Has a far better protagonist with an actual personality and character arc

I thought the same before actually reading it.
But in reality the setting was tiring, like I just didn't enjoy reading through it.
Maybe it was the stands, the enemies being literally generic mobs without backstory due to white snake. It picked up by the end for me.
Also I didn't enjoy seeing Jolyne in an extremely bad setting, all the odds were against her, the whole prison arc was a really underdog way to present the character, it's literally the Pucci's playground.
Unlike every other Jojo that gets a more balanced start, this was kind of depressing to read.

I really doubt you "love" that I feel you're being sarcastic

What I hate most about Part 6 is Hermes' existance. What was the fucking point of her? What an useless cahracters

>DIO's sons were a complete waste as they were just more fodder of the week with no personality

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>It's difficult to read through
Are you, unironically, a brainlet?
>the narrative is sloppy, the pacing is all over the place
Expand more on this, otherwise, the same as above.
>the minor antagonists are lackluster, all of the stands are terrible
>it has the weakest cast by a long shot. Jolyne is a pathetic MC who is just an edgy whiny bitch with daddy issues...
>Her poor actions are blamed on Jotaro and she doesn't have a moment of self-reflection to become a more mature person. Being a Strong Female Character™ isn't being mature
Stop spiting meme and trying to make them pass as arguments, she literally has a moment of self reflection directly in the part in where she was sent to that special part of the jail as was forced to eat bread with cockroaches without whining like an idiot or being edgy and she also forgave Jotaro (who wasn't blammed for her actions beyond her hating him because he was never present).
In contrast, Giorno is literally OC donut steel tier.
>MY NAME IS GIORNO GIOVANNA AND I HAVE A DREAM
>MY FATHER IS DIO
>BUT I AM ALSO A JOESTAR
>MY STAND CAN CREATE LIFE, CURE EVERYONE AND EVEN MYSELF ( SO I AM BETTER THAN JOSUKE), MAKE PEOPLE SUFFER PAIN SUPER SLOWLY AND WHEN I GET HIT BY THE ARROW I CAN REVERT ANY ATTACK BACK TO ZERO
>MY NAME IS GIORNO GIOVANNA AND I HAVE A DREAM
>Pucci is a cliched, generic shounen villain with a backstory that is ridiculous, laughable and tacked on late into the story
>generic shonen villain
Brainlet, genuine brainlet.
>DIO's sons were a complete waste as they were just more fodder of the week with no personality
Just like Giorno, except Versace has personality.
>And the ending is fucking terrible.
In what sense?
>inb4 calling other brainlet and complaining about spiting memes as arguments

>DIO's sons were a complete waste as they were just more fodder of the week with no personality
God I hate braindead speedreaders

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best part

Part 6 (compared to other parts):
>Weak side characters
>A lot of shitty stands and shitty fights
>That snails thing
>Bad pacing
>Weird Araki's transition drawing
>A lot of women
>Almost everything happening in a prision is an interesting concept but the story's overall mediocrity makes it boring and poorly executed

I agree that Pucci and Jolyne are cool, but still, Part 6 is the worst part after Part 1

That's exactly how he felt about Stone Ocean, yeah. Thanks for the tl;dr.

>Weak side characters
Hermes is the only one that feels like filler and kind of pointless (but not as much as Fugo) and even with that having a weak protagonists and antagonist is far worse.
>A lot of shitty stands and shitty fights
This is quite right but that doesn't mean it didn't have some pretty good ones.
>That snails thing
Nothing wrong with that.
>Bad pacing
Explain
>Weird Araki's transition drawing
I didn't feel like there were weird transitions at all, the same as above, provide examples.
>A lot of women
It doesn't matter if a manga has lots of women, the only thing that matters is the execution, also, the group had 3 women and 3 men.
>Almost everything happening in a prison is an interesting concept but the story's overall mediocrity makes it boring and poorly executed
Mediocre in what way? it had a pretty good main character with a nice development and antagonist, the ending wasn't some garbage like pulling a power up for the MC out of nowhere and it didn't feel like some sort of fanfiction.

>Pucci
>a personality
Am I being rused? White Snake isn't Pucci.

>Pucci has not personality
>White Snake is not a part of Pucci.

Attached: 14565641546.png (780x1200, 1.69M)

Being a weird fruity fucker isn't a personality. Everything people like about Pucci usually involved Dio in the same sentence. You like Dio and project that onto a blank slate because Dio befriended said blank slate. He was a lacking antagonist and final villain. It's pretty bad when your own stand upstages you in every way.

Dumb Diofag

It’s kinda cool how Pucci’s design and character is that of a priest but his actions and Stand’s abilities are reminiscent of the devil’s.

I don't even like Dio that much but he's better than Pucci.

>I don't even like Dio that much but he's better than Pucci.
Dio part 1? no, even Speedwagoon said that he was born evil, trash.
Dio part 3? even less, he was like Diavolo in the sense that he only appears at the very end like a generic villain who doesn't have any sort of presence beyond sending underlings and who simply wants to take over the world, the only difference is that at least he has a little more personality.

Do you even like Jojo? Everything you said applies to every other part.

Who do you like then?

>Hates Stone Ocean
>Uses election tourist lingo "Strong Female Character™"
Checks out

I MISS HIM

Attached: OUR KING.jpg (960x960, 161K)

As a guy who goes to church a lot, Pucci has a very good personality. He's a priest, meaning his job revolves around speaking to people and convincing them to change in ways he sees fo the better. Like any good priest, Pucci can take anything and just turn it into a magnificent speech. In his first fight with Jolyne he randomly brings up a sparrow that often kills itself because it's upbringing, a good metaphor for a lot of Joestars who don't have the best families and always find themselves in life or death situations. He recruits Ungalo and the rest of DIO's children by telling them about the idea of gravity and how they should find happiness by following Fate and helping him to reach Heaven. When fighting Jolyne again he randomly brings up how he thinks about the first man who ate the mushroom, which shows his beliefs in Fate.
There's also the little things that characterize him further like Whitesnake's attitude which shows how high he values himself and his words and how honorable he is since he was going to make Emporio die a martyr
I personally don't use Dio to explain why Pucci is a great character. Actually I would argue that you don't need Dio at all to do so. Dio is dead in part 6 and Pucci is on his own. In the end Pucci discovers Heaven and uses it for his own goals, Dio would still die in Pucci's world. Dio is just a means to an end in Part 6 rather than someone Pucci revolves around. He's Dio's friend, not a servant like Vanilla Ice.

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During that fight how the fuck did Jolyne manage to kick C Moon in the face? I thought only stands could hard stands? How the fuck did Dio manage to deflect emerald splash with his bare hands?

Just wished F.F. got more fights, having a regeneration ability could let fights max out on brutality, which is always welcome in my eyes.

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Post prime numbers.

Based. I hate it when people just write off Pucci as just Dio's boyfriend when in actuality he's one of the best characters in the series. Along with everything you mentioned, stuff like him counting prime numbers when he's anxious, his relationship with Weather Report, and the detail that Whitesnake's power was born out of desire to preserve his sister's memory really help to make him feel like a real person rather than just a cartoon villain

youtube.com/watch?v=NHEaYbDWyQE&t=152s
here you go

I think the reasoning is that because Jolyne can unravel herself into string, Stone Free and her body are essentially one.

Jolyne and Pucci are fucking great, and the beginning and ending are great as well, but the middle is such a boring drag and the supporting cast is painfully dull.
I like it though.

I agree and disagree. The only issues I had with the middle are Dragon's Dream and Yo Yo Ma (For just dragging out more than anything)

I hate DIOfag memetards so much. You're all literally speedreaders.

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>Pucci is a cliched, generic shounen villain
You know, I get a lot of complaints about Part 6 and I shit on it maybe a bit too much, but Pucci is genuinely the best written villain overall in JoJo.
Even though I like DIO more.

Attached: b96.png (800x960, 1.5M)

Oh fuck off. Pucci is great because he built off of what DIO set out to do and evolved his vision while still being true to himself. He acted nothing like DIO and it was interesting to see them become friends despite their differences.
Pucci wanted to create a universe that (he believed) would be better for everyone. He had his own morals and his own ambitions, it's just that Dio set it in motion.
If you honestly believe everything Pucci has to offer comes from his friendship with DIO you seriously must have read to part wrong.

Why did Araki hate FF so much? She gets fucked up every fight even worse than Mista and ended up not even making it out of the prison

I just really dislike everything from Ultra Security Punishment Ward to the end of Bohemian Rhapsody.
Though I do like Pucci vs. F.F. and when he acquires C-Moon, as well as some parts of Jailhouse Lock.

