El Melloi II Case Files

It brings out Waver's ptsd of saberfaces.

>Generic waifu-bait is the only good thing about it

So it's complete unredeemable garbage? Good to know.

>muh ufotable
Fuck off spic

Are you telling me Waver can't carry his own show?

yes, he has 0 gimmicks other than being brooding faggot

Gray for (you)!

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>Aarghhh!!! Where are my servants?!

Fuck off.

Case Files had a better start. First two KnK movies are mediocre.

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> the style of KnK
Read it, illiterate fateniggers.

Is it? So what happens? Why doesn't Waver participate in 5th GW?

Literally in post credit scene of last episode Luvia told him that 2 spots magic association had for becoming master have been occupied while Waver was busy with other shit.

Because he's a weak little baby mage?

>2 spots magic association had for becoming master have been occupied
Bazett and Atrum right?

Yes.

>Does Waver participate in the Fifth Holy Grail war or what?
He misses out on it, but he shows up after the ending of Heaven's Feel to help dismantle the Grail.

>Yes I know her backstory, but it's just to justify her ressemblance, but doesn't bring anything to the story.
On the contrary, it's interesting because despite liking her, the very sight of Gray's face gives him horrible PTSD flashbacks. It's an interesting character interaction.

It was mentioned right in the after credit in ep 3 though ? In the novel:
>"You haven't given up on being the Association's representative for the Fifth Holy Grail War, right?"
>"...right."
>I could feel Gray instantly react to those words. It seemed she had her own thoughts about the Holy Grail War.
>"Well, I actually heard from the Trambelio family that the Association's representative has been all but decided already. It seems to be one of the current Sealing Designation Enforcers, a true professional by the name of Bazett Fraga McRemitz. Considering the reality of the Holy Grail War, she really does seem like the right person for the job. Also, there seems to be another position, but it seems pretty suspicious to me. Like it was given to some newcomer who happened to fill the right pockets."
>After a few moments of silence, my brother just flipped his hair.
>"Being the official representative of the Association isn't the only way to get in. At any rate, I've got a debt to you and the El-Melloi family I have to repay first."
Planning to participate in the 5th HGW is also the reason why Waver met Gray too, since he was looking for someone who is good at dealing with spirit stuff

I was wondering why the fuck Waver would be having PTSD about Saber rather than Gilgamesh considering the events of Zero, but now it's pretty clear it is so they can fit in another Seibahface into the plot. Can't let things like logic get in the way of shoving that sameface everywhere.

Could have been a good show but now we know most things will orbit around and be resolved by the Saberface, this time with the added shit of having a fucking ugly retarded weapon.

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Ok so what happens to Gray?

>I was wondering why the fuck Waver would be having PTSD about Saber rather than Gilgamesh considering the events of Zero
Waver has PTSD about Saber because he thinks Saber killed Kayneth though ?

Retard, it's because of his guilt over Keyneth's death. He doesn't know the specific manner, just that Keyneth was taken down by Saber's team. For fuck's sake, they even explain to you in the very first episode. I can't believe I actually have to defend a seibah face, fuck you dumb speedwatcher.

>he thinks Saber killed Kayneth
She did.

During Case Files or after Case Files ?

Even if Waver doesn't have PTSD of Saber, Gray will still tell him to hate her face for sure
>My master already knew this much. You could call it a preamble. Something we talked about the first day we met in my old home. When I had made that request.
>Please...keep hating my face.
>Thinking back on it now, it was really a cruel thing to ask of him.
>I don't like it, so please don't like it either. Was there anything more selfish? I was just so happy that, unlike my family, someone had responded to seeing my face with fear, but even that was no excuse.
>But that was a discussion for another time.
>Pushing down my suicidal self-hatred for now, I got to my point.

It's a good thing anyway, Waver would have gotten his ass kicked even harder in the 5th.

> Also no snek

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He also... you know... got fucking EXCALIBLASTED because Seiba thought they kidnapped Iri?

That's even dumber.

Turns out guilt is a thing that normal functional people can experience. Of course, I don't expected autists like you to comprehend basic human emotions.

Why? He assumes his teacher was brutally murdered by Saber and it's partly his fault.

Both please

He would've curbstomped. 5th Grail war had way weaker servants and little kid masters.

The guy's either a genuine retard or just fishing for (You)s so don't bother.

I just want see Touko! Muh Dick!

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> 5th Grail war had way weaker servants and little kid masters
It's actually the other way around. Most heroic spirits of 5th war are of higher tier than 4th war's and everyone beats their 4th war class counterpart except for Archer. Oh, and Rin is fa r superior magus compared to anyone in 4th war.

>swing by /m/
>yet another thread with people confused about Katejina
>every case file thread is obliged to have people being confused with why waver hates artoria face
Guys, I'm beginning to think that the average anime fan is kinda dumb.

> Medusa uses Mystic eyes
> All the Zero servants are ded.

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It's honestly hillarious how many servants autolose against her eyes. And that's not even counting her nuke which is really strong too.

After her first meeting with Waver, she left her village and went to the Clock Tower with him.
During Case Files, she joined the El-Melloi classroom, became friends with other people and acted as Waver's Watson throughout the story. She also took care of his daily routine, his apartment and his shoes too. By the end of Case Files, Saber got summoned by Shirou in the 5th HGW thus make Gray's hair turns blonde, she gets advanced regeneration abilities, and she gets a dragon mana engine in her body just like Saber has so she basically generates mana just by breathing. I think after Case Files, she will still stay in London with the El-Melloi classroom since this is the first (and probably the only) time she's treated like a human, normal girl.

Saber killed her nigger

Yes, so?

What does Saber getting summoned affect Gray?

And he also had to come to terms with the fact that Keyneth was right. All that put together, it's not surprising he'll get turned off by Gray's face.

Saber is the sole exception because it's the mary sue class with innate A magic resist for no reason beyond making it inmune to casters.

Saber is one of the few servants in those wars that would outright defeat Rider everytime. She has massive mana reserves that counter Rider's mystic eyes, her nuke is stronger than Rider's nuke and in close combat she's decidedly superior. Only thing Rider has in that battle is superior speed.

High mana stat is more important. Saber's mana stat is high enough to resist.

> A magic resist for no reason beyond making it inmune to casters
I mean the whole Fuyuki HGW system was rigged to give knight classes magic resistance and for 3 founding families to summon them to give them advantage over other participants. And not every Saber has A rank MR, Artoria is just exceptionally good against magic because of her dragon core and shit.

>Saber
>Zero Servant

>can fuck all the girl but Taiga

Because of Saber's soul. Everytime she gets summoned, Gray's forced transformation will progress (like in the 4th HGW, she lost her original face). The cult's plan is waiting for the moment when the transformation is completed and Saber's soul will possess Gray's body but since the 5th HGW is the last one, Gray's body won't be turned into Saber's.
Btw this might be helpful

Yeah, by massive mana reserves I meant her magic stat which is always at least B. It's just such a bad match up for Rider when her mystic eyes are ineffective and her opponent has strongest holy sword to counter Bellerophon.

She wouldn't have beaten Gil or Lancelot, arguably Alexander too.

She was in it dumbass

> She wouldn't have beaten Gil or Lancelot, arguably Alexander too
Gil no, but he's strongest heroic spirit anyway. Lancelot and Iskander have C rank in mana stat so they autolose against her eyes.

But she's from F/SN, just like Gil.

> Lancelot, arguably Alexander too.
One-shotted with a glance.

>Fuyuki HGW system was rigged to give knight classes magic resistance and for 3 founding families to summon them to give them advantage over other participants
That's a meme perpetuated by fans that has no basis in reality. It's not stated anywhere.

Nigga he's got a ton of servants to scout out her eyes and devise a counter attack. Medusa is strong but she can't beat the entire Greek army.

That's just speculation about certain possibilites when in Fate everyone can beat everyone under right conditions. But Medusa is superior to Iskandar and would come out as a winner more times than not. Also her Bellerophon is stronger than any attack Iskandar has.

Is case files ending already?

He can't use them like that. His NP is the desert where he fought with all these dudes, and it is supported by their collective will. He can't use them like Zero Assassin and his alternate personalities.

Vol 10 (the last vol) was released back in May. The manga is still on-going and Case Files Material will be released this winter.

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I liked her casual design in KnK a lot more.

Iselma Twin Towers happened in a social gathering, though. Touko also has another design in Grand Roll case.

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>Medusa is strong but she can't beat the entire Greek army.
Not a bet I would take.

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Not even needed to become Gorgon. His army can do nothing against pegasus who massively increases her defenses and will wipe his soldiers out. That, and everyone turns to stone with single glance anyway. People underestimate Medusa far too much.

Thinking about it, Pegasus can fly and its dragon-class defense can tank arrows and spears.

Yes, as his army has no noble phantasms, they won't even scratch it.

Was it worth it in the end?
I like it's not about yet another grail war, but the first episodes were kind of... forgettable?
Just about mystery you can't really understand since they're based on unexplained magical details.

Honestly when I finished Fate/Zero I would have liked to believe that, due to the inspiration of Rider, Waver self-actualized, found true purpose in life and became a well-rounded person.

Instead he deals with a job that does not truly make him happy, which he mostly does out of obligation, only really finds fun when playing vidya, still gets triggered over any saberface, never found love, does not have kids, has to deal with copious amounts of debt, geez it is a bit too realistic for me.

