This is one of the best 3D platformers of all time. Speed stages are pure kino...

Seek help

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>Sky Rail
>Bad
Zoom Zoom.

>implying all sonic fans are the same

You first

Unironically one of the best soundtracks in video games

Aged like absolute shit, sadly.

>All the others range from okay to great.
That's the problem though. I'd vastly prefer a game with 20-25 excellent Sonic/Shadow levels (on the level of White Jungle and Final Rush) rather than a game with 45+ levels, with about half or so that are mediocre/okay-ish. It makes replaying the game an absolute chore.
I don't think SA2 is a bad game, and I absolutely loved it when it came out. But it certainly missing a level of consistency (that Mario 64 has no problem maintaining) that keeps the game from being a 10 (or even an 8-9) in my opinion.

Sonic's pyramid level and Crazy Gadget were ten times worse

Treasure hunting is ruined because of the radar, and the mech levels are shittier versions of Gamma's levels from SA1.

Only 1/3rd of the game is worth playing.

>Sure, if you were a faggot and rage quited in the middle of the game

This has never happened to anybody, it's not like difficult whatsoever.

These games should have been all speed stages with multiple characters and different ways to complete the level with the unique abilities, ala the Genesis games, and they would have been masterpieces

but no they had to throw in treasure and shooting and all other manner of bullshit and ruined the games

yeah but, PLAYTIME IS OVER!!!

The tails and eggman missions are pure shit. That’s literally a third of the game that’s shit. Even if the other sections were assumed to be good (they’re decent at best), that’s still a massive problem.

>playing as a fat Mexican man who jumps
or
>a cool dude who don't give no fucks

>This is one of the best 3D platformers of all time.
>What is Rayman 2/3, Mario Sunshine (when not collecting for 100%) and Banjo Tootie.

You need to play more games than Sonic ones, OP. Get some standards.

Not him but it unironically is. Mario 64 is stiff as fuck and the constant frame rate drops doesn't make it any better.

Treasure Hunting stages are easy as fuck. Only Zoomershits can't beat them

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Agreed, all three gameplay styles are great sadly Nu-males and zoomers will seethe for eternity because they were programmed to think they are shit.

>Easy = good
Ok, fuck this shit. There's people in this fagbase that cries Mania was too easy and that's bad, only for SA2fags to cry shit like Big and Gamma is "easy" so it's good. How can it be both? If challenge is what makes a game good, how can it be easy good? Or how can it be the other way around?

Simple, difficulty is not the reason people hate non Sonic/Shadow levels. They just suck in a series about going fast, it's just what people expect out of the series, there's nothing you can do. If the emeralds just stayed like in SA1 with level design no bigger than Pumpkin Hill, it wouldn't be hated on at all.

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Literally only a third of the game is consistently fun to play. The emerald hunt stages are decent at best and are implemented worse than in SA1. The mech stages are mostly straight up slow garbage with zero depth other than "shoot shit" and the dark story is fucking plagued with them. At least the Gamma levels in SA1 were relatively fast paced despite being so easy.

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>emerald spawns at the very top of the level

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It's not even better than SA1, and that's a low fucking bar

It literally takes 5 seconds to get to the top of the level what is your point?

>Banjo Tooie
But Kazooie is better

I prefer 2, but even 1 is a good example either way.

It's okay, SA1 has better Sonic stages though. Not that big a fan of the hallways. Final Rush is really the only level that felt open enough for a Sonic level to me and it's a bunch of grind rails over a bottomless pit which is kinda lame.
As a full package though I struggle to think of a 3D platformer packed with nearly as much content.

Bullshit. And also, high sight is not an argument, first time is shit, times afterwards just reveal how tedious it is in the first place.

The only good TH level is horizontal ones. You literally don't have any powers of your own to go up fast, just forwards and downward fast, it's quite the oversight in moveset potential.

>Bullshit. And also, high sight is not an argument, first time is shit, times afterwards just reveal how tedious it is in the first place.
There is literally a spring at the bottom of the level that bounces you to the top of the level. Its in plain sight and I found it easily on my first playthrough sorry you are a brainlet user.

Literal Brainlet user. Are you near-sighted?