>He didn't like planet waves

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>Jolyne has a personality at the expense of everyone else in the group
>Pucci has a "motivation" but it's canon nonsense that Dio made up and works just because, confirmed by Araki himself
>the protagonist doesn't pull an asspull, a character irrelevant since the first half does
>most stand fights are boring save for the first few and the last chapters

And of course it's from a "hur dur what is diavolo's motivation" poster.

>Pucci is great because he did exactly what DIO set out to do and followed all his steps while thinking of him, emulating all his moves, and had the same end goal and method as DIO had. He just had a different backstory it doesn't matter if he was just a proxy for Araki to have DIO as another antagonist!

The transition drawing and the pacing will be fixed by DP, and the A lot of Women issue...it will work in this era due to people loving strong female characters in Shounen Series unlike the 90s.

bad quality bait

Alright, but the few bits that are memorable are more memorable than most high points of other parts.

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Maybe the emerald splash is physical.

>less than 5 memorable moments that pale in comparison to even part 1's only good moment
Just admit you like the girls and get it over with. It's not worth lying when you're anonymous.

>Jolyne has a personality at the expense of everyone else in the group
And that's wrong because? would you rather have a plain as a table protagonist with quirky secondary character that has not effect on the plot?
>Pucci has a "motivation" but it's canon nonsense that Dio made up and works just because, confirmed by Araki himself
Citation needed, and even with that, there is nothing wrong with that.
>And of course it's from a "hur dur what is diavolo's motivation" poster.
>DUDE HE WAS EVIL BECAUSE HE WAS BORN EVIL 10/10 WRITING JUST TURN OFF YOUR BRAIN
>"I want to go to the moon because the moon is cool"
>"and you? what do you want to do?"
>"i dont know"
>"what about going to the moon? you have always said that you like high goals"
>"i dont know, i dont think i can go, i dont know how"
>"i know how you can go to the moon, see you just need to to this "
>"hey thinking about it in this way and now that i know how to go there i think i will do it, going to the moon will help me to achieve what i always wanted: recognition and the pleasure of having achieve an intellectually fulfilling goal."
>This is somehow bad
Dio is a vampire, he has superhuman strength.

not gonna have a thread die for me to ask this but whats a good site to read part 6? just got into jojo recently and finished all of the anime.

These two are the best, choose the one you like the most, they are both colored.
mangadex.org/title/6271/jojo-s-bizarre-adventure-part-6-stone-ocean-official-colored
mangarock.com/manga/mrs-serie-290475
If you would rather download the entire part you can do it directly from the Jojo Colored Adventure website.
jojocoloredadventure.blogspot.com/

>Not liking JailHouse Lock
>Not liking Planet Waves
>Not liking Pucci vs Foo Fighters

thank you! :)

>Jolyne has a personality at the expense of everyone else in the group
How? Hermes is vibrant and cares for her friends. F.F wants to survive and preserve her knowledge while learning more about life, Anasui is obsessed with Jolyne but he thinks being obsessed with things and pursing your goals are noble traits, Weather is quiet and reserved but he's really a bitter, broken man who hates the world for the fate he was dealt, and Emporio is a helpful kid. Admittedly I don't like him much but he doesn't drag down the group.
>motivation
Pucci wasn't to create a world where everyone knows their Fates beforehand so people would be able to courageously face the ills of tomorrow. This stems from form how he, Perla, and Weather where all ruined by their Fates, his motivation is to help him cope with what he did to them. The method to Heaven might not make sense but that's not important.
>asspull
It wasn't. Weather and Jolyne had set up Emporio's victory.
>borring fights
Part 6's fights are so bizarre that they aren't boring at all. The one fight I disliked was Yo Yo Ma because it's power was dull and his defeat sucked.
>diavolo's motivation
They weren't that good. We already had the emperor attitude from Dio and the "anonymously living life in comfort" thing from Kira. Diavolo was menacing before he revealed his design fully, afterwards he just bland.

The lower anime only expectations are the more likely they are going to like it. It happened to Part 5.

>skipped part 6 as i was always told it was irrelevant garbage and jumped to part 7 instead
>read it during a sleepless night
>it's actually decent

when F.F. and Weather Report died i felt more empathy than any previous death and dio's sons were interesting takes in the giorno formula.

Part 6 is just objectively better than than 1, 3 and 5 and subjectively better than 2. Don't bother debating this since it's already been proven.

>skipped part 6 as i was always told it was irrelevant
It's the fucking end of the original universe, how the hell can somebody consider it irrelevant?

What does being the end have to do with it?

Jojotubers keep sperging how Part 6 is bad because "MUH GIORNO DIDN'T SAVE THE DAY" or "MUH FETISH CHARACTER IS ACTUALLY IMPORTANT AND SHOULD'VE BEEN RELEVANT"

Are you a brainlet?
>why is the end of a story, the end of the most important jojo besides Jonathan, the culmination of the Joestar bloodline in the original universe, the absolute final wave of dio, the most important antagonist of the series, influence thought all the parts, the reason of why Araki was able to start a new universe without needing to follow the previous one, has to be considered relevant?

It's just the last part. If part 6 never existed, part 5 would be the last part. And if parts 5 and 6 never existed, part 4 would be the last part. And if Araki didn't make part 7 in a new continuity, then that would have been the end or even a part after that.

There's nothing inherently special about part 6 that makes it relevant, it just so happened to be the last of the original universe.

Part 7fags overrate their part way too much. They're going to get the opposite effect of if they keep this shit up and anime-onlys get slammed with Mrs Robinson and Pork Pie Hat.
It's a bit more important than that. It's ends the original Joestar/Brando conflict after the stories of Jonathan's, Joseph's, and Jotaro's kids (Giorno, Josuke, and Jolyne) have been explored and concluded.

Besides the point that unlike part 5 (which by all measures is infinitely more irrelevant and almost fanfic tier), part 6 ending is not a regular ending like the one that any other part has, don't be a fucking brainlet, part 6 ending is literally the culmination of part 1-6 story, the absolute ending of dio's reach and jotaro's story, you can't get more relevant than that.

Part 6 only deals with a conflict that was introduced by part 6.

>ending not having an asspull
>pucchi a man faster than star platinum and the only thing being that is sped up with universe can't catch a dolphin or get back to shore'
>weather disk made it to the new universe when not even clothes did
>knocked the weather report disk in by accident

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>finish the joestar/brando conflict
>random kid was the one who killed dio's cocksleeve

>Jotaro's daughter is a stronk female character
>Dio suddenly has a best friend and he's a black repressed homosexual
>Ermes is a Mexican
>Foo Fighters is an otherkin
>Anasui is a tranny orbiter
>Weather Report sleeps with trannies in pianos

If part 5 is almost fanfic tier then part 6 is beyond fanfic tier.

Wrong board, /pol/ is somewhere else

You can't be this dense, yes, part 6 deals with a conflict that is introduced in it, but that conflict root goes as deep as part 1 and the result of that same conflict not only affected the protagonist of the part but also the one from part 2, part, 3, part 4 and part 5 and all the secondaries of the previous parts, again, you can't get more relevant than that.
>pucchi a man faster than star platinum and the only thing being that is sped up with universe can't catch a dolphin or get back to shore'
He was busy killing Jolyne
>weather disk made it to the new universe when not even clothes did
Stands, and things created directly by stands like that disk (something that directly contains a stand) aren't regular things, that stand disk was created by White Snake, which is Pucci's stand so of course the disk was able to survive, Pucci was able to maintain his current stand when he reset the universe.

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The conflict is with Pucci. Not DIO.

Trying too hard there 5faggot, go back to your Giorno porn

Might be a head canon but i don't care. In the Yo Yo Ma fight, Annasui is picking him up and throwing him around like a cushion. I'm thinking that long ranged automatic stands are able to be harmed by humans because they're like a separate entity from the user.

>Jotaro's daughter is a stronk female character
She is indeed a strong character, but definitely not one of those shitty one that you can see in a lot bad fanfic, she actually went trough a lot without becoming edgy, if anything she became a far better person at the end.
>Dio suddenly has a best friend and he's a black repressed homosexual
Dio has always been described as very charismatic so is not a surprise at all that he had a best friend.
>Ermes is a Mexican
>Foo Fighters is an otherkin
>Anasui is a tranny orbiter
>Weather Report sleeps with trannies in pianos
user.

It could just be that Yo yo ma is like that

Yes and Pucci was influenced directly by DIO and that conflict affected literally everyone.

but it's not the same conflict. it's a new one.

Yes a new conflict that was created thanks to the
direct influence of the perpetrator of the original and most important conflict of all the series.

