ITT: Thirsty JC

>ywn get to drink a young girl's bodily secretions

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He was handsome, masculine and easy-going. But as in OP, Asuka really wanted to be seen as a grown woman, which was as much part of it as Kaji being attractive.

Daddy issues

cunnygang cunnygang cunnygang

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woah mama

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This is either bait or just wishful thinking. She wasn't thirsty, she was desperate for validation

for some reason I feel compelled to accept your assertions as correct and indisputable

nice trips
>she was desperate for validation
isnt that similar to being thirsty?

Girls see having sex with a guy as validation?

What does validation mean exactly?

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Confirmation of their self worth in this meaning.

in her case it's because kaji is a cool, mature figure that represents the adulthood and self-sufficiency she tries to convince herself she already has. him reciprocating would be telling her that she's an equal and not a child, validating her sense of self-worth and all the self-destructive coping methods and beliefs she built up after kyoko died & her stepmom seemingly rejected her

>jk
a bit old but still good

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not at all. being thirsty implies being horny, she wasn't. she was desperate to feel wanted by someone she deemed worthy.

that's the thing with asuka, she's mentally ill. she's able to put up a strong façade by putting so much weight into being an eva pilot, but once that foundation of hers starts to shake it all comes crumbling down like a house of cards.

i've met people with similar issues IRL. they don't need sex, they need help.

>the stuff after that
>a grown up
This scene was perfect. She even talks like a child while denying to be one

>i've met people with similar issues IRL. they don't need sex, they need help.
but can you sex them after you help them?
and were they JC?

maybe, but if you care about that person you really shouldn't. shit can go sideways real fast. remember the old adage - don't stick your dick into crazy.

and no.

oh well whatever 3dpd, 2d little girls are the best

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nice trips

you'll find 3d happiness one day user, I believe in you.

She was definitely horny for Kaji, dude

2b-honest

ive been attracted to middle/highschool girls ever since i was just an elementary kid; even now, older women just dont appeal to me at all

everyone's horny for kaji

ginko is so sexy

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This is why Rei was always superior

Damn, what is it about Kaji that made him attract women with father issues so bad?
He doesn't strike me as a Daddy

all 2D is perfect

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All 2d girls are perfect
but some are more perfect than others

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Did you even watch the show? Asuka didn't have daddy issues, Asuka had mommy issues, which were the cause for her fear of abandonment which in turn made her compensate by overachieving as she subconsciously tied her self-worth to her performance ("I perform adequately therefore I won't be abandoned"). Her infatuation with Kaji as a mere aspect of that: she seeks constant validation that she's performing "well enough", whether it's as a pilot, being "desirable", etc. - and getting that recognition from Kaji would have satisfied that. The moment Kaji was gone she latched onto the next best thing, which was Shinji.

>implying someone can't have both daddy and mommy issues
Maybe you're the one who needs to rewatch the show, are you seriously implying Asuka overhearing her dad 'abandoning' her and her mom didn't have an effect on her?
It obviously impacted the way she views men in general.

>The moment Kaji was gone she latched onto the next best thing, which was Shinji.
The moment Kaji was gone she ran away and tried to kill herself in a bathtub.

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The primary cause of Asuka's trauma was her mother's suicide. There is no indication that she was particularly close to her father. In the manga she doesn't even know him.

>The moment Kaji was gone she ran away and tried to kill herself in a bathtub.
No, the moment Kaji was gone she approached Shinji as the next best target for validation. When Shinji didn't respond it only made her pursue him more.

>The primary cause of Asuka's trauma was her mother's suicide.
We know this you retard. That doesn't invalidate the possibility that she could have had father issues, too.
>There is no indication that she was particularly close to her father.
And that in itself can have a severe effect on a child, are you daft? Do you seriously think she didn't care when she overheard her father talking with her stepmother-to-be when she was a child?

>No, the moment Kaji was gone she approached Shinji
We see at the beginning of episode 24 the moment Asuka is told Kaji is gone she's shocked in disbelief and the next scene she's lying in a bathtub filled with blood.

>That doesn't invalidate the possibility that she could have had father issues, too.
It doesn't invalidate the possibility because it's unrelated.

