Monogatari Thread

Clannad feels like a cheap tearjerker compared to Monogatari.

sold
I fucking hate the animation style, but I am rolling the dice based on this conversation.

I saw clannad many years ago, but i gotta say it hit my feels really hard. I dont normally watch slice of life/harem type shows but it was recommended to me and i cant say i regret it. The monogatari series is vastly different in how it is portrayed and its a little bit "edgier" i guess. The feels are there though, i definetly recommend giving it a shot. What´s left then is to choose the order to watch it in, it all works apparently but since it´s a show that works through past-now-future phasing alot, you can get confused easily.
Sweet, so more monogatari isnt an impossibility but rather a probability. Kind of sad to know that it´s going to end but i guess everything good does

If you have a PS4/Vita, try Utawarerumono. It hits really hard in the latter half.

Will do, getting my fill of feels itt, thanks anons.
> What´s left then is to choose the order to watch it in
I was going to go release date, is that wrong?
> it´s a show that works through past-now-future phasing alot,
Ho boy. Is it as retarded as WoW lore? I am trying to piece cutscenes together with the books and I am about ready to blow my brains out.

One arc, Kizumonogatari, was super delayed and it contains a bunch of information that other arcs call back to regularly. Broadcast order, but move Kizu right after Bake is the easy switchup to massively improve your viewing experience.
Other arcs were slightly delayed from novel order, but they don't have as much impact.

In general, the non-linear storytelling works really well and also makes for a bit of a mystery to piece things together.

Thanks user. Now I can sleep good, vampire is one of the best characters if not the best.

Will do, already on this shit. Thanks user.

This angry girl walks into your bathroom and tells you that Hanekawa and Izuko are idiots with nothing on her, what do you do?

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Do you have favourite op? For me it's either mathemagics or delusion express

Be nonplussed because that's not much of a feat.

Jun Aikawa, stop posting. Don't you have crimes to solve or dogs to walk or something?

Doujins when?

>karen bee part 3
>doesn't show up in the episode

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It's fine. Araragi just has to have some fun bantz and/or life-changing conversations for a bit.

>Shinobu Time
>not the arc where shinobu time travels

Never. Oyakodon isn't in the cards for Monogatari, Sister Incest however has a long history so enjoy the 0.01% chance someone tolerates Izuko long enough to draw a doujin of Tooe/Izuko.

She got headpats and donuts because she's a good bat

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Not as in time-travel bullshit (thus far atleast, havent seen all of it) but as in the story takes place at different points in time, so you´ll have bits where they talk about something that´s already happened but you havent seen it yet, and you watch that later and it fills the gaps. Like one user said, it keeps the mystery bottled up in a fun way

Who was the in the wrong here?

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In order of Least Wrong to Most Wrong

Araragi>Society>Snake>Ougi>(You)

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Thank fuck, I am glad to hear we aren't dimension hopping here, that shit gets confusing really fast.

But would she turn out normal if everyone stopped calling her cute all the time and treated her like everyone else?

Snake > Hanekawa > Kanbaru > Senjougahara > Mayoi.
Kanbaru would be higher but she has the excuse of actually having the Rainy Devil pull her dark side out further and actively attempting to repent for her oddity with chopping off her arm and then spending the next year and a bit duct taping her arm to a wall while she sleeps, checking the newspaper every day and actively going out of her way to repay Araragi. Hanekawa and Snake were in control of their oddities, Senjougahara is still a cunt but hasn't attempted any serious murder in the way Hanekawa, Snake and Kanbaru has.
Mayoi is flawless.

Spook is pretty cool though

You know what scratch that - put society up past Ougi. Snake did probably the shittiest thing in response to the hand she was dealt and Ougi actually did her part deliberately but Snake's peers, parents, and teachers were definitely more at fault even if they didn't realize. What they did wasn't as bad but it was sustained - and therefore more impactful on Snake's psyche. Also put Kaiki in there just above Araragi for being an early trigger.

Normal? Who knows. You're asking about an entirely different girl. It's not "Nadeko isn't a bad person she just had a hard time", it's "Nadeko is a bad person because she has a bad time". I like to think, though, that she would be more sociable and confident - which given her interests makes me think of her as a total hipster-type.

I think they were talking about Otori in particular. If they meant Bake or the Bake cast then Nadeko would actually be the least in the wrong. That's one of the many points of the arc - she couldn't stay the victim forever.

Spook is absolutely fascinating but that doesn't change the fact that she instigates two of the most horrible events in the series before she even gets properly introduced.

>but Snake's peers, parents, and teachers were definitely more at fault even if they didn't realize.
Not that user but this is just plainly not true. We already know Nadeko cultivated the issue of herself that she hated.
It's why the moment she decided to actually do something. Read: kick down a door and tell her class to harden the fuck up.
She had to blame the snake and even he calls her out on her bullshit.
Nadeko is entirely the blame for her own shortcoming because she's just in denial. If you know acting a certain way will convince people you're cute and then you complain when you get called cute, that's entirely on you to change that perception.

Oh, specifically in Bakemonogatari? Then yeah, Snake gets second last place. Mayoi is still the least wrong because her violence was an active defense to keep people away from her to avoid being lead astray as her other two defenses of ignoring people and telling them to leave were ineffective.