>t. speedreader
Funny cause the most kino moments barely involve the girls.
>"I'M APOLLO 11"
>versace stealing the disc from pucci
>weather flirting with annasui
>"where the fuck is mickey"
>whitesnake shooting johngalli a
>the entire frog rain arc
>FF getting her brain exposed
>diver down putting a frog into yoyo ma's brain
>annasui lying to guccio and turning him into a trap
>pucci using guccio to play a song

unrelated but why the fuck is Yea Forums always fucking with the file size? last year i swear the maximum limit was 6 MB, and now its only 4

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>>weather flirting with annasui
Fuck, not what i meant to write. I meant the part where he's fucking with Annasui and telling him how to talk to ladies.

>Yes a new conflict
Therefore not a continuation or end to an old conflict

The conflict is with Dio's henchmen, yes. One of the motifs of Stone Ocean is revenge and passing things on to others. It's hard to imagine people who knew Dio wouldn't try to seek revenge after seeing their loyalty in Part 3.
After the Universe is reset the conflict is over and there are no loose ends.

This especially considering Parts 4 and 5 had established that DIO had some sort of influence even after death given what happens to Okuyasu's dad, Yoshihiro Kira gaining the stand arrow from him, and Giorno being used to establish DIO spent some time making offspring

Is the end and continuation of the original conflict and at the same time a new one because despite Pucci having different goals than DIO he was able to achieve and put his plan into movement thanks to the aforementioned one presence and that presence is directly tied to the main conflict which ended in the culmination of Pucci's plan and main goal.

Hermes' character ended with Limp Bizkit fight.
very based

>191493393
>has a far better protagonist with an actual personality and character arc
"Daddy issues" the character!
>has a far better antagonist who appears and from the very beginning, has an actual personality, goals and motives.
muh gravity and dead vampire bf
>the ending is toptier without the protagonist pulling some asspull and with an actual fight
everyone dies, this child suddenly killed the antagonist because someone had to do it, but that doesn't matter because everyone is alive again.

Wow, what an amazing plot.

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>retarded eva poster who didn't even understand his own show doesn't understand stone ocean
Who would have thought

>"Daddy issues" the character!
She only has resentment over Jotaro and despite that, when Jotaro is not around she never brings it up.
>muh gravity and dead vampire bf
? muh gangsta, muh hands, muh take over the world, muh gem, muh anonymity
>everyone dies, this child suddenly killed the antagonist because someone had to do it, but that doesn't matter because everyone is alive again.
In the circumstances that they were Emporio was the most fitting to kill Pucci and they are not the same people.

No, it's just a new conflict. It does not continue anything that started in a previous part.

Have you tried to read part 6? Araki went through a transition phase in his paneling at the expense of us readers. The panel placements wete at times unnecessarily complex and the flow was mostly bumpy.

It was a case of a decently written speech, ruined by awful oratory

>No, it's just a new conflict. It does not continue anything that started in a previous part.
It continues the fight against the Joestars and that fight is the conflict of the main series.

The fight against Dio's lackeys started in Part 1.

There is no "fight against the Joestars". There are multiple fights that members of the Joestar family coincidentally find themselves wrapped up in that are sometimes loosely connected.

And ended in Part 1.
Then DIO came back in Part 3 and found new lackeys, which led to another fight that ended in Part 3.

Part 6 is not either of those fights. Pucci was not in Parts 1 or 3.

And what is to prevent those that didn't die in Part 3 or had a relation to Dio from seeking revenge?
Part 6 puts an end to that.

>There is no "fight against the Joestars".
You can't say that with a straight face
The fight against the Joestars started with DIO and had a direct influence over all the parts.
If DIO had not existed and didn't start the fight against the Joestars with Jonathan, nothing in part 3, 4, 5 and 6 would have happened. Part 6 is the end of the struggle of the Joestars against dio's influence in their lives, is the end in all ways to that fight that started in part 1.
>Part 6 is not either of those fights. Pucci was not in Parts 1 or 3.
Of course not, but he is a sub-product of part 1 and 3 that is directly tied to dio and dio's influence.

They didn't exist until Part 6 started.

Dios heaven plan is dumb and came out of nowhere. Couldnt araki just use the stone mask or the arrows since theyre already established? Why the weird meta-religious nonsense?

Bad writing.

This doesn't refute what I said. The parts are loosely related to DIO but they aren't part of one big fight. Most of the antagonists have never heard of DIO and don't know "the Joestars" until after they get involved.

He was trapped for nearly a century with the decomposing corpse of his adoptive brother. You'd come up with a way of achieving heaven too if you had to do the same for so long.

No you wouldn't.

I'll make you immortal and send you to the bottom of the ocean and we'll see.

Araki wanted to introduce something new and he knew that if he decided to introduce something like the arrows he would need to bring Giorno back somehow and he already had 3 parts dealing with the arrows and 2 with the stone masks and because probably he simply wanted to start a new universe and needed and excuse.
Also remember that he was trapped 100 years in a coffin, pretty sure he had a lot of time to meditate and become more interested in that sort of stuff.
>The parts are loosely related to DIO
They aren't loosely related, Kira got an stand directly thanks to dio, Giorno is ouright dio's son and Pucci directly talked with him while being influence by dio himself.
>but they aren't part of one big fight
They are the fight against dio's influence throughout the series.

>all of the stands are terrible
fuck you nigger, part 6 has the most creative stands

>Part 6 is literally the worst written part
Everything you said part 5 did worst though

>They aren't loosely related, Kira got an stand directly thanks to dio,
Kira got his stand from his father's arrow which he got from Enya. Not DIO.
>Giorno is ouright dio's son
There is no conflict between Giorno and the Joestars.
>and Pucci directly talked with him while being influence by dio himself.
That's just Part 6, like I said before. It's not what the whole series is about.

>They are the fight against dio's influence throughout the series.
If that's the case, then you can't even claim that Part 6 put an end to that fight because DIO's influence still exists afterwards.

The argument just doesn't work. Part 6 doesn't conclude the stories that came before it, it tells a new one. I think that people should read it and enjoy it for what it is, and not because it's the supposed end to a previous part.

>And of course it's from a "hur dur what is diavolo's motivation" poster.
You know that the only good thing about Diavolo is actually the existence of Doppio, right?

>Part 6 is literally the worst written part. It's difficult to read through, the narrative is sloppy

Pay attention nigga and don't speedread

>the pacing is all over the place

If you speedread yes

>the minor antagonists are lackluster

Sports Max, Rikiel, and Versace were god tier, and McQueen and Gwess were good intro level threats

>all of the stands are terrible

Part 6 has the most creative stands in the series

>and it has the weakest cast by a long shot

Aside from Hermes this isn't true

>Jolyne is a pathetic MC who is just an edgy whiny bitch with daddy issues. Her poor actions are blamed on Jotaro and she doesn't have a moment of self-reflection to become a more mature person. Being a Strong Female Character™ isn't being mature

Jolyne doesn't blame everything on Jotaro and she has a moment of self reflection when she forgives him after putting herself in the punishment ward.

>by the way. Pucci is a cliched, generic shounen villain with a backstory that is ridiculous, laughable and tacked on late into the story

Yes because all shonen villains believe they are genuinely good people who are humble. Pucci is one of the best written Jojo villains in the series for being more proactive and competent than most which isn't something that could be said for generic Jojo villains.

>DIO's sons were a complete waste as they were just more fodder of the week with no personality

Versace literally caused Weather Report to die and was a cocky entitled bastard who felt he should be the one to attain Heaven due to being related to DIO, Rikiel was an honorable warrior willing to give a fair fight and not using underhanded tactics, and Ungalo was someone who felt society personally fucked him over but I can agree he's probably more fodder-ish

>And the ending is fucking terrible.

Why? Is it because Giorno didn't use GER to save everything?

Sadly this, it's the truth. Diavolo gets so much attention because he's also a frail little kid and their relationship is okay. Remove Doppio (which happens, he dies and Diavolo doesn't know or care) and you just have some schizo. That post from earlier about how you need Dio to defend Pucci actually applies to Doppio and Diavolo,

>If that's the case, then you can't even claim that Part 6 put an end to that fight because DIO's influence still exists afterwards.
Is the end of dio's influence and conflict in the original universe.
>Part 6 doesn't conclude the stories that came before it
It does, it concludes not only the fight against dio's influence over the Joestars but also Jotaro's story as well.
The universe in part 6 literally got reset, and that was something that affected every single living thing in it, you can call part 6 whatever you want but irrelevant is the least correct of all of them.

I honestly can't believe that part 5 fags exist now. Digornio is the least interesting thing about his part.

>Is the end of dio's influence and conflict in the original universe.
How is it the end? The only thing that is different by the end of Part 6 is that Pucci is gone. That's just one out of many of DIO's influences. If you're going to count everything that DIO is related to as being a part of the conflict, then the conflict didn't end in Part 6.

The more I look back at Part 6, the more I like it.