I don't think he wants love.

yeah, but it does not mean it could not have been written otherwise, not that it necessarily needs to, I just would have prefered it if they took the character into a more idealistic direction overall

It's literally the only spin-off set in FSN line.

You know the novels are done right? Gray is important but not the center of the narrative at all. Her whole thing is solved in a different arc before the last one.

He is slowly becoming important and basically being the teacher of the best generation the Clock Tower is going to have (to the point it's said he would change the entire power system of the organization if he wanted).

He is also going to become the guy who ends the Grail Wars.

It's the least worst but it's still nowhere close to Zero and the original VN.
Everything neo-TM releases is just chuuni crap nowadays. It reminds me of the To Aru setting (Index/Railgun/Accel) where they seemingly have a huge setting with complex power stuggles and a deep system of magic, religion and science. But in the end it's just kids doing chuuni stuff with loli waifus as bad guys.

Isn't Gordius Wheel the same ranks as Bellerophon?

Also, the only chance Iskander have against her eyes, is having a good caster in his army.

> There are also some Heroic Spirits that are stronger than the summoner himself, as while his deeds were great, it is not a testament of his personal martial prowess. Aside from the several people who are stronger than Rider himself, there are also those summoned that has greater military power than Rider and there are those who has Charisma equivalent to Rank B for being the kings of their own countries.

It is the same rank, but it has never shown offensive capabilites on the level of Bellerophon.

What you have seen is anime original material. Ghe only adapted moments are the little cat story and the talk with little Reines, both of which are extended prologues, not actual chapters of the LN

the novels are way better than f/z which is just juvenile shite

The bad guy here is not a loli though. It's not even a woman.

Taiga is for Waver

Taiga raped bedridden kiritsugu.

For what purpose though.

>ray of sunshine powerhouse and gloomy chainsmoking lanklet
???

Introduce the characters I guess since they're not starting from the first novel for some reason.

>In choosing Rail Zeppelin, Sanda kind of went through process of elimination. Most mystery novels are theatrical. In Detachment Castle Adra, the curtain truly rises when they get to the castle. An incident occurs and the tension rises. From that Gray and El-Melloi II investigate and there's another incident. Finally there's a climax. When writing the script a TV anime, 6 eps couldn't come out of that.

>This is also different from an action light novel. When Sanda writes one of those, There's a battle by page 50, another at 120, and the best battle on 180. The volume ends on 240. Making an anime with that is easier because you get a mini climax each episode. Adra and Iselma are more theatrical stories.

>Rail Zeppelin has all the actions but still you need previous knowledge like Gray's abilities, El-Melloi II's relationship with Reines and aspects of the classroom.

Her young CT student design is probably my favourite, it's a shame it's never been used in anything. I'd watch Aoko and Touko in a pre-Mahoyo Clock Tower story.

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>Iskandar doesn't stomp Medusa
>Medea isn't comparable to Gilles
>Zerkerlot and Heracles aren't on the same level.
>4th HGW Saber isn't better than 5th HGW Saber
Kojiro and cursed arm are worse than hundred face, sure.
But what the fuck are you on.

Medusa petrifies Iskandar with Mystic Eyes, he has no resistance
Medea is far, far stronger than Gilles, the only thing Gilles has going for himself is the Cthulhu button.
Herc is way more dangerous than Lancelot. Lancelot dies if he's killed.
Cursed Arm is better than Hundred Face looking at the track record.

Emiya is also a several times better archer than Gil when he gets on top of a sky scraper.

>Iskandar doesn't stomp Medusa
Loses with to a single glance of her eyes
>Medea isn't comparable to Gilles
Medea is one of the best casters around, she can blast him with casual A rank spell and it's over. She only loses if he summons giant sea monster which takes time
>Zerkerlot and Heracles aren't on the same level.
They aren't. Herc is much stronger. Lancelot can't take all his lives anyway.
>4th HGW Saber isn't better than 5th HGW Saber
Kerry's Saber is only superior to Shirou's version without Avalon. Rin's and Sakura's Saber are far stronger.
>Kojiro and cursed arm are worse than hundred face, sure.
Kojiro that can fight Saber and repel Berserker? Sure.

>secondaries hate it cause no ufotable
>FGOfags hate it cause no Servant trash

Yep, this is the best thing to come from Type-Moon since Mahoyo.

>Kojiro that can fight Saber and repel Berserker? Sure.
Let's be fair, that's conditional.
He can fight Saber if he encounters her on a narrow staircase where he has the height advantage. If it was an open field he'd be dead.
As for Berserker, Caster helped out there.

You do realize that the next 3 months are theirs right?

Still shows how good he is. When we compare that to fucking Hundred Face, that's more than enough.

They are never going further their usual "Jesus, put your hood back, I have a very bad PTSD". It was clearly added afther the idea of creating their own saberclone, not as something that they would work with through all the story.

To be fair this is the only thread remotely negative about this. So far it has been mostly liked by everyone here as far as reactions went.

Whose? People who like CF? Yeah, I'm really excited for 3 more months of this.
FGOfags have their shitty Babylonia anime in October anyway.

Usually HGW happening once in 60 years, they are never going to accomplish this anyway. They were lucky with 5th HGW happened this yearly and have the same Saber twice.

I honestly don't have any problem with the animation by Troyca. Both Case Files and the 2nd OP of FGO are fine, though for CF some of the character designs look really different from the novel and manga (Gray, Flat, also Yvette's dress in the novel is better than the one on anime IMO). Anime Reines looks very good too. It's not like Fate - Typemoon and ufotable need to stick with each other for all of their anime projects.

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FGO OP 2 looks like shit at times, especially the last few shots, but then again it's well deserved for that kusoge and mostly it's fine.
Case Files looks great, the character designs are different but good (except Flat) and the facial expressions and fight animation have been pretty well done.

There will be a servant and FGO character anyway.

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How will Waver fare if he got in the 5th HGW instead of Madea's master? What if the Matou managed to summon Medusa first? Who will Waver summon? Or will he have Grey be the summoner? She does have practically infinite mana by the end of the series. Will he bring Flat and co along?

Iskandar apparently is qualified to be Rider, Lancer, Caster and Berserker so I guess he would summon caster version since other slots would be occupied already.

Btw Trisha just made a cameo in ep 2. This and since Caules and Yvette got introduced already, Adashino should show up soon.

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>Iskandar Caster
Man I can't picture that. I was thinking Madea might still work considering she was a fellow Greek. Or maybe Zhuge Liang might show up due to the whole karma thingy.

>especially the last few shots
Yeah, especially the Kirei & the Church shot which looks meh but Troyca really improved at this kind of scene in Case Files. Other than that i think it's fine.
Anyway i hope the Rail Zeppelin adaption will have good quality and won't be rushed/have pacing problem. There will only be 13 episodes after all.

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Waver would be using same catalyst. If Iskandar doesn't come, one of heroic spirits from his army who was close to his king will be summoned maybe?

Waver is still a third rate mage, i would imagine him making friends with Shirou and Rin though. No question he would go for Alexander again. If he would have succeeded to summon him as Rider that would take care of the Medusa problem but that would mean the Matou would have had access to something far stronger in it stead probably. Gil would still beat Iskandar though, but maybe with Rin and Shirou his fate would be altered.

>But in the end it's just kids doing chuuni stuff with loli waifus as bad guys.
Of course you can't say that when the past 3 volumes have not even been about the mcs but an old man facing his past regrets and demon? Granted, it's still pretty chuuni, but still.

Are you implying that Fate wasn't chuunishit since day 1? Because if so, man are you a sad, deluded motherfucker.

He might be on a collision course with Shirou if he think he must kill Saber ASAP to prevent Grey from getting sublimated.

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Lancelot can just make new NP with his knight of owner and kill herc 12 times with stats

>Matou would have had access to something far stronger in it stead probably
I mean, Medusa's really strong heroic spirit. Dunno how high are Sakura's chances to summon someone stronger without catalyst.

Waver is a shit magus and wouldn't be able to supply a servant properly. If he was smart he'd let Gray be the master since he was planning on bringing her along anyway. If Gray is doing the summoning I doubt Iskandar's catalyst would even work since Gray and Rhongomyniad are far stronger catalysts for Artoria. So Waver would end up with Gray (with blond hair and dragon mana core) and Artoria making him basically unbeatable. Rhongobongo + Excalibur spam as Gray has nigh limitless mana, Saber working on max output. Only really Gilgamesh can oppose them, but I wouldn't be surprised if Waver ended up teaming with Rin. Shirou probably would still get involved due to getting killed & revived but wouldn't have a servant.

Those NPs are D rank. It's also weird in how in those discussions people treat Herc as if he's standing target that would wait for opponent to try out all his methods of getting past God Hand when Herc's got top tier stats enough to wreck Saber without using mad enchantment buff.

Maybe Waver could do what Fastwheels before him did.
Have himself as the master but someone else (like Gray) be the mana source.
That would be super ironic.

Oh yeah, I could totally see that happening as dramatic irony

Every continuation of FSN ends with Saber being desummoned. If anything, It's highly likely that if Gray Meets Shirou

she falls in love with him

D rank, can't bypass God Hand.

It might not really matter who Sakura summons.
>Sakura summons somebody else
>that someone ends up stuck with Shinji anyway because neither Zouken nor Sakura really wanted to participate in the 5th war to begin with
>they also might not even have an ability like Bloodfort to help gather mana

>neo-TM chuuni crap
>I AM THE BONE OF MY SWORD
>The entire concept of summoning heroic spirits
>Shiki's fucking eyes having their magical power sealed by his glasses being worn.

