Smash Ultimate is the most balanced Smash Game

I just played through all previous entries and I have concluded that Ultimate's play-style and presentation is the zenith of the entire 5 game franchise.
I do not see how someone could play melee religiously for 18 years, it is an eyesore and the elitism is cancerous. It was fun when I was like 7, now... not so much.
I mean FFS we got most of the meme characters included such as K. Rool, the online is superb, and the gameplay feels engaging, but contrarians will say otherwise.

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cool, nice discussion guys.

It really is impressively balanced, and anyone who says otherwise is biased. Might have to do with the fact that there was a separate balance team aside from Sakurai himself. He did okay before but it’s all clearly too much of an undertaking to be done by himself.

I wonder if the DLC chars will be high tier again. Bayo was clearly pushed before balancing could be done

As far as connection issues go online, that’s mostly due to people on Wi-Fi. The real problem is how their matchmaking system was set up. The input buffering needs to be brought back a bit too

By “brought back” I meant “reigned in”

If nintendo could stop being retarded about online and they fix the shitty battle arena system the online mp would be infinitely better

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Just don’t match me with a game mode other than in my preferred settings, FUCK!

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>close to getting elite with little mac
>matched with spammy young link
>items on
>stage is a moving one
>item spawn is high

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My only issue with the game (and this probably stems from me just sucking) is that you can have characters like Mario where your up+b is the only moves that will hit hard enough to eliminate enemies, so at some point in the high percentages I find its too easy for my moves to be read.

For some characters I dont have that problem at all, like Inkling, where every move is extremely useful in its own ways.

Wut? I’m genuinely confused by this comment. Mario’s smashes are all great (though his side smash range is a bit short). He’s also lucky enough to have a Forward Air that is also a meteor attack. In general his attacks are also fairly quick and safe to throw out.

To your specific point, don’t just go for kill attacks once they’re at a “kill percentage”. Keep fighting as usual and try to hit enemies with quicker attacks that can punish their mistakes. I see too many Mario’s, Fox’s, etc that only try to do UpSmashes once I hit 70% that it becomes extremely predictable and punishable

I see, you explained my issue with the second paragraph. I guess I just have a lot to learn about winning in this game.

Good! Yeah, it can be tempting to go for the really heavy hitting attacks, but unless you’re just fucking around and going for hype/stupid shit, just take advantage of whatever openings you see. If someone’s vulnerable for a light attack, go for it. If someone’s open for a smash even at 0%, I guess go for it?

Btw I can sometimes be bad in the other way, often taking the safer bet until they’re up to 130%+

Oh also, I really wouldn’t rely on his UpB for a kill move. It leaves him way open. Use smashes.

>we got the most meme characters included

Opinion disregarded. Was really into it looking for something of substance.

>use smashes

I think I may be misunderstanding this. What button combination would a smash for mario be? Are we talking about the light attack button + a directional?

Hard to make that call yet. There are so many characters that we’re far from discovering who’s got the most broken matchups.

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Not saying much.

It depends on your controls. It's either a directional + attack or just a tilt of the c-stick. They're the powerful moves that can be charged. I don't play Mario but i know enough that his specials are not for KOs. Like the other user said, use smashes. His up smash is really good. And off-stage his fair spikes people.

The online is trash. It seems relatively balanced but is also very young. As the game gets on in years certain characters will get phased out of the meta do to having losing match ups with really common characters. For example Wolf is very strong and is very popular. If your character is alright against some top tiers, but gets shit on by wolf your chances of success get limited by your encounter rate with skilled players using Wolf. Smash 4 was the most "balanced" smash game for a while too. It still had these problems. As for melee fans being melee fans most of them care way less about the characters and more about the functions. Melee still is the fastest smash game and people enjoy the difficulty of obtaining the highest levels of speed possible in that game. The depth of what it's movement system allows for combined with its stronger combo system is what keeps people coming back to it.

>Things that didn't happen

Bruh, this stopped after literally the first update.

>Jab
Press A alone
>Tilt
Hold the analog stick in a direction then press A
>Smash
From neutral, press the analog stick in a direction and press A at the same time. Can be charged to deal more damage and knockback

Pictured: side tilt

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Mario's Up B is literally not a kill move unless it's at the end of a ladder combo where the opponent is near the high blast zone ceiling already.

I have no clue what you're talking about.

Mario has quite a few kill moves. What he lacks is range and a reliable way to rack damage once the early bread and butter combos no longer work.

Pictured: side smash

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Doc's and Luigi's are though. Which I guess is a reasonable mistake if this dude is underage.

Quite honestly I think most people who complain about balance don't really know what they want. Balanced doesn't also automatically mean that is better too. A perfectly balanced game would be a homogeneous mush where everyone is the same.

Thank you, this should go a long way in helping me get better.

Honestly most people are some sort of unintelligent roster and/or waifu fag who just want instant gratification. These types care more about how they appear that how the game is playing out. Think basically everything involving K. Rool. Hated by casuals because he has low level cheese options, but also loved by meme lords because he is this weird sort of contrarian underdog type of character. If you go to the next step above that with sort of caring about competitive results, character results are the most obvious thing someone with no skills or knowledge can critic. Even for die hard players having zero character diversity is bad, but really once you get like 30 to 50 "common matchups true competitors stop caring.

How the fuck do you deal with Shulk's long ass range? I was trying Lucina's usual BS and he was like a sword version of Dhalsim.

>Smash ultimate
>Balanced

When broken trash like Stinkling exist as well as Pichu and Peach it's not very balanced.