Especially when they talk about how deep Part 5 is despite the last arc literally spelling it out for the readers/watchers and shitting on Part 6

Once Part 6 airs everybody will suddenly love it like with Part 5

The chapter where Jolyne fucks up Romeo's tongue shows more character than Giorno did in the entirety of Part 5.

If aim honest with you I would not be surprised at all if Jolyne in one chapter had more dialogues than Giorno in 3-4.

>Giorno is brutal with all of his enemies defeats
>Shows grief and sadness with the deaths of his comrades
>Willingly destroys his body to inspire others

Wrong wrong wrong

>Protag is chivalrous
Wow, what complex and deep characterization and totally not just a boring "just criminal" archetype

>What is the Banana gun
>What is Bruno's death at the hands of King Crimson along with Narancia
>What is White Album

Giorno is literally the best of two worlds with Jonathon's humbleness and Dio's tactical ruthlessness

Watch this bit on Giorno and I timestamped it for you too, it will be 7 minutes of your time

youtu.be/jXPziHbmOEs?t=321

>inb4 "MUH JOJOTUBERS ARE BAD"

Fucking watch it retard and try to prove the points said

all of giorno's dialogues are:
>now i understand how the enemy stand works
>something about resolve

even worse, the whole gang has better dialogues and interactions
>torture dance
>kicking the shit out of that random passerby
>mista eating lunch
>fugo worried about narancia screwing up
>abbacchio being a dick towards giorno
>bruno being a soccer mom
>pesci and prosciutto's learning dynamics
>cioccolata and secco's awkwardness
>fucking doppio

any panel or scene in which giorno is present feels like some npc dialogue, only the 7 page muda feels alive

Literally based and repilled SOchad

Attached: Volumen_80.png (984x1548, 3.3M)

Oh my god did this guy really just link a fucking jojotuber as his argument.

>Oh my god did this guy really just link a fucking jojotuber as his argument.

Not an argument

>12 (twelve) (you)'s since I left
>what is a pasta
Fucking newfags lmao.

SOtists in a nutshell.

>I WAS JUST PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED

>post ask about why Stone Ocean is consider bad
>user post his arguments
>other anons respond to those arguments
>this is bad because is a pasta and you are not allowed to reply to pasta even if they are relevant to the op

>Giorno is literally the best of two worlds with Jonathon's humbleness and Dio's tactical ruthlessness
Johnny is a selfish whiny psycho with inferiority complex, he's still better than Giorno as a character in a story

I hate this shit, "who cares if the bait spurred legitimate discussion, you're all still retards for replying lol"

>Johnny is a selfish whiny psycho with inferiority complex, he's still better than Giorno as a character in a story
That has nothing to do with Johnny, maybe bring an actual rebuttal on Giorno

>you're all still retards for replying lol
Yes they literally are

Attached: DoppioPortrait.png (734x982, 1.36M)

>muh jonathan/dio
sure but what about GIORNO? i don't care about how he calls back at other characters, he as a standalone character is a cardboard cutout, pretty much all his personality is:
>my resolve is bigger than yours
>i am very smart at figuring out the enemy's stand by myself

even the interactions with bruno and mista who are the closest characters to him seem too robotic, i can buy giorno's worry about bruno, but it is overshadowed by "I HAVE A DREAM" each and every time

>Part 5 fag calling others retard

Go back to enjoying your part where there was a literal arc made to spoonfeed themes to you

>sure but what about GIORNO?

He is mischievous given his interactions with Koichi and the piss scene

What was mischievous about it?

>Part 5 fag
>hurr durr muh boogieman
God you guys literally are leddit, I like Part 6 I'm not even that user but they are unironically retarded because they felt for some Yea Forums tier bait

He made everyone think he drank piss and he just took Koichi's shit not giving a shit about the manlet

>God you guys literally are leddit

Not that user, but reddit hates Part 6 and is full of Part 2/5 fags who suck Joseph, Giorno, and Speedwagon's dick

Do you actually know what mischievous means?
The piss drinking chapter isn't mischievous at all and the minimal characterization we get at the very beginner of the part is dropped not long after it's introduced.

Can someone post that Jojo template of favorite protagonists, stands, fights, and whatnot? Tried to find it, but get ant sized and blurry pictures

>reddit hates Part 6
Show some evidence of this

P6 is good part. Only people that hate it are the seething incels who cant handle a woman protagonist. Only Jojo end fight that isn't a complete asspull.

>Not that user

Attached: OK6W_koKDTOqqqLDbIoPAizypB31hX6IvXWpYpzxpTw.png (1280x738, 1003K)

All the people who literally say to not skip it are just saying it so Araki has more time to finish 8 and to get to Part 7 quicker

Also the faggots who are like "WE NEED TO GET TO PART 7, IGNORE 6"

inb4 and are the same person

>Only Jojo end fight that isn't a complete asspull.
>OH MY JOBBER PROTAGONIST
You guys are literal gold, please never stop.

The Kira fight doesn't have an asspull

AU Diego fight doesn't have an asspull

Only final fights that have asspulls are Parts 2, 3, and 5

>5
Can we stop with this meme already?

Explain how it isn't an asspull

Where?

The protagonists dying is an asspull? I'm getting baited hard aren't I.

O MY SUN BEHIND MY HEAD

>Muh Giorno already won by getting the arrow!
No you fucking retard, sure, he achieved the goal, but the fight itself was only won because of "lol i can do anything now".

Reddit and Twitter

I literally just search "jojo part 6" and scroll a little under the images and found this with the source being Reddit.

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>Jonathon's humbleness and Dio's tactical ruthlessness
Being a Jonathan/Dio hybrid is contradictory though. He steals, he lies, he disposes anyone who crosses him, the exception being Bruno. Giorno's gentlemanly nature doesn't shine, more like it occasionally peaks in very small moments. If anything, Giorno is 80% Dio and 20% Jonathan.
Giorno is just a funny character all around. His motivations are honestly weak, "muh drugs" isn't a meme for a reason. What are his policies as a gang boss anyway? What direction does he want to direct the gang in? Why drugs specifically when gangs do all kinds of terrible things? We just don't know, his moral code is fucked. Interactions with other guys in the crew? Giorno didn't make the crew or recruit anyone, Bruno did, Giorno is the newfag. His interactions with the crew are lackluster. How much dialogue does he have with Trish? Or Narancia? When he does talk with them it's either Aba shitting on him or everyone else giving him praise and kissing his ass. It's so forced and artificial.
The most interesting thing about Giorno is when he does absolute madman stuff like steal cars and lie to Cioccolata, otherwise he's bland.

That's literally trivial you fucking brainlet, they fought to get arrow and by doing that they fucking got it and won, Jesus is that so hard to understand? The "le part 5 ending is an asspull xD" meme is even worse than the "hurr durr how does KC even works"

Attached: Sin título.png (2640x1692, 1.54M)

See my post that counters this exact argument that you seemed to have missed

The Requiem Arrow was the real asspull, it felt so forced in at the last second it was ridiculous.

>Sin título.png

Oh now I see haha.

Attached: lmao.png (1920x1080, 1.78M)

That's literally how the story it's supposed to be, how the fuck is it an asspull?

Part 5 may be shit, but the requiem arrow it's still less of "asspull" than jotaro getting the world.

Honestly, it's kinda "justified" but i agree it's a still a shitty plot device.
shit they got me

We aren't talking about the story, we are talking about the fight itself you O MY GER apologist

Look up the definition of asspull and explain how polnareff and the arrow is not an asspull

Giorno has the most half assed and retarded motivations of any manga ever.

The worst part is how he never does something to prove his point, we just saw him becoming the boss (which in the end means literally nothing) and just that, like Araki forgot to add another 1/3 portion of story.

Do you even know the meaning of asspull? God you're so fucking dense, think I'm getting baited real hard here

>O MUH DADDY ISSUES
Yikes

Do YOU know what the meaning of asspull is?
Where is "lol death loop" hinted at at any point in the story beforehand? Silver Chariot Requiem's ability is completely different from GER's?
>Hurr durr da fight is just a formality after getting the arrow
What a flimsy excuse to let the most egregious asspull in the series slide, it doesn't matter if the goal is completed, the fight itself was won through an asspull

>Silver Chariot Requiem's ability is completely different from GER's?
Requiem controls souls retard also

>Where is "lol death loop" hinted at at any point in the story beforehand?

Where is Dio's head being alive hinted at, where is Kars not being able to survive in Space hinted at, where is DIO's leg being weak hinted at?

The real asspull of Part 5 isn’t anything in the final battle itself, but rather the sudden introduction of Polnareff.
>O MY FRENCH GUY WITH AN ARROW

>where is DIO's leg being weak hinted at?
Never. DIO's weak leg is not canon.