Gray-tan is fluffy and yellow?

Does the wolf boy see Saber when he sees Gray?

I doubt he would have curbstomped the war, mostly because Gilgamesh and Hercules, but he would have walked circles around every master not named Rin and Kotomine.

There's also issue if new servant would tolerate Shinji at all. Guy was lucky Medusa was so loyal to Sakura that she didn't do anything when Sakura gave her away.

Sakura would have had to waste a command spell on having the servant obey Shinji.
But Zouken can probably make more, considering he created them in the first place.

Man there's something that always ate away at me.
>Gimmick/trait of the Rider class is supposed to be a bounty of noble phantasms.
>Medusa has her eyes, the reins of the pegasus, bloodfort, and maybe her weapon counts as one.
>Iskandar has his thunder-calling sword, bull chariot, horses, and the reality marble
>Astolfo has the lance and hippogriff he "borrowed" from Bradamante, the toot, and the book.
>Ozy has his boat, his pyramid, his other pyramid, and the ability to create sphinxes
>Drake has the fleet...
Do we count the selectively-summoned Cannons as one?
Is her power boost with finances via Golden Rule one, given that's not how it works with, say, Gilgamesh or Dantes?

Those were movies

Is the silver blob sentient or is Reines using it like a puppet?

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Well, as we see in prologue, commands that imply absolute obedience aren't very effective. If that servant hates Shinji, they would find a way to get rid of him even under such command spell.

You think Waver could have avoided getting Kirei’d if he had been the representative instead of Bazett?

It has some self-control

Yes. It's specifically a golem made using the mercury magecraft.
Trimmau has a very limited bit sentient personality.

What I wonder about is what the fuck you would do if you get Drake or Blackbeard as a servant. Unless the HGW just happens to take place near a lake or a ocean, you're kind of boned.

He's not in love with Kirei at least

Yes, the blob can slap you if you touch its butt.

So she isn’t a natural redhead? She’s really a brunette like her sister?

Probably.
He doesn't trust others easily.
And would be well-defended if he takes his students with him.

Probably. Especially if he has Gray with him.

Kirei is an absolute beast as a killer, and Waver is a borderline hikkineet.

>think she’s no longer evil in KnK
>she’s actually still totally evil

Dang, man.

would it be a playful slap or death slap?

False. Drake's ships, at least, do not need water and can fucking fly.

He would have Gray with him
and I very much doubt Add would trust him either

Pioneer of the Stars is good though, even in Extra Drake was holding on her own despite Shinji fucking around.

I honestly can’t decide if Kirei could easily corrupt the impressionable Flat or not

Flat trusts Waver a lot, I doubt he'd switch "masters" so easily.

Gray's voice is sex.

Their ships can fly and Blackbeard gets stronger the more people are on his ship so all you’d need to do is either trick the enemy into fighting you on the Queen Anne’s Revenge or kidnap a whole bunch of folks and keep them in the hold

shishou~

Gray's everything is sex!

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She can summon her entire fleet or even a simple rowboat out of nowhere to ram into her enemies in a pinch

Did you forget the part of Zero where Iskandar just kinda casually flies through the air with his chariot?
Gravity doesn't care about phantasmal mounts, apparently.

Imagine Patton or Bomberman Harris as a servant.

Summon Columbus! He has powerful offensive and defensive options, a bevy of weapons, two ship girls (Nina and Pinta) who come as his sidekicks, and he never ever gives up! He’s The Godfather of European Explorers and Pirates alike!

Cartoon violence.

Now I wonder, if Waver likes Japan and Akihabara so much, why doesn't he make Gray dress up in frilly goth loli outfit?

>implying TM is good

Literally nothing. It's just a waste of time.

He hates Japan, he just likes their video games

I was reading HA and Medusa's Breaker Gorgon came up and I was wondering, if she has access to that NP and she can seal things or "concepts" with it, like her own MEs via looking at a mirror, why doesn't she use it more often to seal an enemy's NP or ability?

Isn't he Yea Forumsnon??

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>Summoning a shitter that accomplished no actually amazing feats in his travels and is only wanked by americans
No I'm fine.

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>Drake's ships, at least, do not need water and can fucking fly.

I take back what I said, that sounds fucking awesome. Any servant that comes complete with a free airship is okay with me.

And what did Drake accomplish? Even his circumnavigation was only the second one.

>First captain to do so
>Beat up Poseidon
>Acquired the actual Holy Grail

He is only good at enslaving natives.

Waver would probably panicking as Grey turn more and more into Saber, becoming more inhuman in the process. He'll probably want Saber to be gone sooner than later.

She should be capable of sealing enemy's NP and abilities, also trapping them in a dream too based on its description. I'm not sure, maybe enemy should have low magic resistance or mana stat for it to work, just like with her mystic eyes?

Can someone screencap me the piece in the novel that suggests Gray does have feeling for Waver? I find it hard to believe with how austitic he is, she can see him more than just a teacher or a father

When will they get on the train?

Sabers always have feelings for their MCs, no matter how weak or autistic or retarded they are. Self-inserting is serious business in anime.

ep6 or 7

I hope it doesn't continue with the episodic sherlock holmes shit any longer. t animeonly

Who is doing the sound track? It sounds similar to Zero but there isn't any chanting so it can't be Kajiura again.

>>Remember Sieg
God damn it. Shiro is nice though

forums.nrvnqsr.com/showthread.php/5943-Lord-El-Melloi-II-Case-Files?p=2989668&highlight=hating#post2989668

>Who is doing the sound track?
Yuki Kajiura

>Arthur & Manaka
>Seiba & Kiritsugu
>Siegfreid & Gordes

Waver is basically the ultimate teacher,if he become friend with Shiro and Rin he basically get two more students and servents, all of them could use some extra lesson...

>Siegfreid & Gordes
This one is true.

Thanks, user. That's kinda sweet. Too bad Waver is gay for Iskandar

Meeting Saber again would be awkward for both of them.

Other way around. 5th war servants and masters were on steroids. Cu, Herc, Medusa (with a proper master) were ridiculous, the former 2 being outright high-tier. For masters, you had humans who could beat servants on advantageous terms and fucking Dark Sakura

lol what the fuck

What about Mo-san?

"Shiro meet the Rider's master i though i had excalibursted the last time, "

I'm enjoying strange fake mostly because it's delivering what Apocrypha promised, while incorporating all aspects of Nasu's worldbuilding into one universe. It also feels much more creative in terms of the variety of masters and servants.
Knowing Narita though, it'll be fucking years before it gets anywhere.

Read the VN

Based speedreader.

So wait, if saber sticks around in UBW good end, doesn't that mean that Gray would be fully transformed and there'd essentially be two Artorias?

>Seiba & Kiritsugu
Kiritsugu was too old and wasn't an MC for self insertion.

If the Grail is so attractive to Magus/Magicians why aren't stronger entities trying to join?

He probably wouldn't be done in as simple as Bazett, but I do wonder how a conversation would be between the two. Waver is insecure as fuck, and Kirei would have an easy fucking time with that. But since Waver is all magic detective and shit, maybe he would uncover Kirei's rule breaking a lot faster?

Fuck creating a new thread, I'll just ask here:
What servant is so long overdue to show up, that he\she is gonna be a dissapointment regardless?
Also, is Adam and Eve a thing in nasuverse and would they be summonable?

You just mentioned Adam. Most biblical servants aren't in. There's also Genghis Khan who will probably be as disappointing as Attila.

Roland

Archer Herc (not Alcides) maybe? His power level is so hyped up that he probably won't live up to it.

In terms of "has been in fate projects but hasn't been in F/GO?" the answer is fucking Wukong.
Especially because there's enough to work with that they may end up being Grand Lancer and so far we're 2/7~3/8 on Grands and 5/9 for Beasts. Kind of 6 because of Prototype.
In terms of "notable legends that haven't been in Fate?" God damn Kaguya is one of the few japanese legends people actually know about on a more global scale and even though we have the entire extraverse taking place on the moon, she's been mentioned once in a Tamamo line in CCC and that's it.

>Waver getting Saber as a servant.
I want this so bad now. Just imagine the two trying to work together and dealing with their respective HGW4 induced traumas. Both ultimately bonding over their mutual hatred of Kiritsugu.

Also, Saber doting on Gray would be adorable.

Kirei being a former master is public knowledge. Waver would probably be suspicious immediately, especially when Kirei pulled some shady collusion with Tokiomi in the last war, and because he probably didn't forget how Assassin tried to kill him before.

The Americans tried with Strange Fake.
It's still ultra retarded though. Servants are ultimate beings to humans and you can summon them anywhere after some preparation and yet no one takes advantage of it for doing usual human stuff (war, assassinations, crime, etc).

Archer Herc is weaker than Alcides and we were already told in mats that Herc as a heroic spirit is only "close to the strongest heroic spirit", who at the time was Gilgamesh.

Considering how Genghis Khan is almost certainly going to be Grand Rider. I actually have pretty high hopes for him. Since both Grand Assassin and Grand Caster are kind of awesome.

He's probably going to end up being the Grand Archer. If only because of how much he's been hyped up.

