about having a physical collection of music. Dealing with music industry DRM and copyright antics is also a major negative towards physical distribution. If could buy an SD and copy the music to wherever, I would be set, but I know the industry would never allow that off the bat.

Is DSD really the best there is in digital? I remember reading a lot of criticism about it a while back. Supposedly, MQA is the hot new thing that offers digital without the issues, but is a DRM hellscape.

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Rephrase your question please.

Niche games still get physical releases

that's what I said

But PC still gets physical releases of many games. The catch is that they come in DVD format and only have a steam installer.

>but the average normie I deal with doesn't seem to care about having a physical collection of music.
It's because it doesn't get advertised to them. The industry are advertising streaming to them.

If you advertise to them properly it could work.
Convince the major smartphone companies to make a convenient SD card slot for it to work on phones(as well has them having DSD de-coders/DAC's on them).
Include an MP3 download link code for every purchase to go along with it.

But the industry is greedy and just wants to jew artists for all of their shekels with this streaming bullshit. It has no foresight for the long run and that's why it's barely surviving as a result.

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Streams are bit starved a lot more than blu-ray. Netflix "4k" streams have a fraction of the bitrate of a blu-ray, let alone 4K UHD blu-ray. Dumb fucks buy 4k tvs just to watch their bit starved streams on. Same with CDs, spotify isn't as high quality as a proper CD, even then the redbook on CD should be updated because it is capable of more
There were several discs in development that could hold over 1tb. In 2000 hyper CD-rom could hold 10tb. The guy that made it funded the development himself though so the big players already in the market wouldn't have got a cut.
Disc is still far superior to paying for digital distribution, especially when it comes to games because digital distribution is a cancer on gaming. I started pirating when PC went digital only. I have never and will never pay for digital distribution

>MGSV had a PC retail release
>Only thing the disk had was a 3MB steam installer

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>Is DSD really the best there is in digital?
Yup.
DSD128 and above(DSD256, DSD512 etc.) that is(DSD64 was tried on SACD's but it was too noisy).
It's analog on the digital domain. It uses Pulse-Density Modulation en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse-density_modulation
It's a continue sine wave just like in analog only without the downsides of analog.

Music natively recorded on DSD(as in not converted from an Analog Master Tape) is the best music has ever sounded.

The problem is the tools for editing are crap so recording to DSD directly is not feasible except for acoustic and live music because you have to convert it to PCM to edit it.
But while it fails at that I can see it as a good format to store analog audio in a digital format.

A digital download code in a box is not a physical copy. A physical copy has the entire game on the physical media and doesn't require some platform like Steam or a download to be playable. Using your logic a prepaid iTunes card is a physical copy which it isn't so a download code in a box isn't either.

What's the difference between ordering a game online and downloading a drm-free version? It's the same thing.

Who besides movie buffs still buy media on Blu-ray? Buying games physical is pointless now because without the day one patch the game is broken and or unfinished. Blu-ray only lasted the 7th gen and start of the 8th. That’s not 3 just in case you can’t count.

I was not arguing about streams.
But streaming has its place for convenience with normalfags.

Blu-ray is outdated and is barely even delivering 4k movies. I don't see how long they can ride on his meme considering that even the original Blu-ray before UHD Blu-rays was not that popular and DVD was kicking its ass.
If they plan on offering 8k movies in the future I just don't see how they can do it with the Blu-ray tech.
Blu-ray has simply reached its limit.

>download only no disc included
Why are they wasting plastic on this?

Don't get it either. Really bizarre

It's not the same thing, not at all.
And Steam is not drm-free.

>They're not that fucking expensive.
32GB carts plus licensing cost 60% more than 50GB dual layer blu ray printing plus licensing. That cost is right at $20.

It's not 20$ for companies who order it on bulk, fuck outta here.

Why did they remove the "requires steam account to play" part?

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>optical media
LOADING
LOADING
LOADING
LOADING
LOADING

>And Steam is not drm-free.
Depends on the game

>It's not the same thing, not at all.
So...are you going to say why?
Also, steam has tons of drm-free games.