None of these have won a major...Inkling's performance has actually been awful.

That's really because of all the top players just not picking him, as well as people getting by with their brawl and smash 4 experience on more familiar characters.

The game is balanced enough that if your top 10 skilled players just don't pick Inkling, you won't see any Inklings, even if they are top tier.

This has been the most balanced smash to date.

The top tiers really aren't that much higher than high or mid tiers.

Even low tiers can put in work.

Compare that to melee brawl or smash 4.

64 is objectively the most balanced on both the theoretical and material level. Every character can and has won tournaments

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I wouldn't really trust tiers for another few months.

Can't say I buy that if Inkling is as broken as you say. Bayo was broken in Smash 4 and she was everywhere to the point of the Evo Grand Finals of 2018 being a Bayo mirror.

Pikachu

It's still early in the meta, you fucking dotard. Tell me about it a year or two from know and you'll see. Most pros see Stinkling as broken. Leffen for example see it, Peach and Pichu in a tier of their own.

But for sure Stinkling is broken with that bitch ass dash animation, jab, recovery, ink mechanic and other bs.

I didn't say melee was broken. I'm not the guy you originally responded to, just disputed Inklings performance being "awful", which is really hasn't been. He shows up in a fuck ton of top 8's. He just doesn't the right player to give him top 1,2, or 3 like Wolf, Peach, Pichu, and Ike's have.

can and has been beaten by any character in a tournament environment. 64 doesn't have a matchup nearly as bad as peach vs mac in ultimate for example

*I didn't say inkling was broken

How come people want to ban pikachu then?

tiny roster, not a big accomplishment honestly

Anyone that says this has never played or even watched competitive 64. It's the 2nd worst balanced meta behind brawl easily.

After all the patches and work people did to hack Brawl to the point it was, is Project M actually that balanced?

from what I can tell, the tier list still mostly resembles normal brawl, but everyone is closer in balance to each other.

That is just going off tier lists though, I could be totally fucking wrong.

>preferences: free-for-all 3 stock, 7 minutes, all items and stages
>get matched in a fucking team stamina battle
>kill myself and leave the other fucker to get shredded alive

Project M is pretty balanced in the sense characters are all broken in their own way.

Games this casual don’t have a meta and never will.

Yikes

>using Leffen "Snake is bad, Falco is S tier" Hjelte as your source of competitive insight

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This
In a roster of 70+ characters, there's more likelihood that characters have tools that completely fuck the other, as Smash's newcomers become more & more commited to a form of uniqueness. The result of that are matchups like Little Mac vs Pac-Man. Pac-Man's Trampoline completely invalidates Mac by forcing a jump, a huge commitment for a character that's basically 100% grounded, as Mac. It puts Mac at an inherent disadvantage right off the bat. 64 doesn't have that.

Imagine insulting based Leffen

Sorry, your based Leffen can't even follow the script correctly. All he had to do was win 2 matches so he can face off Salem.

It's not only leffen, braindead Stinkling nigger. A lot of pros place Stinkling among the top 3 characters in this game.

It's a fucking busted character.

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>Stinkling

Holy shit, are you in fucking grade school?

Inkling, Pichu, and Peach aren't broken. They're just among the strongest characters. Ive been completely shut down by weaker characters in Ultimate so the meta is great. Hopefully dlc characters dont end up too op though.

Nigger, I don't even like Inkling.
>Top 3
Nigger what? Are you stuck pre 2.0? She's dropping, and dropping hard.
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Funnily enough I haven't been matched with any obnoxious ruleset faggots until quite recently and I've been playing since release. Last week I was matched against a laggy Snake with 2 stocks 3:00 minutes on fucking mushroomy kingdom and Just a couple of days ago I was matched against a Sonic with items on the Punch Out stage. I just turned my console off instead of attempting to bear with the absolute hell that was about to unfold.

>Mac
>Elite
Pick one

seething. cope harder.

Yet it does, despite some random faggot on Yea Forums claiming otherwise

but I have him in elite, he was one of the easiest ones

Imagine thinking Stinkling isn't broken. While lower tier characters can stand up to scrutiny at a certain point it doesn't detract just how broken it is.

For fuck sake it's hit box does almost all under during the dash animation. Excellent aerials, recovery, splatbomb for stage control, a fucking oppressive jab that inks, the ink mechanic that allows even greater damage and a roller that grounds forever. Shitters will say it can't kill but that's a goddamn lie. Shit is fucking broken.

>Palutena
>Greninja
>Pikachu

Yeah ok retard
t. Pac-Main

Baded

The melee part was bait. But i felt bad for the thread so i bumped xd

>the online if superb
why did anyone bump this dumb thread

>"the online is superb"
>be in elite with many characters, currently sitting around 4,100,000 roster gsp with my highest elite being a bit lower than that
>try ganondorf
>the only 6 rounds are, i shit you not, zelda snake snake zelda snake ness
>get camped out most of the rounds, win the 4 games i can stomach being a campy defensive bitch
>maybe i just picked wrong character at wrong time?
>play my link because he's not in elite yet
>r.o.b. fox fox fox wolf
>what the fuck, why am i getting counterpicked so often
>play some incineroar elite
>snake snake olimar duck hunt
>okay this HAS to be built into the game
>try inkling
>wolf wolf wolf
is there some counterpicking mechanism in this game against high gsp or do i just have some of the worst luck with matchmaking?

and out flies the buzzwords

He's right