Party members not currently used don't receive any EXP

Fuck FFVI for this

>Pokemon added a feature that all pokemon level up at the same time
>people bitch about how easy this is

Pic not releated
? Are you retarded Xenoblade 2 party members get xp. You can go to inn and level them up

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>party member dies in the last few seconds of a boss fight
>no XP

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Pokémon is an easy game no matter how you play it. The Pokémon fanbase is just infantile and confuses tedium for difficulty. Gen 6+ EXP share cuts tedium and allows more flexible team composition, and with proper balancing you can still have a challenge with it turned on.

People bitch about exp share? It's completely optional and useful.

He meant the reverse.

XC1 and XC2 give all party members, even unused ones Exp even if you never use them.

Xenoblade X only gave exp to those you're currently using, so you have to grind them all separately.

>beat boss easily in game
>cutscene shows your party battered and bruised while boss is merely holding back using 2% of his power
Stop this shit

>party member you've used all game and spent exp on dies and/or betrays you in the story and are no longer usable
>their only replacement is a character severely underleveled

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I apologize then to him

Fuck this always drove me mad especially if its a boss that gives a huge amount of exp to catch up a weaker character.

Which would you prefer?
>cut off the fight somewhere before boss's HP bar hits zero
>big bad's HP goes all the way down but fight still continues in cutscene, and big bad gets away
>you don't fight the big bad ever until the end of the game
Because realistically it has to be one of those.

>big bad's HP goes all the way down but fight still continues in cutscene, and big bad gets away
This is actually the most preferable choice.

I liked how Tales of Legendia did that

>fight boss
>after boss hits a certain HP (or time) threshold he uses his ultimate move
>battle ends right there

I rather the fight get cut off before hp bar goes down completely. Seeing boss collapse/explode in gameplay then immediately dunking your party in the following cutscene really kills your sense of achievement.

>benched party members dont get exp
>there's a forced B team section

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Anyone have trouble going back to older games cause of things like this? I tried replaying Persona 4 after 5 and I ended up having only 4 party members at high levels while the rest were half, it sucked.

>big bad's HP goes all the way down but fight still continues in cutscene, and big bad gets away
>Mfw no game where you fight a boss but when the boss' HP gets low, he uses a new move that slows you down and runs away from you all while still in gameplay

I agree with this
The purpose of the HP bar is to communicate the player's goal in any given battle and they will craft strategies around how long of a fight they're looking at, ending the fight before they can pull off what they're planning is kind of a dick move

>(or time) threshold he uses his ultimate move
No, fuck you with that bullshit. This shit annoy the fuck out of me in FF9 and Beatrix.

fuck you ff ix

broke: levels make you stronger by increasing your stats to deal more damage and receive less
woke: levels make you stronger by letting you equip more skills/character modifiers or letting you use them more often in battle

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luckily if 3 of the 4 or even 2 of the 4 can carry the other 2, the lower level ones can gain like 2 levels a fight for a bit

youtube.com/watch?v=Jo-J-YJZQOk
How to do an unwinnable fight correctly. A little background on Lisa the Pointless
>the main character learn how to do karate via video tape
>he get cocky because he can beat up his bully with these move
>decided to be join a fighting tournament because he want to make it big
>the rule had it where he cannot perform illegal move
>the main character only know illegal move
>if the main character use these move, he get disqualified
>if he doesn't he get his ass kicked
>he can also choose to quit
>this cause the Main character to change form in the present

>there are people like this
>"Quality of life improvements dumb the game down for casuals"
Do they ENJOY playing through shitty mechanics? Do people think trudging through some clunky UI and unnecessary grind is good? For clout points? It's like people want games to give them a headache.

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It gives you a reason to rotate through the characters.
Fucking casuals.

this point is basically moot in jrpgs. It wouldn't be that far of a stretch to include some flimsy plot device about EXP literally being "soul energy" or some bullshit that you can absorb from dead enemies. Add in some other plot point about party member's "souls" being linked since them getting together in a party is fate or destiny or some bullshit and so all EXP is shared for the whole party as the "soul energy" from a dead enemy diffuses throughout all of their souls. Replace "soul", "soul energy", "destiny" with literally whatever else and it'd work just fine. It wouldn't be an ass pull in the slightest considering there's already a ton of "huh, what?" type shit in jrpgs like xenoblade. Maybe make it so that the party member who kills the enemy absorbs most of the "soul energy" and the rest trickles down to the others.