3D Sonic fans are eternally zoomers no matter how old the games get.

You do realize the top of the level is the secret area only accessable with a arm lift, which takes 3 secs at best to take you up to the real top of the level, plus 2 seconds for the spring itself.
It's 5 secs if you somehow warp from both spring and arm lift at the same time, which is impossbile without cheating. So you're bullshit, the travel time between both of those objects doesn't eqate to 5 secs to get to the top.

And that's also implying you KNOW the emerald is at the fucking top, which the game doesn't tell you so why would you take that route unless you took a hint monitor, which means that's MORE time wasted to say it takes 5 secs to get to the top of the level. So, yes, you're fucking bullshit.

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t. someone that was born after the dreamcast died

I played SA1 on the Dreamcast back when they released. But I'm a zoomer according to you.

This. They aren't real Sonic fans based on Sonic's original image.

Sorry user it takes 10 seconds to get to the top does that help your autism?. Still the point is you have plenty of time to beat the stage and even get the A rank. You can travel around the entire level in 40 seconds max to check for emeralds.

The level is chokefull of rockets and springs to propel you upwards, you're either an idiot or you're lying.

3Dfags wouldn't exist when all the 2D games, even the Modern Sonic ones, are better, making you zoomers. And yes, ZOOMERS are 1996+fags, millennials aren't boomers fucking retards.

>Still takes more time than 5 secs
plus it's tedious and doesn't fell fun no matter how you defend it.

>And yes, ZOOMERS are 1996+fags
I don't think you understand how time works underage. People that played the adventure games on dreamcast were born in the 80s people born 1996+ would play garbage like Heroes and boostshit.

>plus it's tedious and doesn't fell fun no matter how you defend it.
I think Rogue and Knuckles have great and fun movement when mastered so no I will defend it.

I was born in 1982. I played both the 2D and 3D games. Your point?

Nope. There is ONE SINGLE handle that pulls you to the upper level.
Perhaps you played it once and all emeralds spawned downstairs.

>People that played the adventure games on dreamcast were born in the 80s people born
Lies, I was born in 93 and played the classics and prefer them, zoomer. Imo saying you're 30+ defending SA2 is laughable, at least SA1 is thanks to pure nostalgia for that "soulful" Satarn/Dreamcast SEGA era, not because it was actually good like the Classics.

>Rogue
False flag detected.

>I-If you like the Adventures you're a Z-zoomer
>D-Defending SA1/SA2 Y-you're too old to defend t-them
Any real points?

>My family was poor and couldn't buy me a dreamcast so everyone that played them has to be a zoomer
Nice cope
> Imo saying you're 30+ defending SA2 is laughable, at least SA1 is thanks to pure nostalgia for that "soulful" Satarn/Dreamcast SEGA era, not because it was actually good like the Classics.
You seem to really fit in with these zoomers you hate some much. Sorry I don't subscribe to your groupthink circle jerk.

>Rogue
Rouge* sorry

Rouge's Stages are easier than Knuckles'

Mad space sez hello

>>My family was poor and couldn't buy me a dreamcast so everyone that played them has to be a zoomer
Nah, it means you're blinded by Nostalgia. I might not have owned a DC, but I still played SA1 like twice and while it was fun at the time, SA2 is basically SA1 just edgier, with all of the problems of SA1 still there. If I can see the flaws of SA2 at this point and critique against it as such, same goes for SA1 and the only reason to praise it as " the best thing" is pure nostalgia bias. And basically, if you liked the classics because of its gameplay, Modern Sonic of any kind outside of the Advance games I mentioned, should be "the best" Sonic game to you.

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This

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>If I can see the flaws of SA2 at this point and critique against it as such, same goes for SA1 and the only reason to praise it as " the best thing"
Dunno where you got i think they are the best thing ever. My favorite sonic game is 3&K, I just think Sa1 and 2 were great games for there time and are still good to this day.

*shouldn't be

Do we even get 20 levels now between all the characters? I know one reason they cited they don't do more speed levels is because of how short they are vs. the amount of work it takes.