That's exactly wrong

That is a patch, dumbass. Again, you don't know how this works. The reason day 1 patches exist is because of how game development works and how the current state of technology affects it that process. What used to happen before patches and updates were possible is that a game would have to be fully completed before"going gold", which is the term to designate when a game is ready to be printed to the physical format it will be sold as. Once it goes gold, no further work can be done because what they have is what is getting printed. Once the ability to patch and update games came about, it meant games could go gold sooner because what wasn't done yet could just be patched in later because devs now had the ability to work on the game literally up to the release date, meaning games actually go gold and are printed well before they are fully polished and complete, allowing them to ship sooner and start producing revenue sooner, since the devs can use that time in between gold status and release to finish the game via a day 1 patch. Those downloads on day 1 have nothing to do with that data being too much to fit on the disc. Those downloads are because the publisher wanted to get the game on store shelves and start making money on sales as quickly as possible.

You're confusing installations off the disc with patches here and proving you don't know what you're talking about.

If you have to use Steam to play it it's already DRM.
I don't think Steam works like GOG.

>If you have to use Steam to play it it's already DRM.
But there are multiple games released on Steam that don't require Steam

ok retard

>If you have to use Steam to play it it's already DRM
You don't need to for many games.

Yes it is. What cuts your licensing cost is the MSRP of what you're selling.
Only the 8GB carts are on part with regular PS4 or Xbone games. If things were as cheap as you're implying then so many games wouldn't be using smaller sized carts and requiring downloads on top of it.

alright well thanks for explaining it

I would never pay for digital distribution.
That is because of digital distribution. One of the main reasons Valve pushed digital distribution is because it allows developers to intentionally release their games unfinished or unplayable without a patch. You are suggesting everyone cuck and accept it by paying for digital. Any game that doesn't have a physical release with the entire playable game on the physical media should be boycotted. They intentionally sabotage physical releases to get people to go digital.
Steam itself is inherently DRM, so is having to have an account and be authorized by a server at any point to access your game from the source even one time which even applies to GoG. kys Valve drone

>it allows developers to intentionally release their games unfinished or unplayable without a patch
Shit in the box and ship it has existed long before Valve

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>gamestop is drm because you have to enter the store to buy it

>Steam itself is inherently DRM, so is having to have an account and be authorized by a server at any point to access your game from the source even one time which even applies to GoG. kys Valve drone
Like I said - there are games released on Steam that don't require Steam or internet to play. They are simply using Steam as a digital store.

Dude Gamestop is literally DRM

Holy shit, you're that one autist. You post this same retarded shit every time digital distribution is mentioned, you've been doing it for a few months. Take your autism pills and stop shitting up Yea Forums.

>Physical storages
Get on with the times grandpa

Can you copy them on a different hard-drive and play them on a different computer without installing Steam?

That's DRM-Free to me.

No it isn't. Not even close to 20 dollars.

Yes, user. Ofcourse you sitll need the steam client to download the game. Then you can uninstall it and still play the game. Some games require a first launch with Steam so they can install dependencies and the sort.

steam.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games

That's not how it works. It's impossible for mask rom production to be as cheap as optical media. The operating costs and materials alone are far more expensive than the type 7 polycarbonate and the aluminium used on the layers.

Fuck you, it fucking didn't.
Broken games used to get scrutinized back in the day.

There were a lot of glitchy and shitty games back in the NES/SNES days but by god they were fucking finished.

The only logical progression would be to go back to cartridges but flash storage is dramatically more expensive than optical storage. Even if they'd be getting 64GB carts at half this price that's still 5x less copies of the game for the same price tag.

That's one of the big issues holding the Switch back, devs say that the Switch can actually run a decent number of games (mind you at maybe the level of blurry DOOM) but compressing everything to be suitable for the Switch's storage is hard because the 32GB carts are very expensive, only one game has used them so far which was DQI&II back in May 2017 which was a Japan exclusive.. FFXII will be on a 32GB cart worldwide so maybe that means the storage prices are coming down which could be pretty big for more hardware demanding games going to Switch in the future.

But you take this problem and remember that 32GB carts are breaking the bank and now apply that to the 60+GB sometimes 100+GB games from other systems and PC that are using 4K assets? You're a nutter. Obviously they'd be using cheaper standard storage formats and not paying some BS Nintendo tax but NAND isn't cheap and games are fuckin huge now, no change any time soon.

I'm shocked I don't actually buy more PC games this way. I like having boxes on my shelf, even if they're empty. But I'll probably pirate Sekiro anyway.