Some rm2k games back in the day, e.g. Laxius Power, did it the best way IMO. Inactive party members got half the exp. This way, they weren't as strong as the characters you were using (which wouldn't make sense), but being forced to use them didn't necessarily mean you were fucked

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>It gives you a reason to rotate through the characters.

I understand but when you have to rotate through 14 characters, for 3 slots, it sucks.

I am aware of the training that can be done to level ONE character while the game is off but that's still 13 people to rotate into a pary of 3 and creams "bad game design"

So you play pokemon for the story or what?

Never touched a pokemon game. Does it even have one?

But there no reason to use any other Pokemon besides your starter because they'll always be 10 levels higher than your other Pokemon.

I like how KoToR 2 state how the Exile get stronger by killing people and sucking the energy from her companions.

x party members are all useless postgame anyway

>bench party member and almost never use them
>they don't gain EXP
>there's a section later in the game where you're forced to use only that character

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why would anyone be against the first one?
>start fight with big bad before the end of the game
>have party member either before the fight or during it comment on how strong he is and how their best move would be to play it defensively
>the more damage you do to big bad, the more seriously he starts taking the fight
>starts out treating the fight like a joke, clearly fucking around with people he thinks are nowhere near his level
>when he sees you taking his weak hits and dealing damage starts being more aggressive and busting out harder moves
>when you get his health down low enough a cutscene plays where he demolishes the party with a single strike and then walks away laughing about how you're still too weak to face him
I'd prefer that way more than the second choice, assuming this is actually a game where you HAVE to face the big bad at least once before the final endgame fight. Second choice just feels as bad as "kick the bosses's ass in the fight, lose in the cutscene", and that kind of shit is frustrating as hell. Having a fight like I described where the actual fight health bar is really 20% of the health bar you see would make for a way better experience, it'd make the fight the first time through feel a lot more frantic on your end, like
>holy shit, I've been whaling on him this long and I only have 10% of his health down? this really IS the fucking big bad
when in reality you have half his health down and the cutscene is close to playing.

Luckily this isn't a problem unless Machina and Rem are your favorite characters.

due to how the game is designed around parrying, and hitting at the right time, I stuck with King sine he seems to hit the parry shots at just the right moments.

Plus it's Sugita

I like the second choice due to how much I hate the whole LOL I ONE SHOT YOU! I WIN battles and how fucking common it is. Many times, it not even the final boss that does this.

this shit screams bad game design in any game it pops up in. I don't understand how devs don't foresee that shit happening, especially if it has the potential to hardlock a game
>give players the freedom of choice to use their favorite party members
>act surprised when they don't pick the dev's favorite party member that gets a dedicated section later in the game
what a fucking dumb idea, you can't give players a mechanic and then expect them not to use it. If this shit happens far enough in a game where I'd be forced to either restart or load an old save to grind that party member back up, I honestly just drop the game and never touch it again.

The second one is way worse in this regard though. You demolish the boss, actually take out his health bar and "win" but the game doesn't give you the satisfaction of that and just spits in your face by having the cutscene shit on everything you did prior to it. At least if it's the first choice and the fight is programmed to be unwinnable, you know there's nothing you can do about it and the game gets across the feeling of the big bad being way out of your reach for the time being well enough.
Bonus points if in the scenario that you DO somehow end up killing the big bad even if the fight is unwinnable by exploiting a glitch or mechanic or the like, instead of it playing the same unwinnable cutscene as if you lose the game plays an alternate one where you actually do kick the bosses's ass and insert some other reason as to why/how he gets away. Love it when games do this, would love it even more if that would actually kill the big bad for good and have him replaced by his right hand man, number two in command for the rest of the game.

Because the EXP share isn't balanced in the slightest. It leads to all of your mons being overleved, since the game is designed with split exp and mons being rotated in mind.