Completely agree, I didn't mean to defend snake's actions, just point out that she wasn't the only one at fault there.

Why is their love so strong?

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For one thing my focus was mostly on the parents when writing that. Those parents knew absolutely nothing about their daughter - didn't engage in her life past the most surface level - and are 100% culpable for her development because of that negligence. As for the others, forcing responsibilities onto her is a dick move and as both she and Kuchinawa said that absolutely should have been the teacher's job - not hers. Also she doesn't disagree with Kuchinawa when he says that it was all her in the classroom.

As for the cute thing, I feel I need to stress that life being "easy" and life being "pleasant" are two very different things. From what I gathered Otorimonogatari really hammers home that Nadeko takes advantage of the easiness of being cute, but that doesn't mean she enjoys it - or perhaps I should say "what you want" rather than "pleasant". This extends to her love of Koyomi - she WANTS to be with him, but not getting or losing him is easier. It's not quite laziness, but something worse: It's weakness. She has no faith in herself or drive to accomplish her goals. It's why she's so detached and broken.

Wow... everytime I write or think about Nadeko I'm astounded by how many more parallels I find between her and Hanekawa. Seriously I recommend everyone just spend some time thinking about how similar the two are in regards to situation and oddity. Some of them are subtle or meta but there's a lot there. Just a few key differences spelled a death sentence for Nadeko in this regard. Also to clarify I'm in no way saying she did nothing wrong. She is not absolved of her sins - but neither are the people who helped steer her to them.

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Lets split this into two because you honestly brought up something more interesting with the Hanekawa part.
So lets do your last line first since I summarily understand the argument you're making.

>She is not absolved of her sins - but neither are the people who helped steer her to them.
I believe our conflict here is which percentage of burden we believe Nadeko shares in this pie. Her parents don't know their kid, we agree on this but Nadeko also doesn't share anything of herself with her parents.
To quickly sum up this point. I think the outside forces are only 30% to blame for Nadeko's shit personality.

For the more interesting part. I actually 100% agree with your assessment that Nadeko acts as a parallel to Hanekawa but not in the way you think.
Nadeko is the unwilling Hanekawa. She's not morally good, she's not willing to help her teachers and she's not wanting to be Class Rep.
This is to emphasize what would happen to Hanekawa if you removed her from her high morality score on the Morality index provided.
On the other hand, Kanbaru is the other half of Kanbaru.
While Hanekawa is gifted in every way and her talent leads her to achieve great goals. Kanbaru is weak as told by Tooe and herself. Kanbaru herself admits that she can't get smarter or faster because she's always giving 100% and while it made her a school star and in Araragi's own words "One of the two stars of Naoetsu High", Kanbaru is proof of what happens when you have high moral character but low intelligence, which leads to an inability to achieve the things Hanekawa herself could achieve without outside assistance which made her rely on the Devil and fall prey to it while Hanekawa could take over the Cat.
So in the way that Yozuru and Kaiki are Araragi's paths, Nadeko and Kanbaru are Hanekawa's parts.

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It'd be hard to pick one. I like specific parts in each OP.
>terminal terminal: snail opening mouth with bubbles, the clock arms
>zoku owari op: the camera spins into shinobus mouth
>dark cherry mystery: when the bike flies across the beautiful city skyline
>dreamy date drive: overloading with crab expressions and reactions
>decent black: ougi being revealed by the vertical lines at the start
>white lies: the camera movement, the character intros start with eyes and nice lyrics
>platinum disco: 2 Tsukihi swinging their heads, is best part

A lot of reasons. The soul bond facilitates it, but giving it all or most of the credit would be disingenuous.
Seeing each other at their absolute lowest helped a lot, since it ended up tearing down a lot of barriers that Araragi especially puts up between other people when he really feels the need to put his best foot forward or like someone is "too good" for him. As a result, he's super uninhibited around Shinobu to a degree that only Hachikuji can compete with.
They have similar morals, and can't help admiring each other's attempts to do the right thing even if they fall short or it gets twisted.
Whenever either of them have trouble, the other is right at their side, sharing it and being supportive the entire way. Other girls might offer their help frequently, but not to this ridiculous degree.
They have extremely compatible personalities, from fetishes to joke tastes.
Shinobu puts a huge amount of work into their relationship on a daily basis while Araragi steps the fuck up to the plate when he's needed.

Oh shit, is that the next novel cover? Shinobu looks fantastic.

Spank the monkey and my monkey while my wife monkey cheers me on

Whoa, I don't remember posting this. And with a different IP too?

hah? Monogatari is a tearjerker?

No, but it does have big, well-executed emotional payoffs.

Monkey and Snake OPs, Fire Sisters OPs and Kaerimichi
But almost all OPs are fine. Mein Schatz and Dark Cherry Mystery are slightly weaker

Oh, it's part of an illustration set that you need to win from a raffle.

When I refer to the parallels between them I mean a few different things, so I'll start with the more direct parallel of their behavior. Both of them are reflections of expectations and how people respond to them. Or perhaps "environments" rather than expectations, though that feels too broad. In Hanekawa's case the "perfect morality" that she achieves is merely a reflection of her desire to be "normal", which in reality is a desire to do what's expected and follow the rules. This is all a failed attempt on her part to "blend in" and become exactly what she should, which is ironically what makes her so abnormal and unable to blend in. For Nadeko "blending in" is about being unnoticeable. I suppose this makes them opposites in this regard. Nadeko basically refuses to expose herself in any way that would leave a notable impression - because if no one notices you you aren't out of place. So for both of them they implement these attempts at camouflage, and funnily enough what leads to Nadeko's failure is how much better she is at it.