Case files contextualizes the grail war as just another everyday Magus' ritual that takes place somewhere in Asia.
They don't even see too clear about the inner workings of it at all. Most of them are probably more invested in their own research anyway.

He's a NPC in Grand Order. Let's just say many of Charlemagne's knights are weirdos thanks to being present in Orlando Furioso.

>Genghis Khan
>Grand Rider
There are two notable traits we have with Grands so far.
>Escaped the mortal coil somehow
>Have a form of clairvoyance.
There's someone who has both checked and 9 phantasmal beasts that let him effectively cover the entire planet's surface in 24 hours.

Attached: Quickmas.jpg (1280x720, 71K)

Clairvoyance part is only requirement for Grand Caster. King Hassan doesn't possess it.

Doesn't Grampa Bones have a variant in form of literal messages from God telling him who his targets are?

That would actually be perfect. But since Saber Alter is already Santa, my best bet is still on Genghis Khan. Guy pretty much redefined what it means to be a conqueror, and his army has become synonymous with horses.

I always thought that it is actually stupidly costly to summon and maintain even shit tier servants without at least a makeshift grail as an anchor.

>3/8 on Grands
Gil, Merlin, Solomon for Casters
King Hassan for Assassin
Genghis for Rider probably
There was also a prehistoric Excalibur weilder, so some saberfoce for Saber.
Am I missing anyone else?

Clairvoyance is for caster only and more of a requirement, no?

>escaped the mortal coil
Would Koschei qualify? Fucker didn't even remove his soul, but yanked his whole concept of death out of himself.

Saber Alter is not Santa.
Saber Alter (and Jeanne Alter Lily) are overcome by the passive presence that is "Santa" as energy that they don festive clothes and act as he would for Chaldea.

>Prehistoric Excalibur weilder
It's going to fucking be Galactica. Takeuchi will not allow Grand Saber be anything but an Artoria. She's such a blank slate she can be forced in to both be who fell Sefar's projection and be whom the MHX project was meant to emulate.

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Don't bother replying to animeonly fags who have no idea about servants' strength.
Fate series have always been chuuni as fuck, Zero is no exception.
Stop pretending your beloved zero is a hidden gem when it's literally the same as the others.

There are a fuckton of Greek heroes that are still ripe to be used. I expect all of them to be disappointing, considering what a terrible track record Fate has with Greek heroes.

Waiting for Perseus and Odysseus, at least.

Yes, The Evening Bell. But it's not really clairvoyance, but unique skill he has as a result of having become one with the rites of passing.

>Waiting for Perseus
Nigga he's in prototype.

Most people seem to like Achilles and Herc though.

Btw don't forget that Daybit's servant is a Grand too
>Da Vinci
>(That miasma is too dense. I can't observe his actual body.
>From the narrow outline, I can grasp his scale, but -
>There's no doubt, that's a Grand.
>That man contracted with a Grand Servant...!)

>Asclepius
>What? You... What was that?!

>???
>Yama......Yamaten, huh.
>Judging dead men? What kind of joke is that idea?
>Death is something to be devoured. Life is something to be offered.
>The anarchy of allowing freedom to dead men does not exist in my world.
>So I ate them all.
>But the taste was foul. It was proof that their diet was anything but decent.

>Daybit
>Don't stick your head out too much. This isn't your land.
>Did no one ever tell you to never drink the groundwater of a foreign soil?

>???
>You have a point. I will control myself.
>After all, we aren't here for a gourmet meal.

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Waver to Shiro
"i'm sorry boy you did magic wrong all your life,but don't worry i can teach you,also...is your teacher still single?"

Being suspicious of Kirei is the default for almost everyone that deals with him. Doesn't really stop him from doing his suspicious stuff, or fucking you over.

Prototype isn't barely a thing. And the Prototype version of him is ridiculously different from his portrayal in HA.

We know he was supposed to have a berserker, and what he has is on a grand level.
But so was Qin but "Grand Ruler" isn't a thing.
Also, it wouldn't be the first time two servants would have been named into the same class, only for one to lose the title due to plot.

Fuck off, Taiga.

That combination seems way too strong to be able to beat Gil. Maybe if it was Waver completely unable to use magic and Gray capable of using Rhongobongo just one more time, in that case I'd give the advantage to them.

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Yeah i mean QSH's Saint Graph is on par with a Grand's but from what Da Vinci said, his servant is indeed a Grand Servant (like King Hassan before), not "in the same level with a Grand"

>Taiga survived two grail wars she didn't even know she was in
>Yakuza money behind her
>Swordplay that challenges Seiba
>Accidentally summoned Shiki that one time
Imagine the potential as a master.

Part of Waver’s ptsd involves Saber almost blowing him up. I don’t see why he’d hate Kiritsugu since their only interactions with each other is a phone call telling him the plan to beat Caster.

>turns out it's another parallel universe.
It's not, did you miss the intro featuring the fight of Alexander with Gilgamesh nigga?
>Why doesn't Waver participate in 5th GW?
Because he doesn't want to? He'd have to travel to Fuyuki, he can't automatically summon Rider in London. I mean, if he did participate that would make it a parallel universe since the participants of 5GW have already been established.

>Servants are ultimate beings to humans and you can summon them anywhere after some preparation and yet no one takes advantage of it for doing usual human stuff (war, assassinations, crime, etc).
Servants answer the call for the HGW because they either expect an enjoyable fight out of it, or have a wish they want from the Holy Grail. If someone were to just summon a Servant to treat them as a simple familiar, they would either just not answer the summons or rebel after being summoned.
This exact same scenario occurs according the Apocrypha's side material, where a ton of fake Grail Wars pop up, but Servants would often just kill their Masters immediately when they realized they got summoned for a farce of a War.

Because if you summon them for no good reason they're just gonna kill you on the spot and fuck off.

Did you forget he was the target of Saber's noble phantasm and survived only because Alexander jumped with him at the last moment?

Kiritsugu is the one who killed his teacher though. Something that seems to have played as big of a role in his developing PTSD as Saber almost turning him into space dust.

>never found love, does not have kids
Hopefully Gray will take care of that ;)

FGO makes it a point that Grand servants can also be summoned as non-Grand servants (Solomon even has two separate Pokedex entries: one for his Grand Caster form and one for the normal Caster form that got summoned in the 5th war). There's absolutely nothing stopping normal Seiba from being Grand Saber.

I wouldn't be surprised if Grand Saber will end up being Artoria who somehow fulfilled her contract with World and became guardian.

>Everything neo-TM releases is just chuuni crap nowadays
Have you even read Tsukihime or KnK? The Fate stuff is outright tame compared to how chuuni they are.

I personally find it a touch curious that G.Saber hasn't had any kind of acknowledgement in F/GO. You think she'd be featured in a CE or have, say, Mysterious Heroine XX have a joke hinting towards them.
Considering Saber Venus was a thing and then has its small cameo in Summer Nero's noble phantasm, it isn't like the character design is too taboo anymore.
Even Saber Lion got its bits in Carnival Phantasm and the theme park in Prisma.

Tsukihime and KnK don't have fanservicing saberclones, genderswapped loli servants everywhere or chuuni children characters acting like children.

>(Solomon even has two separate Pokedex entries: one for his Grand Caster form and one for the normal Caster form that got summoned in the 5th war)
No. Solomon is only grand caster even in his materials. You're confusing his profile for Goetia who was masquerading as grand caster as well

This is a Japanese game and yet the most famous sword in Japan history aka Kusanagi hasnt appeared. Though I know Type Moon has a huge favor with Saberface, having the first emperor in Japan possesing the imperial regalia (Kusanagi, Yata and Yasakani Magatama) as his noble phatasms being Grandsaber isnt a bad idea

She is in avalon with a proper HS worthy Shirou by the end of her story though. It is notoriously hard to pull things out of there.
Another CG shows up. fully covered, so you can't see actual figure, but openly goes by PENDRAGON. Turns out to be Uther with infinite Caliburn.

He was summoned as regular caster in FGO's timeline for 5th war. Also Old!Hassan burns through his grand status and goes around as regular Assassin in Babylon

But he did though. He went from being a powerless little twerp to a man with purpose. That he chooses to face his pretty enviable situation (essentially one of the most influential people in magus society) as a burden instead of a perk is just his in-born sourness and mutt complex talking

The bottom card was registered as Goetia, but the profile makes it clear it's still Solomon's Grand Caster entry. The top is the Solomon who was summoned in the 5th war and later became Romani. Notice how the bottom card clearly says "Grand Caster" while the top just says "Caster".

Attached: solomon.png (784x872, 1.29M)

I mean, Excalibur is constantly called strongest holy sword and it's divine construst that's even stronger when used to defend the planet. With all this wank surrounding it, my money is on Grand Saber being wielder of Excalibur.

>Grand Assassin and Caster claimed
>Saber's almost certainly a form of Seiba
>Rider is either Khan or Santa
>Longinus is in Requiem, so Wukong is one of few names really thrown about for Lancer.
>Archer often comes to people claiming Hou Yi
Who the fuck, besides maybe Samson, is going to be berserker?

Beowulf, naturally.

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Just hope that its a version of male Arthur. No more Saberface, please

>Mildly Miffed E-
He should've been it but here we are.

His ME rank is so low because it's part of his superior Berserk A skill which gives him the benefits of ME without the drawbacks and more.

Cain.

what day/scene

My sav bias is showing, but I really want either Koschei or Svyatogor as Grand!Zerker.
Or Cain

He's the original Berserker, he's in.