Yeah, I liked King as well, because guns, and Trey I think it was? The guy with the bow and arrow, he rapes everything during the war battle segments due to being able to hit enemy units from farther than they can hit him.

What games do this

Wrong. The LOL I ONE SHOT YOU! is more insulting if you actually level up to that point and no amount of effort would effect the outcome, regardless. Even if you know it beforehand, it undermine the story a whole lot. As I mention before, it not even the final boss that does this all time, it mostly shitlords that thing their hotshit and they die to the final boss without you actually killing them. This was absolute cancer in JRPG and I'm glad this shit hardly exist in any other MMO. And who to say the second choice wouldn't cause the boss to just gitgud and make the next fight harder?

FFX

At least the enemies were scaled to his level but fuck Kimahri for this.

It is dumb. Either they still follow your group and have their own off screen battles around you or if you leave them behind, they should have their own little adventures or training to gain experience etc.

>MMO
RPG*

>bench party member and almost never use them
>they gain EXP
>there's a section later in the game where you're forced to use only that character
>their level ups are saved and can be used up in the middle of the fight and recover full hp because of it.

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>health bar is really 20% of the health bar you see
>his HP bar is the same width as the screen
>have a super dramatic early game fight with a boss, full of tense moments.
>he's hamming it up to mock you
>"NOOOO HOW COULD I HAVE BEEN DEFEATED" when his HP gets really low
>The hp bar slowly zooms out and it's shown that was only a tiny little fraction of his HP bar.
>he laughs at your stupid faces and one shots your whole party
Pic related

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>and creams "bad game design"

The whole point of the combat system is to match the current enemy type with the character who perfectly counters it. Like in a card game. Because they're all named after cards and shit. Switching characters is so fucking quick and easy, you literally have no excuse to be this lazy.

except you can only bring a small group and if you picked the wrong people, you are fucked

>like in a card game
name one card game where the cards get weaker throughout the game when you don't use them

If you make poor choices and get fucked, then you learn from your mistakes and try again. Like in any other video game.

but when you realize you fucked up at the very end, redoing like 40 minutes of gameplay just fucking sucks

You only have yourself to blame if you didn't know how to manage your assets. The game expects you to use everybody and creates situations tailored for them, and they only need to show up in battle for a second to receive the benefits.

Do it the Chrono Trigger way and give you an honest fight against the big bad without nerfing him, if you beat him at that point in the game you get a special ending and if you don't (like 99% of players) you get fucked up and progress the story as normal.

The Mario RPGs had so many good concepts that appear too little elsewhere. Being able to choose which stat you want to increase on level up is one of them. Badges were another

>shifting the focus from what is objectively bad game design to "player mistakes"
If a game hardlocks because the game requires you to use certain characters in a certain part of the game without any prior notice after giving you the freedom of choice of using any damn party composition you want for the entire game leading up to this moment, that is literally nothing but bad game design. You cannot honestly call it anything other than developer oversight. Devs that implement that kind of shit and then have a sequence where you have to use a character that could have potentially gone unused are devs that didn't realize that party member preference varies from person to person and isn't the same for everyone. Hence, those kind of devs completely overlook / misunderstand the point of having a variable party composition in the first place. When a game has good design and introduces freedom of choice to pick between different members to make up your party, the player naturally, instinctually expects and understands that this is the devs giving him the ability to tailor the gameplay to their own personal preferences, and acts accordingly.

Fucking Symphonia

Go get em Colette!

Well, I'm sorry you're bad at video games, but nothing like that ever happened to me, even on higher difficulty levels.