I had to split this because I'm a wordy bastard. More incoming.

Hanekawa>>>>>>>>>>>>>shitjougahara

Another parallel is in the fundamental structure of their arcs when broken down to bare essentials. I'll skip right to the conclusion here: A girl living a facade faces mounting pressures from school, family, and romance causing her to come under the influence of an oddity who was in fact her own darker intentions from the beginning. It's a pretty solid comparison, if somewhat bare-bones. Additionally there's the element of both girls having conflicting emotions - another side of themselves opposed to the dark intentions in question.Since I expect you'll disagree that Nadeko is conflicted I'll refer you to the line of internal monologue "But that's Nadeko not me!" near the end of Otori. It's not the only example but easily the most obvious of one of Nadeko's "personalities" being opposed to what she's become. It also adds a lot of depth to analysis based on her persona (specifically the cutesy way of referring to herself in the third person and what that means for her character) but I digress.The point is that both girls face a lot of similar story beats but a few essential differences keep the Nadeko from actualizing herself. I mean, really the biggest one is exactly that - she has become unable to self-actualize. This is the "weakness" I was getting at, and it can basically be understood through a few phrases. Those phrases are "it can't be helped", "in any case", and "that aside". There aspects such as her "personalities" being more muddied - much less clear cut than Hanekawa - which contribute. But reasons aside, the end result is the same as if Hanekawa ran away: her inner darkness became a monster too strong to beat. But not too strong to con, of course.

I have more comparisons but halfway through typing this I realized I've been awake too long and my brain is fried. I think these are the most important two, and while I haven't been as clear as I would like I hope this gets my meaning across.

Are you calling my wife and our children dumb? I'll fight you at the nearest cram school

Oh, also, I agree wholeheartedly with the comparison between Kanbaru, Nadeko, and Hanekawa. And for two final points: A) I consider it not an issue of dividing blame but sharing it. Nadeko gets 100% for not being better and her parents get 100% for being awful parents and raising a terrible kid. The others get varying percentages because they aren't as involved but that teacher is seriously a piece of shit - high blame or no. and B) She's in middle school this comes with a maturity difference that I take into account both in regards to her culpability and in regards to how she measures up against Hanekawa.

It still feels so strange to me that Hanekawa is supposed to be such a genius but couldn't figure out why she was completely failing to blend in.

No wonder Kaiki was obsessed.

She should've been Shinobu. She has amazing range and could have done a great job for all of Shinobu's forms, especially Kiss-shot.

has anyone here read sodachi fiasco translation by mirrored? the one that got deleted, you can find it in archives though

Oh god, I do not like the sound of that. That seems like the setup for big ol' goodbye arc for bat.

Mind elaborating on that Kaiki/Yozuru part. Sounds interesting.

If he does a goodbye arc for the soulmates after the confession they had people will literally murder him and I would agree.

Lads why do I feel my soul healed every time I rewatch the date chapter? I am reading the LN and I'm about to get there and I can't help feeling sad that I won't be able to read it for the first time ever again

Monogatari is a series that I love to rewatch bits and pieces of a lot, but it really bothers me how different and varying in quality the subs are.

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No, but that's a man of great taste in term of names.

>a man

Deathtopia is definitely a girl.

idgi

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Bully the vampire

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NO

Still nope.

I need a doujin between these two about bullying.

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Yes, and it was pretty great. Adaptation soon.

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Are gonna people sperg about again like "muh 7 page muda" ?

Monogatari seems to have good story, but I can not stand its kind of jump-cut. So should I read the LN? And on which order?

Clannad hits me hard, too, since I grew up with a single father. It really is a great depiction.

Backwards release order is recommended.

problem with LNs is that official translation is behind anime adaptations, I think they are doing owarimonogatari now, and fan translations don't cover everything

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If it's at least 10x longer than the Owari one maybe.

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Only if it's light, loving bullying and she gets to do it back.

>Only if it's light, loving bullying and she gets to get back at me with angry, pouty, rough sex.
ftfy

That's nice and all, but you gotta not be a little bitch and be ready to get as good as you give.

But I did mean she would be in charge during it.

Love the vampire.

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I love how insane my wife is!

yes we are lolicon brothers and we love it

Chocolate insomnia or marshmallow justice. I like them too much.

Official translations are currently in the middle of Koyomimonogatari (part 1 released late june, part 2 to be released later this month). They've been picking up the pace and they'll be catching up to the anime next year or the year after probably.
I like the LNs but I don't want to imagine how much gets lost in translation with writers such as Nisioisin who's such a madman when it comes to puns. I have to commend the translation of Katanagatari for footnotes that explain some of the puns and references Nisio throws in that don't work in English. I wish they'd do the same thing with Monogatari.

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release date for last part of owarimonogatari is end of april 2020, I suppose there might be another anime adaptation by that time, and there's still going to be zoku in the way
god, I wish I knew japanese

It's never too late to start learning Japanese, user. Yes it's daunting at first but it just takes time and regular practice.