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That's not any better, honestly. It's still Arthur, justmore boring and with a dick. Personally I want grand saber to be someone completely new character.

I still feel like Cain was the true name of KH. A lot of the backstory feels in line.
It'd be more than fitting that the lad who INSTILLED THE CONCEPT OF MURDER IN HUMANITY, became Grand Assassin.

>Saber's almost certainly a form of Seiba
I honestly kind of hope not. I like Saber just fine, but there are so many more interesting choices they could go for.

>Archer often comes to people claiming Hou Yi
Isn't Hou Yi a god? Either way, my guess is still Hercules.

>Who the fuck, besides maybe Samson, is going to be berserker?
I find it unlikely that they would include two people from Christian mythology as Grand Servants. I think somebody from Norse Mythology, or even Warp Spasm Cuchulainn, would make more sense.

Isn't Grand literally just mean when the servant is summoned they have a larger container for their power?

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It sure does make more sense than him being Noah.
On that line of thought, could Adam be summoned as a Berserker, him eating the Apple qulifying as the greatest possible form of madness Man could ever do?

but he was tricked, he didn't do it maliciously, or in a fit of rage/madness.

It was contextualized like that earlier in the World Material. Case Files gives insight about it and info about how there are unknown parties inside the Clock Tower trying to make it less of a deal.

>A lot of the backstory feels in line
But he never have a proper backstory, he's just a mysterious person so you probably fill the void with your own thoughts.

Dick makes everything better.
Joke aside, if Excalibur is still chosen as the noble phatasm of Grandsaber, then we cannot expect anything else. Arthur or Artoria, a version of them will be grandsaber. Painfully boring, but high possibility.
My hope is placed on Jimmu, who is the first emperor of Japan and possesses Kusanagi. Other than him, I cant find anyone else thay can fit that role

Yes, but who the one chosen to occupy grand spot is supposed to be pinnacle of their class.

Hou Yi is a dude who in chinese mythology shot down a bunch of dietic sun birds because they were basically scorching the earth. Specifically there were 10 suns and he killed 9 of them by himself.
Depending on the account, he ranges from God of Archery, to a demi-god, to being purely mortal.
His wife is the lunar goddess Chang'e no matter what though.
Grands are "Heroic Spirits who technically didn't die but are still registered in the Throne of Heroes. They can't be normally summoned. Instead, the counter force uses them in the absolute worst case scenario situations. In principle, they are the counter-measures to a Beast manifesting," and thus are seen as the pinnacle or best of their container.

How about male miyamoto musashi?

Grand Assassin Stheno

Considering the qulifier for zerker is being mad to the point of insanity or general public image of being crazy, you could probably stretch it to: done something insane out of lacking the ability to know better.

>Depending on the account, he ranges from God of Archery, to a demi-god, to being purely mortal.
I guess he COULD work. Still seems kind of unlikely though. If only because, and feel free to correct me here, he seems pretty unknown.

Ai-chan?

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Nice idea. I like badass old swordman. That said, what makes him famous is his skill. His sword, not so much

>forgive them father, for they do not know what they're doing
Those were Jesus last words on the cross well not sure if literal last words but you get the point. The representation of humanity itself will be Grand zerker

The story is Chang'e is very, VERY well-known in China. It's the kind of thing that's seeped so deeply into Chinese pop culture that even people who have never heard the story probably recognize it.

Almost certainly Charlotte Cordday.
She may be done by the Tawawa artist. We'll have to see when LB6 happens in 10 months.

Most of the characters or persons could be grands. Merlin have potential to be a next grand caster and isn't even as broken as everyone expect from grands now. Even before FGO Solomon probably wouldn't be the definitive choice for this title, people would choice from someone else. It's authors who decide which could be grands and think that there will be a lot of bullshit with them.
I expect that one of the grands wouldn't be usual old and strong person as everyone predict.

True. Even I know about it, despite being a western pig, because of Touhou.

Does this show require you to know some prequel? I haven't seen anything of Fate series.
Can I just jump into it?

Y'know the entire thing of Chinese New Year being tied to the lunar phases?
Chang'e is HUGE for chinese mythology and the couple is the mythological center for the sizable seasonal festival held in autumn.

some basic knowledge would be nice at least fate zero

Jesus has already been confirmed "Saver" class

They kinda made anime original stuff for newfags, but you're supposed to know at least Fate/Zero before it.

It's a pretty direct sequel to Fate/Zero. It assumes you at least have a passing familiarity with how mages work in this universe.

Gotcha thanks

I didn't actually meant Jesus but that's cool

It's a direct sequel to Fate/Zero and could be seen as a prologue to Fate/Stay Night.
You could just jump in but you may not understand who some characters are

God look at that rack

Saver class is for the messiahs of the world like Buddha and Jesus. Expect the leaders of religions to also be in this class

>Jesus exists.
>Nature of the universe means christianity is a lie.
So, like, in the Fate universe was Jesus just full of shit about being the son of god?

mmmm tiddies

>L. Ron Hubbard can be summoned as a servant.

The same probably goes for other religions, they aren't really just compatible like that, people imagining they're all like pagan gods

Of course Jesus exists.
Martha's divinity comes from meeting him.
Also did you forget the part of Apoc where Lionman tells Mordred his family became mages by literally making a pact with Satan?

>but since the 5th HGW is the last one
Wasn't there still conflict of the scale of HGW that Waver and Rin participated to end the HGW system in Fuyuki? Plus there's also the fact stopping HGW in Fuyuk doesn't mean there won't be other HGWs in the future, see Strange Fake.

It's the last Fuyuki HGW as greater grail was dismantled 10 years after 5th one.

>The representation of humanity itself will be Grand zerker
Grand!Berserker Unknown Soldier, the collection of every single human who ever picked up a weapon to fight or did it with bare hands. Np is basicly the reverse GoB - the entirity of humanities weaponry through its entire history, making US stronger depending how late into humanities history he is summoned

My Christian-fu is lacking, but shouldn't Jesus qualify for saber also. Something about him returning with a burning sword and proclaiming apocalypse?

I know that Jesus exists. My point is that his teachings are actually a lie because in the Fate Universe.

We don't really know what the hell the abrahamic God is in the context of Fate, only that he seems to exist in some fashion.

There is just references to an eventual future where Waver and Rin go back to Fuyuki from the Clock Tower to dismantle the HGW. This results in a conflict about the same level as the war itself, but it's not actually a HGW...or something like that. But that's really all we know, and nothing has really been written about it yet.

Attached: fsf after dismantling war.png (941x181, 67K)

The Unknown Soldier already exists in Fate. It's the excuse the Throne of Heroes used to register Emiya as a proper heroic spirit, claiming he worked well enough as a representation. That's why his true name is officially "Nameless" in the Extra universe.

>Something about him returning with a burning sword and proclaiming apocalypse
As someone who was born and raised in a ultra religious catholic family, either I slept too hard thru mass or never actually payed much attention to anything i was ever told because i don't remember ever hearing anything like that and sounds quite interesting.

Correction: Nameless represents all unknown heroes of justice. It's possible that there can be another nameless hero representing concept of war madness or something.

All myths are true.

I'm pretty sure he's right. I don't have a quote right now but Jesus will return surfing on a blazing cross and accompanied by a choir of angels playing metal gospel.

No, jesus in fate is the real deal. If anything he'll be a Solomon-face seeing as he's considered the second Solomon. The way Abrahamic religions are like so far in fate links them to Buddhist/hindh stuff like the fact Goetia being in nirvana so expect all jesus stuff to be true but with a mix.

Well, Chaldea had a chance to stop the baddies in FGO because of literal "Deus Vult".

Goetia is kinda God's fault anyway he might as well help

Wonder Fate is gona ever cover it since Strange Fake seems to be building up or hinting Waver to the idea of dismantling the HGW.

Christianity is a monotheistic religion

No it’s dumbrheiseifc

What's your point?

there's no sort of competing power

As a casual follower of this franchise (anime-only, no LN or game), I actually find this anime easy to grok and interesting enough to keep watching.
And I like the implication that magic is on a steady decline over the years. A theme I enjoy in other urban fantasy novels.

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Satan? Demons?

Why is no one writing about third holy grail war?
It's much more interesting than yet another alternative war somewhere in the world.
>two saber servants
>angra mainyu polluting the grail
>nazi

We already got abridged version of it in F/HA.

Theres a fun tidbit in Strange Fake where Waver talks about Smartphones alone potentially destroying the masquerade, and how the concealment of magecraft will have to adapt. Then he predicts that the solution will be bombarding the internet with dummy stories until everything is considered "fake news"

>The two magi sent by the association jobbed really hard offscreen before the original novel started
That was lame

Yeah, through it all Taiga didn't get enough attention

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They keep it as a universal "wacky shit happend, new timeline now". It is never gonna be properly explored

OP of the season, if not year. As expected of Kajiura.

I mean if Christianity is true, then God could probably just erase them if he wanted to. I'm not Christian, but why 'He' doesn't is like asking why he doesn't erase bad people or override everyone's will.

>Merlin have potential to be a next grand caster
He already is according to mats

Isn’t everyone a native in one form or another?

Merlin is also weird case where he's still a living person.

Based Edison: Mystery Slayer EX!!!

