So let me get this straight: this bitch with mommy issues spends centuries ruining people's lives, all because of a curse he brought upon himself, and all it took to stop him was a slap from his mom, who appeared at the last minute out of nowhere? Holy mother of shit writing. Fuck this manga.
Non-canon. Only the old anime adaptation is canon.
So let me get this straight, this guy is the best character?
it's canon, he nearly came when his mom showed up
Nope, didn't happen in the original story.
He fought his brother in a manly clash and that'a how it ended. Manga's axed rushed ending and nu anime DO NOT COUNT.
He's still obsessed with a cunt that is all but a clone of his mom. His other half and reincarnation ends up marrying her, so yeah.
it was cute, nu anime is pretty rushed it looked better in the manga
You ignoring the fact that he jobs to a literal jew pyramid with invisible lizardmen soldiers
>it looked better in the manga
it looked like an asspull
so what? he still became the shaman king
why do you hate your mom so much user?
>He still became the Shaman King
And is literally going to get disqualified and never get to use any of his powers for real because he's jobbed to a jew who only cares about money
well, of course no one is gonna get behind his platform of 'destroy every single living being on the planet'.
if anything YVS is doing the planet a favour, then again, he shouldnt be such a dick about it by trying to ruin the Taos, killing the patch tribe and murdering Jeanne.
> taking takei's powerlevel wanks seriously
didn't tamao reach god level recently?
How is Yoh even considered the main character?
>Doesn't become the Shaman King
>Isn't even the strongest among his group of friends
>Wasn't even the one to convince Hao
>Fails to make a difference in the world and is nothing but a blip in history
>Barely develops as a character and influences few characters that are important to the plot
He doesn't feel any more important than Ren or Horo.
>He doesn't feel any more important than Ren or Horo
Now name five other MCs that manage that. Yog is a pretty unique MC.
>Now name five other MCs that manage that.
Not him but literally any other shonen MC. Yoh is definitely unique but originality alone doesn't make a good character.
The sequels are such a fucking mess from what I've seen. Hats down to anyone that kept reading after that god awful ending.
read Red Crimson.
I don't know, Shaman King is for some reason some kind of obscure manga and there's nowhere you can read the sequels and spin offs without reading moon runes.
Shaman King has the basis to be a classic anime... in fact, it IS a classic anime Shonen...
But it's mostly due to a great start, I'd be dammed to remember anything past the middle point except for the X-Law fight and the Babylon spirit that shit was kino
It's such a waste.
Reminds me a bit of Zatch Bell too, though that one is much better. But they both deserved better, could have been the new generation of great battle shonen.
What would their conversations be about?
Killed Ren's wife so an ugly seething femcel can have her as a spirit ally to use against Ren's son
At least from the old anime I remember Yoh absolutely mogging the others in power, at some point I think he makes his sword smaller and just dabs on Ren who is still using the gigantic Oversoul and it's made clear that Yoh is easily the best. Reminded me of Goku just teasing Vegeta with his mastered super saiyan during the Cell saga
I think is nice that the MC is part of the effort but not the one delivering the finishing blow. It humbles the character and the expectation that he must be better than his buddies. They're all all truly balanced and awesome in different ways that matter for the whole.
Shaman King was better back when there is none of this tournament bullshit, fite me.
I absolutely hate when authors have to make a bunch of spinoffs containing vital information that should have been included in the main storyline. It makes a chore having to read side material to understand what's going on in the main story when it should have been included there in the first place.
Unironically this. Yoh was so much better back then
> We have to help humans, and treat the death with respect. Come, Manta, let's help these lost souls.
The after the tournament was like "please Hao-sama fuck my girlfriend"
Me watching the Persona 4 Anime.
Had to go watch the Persona 4 Golden anime episode 6 because it contains the fucking backstory of the main villain. Like, the original anime / game just throws you into the final battle without explaining much about the fucking serial killer you've been hunting for 100 hours.
Happens a bunch in other series too, it's awkward.
>It humbles the character and the expectation that he must be better than his buddies.
But that's literally the point of being the protagonist. Imagine if instead of Ed, Winry defeats Father with some asspull bullshit. Or if Tanjiro didn't beat the shit out of Muzan, but Inosuke did. Then what's the point of being the main character?
>Or if Tanjiro didn't beat the shit out of Muzan
Killing Muzan was team effort. They even had minor characters drive cars into him.
Why does he wear LEGO gloves and boots?
I don't think shaman king was very good in general, but this is an unacceptable opinion here. I still kinda liked the ending
the pain makes him forget he got buttfucked by a priest at one point
Dude I fucking wish this happened more often. Not him but I'm tired of that mentality, I just watched SAINT SEIYA and I fucking tell you you'd think the same after watching it, it's got the worst Main Character syndrome in the entire history of anime.
His other 4 comrades are both more interesting AND stronger than Seiya, many times it seems the most appropriate that the win against the main baddie should go to themselves, they also usually have philosophical clashes with the villain and it seems like it's their turn to win BUT NO they'll end up trashed in the ground saying
So he asspulls a win.
Dragon Ball Z, the quintessential Shonen anime, doesn't really give Goku any victories beyond Frieza and even that one was THE team effort of the century, same as his big fight with Vegeta or Raditz.
DBZ is better than 99% of series actually at handling protagonism.
Everyone remembers Goku as overpowered but he either wins with titanic team efforts, or outright lets someone else take the mantle.
Gohan and Goten & Trunks had surpassed him in the Buu saga, he just got to "beat" a nerfed version of the main villain (and it was again the entire world's effort)
It would have been a fine ending if not for O MY MOM. Very little foreshadowing or requirement for her to show up.
>user hates MC's that win by themselves
Good evening, do you have a minute to talk about World Trigger?