So what happens now that rarararagi isn't a vamp and back on the small lifespan?
Or is that something to worry about in the future?

pretty sure he went back to being quasi-vampire at the end of zoku in order to restore his soul bond with shinobu

>restore
Well, now I feel like not watching this show anymore, knowing that they actually severed it at some point.
I already couldn't really deal with Araragi being romantically interested in others after their bond and her "if tomorrow is the day you die" confession.

they didn't severe it on purpose though, it was someone else's doing

With "they" I meant the author.

His bond with Shinobu goes beyond that.

Yeah but that's also part of it. I just get bored hearing about the other ones in some sort of romantic capacity because it literally doesn't matter compared to those two.

>her "if tomorrow is the day you die" confession
That was when they restored the bond.

His bond with Shinobu goes beyond romance, that's the point. And he's only romantically interested in Hitagi.

He literally has a "normal" girlfriend and "marriage".
But yes again, that's the point. All his other relationships are so completely irrelevant compared to the one with Shinobu that I just get bored hearing about them.

>All his other relationships are so completely irrelevant
Not really, don't be a speedwatcher.

Kogarashi Sentiment. The visuals are absolutely fantastic and it's a duet between the two best girls. All of the OPs are top tier but this one edges out the others ever so slightly.

i.e. still a tearjerker, but in an untraditional sense as it doesn't rely on cheap emotional manipulation but rather the strength of it's narrative beats and character arcs

I don't know what the general consensus is on commie but I can't stand their unnecessary edits and weird attempts at localization

Anything's a tearjerker if you play really good, sad music over it.

>She got paid to babysit Karen for an arc
So does Karen now know about Shinobu? Or was it a watch her from the shadows kind of deal?

I watched Coalgirls' releases and they were overall fine. It's a good thing Owari S2 and Zoku had subs in my native language so I didn't have to watch then with HS subs.

He is right tho. What do those relationships add to the plot? Fanservice? Gag yourself

t. speedwatcher

Are HS subs in general bad?

They're horrible.

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Haven't gotten into the story as far as the babysitting thing but the two brushing short stories have Tsukihi and Karen see Shinobu playing assistant to Araragi as he helps his sisters in no suggestive ways what so ever.

Is there gonna be more seasons? Is shaft gonna keep milking us ?

They said they want to, but they did lose a lot of important staff relatively recently. I hope that doesn't stop them though.

first stage of denial.

Maybe, but I am too used to Sakamoto's voice for Shinobu to imagine anyone else now.

Karen has met/interacted with Shinobu about a dozen times but just thinks of her as multiple strangers and has no clue about her true nature or her relationship with her brother.

It's beyond romance, but doesn't preclude it.

>doesn't preclude it
Just makes it seem a whole lot less important or relevant in comparison.

[x] genuflect

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I feel bad for Kanbaru. Her Gaen side had all the best genetics but all she got was the ability to revive the Rainy Devil from it's seal.

>no nipples
What a copout of an artbook.

BIG
FAT
BAT
TATS

Bat a best
are in there more series like this one? I mean non chronological order stuff

Yeah, which is why they're not acting on it. I can't believe that they don't have a good measure of romantic attraction to each other though.

what about big bat wings?

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Very cute when they're hugging/acting as a privacy screen.

this. When she covers them both with her wings it just shows how intimate it is

I just realized that Shinobu stole crab's role here. She deliberately stood on the sidelines because facing was something he wanted/needed to do himself, and then welcomed him back to normalcy. Except she did it in absolutely spectacular fashion.

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There has to be a big, actual canvas painted version of this, somewhere.

Precious

*faps your pepis*

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They're shit. I don't know how people can take issue with honorifics but be fine with awkward, unnatural dialogue and borderline unreadable accents.

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Give headpats

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It's not that she didn't blend in, it's that society pretty much abandoned her. She had friends before Araragi, it's just that when she took one home her parents acted like super autists and scared the friend away, who on turn abandoned her, because they just saw her for the immaculate student who does what's right, never learning who Tsubasa herself was. And no, the child is so perfect you want to hit them is not a good excuse, Oshino even admitted that was his own personal bias, his neutrality completely broke down then. If you read Tsubasa Tiger, it even says she developed the abnormality due to not wanting to be abandoned as a non-blood related child, as they wanted to throw her out on the street in grade school regardless of how she behaved, and only stopped because it made them look bad. That they'd lose face. That was what the whole letter was about. Their whole excuse is literally, "she basically raises herself and makes me feel bad for hating being a parent, so there, hmph".

Nah, it was stupid. If Cat hadn't went through hell to save him, he would have welcomed the abyss with Ougi, and pretty much metaphorically flipped the bird to all the people who would miss him.

FAp to children

If anything, his relationship with Shinobu is pretty much a constant reminder that there are things he won't change no matter what. If you remember that bit where Yotsugi pretty much called him a coward for clinging to that idea of staying unhappy and using his relationship with Shinobu to stroke his nihilist boner. That same thing he parroted when he tried to say he and Hanekawa can be unhappy together in Neko Black and she unconsciously rejected that. He is STILL holding onto that and it comes up every time when he talks about his bond with Shinobu, his sin. I kinda wonder why people don't call him out on it more when it's out in the forefront, and act like Araragi is suddenly mature.