This God isn't just " the Christian " God. He's the abrahamic God mixed with syncretism of other religions and fate shit. He doesn't directly interfere at this point but will steer certain event through others to help humanity. He controlled Solomon and gifted him his powers Goetia was evil yet still view God in a good light. Karna views this God in a grey light. A god of everything is the God of evil as well. He does what he wants and so far it's to push humans a bit.

>God knew that Goetia would rebel
>simply instructed Solomon to fling one of his rings into the future
>God allowed Goetia to waste thousands of years of planning/scheming just to teach him a lesson in humanity/humility

It would’ve been kinder to just smite him outright

yeah but that's sort of what user said about Christianity not really being true in Fate

A father can't baby his children. If you're gonna scheme for 3000 years be prepared for that shit to fail in 2 years thanks to a nobody. Ultimate lesson for someone trying to become God.

In fate it's true. It doesn't make sense if you look into to much though because making EVERYTHING true means some things will have to conflict. So far Big G is better than any God that has appeared so far yet Christian and other abrahamic following servants recognize other Gods. It's a mess.

I wonder if Case Files will be used to introduce Marisbilly's design. With them bringing up the suppression of the HGW in Case Files while not actually answering it, him being involved with that and leading into his plan in FGO would make sense. Maybe there being more than one HGW changes his plans somehow.

I feel like they'll have his face hidden but we'll hear his voice. How much is he involved in CF anyway? Is he prominent?

I don't think he has a role in it, but they could have him cameo at some point.

I don't think it would really be that interesting. No characters we've seen before would be present, except Saber who would have impersonal masters, being made to comply with orders, and the old Einzbern. If I understood correctly, the Einzberns expected Avenger to be a super-servant but they were disappointed when he turned out to be a lamer, so their side of the story is pretty meh. That leaves only new characters to make it worthwhile. Of course, the historical setting could make it intriguing, but that's it.

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Artoria wasn't in the 3rd war, the Edelfeld sisters summoned some kind of twin sabers

It's funny because this guy was going to get offscreened by Kirei too but he was so incompetent that by the time Lancer got there he was already dead.

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We'd have Zouken, young Risei, the two Edelfelt Sisters who may or may not actually be a Rin and Sakura face because why fucking not, Homo shown in the Apo flashback, Shadow Boi manjew, Papa Papa Tokiomi, Darnic, Papa Papa Dioland, and probably a Matou Master/

Artoria shouldn't have been in 3rd war, otherwise she would've known about avenger.

She was present in every war, that's what the contract with the world entailed. They Summoned Saber and Alter Saber (from the Heaven's Feel route), as shown in Fate/hollow ataraxia.

Why didn't she know about manjew then?

> They Summoned Saber and Alter Saber (from the Heaven's Feel route), as shown in Fate/hollow ataraxia
No, no. Simulation of 3rd war in F/HA uses 5th war servants and masters.

>otherwise she would've known about avenger.
Avenger could have been offed by someone else without her knowledge.

No that's not what happened at all. Manjew used the 5th war faces on the 3rd war servants and masters since those were from Shirou's memories. Did you think Rin and Sakura were on the war too or what?

But Saber was summoned in every war nonetheless

>Unlimited mana Saber and dragon core Saber-clone Gray combination.
This is my fetish. I can already imagine Saber reducing the entire Einzbern forest to ashes.

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She wasn't in Apocrypha's great grail war, for example. I know it's alternative timeline, but she still should have contract with the world there.

It's named "Apocrypha" for a reason user.

Emiya san is better

There's Strange Fake where she's not summoned either.

Maybe that's why it's Strange Fake.

XD

>just realized Atilla the Hun and Genghis Khan aren't the same person and lived in completely different times
fuck I'm a retard

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Comf spinoffs are the best.
Emiya-san > Carnival Phantasm >> Case Files.

How it's called is hardly an argument. Apocrypha even uses Fuyuki's greater grail for the ritual. Every timeline is canon, all those wars were over holy grail, yet she was not present which contradicts your point.

I used to laugh at people like you only to find out it is a surprisingly common mistake.

I used to make this mistake too

And due to this popular misconception Genghis is summoned with a vagina. Bravo Nasu.

>And due to this popular misconception
no, it's because vaginas sell gatchas you fucking idiot

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A bunch of things. Gray has an interesting arc related to her relationship to her apappearance.

There's a tendency to dislike it because the "saberface" became a meme in the fandom, but there's little reason to do so.

>Genghis Khan is Velber 03 after big sis fucked up

it's because vaginas wreak havoc and destroy civilisation

Altera has almost no doujins so maybe she has no vagina after all, I dunno

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I'm not the user you first spoke to. But "every timeline is canon" doesn't mean that every timeline shares the same features and logic. In fact, Nasu encourages his writers to take liberties with the lore.
So yes the timelines are all canon, but they are all separate universes with their own rules as well. In fact, Nasu even considers FZ to be in a separate universe that's simply extremely close to FSN.
So Saber not being invoked in Strange Fake and Apocrypha doesn't disprove that user's point.

The 4th and 5th wars happened with Saber in them in Strange Fake, suggesting the same contract with the world was in play

No you're just a retard
She only appears in the fourth and fifth
She has a continues memory and the 4th was her first

What is it with Medea and blondes?

That i8s a very pretty saber. Where is she from?

So what happens to Gray in the UBW Good end?

Double saber all the way?

TWINS THEY WERE

Taiga summoned Shiki?

Imagine if Reine makes a mercury tentacle monster.

I doubt they go to the association with her. That would be super red flag. Probably doesn't affect her any more than the initial summoning did.

>hurp durp he has Gray he'd surely summon Artoria lmao
He'd offer Iskandar's shit as a catalyst. If the catalyst is there and you're focusing on it, it's not like someone else can pop out just because Gray is standing in the room.

What's Reine's mystic eyes and why does everyone have mystic eyes nowadays?

'cross the sky

Most mystic eyes including hers are basic

Seiba posesses her to get that sweet mana.

>implying the summon won't bug the fuck out and summon a dupe Gray

We literally k n.j ow for a fact that Artoria was not the Saber in the Third. It is stated clearly and explicitly that the Edelfelt sisters cheated and summoned 2 Sabers that counted as one guy (kind of like GO's Anne and Mary I guess). A common fan theory is it was Siegfried and Sigurd but I've also seen people suggest old Beowulf and young Beowulf.

>as Grey turn more and more into Saber
By the end of the LNs she's pretty much 100% Saber already, her hair has turned blonde and she has Saber's infinite mana generator.

Reines's eyes basically just get itchy when mana is nearby. It's more like an allergy than anything, she even had medicine for it.

Mystic Eyes aren't rare. Even Illya has Mystic Eyes of Binding and used themnon Shirou in the Fate route. The specific Mystic Eyes that Shiki has are rare but not ME in general.

>Saber and Lilly

This anime better do well so that they'll make a season 2 adapting the arc at Gray's home town.
Zepia from Melty Blood is the guest party member there.

Oh my god.

Would Waver make them both cover their faces?

user who remembers? I am proud of you.

>Bellerophon
>Rank A+
>Bellerophon is stronger than Gordius Wheel
Gordius Wheel rank is A++, which puts above mere A+ rank phatasms like, you know, some Bellerophon.
Ionion Hetairoi is ranked EX, putting it's above bellerophon and Gordius wheel.

I think A++ is stronger than EX, powerlevel shit is kinda fucky in the Nasuverse.

GW is A+
>ranked EX, putting it's above bellerophon and Gordius wheel
So you have no idea what you're talking about. Okay.

I agree IH is stronger but EX doesn't necessarily mean stronger it just means not on the scale of A-E.

Like there are Servants with Madness Enhancement EX but their version is weaker than ME B, and its only EX because it acts weird not because it's a big numbers buff.

I know that EX is the rank for more conceptual NPs like Touta infinite rice barrel

Would Svin buy Gray's bottled bath water if she was selling it?

Nope, it's A+
Also have 100 people as maximum target while Bellerophon has 300
EX means outside of normal scale, not necessary stronger. His army with no noble phantasms is useless against flying pegasus with dragon level defenses.

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Each command seal has a fuckton of mana in it. Enough to fill Saber's tank or even power teleportation.
I dunno from where Zouken would get enough energy for that, maybe hack the grail.

Gray stays with Waver at the end of the novels, right?

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Yes, because she has nowhere else to go. She even has a cameo with him in Strange Fake which is set some time in the 2010s, so she's 20 something there and still hangs out with him.

blelelelephon and gordius wheel have different atack methods
Belelepohn is a single massive attack while via sponge is ten solid trampling hits so yeah

How does she get money?

>20-something Gray
She probably looks like Mysterious Heroine XX at that point, who is supposed to be Saber around college age.

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Beating strongest holy sword with help of 4 layered Rho Aias is far more impressive than anything we saw from gordius wheel anyway.

Glasses on, or glasses off? Which makes you harder?

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She is Waver's assistant so I assume she has a salary like he does.

>still a midget.
And they forced her on Gray?

>Medusa petrifies Iskandar with Mystic Eyes
She can't petrify fucking Soichiro in time to not get herself killed, so that's arguable.
>Herc is way more dangerous than Lancelot.
Lancelot is way more skilled with sword, two times faster than Herc and can break through God's Hand using only his physical strength. Yeah, it's conceptual defense that protects from anything below A-ranked attacks, but Lancelot Strenght is A-rank meaning even his normal attacks can hurt Herc, even without some A++ rank Noble phantasm like Arondight.

