Admit it, he ruined the fantasy genre

Admit it, he ruined the fantasy genre.

Attached: hack.jpg (1200x1200, 74.89K)

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=RRVIVJjuaHE
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

H-Howard sama...I kneeru...

I thought the same as you, until I started reading Modern fantasy and realize that Tolkien was the pinnacle and which no one can surpass. Especially now with fantasy authors making self-inserts of themselves.

Attached: Bakker’s self-insert.jpg (700x1418, 362.19K)

>Admit it, he ruined the fantasy genre.
God, no. If anything, Tolkien is the father of Fantasy for a reason. Compare his works to all the others and you can see why he's so revered. Just taking a look at modern fantasy and you can't convince me that this isn't the worst introduction to a fantasy world ever.

"One cannot raise walls against what has been forgotten.
The citadel of Ishuäl succumbed during the height of the Apocalypse. But no army of inhuman Sranc had scaled its ramparts. No furnace-hearted dragon had pulled down its mighty gates. Ishuäl was the secret refuge of the Kûniüric High Kings, and no one, not even the No-God, could besiege a secret.
Months earlier, Anasûrimbor Ganrelka II, High King of Kûniüri, had fled to Ishuäl with the remnants of his household. From the walls, his sentries stared pensively across the dark forests below, their thoughts stricken by memories of burning cities and wailing multitudes. When the wind moaned, they gripped Ishuäl’s uncaring stone, reminded of Sranc horns. They traded breathless reassurances. Had they not eluded their pursuers? Were not the walls of Ishuäl strong? Where else might a man survive the end of the world?
The plague claimed the High King first, as was perhaps fitting: Ganrelka had only wept at Ishuäl, raged the way only an Emperor of nothing could rage. The following night the members of his household carried his bier down into the forests. They glimpsed the eyes of wolves reflected in the light of his pyre. They sang no dirges, intoned only a few numb prayers.
Before the morning winds could sweep his ashes skyward, the plague had struck two others: Ganrelka’s concubine and her daughter. As though pursuing his bloodline to its thinnest tincture, it assailed more and more members of his household. The sentries upon the walls became fewer, and though they still watched the mountainous horizon, they saw little. The cries of the dying crowded their thoughts with too much horror.
Soon even the sentries were no more. The five Knights of Trysë who’d rescued Ganrelka after the catastrophe on the Fields of Eleneöt lay motionless in their beds. The Grand Vizier, his golden robes stained bloody by his bowel, lay sprawled across his sorcerous texts. Ganrelka’s uncle, who’d led the heartbreaking assault on Golgotterath’s gates in the early days of the Apocalypse, hung from a rope in his chambers, slowly twisting in a draft. The Queen stared endlessly across festering sheets."

It wasn't his fault though

same one excerpt LULE

Yeah he ruined fantasy even though LOTR is good by spawning garbage like that

He did but not because of lack of quality, he did because his style traveled like an all-devouring infection which took over the style of the majority of fantasy writers, he is the king of their style and originator, I prefer the older style of which he was a member, which required studied of folk tale, fairy tale, religion and often decadent art and even language itself, the imaginations of the old fantasists was born from many cultures and traditions, the imagination of the modern fantasist is by majority a child of Tolkien or an incestual grandchild of tolkiens, maybe with some shades of Robert e Howard-moorcock or lovecraft thrown into depending.

Imo dunsany is far and away the best fantasy writer if we don’t consider the extent of fantasy, if we use the traditional conception of it, the “fairy way of writing “ in which the fantastical and religious and mythic are used, it’s a debate where Dante, Virgil, Ovid, Shakespeare and Spenser tower as titans above all else.

The fact the likes of eta Hoffman, Jean paul richter and, to some degree, Lewis caroll don’t come up when the topic is fantasy literature, shows just how much Tolkien gobbled up the genre, and transformed formed it into a mythic form of writing into incestual replicants fixated on world building.

I don’t even dislike worldbuilding, I just find it nonsense when someone tries to worldbuild, who doesn’t have an appreciation for this world’s cultures and beauties first, which will always result in their worlds being strictly inferior worlds.

He didn't. Not his fault hacks can't be original in their works.

nah

this.

Tolkien's work is the GOAT because he was an Oxford leading scholar on ancient and medieval myth, being the go-to translation on Beowulf until Heaney (and I still prefer Tolkien). He appreciated history and myth. He helped write the Oxford English Dictionary. He was a bloodied infantry officer in the First World War. He was a devout Catholic.
Tolkien's fantasy was absolutely a product of his entire being, a very real but very mystical being.
How can some fat nerd compete?

Attached: ithilien rangers.jpg (720x1601, 146.46K)

He started the fantasy genre.

Nah he didn’t, as it exists now he did, but there’s plenty of authors who wrote fantasy and even fantasy worlds prior to him. E. R. Eddison and Dunsany are both high fantasy pre Tolkien, the first is even pretty systematic. And these Again aren’t the first, and it’s not like that style of writing was invented by him either, whether we go to people like John Mandeville who effectively re-imagine how eastern cultures operate, or reformulate a singular county into a fantasy of theirs like Anthony Trollope.