My bebis!?

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She didn't say that though about Hanekawa. Besides, Hanekawa did what she did without a special bloodline and minimal knowledge. Unless Nisio says she has divine ancestry or something later on.

guess no matter what, koyomin is simply too dense to realise that

Yeah, nah. A bright girl still should have had plenty she could have done to blend in, especially since she's apparently so beloved regardless.

Have Araragi and Shinobu become the biggest "just fuck already" in the industry? Even Korbo has been made a mother at this point.

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Their relationship is weird. The intimate moments seem obsessive, unlike something with his sisters for example. It's easier to imagine them getting it on.

Pretty much.

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Any reason Kizu's artstyle is different from the rest?

She jobs to Snake against for 3-0. Hard to believe given the state of the latter isn't like before.

Superior frames folded for 10 years.

The Maria Holic character designer helped the usual one.

Consider this:
>Squishy
>Little
>Snake
>Tits
That is all.

this user gets it, nadeko a best

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wrong, she WAS a best

MOU ICHIDO
MOU NIDO TO
IENAI KOTOBA WA

reading the LN lately and i have to say snake is quickly becoming my favorite girl.

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Theres gonna be more monogatari anime??

Why do people watch this?

I love her so much bros

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She unironically became a "but I get to cuddle with Raragi after he's done fucking his wife, so who really won" tier cuckquean, but her fags will bend backwards into a pretzel trying to cop-I'm sorry, explain why that's actually a good thing. Kind of a pathetic affair, really.

>WAS
give me 1(one) reason why

>protip:you can't

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She's had a more intimate relationship with Araragi than any other girl since the very beginning. You just have dicks in your brain.

Without those relationships, Araragi wouldn't have gotten over his problems with Shinobu and the world would have ended.

This but unironically. The argument is always "Araragi has an extended lifespan so Shinobu wins in the end"

True story. For all the people who call out Araragi in Bake and Nise for being a virgin, they would never have imagined that the guy already had vampire sex which is even more fulfilling.

That's the way plebs look at it. Anyone that actually pays close attention has been scratching their heads since Nise over the fact that Araragi fucking Hitagi means that technically Shinobu has fucked Hitagi as well. Their relationship goes well beyond metrics that can be described in "who sucks Araragi dick".

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This show just sounds like an increasing amount of annoying roundabouts and stave-offs of the romantic fulfilment of the couple that people actually want to see, which is exactly what I hate about how anime does romance.

Commie is objectively awful translation, but I can see why people find them entertaining.

This whole series is gay as hell and garbage.
Bat was the single redeeming factor, and she got cucked by some psycho cunt with short hair.

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See the problem is people keep thinking this series is about romance when it's not and has never remotely been about romance. The "girlfriend" being an absolute nobody is testament to that.

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The general consensus on commie is that nobody that has watched anime for more than a year wants anything to do with them, and there's always some fanboy/IRCfag saying "they're not that bad this time guise I swear!". Every fucking show there's someone pulling that shit and every fucking time it's still shitty meme subs where the "translators" insert their fanfiction retelling of the dialogue in over the characters.

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Fuck dude when I see stuff like this and then the series isn't about romance I kinda get discouraged. I just want my sickly sweet grand romance for once.

Well it doesn't follow the same dynamics of a romantic anime very much at all, but if's still a series that revolves around interpersonal relationships, and Araragi and Shinobu's relationship is a heavily-emphasized one. If anything, Monogatari as a series made me become dissatisfied with archetypal romance.

I watched coalgirls up until they stopped and haven't watched anything past Owari 1 because the only available subs after that are awful. The choice is between Hsubs and even worse stuff, I'd settle for commie but they haven't done it either and aren't looking to anytime soon

Are there any LN similar to gatari series? It's so fun to read, probably even better if you read untranslated

>yozuru starts to speak for the first time
>mfw this happens

Attached: commie not even once.png (1920x1080, 1.12M)

So what parts can you even watch with good subs?

>super chuuni
>super cunni
>super cunny

There's at least a decent sub option for every part. Commie is actually one of them for Second Season.

It's not, but Araragi and Shinobu need to just fuck already more than any other written couple.

Personally I think the best are Orange Mint and Mōsō Express which is objectively better than Renai Circulation.

They're like long-time partners in a cop drama that always have a moderate-high level of sexual/romantic tension but never act on it.

I mean your logic sounds fine but all that tells us is that Hitagi has fucked Shinobu but Araragi hasn't meaning that in this situation Hitagi has fucked both but Araragi has only fucked Hitagi still leaving Shinobu as an observer to a sexual relationship in which the man she loves is fucking another woman while she's being fucked by a woman who doesn't love her.

Except are also basically married.

aren't the subs for Owari 2 shit everywhere?

Yuudachi Houteishiki, I think. The animated op gives me feels.

Friendly reminder that they fucked in Kabuki LN. Don't ask for source. Go read it yourself.

Nah, that Araragi and Hanekawa. Araragi has danced around Hanekawa so much that he literally twists his feelings into a pretzel each time they meet. She is his second mother, his savior, and he has said internally he loves her since the series started, his pettiness in Mitome Wolf only highlighting that twistedness.