I think Dragon Ball in general gets a pass whenever other shonen wouldn't because the bar for it it's incredibly low right now. It's so old, so many things have happened, that nobody gives a shit whether something stupid happens for the sake of the plot.
A protagonist doesn't have to do everything. It's OK to fight in a team and to have friends that can back you up. Shaman king for all its flaws did a good job at keeping the focus on a tight group instead of either focusing purely on two characters and shitting on the rest, or spreading it out too much and shitting on everyone
Yoh was the spiritual core of the group. He was the one that was always level headed and did their best to look after the others. He's the reason Ren started to chill out, he helped Lyserg chill out after he went full deus vult. He helped Choco deal with the Golem, Ryu and Faust both owe him a lot, especially Faust through his relationship with Anna. Sometimes the main character doesn't have to shoot the biggest energy blast.
goku mostly gets shit on for being insane at least in regards to fightfagging. Stuff like Piccolo having to tell him that he didn't know shit about his own son is pretty much his lowpoint
The MC eating the main antagonist by himself has never been a problem. The problem arises when the MC is consistently leagues more powerful than the entire rest of the cast and the side characters never get a chance to shine and are not allowed to have any major plot relevant victories.
I remember quitting SK before the tournament and later picked it back up, and I was wondering if I'm reading the same manga.
Yoh pretty much stopped being the MC after the shaman fight started.
We switch to Ren, Ice Pedo and everyone else's POV passed that point and Yoh became like that guy in the team that is plot relevant but rarely is the main focus.
Yeah but, I'm at the point of going full circle, there's actually tons of genius in there. Like I said victories are usually earned by everyone, and other characters get enough time to shine with Goku away / dead.
But Yoh also has main character syndrome? We're supposed to think Hao deserves forgiveness because Yoh thinks so. The whole decision to forgive Hao revolves around Yoh preaching his philosophy and convincing other characters to forgive him. The whole cast bends backwards to do it like they all suddenly became a hivemind. It's like only his thoughts on the matter are important, fuck the rest of characters that had their lives ruined by him.
I never said a protagonist shouldn't need help from other characters. It's just Yoh in particular falls behind everyone, to the point he's mediocre. To make it worse, the narrative outright says he could be the strongest, but decides just not to. He feels like a background character when he's supposed to be the main character.
This sounds reasonable. One of Dragon Ball's best qualities is that it has room for the side cast to do cool or relevant stuff. Krilin is a fan favorite for a reason. A good adventure let's the whole main cast to take part in it and show what they're made of. I'm not into One Piece but from a distance I can see why it's so popular as the entire crew seems to have their place and their moments to shine through the arcs. Fullmetal Alchemist had the Elric Brothers that had a pretty OP ability but that didn't made them instantly better than everyone else and many other characters took center stage while it also allowed the Elrics to truly show their smarts, resourcefulness and bravery to go through challenges bigger than themselves.
Anyone find it funny that even in a manga revolving around human spiritualism, and Animism they still had aliens be the root cause for everything?
This thread is just a circlejerk trying to act intellectual but misunderstands the content, the demographics or even what the point is of the story.
Not him user, but it feels weird that you're arguing that Yoh has main character syndrome, but is also mediocre. Look at it another way, this is Shaman King, not Pokemon. The goal of a Shaman as it's first told to us isn't to have the biggest number, it's to be a medium, a bonding point between the living and the spiritual world and a bonding point between people. That is where Yoh excels. He wasn't the strongest person, but he was the only person who never gave up on anyone or wrote them off and always tried to have hope that things could work out.
I find it funny that a manga that has such a misanthropic message has been stretched ad infinitum because it's the author's only successful series.
One isn't exclusive of the other. Main character syndrome is an example of bad writing, as is your main character being overshadowed by literally everyone else in the cast.
>this is Shaman King, not Pokemon. The goal of a Shaman as it's first told to us isn't to have the biggest number, it's to be a medium, a bonding point between the living and the spiritual world and a bonding point between people.
Yes, this message was perfectly conveyed in the tournament arc with confusing power levels, repeated resurrections to power up, and spirits being switched around because of said power levels.
funny you talk about demographics when shaman king was axed due to low ratings
It's shounen, certain tropes are to be expected, but the whole forgiveness arc with Choco, deradicalizing Lyserg, rescuing and mellowing out Ren and Ryu, any of that ringing a bell?
None of that really changes that the main focus for a long time has been the fights and power levels. In fact, superstar is even worse since it actually treats spirits like pokemons. Saying that shamans are meant to help the dead and yadda yadda, it applies to early Shaman King, which was miles better than what we got later on. Nu Shaman King is mostly powerlevels and aliens.
The most annoying thing about ending with mommy issues isn't the mom angle, it's Anna. Takei's waifu is Anna and he crams her in every single series as someone super special. It makes the ending come across not as Hao losing, but the author trying desperately to make everyone love Anna as much as he does.
>None of that really changes that the main focus for a long time has been the fights and power levels.
It was never just fights and power levels though. Like fuck take the first fight Yoh and his team have in the tournament. They have the power to crush their opponent in an instant, but instead of just wrecking them they demonstrate everything they can do, but encourage the Ice fuckers to fight them anyway. It wasn't just to show off, it was because Yoh understood that they would never be satisfied if they came this far, but just gave up. Ren's team first fight is won by Chocolove being a fucking goofball and making his opponents laugh. The core themes are still present throughout the fights, it's not like we were just looking at grunting and beam struggles.
Wait didn't X Laws just gang up on Hao's team before he gave them that second power up? Jeanne alone would have floored them all and then all that was left was asking Azazel guy to join them again to BTFO Hao when he was on his own before getting the GS, or better yet they could've joined forces with Ghandara for a even bigger curbstomp. Yoh's team wouldn't been needed at all.