But again, Tolkien is big for his autistic systemization and standardization mixed with his talent, I do not think him the greatest fantasist but he is undoubtably the father of the fantasy-world-building.

No, it was millennials.
Who made fantasy a cash cosws for corporations after the succes of the LoRT? And who decided tto mindlessly consume the crappy works corporations spawned? And who calls you a chud and schizo for not liking the lastest fantasy shit inspired by definitively not Rowling starring a purple haired latinx that speaks with ebonics?
Millennials. They are to blame for every woke trend that has managed to make rich men even more richer.

>genre
>>not ruined be default

To blame Tolkien, Howard, Moorcock or Lewis for the sins of later fantasy authors is downright stupid. You want to know who really ruined the fantasy genre? Philip Pullman. Pullman's His Dark Materials caused the rise of soulless bullshit we have now

He ruined it by inventing it.

He began and ended High Fantasy and adapted classic sagas in a way that resonated with millions of people. One of the most important authors of the 20th Century, his works will be remembered longer than those of a lot of other big 20th Century names.

I'm sad I'll never be as soulful as him. To gain even quarter of it would be amazing.

In what way, lol?

Admit it. You ruin Yea Forums with this low effort bait thread.

nope, he invented the genre. Its exists now because he invented it.

The guy brought class to the fantasy genre which is lacking in many midwit modern fantasy writers.

Tolkien did not invent the fantasy genre. Fantasy was a genre already established long before tolkien put pen to paper. If we discount gothic fiction then even then we have authors in the british isles such as George MacDonald, E.R Eddison, William Morris, H Rider Haggard and Lord Dunsany who were writing far better material when what tolkien would ever manage to put to paper. Across the pond you had authors such as Lovecraft, Robert E Howard and Clark Ashton Smith who were making waves in the pulps. Tolkien wasn't even that popular until the mid eighties and early nineties when epic fantasy suddenly grew in popularity and eclipsed the novel which at that time had been home to sword and sorcery.
How did this hack author with his work which is HEAVILY influenced by Wagner, Eddison and Morris suddenly grow so popular while pre tolkien authors are basically reduced to a state of utter obscurity?

Attached: clad-warlike-gear.jpg (500x683, 111.45K)

Fantasy genre... it was nothing before him.

wrong

You are absolutely retarded. It was extremely popular in the 60s and 70s

If tolkein wrote the exact same stuff he wrote from 1920-1960 today, in 2020 it would be an absolute cringe fest
If you wrote about people smoting hosts of others today, you're a faggot. Absolute pretentious piece of shit
but you aren't if you write that and you're tolkein

As were elric, conan and countless others but (((tolkienites))) ignore those and subvert them

If you're over 18, why would you read this? It has no value whatsoever. Every fantasy writer is a failed writer, one that wasnt able to write proper adult writing. Dont be a manchild. Peace faggots.

No, Tolkien invented it. Before him all fantasy was connected to the real world usually Christian.
Tolkien invented the idea of a completely other fantasy world.
>How did this hack author with his work which is HEAVILY influenced by Wagner
You are an idiot. Repeating the baseless attacks by a Swedish translator of LoTR that had some sort of issue with Tolkien.
Tolkien didn't copy wagner. He had access to the texts that Wagner based his work on.

>brackets
Complete imbecilic /pol/tard. Tolkien was reportedly a fan of Conan.

Blah blah, fantasy is shit. Inventing shit is shitty. Tolkien? More like Tolkshit.

I'm out.

thanks for conceding.

>smoting

What causes Yea Forums retards to be in a constant seethe over tolkien?

He's basically one the giants of literature and he will be remembered for centuries and I'm 100% sure he will join the western canon at some point.

HE'S THE ONE TO INVENT FANTASY.
His literary influence over one of the biggest literary genres now in terms of books sold can't be denied.

HE'S THE ONE.
Everyone after him tries to debunk him or just try to rip off him.

He's to fantasy what Asimoc, and wells and verne is to sci fi.

Why not make a porn thread instead of talking shit about tolkien on lit?

Attached: 1596597614047.jpg (652x574, 115.28K)

Literally because he's popular and Yea Forums reads for social capital and one-upsmanship if they even bother at all.

>What causes Yea Forums retards to be in a constant seethe over tolkien?
Because Tolkien is a genre writer who is accepted to be literature.

probably hiberno-cabalists. They are always secretly attacking Anglo-saxon writers like Tolkien and Rowling.

Yea Forums is full of people who hate beauty.

Attached: high_king_gil_galad_by_artigas_debkix0-fullview.jpg (1280x1971, 472.26K)

>genreshit
>leetratche
heh

Yea Forums is full of pretentious assholes who think they’re clever but are at best, Reddit-tier intelligence

Calling Tolkien a fantasy author is an insult to Tolkien. Fantasy is juvenile trash.

>What causes Yea Forums retards to be in a constant seethe over tolkien?
Mostly anglophobic chuds who can't handle the fact that their 'opressor' and the 'most evil nation' wrote so much literary KINO.