>Where is Dio's head being alive hinted at, where is Kars not being able to survive in Space hinted at, where is DIO's leg being weak hinted at?
Are we talking about the other parts right now, retard?
Also Kars can survive in space you speedreading fuck
>He thinks Dio's head was an asspull
Holy fuck, VAutists really are something else.

>Where is "lol death loop" hinted at at any point in the story beforehand?
>Hurr durr if they don't talk about the exact definition of the ability before it's showed then it's an asspull
Yup, I knew it was bait, you got me on the last one though so touché.

I hope for your sake you aren't talking about Jolyne.
Jolyne's daddy issues end when she realized why Jotaro wasn't around and how he put himself in danger to save her. This is really early in part 6, which is why I believe anyone who thinks Jolyne has daddy issues as if it lasts the whole part is a speedreader.

>what is an ambulance

The minor villains are a step back from the epic Part 5 villains.

>P1
Dio has a hamon sword cut through his neck but the ripples dont reach his brain bc magic
>P4
Ambulance man saves the day

Each of the first 5 parts are asspull ends

>Being so dumb you don't understand the ambulance
He was defeated, what's more inconspicuous, the ambulance seemingly backing over his head on accident or his bloody pulp instantaneously appearing in front of the entire town?
And on top of that, it reinforces the "Golden Spirit of Morioh"

>the arrow chose giorno
>not as asspull
P5 fags are pathetic

>what is Jotaro literally obliterating him
Oh are we gonna start with that?

>exact definition of the ability before it's showed then it's an asspull
Yeah, it is you fucking moron, when the exact same situation is shown with a completely different ability.
The bottom line is Araki made KC too powerful and he realized the characters had no realistic way of defeating him and needed something fast.
Just keep calling me a retarder baiter, that'll surely make up for the fact you don't know how to truly argue

>the epic Part 5 villains.
Oh yeah who can forget the great peppechino linguini who wanted to kill people for money

The arrow is not an asspull per se, but more of something extremely convenient, i mean, dont you think that is fucking convenient that a villain is introduced how is seemingly stronger than DIO and now there is an new arrow that gives you the opportunity to defeat it? that doesn't sounds convenient to you in the slightest? at least with Pucci you can argue that after spending 100 years in a coffin meditating and thinking DIO had something like an epiphany and was able to come up with those step but the arrow being introduced in the same part has Diavolo so there could be a way to defeat him is inexcusable.
>but what about Kira!
Yes Kira got hit by an arrow but he simply gained a new ability that wasn't very broken and defeat trough brain.

>the ambulance ran over him for Jotaros sake
Fucking worse in that case. Anyways he was going to go back in time by blowing the nice lady to smithereens with bites the dust, they got saved by the true protagonist, EMT driver

>its not an asspull it's just extremely convenient
Oh yeah the volcano blowing Kars out of orbit wasnt an asspull either it was just extremely convenient. Faggot

>The arrow is not an asspull per se, but more of something extremely convenient
That pretty much is an asspull.

Extremely convenient + saves the heroes + added in at the last minute with no foreshadowing = asspull

>Oh yeah the volcano blowing Kars out of orbit wasnt an asspull either it was just extremely convenient. Faggot
And were the hell I am defending part 2? faggot.

Might as well say
>P6
Weather's disc happens to contain the oxygen increase part
>P7
Gyro told Johnny about infinite rotation despite spending months on horseback before

>just happens to contain oxygen increase part
>as if that's not part of the stand to begin with. Controlling weather
>haven't read P7 yet so I concede

>he was going to go back in time by blowing the nice lady to smithereens with bites the dust
Nice headcanon faggot, wew I didn't knew SOtists hated DiU as well

>>the ambulance ran over him for Jotaros sake
I always assumed Jotaro beating the shit out of him launched him right behind the ambulance which is why the EMT says "He appeared out of nowhere"

>haven't read P7 yet so I concede
Don't worry, he's wrong about that too.

>doesnt know what a comparison is
Dear God were you born retarded or just dropped on your head as a child?

You mean the lady talking to him wasnt a dead give away that they knew he was there? Damn, SO haters really are sub-human IQ

Jotaro had already prevented him from reactivating BTD.

Okay, yes, part 2 ending is an asspull, i have never said the opposite, now, were are your arguments about part 5's arrows not being something extremely convenient or outright and asspull.?

vGyro told Johnny about infinite rotation despite spending months on horseback before
Based, the Infinite Rotation and Tusk IV are some of the worst aspulls in jojo history, O MY LITERALLY UNSTOPPABLE NAIL SHOT, inb4 SBRetards will defend this

Imagine being this bad at critical thinking.

>Damn, SO haters really are sub-human IQ
Where did I say or even imply I hate SO
Also the only time they talk to him after Jotaro resumes time was when they were already basically on top of him, go reread the chapter

SOtists are literal schizos straigh out of Tumblr, as simple as that, that is why they hate Part 4 and 5 so much user.

>You mean the lady talking to him wasnt a dead give away that they knew he was there?
Uh, user? Kira wasn't crushed in the place where the lady was talking to him.

"Spin your nails in the golden ratio!... then you should have the ability to harness the power of infinity."
Gyro literally said that to Johnny in chapter 43.

>O MY HIDDEN DORMANT ABILITY PUCCI DIDN'T KNOW
>O MY I COULD HAVE USED THE DISC SINCE THE C-MOON FIGHT BUT FUCK JOLYNE AMIRITE

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Why does Daft Punk not have a stand or character after them?

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*Doesn’t

Because Araki isn't Reddit

>REEE THEY LIKE A STORY WITH FEMALE PROTAG
>TUMBLR TUMBLR
FREE REAL ESTATE. Have sex incel
>why they hate part 4 so much
I love part 4, more than I like P6 honestly. I'm just not a total faggot about hating P6 like you sad KHVs are

C-Moon could literally have fucked with Emporio's gravity and kept him far away from it, and Emporio was reliant on Jolyne

Part 6 isn't bad it's just got a really boring middle part. It's exacerbated severely by the fact you know they will break out of prison.

>Have sex incel
I prefer to watch, actually.

>SOtists are literal schizos straigh out of Tumblr, as simple as that, that is why they hate Part 4
>I love part 4
>Literally admitted being a SOtist
Holy shit this has to be a fucking joke

Based.

I don't know boss, I'm a KHV but Jolyne is one of my favorite Pre-SBRverse protags

>O MY HIDDEN DORMANT ABILITY PUCCI DIDN'T KNOW
Why would Pucci know about that ability? Weather spent the majority of his life without his memories or using his stand so of course he doesn't know what he can do with it, in the same way KQ had multiples abilities WR can have them as well.
>O MY I COULD HAVE USED THE DISC SINCE THE C-MOON FIGHT BUT FUCK JOLYNE AMIRITE

>Samefagging this hard
>On Yea Forums

Based

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>cant like multiple parts
Are you that autistic that you think everything has to be a group war on the internet?

Take this L nigger

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Screencapped lol, that's fucking gold.

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I like Vento Aureo, but it really is the only part of JoJo you could skip without losing anything for it. A Stand expansion pack.

What did he mean by this?

>Take this L

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>cringe aureo leftists calling the rest of the crew on the fujo discord to raid and flood the thread with garbage
yikes!

>fujo discord
please tell me how I can go there

Nigga what the fuck is reddit

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Okay but can we all agree that part 4 is the best and Great Days is the most kino OP

Did you forget to take your meds?

If you treat it as a spin-off, it's solid.
A lot of it comes down to personal taste like everything, I personally love the location, the subject matter of the mafia, the fights, the stand designs, and the supporting cast, but it barely fits in with the rest of the series, even just in tone.

Ok i cant keep with this farce anymore, you got me.
>inb4 inspect element
Is there a way for you to demonstrate that you aren't doing that yourself?

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>daft punk is reddit
How can someone be so stupid

>Great Days is the most kino OP
Literally incorrect to the nth degree
youtube.com/watch?v=OpUbnLjexTc
Bloody Stream, the song and the OP itself, fits the extremely stylized tone of Jojo to a T.

VAfag's and SOtists are so fun to watch when they fight lmao, besides that they need to go Yea Forumsack

Based, it's impossible he's not trolling though

Aye dont get me twisted, Bloody Stream is the shit. But I'm including the Kira twist along with the OP which gives it that extra edge. Stream was my favorite for a real longtime before that

>But I'm including the Kira twist along with the OP which gives it that extra edge
I can respect that

Go to Yea Forums and say it isn't, Good Luck With That.

Weather is so blackpilled he turns into chad. Based black man

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>Yea Forums
>hipsters who post garbage music are experts on what good music is

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Part 4 is the second best after Part 7.

Vento Aureo is filled to the brim with cool designs and fights. It's really entertaining.

Even if Diavolo's powers and motivations are abstract, you can't deny that there's something really entertaining about King Crimson. It provides us with a spectacular insight into the possibilities of how Stands operate.