>Do you seriously think she didn't care when she overheard her father talking with her stepmother-to-be when she was a child?
A reasonable person would argue that these weren't "separate" issues tied to her father in particular but rather that this triggered the abandonment issues that she already had due to her mother, which the show introduced us to.

Both Shinji and Asuka share mother issues.

>We see at the beginning of episode 24 the moment Asuka is told Kaji is gone she's shocked in disbelief and the next scene she's lying in a bathtub filled with blood.
Kaji is "gone" way earlier in the sense of leaving her with Misato and Shinji where she has quite a bit of interaction with Shinji where she attempts to make him recognise her womanly charms. Did you actually watch the show?

>It doesn't invalidate the possibility because it's unrelated.
Unrelated to what? You're the one that replied to me first saying implying that just because she has mother issues as well she can't have father issues.

>A reasonable person would argue
A reasonable person would argue she has both, like a fair amount of people in the real world actually do.

>Both Shinji and Asuka share mother issues.
Except Shinji was primarily fueled by his father issues throughout the show, she didn't come into play until way later on.

>Kaji is "gone" way earlier
So now you're changing goalposts?
You said "gone", and I'm assumed by that you meant dead. Once Asuka finds out Kaji is dead she immediately heads to the bathtub and tries to off herself.
Rewatch the show, seriously.

>In the manga she doesn't even know him.
every fucking time, stop mixing the manga with the series the characterizations are completely different

Why are JCs so horny?

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>You're the one that replied to me first saying implying that just because she has mother issues as well she can't have father issues.
I didn't say she can't have father issues I said there is no solid evidence for it. Her entire trauma - as we are presented it in the show - is centred around her mother. Any issues related to her father are peripherally present at best. If the directors wanted us to believe that she has father issues in particular they would have made it a significant element of the plot. They did no such thing. Any issues with her father are in truth tied to the issues she had due to her mother.

>A reasonable person would argue she has both, like a fair amount of people in the real world actually do.
Like who?

>Except Shinji was primarily fueled by his father issues throughout the show, she didn't come into play until way later on.
Your previous argument goes right back at you: the fact that he has mother issues does not rule out that he has father issues too - except that in Shinji's case it actually applies, because here both parents play a role in the plot.

>So now you're changing goalposts?
No, that's what I was talking about from the beginning and if you had actually watched the show you would have inferred that based on the fact that most of the interaction between Shinji and Asuka happens after Kaji is "gone" - i.e. literally gone in the sense of not being physically present in their daily life rather than "figuratively" gone in the sense of being dead.

>I'm assumed by that you meant dead
You assumed wrong.

>Once Asuka finds out Kaji is dead she immediately heads to the bathtub and tries to off herself.
Her mental issues were not tied to Kaji alone. Her state was much more induced by her failing as a pilot, which was the ultimate nightmare for her. I don't think you understand the character.

>I didn't say she can't have father issues
Then why the fuck did you reply to me in the first place?

>the fact that he has mother issues does not rule out that he has father issues too
Except I never argued Asuka doesn't have mother issues you absolute retard.
You're the one that came at me saying she can't possibly have daddy issues because of her trauma with her mother. Well Shinji is a great example of a kid who has both so your whole argument just got debunked.

>I don't think you understand the character.
I understand her far more than you.

Nips are for plebs, areolas are what makes a downblouse shot perfection

>In my fanfiction she doesn't even know him

Either way, getting something is better than nothing at all.

You are clearly lacking in logical reasoning ability. I never made the claim that having mother issues rules out having father issues I made the claim that there is no evidence for Asuka having father issues and that her character is most of all characterised by mother issues so claiming she is motivated by father issues - like you did - is an example of a lack of understanding of the character on your side. That's what I responded to, that's what still applies.

>I understand her far more than you.
Apparently not, because you've yet been unable to defend your position. All you could reply was "uh-uh.. she may have father issues TOO!", but I don't see solid evidence for it.

see: >Did you even watch the show? Asuka didn't have daddy issues, Asuka had mommy issues
You implied she can't have both and never responded to my evidence of her having daddy issues.
I don't need to defend any position when you're the one who sperged out and replied to me first.

>You implied she can't have both
But that statement does not imply that. There is no logical implication that ties one to the other - they are two unrelated statements (A, B rather than A => !B).