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False
Fucking
Equivalence

>For the same amount of money, you could buy a real harddrive that has 4TB of storage.
>Not buying both

>Some games require a first launch with Steam so they can install dependencies and the sort.
That's DRM, don't even try to sugarcoat it.

I fucked up looking at the optical pack's price. It would be around 3x less copies at half that SD card price but someone still has to eat that cost and the margins on $60 games are already very thin when you look at where all the money goes.

It won't be ever as cheap as optical media but it can get pretty close.
Say if an optical disc costs 10 cent then I can picture an SD card costing 20.

You could mass produce flash cards that hold 100gb of data pretty cheap, but that would be dumb.

The Switch cartridges aren't NAND flash carts. If they were, some would lose their data and become corrupt within 10 years, some within 20 years, some within one year.

How is that DRM? Also I said SOME games require dependencies like you know visual C++ redist and shit like that. Steam always installs this shit on first launch of any game. And again, SOME games require this, others don't. Learn to read.

It is, but no one's just going to toss out the executable and every single dependent program like all the fucking vc redistributables for every game. They have steam that offers that exact service for them. After they're installed you've done your first run, you can uninstall steam and the game will still function.
epic launcher is the same way for SMB.

The only way to dramatically reduce the price is mass adoption.
Companies have to push the thing, just like they did with CD's back in the day.

What is the point of all these technological advancements if we're not allowed to use them?

Oh child

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Because Blu-ray has been able to keep up with the storage capacity needs of the movie and vidya industry. CDs are still much more economical than solid-state medium when being mass-produced

Why fix what isn't broken

SD cards are already produced in absurdly high quantities, they're the primary storage format for cameras where raw high resolution video absolutely chews through space, there's a huge war to lower flash prices and I don't see video games having a big impact in that since SD cards are such a saturated market already, if anything it will just temporarily increase prices because of the demand spike.

It's impossible, with current technology, for an SD card to be that cheap. And those cartridges aren't using flash memory like SD cards, that would be insane considering how unreliable it would be.

Every game cartridge uses mask ROM for the read-only data, out of necessity, so your cart won't have a literally random lifespan beyond one or two years without being used (electric current is necessary to prevent data loss) but even that won't prevent the cells dying.

It's not a matter of there being too little market adoption. The technology is mature already, and pretty widespread. It's simply impossible to be that cheap. The cost of extracting and purifying silicon alone is more expensive than the extraction of the metals necessary and the plastic production. It consumes FAR more electricity. Can't compare pressing stamps of metal layers with semiconductor manufacturing.

The yields are also great for optical media, while a defective run with cartridges would be in comparison a massive loss.

Optical media is just binary data punched into microscopic holes on a surface. You could technical make a CD out of anything, provided it is flat and dense enough.

Yeah, yeah, yeah it still wasn't the norm back then and you know it bitch.

You just don't know.

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>SD cards are already produced in absurdly high quantities
lol no

It's either SD cards or the industry going full digital.
Blu-ray and Optical Media is fucking done for gaming, period.

With the rise of filesizes for video games, if they want to continue with physical they either need to
1. Shut the fuck up and take the financial hit
2. Increase the prices of games to 80$

It's sickening how much optical media is holding back progress, it really fucking is.

But it isn't at all. Retail games exist because there's a market for them.

Once they go full jew, indeed, distribution would be exclusively digital. But that doesn't change anything. Discs are just a means of delivering files. Current consoles don't even read the data from them during gameplay, it's just for installing and booting the game.

The amount of misinformed, nonsensical drivel (especially from that aggressive mongoloid who is clearly the same poster)

And comparing cartridges from back in the day with "modern" cartridges is especially daft. It's not even the same thing. One is a slot loader which is basically also the RAM itself and can communicate with the onboard chips while the other is just a passive storage medium for read/write operations which is also way more expensive (in an acceptable size and speed performance) than your average dual layer Blu Ray. You are talking a few cents vs 20$ in production cost. And no, even mass producing them would not lower the price to a few cents.

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>lol no
retard

I predict people will start getting sick of Blu-rays when they have to use 4-5 discs(like back in the PSX days) to install a 300gb game.
They're already getting sick of dealing with the headache of uninstalling and installing games to begin with.