Shinobu and Araragi are like a couple that just isn't good with being openly intimate, despite being a hair away from fucking. He basically treats it like it's an open secret, but unlike most polygamous relationships, he won't allow Hitagi to interact with Shinobu and keeps them starkly apart, and it's written that it just works, despite logic being that this would cause issues down the line. When he and Hitagi have kids, what will he tell the kids? Will he try to keep them in the dark, what if they inherit oddity traits? Children are a big deal, marriage is a big deal. Trying to marry one person and live a secret intimate life with another is a recipe for disaster.

My point is simply that their relationship cannot be accurately summarized by who has crossed what physical barrier. Elaborating on why specifically Shinobu is a lot closer to him than Hitagi would take a longer post, but as a general theme being one de facto entity that shares all experiences is a lot more intimate than getting your dick wet.

It's not a status quo without flaws which is why one of the long time theories had been Hitagi would leave him long before they got to that level of commitment.

user, if you have to say "Their relationship is deeper than physical contact" then you're ignoring the reality of the situation in favour of weaving your own narrative to dance around the fact that Shinobu had to sit there and watch as Araragi fucked Hitagi without ever having gotten laid herself.

>without ever having gotten laid herself.
How do you know that? Araragi has made it clear he won't tell the audience his intimates moments with Shinobu

Which do you think people do more easily, fuck or take shits together? Fuck or share a girl together? Fuck or live and die together? You sound like the series' themes are, frankly, too deep for you.

If your evidence is that there is no evidence then your argument is pretty flawed.

I too dodge the question because I realize that I'm in the wrong about Araragi fucking Hitagi while Shinobu is still as pure as the driven snow.
Shinobufags need to realize that for as long as Hitagi is alive, Shinobu is a cuck.

I just said it's in the Kabuki LN dipshit

>sat there and watch
Based on what he know about how the shadow bond works, Shinobu got to enjoy the sensation of plowing Hitagi's virginal highschooler vagina just as much as he did and Hitagi "don't get serious with any other girl" Senjougahara either was left in the dark or had to accept an ancient vampire getting to enjoy her body proxy.

how gay do you have to refuse to go on a murdering spree for 500 hundred years with this girl?

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I have the book, if you want to give me a page which supports your statement. I will be all too happy to check. It's your evidence to provide since it's supporting your argument.

how is it being a cuck if they are fucking the same person at the same time?
Also didn't Hitagi said something like
"As long you are with me I don't care what you do with the other girls"

He is talking about the moment when they spent a night together before the Mother's day. They slept in the park.
Nothing happened,

So Hitagi is such a CHAD that she can make two people orgasm while riding one dick?
10/10 slut skills.

>how is it being a cuck if they are fucking the same person at the same time?
But they aren't. Shinobu's dick ain't in that relationship. Just because Shinobufags push "Shadow bond" doesn't mean she's actually in any significant way involved. She doesn't affect Araragi's enjoyment nor Senjougaharas.
She's basically just getting off while Araragi and Senjougahara go at it much like a guy who sits there and watches his wife get fucked by dudes as he beats it.

Page 206. Of things we have seen what else would be censored?

No I'm not.

user, which part of she feels whatever he feels you don't undestand?

Shinobu has a phantom dick? Wow, gay.

Still a dick

There's really nobody in the series that has taken a shorter stick than Hitagi
>wanted Araragi for herself, he turns around and acts like the biggest manslut of all time
>will never have a legitimately intimate moment with him for the entirety of her life because Shinobu's literally attached to him
>he leaves her for dead for the vampire loli he goes on regular supernatural adventures with instead of studying for college like she asked
>literally subservient to hanekawa at the threat of her making a move on her boyfriend
And I don't mean that in a malicious way, I genuinely don't get how she always puts up with Ragi's shit.

A cuck also gets off when his wife gets fucked. Doesn't mean he's fucking his wife.

Do you mean the scene where Shinobu and Araragi "enthusiastically high fived and fist bumped eachother over and over again when we hit upon the excellent idea..." part?

>And I don't mean that in a malicious way, I genuinely don't get how she always puts up with Ragi's shit.
I ask the same for Shinobu. Araragi is a prick.

Did you read the rest. (a scene I definitely cannot let you see, dear readers). What thing is so important that has to be censored?

>it's a hitagifags make a big deal out of having implied sex thread
Characters Araragi has also had implied sex with:
>Karen
>Kanbaru
>Shinobu

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???
That's still part of the same sentence my dude. You've misunderstood the paragraph. It's all one run on paragraph talking about how he wanted to look rational and cool but ended up being a fucking loser by getting excited and high-fiving/fistbumping Shinobu.

That's the point guys. After five years together Shinobu probably fell in love with Hitagi too. To some extent. Especially since she can feel Araragi's joy and pleasure. Their relationship is fine as it is. It's just not vanilla and never meant to be vanilla. Don't call them cucks. In Musubi Shinobu doesn't mind Araragi marrying Hitagi. Not even a slightest bit of grudge or jealousy.

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Why is togashi's writing underrated? This literally sent chills down my spine.

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>Asks for source
>Unironically refusing to read what is written.
I should've known

Stop, you're just making it worse. Shinobu accepting her partner Araragi getting married to another woman is just sad, especially when she's now fine with it.