>and never responded to my evidence of her having daddy issues
But I did. See I said:
>A reasonable person would argue that these weren't "separate" issues tied to her father in particular but rather that this triggered the abandonment issues that she already had due to her mother, which the show introduced us to.

Further evidence is that her father is hardly present - very much unlike her mother. The idea that these are two separate traumata rather than her father's statement triggering existing trauma is simply not as likely.

>Further evidence is that her father is hardly present
By that I meant: present within the plot, exposition, screentime, etc. - as it seems I have to spell out everything to not cause misunderstandings like with "gone".

>they are two unrelated statements
then you should've used a semicolon :)

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Next time I will. I didn't expect your language processor to be so strict about syntax.

Your original statement did imply that because you were replying to a comment about Asuka's daddy issues. Asuka having mommy issues does not erase that.

>Further evidence is that her father is hardly present
Shinji doesn't even remember his mother and yet he has mommy issues all the same, how is this an argument?
The lack of a parent can fuel a complex just as much as their presence can.

And for Asuka, she overhears her father directly. She brings him up again when running to her mother's room "I won't be sad over dad not being here anymore!"
To suggest she wouldn't be even slightly affected by her father's treatment of her is absurd.
A father to a girl plays a gigantic impact on how they view men as they develop - we see this with Misato.
It's clear that Asuka's father's actions had some affect on how she viewed men.

>Your original statement did imply that because you were replying to a comment about Asuka's daddy issues.
No, my original statement did not imply that. When I say: "I'm not wearing a red shirt, I'm wearing red pants.", then this does not imply that I cannot wear a red shirt together with red pants, it literally only means that I am wearing red pants rather than a red shirt.

>The lack of a parent can fuel a complex just as much as their presence can.
You're arguing hypothetically rather than specifically about what we're presented in the show. Yes, the lack of a parent 'can' fuel a complex but there is no evidence that this is the case for Asuka as her father plays hardly any role within the narrative - very much opposed to her mother.

>It's clear that Asuka's father's actions had some affect on how she viewed men.
No, it's not "clear" at all. It's all hypothetical.

>"I'm not wearing a red shirt, I'm wearing red pants.", then this does not imply that I cannot wear a red shirt together with red pants
That's exactly what it's implying or else why bring it up in the first place?
Your first response to my post that it was daddy issues was bringing up her mother issues, implying she can't have both.

>specifically about what we're presented in the show
What we're specifically shown in the show is Asuka overhearing her father and bringing him up again when she's running towards her mother, so he clearly had some affect on her.
She wouldn't mention it if it didn't bother her.

Truly a man of culture. The tease is always the best.

The show clearly focus on her issues with her mother though sure there are a few places her father actions are brought up or referenced, I can think of the time we hear her father talking to the nurse/doctor of her mother. But throughout the show we come back to her mother time and time again. So sure you can bring up her dad but the show really doesnt focus or give us much if anything about him in comparison to Kyoko.

The argument was never about whether she has mother issues or not. We all agree she does. It was on her father issues, so bringing up her mother issues is irrelevant.

Asuka is gross

Is this really a JC thread?

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It’s supposed to be

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It just seems to me bringing up her father issues is irrelavant given the show. The show doesnt elaborate on them to any depth.

It's not irrelevant when talking about the possible reasons why she may be attracted to Kaji
Girls who are drawn towards older men tend to do so due to a lack of a father figure when growing up.

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This guy actually gets Asuka

She latched onto Shinji way before kaji died. The difference being that she wanted him for a different reason than she wanted Kaji.
Kaji was more of a way to convince herself she was a mature adult to help support her self destructive coping mechanism instead of accepting that she craves genuine affection and wants to rely on others.
Since Ep9 Asuka was trying to make advances and get close to Shinji, albeit behind a large layer of plausible deniability, in hopes of him reciprocating and thus being able to rely on him for emotional support. Although her coping method wouldn't allow her to be honest with herself, let alone Shinji, in what she actually wanted.

She is drawn to Kaji for the same reason she is drawn to Shinji: she wants validation. She wants Kaji to recognise that she is attractive and therefore undeserving of abandonment. Asuka is not interested in serious romance, it's all about feeling validated.

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>She latched onto Shinji way before kaji died. The difference being that she wanted him for a different reason than she wanted Kaji.
Yes. By "gone" I meant literally "gone" in the sense of leaving Asuka with Misato and Shinji which happened right after Asuka was introduced.