To me, that's a significant part of its appeal as I believe Stands are a significant part of JoJo's appeal as a whole. That entire concept is cool. No one can really deny this.

Part 5 also has a really nice overarching theme; the ends do not justify the means, the method one takes in reaching their goals is more important than reaching the goal in question, as it eventually sublimates into the truth. It's simple, but nice, and is reflected well in Giorno and Diavolo. It's also touched on by Ahbacchio.

Also Diavolo's goals are simple; as a young man, and as an adult, he does not want to be weighed down. People who know his identity are anchors, baggage and this is where they start to become liabilities. Liabilities to his free moving and wholly selfish way of life. Past mistakes, regrets, are the same way.

His ability cannot change them, so the only way to make it so those low points in his life cease to exist is by eliminating everyone related to those incidents. Trying to investigate him means you are jeopardizing his way of life, his perfection; an affront to his identity that is akin to murder. That's why people like that need to be eliminated.

So maybe he isn't executed as well as he could have been (although I don't know how he could have been done better) or explored as thoroughly as he should have been (inb4: that might be the point, user! We could have learned more about Diavolo through his perspective) but he's very intriguing, and has a cool power.

Sometimes being cool is all it really takes to make a story work. There's plenty of reasons to like Part 5.

This is a copy/paste from plebbit isn't it?

I just wrote that myself.

>the method one takes in reaching their goals is more important than reaching the goal in question,
And then Giorno became the boss, the end.

Giorno's methods are pretty good.

>Makes a capo kill himself because of an oversight for their stand which is automatic
>Lies to the whole gang about his involvement with that

We never know his method.

There are good things and bad things about all parts of JoJo. Not currently in the mood to write a fucking essay, but y'all can discuss.

We see his methods.

Polpo was a piece of shit with an utter disregard for human life. That's why Giorno killed him.

> His stand is automatic.
Then he shouldn't be instructing it to stab people with an arrow. The initiation into Passione is designed to draw out Stand users solely for the benefit of the gang and doesn't take civilians into account. Black Sabbath attacks people indiscriminately and that's not okay.

Will jolyne actually get some decent lewds?

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>We see his methods.
Where? It just shows him sitting in a chair.

I agree with this right now, but depending on where it goes, part 8 could overtake both for me.

All throughout part 5.

I hope not, Jolyne is pure-ish.

What his method for becoming the boss? We never see it.

We see his methods for dealing with problems / living his life / getting what he wants all throughout Part 5.

Jolyne is cute but not pure.

Pretty sure killing Diavolo is what makes him the boss. Who is going to tell GER no.

We never see his method for becoming the boss. It's skipped over - the process is ignored in favor of the result.

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Was killing Diavolo not the process

Killing the boss (that nobody in the gang knows about) does not magically make you the new boss.

>KILLING BIG STRONG BAD MAN IS THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS
Part 5 isn’t as subversive and clever as people think.

kill yourself.

Who the fuck called it subversive?

I mean, people have to know Diavolo exists, they just don't have any personal information on him. I'm sure there are channels to get the word out that Diavolo is dead, and even if people don't initially believe him, who the hell is going to tell Giorno he can't be the boss?

Super cute

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I’ve seen posters call VA a brilliant subversion of Shonen tropes.

I wouldn't call it subversive.

If anything it seems to be embrace its Shonen heritage. That was the gist of my initial post; it's fun. Before getting side tracked I was going to do a comparison with Part 6 but this guy summed things up pretty well.

No

>I mean, people have to know Diavolo exists, they just don't have any personal information on him.
They know that there is a boss, but they don't know who he is. If the boss dies, nobody will know about it. And they certainly won't be able to know who killed him.

>I'm sure there are channels to get the word out that Diavolo is dead
But does Giorno know about them? Can he access them?

>and even if people don't initially believe him, who the hell is going to tell Giorno he can't be the boss?
Who would tell him that he can be the boss? You're already making a huge leap by assuming that he'd be talking to anybody in the first place. At the end of the fight at the Colosseum, Giorno is a homeless traitor with no resources or connections. He's not in the gang anymore. All the capos that he met are dead, there's no way for him to contact Passione at all unless he gets Mista to call Fugo and beg him to let them back in.

Of course, this is all beside the point. Whether or not we can imagine how Giorno became the boss is irrelevant - the fact remains that we are never shown it in the story. Araki violates his own message by ignoring the methods and showing only the goal.

yes.

Are there any pictures of her with Avdol?

She has plenty of decent lewds. Where are you guys looking that you can't find any?

Nope sorry. I got Joseph though

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> But does Giorno know about them? Can he access them?

If he didn't, Mista or Trish sure as hell did.

>Araki violates his own message by ignoring the methods and showing only the goal.

I feel like this is a really dishonest assertion. If you kill the leader of a criminal organization that you, yourself are a part of, that creates a vacancy - and it's only a matter of asserting one's self to fill that vacancy. Typically what happens with criminal organizations in those situations is that a schism occurs and fighting over who gets what territory and what profit begins. It continues like this until either someone appears to take control of the chaos or two distinct groups become larger entities.

Part 5 could have been made even longer to demonstrate this gang war, but I feel like that's unnecessary, as killing Diavolo is shorthand for that process, being the ascension in and of itself.

Giorno wants to become Passione's boss (more specifically, he wants to become a Gang-Star, basically a famous gangster with ethics and morals).

To become Passione's boss, he has to displace Passione's current boss. This is just logic.

By killing Diavolo, he has therefore displaced him. We follow him on his journey to do this.

We also definitely see him become a more famous gangster. (see Ciocolatta's fight, Giorno has been making waves on his trip.)

So, no, we don't just skip to the goal. Through following Giorno on his journey, we very much reach the truth: you can't just use your powers to fuck people over and expect to get away with it. Morality, human empathy, and the sanctity of life take precedence.

>Through following Giorno on his journey, we very much reach the truth: you can't just use your powers to fuck people over and expect to get away with it.
Don’t we learn the opposite? Giorno uses power to fuck people over And is rewarded with more power.

anyone has the english subs for part 5? got them episodes from a russian site so no eng subs

Giorno only ever dispatches people trying to kill him or his comrades. Other gangsters, not innocent people, allies, children, etc.

Anyways, you're being willfully ignorant and I'm not in the mood to bite the bait today, so this'll be my last response.

I’m not the same person that you were talking to.

>Giorno only ever dispatches people trying to kill him or his comrades. Other gangsters, not innocent people, allies, children, etc.
user, he is a literal gangstar now, what do you think gangsters do? fight criminals?

But all the animes tell me that gangsters are good!

>If you kill the leader of a criminal organization that you, yourself are a part of, that creates a vacancy - and it's only a matter of asserting one's self to fill that vacancy.
The thing is, Giorno isn't anywhere close to filling that vacancy. If Part 5 was a story about Giorno working his way up the ranks, and fighting Diavolo when he's in a position to inherit his position, it would make sense. It even starts out that way, with Bruno becoming a capo. But then the story pretty much goes in the opposite direction. Giorno (and the others) all openly betray the gang. They lose their status as members of the organization.

>To become Passione's boss, he has to displace Passione's current boss.
>By killing Diavolo, he has therefore displaced him.
This is just the first step in becoming the boss. Displacing Diavolo only creates room for someone else to become the new boss. It does not guarantee that Giorno will be that someone.

>We also definitely see him become a more famous gangster. (see Ciocolatta's fight, Giorno has been making waves on his trip.)
I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. If it's just Ciocolatta knowing about Giorno, it's because the boss knows about Giorno and would have passed that information along because he's one of their targets. It's not like he's becoming known within the organization as a whole. If he had, then it might make more sense that the other capos would willingly choose him as the new boss, but the story isn't written that way.

>So, no, we don't just skip to the goal. Through following Giorno on his journey, we very much reach the truth: you can't just use your powers to fuck people over and expect to get away with it. Morality, human empathy, and the sanctity of life take precedence.
I don't agree with this and I don't think it's relevant to what we were discussing earlier. The process by which Giorno goes from being a traitor to becoming the boss is very much skipped over in order to get to the goal.

The first thing we see him do is bribe some cops to steal Koichi's luggage. Sounds like using your powers to fuck people over to me.

I guess Part 5 is just too deep for you.

Not only does he bribe policemen, but he bribes them with DRUGS.

I would have sex with the entire entity known as Foo Fighters.

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Why? Is it just physical attraction?

Giorno is only a traitor to Diavolo's Passione. Once Diavolo stops existing, this is no longer a problem.

The rest of Passione will still see him as an enemy for killing their boss.

> It's not like he's becoming known within the organization as a whole.

He definitely is. Your own logic (that being a traitor means he's no longer a member of the organization even though the person he's betrayed was killed) means that people have to know about him to know that he's a traitor.