Get in the damn train Waver

So once the LN plot starts the guest party members are going to be Caules and Olga Marie? I'm just going off the LN covers for this arc, please correct me if not.

>When we compare that to fucking Hundred Face, that's more than enough
Really? Why do you think he can stop some sneak attack even after he failed to do so against half-summoned Hassan of the Cursed Arm?

Umm, what? Cursed Arm literally was summoned inside Kojiro's body and torn him from inside out.

Given it took Alcides, Humbaba and Ishtar working together to beat a semi-serious Gil...

Wasn't Gil in full on panic mode once he realized Berserker was Humbaba?

Alcides shot nine lives
Ishtar fucked up the gate
Gil was still fine to use existing NPs to block it
Humbaba roars, which freaks gil the fuck out
Gil gets hit
Narita says he has a Vegeta vs Perfect Cell freakout reaction

Kuzuki would murder Iskandar in the same condition. Also,
>Shinji's Medusa

>two times faster than Herc and can break through God's Hand using only his physical strength.
Agility doesn't work this way. Lancelot can hurt Herc with his strength once. Not kill, hurt.

>WOOOOW IT TOOK THREE OF YOU TO BEAT ME

>She can't petrify fucking Soichiro in time to not get herself killed, so that's arguable.
From her perpective he was normal dude, she wouldn't even bother taking off her mask in such situation. She had no problem taking it off in time against Archer who was actively engaged with her in battle.

Revelations. Jesus shows up with a crown made of seven stars and a sword representing the Word comes from his mouth.

Doesn't he also have white hair and eyes of fire?

I wonder who the hell was the Saber(s) of the 3rd Grail War. Actually, I'd like to know what servants were summoned for the first three wars, really.

Isn't this kid the son of the fat uncle from Apocrypha?

Attached: yggdwhatever.jpg (680x361, 34K)

>I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war.
>His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself.
>He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.
>The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean.
>Coming out of his mouth is a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. "He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty.
>On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords.
Revelation 19:11 - 19:16

t. convert

Yes. He's a main character in fgo too.

With her mana output she could probably make great money selling supercharged bodily fluids. She'd just have to be careful not to completely crash the cumjar market and piss off all the poorfag magi.

Very limited knowledge about servants of 3rd war. What we know:
> berserker was replaced with averger Angry Manjew
> assassin was another Hassan with noble phantasm called Zabaniya: Cyber Phantasy that upon contact between an enemy's head and one of Assassin's hands, turns the target's brain into gunpowder, causing it to explode and destroy the upper half of their body
>going by Apocrypha, Darnic summoned Fionn as Lancer

We knwo a couple from the Third.

>Saber: Two Sabers who counted as one guy. Summoned by the Edelfelt sisters.
>Assassin: A midget Hassan whose NP makes peoples' heads explode. Summoned by a US government guy who used puppet magecraft.
>Lancer: Fionn mac Cumhaill. Summoned by Darnic Yggdmillennia, who was there to steal the Grail for the Nazis.
>Berserker: None. Berserker was replaced by either Ruler Amakusa Shirou or Avenger Angra Mainyu, depending on if it's the Apocrypha or Stay Night timeline. In both cases he was summoned by the Einzberns.

We don't know what classes the Tohsakas and Matous had but we know they participated because they always participate.

Attached: Third Grail War servants and masters.jpg (824x764, 84K)

Touko got Mystic Eyes of Binding, right?
So glasses off, no question

Wtf I'm Christian now.

Seiba and Seiba (male)

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Was Kirei's dad a master or was he just the overseer?

Can't serve your lord if you don't live in a monarchy and all western monarchies have their power granted by the Christian God.

Where should I move too?

>Summoned by a US government guy who used puppet magecraft
I could swear this guy was a Dead Apostle

Be fruitful and multiply. Your descendants will make your country a great kingdom again.

Just supervisor.

I thought it was just a bunch of infodumps.

>Lancelot dies if he's killed.
This dumb meme always makes me laugh.

I think the part where 3rd Assassin's master was a US government agent comes from Strange Fake. He leaked the workings of the Grail War back to Washington, allowing the US to make their own copycat Grail War in Nevada like 80 years later.

You're thinking of Strange Fake Assassin's master, he's a DA.

Poor Fionn.

Attached: fate heil night.jpg (1280x2160, 2.83M)

Ooooo, you gettin' the wheel, mister!

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Can they retcon Fate Achilles into something less lame?

Attached: achilles.jpg (378x492, 22K)

I'm going to assume that, as the OG Berserker, Beowulf was summoned in at least one of the first two Grail Wars.

I mean, Illiad Achilles was pretty lame. The stakes of that story were hilariously low.

The logic of class name being catalyst itself only applies to assassin. The only change in summoning system was avenger's curse in 3rd war so anyone could be berserker in first 2 wars.

So, is Quetzalcoatl a complete ayylmao or just a intra-solar system being?

>Lancer: Fionn mac Cumhaill. Summoned by Darnic Yggdmillennia, who was there to steal the Grail for the Nazis.
Wait, where was Fionn confirmed for being the Lancer?

I know, but considering he's the most famous Berserker you'd think he would have been summoned by now.

In Apocrypha. Most likely Darnic summoned same hero in FSN timeline.

You mean the aztec gods were ayys?

They should do just a two cour season of the last two arcs.

South American gods were alien viruses that arrived on meteors and then infected animals, raising them to godhood. Like a jaguar god was a jaguar infetced by alien god virus.

Ishtar talks about how fucking weird Quetz is even by god standards in GO's Babylon chapter.

Marisbury was the one who contracted Heartless to investigate the Fuyuki HGW, making Marisbury notice that the mainline HGW doesn't work for him because it's corrupted.

That also gave Heartless the whole idea for his own plan to change the magical world and Modern Magecraft forever.

Apocrypha anime and manga both had flashbacks to the Third with Fionn. Apocrypha's author tweeted that he had also considered giving him Sir Tristan or Beowulf but ultimately chose Fionn.

Attached: Fionn_Apocrypha_anime.jpg (1024x576, 57K)

Why the heck would he be expecting Douglas MacArthur?

Daanic.

Fionn also works better because he is perfect for Darnic to get the idea and the means to find and steal the Great Grail.

does this have something to do with the current lostbelt crisis?

The Aztec empire was on Mexico (aka North America) while the Maian one was on Central America though

Yeah Fionn is actually really fucking OP lorewise. I wish he was better in gameplay.

Japan has a curious fixation on MacArthur.

Margery is kinda shady. It's like he knows what's going on in other timelines and he picked the optimal one for his plans.

He's gotten better, I've heard. Still not as strong as he should be, but not bad either.

So all three known Fuyuki Lancers have been Irish?

Spears are kind of Irish heroes thing. At least in Fate.

Attached: Grail War winners.png (726x4757, 2.44M)

He's kind of a discount King Arthur due to his lack of exceptionally powerful Noble Phantasms. Mana rank could be better too.

The only think Fate is good for is rising awareness of Irish myths, so there's that

>three known
bro theres five wars

A lot of the greatest Lancers come from Ireland. Part of it is due to all the legendary spears that come from there. For such a small country, it has a lot of spear myths.

We don't know who were Lancers of 1st and 2nd wars.

Yeah but we don't know who were the Lancers in the first and second.
We don't know any of the servants in the first and second.

His Salmon is basically a FAQ or strategy guide. It's like a cheat.

It makes him to know what to do to win or solve a problem. He shows how good it is in the 2019 New Years event.

Technically, Kiritsugu won, as the Grail had more or less chosen him. He rejected it and ordered it destroyed. Gilgamesh and Kotomine merely survived. Being the final survivor isn't enough to say that you won. In a hypothetical case where the Grail is complete before all Servant and Master teams are beaten with the exception of one, the Grail will choose the one who accomplished the most.

>Second Fuyuki Grail War
Apparently no one won, everyone participating was killed somehow.

first Captain to survive the whole journey in charge counts!

God imagine combining him with Holmes.

Holmes's NP makes an unsolvable problem solvable, but with the caveat that you still need to figure it out yourself. Like for example if you're in a murder mystery without any clues his NP will create clues out of thin air, though you'll still need to find them and put them together.

So that plus Fionn's thumb-sucking NP is god mode.

It doesn't give you all the answers. It just kinda gives you a guideline of what to do in order to reach an answer. It doesn't guarantee victory in any way.

>Lucius Longinus
oh shit really? He finally appeared?

It was potent enough for him to get enough info to fool the final boss into thinking that the inn went back in time. The characters themselves say it's a cheat.

He's like a cool oji-san type of character
his Master is the grandma of Requiem's MC and uses magic to stay young

Attached: Longinus and Master.jpg (1536x2048, 1.24M)

Hot grandma.

He's the gilgamesh equivalent in fate requiem being the top Servant and winner of a previous war. Pretty cool and strong guy.

Didn't Archer win in UBW?

It's still not absolute. It's not like it'd help him beat the likes of Heracles, Gilgamesh or Iskandar. In fact, it doesn't actually seem to help him much in terms of combat, since it's not like he can stand around and suck his thumb in the middle of a fight.

In a sense, he's a bit better off than Emiya, but his lack of powerful Noble Phantasms is a problem.

He didn't have a Master. All he did was killsteal.

I guess, in true ending he's last servant. In good ending it's Saber though.