Worst jc. Kuroko and Uiharu are better

That's what she wants on the surface as a result of the mask she puts up. It's obvious she wants and needs to be able to rely on others emotionally like every other character in the show. She just never admits this to herself since that's the entire point of her coping method from childhood. If she never has to rely or be honest with others, she can never get hurt as bad again like with Kyoko and her dad.

>That's exactly what it's implying
No, that is not what it's implying at all. It literally does not. If you think it does you either don't speak the language well enough or you're incapable of logical thinking.

>Your first response to my post that it was daddy issues was bringing up her mother issues, implying she can't have both.
It does not imply that at all. When I say that I'm wearing red pants rather than a red shirt then I am NOT implying that it's impossible to wear both. It boggles my mind how you would think that and it's getting rather tiresome because you're either too stubborn to admit you're wrong and therefore outright lying or genuinely too dumb making it fruitless to have a discussion with any longer.

I brought up her mother issues to specifically because Asuka's character is all about mother issues. There is no evidence that she has father issues.

>She wouldn't mention it if it didn't bother her.
Again: it takes place within the context of her mother issues. It is all tied to her mother.

I don't think it's a surface issue but a subconscious demand. Asuka fears abandonment and she quells those fears by overachieving, yearning for validation and thus the confirmation that she won't be abandoned. Her desire to be recognised as a woman is yet another aspect of that. While I won't rule out that she is attracted to Shinji at some level (e.g. she blushes upon being confronted by her classmates about her banter with him resembling that of a married couple), but I don't think she's seriously seeking for any kind of relationship - neither with Kaji nor with Shinji.

>Worst jc.
My dick disagrees. Kuroko and Uiharu aren’t bad either

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>all of the horrible things Asuka does are because she was desperate for validation
>all of the horrible things Shinji does are because he's a thirsty incel who needs to have sex
ok

In Asuka's mind, Shinji is just good enough for experimentation and practice. She kind of realizes she isn't grown-up and wouldn't know what to do. It's disturbing to her to realize Shinji's always there when Kaji skips out, how often she'd switched to trying to show off to Shinji instead, and how much of her head Shinji actually occupies.

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She doesn't even know what it means to have a relationship. With Kaji she says "I'm ready for anything, even kissing and the stuff that comes after that!" the latter part implying she doesn't even really know what sex is.
She's far too immature which is to be expected of a 14 year old girl.

But we know why she has any sort of attraction to Kaji its because she wants to feel validated as being mature and grown. You bringing up it is because her father is coming out of left field because in the show we are shown why she goes for Kaji. We have no need to invent or look for a reason when a whole important part of her character focuses on her need to appear mature and grown from the loss of her mother.

I absolutely think she was interested in him, but it isn't easy to pin down in which way. He absolutely wouldn't help support her self destructive facade of being an adult, so I always felt that the sadness she experienced when Shinji wouldn't comfort her (not comforting her when she was lonely and anxious during wall of Jericho, not holding her during the kiss) was more genuine than anything.

With Kaji, she always tries to put on a face before seeing him, as shown by her forcing a smile when she is desperately depressed before entering Kaji's work office. Whereas with Shinji, she is more open, even letting her guard down accidentally and telling him about her indifferent relationship with her step mom.

I guess the best way to describe her 'crush' on both of them is that with Kaji, it's the equivalent of a teen girl being infatuated with a pop star, and with Shinji, it's more akin to an old quarreling married couple. Not going to pretend my interpretation is foolproof.

Yeah it seems like the longer they lived together domestically, the more she comes to realize how relatable Shinji is and thus starts trying to use him as a means to fill the emotional void left behind by her mother. When this doesn't work and she mistakes Shinji's fear of rejection for him rejecting her, specifically during their kiss, her entire character begins to come crumbling down, only sped up by him then overtaking her as a pilot and further rejection by Kaji which only helps to destroy the mental facade of maturity she envisions of herself.

She puts on a face for both of them, the only person in the show who really saw the real her was Hikari technically.