Just by virtue of knowing Fugo, Mista, Bucciarti, and killing Diavolo, he's a famous gangster, but his reputation probably extends beyond that.

> This is just the first step in becoming the boss. Displacing Diavolo only creates room for someone else to become the new boss. It does not guarantee that Giorno will be that someone.

But pic related does.

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>This is just the first step in becoming the boss. Displacing Diavolo only creates room for someone else to become the new boss. It does not guarantee that Giorno will be that someone
Come on, did you really want to see GER saying "lol nope" to a bunch of nobodies

It really says a lot about Giorno's personality the fact that the best thing anybody can say about him is "hehe he can beat anyone"

>All chapters must contain epic stand battles! What could Giorno possibly do other than use his big strong powers to get his way?

i dont understand, this is all about part 5 and not part 6. you havent said anything about part 6

No one is going to fuck with a 15 year old teenager that not only killed the mysterious boss that no one dared to talk about lest they get killed but also completely destroyed the boss personal guards and traitors from the fucking best assassin squad.

>Hi guys I was the boss all along how are you doing
(like PHF did)
or
>Hi guys I'm the new boss, the one who killed the old boss, his personal guards and even La Squadra, you better believe me unless you want infinite death

I don't think it was really that important to show this desu, the only things I really wanted to see were Fugo and Trish desu

It's not "Diavolo's Passione", it's just Passione. He betrayed the whole organization.

>Your own logic (that being a traitor means he's no longer a member of the organization even though the person he's betrayed was killed) means that people have to know about him to know that he's a traitor.
What I mean is that he isn't going to be known for anything other than being one of the traitors. Not as a famous gangster that the capos would consider willingly pledging their new loyalty to after the old boss was gone. They won't know of his accomplishments or principles, or anything else about him that would affect his ability to become the boss.

I will admit that my argument was worded poorly but I was fighting against the character limit.

>But pic related does.
It really doesn't. There's no rule that says that the guy with the strongest stand gets to be the boss and most of the members aren't stand users. Unless the implication is supposed to be that he just uses his power to force everyone to submit to him, but that's going against the whole
> you can't just use your powers to fuck people over and expect to get away with it
idea.

But again this is all irrelevant to the fact that Araki skipped the methods to show us the result, invalidating the message.

>Hi guys I created this organization 15 years ago when I was an infant

How would they know that there was only one boss, or even that Giorno is 15 years old?
Still, there is the second option I mentioned

What is this some part 5 vs 6 thread?

Giorno's identity is not a secret

If it’s that simple, why couldn’t Araki dedicate a few pages to it?

The battle for last place is vicious.

Because the only thing that matters is the result!

Based bossu.

Diavolo really won in the end huh..

Everyone knows Part 1 is the last place. But I do prefer 5 over 6 so I guess I'm on 5's side

>araki foreshadowing joruno starting to be more like diavolo
Based?

Exactly. I just called out a guy claiming to be a navy seal in another thread

Lets say that the villain of part 9 is Giorno who managed to went troughs MiH like nothing thanks to GER and decides to make another Passione, would yo like it? I personally would love if the final villain end-up being him and Araki decides to finally give him more personality by example making him overconfident thanks to GER also making a previous Jojo the antagonist(who happens to be dio's son) fighting against another one would be a good fit for the ending of the series.

It would feel out of place after we've been away from the original continuity for so long. I don't think there will be a part 9.

Agreed, giorno is a terrible fucking character and stone ocean was a far better read

How could you defeat GER tho

>I don't think there will be a part 9.
There probably will be.
>part 7 is a mix of part 1-2
>part 8 is a mix of part 3-4
>part 9 would be a mix of part 5-6 (end of the line in the original universe)

Well the arrows fell from GER's head which means that Giorno needs to stabs his stand every time he wants to use it, pretty sure you could steal it from him before he activates it.
>part 9 is another battle to get the arrow like in part 5 but this time done right.

Dios son all represent a broke aspect of DIO and if they can overcome it.

Ung represent DIOs mind.
Versace DIOs body.
Rykiel DIOs spirit.

Araki confirmed this in an interview.

Based

Do you have a link?

yes hold on I have to shit it out first

Because it was that simple.

It was fucking obvious once he killed Diavolo.

That was it, nigga.
That was the process.

Another user asked who would want to see GER beat the dogshit out of random nobodies for several more chapters and not one person has yet to come forward and say, "Hyuck, yeah boss, give me some of that!"

I don't know about all that.

If anything I would have wanted to see Giorno in Part 6 or something.

Why the fck would you want the worst character in the series to reappear?

That's not the process of how he became the boss.

A "Giorno Giovanna" that is to GioGio what Diego is to Dio, maybe but not the other way around.

You mean 1-3 and 2-4 right?

...

Giorno killed Polpo. And then on the next page, Giorno was the new capo. That's how it works, right?

Obviously! Once you kill big strong bad man, things instantly go your way!

It is though.

>It really doesn't. There's no rule that says that the guy with the strongest stand gets to be the boss and most of the members aren't stand users. Unless the implication is supposed to be that he just uses his power to force everyone to submit to him, but that's going against the whole
> you can't just use your powers to fuck people over and expect to get away with it
idea.

They're gangsters; at the end of the day, if someone won't work with you, or submit to your authority, you use force, that's how it works. They are NOT civilians.

Also, no it doesn't go against that idea at all. There's a difference between doing what the antagonists of VA and telling niggas they cannot beat GER to make them get in line.

No one ever said Giorno was a saint, but the VA antagonists are scum with no regard for civilians.

> It really doesn't. There's no rule that says that the guy with the strongest stand gets to be the boss and most of the members aren't stand users.

I guarantee that's how it works.

> It is remarkable by the secretiveness of its members and the unusually high number of Stand Users among them.

> The most remarkable teams of Passione were La Squadra Esecuzioni, who were responsible for assassinations, and La Unita Speciale who operates directly under the Boss' orders. The gang's strangest member is Vinegar Doppio, who serves as the main cover for the Boss and works as his right hand, thus operating alone.

If you think Stands =/= clout in Passione you're delusional, and arguing for the sake of arguing.

>It is though.
No it isn't. Diavolo being dead does not automatically make Giorno the boss.

>obey me or suffer for eternity
That fits the description of abusing power to screw people over pretty well, even if those people are other gangsters.

It pretty much does though.

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I'm 100 percent sure that Giorno wouldn't have any qualms letting people leave, and would only take action against them if they attempted to eek out a profit through the same means in Passione's territory.

Which is perfectly reasonable in the criminal underworld. It happens all the time.

The only reason that the stand using squads are the most notable is because the entire story is focused on stand battles rather than exploring the structure of Passione. There’s no rule saying that everyone in the gang will instantly worship the person with the strongest stand.

This shows that the people with stands get jobs that let them use their stands. Not that having a stand gives you a higher rank.

At the end of the day, Giorno is still an unabashed criminal, so I don't know what you're getting at. It sounds like you'd only be satisfied if he never used his Stand at all, but that's ridiculous considering the lifestyle he lives is dangerous.

Even if you take Stands out of the equation, mobsters are constantly living a life of looking over their shoulder, or wondering if they're going to get to walk out of a room once they walk inside.

Based off of what we know about Giorno, he probably wouldn't just sic GER on people just to do it, but it's reasonable to expect it would be a response to aggression, and a display of power. No one is saying GER has to death loop anybody, but just the simple fact you can't act against it would probably frighten most Stand users into backing down.

Polpo was the only one with stand users working under him because he had Passione's only arrow. Most of the members (including capos) were normal people like Pericolo.

> Polpo's entry test is literally designed to produce Stand members.

> Somehow people still think Passione's Stand users aren't its strongest assets and treated the best.

This disregards almost everything we know about Stand users and their shitty personalities. To even imagine that a Stand user that isn't a Protagonist would be subservient to someone without a Stand is just insane.

>Somehow people still think Passione's Stand users aren't its strongest assets and treated the best.
It's literally a plot point that the hitman team was upset over how they were treated

Yeah but Polpo, the boss, and their elite assassination squad were all Stand users. It's not like Stand powers are only significant in regards to Stand battles / other Stand users. I don't know why you think that the normal members inability to perceive Stands themselves means they wouldn't be impressed with Stand powers. It just means they'd be even more terrified of Stand powers.

Obviously the people who kill for a living will have powers that other branches don’t need.

The point is that stand powers aren't what determine your position in the hierarchy. Guys like Fugo or Narancia could easily take Pericolo in a fight, but they're street level thugs while he's a capo. Jojo is an action series, so most of the story we see focuses on the battles, but the mafia is more than just people fighting each other. They actually have to commit crimes and manage their territories and business, and the people in charge of doing that are going to be the ones most suited to the job, not whoever has the best superpower.