>No, Tolkien invented it. Before him all fantasy was connected to the real world usually Christian.
LOTR is connected to the real world.
If LOTR is somehow a completely different fantasy world then R E Howard's Hyboria is and that was written 30 years before tolkien ever put out LOTR. Clark Ashton Smith, Robert E Howard, even Edgar Rice Burroughs invented fantasy which isn't connected to the real world years before tolkien
Tolkien just ripped off william morris and e r eddision you delusional tolkienite fanboy

>He's basically one the giants of literature and he will be remembered for centuries and I'm 100% sure he will join the western canon at some point.
>HE'S THE ONE TO INVENT FANTASY.
>His literary influence over one of the biggest literary genres now in terms of books sold can't be denied.
>HE'S THE ONE.
>Everyone after him tries to debunk him or just try to rip off him.
Nope
Howard, Lovecraft, Ashton Smith, Eddison, Burroughs and Morris invented fantasy long before t*lkien

D&D autists ruined the fantasy genre. That's why it's all now the same derivative shit. Those smelly fucks pushed out anyone with an ounce of originality or creativity and that's why you have the same shit with a different label. Same thing happened with the gooks and their webnovels.

*enlightens ur path*

Attached: 738DE24B-0A8B-4501-A5B9-DC7BEF52F24F.jpg (787x1101, 150.38K)

You're a fucking midwit. Of course tales of fairie already existed before. Tolkien is very frank on where he got his inspiration and even his works speak for themselves. (example: Túrin Turambar = Kullervo)
Tolkien did invent the Fantasy Genre as we know it today (in which before had already declined and regarded as infantile; solely for children), as the majority of fantasy books draw from Tolkien; be it in admiration, like Bakker, or in subversion, like George Martin. Indeed others helped in the revitalisation of the genre, like CS Lewis or Michael Moorcock. But none had the same impact as Tolkien.
The Hobbit, which had been published in '37 was already a popular success. Such much so that an equally popular sequel had been made.
>HEAVILY influenced by Wagner
Fucking what?

Attached: Tolkien_reading_tier_(4).png (1424x8332, 2.13M)

I have literally never read any of Tolkien's books. I haven't seen any of the films either. It doesn't look all that impressive from the outside.

People who don't like Tolkien are people really, -really- hate classicism of any sort, and tend to lack patience. Tolkien spends more time telling you the lore and culture of his world than focusing on the inner struggles and minds of the characters.

Tolkien is -soaking- in aesthetic appreciation, which drives character-driven story lovers up the frigging walls. There is no better way to get the little ADHD ratbrains upset than have them have to look at and sit still in a story for five minutes, and LotR spends -hours- telling you how gorgeous a single house, be it ever so humble can be.

I "hate" Tolkien because I am a classicist. He's too infantile and simple minded.

Tolkien is kino and his songs are very nice. It’s not an either or question, you can enjoy both the pre-Tolkien writers and see value in him also.


youtube.com/watch?v=RRVIVJjuaHE

Pray tell what exactly is simple-minded about The Silmarillion?

The Hobbit is written for children, so I'll grant you that, but for the rest of the Legendarium you have no legitimate excuse, user.

>Pray tell
Neck yourself

Tolkien is only so visible because he's the only one to write a decent fantasy in over a hundred years. It's your mediocrity that compels you to see him in your own emptiness.

>Of course tales of fairie already existed before
Midwit detected
Robert E Howard wrote no faerie tales. the wor mouroborus is not a fairie tale, nor is the house of the wolflings, neither are hp lovecrafts or clark ashton smiths works. you've never read any work of pre tolkien fantasy you delusional fanboy midwit
>dude fantasy was for children and only cosisted of fairy tales before muh tolkien came around
try reading some conan or some solomon kane and tell me it's for children. they make tolkien look like teletubbies in comparison

>Tolkien is only so visible because he's the only one to write a decent fantasy in over a hundred years. It's your mediocrity that compels you to see him in your own emptiness.
>he has never read r e howard
>he has never read hp lovecraft
>he has never read clark ashton smith
>he has never read william morris
>he has never read e r eddison
>he has the gall to say tolkien is the only one to write decent fantasy
off yourself tolkien fanboy

>pray tell
I cringed so hard when I read this

You fucking idiot. You mention Howard, Lovecraft and Ashton Smith as if they weren't Tolkien's contemporaries. In the case of CAS, he knew of Tolkien and certainly had read The Hobbit.

>ad-hominems when shown to be blatantly wrong

They literally wrote before Tolkien you delusional tolkien fanboy
The hobbit was released in 1937, a year AFTER Howard had shot himself, and Howard had been writing stories set in the Hyborian age since the early thirties, and had been writing in the stories with set in the thurian age with king kull as the protagonist before the thirties.
This isn't even mentioning William Morris and E R Eddison, the worm ouroborous having been released in 1922, or lovecraft's The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath
which was written in 1927.
None of these authors had any contact with tolkien by the time they were writing them. Stop coping and accept the fact that your shitty author did not invent the fantasy genre and just plagiarised eddison, morris and wagner