I would absolutely not relate her relationship to Shinji with that of a quarreling married couple, because her hatred for Shinji is very genuine as well, during the bath scene where she's having a breakdown - when she screams she hates Misato, Shinji, and First - she absolutely means it. Because she hates herself.
Her relationship with Shinji is extremely toxic and destructive to both of them, that is not what I would consider a conventional married couple. More like trailer trash parents who are physically abusive with each other and their children.

I think attributing her character crumbling down to be primarily because of Shinji is a major disservice to her character.
It was first and foremost because she kept losing every fight and getting worse and worse at piloting which was her main reason for living. The stuff with Kaji and then Shinji comes way after that.

When she's sitting in the bathtub completely broken, she even states herself it's because she has a sync rate of 0 - because no one will look at her now.

There's a large duality in their relationship. She has a crush and is attracted to him, whether it be sexually, romantically, emotionally or selfishly, or all four together.
At the same time she hates him because his meekness and openness about his desire to rely on others reminds her of herself. She has those same desires but she bottles them up and hides them away behind her facade of maturity. And she hates looking into that mirror. On top of that, him overtaking her as a pilot with little effort and 'rejecting' every advance she made on him destroys her own pillars of self worth and reminds her of the rejection from her mother.

Their relationship is probably one of the best in the show at really examining the duality of the human condition.

Also yeah, the entire reason their relationship as friends/partners whatever didn't work is because they both hate themselves and can't be open and honest with anybody, especially themselves.

I mostly agree with your post. What should also be considered that her relationship with Shinji gets more difficult due to him also being her rival as a pilot.

I absolutely don't think that's the only and primary factor. It was more of the first rock to come tumbling down the mountain. The entire tone of her character begins to change right after that point in time and just gets worse as the world shits all over her.

My bad for not properly articulating my thoughts.

Absolutely. That's what I brought up here

Their dynamic was a hybrid of genuinely wanting each other to plug their emotional holes and rely on one another but also disdain and pain as a result of not being able to love or be honest with themselves.

Doesn't her sync rate drop right after they fuck up the kiss? Before she even knows Shinji is catching up to her on sync rate?

I mean, that's also after she sees Kaji smells like lavender and is 'back together' with Misato.
That probably bothered her for sure.

>genuinely wanting each other to plug their emotional holes
I can't say I agree with this being specifically about Shinji and Asuka.
Asuka's facade towards Kaji and towards the kids at school as a happy-go-lucky optimistic girl, her more rough facade towards Shinji/Toji/Kensuke/Rei, they're all a means at plugging her emotional hole with her mother. Everything she does and every way she acts all ties back to this.
It's the same with Shinji and every single character.

Piloting is her ego, that's her sense of her worth, her proof of being too important to be left when people don't want to deal with her anymore. She was good until she was completely ineffectual, she threw everything at an Angel that bowled right over her, an Angel that Shinji started throwing around. I wouldn't dismiss it being complicated by Shinji appearing to die from that, coming back after 30 days, and acting like none of that was anything to him, but that's the slide she's on going into Arael.

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I don't agree mostly because she never shows any signs of actually caring about any guy in the show besides Shinji or Kaji. She ignores every schoolboy giving her love letters. She abandons Chad at the amusement park date. She literally does not give a single shit about Toji or Kensuke not liking her.

The only two men she puts any value on in terms of their opinions/actions towards her are Kaji and Shinji. I see her crush on Kaji as her being infatuated with an old, mature dude who is good-looking and the epitome of 'maturity.' If he successfully reciprocates her, it just acts as fuel to continue firing the facade she puts up of being a mature woman who doesn't need others for emotional support (a lie she tells herself).

With Shinji, there's no proof or substantiation to the facade she puts up. In fact, her mind rape in Episode 22 shows that she desperately wanted Shinji to comfort and hold her. How can this be anything other than genuinely wanting him to pug her emotional hole? By realizing and admitting to herself she wanted Shinji, it's a complete breakdown of the mask she puts on of being a mature woman who only needs herself. She finally admits and owns up to her actual wants and the reality of her needing to rely on others at times, and as shown in the montage, Shinji was the one she was attempting to use. And this admittance and realization adds a large part to her breakdown as she realizes the person she thought of as 'Asuka' was a complete lie she made up to cope from her childhood.