Mad Space is easy you literal brainlet.
>Durr how do I get out of the atmosphere

Original had way better theme songs though
youtube.com/watch?v=NDpZ9Qg761I

Did anyone managed to get a chris chan necklace when he sold them back in the day?
That would be a real piece of Yea Forums history.

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The american classic sonic design was a mistake

I agree with you for Sonic's theme But E.G.G.M.A.N, Fly in the Freedom, Unknown From M.E. 2 and Throw it All Away are quite good as well.

If it wasn't for that design, we wouldn't have Sonic's classic/modern design at all zoomer. We'd have Mr.NeedleMouse instead.

look, the game is fun and I liked it a lot as a kid

but to compare it to mario 64 mechanically is retarded

hell yea

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>If it wasn't for that design, we wouldn't have Sonic's classic/modern design at all zoomer.
The fuck are you talking about that design of sonic was forgotten and for good reason. Right now both of the designs we have are from japan

I've spent a lot of time with both Adventure games, especially the first one. I think they're both mostly shit. The Sonic and Shadow levels are the best by some distance but even they leave a lot to be desired.

The villain themes were fine, no idea why they felt the need to ruin all of the hero themes with garbage remixes instead of just carrying them over.

Not the point, I mean that design was the redesign of Mr.NeedleMouse, and the currently used Sonic designs are the repolished designs of the American redesign.

Basically it goes Mr.NeedleMouse - Americanied Sonic - Japanese paint over Sonic (which is superior mind you) - Adventure Sonic - Modern Sonic.

Perfect Chaos in SA1 is one of the best final bosses in any game.

>Battle
>Boomer
Fuck off underage.

I miss the Dreamcast aesthetic.

>This is one of the best 3D platformers of all time
Yeah, I played it when I was 13 too, its still mediocre at best

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>Not the point, I mean that design was the redesign of Mr.NeedleMouse, and the currently used Sonic designs are the repolished designs of the American redesign.
Completely untrue. That was a redesign of the finished japanese design because they didn't think the japanese version was ""cool"" enough.

>pyramid level
learn to spindash jump through the door. bait the ghost away, stand on the cross, charge a spindash point yourself at the door seam and perform a spindash jump. you are an adult man. you can handle it.

False again
youtu.be/f-ij_RcEzcI?t=443

Yea Forums bought the sonic totem.

Okay you got me never knew that and I've been a fan since the first game. Thanks for the info user I guess.

I mean lets be honest, as bad you wanna say Sonic Adventure is, most of the same shitty arguments can be used for SM64. People tend have this hate boner for Sonic when plenty of games that came out at the time were either just as bad or even WORSE!

This, SM64 is a great game but it has also aged a shit ton. People don't like bringing that up though the sonic hate boner is really annoying nowadays.

I could do it when I was 14, doesn't make it any less shitty of a level.

NP. Actually, that video actively reveals exactly why Sonic as an IP collectively "died" once 06 happened. The fighting over which Sonic was "the" Sonic, all the way to the death of the DC, which began a brand new look on Sonic, which is heavily Japanese styled, really does reveal what the Modern Sonic series meant to Yuji and the rest of the Japanese staff. It all makes sense now, Modern Sonic was a redesign for the series to regain their original Japanese vision, and since most Americans don't like the Adventure era as much as the classic era, it really make sense now. My only question is, did the Japan audience like SA1/2 more as a result? Or was Sonic still just a mascot to them?

While this true, I don’t really think it’s fair to compare Mario 64 and SA2 if you consider they came out 5 years apart. SA2 and Super Mario Sunshine are much more each other’s contemporaries, and Sunshine blows sonic out of the fucking water (and holds up pretty well today).

>SA2 and Super Mario Sunshine are much more each other’s contemporaries, and Sunshine blows sonic out of the fucking water
Debatable, I fucking love sunshine its still my favorite mario to this day but it was really fucking buggy. The slopes were completely fucked you randomly fall through floors especially on moving objects and it has a shit ton of filler and reused missions.