But I read it, it's how I know it's all one run-on sentence.
You're being either deliberately obtuse for the sake of argument or you don't know how sentences work.

What. user, sometimes jokes are just jokes.

She wants her soulmate to be happy also she knows the marriage will crumble. They broke up 4 times for dumb reasons and she just came back crawling to be back with him. They won't last long

While I am 100% with you on the entire Senjougahara/Araragi relationship being rock-bottom.
Now you've just made it worse. Now you're having Shinobu let Araragi fuck other woman who's going to break up with him which will cause him heartbreak all because she wants to play the long game.

No it's you who are refusing to accept sonething. You asked for source I gave you and you refuse by saying it's something else that doesn't make sense.

I even asked you of all things we have seen in this show what is so important they had to censore it? You didn't even answer you are just dodging the question

She is also fucking them with him and like I said. She just wants her soulmate to be happy.

Confirmation bias all day long.

Shinobu demands nothing from Araragi. She decided to stay with him in Owari 2 with no conditions.
Salty batfag, please. Araragi and Hitagi love each other very much as we can see in Musubi. Araragi has no intention to give up on her.

A buncha y'all are overvaluing sex 'cause ya ain't getting any. It ain't some sorta stamp of approval that gets used to validate a relationship. The bats are happy with their relationship where it is and adding sex to it would only complicate things with crab and all sides seem alright with that. Now we can just wait and see if further developments change that status quo.

>Salty batfag, please. Araragi and Hitagi love each other very much as we can see in Musubi. Araragi has no intention to give up on her.
We all know who he likes more. And we all know Hitagi/Araragi will crumble soon. You can laugh for now but I will have the last laugh. Shinobu and Araragi is OTP

Just 'cause a relationship doesn't work out in the end doesn't mean it wasn't beneficial to the people in it. People grow from their fuckups more than their successes. Better to have loved and lost and all that bullshit.

>I even asked you of all things we have seen in this show what is so important they had to censore it?
This is the issue you've misunderstood. Nothing was censored in the scene with the high fiving. He's calling attention to the fact that it would be uncool for us to see him doing that after writing his narrative prose in such a way that he seemed "rational".
You're so stuck on your own misunderstanding that you can't bring yourself to correct your own misunderstanding about the sentence by re-reading it and checking for context, commas and fullstops.

>"I've made it seem as though we decided what to do calmly, rationally, but in reality Shinobu and I enthusiastically high-fived and fist-bumped each other over and over again WHEN WE HIT ON THE EXCELLENT IDEA WE WERE ABOUT TO CARRY OUT (a scene I definitely cannot let you see, dear viewer).

Are you telling me right now that the idea Shinobu and Araragi were highfiving over was that Araragi was going to take Shinobu into a park and bend her over the swing to wombpunch her with his dick?

>This is the issue you've misunderstood. Nothing was censored in the scene with the high fiving.
I alredyo told you I wont say again.

>Are you telling me right now that the idea Shinobu and Araragi were highfiving over was that Araragi was going to take Shinobu into a park and bend her over the swing to wombpunch her with his dick?
Is this how you cope? Why are you trying so hard to refuse the obvious? THEY FUCKED get over it.

Also their breakups weren't that bad. And they weren't actual breakups just big fights. The third and biggest one was totally understandable. They just didn't want to fuck up each others future. And they ended up in The Gift of the Magi situation like Araragi mentioned himself.

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It's a little more weird than that, Araragi's feelings for Shinobu get out of hand sometimes and she actively shuts them down when that happens (Kabuki and Oni), so this isn't a "Araragi has other priorities right now" thing to begin with. The prevailing logic is that he only gets one human life before his immortal vampire life, so she emphasizes on him living that out before she lets him progress with her. She's the main roadblock in their relationship's progress.

The elephant in the room is that there's nothing normal about Araragi's life in the first place, that he overuses his vampiric nature and generally lavishes the supernatural side of life while putting his humanity on a lower priority. The most accurate description of their existence is already "a couple of inseparable immortals LARPing in the human world to kill time".

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> THEY FUCKED get over it.
They didn't. You know why? Because nothing changed between them afterwards.
And then in Oni he kissed her for the first time and she was shocked. Fucking batfags. Can't even watch properly.

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Do her and crab ever interact? I really want to see them bantering.

You can tell me all you want but when you provide me the page for you evidence and it proves you wrong then the onus is on you to either argue your point better or admit you're wrong.
I have provided a perfect quotation letter perfect down to the very last grammar mark, that you yourself believe to be the evidence that they copulated in full context and it has nothing in it which agrees with your point.
I don't know if you're just ardent on believing this point or you have genuine autism.

They have yet to interact. Ishin's probably holding that back for a big ol' dramatic finale.

>They didn't. You know why? Because nothing changed between them afterwards.
They are already soulmates what else would change? How do you it was the first time he kissed her?
They fucked. Cope with that

I already told you. Censored scene that you pretend that doesn't exist. You are refusing to accept the truth.

Also insulting me wont change the fact that you are wrong and I am right

It was a joke, retard. God I hate there threads.

Oh so you're just retarded. Is English your second language per chance?

>I-Its a joke guys
Also
>No arguments
Pathetic.

>getting to enthusiastically high five and fist bump Shinobu over and over again
I'm envious. Why don't more series emphasize the "wife that's also your best friend" archetype?