She wanted that Hillshire sausage

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>because she never shows any signs of actually caring about any guy in the show besides Shinji or Kaji
It's not just about guys, it's how she acts with everyone.
Why else does she act all happy-go-lucky at school? Why does she put on Misato's shirt, try on her perfume and use her room whenever she's gone?
She wants to be an adult, she wants people to look at her, she wants validation via them acknowledging her.
This isn't just something she does solely with Shinji and Kaji, she does it with everyone.

>In fact, her mind rape in Episode 22 shows that she desperately wanted Shinji to comfort and hold her
This is wrong, though. First of all, the scene you're mentioning wasn't even in the original airing for the show. It wasn't even Anno's idea in the first place, he got it from Nobi Nobita's doujinshi called Bridal Veil:
forum.evageeks.org/thread/17938/Nobi-Nobita-Bridal-Veil-Ep-22-DC-Source/

e-hentai.org/g/1377732/c4c53e87b2/
As the doujinshi shows, it's not really about Asuka wanting Shinji in particular. On the contrary, it shows that she's comparing Shinji to Kaji the entire time. A kid vs. an adult.
And when a kid like Shinji rejects her - a person she deems so weak and pathetic like Shinji rejects her - it's the absolute worst blow to her pride. If not even Shinji wants her, then who does? No one wants to look at her.

They have a rather amicable and 'arguing couple' like relationship up until the turning point in the late teens episodes where everything starts to come crumbling down. Even Toji and Hikari realize this and they spend every week together with the two of them so their opinion is pretty reliable. The two just can't admit anything to themselves when it comes to feelings about themselves or others.

Brings up a good point too

>They have a rather amicable and 'arguing couple' like relationship
It's amicable, as is Asuka's relationship with Rei and Misato in the beginning. When the show is still somewhat 'lighthearted'.

But arguing couple? Isn't the whole reason why Asuka is so peeved at Shinji because he doesn't fight back? He rarely ever argues with her, he just kind of takes it. This is what pisses her off so much. Yes, there's that one gag scene with Toji, but he also says something similar with Shinji wanted to 'get it on' with Rei just because he was looking at her in an early episode so I don't consider him the best judge on the subject, plus it's quite inaccurate when you look at their dynamic in any other scene - Shinji being passive and Asuka being aggressive.

This is a legit discussion going on here. Keep going guys.

i just wanted to make a thinly veiled cute and funny thread, i didnt expect two autists to start arguing about childhood trauma and all that
pic related are JC

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Yes, she cares about the literal who's at school for the sole purpose of validating the social mask she puts up. She doesn't want them to 'hold her or help her' like she does with Kaji or Shinji. They are simply stepping stones to proving her maturity.

Trying to get Shinji to comfort her when she is lonely and anxious in EP9 or getting him to hold her because she wants genuine compassion (which every human in the show wants) is the complete antithesis of just using him to prove her 'maturity'. If that was the main goal, she would never breakdown during her mindrape about those factors (specifically the 'help' and 'hold') because that right their is an admittance that her entire character that she thought of 'Asuka' up to this point was nothing but a facade brought about in an attempt to cope with her childhood trauma involving her mother. What she wants out of her relationship with Shinji vs some random school boy is completely different.

I doubt Anno would use that and try to make Asuka's character out to not give a single shit about forming true, genuine bonds with other people as opposed to her only wanting validation. That feels like it goes against the entire theme and point of the show where people are desperately trying to search for love to fill the voids in their soul but absolutely failing to communicate, driving them to hurt one another.

Yes.
Most girls see having sex with attractive men as validation of their own self worth.
"attractive" not necessarily meaning appearance. Serial killers get a lot of women wanting to be with them because they are "attractive" to them.
women are really shallow.

I have't watched in a while but I'm almost positive there are scenes where they have back and forths with each other, although obviously Asuka is usually the dominant one. I'm pretty sure in the same scene with Toji calling them a 'couple' Shinji argues back with her, although I could be wrong.

>but he also says something similar with Shinji wanted to 'get it on' with Rei

I mean, I don't think he's wrong. Shinji finds Rei attractive. He will never admit that he was attracted to her in that scene with Toji because Shinji is Shinji. Doesn't mean Toji is a bad judge on the subject.

women were a mistake

I feel like you're not really reading what I'm saying in my post.
Asuka's character does not solely revolve around men.
When she says 'look at me' and 'no one will look at me', it's not specifically Kaji and Shinji she's talking about, it's everyone. They all contribute to her facade and are all a source of validation for her to some extent. Yes, Kaji and Shinji play important roles in her character arc, but they are not the sole contributors.
When she lays in that bathtub, completely broken, she's not crying for Kaji or Shinji, she's crying for anyone to look at her.