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>party member rejoins you
>he's tens of levels behind the rest of your party
>he grinds by himself to catch up while the rest of the party sleeps

oops, thought I finished this post when I didn't. To add on after,
>When a game has good design and introduces freedom of choice to pick between different members to make up your party, the player naturally, instinctually expects and understands that this is the devs giving him the ability to tailor the gameplay to their own personal preferences, and acts accordingly.
When the game gives you this opportunity, and then turns around and goes
>well ACTUALLY we expected you to use THIS specific character because now you have to do a section entirely locked in as them or restart the game and play it OUR way
then what's the fucking point of having freedom in party of choice? That just adds a "gotcha" element to the game where the devs fuck you for using what you thought was a game mechanic because the devs are dump nips who don't understand what freedom is.

kek, here's your (you) user, you've earned it
that post legitimately made me laugh out loud, would love to see this in a game

>If a game hardlocks because the game requires you to use certain characters in a certain part of the game

I never claimed anything like that. The game expects you to make use of the characters in certain ways, but it's perfectly possible to clear every situation without them, thanks to the overpowered killsight system. It's just easier for the intended character types.

>bench party member and almost never use them
>they gain EXP
>there's a section later in the game where you're forced to use only that character
>They are still underpowered because they don't have any equipment, because you never use them.

You know what I hate the most
>Boss fight
>Party member contributes a fuck ton
>Party member gets unlucky and dies
>Boss dies next round
>Party member gets no exp
Literally why? Fuck this mechanic

>big bad is an evil wizard that's several hundred years old
>plot revolves around him having a "soul swap" spell that lets him trade bodies with someone else, allows him to skirt the limitations of aging and death and remain on an active evil rampage for centuries on end
>your main character and party are yet another one of the endless strings of parties over the ages that try to embark on a quest to stop him
>your character works their way up to becoming a wizard on the level of the big bad over the course of the plot
>final boss fight begins, you and your party are beating the absolute piss out of him
>big bad wizard realizes that he's not going to make his way out of this alive if he keeps fighting, casts a "swap soul" spell on your main character and switches places with him
>main character player view switches to the side of the big bad wizard, your main character's soul is in his body and the big bad wizard's soul is in your main character's body, you now control the big bad wizard
>the rest of your party hasn't realized what has happened
>main character with big bad wizard soul smirks at you and continues the fight, now with YOUR party of YOUR friends on his side who think you're the big bad wizard
>you decide fuck this, jump out the tower window and make your escape
>what you thought was going to be the final fight in the game ends up being the halfway point as you now assume the role of the big bad wizard's body with the main character's soul, having to hunt down the main character with big bad wizard's soul down in the world and kill him to put an end to this madness once and for all, except now you have the big bad wizard's powers and abilities (except for the soul swap since he takes it with him when he swaps) and minions at your disposal, except now the entire world is against you and you have to battle through legions of party adventurers and armies of good to reach the main character with big bad wizard's soul to kill him
why has no rpg done this yet?

A game did it was called Paper Mario The Thousand Year door.

Ah, nevermind, haven't played FF. I thought this was related to an earlier conversation in this thread about games that force you to use a specific character in a certain section alone regardless of that character's level or whether or not you've used them before in your party, essentially hardlocking it as that part becomes impossible. That's my bad user, wasn't sure how it worked in FF and jumped to conclusions that it was the same as games in the earlier convo

>Party member dies
>other party member carries their body while enemy attacks
>much harder to dodge enemy attacks while carrying party member and will probably die as a result
Goddamn Mario & Luigi series though it is pretty heartwarming

Not really, the plot of Thousand Year Door has no semblance to what I described at all outside of body possession.

Like it should be? They aren't fucking fighting.

>game can leave you at a dead end if you don't have multiple saves

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Your plot basically just describes the doopliss chapter

Chrono Cross

>X has like 10 different party members
>most of the cast is going to miss out hard on XP gain
>1 slot is always taken up by the protagonist
>usually forced to take the 2 same characters for almost every story missions
X did a lot of things I didn't particularly care for or like, but this pushed me over the edge. My leveling autism can't handle it

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I wouldn't really call it an honest fight. Ocean Palace Lavos is actually a shit ton stronger and has 3x HP and you still have to fight the other forms.

But its still an interesting way of handling it.

Bump

Fuckin Kain

>party members you bring to the final fight stay behind at a certain point
>you have to now switch to the Lower under powered members and continue

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>game has forced Battle using character that's severely under leveled
>last save point is in an area where grinding is impossible

>Only the party member who delivers the final blow receives experience

weak monsters give no XP and strong monsters give exponential amounts of XP

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>main character only area despite being already overleveled