Speaking of Requiem, what happens at the end of the novel? Will there be more volumes? Will Giorno appear?

So he won.

Nobody won. Saber could be considered winner if anyone since she remained in the world while Archer refused to.

Reminder that Christianity is a pretty terrifying religion. Not on text, necessarily, but with its progress:

>Romans oppress Christians
>wind up oppressing people for NOT being Christian
>Normans sack Christian monasteries
>wind up sacking places that dared to oppose Christiantiy
>Japanese try to expel Christianity on every level
>today, media gobbled up by anyone below 40 (if that) can liberally lean on Christian themes and imagery with no consequence

Could the SJWs be next?

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It's not absolute but it's still a big cheat. Also his stats are pretty high overall and having a A ranked NP for offense it's pretty good anyway. He is said to be of the "Great Hero" category for reason. Looking at stats he is better than Cu.

Nobody wins the Fuyuki grail so the last standing servant should be considered the "winner"

It would be interesting though, and the main story would be edelfeld vs tohsaka.
Einzbern would have a smaller role but who cares about them anyway?

Then it's Archer for true ending and Saber for good ending.

I heard that the novel ends with Karen telling the MC that the Grail War her grandma won isn't actually over and to go to Fuyuki for answers.

I just remember that the shota was going up against the African servant and shattered her knife with one finger. Also something about him being afraid of snakes so people were speculating on him being Adam.

He is given the great hero status. Only the pretty strong Servants (Gil, Herc, Achilles, Karna, Arjuna) get that title. He is definitely strong.

Stats don't really seem to take raw speed and technique into account. Ireland's Child of Light is still considered the superior Lancer. Cu Chulainn is one of the top three Lancers of all time.

And stats alone don't actually do much unless you're a freak like Heracles. Having a powerful Noble Phantasm is still necessary. Although its rank is B+, Gae Bolg is an exceptional Noble Phantasm due to its properties. Having a powerful Noble Phantasm can really make or break a Servant. There are so many times when a Servant wins not through stats, but through the power of their NP. The entire reason Gilgamesh was said to be the strongest was because the sheer number of Noble Phantasms in his arsenal.

Well yeah. But he's still below Cu Chulainn and Scathach, at least in this universe.

Adam is the speculation I've seen too.

People were speculating the Little Prince before release, but that was brought up in the LN itself and then shot down because he didn't recognize the red toy plane or Little Prince book.

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Is Cu still in the top three?
>Karna
>Scat
>Longinus
>Saber Lancer
I feel these four are a bit more wanked.

>Cu Chulainn is one of the top three Lancers of all time.
At the time of writing F/SN*
Seeing the lancers we've got since I feel even being 3rd best is a huge stretch. Above him there's Enkidu, Karna and Romulus for sure. I don't see how any of them could be weaker.

Cu would be god tier if he a) had an Ireland fame boost and b) had a better Master. Japan and Kirei are holding him back a lot.

Cu is better than Scat, but has other examples

He's Hastur

Doesn't Cu get access to like two extra NPs if he's in Ireland?

Voyager 1 imbued with something on the golden disc makes the most sense.

Didn't Nasu said that Cu, Herc and Artoria are equal when they're all at full power?

God I hope not. Fuck cthulhu shit, it is never done well in anything.

Archer said Cu is in the top three FASTEST Lancers. Not necessarily most skilled or powerful. Just speed.

Raw talent, apparently. Even Rama acknowledges Cu Chulainn as the greatest Lancer. Scathach was someone who reached the realm of the gods through nothing more than her sheer talent in battle and thaumaturgy, and Cu Chulainn surpasses even her.

Karna, Altria and Lancer may have raw power thanks to their Noble Phantasms, but as a spearman, Cu Chulainn can surpass even them.

This was very deliberate in order to prevent Christianity's spread in post-war Japan:
globalresearch.ca/the-70th-anniversary-of-the-bombing-of-nagasaki-unwelcome-truths-for-church-and-state/5466919
>So it was the height of irony that the massive Cathedral – one of only two Nagasaki landmarks that could be positively identified from 31,000 feet up (the other one was the Mitsubishi armaments factory complex, which had run out of raw materials because of the Allied naval blockade) became Ground Zero for Fat Man.
>At 11:02 am, during Thursday morning mass, hundreds of Nagasaki Christians were boiled, evaporated, carbonized or otherwise disappeared in a scorching, radioactive fireball that exploded 500 meters above the cathedral. The black rain that soon came down from the mushroom cloud contained the mingled cellular remains of many Nagasaki Shintoists, Buddhists and Christians. The theological implications of Nagasaki’s Black Rain surely should boggle the minds of theologians of all denominations.
>Most Nagasaki Christians did not survive the blast. 6,000 of them died instantly, including all who were at confession that morning. Of the 12,000 church members, 8,500 of them eventually died as a result of the bomb. Many of the others were seriously sickened with a highly lethal entirely new disease: radiation sickness.
>Three orders of nuns and a Christian girl’s school nearby disappeared into black smoke or became chunks of charcoal. Tens of thousands of other innocent, non-Christian non-combatants also died instantly, and many more were mortally or incurably wounded. Some of the victim’s progeny are still suffering from the trans-generational malignancies and immune deficiencies caused by the deadly plutonium and other radioactive isotopes produced by the bomb.

That I can see, yeah. While Agility != speed, Karna is equal in that regard. Enkidu can buff himself to A+ at least but that's temporary.

Do we know Longinus's stats?

The guy writing Requiem is the one who started the whole Foreigner thing in FGO so I wouldn't be surprised.

nope

What about Abigail(yog-sototh), hokusai(cthulhu) and summer BB?(Nyralthotep)

Apparently, it holds the same light as Rhongomyniad. That's all we know.

But I thought Alcides was looking down on Gil?

fgo non canen

It was a bluff. Alcides himself admits that it would take a full day's worth of preparation in order to stand a chance against Gilgamesh.

He looks down on everything, but especially those with divinity. If he was Aclides without the grail mud crazyness he and Gil would probably bro it up over insulting gods though.

Isn't there another servant in requiem with the Holy Spear? It pierced the main character if I remember.

Wasn't he trying to get Gil to bring out Ea so he could steal it or something?

Yes. He'd probably be able to steal but I doubt he'd be able to use it though, since it's been mentioned multiple times it's pretty exclusive to Gil.

Probably. We're yet unclear as to how Reincarnation Pandora works, but goading Gil to draw Ea and looting it would probably be most ideal.
Though, honestly, it must have some limitation, else he'd just have looted Gate of Babylon and rendered Gilgamesh mostly harmless.

Ah okay. Alcides wouldn't be aware of that fact though but still taking Gil's trump card would be great. Istar did far better though by closing the gate. Gil got really unlucky this war. Wasn't he saved by Enkidu?

So assuming that True Berserker being Humbaba wasn't a retcon, I wonder what this means for the hint that it was Edison.

Not really saved, more like kept alive for now. His saint graph is almost completely or completely gone and the only reason he's not dead yet is because Enkidu can draw mana from the land and supply it to him. Maybe he'll die next volume, maybe not, we'll see. I personally doubt it seeing as Narita pointed him as one of the main characters plus him still having a yet to be revealed NP on his character card.
I'm 100% sure it's a retcon.

Probably hijack or Haruri thinking she summoned Edison.

So, where were (You) during this all nonsense in the other timelines? Were you still a child or perhaps not even born yet?

Apparently Humbaba hijacked his summoning If I'm remembering the spoilers accurately. In Fgo there was hinted that Edison had a transformation called Madza Edison.

Oh wow, gil got fucked, what about his loli master?

Tine is fine, almost killed herself trying to keep Gil alive though.

Why not just shota-ify gil to reduce his mana consumption rate? there's that otpion. He can still fight if fgo's shota-gil is any indication.

>So, where were (You) during this all nonsense in the other timelines? Were you still a child or perhaps not even born yet?
What did user mean by this?

I wouldn't be surprised if they end up doing something exactly like that. Or Gil having to become a brawler until he can grab the spare key from Ishtar again, forced to utilize whatever he has on hand plus Enkidu's weapons.

Without Chaldea, Gudako is just a normal person living a normal life.

>gil underdog arc
I can definitely see it

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By (You) i mean the player character from f/go.

>Extra
(You) don't exist
>FGO
(You) are a normal person living a normal life

Pretty sure in this timeline Lev kills himself and so Goetia's plan fails, so Guda just joins Chaldea and remains a B-lister forever. No Grand Order is ever issued and Chaldea just peacefully manages what they can.

I'm pretty sure Enkidu is supposed to be equal to Gilgamesh and Saber Lancer is basically Saber++. So... probably not.

I don't think chaldea is even a thing in the other timelines.

Oh right, without Marisbilly getting funding in 2004 the project probably never gets off the ground.

Does Chaldea even exist in non FGO timelines?

At least goetia doesn't get to incinerate the human order, then ayys don't freeze the whole fucking world and try to usher a new era of gods.

I wonder if Marisbilly also had a ring of Solomon in stay/night timeline incase he got a chance to get in a GW.

Chaldea should be as it was founded in the decades earlier. What Marisbury did in 2004 was completing Chaldeas the astronomical model.

The Ayys freezing the world was independent of Goetia. Ayy God was even caught off guard by that. If merrybilly is the God though like speculation then it makes sense.

Astronomical?

Altria (Lancer) isn't much stronger than Altria (Saber).

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