>she would never breakdown during her mindrape about those factors (specifically the 'help' and 'hold')
But she didn't breakdown because of those factors. That scene was added until D&R/the DC two years later because Anno read the doujinshi I linked above for you, did you read it?

Asuka's character isn't about forming bonds with others, it's about forming a bond with herself. She's constantly trying to prove to herself she doesn't need others, yet she solely relies on their gaze and acknowledgement to validate herself and establish that she has purpose to her life.
Asuka's character was mainly about coming to terms with herself and her mother's death, but we never get to see a true conclusion to her character unlike with the others.

>I'm almost positive there are scenes where they have back and forths with each other
Yes, there are scenes. But they are very scarce in comparison to the many more scenes with Asuka biting at him and him just taking it.
It's that very meekness that pisses her off so much, it defines their relationship and thereby defines why she's so angry with him.

>I mean, I don't think he's wrong. Shinji finds Rei attractive.
In that very scene he's looking at Rei because he's wondering why she's alone, not because he's checking her out. Toji is most definitely wrong there.

All JC should be this sexy.

there is value and justice in flatness too

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Kaji's big dick, compared to Shinji toothpick.

I think you and I just have different views on the importance of the DC material that was added. Just because it was added later doesn't mean it isn't as plot relevant as the original airing content, and the interpretation in context of the show makes more sense than interpreting it in context of the doujin.

Instrumentality in EP25 even shows that Asuka really doesn’t want to be alone, that pushing away and running from others didn’t cure her pain and loneliness. She says hates everybody because nobody stays with her or protects her. This isn't even DC content, it is in the original airing. She hates the idea of being so attached to anyone and has become obsessed with becoming a mature 'adult' who only needs and thinks for herself so as to never have to be put in a situation again like with Kyoko. Much of her character was coming to terms with the fact that she cannot necessarily live by herself. The duality of her relationship with Shinji was very important in displaying this unless you honestly think she wasn't in some way attracted to or crushing on Shinji.

It's plot relevant, but you need to remember that one scene is the only evidence we have that there was something more to Asuka's Jericho and kiss scenes.
That means Asuka's character was originally written without such intentions in mind, the Jericho and kiss scene were originally just as we're shown: gags.

When Anno added in this scene, it wasn't a matter of "Oh, I should make this part of her character more clear" it was "Oh, I really like how this doujinshi author portrayed Asuka, I should add this in!" i.e., he literally took an idea from a complete third-party and added it into the show later.
It's not a 'ret-con' per se, rather I'd agree with you that it gives more depth to Asuka's character, but it just goes to show that because it was added later and not originally something Anno had in mind when writing her character, we can't really it to having as much significance to Asuka's character as you're claiming.
It's more of an extension to her character rather than a contributing factor.

As for the rest of your post, I agree but I don't see how any of that refutes my post. It's basically what I've been saying this whole time.

Jesus fuck you evafags are autistic.

Yes, some would consider talking about anime and characters pretty autistic, that’s why Yea Forums exists

I don't think that it is too far fetched without the DC scenes added in.
After the Wall of Jericho, she comes out of her room, uses the bathroom and then half-consciously falls asleep on Shinji's bed. Maybe it wasn't completely on purpose, but it shows us that she was extremely lonely and anxious after the doors closed, and most likely wanted to be comforted, which is only made more clear in the DC content.
With the kiss, even without the DC content, when she runs away from Shinji the top of her face is shaded all black to imply some sort of sadness. On top of that, the following morning, she looks distraught and her sync rate begins to decline. Obviously part of this is due to feeling like she 'lost' Kaji to Misato, but it also can be implied that she was sad over not getting something more out of Shinji considering what she genuinely wants deep down is to have somebody to stay with and protect her. It's still there, just much more subtle than the DC content blatantly spelling it out for you.

To me it seemed like your posts were trying to imply that she needed to learn to value herself and only that. Obviously this is absolutely what she needs, but another significant part of her character is realizing she wants to be able to rely on others to protect her and comfort her, despite the mask she puts on to convince herself and others otherwise. And it seemed like you were ignoring that second part as significant, although it could just be my pea-sized brain not comprehending everything you said correctly.