Something has to change. The video game industry needs to cut down on budgets or some shit because this thing is getting out of control.

Video game companies make a 100 million dollar game and then they're too cheap to put it in a proper format, that is fucking absurd.

Compared to the quantity of optical media it's a joke.

european retard

>You are talking a few cents vs 20$ in production cost.
Keep memeing this bullshit but it will never be true.
It's not even close to 20$.

You should seriously seek help. Hope it makes you extra angry that the industry will never listen to your demands for very good reasons.

If they really had something better in terms of price/performance ratio they would use it.

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>it costs $20 to make an SD card

?

not him but i appreciate the plug suits

Yes. San Disk has published a break down on their business site. To get HDD compareable constant speeds with a MicroSDXC 128GB (their A2 extreme or extreme plus series) with having acceptable longevity(!) it does cost San Disk close to 20 bucks to produce them. Another big issue is the production speed and quantity of SD cards and that they could never shit out the same amount as optical discs in a certain period of time.

we're at the peak of our civilization

it goes all downhill from here

You're not getting memed, it is absolutely that expensive
twitter.com/ZhugeEX/status/906053345206566912

When you are shipping millions of an item, saving even 5 cents is a lot of money saved

Because games don't really need to be more than 25gb

>60% more than $0.20 is $20

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Music industry died 15-20 years ago, it’s been a shuffling zombie ever since.

What do you think the licensing cost Sony charges per disc printed is? I'll give you a hint, It was a flat $5 per disc in the PS1 days and licensing plus production of a PS4 game is over $10 per dual layer bluray disc now.

Bullshit.
UHS3 128gb SD Cards cost 30 bucks
amazon.com/SanDisk-Extreme-128GB-microSDXC-UHS-3/dp/B06XX3X9JD

They cannot be profiting this little.

And not to mention that if SD cards were to be massively adopted and pushed by the big guns they would be much cheaper than this too.

So it's not $0.20 per disc then, it's $10 per disc. That means 32GB Switch games were $16 each as of late 2017, which means they're probably own to $13 now, with how much memory prices have fallen since then.

Yes because Sony can't just make their own proprietary version of SD/Flash Cards right?

> 3 generations
lol no 360 was dvd
ps3 was bluray
wii u was some gay nintendo dvd
plus the new xbone has 4k blu

Actually I meant to say they're something like $8 now, since memory price per GB has almost halved in price since then.

Is Nintendo unironically the hero we need but the one we don't deserve?

Nintendo is the only company fighting the optical media jewish luddites.

Believe what you want user. 32GB Switch carts are insanely priced which is why only 1 or 2 games have ever used them, and why so many companies use a small cart and require downloads. Switch uses proprietary carts that only Nintendo makes and carts of those sizes will never be as cheap to produce as a disc. The only reason the numbers are only 60% off anyway are Nintendo is taking a smaller licensing cut on those larger sizes as a way to subsidize the cost.

Flash memory prices are down to $0.10/GB now. They were $0.25/GB in 2017 when that tweet was written. Obviously switch carts don't use flash memory, but pretty much all memory prices have fallen by the same amount in that timeframe. That means if they cost $10 to manufacture then, they are less than $5 today. The outlook for the rest of the year shows prices falling even faster. That means that by the end of this year, the cost will probably be halved again.

If it ain't broken, don't worry about it. Blu rays are still the cheapest and most accessible form of disc physical storage. Not to say they are capable of quite the workloads.

But it is broken.
You can't play games off of them directly anymore without installing them so they're broken. Period. You fucking shill.

It's slowly being phased out in favor of digital downloads and streaming.

Net neutrality was only a law for 2 years. The internet, Yahoo, Google, Yea Forums, Youtube all predate a 2 year old law signed by Obama. Get that dumb fear mongering shit out you stupid literal mouthbreathing millennial cocksucker.

UHD Bluray is just H.265 user and sometimes 100GB discs

Here's the thing.
Sony will have to abandon Blu-ray sooner or later and they will be forced to used Flash Memory.

Why you ask?
Because consider the following:
1. Devs won't put up with the crappy storage size of Blu-ray anymore
2. Japan has got Sony and everybody by the balls because they don't do digital and still love their physical releases

So, in a nutshell, our only hope to prevent a digital-only nightmare lies entirely on Japanese people.