>most of the same shitty arguments can be used for SM64.
Not really. SM64 has problems with its camera and it isn't the prettiest game to look at, but it isn't bloated from awful/mediocre alternate game play styles or an overly dull hub. It also doesn't mistakenly place emphasis on a story that doesn't deserve the attention, and its level design and control are satisfying on multiple fronts. Most Sonic/Shadow stages -- which are the best moments the games have to offer -- frequently suffer from being setpieces and uninteresting hallways held together with the game equivalent of Elmer's glue. SA1's Sonic levels fare better than SA2's since they tend to involve less mindless GOTTA GO FAST and more platforming, but it's still rarely as engaging as SM64's levels.

I don’t really think bugginess is a solid measurement of how well the game holds up. Besides, I think many of SA2’s problems go far beyond mere bugs and are indicative of poor development decisions. Many of the game’s systems work exactly as intended and are still overly cumbersome (the game’s camera being the most glaring example).

>Many of the game’s systems work exactly as intended and are still overly cumbersome
Besides the camera can you tell me what systems don't work as intended? just curious.
>I don’t really think bugginess is a solid measurement of how well the game holds up
I agree but i'm someone that finds all the gameplay styles in Sa2 fun

I would say it's debatable too, but Sunshine as a whole still is objetively better on the grounds it feels like a consitant game with an objectively consistent way to play. If I hate Tails and Eggman, there goes 1/3 of the game. If I kinda like Knux but nearly loath Rouge, that's now 2.5/6 of the game that's acceptable. And when you consider Shadow is basically reskinned Sonic, because the levels was actually made for Sonic before they forced Shadow as playable after the Tails debacle, this means only Sonic and half of Knuckles is enjoyable... Meanwhile only thing I hate about Sunshine after playing it for the first time last year is the pachinko level and the poison leaf level. And the piantas . Fuck them.

SMS Doesn't blow SA2 out of the water, but I think it's overall a better game. Anything more would be you liking Sonic over Mario because you like edgy/action tryhard characters over basis, self insertion MC Nintendo has millions of.

IM A CHUCKSTER

youtube.com/watch?v=8jv7qv4wCUk
Good taste my man right here.

I enjoyed sonic adventure 2 man but come on. It was clunky as fuck.

>It was clunky as fuck.
Polish does not always equal a better game.
Odyssey is the most polished 3D Mario ever but I wouldn't call it the best 3D Mario.

Fuck off with your youtube channel.

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Fuck you Rouge Squadron is great

Two that come to mind are the weapons systems in Tails/Eggman’s levels (it’s a bit mindless. Gamma’s levels in SA1 also utilized an auto-aim system but that managed to feel a bit more dynamic/fun). Another is momentum. I’m not sure what the solution for this is but it’s a problem when making a 90 degree turn brings you to a complete stop at full speed.
Then there are other problems like the treasure levels’ radar being overly simplified and the over reliance on homing attack/grinding/gameplay limiting set pieces. If you like these, then I’m sure you’ll see nothing wrong with them. But for me they all cause the gameplay to feel a bit stale and become monotonous/chore-like on multiple playthroughs.
So again, not really a matter of bugginess. Just, in my mind, questionable development decisions.
Obligatory, I loved all of this when it came out. But I find it less appealing at 30 than I did at 11-12 after chewing on the gameplay all this time.

You're forgetting Meteor Herd fag

So is it just me or is this a side mouth in a game that can have perfectly fine frontal mouths at the same time?

...So why does the Boost era games looks so stiff and shit now? I mean, if it wasn't for the lanky designs, this actively looks better than all the Modern Sonic games animation wise. So why aren't they like this anymore? Who animated for Riders?

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>Another is momentum. I’m not sure what the solution for this is but it’s a problem when making a 90 degree turn brings you to a complete stop at full speed.
This doesn't actually happen or maybe you worded it wrong dunno.
All the other things I can see where you are coming from, but I would rather playthrough the mech stages in Sa2 anyday over doing the 20 red coin missions in Sunshine or the annoying secret shines. But its just a preference thing I guess.

Polish and Janky aren't things that make a game better user. Neither matter if the gameplay is fun in the first place and exciting and freedom enducing controls. Mario has this, Sonic, or mostso, Eggman/Tails, not so much.

>Eggman/Tails, not so much.
Untrue the Mechs have a huge amount of momentum that when mastered allow you to move pretty fast, that paired with the hover makes the movement pretty fun imo