>JC
Who?

>downblouse small_breasts
Proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy.

Arguing about the same things for over 20 years is pretty fucking autistic.

Here, I'll give you the Yea Forums experience you seem to be whining about:
Your waifu sucks ass.
Your favorite anime is shit and I wont tell you why, it's just shit.
I don't like this thread so I'm going to sit here and cry about it
Your taste in anime is a shit.
Go back to ___ fag.

I agree that it you could certainly make that interpretation even without that DC scene, but you must admit if that scene was never added you wouldn't make a direct correlation with Shinji's actions being a direct cause for her breakdown. Maybe after watching the show and thinking about it a little, sure. But definitely not during your viewing like you can with the DC scene explicitly stating it.

I'm implying her character centers around the glaring hypocrisy that she's convincing herself she doesn't need others, but is solely reliant on them for validation at the same time.
People need people, of course. It's true in Eva and it's true in real life, the strength/importance of having bonds (despite the pain it could bring) is emphasized in the show countless times, but what we're shown in the TV series is Asuka finally facing this hypocrisy in herself and breaking down once the facade shatters and she's forced to see herself for what she truly is.
In EoE we see her realizing her mother has always been by her side, but she's technically offscreen for the rest of the movie until the last scene.

Thus, based on what we see of Asuka in the show/EoE, her character is all about coming to terms with herself. How she will form bonds with others is only left up to speculation at the end of EoE, it is not addressed explicitly for her character.

>Maybe after watching the show and thinking about it a little, sure. But definitely not during your viewing like you can with the DC scene explicitly stating it.
how is that relevant? how is that a point at all? especially when it's eva being talked about

She was still gaining, episode after that is the one where Shinji beats her score and there's nothing said about her losing points over either. It starts in 22 and her first test since the Eva's head had been cut off.

>draw JK designs for Asuka, Rei
>call them a JC instead
lol Anno and Sadamoto

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I did realize on my first watch through that Asuka was distraught the day after the kiss with the sync rate and all. I obviously didn't realize the 'true' intention of it until I finished my first viewing but I had the feeling that she was kissing him for more than the reason of just being 'bored' and the shaded eye area did cement that something was fishy to me. It wasn't as blatant as when it was shown in the DC content but i did make that connection, although it wasn't nearly as concrete. This is probably because on my first view so many years ago I was told about how 'deep' Eva was and so autistically payed attention to detail and tried to watch the series in 2-3 episode bites a day and reflect on them afterwards.
Either way not 'realizing' it your first time through isn't really relevant since that can be said for a vast vast amount of shit in Eva.

>I'm implying her character centers around the glaring hypocrisy that she's convincing herself she doesn't need others, but is solely reliant on them for validation at the same time.

I agree that this is a great hypocrisy but I think her character is centered more around the fact that she convinces herself she doesn't need others but in reality she has been lying to herself the entire time since Kyoko's death and desperately wants another person to protect and comfort her, to never leave her. She straight out states this word for word during EoTV and she says the same thing to Shinji in EoE while on the introspection train, but with a focus on him. Her entire life and person was a lie she told to herself and she finally realizes this during EoTV Instrumentality.

I think we both agree on most parts. Only difference is as I stated above and maybe the fact that I think her relationship with Shinji is one of the most pivotal and generally significant relationships in leading to her downfall. It's also probably the greatest one in the show for displaying and examining the human condition.

>but I had the feeling that she was kissing him for more than the reason of just being 'bored'
i really hope it didn't take the DC additions for most viewers to have an inkling of this, her character's been pretty well established by that point and regardless of what you think about validation vs affection vs whatever it should be abundantly clear she isn't being genuine with her pretense. i mean its pretty much spelled out in dance like you want to win

There are people that legitimately think everything she says is true despite her character being defined by saying one thing outwardly and actually wanting something else. People are stupid and literally can't see past the mask she puts up despite everything that is shown. Yea Forums is evidence enough

Can’t blame her honestly, Hei has a pretty sexy collarbone

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meant to reply to

What in the world is this?

Snake.

They're actually JS in this scene.

Hot. All JS should be that sexy