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Arguments don't work against retarded fags

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Where do I get the translated LNs free these days anyway?

user, we're going to go in a circle over this but you're the one without an argument here. Your statement is "This one line without context says they fucked because it implies a censored scene" rather than the reality which is Araragi riffing on himself for trying to be rational and then ending up being childish and then lampshading it by saying "A scene I wouldn't show you" even though he just told us about it.

mega.nz/#F!TWxWgChR!_PVEZtaqSZ7DwgOiCB-VoQ
Here you go. Not all but something.

Also fan translated Musubi
polaristranslations.tumblr.com/private/185455006289/tumblr_pssl1g18Qo1tqn5s8

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Has anyone with enough japanese knowledge commented on if the official TLs do any justice? Localization is usually a horror story even for stuff with simple subject matter.

>A scene I wouldn't show you" even though he just told us about it.
No he didn't.
They didn't show us anything of the "censored" scene. Dude they fucked. That's the only thing they wouldn't show to us after all we have seen. You are denying when the evidence is pretty obvious.

So that's you don't understand? Got it.

THERE IS NO CENSORED SCENE.
I know have to decide whether this is some pro-tier bait and you're not actually this dumb, in which well-played, Batfag. Or you are this dumb and your existence alone brings the the IQ average of Batfags down to the level of Snakefags.

She's an ancient immortal and knows that everything he does is petty in the scope of crushing eternal life. Hitagi is mortal and only has one lifetime to spend with someone so it's a different story.

He raises a point, why would a scene refuses to show be a scene he'd just shown?

>Bulling the vampire
Hmm... So just kill arararagi in front of her?

I would kill Araragi to take her for myself given the chance.

>t. seishirou

Araragi isn't being serious when he says that he couldn't show the scene of them high-fiving. He's taking the piss as a way to contrast the rational narration he used with the actual events that occurred of a Japanese High schooler and an 8 year old girl acting like children when they figured out how to get out of this universe.

Dude just said is a thing he can't tell us.
>Not censored
The scene is not the high fiving. They came with an idea and when they were going to carry it he said it's something he can't let us see. How is that hard to understand?

Don't lump Snakefags with their autism.

But then hitagi is going to hunt you down

user, the scene he can't let you see is the fistbump scene. The entire sentence is written with the current tense of "Shinobu and I enthusiastically high-fived and fist-bumped each other over and over again WHEN WE HIT ON THE EXCELLENT IDEA"

Go and read the fucking scene, retard. They spent a night together inside some cramped children house and her ribcage imprinted on his chest. That's all.

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Honestly the biggest retards of the night are you two for
>falling for bait
>resorting to Yea Forums tier consolewar shitposting
You'd think the cancer that is the shounenspam would have made it patently aware that the tribal mindset is for underage trash but evidently not.

Bat would super murder you and then the world user.

Is bat just genjimonogatari-ing Araragi? Using crab as a tool to sculpt her perfect boy.

I can't help myself. I'm too earnest in believing people are genuinely just too dumb to understand full sentences and need it explained to them.

They were doing that before carrying the idea.
Do you even know what we are talking about?

You two are wrong. You still fail to realise that. It's ridiculous.

The idea is to go to the Shrine to reteleport, user. The entire conversation before the quote we're debating over is about it and then the very next page is them arriving at the Kita Shirahebi.
That was their big plan.

He's already her perfect boy user.

>Araragi is being held like a child
>Shinobu is usually a loli he treats like a daughter
>also they're basically married
Is Nisio also on the daughter-mom-wife team?

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And them going to the shrine is censored? They fucked before going there. Fist bump then sex then shrine.

Dude think this way. Remeber that Araragi was holding Shinobu while foing up the stairs why do you think he did that? Because she was tired fron the sex. If nothing had happened she could go up the stairs by herself. Stop denying the obvious for fucks sake

Most batfags literally haven't even watched or read Monogatari at any point.

...

Nice argument

It's not an argument, it's a factual statement. A significant portion of batfags are mentally ill and only fap to doujins. At best they might have speedwatched the scenes where Shinobu appears.

@191796040
Yes yes lovely shitpost, very troll. Try not to get banned.

I've shown you evidence and you didn't even know what we were talking about. Also why would a batfag speedwatch bat scenes kek.

Different user, I don't care if you can read or not. I just wanted to point out that batfags are fucked in the head, that's all.

Do we need another big diagram to go with the Watch Order one to explain what subs to use for each one now?

As long we are in the right there is no problem

Looking at this thread, this show sounds like getting yourself invested in romantic relationships only to be endlessly tortured by none of them having satisfying conclusionary moments.

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this is the best meme ever

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>bribes with doughnuts?
how about snake? or does she fade after the whole Keiki thing?

>goddess
>medusa
>white hair, red eyes
>cut the cutesy act
>appearance of her real self
She better not revert into the damn nobody she used to be. Titty twisters are the only thing she can expect if she gets ideas about falling back into that way of living (even worse if not trying to be the lewd slut in love with being in love like before).

She is the true endgame

post more bat

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best bat is kizu bat, donuts were a mistake.

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>will never have nadeko

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there are millions of young japanese girls with identity issues, they even come with bangs.

>spend 5 hours arguing with a false-flagger