Okay but we already know Giorno is smart, and charismatic. He got Koichi, Bruno, and pretty much the entire gang to like him.

Killing Diavolo is all we need to see. We know he has the charisma to get people on his side, the brains, the only question was the power, and that is firmly resolved when he kills Diavolo. There's no more we need to see.

I'm closing the book on this one guys, it's pretty clear that we've all come to an agreement that Diavolo was the perfect capstone for Part 5. Why don't we talk about Part 6 for a change.

It quite literally does not.

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Autism speaks.jpg

So even you would agree that Giorno's methods for becoming the boss are not shown in the story, right? "Killing Diavolo is all we need to see", means there is more that would have to happen that we did not need to see. So the original point
>>the method one takes in reaching their goals is more important than reaching the goal in question
is wrong, because Giorno's methods are not treated as being more important than us seeing Giorno at his goal of being the boss.

THE SBRVERSE WAS NOT CREATED BY MIH YOU RETARDED SPEEDREADER
Unless you are suggesting part 9 would take place in the Ireneverse which is insanely improbable.

I accept your concession.

Pucci literally created the SBR universe.

>people will fall for this AGAIN

Shh

The pasta is right

Disappointing.

I mean, it's a simple point, I don't understand why you can't see it.

GER calls attention to it.
Abbacchio calls attention to it.

Diavolo is only concerned with results. He lost sight of the truth. He'll never reach it.

Giorno is not concerned with the results. He's not concerned with the end profit. He's not concerned with beating the enemy. He's concerned with protecting the sanctity of life. Such is why he despises selling drugs to children.

Such is why he constantly puts himself in harms way and never gives up on the members of Bucciarti's gang even when it looks like the battle is a lost cause and they're literally screaming about how it's over and he should run away.

To insist that this theme is flawed or is somehow betrayed because Araki doesn't go out of his way to meticulously show us how Giorno goes from being a grunt to the boss (after the boss is killed by Giorno) is asinine, as these things can be safely inferred.

Maybe if you were to say something like, "I thought Vento Aureo would be a story about GioGio climbing up the ranks, and it seemed to start that way but then Bruno's gang spends the entire part on their first real mission and then they become traitors, so I was disappointed by that," maybe you'd have a point. But what you're trying to peddle is unreasonable. Trite. Hollow.

Contrarian.

And sad, because there's plenty of valid criticisms one could level toward Part 5.

God damn do I want to strangle the person next to me

I'm surprised that Part 6 is considered bad, and I attribute it mostly to new Yea Forums. A couple of years ago Part 6 was criticized for being weaker than some of the other parts, but Jolyne still had a healthy amount of fans and was lauded for her witty applications of Stone Free. People called her female Joseph pretty regularly, and Joseph was the golden boy.

It has a really sluggish middle portion, but it's thematically and philosophically really good. You're literally watching a bunch of human failures cluster together to take control of their lives. They fight as hard as they can to do something good and they're all killed. It's brutal.

Who are they?

Pathetic bait. Part 5 is the most acclaimed because it's the best. Best battle shounen ever on it's own.
SO is the worst, simple fact.

Cringe.

>To insist that this theme is flawed or is somehow betrayed because Araki doesn't go out of his way to meticulously show us how Giorno goes from being a grunt to the boss (after the boss is killed by Giorno) is asinine, as these things can be safely inferred.
Yet Araki chose to show Giorno becoming the boss at the end when, by your logic, that also could have been safely inferred. You can't claim that Part 5's message is about the methods being more important than the result when the writing of Part 5 itself prioritizes the result over the method.

>Maybe if you were to say something like, "I thought Vento Aureo would be a story about GioGio climbing up the ranks, and it seemed to start that way but then Bruno's gang spends the entire part on their first real mission and then they become traitors, so I was disappointed by that," maybe you'd have a point.
But that's not what my problem was. I'm pointing out how the presentation of the ending displays the complete opposite of the message the user claimed Part 5 was trying to teach. Which it does.

>But what you're trying to peddle is unreasonable. Trite. Hollow.
>Contrarian.
>And sad, because there's plenty of valid criticisms one could level toward Part 5.
I don't understand your logic. I'm not criticizing Part 5 for the sake of criticizing it. I'm talking about a specific idea that another user brought up that I disagreed with. Making a "valid criticism" that isn't related to the topic I want to discuss would be meaningless.

My mother.
Maybe I should start filtering part threads to prevent this.

Does anyone have that original 'part 6 is shit' copypasta?

I don't understand what you're trying to say.

Are you trying to say that because Giorno is shown as the boss in the end of Part 5, that this theme is absent from Part 5? That's dishonest.

Maybe you should see a therapist instead.

Your... mother?

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The theme is very blatantly featured throughout the part, but the ending contradicts it.

I'm saying that the presentation of the ending directly opposes what user claims about the theme.

The ending: shows the results instead of the method
user's claim: the method matters more than the result

They are opposites.

> "The result is not all I desire. When you desire only the result, you start trying to take shortcuts... and when you start taking shortcuts, you start to lose sight of the truth. Eventually, you lose your motivation too."

> “Only the results in this world, only the results matter!"

> "You will never arrive at the truth that's about to happen! None who stand before me shall ever do so, no matter what abilities they may wield!"

Only by your standard. Nothing in the text contradicts this theme.

From an actual story telling standpoint, the essential journey was over from the moment Diavolo was killed. He was the major obstruction in the way of Giorno's goal. He was toppled. It isn't necessary to get into the politics of what happens afterward. We've already reached the truth. The story is over.

Okay, maybe it was worded poorly, but at that point, you're still just arguing semantics. The theme is present in Vento Aureo. There's an abundance of quotes available to prove this.

All you have to facilitate your argument is ... the epilogue.

Of course the theme is present. If it wasn't present then what the hell would we be talking about? That the ending is incompatible with a theme that doesn't exist?

>complains about valid criticisms of part 6
>HURRR DURRR BRAINLET DURRRRRR
holy fuck seething part 6 niggers are the cutest damn thing. im not even OP. but goddamn this is retarded.

The ending isn't incompatible with it, because that's just a story telling device and a matter of presentation. You're criticizing the writer of the story for his practices but nothing in the actual text contradicts itself (concerning that theme).

> The two develop a mutual respect, and Giorno boldly reveals his dream to become a "Gang-Star" who will take over the Neapolitan mafia in order to defend the innocent.

Also I get the feeling that you're the same user that thinks throwing GER's weight at criminals is the same thing as what Ciocolatta was doing in Rome or having Black Sabbath stab people willy nilly, and I want to tell you that's a shitty assertion to make and it makes it hard to take you seriously.

It's because someone made a reasonable and well worded appraisal of Part 5 and that made user angry, so he has to grasp at straws to make them look dumb.

Jojo isn't pure text. It's a manga, it has visuals. I can criticize those too. I'm not whatever user you're thinking of, so you wasted your time. Sorry.

Part 6 is the pleb filter

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You're criticizing Araki for not living by the words presented in his story and it displays a fundamental misunderstanding of how art works.

He doesn't have to live by them. But it would be better if he didn't shit on them with the last pages of the whole story.

Oh my god

Kakyoin & Jolyne is the cutest

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Retard.

All of your arguments insofar have been coming from a place of ignorance.

"There's no rule stating,"

"We don't know," So we go by what we do know.

1. It's safe to assume that Diavolo is the strongest member of Passione.
2. The way it's presented during his flashback with Polnareff is that he only founded Passione after acquiring a Stand. It's reasonable to assume that King Crimson had a lot to do with his ability to construct, cultivate, and control Passione. Stand users have consistently been portrayed as using their powers to get ahead, and Diavolo especially seems like the type.

I'd go so far as to say it's unreasonable to assume King Crimson had little to do with controlling Passione. But I digress.

3. Giorno kills Diavolo by exerting a strength greater than the strongest member of Passione we've seen thus far. Diavolo killed Aba, Narancia, and Bruno. He's subtracted more of the cast than anyone else thus far, so his ability as a combatant is indisputable. Also indisputable is Giorno's trirumph over that strength.

From this point onward, anything else related to becoming Passione's don is auxiliary. They don't matter, or they would have been elaborated upon. We don't even know the exact method, but we know that dealing with Diavolo is a part of it. As a matter of fact, it's the most crucial part, and the story centers around it. So we watch Giorno complete the only elaborated upon part of the process. For 155 chapters, we watch Giorno move toward this, the most crucial aspect of his goal, and then complete it.

So no, the story does a good job with that theme.

>They don't matter,
Thanks for proving my point.

>The way it's presented during his flashback with Polnareff is that he only founded Passione after acquiring a Stand.
Or maybe it was the money he got from selling the arrows to Enya.